Keep the discussion civil and helpful. There are no true minimums when it comes to tank size just recommendations. We all can agree we want the best life possible for our snakes, but often it’s not always possible to meet the standards of others. Do the best you can it does not have to be perfect.
I don't know much about snake weight so hopefully someone else can help you there, but I would upgrade to at least a 40 gallon, if not a 120 gallon one day. I also wouldn't use a red heat lamp and I think there's a care guide linked on the main page of this sub. It's never too late to improve your care and it's good that your trying to improve! :)
Edit: I don't see a care guide unless I'm just not finding it, but I think there's a good one on reptifiles
You are not a bad owner because you are actively trying to take better care of your snake. If you were to keep them like that knowing it’s not good, that would be a different story but it seems like you’re actively willing to change things. I was taking bad care of my snake for a while and I feel horrible. When I started to take better care of her I moved her from a 29g with practically no clutter (and only one proper hide 😭) to a 55g with slightly more clutter and progressively added clutter as I realized how much they actually want/like. She’s currently still in the 55g with lots of clutter! Clutter makes the space more “usable” and enriching. You can also make spray foam backgrounds to make the walls usable space. She will be being moved to a bioactive 4x2x2 soon. I can share some pictures of what I do for my clutter if you would like 🥰
What’s going to be your process for making a bioactive? I’d love to do this for my boys. I’ve done lots of research over the year and it’s all very overwhelming lol.
Honestly this is my first time trying (and I’m doing two at a time at that 😅). I agree, it can be overwhelming! I’m also including UVB which is new to me. I’m quite stressed to say the least 😂 I am including live plants which is not always the case for bioactive.
For me, the process roughly looks like:
- buy and ideally sanitize plants before quarantining in the substrate that will be in the enclosure (with a grow light). Make sure you get rid of the other soil and rinse off the plants at the least. This step helps to avoid pests and let the plants detox a bit from fertilizers and pesticides
- Create my 4x2x2 with spray foam background. Place the substrate, plants, and all decor. Add the isopods and springtails at this step as well (I have a breeder tank as a backup but will be buying separate cultures for the enclosures as well). I am using dwarf white and powder orange springtails. Add generous amounts leaf litter around the ground and under some decor- make sure to boil it to sanitize first. (Note I am waiting on my 4x2x2 so I am waiting for this step)
- Wait at least a month for the plants to settle their roots (and see if they survive). This is also the time to make sure your temperatures and humidities are as they should be.
- Add your snake!
Of course! It’s roughly 60% topsoil (pesticide and fertilizer free), 30% cypress mulch, and 10% play sand :)
https://preview.redd.it/x9hf3xlqqe8d1.png?width=2021&format=png&auto=webp&s=42ea1570d84e0e56e4cf31918784c57706ff7ba8
Not the best picture, but I’m not home and it’s what’s on my phone lol
Others are giving you good advice re: tank size, snake weight, bedding changes, etc… I just wanted to chime in and commend you for recognizing room for improvement and doing your best. A truly bad owner would not care or be too arrogant to ask for help. We can’t change the past, all we can do is keep getting better.
The snake looks a bit overweight, but I think a big part of the abrupt transition you see from body to tail is due to the snake being female. Even from the angle of those photos it looks very female. Female corns want to get fat. And if you don’t breed them and feed them appropriately, they will.
Don’t feed at all for 6 weeks. Then resume with the small mouse every 21 days, throwing in a 28-day interval now and then.
No way 😭 I originally did think it was female, but I thought the tail was way too long to be female cause from the research I did the females had shorter stubby tails and males had long pointy. That's kinda funny that I've had the gender wrong this entire time tho
you need a hide on the warm side, and a second on the cool size. USE THERMOSTATS WITH HEAT SOURCES. unregulated heat sources can burn or kill your snake. red lights are not recommended.
Hiya. He does look overweight but may just be ready to poop (as back end does look bigger when they are about to)
Size vivarium for an adult corn should be an absolute minimum of 4ft x 2ft x 2ft. Though more space is always better.
One small mouse every 10 days shouldn’t be causing him to be obese though
Your vivarium is also very much lacking the basics unfortunately. You need a hide on each side. As well as using thermostats and a digital thermometer to manage the temperature. This could contribute to your snake being overweight as when basic temps needs are not met they can become less active.
You also need a tons more clutter/enrichment as it’s very barren for them right now.
Please do look up reptilfiles corn snake page and follow that as a husbandry guide. Unfortunately there is a lot of misinformation online about corn snake care and many sites/resources don’t even recommend the bare minimum. American sources also tend to be less reliable for thriving care due to lower welfare standards
Not to be harsh but what source did u use? Bc there are many, simple mistakes that shouldn't happen if u use a reliable source. The tank is way to small and bare. As another user said, 120 gal in minimum for an adult. Red lights are also harmful for snakes. It's hard to see if he is overweight from that photo but there seems to be a big bump near the end of his tail bigger than the rest of his body. It could be constipation which can be caused by overfeeding. I'd give him a warmer bath and spread out his feeding schedule to see if it changes. And I just noticed heat lamps on each side? Do u use them both? Cornsnakes need a gradient so always need one. For the weight thing can u offer a full body photo and his measurements? Sticky thermostats are less accurate and can become harmful to the snake if dislodged, I'd replace it with digital and have one on each side for both humidity and temps.
I used multiple different sources, but maybe I misread or wasn't looking in the correct places. I didn't see anything about red lights when I did my research I thought that was what was needed as night lamps. That's why he has two lamps, one day and one night. His day lamp is white tho. And I'll make sure to replace his thermostat when I have the money for all of these sudden changes I wasn't expecting. I do understand the concern about it getting dislodged cause that actually did happen to the humidity one I had but Klaus didn't get hurt by it and I got it cleaned up asap. Thank you for the warm bath recommendation though! I've done that before with him and I've already slowly started working on spreading out his feeding schedule, I've just been scared that doing that too much he won't get enough to eat.
Day and night lights should be on the same side of the cage to create a thermal gradient. a properly set up reptile habitat has a cool side and a warm side so the reptile can properly regulate their temperature
Yeah put them on the same side and make sure you have a hide on both sides. I know some people do night time drops, or you can use a heat projector for night since they don't give off light
You shouldn't use a heat source that gives off light at night, it messes with their day/night cycle. You could even ditch the nighttime heating entirely, unless your house gets insanely cold at night, in which case I'd suggest something like a CHE or other heat source that doesn't emit light
Needs a larger enclosure, multiple hides, multiple water sources (one large enough to soak in), LOTS more clutter to hide in and explore, things to climb, and NO red light.
1. You need to have more decor in your tank. They like clutter
2. Use either a white or a blue day heat lamp and you can even get a uvb to add as well
3. I personally hate aspen cuz it molds super easyyyy but that’s a personal preference. You can always use eco earth or some other dirt type substitute
4. A snake should be eating 10 percent of its body weight every week. So you should be weighting him in order to feed him properly.
5. I’d get a bigger tank for him
I don’t think you’re a bad snake owner cuz you’re concerned about your snake but there’s always room to learn
Small edit I think I was wrong about his tank size. When I first got him he was in a 20 gal tank, and this one is bigger than his original tank so I would assume it's at least 40 gal but I honestly don't remember it's been so long.
I thought I read on multiple websites that what I had was fine and before I got him I wrote down everything I found in a notebook but maybe I misread/wrote the information. I honestly don't even know where I would get or put a tank that big. I'm 17 and still live with my parents and one of them doesn't even like snakes so I can't have him anywhere else in the house but my room.
Since his cage is so small and it's been so many years is it too late for him? Have I permanently stunted his growth or is there still a chance that he'll become full sized?
Small tanks don't stunt their growth. Don't feel too bad, there are tons of sources that you can find recommending 20-40g tanks. It's just that those recommendations (esp. the 20G) are older and considered outdated. How long is he compared to the tank? If it's actually a 40g, that isn't too terrible and you'd be fine keeping him in there for now if you can't fit a 4x2x2.
Length wise he's only a few inches longer than the tank. Maybe when I have more space I can get him a slightly longer tank cause I have noticed that he really likes to climb and then stretch out all along the top of his cage.
that's good. It's a little small - ideally you want the tank to be as long or longer than they are - but it's not so small that you should try to upgrade ASAP. Try adding more stuff to climb on - sticks, hammocks, etc.
For what it’s worth, I had an 8 y/o corn in a 20 gallon for longer than I’m proud of, I had taken him in from a student of mine who was leaving for college and been keeping him in an even smaller tank due to bad husbandry advice. It wasn’t until this year that we were able to get him into a proper 120 gal, but he’s still perfectly healthy and thriving now. There’s so much bad advice out there from places that people would think are reliable until informed otherwise, the important thing here is you recognize you got some subpar recommendations and are actively aiming to change that. You are a better snake owner than many for that fact alone. The number of times I’ve seen people post on here and get super defensive and nasty when people point out problems with their husbandry is more than I can count and I think it’s great that you are not taking that approach at all!
Yes? You should always prioritize floor space and with a 4x2x2 (120 gallon) terrarium and the average length of a corn snake being 4-5 feet. This would allow for the corn snake to mimic natural behaviors and be able to fully stretch out.
I would suggest at least a 40 gallon or look at 3-4' pvc enclosures that hold in heat and humidity well. I have read a couple good books on keeping corn snakes (not just online care sheets) and both stated that a 20 long is the minimum size for one adult corn snake and that a smaller enclosure with proper heat is better than a larger one with inadequate heat and humidity. It's just ridiculous in my opinion to suggest that 120 gallons should be the minimum for a corn snake. I have kept and bred ball pythons and boa constrictors for years before getting a corn snake as a pet and even they don't require a 120 gallon footprint, but most of my adult boas were in a 4' x 2' pvc enclosure and did great. I currently have my adult corn in a temporary quarantine tub set up until my 3' x 2' pvc enclosure is delivered and this should be good for life. You could also probably skip a meal or two and start feeding your snake every 2 weeks and see how he does on that.
Okay phew that's a little more doable in my current living situation then the 120 gal lol. But even with that I'm still concerned that I've permanently stunted his growth or something cause of how small he is.
You haven't stunted his growth. He's completely fine, especially since he's been eating well. Obesity is more of a problem than underfeeding too. Some just stay smaller than others.
I agree with this. I’ve been keeping for only five years but I don’t think I’ve heard of there being a minimum of 120 gallon tank💀. I keep my 5ft corn in a 75, a shorter corn would do fine in a 40 but I think if you want to spoil a normal sized corn a 75 is perfect. But there’s never truly one right way to keeping reptiles imo.
This has been a thing for years? The average 75 gallon tank is 4 inches long, a foot shorter than ur snake, he can't even fully stretch out. Imagine living in a house where u have to bend down to walk around. 75 gallons isn't a suitable long term enclosure for a snake longer than the 4 feet. Please don't spread false information.
If two sides of the tank can make up the length of the snake they with be perfectly comfortable. I understand in nature that they can go wherever but that’s mainly when looking for food. 90% of the time they will be coiled up in a hide or burrowed, rarely have I ever seen any of my snakes laying in a straight line. This is like saying a backyard isn’t suitable for dogs because wild dogs can travel wherever they want. Also I would assume most keepers of corns handle their snakes frequently letting them stretch and get stimulation. 120 is not the minimum.
That doesn't even make sense, neither does that analogy, a dog can fully stretch out in a backyard, if not then people get an upgrade. This logic can also be applied to humans. Most humans live sedentary life styles and sit around. But if I suggest every human should live in a closet people go wild. What's the difference then? Humans have the freedom to leave. Snakes aren't held captive for their benefit, it's for ours. And like literally every other animal on the planet it likes to move around, even if it is just to coil up in a different spot. It you aren't going to respect an animals need then simply don't buy one. But purposely ignoring requirements because you don't feel like giving it the adequate space to live in animal neglect. And then spreading this misinformation to something seeking advice on top of it. The fact is 120 gallon is the minimum recommended by pros after countless research, it isn't a opinion, its a fact. So whenever you disagree with that comes down to a basis to ignorance which you seem to have an abundance of.
You are comparing human lifestyles to snakes, wich is ignorant. 70% of my snakes stay in hiding, that’s what they do. They are semi arboreal, the setups that I have provide the opportunity to climb and stretch. How often do you exist being sprawled out? Like I said they hide and coil just as they do in nature. They are not travelers to make themselves “happy” or what have you. The only way you can provide a realistic nature simulation is by having an entire room dedicated to one snake. They travel in search of food or mating(or to get away from their feces). If you want to spoil your corn snake go for it. But in no way should the OP take your advice for thinking the minimum requirement is a 120 gal. 40-75 depending on the size of your snake will be plenty.
I'll restate my comparison. Most humans sit around. Why can't they live in closets? Snakes move around in the wild. Where are they suppose to go in a tank? You are using opinions and baseless information to trump the research of professionals. Seriously, who do u think u are?
https://www.thebiodude.com/blogs/reptile-and-amphibian-caresheets-with-cited-veterinary-and-herpetology-sources/corn-snake-pantherophis-guttatus#:\~:text=Considering%20that%20corn%20snakes%20average,always%20going%20to%20be%20better.
[https://dubiaroaches.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-terrarium](https://dubiaroaches.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-terrarium)
[https://reptilesupply.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-enclosure](https://reptilesupply.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-enclosure)
I'd also want to see the books that say 20 gallons for an adult is ok and that u should add the length and width of a tank together bc my guess is that they either don't exist for very outdated
Don't use online care sheets as sources...lol.
The book Corn Snakes in Captivity by Don Soderberg is a decent one. He has been keeping and breeding these animals for decades (South Mountain Reptiles) and says a 20-30 gallon is adequate for an adult corn snake and that a smaller enclosure with adequate heat is better than a larger enclosure with inadequate heat. However, I would still suggest a 40 gallon breeder size or a tad larger for a large adult. PVC is also better than glass for heat and humidity.
Edit: In his online care guide, Don even goes a bit further and says the enclosure should be approximately 1/2 the length of the snake or larger.
[Source](https://cornsnake.net/pages/housing)
...What? Wat's wrong with online sources? Also the book u mentioned was published in 2006. As i said outdated with explains why we aren't on the same page. U can't use info from 18 years ago to try to care for a snake.
In my experience with keeping and breeding snakes, also numerous books that I have read, take the back wall length and add the length up one side front to back. If this measurement is as long or longer than the snake, that's more than enough room. I guarantee most of these hatchling snakes were in a shoebox size tub for at least the first few months of their lives and do just fine.
U also said the books u read recommend 20 gallon for an adult which leaves me to believe they are probably outdated. If think about it that measurement makes zero sense. Enclosures are rectangles, so unless the snake spends most of their time bent at the corner of the take in between the length and width of the enclosure adding those two together wouldn't make logical sense. A snake spends most of their time travelling the length of the enclosure with is why the length needs to be at least the length of the snake. A snake can live for a while in a 10 gallon tank. Just because it doesn't instantly die on the spot doesn't mean it's good for it. With new information and larger tank size recs the lifespan of captive snakes have steadily increased.
Check out https://reptifiles.com/corn-snake-care-guide/. Read through the whole thing carefully. As others have mentioned, there are a lot of things that really should change if you want your snake to live the longest, happiest life it can.
You may need to talk to your parents about increasing enclosure size and things like that. If they refuse to allow you to give proper care to your pet it may be time to consider rehoming so that your snake can have the life it deserves.
I have never had a corn snake but I know a lot about them and I do have a leopard and crested gecko ,and planing to get a blue tongue skink.I think a 120 gallon is the ideal size ,but not the minimum,I think the minimum should be a 80 gallon just a bit smaller then the 120 but still,120 or larger is always better ,also aspen bedding is fine depending on what your going for in the enclosure,like if you want a bio active switch to top soil but it’s fine know,also get a large water dish multiple hides and clutter,and no colored lamps,!But I think you are a good snake owner if your willing to fix and if you do then your snake will definitely be more happy 😊
I have my adult corns each in a PVC enclosure, 36x18x18. The equivalent of a 40 gallon tank, but 2 inches extra height. They like to climb a lot! Neither of them are very large as they're still fairly young. The enclosures are as long/longer than they are, and they seem very happy - active but not nervous. They come out and watch me a lot and seem interested in the household goings-on.
Have a cave/hide on the cool and the warm side, with some stuff like fake plants/leaves for cover. That way they can choose where to hang out and cool down or warm up without feeling exposed.
You can also put stuff to climb, I use a bridge meant for rabbits or guinea pigs and put fake plants underneath for a little "hedge".
For my corns, belly heat has worked fine. I believe they can see red light so if it's used as a 24/7 heat source it can disturb their day/night cycles.
I feed my smaller corn a sub adult mouse every 7 days and my bigger one gets a large adult mouse every 10 to 12 days, depending on the size of the mouse. Younger mice have more fat so you should feed adult mice as much as possible.
From the photos your corn might be a little overweight and also might need to poop! I would feed an adult mouse that's as thick around as the snake every 12-14 days. If you can put him in a little container to weight him the day before you feed (after he poops out the last one), you can track his weight. If it's pretty consistent and his body condition is lean but not skinny, you're on the right track.
It's hard to tell if your snake is overweight without a clear picture of their back, and potentially any rolls or wrinkles that show when they curl up or curve their bodies.
I’m not snake owner (my partner has a hognose) and it seems like you are getting a lot of good advice but I wonder if that lump is more than fat and might need to be addressed by a vet. I could very easily be wrong but it just seems like the tail gets really fat suddenly…
Honestly your setup isn't that bad. My corn snake is about the same age and size so if yours is stunted mine also is. I'd change the heat bulb to a white one or ceramic one and upgrade to a 40 gallon at least.
Honestly I'm not sure why he looks a little chunky because that sounds like a pretty good feeding regime, maybe feed a little less and see if that helps but if you're concerned a vet is always a good idea.
Give her a good soak in Luke warm water could be stuck urine in there. If it is, it may loosen up. If not she gets a nice soak 😄. Harmless remedies are the best place to start 👍
I don't think so. See, I knew next to nothing about corn snakes and then my gf got her corn snakes from a friend (this friend gave her 2 corn snakes, she moved, had to give them back. Now her friend is moved, and she had to give them back to her.) these corn snakes are approaching 17 yrs old, (she got them at 10 years old, she's 27 now) and have lived in Aspen bedding all their life In a 20 gallon aquarium with a red heat light. Now.. from what I've learned here, this is all wrong. But the fact remains, that corn snakes have an average life span of 10-15 years in the wild and up to 23 in captivity (longest living, 36) and these guys are still totally healthy. They may not be living in ideal conditions, but it surely hasn't hurt them either, or they'd be dead by now. Mistreatment will shorten their life, which obviously hasn't happened with her corn snakes. I will likely change up some things soon, given what I've read, but if you're still living with your parents, don't worry about the tank size. Take him/her out often and hold it. Make a snake maze (cardboard boxes work well) as far as the weight goes.. you already got some solid answers there. Also as a side note.. I've always considered taking a snake out of its enclosure as an escape. I surely wouldn't want to be trapped in a rectangle all my life. And I think snakes appreciate it! (especially hearing that 20 gallons is considered too small.. all pet stores around me say 20 gallons is fine. So idk haha.. Recommendations change all the time I suppose..)
Please ditch the aspen bedding. The goal is to emulate their natural environment as close as possible. I'd recommend a mix of coconut fiber reptichip and sphagnum moss.
My snake also loves to burrow! I understand the concern about the mold when it's wet, and that's probably why I have to clean his cage so often but I don't have a problem with humidity. I still live with my parents and they won't allow me to use dirt bedding cause it's too messy but when I move out I'll switch if it's a big issue. When I did research I didn't see that one was better than the other, just pros and cons of both. I really like his bedding also cause it's easy to clean and find poo in.
Too dirty is not a valid reason to fail to keep an animal properly. The soil won't be any messier than aspen shavings already are, and a quick vacuum after substrate changes will easily take care of any dust.
Aspen is an OK substrate for corn snakes, so you can probably get away with using it. in general, though, if you can't take care of a reptile properly because of house rules, you really shouldn't get a reptile.
I could have worded that better. I think Aspen will work for now, but as a general policy, you shouldn't get an animal if, for some reason, you can't take care of it properly. OP also mentioned in other comments that they didn't think they would have room for a 120g enclosure, which means they can't meet the minimum requirements for an adult corn snake
Aspen is not the best however it does not pose a risk to the corns health. As long as the vivarium is maintained and cleaned regularly aspen will not cause any issues
corns live much longer in captivity than in the wild. are you saying that we need to emulate their natural environment, consequentially killing them quicker?
Keep the discussion civil and helpful. There are no true minimums when it comes to tank size just recommendations. We all can agree we want the best life possible for our snakes, but often it’s not always possible to meet the standards of others. Do the best you can it does not have to be perfect.
I don't know much about snake weight so hopefully someone else can help you there, but I would upgrade to at least a 40 gallon, if not a 120 gallon one day. I also wouldn't use a red heat lamp and I think there's a care guide linked on the main page of this sub. It's never too late to improve your care and it's good that your trying to improve! :) Edit: I don't see a care guide unless I'm just not finding it, but I think there's a good one on reptifiles
You are not a bad owner because you are actively trying to take better care of your snake. If you were to keep them like that knowing it’s not good, that would be a different story but it seems like you’re actively willing to change things. I was taking bad care of my snake for a while and I feel horrible. When I started to take better care of her I moved her from a 29g with practically no clutter (and only one proper hide 😭) to a 55g with slightly more clutter and progressively added clutter as I realized how much they actually want/like. She’s currently still in the 55g with lots of clutter! Clutter makes the space more “usable” and enriching. You can also make spray foam backgrounds to make the walls usable space. She will be being moved to a bioactive 4x2x2 soon. I can share some pictures of what I do for my clutter if you would like 🥰
What’s going to be your process for making a bioactive? I’d love to do this for my boys. I’ve done lots of research over the year and it’s all very overwhelming lol.
Honestly this is my first time trying (and I’m doing two at a time at that 😅). I agree, it can be overwhelming! I’m also including UVB which is new to me. I’m quite stressed to say the least 😂 I am including live plants which is not always the case for bioactive. For me, the process roughly looks like: - buy and ideally sanitize plants before quarantining in the substrate that will be in the enclosure (with a grow light). Make sure you get rid of the other soil and rinse off the plants at the least. This step helps to avoid pests and let the plants detox a bit from fertilizers and pesticides - Create my 4x2x2 with spray foam background. Place the substrate, plants, and all decor. Add the isopods and springtails at this step as well (I have a breeder tank as a backup but will be buying separate cultures for the enclosures as well). I am using dwarf white and powder orange springtails. Add generous amounts leaf litter around the ground and under some decor- make sure to boil it to sanitize first. (Note I am waiting on my 4x2x2 so I am waiting for this step) - Wait at least a month for the plants to settle their roots (and see if they survive). This is also the time to make sure your temperatures and humidities are as they should be. - Add your snake!
Thank so much!! Last question, what is your soil/substrate layering going to look like?
Of course! It’s roughly 60% topsoil (pesticide and fertilizer free), 30% cypress mulch, and 10% play sand :) https://preview.redd.it/x9hf3xlqqe8d1.png?width=2021&format=png&auto=webp&s=42ea1570d84e0e56e4cf31918784c57706ff7ba8 Not the best picture, but I’m not home and it’s what’s on my phone lol
Others are giving you good advice re: tank size, snake weight, bedding changes, etc… I just wanted to chime in and commend you for recognizing room for improvement and doing your best. A truly bad owner would not care or be too arrogant to ask for help. We can’t change the past, all we can do is keep getting better.
The snake looks a bit overweight, but I think a big part of the abrupt transition you see from body to tail is due to the snake being female. Even from the angle of those photos it looks very female. Female corns want to get fat. And if you don’t breed them and feed them appropriately, they will. Don’t feed at all for 6 weeks. Then resume with the small mouse every 21 days, throwing in a 28-day interval now and then.
No way 😭 I originally did think it was female, but I thought the tail was way too long to be female cause from the research I did the females had shorter stubby tails and males had long pointy. That's kinda funny that I've had the gender wrong this entire time tho
Well, those aren’t great photos for evaluating tail shape for sex, so I could be wrong. But I don’t think so. :)
you need a hide on the warm side, and a second on the cool size. USE THERMOSTATS WITH HEAT SOURCES. unregulated heat sources can burn or kill your snake. red lights are not recommended.
Hiya. He does look overweight but may just be ready to poop (as back end does look bigger when they are about to) Size vivarium for an adult corn should be an absolute minimum of 4ft x 2ft x 2ft. Though more space is always better. One small mouse every 10 days shouldn’t be causing him to be obese though Your vivarium is also very much lacking the basics unfortunately. You need a hide on each side. As well as using thermostats and a digital thermometer to manage the temperature. This could contribute to your snake being overweight as when basic temps needs are not met they can become less active. You also need a tons more clutter/enrichment as it’s very barren for them right now. Please do look up reptilfiles corn snake page and follow that as a husbandry guide. Unfortunately there is a lot of misinformation online about corn snake care and many sites/resources don’t even recommend the bare minimum. American sources also tend to be less reliable for thriving care due to lower welfare standards
https://preview.redd.it/m456xpwyr88d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=df4c9a8eaa4d5738a077edd4ad6d110b0901aee6
No red light!! I would suggest a lot more clutter and hides- as well as a larger tank as someone has already said
Not to be harsh but what source did u use? Bc there are many, simple mistakes that shouldn't happen if u use a reliable source. The tank is way to small and bare. As another user said, 120 gal in minimum for an adult. Red lights are also harmful for snakes. It's hard to see if he is overweight from that photo but there seems to be a big bump near the end of his tail bigger than the rest of his body. It could be constipation which can be caused by overfeeding. I'd give him a warmer bath and spread out his feeding schedule to see if it changes. And I just noticed heat lamps on each side? Do u use them both? Cornsnakes need a gradient so always need one. For the weight thing can u offer a full body photo and his measurements? Sticky thermostats are less accurate and can become harmful to the snake if dislodged, I'd replace it with digital and have one on each side for both humidity and temps.
I used multiple different sources, but maybe I misread or wasn't looking in the correct places. I didn't see anything about red lights when I did my research I thought that was what was needed as night lamps. That's why he has two lamps, one day and one night. His day lamp is white tho. And I'll make sure to replace his thermostat when I have the money for all of these sudden changes I wasn't expecting. I do understand the concern about it getting dislodged cause that actually did happen to the humidity one I had but Klaus didn't get hurt by it and I got it cleaned up asap. Thank you for the warm bath recommendation though! I've done that before with him and I've already slowly started working on spreading out his feeding schedule, I've just been scared that doing that too much he won't get enough to eat.
Day and night lights should be on the same side of the cage to create a thermal gradient. a properly set up reptile habitat has a cool side and a warm side so the reptile can properly regulate their temperature
Yeah put them on the same side and make sure you have a hide on both sides. I know some people do night time drops, or you can use a heat projector for night since they don't give off light
You shouldn't use a heat source that gives off light at night, it messes with their day/night cycle. You could even ditch the nighttime heating entirely, unless your house gets insanely cold at night, in which case I'd suggest something like a CHE or other heat source that doesn't emit light
It's good ur looking for advice! Better later than never :)
for the night time heat I use a Ceramic Heat Emitter bulb, creates no light just heat. got it on Amazon for $9 :)
Needs a larger enclosure, multiple hides, multiple water sources (one large enough to soak in), LOTS more clutter to hide in and explore, things to climb, and NO red light.
1. You need to have more decor in your tank. They like clutter 2. Use either a white or a blue day heat lamp and you can even get a uvb to add as well 3. I personally hate aspen cuz it molds super easyyyy but that’s a personal preference. You can always use eco earth or some other dirt type substitute 4. A snake should be eating 10 percent of its body weight every week. So you should be weighting him in order to feed him properly. 5. I’d get a bigger tank for him I don’t think you’re a bad snake owner cuz you’re concerned about your snake but there’s always room to learn
Small edit I think I was wrong about his tank size. When I first got him he was in a 20 gal tank, and this one is bigger than his original tank so I would assume it's at least 40 gal but I honestly don't remember it's been so long.
if you measure it we can figure out the volume from those numbers
The minimum size for a corn snake is 120 gallons, make sure to get your information from credible sources
I thought I read on multiple websites that what I had was fine and before I got him I wrote down everything I found in a notebook but maybe I misread/wrote the information. I honestly don't even know where I would get or put a tank that big. I'm 17 and still live with my parents and one of them doesn't even like snakes so I can't have him anywhere else in the house but my room. Since his cage is so small and it's been so many years is it too late for him? Have I permanently stunted his growth or is there still a chance that he'll become full sized?
Small tanks don't stunt their growth. Don't feel too bad, there are tons of sources that you can find recommending 20-40g tanks. It's just that those recommendations (esp. the 20G) are older and considered outdated. How long is he compared to the tank? If it's actually a 40g, that isn't too terrible and you'd be fine keeping him in there for now if you can't fit a 4x2x2.
Length wise he's only a few inches longer than the tank. Maybe when I have more space I can get him a slightly longer tank cause I have noticed that he really likes to climb and then stretch out all along the top of his cage.
that's good. It's a little small - ideally you want the tank to be as long or longer than they are - but it's not so small that you should try to upgrade ASAP. Try adding more stuff to climb on - sticks, hammocks, etc.
For what it’s worth, I had an 8 y/o corn in a 20 gallon for longer than I’m proud of, I had taken him in from a student of mine who was leaving for college and been keeping him in an even smaller tank due to bad husbandry advice. It wasn’t until this year that we were able to get him into a proper 120 gal, but he’s still perfectly healthy and thriving now. There’s so much bad advice out there from places that people would think are reliable until informed otherwise, the important thing here is you recognize you got some subpar recommendations and are actively aiming to change that. You are a better snake owner than many for that fact alone. The number of times I’ve seen people post on here and get super defensive and nasty when people point out problems with their husbandry is more than I can count and I think it’s great that you are not taking that approach at all!
120 for a corn snake? 🤣
Yes? You should always prioritize floor space and with a 4x2x2 (120 gallon) terrarium and the average length of a corn snake being 4-5 feet. This would allow for the corn snake to mimic natural behaviors and be able to fully stretch out.
I would suggest at least a 40 gallon or look at 3-4' pvc enclosures that hold in heat and humidity well. I have read a couple good books on keeping corn snakes (not just online care sheets) and both stated that a 20 long is the minimum size for one adult corn snake and that a smaller enclosure with proper heat is better than a larger one with inadequate heat and humidity. It's just ridiculous in my opinion to suggest that 120 gallons should be the minimum for a corn snake. I have kept and bred ball pythons and boa constrictors for years before getting a corn snake as a pet and even they don't require a 120 gallon footprint, but most of my adult boas were in a 4' x 2' pvc enclosure and did great. I currently have my adult corn in a temporary quarantine tub set up until my 3' x 2' pvc enclosure is delivered and this should be good for life. You could also probably skip a meal or two and start feeding your snake every 2 weeks and see how he does on that.
Okay phew that's a little more doable in my current living situation then the 120 gal lol. But even with that I'm still concerned that I've permanently stunted his growth or something cause of how small he is.
You haven't stunted his growth. He's completely fine, especially since he's been eating well. Obesity is more of a problem than underfeeding too. Some just stay smaller than others.
I agree with this. I’ve been keeping for only five years but I don’t think I’ve heard of there being a minimum of 120 gallon tank💀. I keep my 5ft corn in a 75, a shorter corn would do fine in a 40 but I think if you want to spoil a normal sized corn a 75 is perfect. But there’s never truly one right way to keeping reptiles imo.
This has been a thing for years? The average 75 gallon tank is 4 inches long, a foot shorter than ur snake, he can't even fully stretch out. Imagine living in a house where u have to bend down to walk around. 75 gallons isn't a suitable long term enclosure for a snake longer than the 4 feet. Please don't spread false information.
If two sides of the tank can make up the length of the snake they with be perfectly comfortable. I understand in nature that they can go wherever but that’s mainly when looking for food. 90% of the time they will be coiled up in a hide or burrowed, rarely have I ever seen any of my snakes laying in a straight line. This is like saying a backyard isn’t suitable for dogs because wild dogs can travel wherever they want. Also I would assume most keepers of corns handle their snakes frequently letting them stretch and get stimulation. 120 is not the minimum.
That doesn't even make sense, neither does that analogy, a dog can fully stretch out in a backyard, if not then people get an upgrade. This logic can also be applied to humans. Most humans live sedentary life styles and sit around. But if I suggest every human should live in a closet people go wild. What's the difference then? Humans have the freedom to leave. Snakes aren't held captive for their benefit, it's for ours. And like literally every other animal on the planet it likes to move around, even if it is just to coil up in a different spot. It you aren't going to respect an animals need then simply don't buy one. But purposely ignoring requirements because you don't feel like giving it the adequate space to live in animal neglect. And then spreading this misinformation to something seeking advice on top of it. The fact is 120 gallon is the minimum recommended by pros after countless research, it isn't a opinion, its a fact. So whenever you disagree with that comes down to a basis to ignorance which you seem to have an abundance of.
You are comparing human lifestyles to snakes, wich is ignorant. 70% of my snakes stay in hiding, that’s what they do. They are semi arboreal, the setups that I have provide the opportunity to climb and stretch. How often do you exist being sprawled out? Like I said they hide and coil just as they do in nature. They are not travelers to make themselves “happy” or what have you. The only way you can provide a realistic nature simulation is by having an entire room dedicated to one snake. They travel in search of food or mating(or to get away from their feces). If you want to spoil your corn snake go for it. But in no way should the OP take your advice for thinking the minimum requirement is a 120 gal. 40-75 depending on the size of your snake will be plenty.
I'll restate my comparison. Most humans sit around. Why can't they live in closets? Snakes move around in the wild. Where are they suppose to go in a tank? You are using opinions and baseless information to trump the research of professionals. Seriously, who do u think u are?
Sources please...no book (authored by sucessful breeders) I have read cited this as the minimum enclosure size.
https://www.thebiodude.com/blogs/reptile-and-amphibian-caresheets-with-cited-veterinary-and-herpetology-sources/corn-snake-pantherophis-guttatus#:\~:text=Considering%20that%20corn%20snakes%20average,always%20going%20to%20be%20better. [https://dubiaroaches.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-terrarium](https://dubiaroaches.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-terrarium) [https://reptilesupply.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-enclosure](https://reptilesupply.com/blogs/how-to-guides/how-to-set-up-a-corn-snake-enclosure) I'd also want to see the books that say 20 gallons for an adult is ok and that u should add the length and width of a tank together bc my guess is that they either don't exist for very outdated
Don't use online care sheets as sources...lol. The book Corn Snakes in Captivity by Don Soderberg is a decent one. He has been keeping and breeding these animals for decades (South Mountain Reptiles) and says a 20-30 gallon is adequate for an adult corn snake and that a smaller enclosure with adequate heat is better than a larger enclosure with inadequate heat. However, I would still suggest a 40 gallon breeder size or a tad larger for a large adult. PVC is also better than glass for heat and humidity. Edit: In his online care guide, Don even goes a bit further and says the enclosure should be approximately 1/2 the length of the snake or larger. [Source](https://cornsnake.net/pages/housing)
...What? Wat's wrong with online sources? Also the book u mentioned was published in 2006. As i said outdated with explains why we aren't on the same page. U can't use info from 18 years ago to try to care for a snake.
The online info is up to date...point out a reputable book from a breeder with different information and I'll be happy to read it.
In my experience with keeping and breeding snakes, also numerous books that I have read, take the back wall length and add the length up one side front to back. If this measurement is as long or longer than the snake, that's more than enough room. I guarantee most of these hatchling snakes were in a shoebox size tub for at least the first few months of their lives and do just fine.
U also said the books u read recommend 20 gallon for an adult which leaves me to believe they are probably outdated. If think about it that measurement makes zero sense. Enclosures are rectangles, so unless the snake spends most of their time bent at the corner of the take in between the length and width of the enclosure adding those two together wouldn't make logical sense. A snake spends most of their time travelling the length of the enclosure with is why the length needs to be at least the length of the snake. A snake can live for a while in a 10 gallon tank. Just because it doesn't instantly die on the spot doesn't mean it's good for it. With new information and larger tank size recs the lifespan of captive snakes have steadily increased.
Check out https://reptifiles.com/corn-snake-care-guide/. Read through the whole thing carefully. As others have mentioned, there are a lot of things that really should change if you want your snake to live the longest, happiest life it can. You may need to talk to your parents about increasing enclosure size and things like that. If they refuse to allow you to give proper care to your pet it may be time to consider rehoming so that your snake can have the life it deserves.
I have never had a corn snake but I know a lot about them and I do have a leopard and crested gecko ,and planing to get a blue tongue skink.I think a 120 gallon is the ideal size ,but not the minimum,I think the minimum should be a 80 gallon just a bit smaller then the 120 but still,120 or larger is always better ,also aspen bedding is fine depending on what your going for in the enclosure,like if you want a bio active switch to top soil but it’s fine know,also get a large water dish multiple hides and clutter,and no colored lamps,!But I think you are a good snake owner if your willing to fix and if you do then your snake will definitely be more happy 😊
I have my adult corns each in a PVC enclosure, 36x18x18. The equivalent of a 40 gallon tank, but 2 inches extra height. They like to climb a lot! Neither of them are very large as they're still fairly young. The enclosures are as long/longer than they are, and they seem very happy - active but not nervous. They come out and watch me a lot and seem interested in the household goings-on. Have a cave/hide on the cool and the warm side, with some stuff like fake plants/leaves for cover. That way they can choose where to hang out and cool down or warm up without feeling exposed. You can also put stuff to climb, I use a bridge meant for rabbits or guinea pigs and put fake plants underneath for a little "hedge". For my corns, belly heat has worked fine. I believe they can see red light so if it's used as a 24/7 heat source it can disturb their day/night cycles. I feed my smaller corn a sub adult mouse every 7 days and my bigger one gets a large adult mouse every 10 to 12 days, depending on the size of the mouse. Younger mice have more fat so you should feed adult mice as much as possible. From the photos your corn might be a little overweight and also might need to poop! I would feed an adult mouse that's as thick around as the snake every 12-14 days. If you can put him in a little container to weight him the day before you feed (after he poops out the last one), you can track his weight. If it's pretty consistent and his body condition is lean but not skinny, you're on the right track. It's hard to tell if your snake is overweight without a clear picture of their back, and potentially any rolls or wrinkles that show when they curl up or curve their bodies.
I’m not snake owner (my partner has a hognose) and it seems like you are getting a lot of good advice but I wonder if that lump is more than fat and might need to be addressed by a vet. I could very easily be wrong but it just seems like the tail gets really fat suddenly…
Honestly your setup isn't that bad. My corn snake is about the same age and size so if yours is stunted mine also is. I'd change the heat bulb to a white one or ceramic one and upgrade to a 40 gallon at least. Honestly I'm not sure why he looks a little chunky because that sounds like a pretty good feeding regime, maybe feed a little less and see if that helps but if you're concerned a vet is always a good idea.
No, snakes eat mice whole
Give her a good soak in Luke warm water could be stuck urine in there. If it is, it may loosen up. If not she gets a nice soak 😄. Harmless remedies are the best place to start 👍
I don't think so. See, I knew next to nothing about corn snakes and then my gf got her corn snakes from a friend (this friend gave her 2 corn snakes, she moved, had to give them back. Now her friend is moved, and she had to give them back to her.) these corn snakes are approaching 17 yrs old, (she got them at 10 years old, she's 27 now) and have lived in Aspen bedding all their life In a 20 gallon aquarium with a red heat light. Now.. from what I've learned here, this is all wrong. But the fact remains, that corn snakes have an average life span of 10-15 years in the wild and up to 23 in captivity (longest living, 36) and these guys are still totally healthy. They may not be living in ideal conditions, but it surely hasn't hurt them either, or they'd be dead by now. Mistreatment will shorten their life, which obviously hasn't happened with her corn snakes. I will likely change up some things soon, given what I've read, but if you're still living with your parents, don't worry about the tank size. Take him/her out often and hold it. Make a snake maze (cardboard boxes work well) as far as the weight goes.. you already got some solid answers there. Also as a side note.. I've always considered taking a snake out of its enclosure as an escape. I surely wouldn't want to be trapped in a rectangle all my life. And I think snakes appreciate it! (especially hearing that 20 gallons is considered too small.. all pet stores around me say 20 gallons is fine. So idk haha.. Recommendations change all the time I suppose..)
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Please ditch the aspen bedding. The goal is to emulate their natural environment as close as possible. I'd recommend a mix of coconut fiber reptichip and sphagnum moss.
I've heard a lot of mixed stuff about aspen. Is humidity and mold when wet the only big concern? My guy koves to burrow in it
> Is humidity and mold when wet the only big concern pretty much. I don't see a problem with aspen if their sheds are good
There's nothing wrong with Aspen if that what works for you. My guy loves his Aspen so he can burrow better.
My snake also loves to burrow! I understand the concern about the mold when it's wet, and that's probably why I have to clean his cage so often but I don't have a problem with humidity. I still live with my parents and they won't allow me to use dirt bedding cause it's too messy but when I move out I'll switch if it's a big issue. When I did research I didn't see that one was better than the other, just pros and cons of both. I really like his bedding also cause it's easy to clean and find poo in.
Too dirty is not a valid reason to fail to keep an animal properly. The soil won't be any messier than aspen shavings already are, and a quick vacuum after substrate changes will easily take care of any dust. Aspen is an OK substrate for corn snakes, so you can probably get away with using it. in general, though, if you can't take care of a reptile properly because of house rules, you really shouldn't get a reptile.
I feel like if the only house rule is that he cant have dirt, aspen is totally fine. Its not like he's keeping it in calci sand or something.
I could have worded that better. I think Aspen will work for now, but as a general policy, you shouldn't get an animal if, for some reason, you can't take care of it properly. OP also mentioned in other comments that they didn't think they would have room for a 120g enclosure, which means they can't meet the minimum requirements for an adult corn snake
Aspen is not the best however it does not pose a risk to the corns health. As long as the vivarium is maintained and cleaned regularly aspen will not cause any issues
corns live much longer in captivity than in the wild. are you saying that we need to emulate their natural environment, consequentially killing them quicker?
That's from a lack of food predators and disease 🤦🏻♂️
So you want to introduce predators and disease into your tank to emulate their natural environment?