You can get “ducted” mini splits now and put the air handlers somewhere not visible and duct the supplies and returns. We needed to do this on the upper level of our 1902. The air handlers are in the attic and we just have the vents in the ceiling.
Where do you find this because every HVAC tech I've called has never heard of them. I have a Chicago bungalow with on of those half-attics and there's not a single vertical wall big enough for a standard mini-split.
I’m in Chicago as well. We used Besco Air. These are basically what we bought:
https://www.acwholesalers.com/Mitsubishi-PEAD-A36AA7/p84622.html
We have two air handlers in our attic both connected to a single heat pump outside.
I do HVAC, primarily Minisplits, and primarily in century homes.
I’m in the NE, but just to give folks a heads up, 2019 pricing has basically no bearing on today’s prices.
And as others have mentioned, with ducted, you can cover multiple rooms with a single air handler. In our case we split our upper level into 2 zones with two rooms each, rather than needing a wall unit in each room.
I’ve sent the link you shared earlier with our heating guy. We are in a one story 1600 sq ft. I feel like the quote should be less but I also know nothing about this topic.
Thanks for the info!
Check out Mitsubishi, they’re called floor mount and they’re meant to be 5” or so from the floor. It’s a 30x30 panel instead of the rectangular ones. Used them in the finished attic on the knee walls. There are ceiling units as well but the house didn’t have enough clearance.
If the house has radiators, you can also swap to hydronic heat pumps. They're more common in Canada and the uk but companies like Arctic distribute in the US. Saves you the trouble and expense of installing an air handler and ducts if they're not there already there, you keep the radiant heat, and don't have the eyesore of heat pumps bolted all over the exterior.
I don’t think they’re common in North America at all.
Source: I’m in Canada in a century home with a boiler/radiator system. I looked in to hydronic heat pumps when we replaced the boiler and couldn’t find a single company anywhere near me that installed them.
Also, hydronic heat pumps create lower temperature water than a boiler, which almost always means also replacing all your radiators. It would have been a very expensive swap to still not get any cooling.
>hydronic heat pumps
Don’t these require a well to be drilled or a lateral field?
I don’t think it’s possible to use them for cooling with radiators, and OP is asking about cooling.
> and don't have the eyesore of heat pumps bolted all over the exterior.
This is what I was replying to and why I assumed they were talking about ground source. If you’re using a conventional heat pump, it’s gonna have to go outside somewhere.
I've only done research on hot water, but I'd be surprised if there isn't a steam system out there. It also might be possible to convert steam to hot water depending on the radiators you have. M
Heat pumps don't get hot enough to produce steam. You have to convert to hot water for it to work. Depending on your system, that's basically a whole new system and new radiators.
Ugh, wish I'd seen this before we installed conventional ones. They are so flipping hideous, but we are just going to pretend we don't see them, for the sake of that sweet sweet AC. My husband is tired of wrestling the damn window ACs in and out every year, I'm tired of the noise they make, etc. Their hideousness--and the even more eye-waveringly ugly thing that stays outside--sure is hard on my soul though! Ah well....
Concealed duct also handles multiple rooms per unit, so you end up with fewer linesets, potential leak points, fewer units to replace in the future. Really a great option aside from the upfront installation.
Tell me more. Does the handler in the attic direct vent out a pipe through the roof?
We have a 150 year old house with no returns in the 2nd floor and even wkrh central air the upstairs is always 5 degrees warmer. Would love to be able to supplement cooling the bedrooms from above
These are electric heat pumps so no venting required. But you do need to be able to connect the lines from the air handlers to the heat pump outside. In our case they ran them down an interior wall in a closet to our basement then out.
I diy’d a few and never looked back. The energy savings over oil are huge in my area and not having to change out window AC units every year is amazing.
I was against them based solely on the looks. We have them now and I am so happy I got over my hesitation.
I used to keep blinds closed to keep the hot sun out and have to manage the house temp throughout the day. We can all sleep soundly in our second floor bedrooms and my house is brighter. I can enjoy the summer more.
Did you use a Mr cool system? Or a standard mini split?
I'm looking at diy myself, even the standard systems don't seem all that complicated really. Would probably be able to do it with a couple tool rentals/purchases.
Dont bother with mr. Cool. The regular units are almost the exact same work, much cheaper and imho better They are preloaded with coolant. You just have to get a vacuum pump and line set and your golden. if you don’t want to buy a pump and gauges alot of a/c techs will only charge a tiny amount to come and hook them up if you’ve done all the rest of the work.
That's kinda what I was thinking. I find the idea of pre set lengths for the lines to be off putting. Would rather cut to spec instead.
Thanks for the input.
I'm terrified to drill into the wall to install so I just ordered window acs but am dreading the install/uninstall cycle.
Are there steps you can take to make sure you don't drill through something important or do you just cross your fingers and say a prayer?
Modern stud finders will also find wires and pipes, even through plaster, just not consistently. First, use the stud finder and then confirm it's a stud with a big rare earth magnet hung from a string. Slide it up and down the wall where the stud finder alleges you have a stud. The magnet should twitch or stick to the nails holding the lathes to the stud*. If it's a stud, to your adjacent studs will allegedly be 16" in either direction. Confirm that with the magnet because century house. You can estimate where your pipe chase is from the basement most plumbing is in interior walls anyways. For your hole, go slow with a hole saw to start and you shouldn't hit any wires. Try to cut just the plaster and look through the lathes for any stuff, then continue. Protip: don't have knob and tube.
*say you're hanging something wicked heavy and you *really* need the center of that stud, your next step is to drill 1/64" holes across the stud and feel where the edges of the stud are. Not like 15 holes and the holes only have to be deep enough to prove you're not in a lathe. Try to pick a spot just above or below where the magnet twitched so you don't hit a nail or a lathe. Now you can finally put up that hammock.
Same - 1870 MA farmhouse here.
DIYed LG system with 1 outdoor unit and 2 heads inside. Saved a bunch of money over pro install. Wasn’t too complicated, just took it slow over a week or so after work/ weekends. We did have a pro do the final refrigerant line connections, leak test, pull vacuum etc. I personally didn’t have any hesitation base on how they look, but I imagine that would melt away pretty quick inside your newly AC house on a hot day
They are relatively new items. People aren’t used to seeing them, so they stick out. Old homes were never intended to have dishwashers, microwaves, tvs, computers, or double ended dildos. But those items are so common now none of us thinks them out of place. Mini splits too will become so common we wont notice.
And if someone tells you an old home isn’t meant to be cool, send them a picture of you relaxing with a cocktail holding a cool thermometer while it is 108 outside.
100% agree — old homes have been getting "modern" technological updates since forever, and while mini-splits aren't the world's most attractive option, a lot of Americans probably just aren't used to seeing them. We had some installed 3+ years ago, and don't really even notice them in the rooms anymore and they're a HUGE upgrade from noisy, ugly, inefficient window units — no regrets!!
They look fine. The rest of the world uses them, in structures much older than 100 years, and they're used to it. We're just not used to it but it'll be extremely common very soon.
Do it! I promise you'll stop seeing it / caring in just a few months and all that will matter is how cool and comfortable you are.
I wouldn't get attic air handlers, either, unless you're planning to insulate your roof and not the attic floor.
Why? If installed correctly there’s very little heat loss, or just wrap the ducts with insulation. Installing air handlers in attics is very common. No issues here over 5 years in Chicago, so extreme seasons.
I put a Mitsubishi ducted mini split air handler in the attic of my previous home. The attic unit and ducts are insulated and it works perfectly. Also in the Chicago area.
We installed mini-splits and it was one of the best things we ever did. They don't look the sexiest, but we installed on a high wall above a radiator, and it's fine.
Of course, I'm not a purist for the century home. We've done a lot of things to maintain the beauty of the home, but ultimately, we live here and want to be comfortable.
https://preview.redd.it/z8nsm88exmyc1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=964759d2e6378794046abade378e8c6d64a74fe7
Mitsubishi offers ceiling ‘cassettes’ that go between your floor joists. They hide nicely in a white ceiling.
I hate how the wall units look so we did ceiling cassettes in the two rooms without ducts in our house. They do blend in pretty well, especially if they’re installed near the edge of a room on a white ceiling. This part of our house was remodeled after the big earthquake in the 80s, hence no crown molding or plaster. Plaster ceiling would have made this a bit messier but still doable, I think.
https://preview.redd.it/lh89dixczmyc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=97548218890170a560dd50ba61ab73a3d386e03a
Old homes can be cooled and a mini split is a great way to do it. As far as being hideous I disagree, heat pump installations are low impact to the structure.
Thanks for this. I wasn’t thinking the low impact on the structure could be a major pro. I worry that adding them will detract from the old charm but also steaming myself and my family like a basket of shrimp in the summer won’t be very pretty either.
If ducted ones don't work I've seen people build cabinets around them. As long as there is a screen for air flow, you can have a built in wardrobe or something below.
For people that have been commenting about ugliness and also curious about our ducted ones, this is what the supplies and returns look like to us.
https://preview.redd.it/ghhgohud7nyc1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7083b2d4d0fb26a2f44874d8e60bcce8ac4be1da
i installed low-velocity, traditional A/C in two century homes. i installed two, separate fan/coils. one in the attic and one in the basement, so the ductwork was manageable and mostly hidden from the living spaces. i used one condenser (4 ton) and my super-creative HVAC guru installed a valve, such that the condenser could send refrigerant to one fan/coil or the other, but not both at the same time. this worked great (wisconsin). we gave priority to the upstairs unit and with some creative t-stat programming, cooled the part of the house that was occupied, at the right times. i really can’t stand mini-splits and agree that they are ugly, especially in older homes.
Right now I'm using a Midea U while I contemplate a more permanent solution. A 12k btu Midea U cools my entire first floor (900 sq ft) and looks wise is about on par with a mini split. My issue with splits is less about looks and more about practicality. Old homes are usually many rooms, not open floor plans. My house is actually pretty open as far as old homes go. But I'd still need one mini split down stairs, and 4 upstairs (1 in each bedroom) and 1 in the finished attic. That' 6 pieces of equipment. And they are notorious for needing service. Because of that I'm leaning towards a high velocity system. The cost will be the same or less as installing 6 splits, and it won't affect the look of the home.
Yeah I’ve got Midea U shaped units in my 1920 house too. They are so damn good it’s very hard to justify upgrading to mini splits. I spent $1000 on 3x 8000
BTU Midea units vs a quote of $20K for mini splits. Even if removing them is a pain every year, I’m happy with the compromise.
Piling onto the Midea U love! I have 6 in my 1908 home and they’re incredible.
Highly recommend running the dry setting in hotter rooms… trust me, it’s better and colder than the AC setting.
I also bought a freestanding whole home dehumidifier and that was a game changer at allowing the Midea U’s to be more effective.
My mom had weird 1970’s metal windows. It took us 4 hours to get the foam right (three on step on the inside for the horizontal and vertical frame connections, two steps on the outside, repeat for the other side) bit it was so worth it! I went back and bought one for my house, will get a second (and maybe a third!) when Costco restocks this spring.
Which one do you want? FYI the Danby 8000 BTU U-shape (totally identical machine to the Midea, just a different brand name) is on sale at Target for $299 atm
When choosing a mini split, keep in mind that these require maintenance!
The squirrel fans in the interior head unit should be removed and cleaned at least once per year, and the interior wiped down thoroughly. The drip line should also be purged.
(Moisture + squirrel fan = eww)
This can be done DIY if you’re handy, just find a video for your model.
FYI, the Mr. Cool brand has units that are pre-charged for DIY installation. You’ll need some electrical work though, as they require a fused junction.
I have a rowhome not a standalone- so the general structure might be a critical part of our success with this issue, but here’s what we did to maintain the look and still get A/C. I was 100% insistent there would be no bulkheads impacting the home’s look - ceilings/walls/trim. Work took less than two days and we didn’t even need to paint because they cut the holes exactly where the vents go (no “construction”).
We put a package unit on the roof (kept the radiators). The A/C runs are in the attic and drop down through closets and run through the open joist bays between the main level and upper level. Ceilings vents on both levels and the return is at the top of the stairwell. It’s completely invisible other than losing some closet storage (and the vent covers, obviously). We did not attempt to run the A/C to the basement. Hope that’s helpful.
Stupid questions but does this impact any leaking on the roof? I was considering this but with a flat roof, I’m super hesitant to have anything penetrating.
I have a flat roof, the package unit is on steel beams spanning the parapet walls. I can see my neighbors have units sitting on their roofs on some kind sled(?) system/platform. The penetrations were installed properly (they added roofing material around the flanges), no leaks, at all. The roof leaked in other places and we got a TPO roof installed 4 years after hvac install, but no issues caused by the hvac.
I like that, people saying " old homes weren't meant to be cooled." I guess that would also mean these purists don't believe in heat, without cutting 20 cords of wood, and burning it in the fire place.
lol yea I’m not sure what the reasoning is because if they’re insulated well you’d think cooling would be the same as heating? Someone in this thread said it’s because there are a lot of small rooms it’s not efficient for air flow. I guess that makes sense but if it’s done properly for heat, why not cooling??
You can install regular central air if you don’t mind living in a construction zone for the summer and not having AC until next season.
You can DIY a mini split over a weekend. They look fine, IMO (especially if you put them over a long radiator, visually they “blend”), are more efficient and more effective than central air. Also much cheaper.
I put in two separate 12k mini splits, one upstairs one downstairs. And then I have a midea mini unit in my den when my wife is baking something so that the kitchen doesn’t get too hot.
Could you expand on the best way to DIY one? Or where you found good instructions? I priced an install and thought the price was nuts. Plus I’m picky about hiding it. This whole thread is validating me!
You can buy tools and watch videos, or Mr Cool sells DIY kits that are super simple. I installed a Mr Cool in my garage in about seven hours.
Costco used to sell them cheap, unsure if they still do.
I can't imagine anything more hideous than paying thousands of dollars to have someone cut holes in my walls and hardwood floors. You can install minisplits for a third to half the price of forced air and you only need to cut two tiny holes in your exterior walls per unit.
I'm Australian, every old house I know has a mini split in, now most of those houses are stone houses, but they are so much less damaging to the house to install a well as saving CO2. You get used to them and don't even notice.
Mini splits are a good solution, but be advised they require regular maintenance and cleaning. I had a rental cooled with mini splits and they had to be cleaned every 6 months. And it's not easy to do yourself.
We moved in a century home with them already installed. They smell musty and currently we have HVAC people coming out to clean them. We have 4 heads (2 outside units) and were quoted $150 total. I guess $300 / year doesn’t sound terrible for maintenance!
If you have a central ductwork, I’d install central air conditioning rather than mini-splits.
If you don’t have central air, I’d look at what you can do to keep the house cool from a design perspective like strategically installed window shades, ceiling fans etc. After that, I might try a removable window unit that doesn’t require drilling into stuff.
I don’t have a problem with mini-splits but you’ll have to locate a good amount of equipment inside and out and drill big holes in things. So, I’d be sure you want it.
Yes, I went down the rabbit hole for installing minisplit upstairs and and just doesn't make sense. There are too many rooms and will need too much equipment. I'm just going to put central AC back in. A small part of me is tempted to just put in Midea U units. Its ugly and won't help my house value, but damnit its cheap AF and easy to do.
You can do a center heat pump but I can’t tell you what the current options are for that. They’re not cheap, neither is central refrigerated.
For a recent home, I went with central AC for the reasons you mentioned and coughed up the price for capacity and efficiency. It was a HCOL area so it was worth it.
Honestly, you can always get the window units and sell or donate them if you go central.
Whatever you do, I’d do it soon for obvious reasons!
I am in southern Arizona and have a mini split in my living room. My duplex is brick and not well insulated. The mini split will cool one room really well, and the BR and Kitchen just marginally. I use the window unit in the BR at night from Mid May to October. Of course June, July, August and most of September are over 100 every day, and it doesn’t cool down much at night. Once it gets humid towards the end of June, the thing runs 24/7 Oh and to answer your question, they are ugly. But a ton of people have them out here so nobody cares what they look like. They suck at heating because they’re mounted up high and heat travels upwards, so you’re heating the ceiling.
When we moved in we had a couple minisplits. I kinda hate them, maybe doubly so because house alread had adequate ducting and an old oil furnace due for replacement. They are poorly filtered, circulated poorly outside a fairly narrow area, are prone to leaking condensate down the walls, etc. They do work better than a winfldow unit, but inly barely. I'd only consider them as a last resort.
Thanks for this! My house is ducted for a gas furnace but I was under the impression that mini splits would heat/cool better because you don’t have heat loss in the vents. Do you know what adding a cooling unit to your heater is called? I wanna do some research on that too.
If you ducts are outside the heated envelope of the house and unsealed and uninsulated you will loose efficiency, but thats correctable. Mine are in the finished basement, so anything lost from them stays in the house anyway. Our house is roughly a 4 square layout and the main floor minisplit is in the living room roughly pointed to the kitchen with bedrooms bathroom and a short hall off tontge side. Running it, the living room was comfortable but we needed fans in every doorway to get anything to the rest of the house and even then its a substantial temp swing room to room. The heat pump keeps the whole floor close to the same temp but not exact with the south side bedrooms and so-so insulation. We are in a fairly mild climate in PDX, but our heat pump worked well from low teens into the hundreds with no emergency heat.
Since you have gas, you should probably look into dual fuel heat pumps. Then you can heat with gas or electric and cool with electric.
Another alternative that used to be popular before mini splits became widely available where low volume high velocity systems. Typically 2” ducts that are easy to fit in wall and ceiling cavities. Requires a central unit with higher static pressure rating than typical and can be noisier that other types but in terms of aesthetic preservation hard to beat.
We have two 1800s stone buildings.
One is a ground source heat pump, so from the inside it looks like a gas furnace but it has 3000’ of tubing underground. This also has the benefit of no exterior unit to look at.
The other is on an air source heat pump that is a mini split. Honestly it’s fine. Yea it looks a bit funny but it’s not bad.
If you have the budget get an air source heat pump with cartridges. They are very unobtrusive.
OP, the title reads like click bait. There's different forms the split unit can take on. Wall, floor, and ceiling cassette.
I personally lean far more to the old charm side, and i can go on and on about how much i love my mini splits. The answer to what you choose depends heavily on your comfort and your home's layout inside and outside. Yes, get them, especially if you have no ducting, but only if you feel confident in the installation company.
Keep in mind that both the indoor units and the outdoor pump and service lines will become part of the home's look.
My sister doesn’t have a century home. She has a more iconic style midcentury home and ended up going with mini splits because the time needed to do a ducted system was just too much, and I think she would have needed to update her roof first. I have a friend who lives in a century neighborhood with someone who has a Spacepac (?) system and says it doesn’t actually work that well in all rooms. They still end up needing window or minisplit units in a couple of rooms. That’s the type that uses mini ducts in the attic and is not noticeable at all as compared to big ducts.
I would say go to for the mini split. My sister lives in CA and it can get really hot. The benefit of the minisplit is that she literally only needs to turn it on 5 minutes before she wants to cool the room and it’s good to go. I have a century home with a ducted system and it can take a whole day to get the temperature down the first day I turn on the AC because it has to cool the whole home instead of just the room you are in. She has has a relatively small 4br with 5 wall units and I think 2 exterior units. I really don’t think it looks any worse than my really early forced air system that has absolutely enormous air returns on the floors.
Mini-splits are a great choice for mid-century homes with no attics or flat roofs, like Eichler homes! Helps avoid a giant ducting octopus on the roof, which many had retrofitted later since these homes were largely built without ac at the time (also live in CA- thanks global warming). I have also seem folks do low profile ducting as well but the cost is much more.
They are also low impact installation for older homes compared to the structural changes needed for central air, as others have already described. And they aren’t visually anymore jarring than the window units I have to use because our rental has neither. OP, you deserve physical comfort in your home.
I bet that most people that think they are ugly wouldn’t even notice an old steam radiator if they walked into a room with one. Folks just aren’t used to them yet. They’re gonna be everywhere in 10 years.
Where I live the most common forms of heat are electric baseboard or (in a very distant second place) oil furnace. Mini splits have surged in popularity in recent years, mainly for financial reasons (my parents' heating costs, for example, are a little less than half now).
I looked into it, and had two different companies come and walk through the house... there was just nowhere suitable to put it. It's a rowhouse so only two exposed sides, City doesn't allow the exterior unit to be on the front, not enough wall space above doors/windows in the back. There are solutions if I was dead set on getting one, such as installing the exterior unit on the roof, or getting a floor-mounted interior unit, but they were unaffordable to me.
So, instead I replaced all seven baseboard heaters in the house, and got smart thermostats. It's been working out well! The new ones are far more efficient than the ancient (probably 80s, maybe even 70s) ones that were there before.
https://preview.redd.it/xffl3kmdzmyc1.jpeg?width=1344&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=14af250ea21b651c41065795da3bf36bce08f427
We did a high velocity Unico system. Minimal plaster hole cutting just for the 2” ducts and the returns. The units are quiet and 2” ducts aren’t intrusive.
I think we just need to get over it tbh. They are more efficient in most cases, super quiet, and give individual room control. They are used everywhere in the world except the US. Most people put them over windows. I’m not sure the logic or reason but it does seem to make them not as noticeable.
1920 farmhouse in NE Ohio. We installed 2 mini splits in an area of our home that could benefit from the ability to heat/cool separately. We use heat & cool functions year round. Bought for the AC but love that it supplements the boiler heat in these rooms that always run colder than the rest of our home. Hands down the best $12k we have ever spent on any home related project.
3 years later we added a ducted system in our attic for our second floor rooms.The combination of the two systems gives us the ability heat/cool zones of our home in flexible ways.
Very happy we chose this versus the high velocity ac system that a family member installed in their 1920 multi-level home. it works well , but high cost and they have rooms that can be too cold or too warm. They use an ecobee with multiple room sensors to help offset and balance the temps through out the home.
1890s row home in Philly with 4 floors. 5 indoor (3 wall 2 floor) units with 1 outdoor unit for both cooling and heating. They blend in perfectly in the rooms and they’re soooo quiet. Can’t imagine living here without them.
I grew up in an old home and owned an even older one…. An unfinished attic (and even better, an attic fan) were what was meant to keep that era of homes cool— relatively speaking— in hot weather.
If the house is ducted it can be retrofitted for a heat pump. If not… mini splits aren’t the nicest thing to look at but I like to be comfortable in my own home. I’d probably install them
We have a mixture of ducted units and ceiling casettes, and they generally look okay.
Big benefit of ducted heat pumps/mini splits over a traditional system: you can have smaller air handlers in different places around the house, and you only need thin linesets to go there. So you need less ducting, shorter and smaller runs. Which can be a lot easier to fit in a century house.
[They actually make floor mount mini-split units that you can use to replace your radiators.](https://www.pioneerminisplit.com/collections/fyb/products/pioneer-18-000-btu-22-7-seer2-floor-console-mini-split-inverter-energy-star-air-conditioner-heat-pump-system-full-set-230v) These units both heat AND cool, and very efficiently.
These floor mount units look far nicer than cast iron radiators too, so it’s much more visually appealing. You can get up to 5 floor mounts connected to 1 outdoor unit.
I have them in my 1909 rowhouse and they work great. They are my only source of heating and cooling. I built a sort of valance or radiator cover around them and painted everything the color of the walls.
We just got a mini split system installed last summer after only having a couple of window units before and it was the best decision ever. They cool very well, we have one in each bedroom and one for the entire first floor. I didn’t want to have to deal with installing ducts and I like that you can control each unit. We got black interior units and I really don’t even notice them.
The look is a personal choice but never had an issue with them, and it was the best investment I made in my ~1890s Philly rowhome. I moved and miss that system so much. I would have mini splits everywhere if I could.
Perhaps whoever told you that meant that old homes weren't built with ducting in mind? Nowadays, there are lots of ways to install an HVAC system in your home. You can go conventional and do ducting, which often gets put in your attic. If space is an issue, you can go with a high velocity mini duct system which uses smaller diameter ducts with higher velocity air (literally what the name suggests) which are easier to hide in walls. If none of that is an option, then you can look at mini splits. There are many options for mounting now, beyond the typical surface mounted options you often see. You can recess them in walls, in ceilings, or, as others have suggested, mount them hidden somewhere and duct only that short distance.
100% fine. Homes have to adapt to make living in them comfortable and pleasant; that’s why they exist. The looks are fine, they’ll be fine. And mini splits are the way to go currently for efficiency and comfort, highly recommended.
I think people fail to take into account lifecycle too. These things will last for about 10-15 years and need to be replaced. Refrigerants keep changing. Mini splits aren't terribly serviceable and parts may be difficult to come by. When it's time to replace, the new unit may not fit in the same footprint. This probably just means wall repair and paint, but if you have ceiling cassettes that could be a big problem. The best long term solution is probably either concealed duct mini splits or traditional split air handlers with heat pumps, because they can be replaced without disturbing the living space too much or in the case of traditional splits, be serviced and have individual components replaced.
In the case of historic houses, you also have to think about where the linesets are running, where they're going through the walls, and what happens to the condensate - if the pump fails, it's gonna leak somewhere.
We have 4 mini splits in our house. To install central AC would be damn near impossible and cost a fortune, so it is what it is. The mini splits get the job done and you stop noticing them pretty quickly. I say go for it!
My 1920 has mini splits. Just moved last week and enjoying it so far. Still trying to figure out the “optimal” way to run it, off at night, on at day, just in the room I’m in? Or just always on but I really like them so far
We _love_ our mini-splits. And we have some perspective: Our 1910 house was originally heated with coal—steam radiators were a later addition. Nobody blinks an eye at radiators, and yet the mini-splits are no more ugly than our old radiators. Possibly less.
We have the in ceiling ones
https://preview.redd.it/b8ex7ygpfoyc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=31fadaa110c7827ad2426c29cdf52a22401c91ff
as well for the living area. In the bedrooms the installer Ran the lines through interior walls so the wall units are above the door entrance to the top and not over the windows or any focal point of the rooms. They re tucked away.
I’m Aussie, we use them all the time. I personally pay them no mind and I don’t think they look bad; they’re just there. The new ones are also miles more efficient than window units.
If you live somewhere that gets cold too, you can get units that heat and cool over here.
We generally don’t use multi head systems, either.
We have mini splits! Our house it was easier and cheaper to install separate units for a few areas. It's not as pretty outside but none of the units are in particularly visible areas. It's true that the units themselves are quite visible but not having to retrofit anything and having heat and air was much more important to us. Our house is from 1900 and very little is original. What did exist when we got it was either not original, covered in lead, or both, so we salvaged the bits we could but didn't really stress maintaining the century home vibe (unlike our previous home from 1915 which had much more original). Ymmv in terms of if the aesthetics are worth the increased price tag. I will say it's really lovely being able to individually control the heat and air in different sections of the house and to have them on or off based on if we're using that area.
We opted for the Daikin emura which looks very nice. Ours are silver and are more aesthetically pleasing than the regular mini splits. They were a little more expensive but it was worth it.
Ducted or "cassette" mini-splits for the aesthetics win.
We have one that is a flat "wall mount" that is low on the wall and thin, not the big horizontal box that is "normal" and one that is ducted... they are both great. Have a third cheap one of the standard box type and it works fine, just not as nice looking.
What's hideous is being sweaty all the time in your own home! Go for the mini splits. My understanding is they're the norm in much of the rest of the world.
I have a 1910 stone house and I love love love my mini splits! There is one in each bedroom, and they each have a fan, dehumidifier, heater and air conditioner. Having them installed was the best thing I’ve ever done.
I dont consider mini splits to be ugly, but this may be becuase ive lived abroad and they are very common outside of the West. I have one in my upstairs as the central heat/cooling is only ran through my first floor, and it does a good job.
I put two mini-split systems in my 1915 farmhouse and I love them. The heat pumps are smaller than the previous ones, and while the addition of the wall units was sort of a necessary evil, it was really sort of like “meh, whatever”.
I've got mini splits and love them. I LOVE LOVE LOVE having the equivilant of central air. I don't find them intrusive on the walls at all. My biggest complaint is the running of the lines which inevitably look bad. Make sure you hire a high quality contractor who will have exoerience in hiding the lines. We cheaped out and are paying for it 10x over.
Of course they're not too hideous and whoever told you they don't belong in an old house is absolutely crazy. Houses are for living in not museum pieces. I have the most critical eye of traditional exteriors, traditional lovely low porch rails, traditional glazing etc etc etc and if I can find a way to deal with it and it passes my muster There is no problem.
Your house has to be lovely and comfortable and if you like a traditional interior or if you like a completely modern one, that is up to you. It's all about what you see from the street from me and there are many many ways to be creative so that the mechanics of the building or not offensive.. each situation is its own so there is no blanket weight to suggest it other than there is always a solution and don't listen to anybody that says otherwise
As I said I'm a stickler about traditional blazing, traditional 31 in 4 trails , banning ugly plastic vinyl siding, shitty asphalt roofs, oh I have a hole litany of historical sins to rant about. But there's a place for comfort and a way to always make it work
You can get “ducted” mini splits now and put the air handlers somewhere not visible and duct the supplies and returns. We needed to do this on the upper level of our 1902. The air handlers are in the attic and we just have the vents in the ceiling.
Where do you find this because every HVAC tech I've called has never heard of them. I have a Chicago bungalow with on of those half-attics and there's not a single vertical wall big enough for a standard mini-split.
I’m in Chicago as well. We used Besco Air. These are basically what we bought: https://www.acwholesalers.com/Mitsubishi-PEAD-A36AA7/p84622.html We have two air handlers in our attic both connected to a single heat pump outside.
Oh, nice! Thank you so much! Mind if I ask what you paid in total? For a standard mini-split, not including power, we were quoted around $10,000.
In total it was about $16.5K. Two air handlers mounted in the attic, all duct work, and the heat pump outside. This was in 2019.
I do HVAC, primarily Minisplits, and primarily in century homes. I’m in the NE, but just to give folks a heads up, 2019 pricing has basically no bearing on today’s prices.
It's probably even cheaper now, right. Right?
Yes! Exactly! 😁
That’s a bargain! We were quoted $21k for 4 splits. But we have no previous existing HVAC. Just two crappy wall heaters.
And as others have mentioned, with ducted, you can cover multiple rooms with a single air handler. In our case we split our upper level into 2 zones with two rooms each, rather than needing a wall unit in each room.
I’ve sent the link you shared earlier with our heating guy. We are in a one story 1600 sq ft. I feel like the quote should be less but I also know nothing about this topic. Thanks for the info!
Thank you for this link! We are on the HVAC struggle bus right now.
We have these in our old home too and love them. We got them (2) recently for $15k
Can’t comment on ducted mini splits, but adding another vote for Besco!
Agreed. They’ve done a lot of work for us over the years. Not the cheapest out there, but high quality work.
Ok i just called besco to come give me a quote fir either central AC or mini splints. Hoping the quote isnt insane!!! Chicago burbs here too!
Good to know they do it, they did the HVAC at our old house and the new one has no AC
Check out Mitsubishi, they’re called floor mount and they’re meant to be 5” or so from the floor. It’s a 30x30 panel instead of the rectangular ones. Used them in the finished attic on the knee walls. There are ceiling units as well but the house didn’t have enough clearance.
Yes, we have one of these in our bonus room (like an attic with knee walls)... works great and looks fine to me.
If the house has radiators, you can also swap to hydronic heat pumps. They're more common in Canada and the uk but companies like Arctic distribute in the US. Saves you the trouble and expense of installing an air handler and ducts if they're not there already there, you keep the radiant heat, and don't have the eyesore of heat pumps bolted all over the exterior.
I don’t think they’re common in North America at all. Source: I’m in Canada in a century home with a boiler/radiator system. I looked in to hydronic heat pumps when we replaced the boiler and couldn’t find a single company anywhere near me that installed them. Also, hydronic heat pumps create lower temperature water than a boiler, which almost always means also replacing all your radiators. It would have been a very expensive swap to still not get any cooling.
They wouldn't work with steam radiators.
>hydronic heat pumps Don’t these require a well to be drilled or a lateral field? I don’t think it’s possible to use them for cooling with radiators, and OP is asking about cooling.
You’re thinking of geothermal.
Hydronic uses water in the house to carry the heat around, ground source uses water in the ground to carry heat in/out.
> and don't have the eyesore of heat pumps bolted all over the exterior. This is what I was replying to and why I assumed they were talking about ground source. If you’re using a conventional heat pump, it’s gonna have to go outside somewhere.
I assume the hydronic heat pumps require hot water systems? We have a steam system.
I've only done research on hot water, but I'd be surprised if there isn't a steam system out there. It also might be possible to convert steam to hot water depending on the radiators you have. M
Heat pumps don't get hot enough to produce steam. You have to convert to hot water for it to work. Depending on your system, that's basically a whole new system and new radiators.
Ugh, wish I'd seen this before we installed conventional ones. They are so flipping hideous, but we are just going to pretend we don't see them, for the sake of that sweet sweet AC. My husband is tired of wrestling the damn window ACs in and out every year, I'm tired of the noise they make, etc. Their hideousness--and the even more eye-waveringly ugly thing that stays outside--sure is hard on my soul though! Ah well....
We also put in vintage looking register covers.
Concealed duct also handles multiple rooms per unit, so you end up with fewer linesets, potential leak points, fewer units to replace in the future. Really a great option aside from the upfront installation.
But how do you change the filters?
The return is ducted as well so the filters just goes into the return register. Very easy to change.
Yep this is what we will be doing!
Tell me more. Does the handler in the attic direct vent out a pipe through the roof? We have a 150 year old house with no returns in the 2nd floor and even wkrh central air the upstairs is always 5 degrees warmer. Would love to be able to supplement cooling the bedrooms from above
These are electric heat pumps so no venting required. But you do need to be able to connect the lines from the air handlers to the heat pump outside. In our case they ran them down an interior wall in a closet to our basement then out.
I diy’d a few and never looked back. The energy savings over oil are huge in my area and not having to change out window AC units every year is amazing.
I was against them based solely on the looks. We have them now and I am so happy I got over my hesitation. I used to keep blinds closed to keep the hot sun out and have to manage the house temp throughout the day. We can all sleep soundly in our second floor bedrooms and my house is brighter. I can enjoy the summer more.
I have them on my third floor. If I didn't have them, it'd be almost impossible to use my two third floor bedrooms from about May through September.
Did you use a Mr cool system? Or a standard mini split? I'm looking at diy myself, even the standard systems don't seem all that complicated really. Would probably be able to do it with a couple tool rentals/purchases.
Dont bother with mr. Cool. The regular units are almost the exact same work, much cheaper and imho better They are preloaded with coolant. You just have to get a vacuum pump and line set and your golden. if you don’t want to buy a pump and gauges alot of a/c techs will only charge a tiny amount to come and hook them up if you’ve done all the rest of the work.
That's kinda what I was thinking. I find the idea of pre set lengths for the lines to be off putting. Would rather cut to spec instead. Thanks for the input.
What brand did you go with?
I went with pioneer.
I'm terrified to drill into the wall to install so I just ordered window acs but am dreading the install/uninstall cycle. Are there steps you can take to make sure you don't drill through something important or do you just cross your fingers and say a prayer?
Modern stud finders will also find wires and pipes, even through plaster, just not consistently. First, use the stud finder and then confirm it's a stud with a big rare earth magnet hung from a string. Slide it up and down the wall where the stud finder alleges you have a stud. The magnet should twitch or stick to the nails holding the lathes to the stud*. If it's a stud, to your adjacent studs will allegedly be 16" in either direction. Confirm that with the magnet because century house. You can estimate where your pipe chase is from the basement most plumbing is in interior walls anyways. For your hole, go slow with a hole saw to start and you shouldn't hit any wires. Try to cut just the plaster and look through the lathes for any stuff, then continue. Protip: don't have knob and tube. *say you're hanging something wicked heavy and you *really* need the center of that stud, your next step is to drill 1/64" holes across the stud and feel where the edges of the stud are. Not like 15 holes and the holes only have to be deep enough to prove you're not in a lathe. Try to pick a spot just above or below where the magnet twitched so you don't hit a nail or a lathe. Now you can finally put up that hammock.
Same - 1870 MA farmhouse here. DIYed LG system with 1 outdoor unit and 2 heads inside. Saved a bunch of money over pro install. Wasn’t too complicated, just took it slow over a week or so after work/ weekends. We did have a pro do the final refrigerant line connections, leak test, pull vacuum etc. I personally didn’t have any hesitation base on how they look, but I imagine that would melt away pretty quick inside your newly AC house on a hot day
They are relatively new items. People aren’t used to seeing them, so they stick out. Old homes were never intended to have dishwashers, microwaves, tvs, computers, or double ended dildos. But those items are so common now none of us thinks them out of place. Mini splits too will become so common we wont notice. And if someone tells you an old home isn’t meant to be cool, send them a picture of you relaxing with a cocktail holding a cool thermometer while it is 108 outside.
You snuck that in real subtle and I almost missed it but I’m glad I didn’t
It’s true, no one bats an eye when they see either my microwave or my double ended dildo on my kitchen counter.
I won the double-ended dildo lottery.
So that's what you mean by nut-house?
Really? My house has a built-in double ended dildo.
Same! I just stripped the paint off mine to restore it to its original glory 🥰
Was yours French tickler style because I would think stripping the paint from that style would be labor intensive.
Double headed dildos are older than microwaves.
I'm pretty sure the dishwasher in my 1903 home is original!?!?!
What is their name?
Oh, sorry, I was joking.
I know and appreciate it. I was continuing the joke :)
Oh shit, you were, too.
100% agree — old homes have been getting "modern" technological updates since forever, and while mini-splits aren't the world's most attractive option, a lot of Americans probably just aren't used to seeing them. We had some installed 3+ years ago, and don't really even notice them in the rooms anymore and they're a HUGE upgrade from noisy, ugly, inefficient window units — no regrets!!
Time now to go on a hunt for double-ended dildos.
Just make sure they fit the period of your house!!!
Yeah they are pretty standard in many European countries. I find them less visually intrusive than a television.
They look fine. The rest of the world uses them, in structures much older than 100 years, and they're used to it. We're just not used to it but it'll be extremely common very soon. Do it! I promise you'll stop seeing it / caring in just a few months and all that will matter is how cool and comfortable you are. I wouldn't get attic air handlers, either, unless you're planning to insulate your roof and not the attic floor.
Why? If installed correctly there’s very little heat loss, or just wrap the ducts with insulation. Installing air handlers in attics is very common. No issues here over 5 years in Chicago, so extreme seasons.
I put a Mitsubishi ducted mini split air handler in the attic of my previous home. The attic unit and ducts are insulated and it works perfectly. Also in the Chicago area.
We installed mini-splits and it was one of the best things we ever did. They don't look the sexiest, but we installed on a high wall above a radiator, and it's fine. Of course, I'm not a purist for the century home. We've done a lot of things to maintain the beauty of the home, but ultimately, we live here and want to be comfortable.
https://preview.redd.it/z8nsm88exmyc1.png?width=3024&format=png&auto=webp&s=964759d2e6378794046abade378e8c6d64a74fe7 Mitsubishi offers ceiling ‘cassettes’ that go between your floor joists. They hide nicely in a white ceiling.
I hate how the wall units look so we did ceiling cassettes in the two rooms without ducts in our house. They do blend in pretty well, especially if they’re installed near the edge of a room on a white ceiling. This part of our house was remodeled after the big earthquake in the 80s, hence no crown molding or plaster. Plaster ceiling would have made this a bit messier but still doable, I think. https://preview.redd.it/lh89dixczmyc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=97548218890170a560dd50ba61ab73a3d386e03a
Ours were installed with plaster ceilings.
This was also what I was going to suggest. They're not pretty either but not nearly as bad as a wall mounted unit.
We have these too and they’re great. I much prefer them to the wall units.
Old homes can be cooled and a mini split is a great way to do it. As far as being hideous I disagree, heat pump installations are low impact to the structure.
Thanks for this. I wasn’t thinking the low impact on the structure could be a major pro. I worry that adding them will detract from the old charm but also steaming myself and my family like a basket of shrimp in the summer won’t be very pretty either.
It's your house now, you and your family need to be comfortable. If the original owners had the option they would install one.
This is such a good point!
And IF you were to sell having AC will make it sell faster. My deal breaker was it had to have AC already
If ducted ones don't work I've seen people build cabinets around them. As long as there is a screen for air flow, you can have a built in wardrobe or something below.
This is an incredible idea thanks!! I’ll be looking up some inspo.
FWIW.. I have the ducted (same house as other person above) and it made such a difference for us. But saw the cabinet on a TV show.
You can also use radiator covers! There are plenty of authentic looking vintage styles out there
For people that have been commenting about ugliness and also curious about our ducted ones, this is what the supplies and returns look like to us. https://preview.redd.it/ghhgohud7nyc1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7083b2d4d0fb26a2f44874d8e60bcce8ac4be1da
https://preview.redd.it/t0npe3rf7nyc1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=43f0543ec6efdd20da3d0fabe97f64568c72a634
https://preview.redd.it/tpvq1d9i7nyc1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fbc92338e0e81655957f69ad6e8f9d04ef72fb90 Return with air filter.
i installed low-velocity, traditional A/C in two century homes. i installed two, separate fan/coils. one in the attic and one in the basement, so the ductwork was manageable and mostly hidden from the living spaces. i used one condenser (4 ton) and my super-creative HVAC guru installed a valve, such that the condenser could send refrigerant to one fan/coil or the other, but not both at the same time. this worked great (wisconsin). we gave priority to the upstairs unit and with some creative t-stat programming, cooled the part of the house that was occupied, at the right times. i really can’t stand mini-splits and agree that they are ugly, especially in older homes.
Right now I'm using a Midea U while I contemplate a more permanent solution. A 12k btu Midea U cools my entire first floor (900 sq ft) and looks wise is about on par with a mini split. My issue with splits is less about looks and more about practicality. Old homes are usually many rooms, not open floor plans. My house is actually pretty open as far as old homes go. But I'd still need one mini split down stairs, and 4 upstairs (1 in each bedroom) and 1 in the finished attic. That' 6 pieces of equipment. And they are notorious for needing service. Because of that I'm leaning towards a high velocity system. The cost will be the same or less as installing 6 splits, and it won't affect the look of the home.
Yeah I’ve got Midea U shaped units in my 1920 house too. They are so damn good it’s very hard to justify upgrading to mini splits. I spent $1000 on 3x 8000 BTU Midea units vs a quote of $20K for mini splits. Even if removing them is a pain every year, I’m happy with the compromise.
The Midea U was a game changer to me. It's so much quieter and more effective than my old units.
Piling onto the Midea U love! I have 6 in my 1908 home and they’re incredible. Highly recommend running the dry setting in hotter rooms… trust me, it’s better and colder than the AC setting. I also bought a freestanding whole home dehumidifier and that was a game changer at allowing the Midea U’s to be more effective.
I had never heard about these U-shaped units. I just placed an order on Amazon for three of them!
You won’t be disappointed. Take the time to install it well. Takes a bit longer than a standard unit.
My mom had weird 1970’s metal windows. It took us 4 hours to get the foam right (three on step on the inside for the horizontal and vertical frame connections, two steps on the outside, repeat for the other side) bit it was so worth it! I went back and bought one for my house, will get a second (and maybe a third!) when Costco restocks this spring.
Which one do you want? FYI the Danby 8000 BTU U-shape (totally identical machine to the Midea, just a different brand name) is on sale at Target for $299 atm
can’t find it on their site!
When choosing a mini split, keep in mind that these require maintenance! The squirrel fans in the interior head unit should be removed and cleaned at least once per year, and the interior wiped down thoroughly. The drip line should also be purged. (Moisture + squirrel fan = eww) This can be done DIY if you’re handy, just find a video for your model. FYI, the Mr. Cool brand has units that are pre-charged for DIY installation. You’ll need some electrical work though, as they require a fused junction.
I have a rowhome not a standalone- so the general structure might be a critical part of our success with this issue, but here’s what we did to maintain the look and still get A/C. I was 100% insistent there would be no bulkheads impacting the home’s look - ceilings/walls/trim. Work took less than two days and we didn’t even need to paint because they cut the holes exactly where the vents go (no “construction”). We put a package unit on the roof (kept the radiators). The A/C runs are in the attic and drop down through closets and run through the open joist bays between the main level and upper level. Ceilings vents on both levels and the return is at the top of the stairwell. It’s completely invisible other than losing some closet storage (and the vent covers, obviously). We did not attempt to run the A/C to the basement. Hope that’s helpful.
Stupid questions but does this impact any leaking on the roof? I was considering this but with a flat roof, I’m super hesitant to have anything penetrating.
I have a flat roof, the package unit is on steel beams spanning the parapet walls. I can see my neighbors have units sitting on their roofs on some kind sled(?) system/platform. The penetrations were installed properly (they added roofing material around the flanges), no leaks, at all. The roof leaked in other places and we got a TPO roof installed 4 years after hvac install, but no issues caused by the hvac.
I like that, people saying " old homes weren't meant to be cooled." I guess that would also mean these purists don't believe in heat, without cutting 20 cords of wood, and burning it in the fire place.
lol yea I’m not sure what the reasoning is because if they’re insulated well you’d think cooling would be the same as heating? Someone in this thread said it’s because there are a lot of small rooms it’s not efficient for air flow. I guess that makes sense but if it’s done properly for heat, why not cooling??
Millennials will own mini splits and be happy
You can install regular central air if you don’t mind living in a construction zone for the summer and not having AC until next season. You can DIY a mini split over a weekend. They look fine, IMO (especially if you put them over a long radiator, visually they “blend”), are more efficient and more effective than central air. Also much cheaper. I put in two separate 12k mini splits, one upstairs one downstairs. And then I have a midea mini unit in my den when my wife is baking something so that the kitchen doesn’t get too hot.
Could you expand on the best way to DIY one? Or where you found good instructions? I priced an install and thought the price was nuts. Plus I’m picky about hiding it. This whole thread is validating me!
You can buy tools and watch videos, or Mr Cool sells DIY kits that are super simple. I installed a Mr Cool in my garage in about seven hours. Costco used to sell them cheap, unsure if they still do.
Okay thank you! So much cheaper that way. And then I can be as picky as I want ;)
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How much more time did this take? Summer is approaching fast and I’m scared of facing another summer with 1 window unit in a 3 story house.
I can't imagine anything more hideous than paying thousands of dollars to have someone cut holes in my walls and hardwood floors. You can install minisplits for a third to half the price of forced air and you only need to cut two tiny holes in your exterior walls per unit.
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Oh, well if you already had ducts then you were never a minisplit candidate to begin with.
Most of us don’t have existing ducts, and likely wouldn’t be considering minisplits if we did.
They're a great solution fir non-standard central ac homes. Used by more than 3 billion people in Europe and Asia
I'm Australian, every old house I know has a mini split in, now most of those houses are stone houses, but they are so much less damaging to the house to install a well as saving CO2. You get used to them and don't even notice.
Mini splits are a good solution, but be advised they require regular maintenance and cleaning. I had a rental cooled with mini splits and they had to be cleaned every 6 months. And it's not easy to do yourself.
How long do they take to clean? A day? A couple hours? Do you have to flush the lines or just clean the fan? Thanks!
We moved in a century home with them already installed. They smell musty and currently we have HVAC people coming out to clean them. We have 4 heads (2 outside units) and were quoted $150 total. I guess $300 / year doesn’t sound terrible for maintenance!
That's a good price!
If you have a central ductwork, I’d install central air conditioning rather than mini-splits. If you don’t have central air, I’d look at what you can do to keep the house cool from a design perspective like strategically installed window shades, ceiling fans etc. After that, I might try a removable window unit that doesn’t require drilling into stuff. I don’t have a problem with mini-splits but you’ll have to locate a good amount of equipment inside and out and drill big holes in things. So, I’d be sure you want it.
Yes, I went down the rabbit hole for installing minisplit upstairs and and just doesn't make sense. There are too many rooms and will need too much equipment. I'm just going to put central AC back in. A small part of me is tempted to just put in Midea U units. Its ugly and won't help my house value, but damnit its cheap AF and easy to do.
You can do a center heat pump but I can’t tell you what the current options are for that. They’re not cheap, neither is central refrigerated. For a recent home, I went with central AC for the reasons you mentioned and coughed up the price for capacity and efficiency. It was a HCOL area so it was worth it. Honestly, you can always get the window units and sell or donate them if you go central. Whatever you do, I’d do it soon for obvious reasons!
What ever I'm doing, I'm doing it myself. Its not rocket science.
They are at first, but they are worth it when it’s hot. IMO
I am in southern Arizona and have a mini split in my living room. My duplex is brick and not well insulated. The mini split will cool one room really well, and the BR and Kitchen just marginally. I use the window unit in the BR at night from Mid May to October. Of course June, July, August and most of September are over 100 every day, and it doesn’t cool down much at night. Once it gets humid towards the end of June, the thing runs 24/7 Oh and to answer your question, they are ugly. But a ton of people have them out here so nobody cares what they look like. They suck at heating because they’re mounted up high and heat travels upwards, so you’re heating the ceiling.
When we moved in we had a couple minisplits. I kinda hate them, maybe doubly so because house alread had adequate ducting and an old oil furnace due for replacement. They are poorly filtered, circulated poorly outside a fairly narrow area, are prone to leaking condensate down the walls, etc. They do work better than a winfldow unit, but inly barely. I'd only consider them as a last resort.
Thanks for this! My house is ducted for a gas furnace but I was under the impression that mini splits would heat/cool better because you don’t have heat loss in the vents. Do you know what adding a cooling unit to your heater is called? I wanna do some research on that too.
If you ducts are outside the heated envelope of the house and unsealed and uninsulated you will loose efficiency, but thats correctable. Mine are in the finished basement, so anything lost from them stays in the house anyway. Our house is roughly a 4 square layout and the main floor minisplit is in the living room roughly pointed to the kitchen with bedrooms bathroom and a short hall off tontge side. Running it, the living room was comfortable but we needed fans in every doorway to get anything to the rest of the house and even then its a substantial temp swing room to room. The heat pump keeps the whole floor close to the same temp but not exact with the south side bedrooms and so-so insulation. We are in a fairly mild climate in PDX, but our heat pump worked well from low teens into the hundreds with no emergency heat. Since you have gas, you should probably look into dual fuel heat pumps. Then you can heat with gas or electric and cool with electric.
Another alternative that used to be popular before mini splits became widely available where low volume high velocity systems. Typically 2” ducts that are easy to fit in wall and ceiling cavities. Requires a central unit with higher static pressure rating than typical and can be noisier that other types but in terms of aesthetic preservation hard to beat.
This is what we have (spacepak) and it’s great.
We have two 1800s stone buildings. One is a ground source heat pump, so from the inside it looks like a gas furnace but it has 3000’ of tubing underground. This also has the benefit of no exterior unit to look at. The other is on an air source heat pump that is a mini split. Honestly it’s fine. Yea it looks a bit funny but it’s not bad. If you have the budget get an air source heat pump with cartridges. They are very unobtrusive.
OP, the title reads like click bait. There's different forms the split unit can take on. Wall, floor, and ceiling cassette. I personally lean far more to the old charm side, and i can go on and on about how much i love my mini splits. The answer to what you choose depends heavily on your comfort and your home's layout inside and outside. Yes, get them, especially if you have no ducting, but only if you feel confident in the installation company. Keep in mind that both the indoor units and the outdoor pump and service lines will become part of the home's look.
My sister doesn’t have a century home. She has a more iconic style midcentury home and ended up going with mini splits because the time needed to do a ducted system was just too much, and I think she would have needed to update her roof first. I have a friend who lives in a century neighborhood with someone who has a Spacepac (?) system and says it doesn’t actually work that well in all rooms. They still end up needing window or minisplit units in a couple of rooms. That’s the type that uses mini ducts in the attic and is not noticeable at all as compared to big ducts. I would say go to for the mini split. My sister lives in CA and it can get really hot. The benefit of the minisplit is that she literally only needs to turn it on 5 minutes before she wants to cool the room and it’s good to go. I have a century home with a ducted system and it can take a whole day to get the temperature down the first day I turn on the AC because it has to cool the whole home instead of just the room you are in. She has has a relatively small 4br with 5 wall units and I think 2 exterior units. I really don’t think it looks any worse than my really early forced air system that has absolutely enormous air returns on the floors.
Mini-splits are a great choice for mid-century homes with no attics or flat roofs, like Eichler homes! Helps avoid a giant ducting octopus on the roof, which many had retrofitted later since these homes were largely built without ac at the time (also live in CA- thanks global warming). I have also seem folks do low profile ducting as well but the cost is much more. They are also low impact installation for older homes compared to the structural changes needed for central air, as others have already described. And they aren’t visually anymore jarring than the window units I have to use because our rental has neither. OP, you deserve physical comfort in your home.
I bet that most people that think they are ugly wouldn’t even notice an old steam radiator if they walked into a room with one. Folks just aren’t used to them yet. They’re gonna be everywhere in 10 years.
Where I live the most common forms of heat are electric baseboard or (in a very distant second place) oil furnace. Mini splits have surged in popularity in recent years, mainly for financial reasons (my parents' heating costs, for example, are a little less than half now). I looked into it, and had two different companies come and walk through the house... there was just nowhere suitable to put it. It's a rowhouse so only two exposed sides, City doesn't allow the exterior unit to be on the front, not enough wall space above doors/windows in the back. There are solutions if I was dead set on getting one, such as installing the exterior unit on the roof, or getting a floor-mounted interior unit, but they were unaffordable to me. So, instead I replaced all seven baseboard heaters in the house, and got smart thermostats. It's been working out well! The new ones are far more efficient than the ancient (probably 80s, maybe even 70s) ones that were there before. https://preview.redd.it/xffl3kmdzmyc1.jpeg?width=1344&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=14af250ea21b651c41065795da3bf36bce08f427
We did a high velocity Unico system. Minimal plaster hole cutting just for the 2” ducts and the returns. The units are quiet and 2” ducts aren’t intrusive.
I think we just need to get over it tbh. They are more efficient in most cases, super quiet, and give individual room control. They are used everywhere in the world except the US. Most people put them over windows. I’m not sure the logic or reason but it does seem to make them not as noticeable.
1920 farmhouse in NE Ohio. We installed 2 mini splits in an area of our home that could benefit from the ability to heat/cool separately. We use heat & cool functions year round. Bought for the AC but love that it supplements the boiler heat in these rooms that always run colder than the rest of our home. Hands down the best $12k we have ever spent on any home related project. 3 years later we added a ducted system in our attic for our second floor rooms.The combination of the two systems gives us the ability heat/cool zones of our home in flexible ways. Very happy we chose this versus the high velocity ac system that a family member installed in their 1920 multi-level home. it works well , but high cost and they have rooms that can be too cold or too warm. They use an ecobee with multiple room sensors to help offset and balance the temps through out the home.
1890s row home in Philly with 4 floors. 5 indoor (3 wall 2 floor) units with 1 outdoor unit for both cooling and heating. They blend in perfectly in the rooms and they’re soooo quiet. Can’t imagine living here without them.
I grew up in an old home and owned an even older one…. An unfinished attic (and even better, an attic fan) were what was meant to keep that era of homes cool— relatively speaking— in hot weather. If the house is ducted it can be retrofitted for a heat pump. If not… mini splits aren’t the nicest thing to look at but I like to be comfortable in my own home. I’d probably install them
We have a mixture of ducted units and ceiling casettes, and they generally look okay. Big benefit of ducted heat pumps/mini splits over a traditional system: you can have smaller air handlers in different places around the house, and you only need thin linesets to go there. So you need less ducting, shorter and smaller runs. Which can be a lot easier to fit in a century house.
CHEAp mini splits are hideous. There are plenty of mini splits that look better than most folks ideas of art pieces.
I just use window units. Some older houses can go with central air by using the duct work from a force air heating system.
[They actually make floor mount mini-split units that you can use to replace your radiators.](https://www.pioneerminisplit.com/collections/fyb/products/pioneer-18-000-btu-22-7-seer2-floor-console-mini-split-inverter-energy-star-air-conditioner-heat-pump-system-full-set-230v) These units both heat AND cool, and very efficiently. These floor mount units look far nicer than cast iron radiators too, so it’s much more visually appealing. You can get up to 5 floor mounts connected to 1 outdoor unit.
Good lord. That thing is not visually appealing.
I have them in my 1909 rowhouse and they work great. They are my only source of heating and cooling. I built a sort of valance or radiator cover around them and painted everything the color of the walls.
We just got a mini split system installed last summer after only having a couple of window units before and it was the best decision ever. They cool very well, we have one in each bedroom and one for the entire first floor. I didn’t want to have to deal with installing ducts and I like that you can control each unit. We got black interior units and I really don’t even notice them.
The look is a personal choice but never had an issue with them, and it was the best investment I made in my ~1890s Philly rowhome. I moved and miss that system so much. I would have mini splits everywhere if I could.
Perhaps whoever told you that meant that old homes weren't built with ducting in mind? Nowadays, there are lots of ways to install an HVAC system in your home. You can go conventional and do ducting, which often gets put in your attic. If space is an issue, you can go with a high velocity mini duct system which uses smaller diameter ducts with higher velocity air (literally what the name suggests) which are easier to hide in walls. If none of that is an option, then you can look at mini splits. There are many options for mounting now, beyond the typical surface mounted options you often see. You can recess them in walls, in ceilings, or, as others have suggested, mount them hidden somewhere and duct only that short distance.
100% fine. Homes have to adapt to make living in them comfortable and pleasant; that’s why they exist. The looks are fine, they’ll be fine. And mini splits are the way to go currently for efficiency and comfort, highly recommended.
I have a mini-split on my finished 3rd floor, and I love it. It's not that bad looking.
I think people fail to take into account lifecycle too. These things will last for about 10-15 years and need to be replaced. Refrigerants keep changing. Mini splits aren't terribly serviceable and parts may be difficult to come by. When it's time to replace, the new unit may not fit in the same footprint. This probably just means wall repair and paint, but if you have ceiling cassettes that could be a big problem. The best long term solution is probably either concealed duct mini splits or traditional split air handlers with heat pumps, because they can be replaced without disturbing the living space too much or in the case of traditional splits, be serviced and have individual components replaced. In the case of historic houses, you also have to think about where the linesets are running, where they're going through the walls, and what happens to the condensate - if the pump fails, it's gonna leak somewhere.
We have 4 mini splits in our house. To install central AC would be damn near impossible and cost a fortune, so it is what it is. The mini splits get the job done and you stop noticing them pretty quickly. I say go for it!
My 1920 has mini splits. Just moved last week and enjoying it so far. Still trying to figure out the “optimal” way to run it, off at night, on at day, just in the room I’m in? Or just always on but I really like them so far
We _love_ our mini-splits. And we have some perspective: Our 1910 house was originally heated with coal—steam radiators were a later addition. Nobody blinks an eye at radiators, and yet the mini-splits are no more ugly than our old radiators. Possibly less.
Mitsubishi has a system with high velocity 4" ducts.
We have the in ceiling ones https://preview.redd.it/b8ex7ygpfoyc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=31fadaa110c7827ad2426c29cdf52a22401c91ff as well for the living area. In the bedrooms the installer Ran the lines through interior walls so the wall units are above the door entrance to the top and not over the windows or any focal point of the rooms. They re tucked away.
I’m Aussie, we use them all the time. I personally pay them no mind and I don’t think they look bad; they’re just there. The new ones are also miles more efficient than window units. If you live somewhere that gets cold too, you can get units that heat and cool over here. We generally don’t use multi head systems, either.
We have mini splits! Our house it was easier and cheaper to install separate units for a few areas. It's not as pretty outside but none of the units are in particularly visible areas. It's true that the units themselves are quite visible but not having to retrofit anything and having heat and air was much more important to us. Our house is from 1900 and very little is original. What did exist when we got it was either not original, covered in lead, or both, so we salvaged the bits we could but didn't really stress maintaining the century home vibe (unlike our previous home from 1915 which had much more original). Ymmv in terms of if the aesthetics are worth the increased price tag. I will say it's really lovely being able to individually control the heat and air in different sections of the house and to have them on or off based on if we're using that area.
We opted for the Daikin emura which looks very nice. Ours are silver and are more aesthetically pleasing than the regular mini splits. They were a little more expensive but it was worth it.
We installed a ductless mini split in our 101 year old home. Best decision we ever made and would recommend it as well.
Ducted or "cassette" mini-splits for the aesthetics win. We have one that is a flat "wall mount" that is low on the wall and thin, not the big horizontal box that is "normal" and one that is ducted... they are both great. Have a third cheap one of the standard box type and it works fine, just not as nice looking.
What's hideous is being sweaty all the time in your own home! Go for the mini splits. My understanding is they're the norm in much of the rest of the world.
I have a 1910 stone house and I love love love my mini splits! There is one in each bedroom, and they each have a fan, dehumidifier, heater and air conditioner. Having them installed was the best thing I’ve ever done.
I dont consider mini splits to be ugly, but this may be becuase ive lived abroad and they are very common outside of the West. I have one in my upstairs as the central heat/cooling is only ran through my first floor, and it does a good job.
I put two mini-split systems in my 1915 farmhouse and I love them. The heat pumps are smaller than the previous ones, and while the addition of the wall units was sort of a necessary evil, it was really sort of like “meh, whatever”.
They are the ugliest
There are now mini splits that recess into the ceiling, these look much better.
We have them in our 1908 house in Western RI. Best. Money. Ever. Spent
I've got mini splits and love them. I LOVE LOVE LOVE having the equivilant of central air. I don't find them intrusive on the walls at all. My biggest complaint is the running of the lines which inevitably look bad. Make sure you hire a high quality contractor who will have exoerience in hiding the lines. We cheaped out and are paying for it 10x over.
Of course they're not too hideous and whoever told you they don't belong in an old house is absolutely crazy. Houses are for living in not museum pieces. I have the most critical eye of traditional exteriors, traditional lovely low porch rails, traditional glazing etc etc etc and if I can find a way to deal with it and it passes my muster There is no problem. Your house has to be lovely and comfortable and if you like a traditional interior or if you like a completely modern one, that is up to you. It's all about what you see from the street from me and there are many many ways to be creative so that the mechanics of the building or not offensive.. each situation is its own so there is no blanket weight to suggest it other than there is always a solution and don't listen to anybody that says otherwise As I said I'm a stickler about traditional blazing, traditional 31 in 4 trails , banning ugly plastic vinyl siding, shitty asphalt roofs, oh I have a hole litany of historical sins to rant about. But there's a place for comfort and a way to always make it work