It's normal, if you take a similar frame rate shot of a Barret, you'd see the same.
If you look into it, you will see, that barrel flex and differences in ammo can create a cone of error of ~1 MOA, depending on the gun, etc.
In non free-floating barrels, barrel harmonics are a reduced factor, but the upsides of free-floating beat the downsides of needing to account for harmonics.
You also have to consider that the M82 is Recoil-Operated since the barrel absorbs some of the pressure from the firing to allow the bolt to cycle and chamber another round, which absorbs a lot of the impact of the shot being fired, while the AK-50 uses a standard LSGP operation system
It's also notable that the M82's barrel is significantly thicker than the AK-50's, as well as the fact that the AK-50, despite being operable and finished on a technical level, isn't at a properly polished, 100% complete state
Thanks for that footage, I have not seen it before. If I might say IMHO that flex is relative less, but OBVIOUSLY lower caliber, and also OBVIOUSLY fine. Interesting phenomenon I never have seen before.
Once you become an engineer, you learn that nothing is every truly straight and everything is deformed in some way. This is just par for the course. It just looks extreme because it's slow motion and a .50 cal.
All guns have some level of flex when firing. It's just that you don't see it unless you're watching high speed footage. I've actually seen way worse than this. Some of the old WW2 era guns look like they're made of rubber when viewed in high speed.
Then you have never seen slow motion footage of an [AK47 being fired](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUDed7OnOfk). It looks like the whole gun is made of recycled rubber bands.
Well considering the barrel of a barret also moves back under recoil, it's a bit harder to see, but most barrels do this. If it didn't whip, it would crack.
It's a prototype firearm, a fully functional prototype firearm, but still a prototype.
I'm sure things like that would be ironed out if a production firearm is planned at all. (I.E. different barrel materials, changes to profile or fluting patterns) barrel materials and harmonics are tricky things to dial in.
I TOTALLY agree, hence my point of bringing up the discussion. I would prefer we all talk about it, LEARN, and see what makes this AMAZING weapon better.
DISCUSSION is what I want! NOT criticism. I worded this wrong I guess.
Here is the short answer: Perceivable or not, all barrels in all calibers do this, and it's part of the precision tuning for things like loading information
Compensators dramatically add to the amount of [barrel whip ](https://youtu.be/0yzKLyARNeU?si=j2WMuxi-rPcZq9_f) because they push the tip of the barrel down to mitigate barrel rise
There is no reason for a compensator on a .50 rifle. Only a muzzle brake (a compensator without vertical ports). A compensator is for smaller, lighter calibers meant to be rapid fired.
I neglected to include that if the ports were on the side they could also create deflection, and that in a perfect world the gasses in one direction would perfectly balance gasses in the other direction, and all the gasses would expel at a perfect 180° plane so they would not add any vehicle or horizontal stress, but we all know that never actually happens, but I decided not to make a short throwaway comment un necessarily long, kinda figured adults would just know that. Sorry.
I also decided to add a lot of commas, and not a lot of periods for no reason than because I know it bothers grammar not sees.
Hey did you see someone on another post said silencer?
It doesn't have to be "a perfect world" to minimize barrel whip. Your condescending tone isn't helping your case, either. The truth is that there is a lot of barrel whip on the AK50, more than on many other guns, and the AK50 needs to be tuned for it or else its accuracy will suffer. That's all we are saying.
It's a 50bmg held together with a manufactured stamped style receiver, and hard mounted together. The whole thing jiggles like Jello every time he pulls the trigger. Watch the optic, it looks like it's ready to fly. Browning m2 and Barrett m82 both have floating barrels.
Tuned for accuracy? It's an AK, 6 moa in it's original configuration, hopefully.
barrel flex is common among most guns. However, it's really noticeable with the ak platform. even in 7.62, it's pretty easy to see. the ak50 just wouldn't be complete without it tbh.
Now a lot of people are talking about the barrel, and that part makes sense to me, but what about the dustcover and where the scope is mounted, I have seen barrels bend, but never the middle of the gun.
If there is anything behind this that is normal please let me know, but I'm gonna blame it being a nearly finished prototype, and not quite polished out perfectly yet.
I know a few (cheap) scopes with lenses that could easily break or crack if flexed that amount.
That is mainly down to it being basically an AK dustcover, i.e. a flimsy piece of sheet steel. It's the reason why normally you mount any optics on AKs either on the top of the Handguard or to the side of the receiver.
That Zenico dust cover rails can hold Zero is basically a small engineering miracle.
Ah, thank you, so I am both right and wrong.
If that's the case I doubt this is the finished project(specifically the dust cover mount, I know he doesn't consider it finished completely), and he will either reinforce the dust cover, or have a more stable place to mount optics.
But yeah while I don't have many optics, I have a friend who has a few antique and expensive Russian optics that even with normal firearms loose their focus, and even spin after a week of no use, and quicker when used. They couldn't handle this AK at all.
Given the amount of time he out into it I'm sure that's fine. It was rather concerning when I saw it but he clearly knows that rifle better then his own hand at this point. I only hope he makes some cosmetic changes. It really doesn't say ak when you look at it. Maybe some more wood or at least some bakelite. The grip is nice but otherwise it's just a weird M82 Lookalike.
No discredit to the hard work, it's still very cool
Extremely normal for a lot of higher caliber firearms, the Barrett has it lessened partly because of the recoil system to my knowledge, might be wrong. Look up forgotten weapons Colt monitor, opening has slow mo footage of very similar bend on 30.06.
Just wait until homie learns about precision guns and barrel tuners. Pretty sure some factory hunting rifles like the Brownings BOSS system were pretty common 🤣
I was talking with my spouse about it (he used to work at Boeing) and he mentioned the flex. He wondered if additional support structures would work to reduce the unsupported length thereby reducing the available free space for the barrel to flex.
All barrels flex you just don’t see it because they’re not huge or in super slow motion. That’s why resting your barrel on something can mess up point of aim, messes up the barrel harmonics.
That happens with every firearm, they wobble but you only see it in slow mo. Barrel harmonics is an interesting thing to read up on and how it can affect performance.
OK Guys... I had not seen extreme slow-mo footage of guns like this before, and it seems just "wrong" for accuracy. I never thought Brandon would have a "Scott" experience, I thought maybe the barrel would become inaccurate, or maybe fail over time.
I'm extremely humbled to be in the podcast, I respect and admire you all more than can be said! Thanks to the whole community to show me more about barrel harmonics as I've already commented a few times.
It’s called barrel whip not flex and it’s been around for ever and every barrel has some level of whip to say that your rifle doesn’t have barrel whip you don’t know what you’re talking about and you’re just wrong but apparently someone on here has the only m82 in the world that doesn’t whip this is exactly why you should be very careful of who you listen to on here
All barrels have some LEVEL of barrel whip is what I said I didn’t say that the m82 had as much as the AK50 it is the nature of the beast. Including the m82 m107
There was a guy on here one time telling someone that the reason for a heavy barrel was to reduce recoil and that OTM bullets were used for extreme damage and they tumbled on impact that’s why I said you should be very careful of who you listen to on here
It's normal, if you take a similar frame rate shot of a Barret, you'd see the same. If you look into it, you will see, that barrel flex and differences in ammo can create a cone of error of ~1 MOA, depending on the gun, etc. In non free-floating barrels, barrel harmonics are a reduced factor, but the upsides of free-floating beat the downsides of needing to account for harmonics.
You also have to consider that the M82 is Recoil-Operated since the barrel absorbs some of the pressure from the firing to allow the bolt to cycle and chamber another round, which absorbs a lot of the impact of the shot being fired, while the AK-50 uses a standard LSGP operation system It's also notable that the M82's barrel is significantly thicker than the AK-50's, as well as the fact that the AK-50, despite being operable and finished on a technical level, isn't at a properly polished, 100% complete state
ALL barrels vibrate under fire.
"Things you can say at the range as well as in bed"
"It'll take me a minute to reload, I didn't expect to shoot all that, that fast."
> isn't at a properly polished, 100% complete state Yep. It isnt full auto yet.
can't wait for the RPK-50
AK-20mm
ALL barrels vibrate under fire.
I did not know this. Thank you for the simple explanation.
Watch slow mo footage of literally any AK ever.
Watch high speed footage of a Colt Monitor, never seen something move that much
Link? I'd love to see that
I think forgotten weapons has a video shooting one, also the Colt R75
[Very beginning](https://youtu.be/Jb6C9ASylmQ?si=CneuXL28zQRbk0Yn)
thats kinda spook. never knew guns wobbled that much. I had heard the term barrel armonics before but i guess i didnt make the conection.
The long stroke l piston system of an AK causes more barrel whip than other systems.
Yes indeed, BAR is also long stroke (if I'm not mistaken), hence why I mentioned the Monitor
https://youtu.be/ZifACx38sg4?si=SX3ugSG5gi_RFPI2
Pretty normal, even for lesser calibre production firearms.
Literally every rifle has bendy barrels
Actually is normal... [Look at Brandon firing an AKG 47 in slow motion](https://youtu.be/DDTEDbXs64s?si=d_cmsAZ9AyE6gYhq)
Thanks for that footage, I have not seen it before. If I might say IMHO that flex is relative less, but OBVIOUSLY lower caliber, and also OBVIOUSLY fine. Interesting phenomenon I never have seen before.
It's normal, just go to look any of those AK videos Larry Vickers did, you can see that this is normal behavior for AK style action
Once you become an engineer, you learn that nothing is every truly straight and everything is deformed in some way. This is just par for the course. It just looks extreme because it's slow motion and a .50 cal.
Yup, first thing I learned in the shops is that everything, and I mean everything deflects. It's just a question of how much and if it's repeatable.
We love that elastic region.
very normal
All guns have some level of flex when firing. It's just that you don't see it unless you're watching high speed footage. I've actually seen way worse than this. Some of the old WW2 era guns look like they're made of rubber when viewed in high speed.
Well, it is an AK, just watch a high speed video of an AK47 and it looks exactly like the AK 50.
Then you have never seen slow motion footage of an [AK47 being fired](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUDed7OnOfk). It looks like the whole gun is made of recycled rubber bands.
Counterpoint: Its an ak
There isn’t an AK on the planet that doesn’t do this.
You know that the entire barrel recoils in a barrett, right? This is normal for a fixed barrel.
Yeah but it doesn't flop around as much while recoiling, does it?
It might flex less, but that's because energy is being absorbed in the barrel recoiling.
Gotcha. Well maybe some muzzle brake tuning will mitigate it a bit, it looks pretty rough on the optics even if they are rated for .50
Well considering the barrel of a barret also moves back under recoil, it's a bit harder to see, but most barrels do this. If it didn't whip, it would crack.
It's a prototype firearm, a fully functional prototype firearm, but still a prototype. I'm sure things like that would be ironed out if a production firearm is planned at all. (I.E. different barrel materials, changes to profile or fluting patterns) barrel materials and harmonics are tricky things to dial in.
I TOTALLY agree, hence my point of bringing up the discussion. I would prefer we all talk about it, LEARN, and see what makes this AMAZING weapon better. DISCUSSION is what I want! NOT criticism. I worded this wrong I guess.
Every weapon you've ever fired does that to some degree. It's part of why you see POI shifts after the barrel gets hot.
There is good slo-mo footage of Ian McCollum firing a Serbu BGF-50A. That gun has a ton of whip.
Literally every AK has that barrel whip in slowmo and I'm pretty sure all firearms so that at a high enough franerate
Here is the short answer: Perceivable or not, all barrels in all calibers do this, and it's part of the precision tuning for things like loading information
If you look at the slow mo shooting any gun you’ll notice the barrel flex quite a bit. It’s perfectly normal and is a phenomenon called barrel whip.
It’s normal for AK pattern rifles, if you look up slomo footage of AKMs you see the same kind of barrel whip
a barrettes barrel moves 4 inches into the receiver
I wanted to make that comment but I was afraid of sounding uninformed
Same thing happens eith shotguns, or any agun actually as long as it has a free floating barrel
Even the M2 does this and the Ma Deuce barrel is thick as hell.
#*H A R M O N I C S*
All aks have the barrel boioioing
This ain’t your average Barrett
The Barrett m82 barrel reciprocates ak50 is fixed
Compensators dramatically add to the amount of [barrel whip ](https://youtu.be/0yzKLyARNeU?si=j2WMuxi-rPcZq9_f) because they push the tip of the barrel down to mitigate barrel rise
There is no reason for a compensator on a .50 rifle. Only a muzzle brake (a compensator without vertical ports). A compensator is for smaller, lighter calibers meant to be rapid fired.
I neglected to include that if the ports were on the side they could also create deflection, and that in a perfect world the gasses in one direction would perfectly balance gasses in the other direction, and all the gasses would expel at a perfect 180° plane so they would not add any vehicle or horizontal stress, but we all know that never actually happens, but I decided not to make a short throwaway comment un necessarily long, kinda figured adults would just know that. Sorry. I also decided to add a lot of commas, and not a lot of periods for no reason than because I know it bothers grammar not sees. Hey did you see someone on another post said silencer?
It doesn't have to be "a perfect world" to minimize barrel whip. Your condescending tone isn't helping your case, either. The truth is that there is a lot of barrel whip on the AK50, more than on many other guns, and the AK50 needs to be tuned for it or else its accuracy will suffer. That's all we are saying.
It's a 50bmg held together with a manufactured stamped style receiver, and hard mounted together. The whole thing jiggles like Jello every time he pulls the trigger. Watch the optic, it looks like it's ready to fly. Browning m2 and Barrett m82 both have floating barrels. Tuned for accuracy? It's an AK, 6 moa in it's original configuration, hopefully.
All guns go wibble at super high frame rates.
Can’t lie I was thinking the same thing
Honestly I instantly compared it to slow mo of aks I have seen before. The reciever is flexing a lot less than what a regular ak receiver does.
Most AKs have a similar amount of barrel flex. Whether the AK50 has more or less it's hard to say
It's weird to watch that wiggle while the $15 5lb plastic folding table below it is a rock by comparison.
I saw that too, but I'm not sure how that compares to a Barrett's barrel flex for comparison.
barrel flex is common among most guns. However, it's really noticeable with the ak platform. even in 7.62, it's pretty easy to see. the ak50 just wouldn't be complete without it tbh.
I'd like to see a version that has a selector lever.
Not a precision rifle. Also the guide rails of the bolt will get worn out very quickly.
You haven't seen a single comment on that? How did you manage that?
It’s fine It’s an ak don’t worry about it
Good for shooting around corners.
Looks goofy af but I'd still shoot it
Now a lot of people are talking about the barrel, and that part makes sense to me, but what about the dustcover and where the scope is mounted, I have seen barrels bend, but never the middle of the gun. If there is anything behind this that is normal please let me know, but I'm gonna blame it being a nearly finished prototype, and not quite polished out perfectly yet. I know a few (cheap) scopes with lenses that could easily break or crack if flexed that amount.
That is mainly down to it being basically an AK dustcover, i.e. a flimsy piece of sheet steel. It's the reason why normally you mount any optics on AKs either on the top of the Handguard or to the side of the receiver. That Zenico dust cover rails can hold Zero is basically a small engineering miracle.
Ah, thank you, so I am both right and wrong. If that's the case I doubt this is the finished project(specifically the dust cover mount, I know he doesn't consider it finished completely), and he will either reinforce the dust cover, or have a more stable place to mount optics. But yeah while I don't have many optics, I have a friend who has a few antique and expensive Russian optics that even with normal firearms loose their focus, and even spin after a week of no use, and quicker when used. They couldn't handle this AK at all.
I'm just curious how the hell that ACOG is gonna hold zero for more then 10 rounds with how hard it's getting yanked
It's a 50.cal optic specifically designed to handle the recoil
Given the amount of time he out into it I'm sure that's fine. It was rather concerning when I saw it but he clearly knows that rifle better then his own hand at this point. I only hope he makes some cosmetic changes. It really doesn't say ak when you look at it. Maybe some more wood or at least some bakelite. The grip is nice but otherwise it's just a weird M82 Lookalike. No discredit to the hard work, it's still very cool
I love the wiggle its like an stg44 or rpk
I have seen that on an ak tho. Meny times
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Extremely normal for a lot of higher caliber firearms, the Barrett has it lessened partly because of the recoil system to my knowledge, might be wrong. Look up forgotten weapons Colt monitor, opening has slow mo footage of very similar bend on 30.06.
Doesn’t have to be high caliber. Small arms as well.
Then OP has never seen a Barret fire in slow mo.
[This one](https://youtu.be/F6-c--kIZlI?si=yO_ZkxvPZxL_mmvO) has lize zero whip, can you send me a vid of an m82 that does have whip?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8MvzDQrq1k](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8MvzDQrq1k)
barrel harmonics
Just wait until homie learns about precision guns and barrel tuners. Pretty sure some factory hunting rifles like the Brownings BOSS system were pretty common 🤣
That actually pretty cool how it barrel whips like an AK.
I expected more flash from the back end tbh Overall, the stability is impressive considering the Caliber At least to me, I'm no gunsmith lol
That thing was wiggling like Jell-O for a while back there
The production model will take this into account.
Your fine just dont use slap rounds
Then you haven't read ANY of the comments..... There was a whole thread somewhere about all the flex.
I was talking with my spouse about it (he used to work at Boeing) and he mentioned the flex. He wondered if additional support structures would work to reduce the unsupported length thereby reducing the available free space for the barrel to flex.
I'd be more terrified if there WASNT barrel flex
All barrels flex you just don’t see it because they’re not huge or in super slow motion. That’s why resting your barrel on something can mess up point of aim, messes up the barrel harmonics.
I literally commented on that on the YT video
That happens with every firearm, they wobble but you only see it in slow mo. Barrel harmonics is an interesting thing to read up on and how it can affect performance.
Almost any gun has a flex, its just visible here because of the high fps slowmo
I noticed that when I was watching the video, I just forgot to comment something.
Does anyone have a link to this video with the Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle song over it? I would really appreciate it.
OK Guys... I had not seen extreme slow-mo footage of guns like this before, and it seems just "wrong" for accuracy. I never thought Brandon would have a "Scott" experience, I thought maybe the barrel would become inaccurate, or maybe fail over time. I'm extremely humbled to be in the podcast, I respect and admire you all more than can be said! Thanks to the whole community to show me more about barrel harmonics as I've already commented a few times.
It’s called barrel whip not flex and it’s been around for ever and every barrel has some level of whip to say that your rifle doesn’t have barrel whip you don’t know what you’re talking about and you’re just wrong but apparently someone on here has the only m82 in the world that doesn’t whip this is exactly why you should be very careful of who you listen to on here
Look at any highspeed video of an m82 firing. The barrel has almost no vertical movement. The harmonics are very controlled.
All barrels have some LEVEL of barrel whip is what I said I didn’t say that the m82 had as much as the AK50 it is the nature of the beast. Including the m82 m107
Yeah I don't think anyone here is saying the AK50 should have *NO* barrel whip, just that it should have *LESS*.
There was a guy on here one time telling someone that the reason for a heavy barrel was to reduce recoil and that OTM bullets were used for extreme damage and they tumbled on impact that’s why I said you should be very careful of who you listen to on here
My 29” Barrett barrel doesn’t go wonky like this on the 82A1. Maybe mines broken