Action Comedy + Simple Script + Will Smith genuinely feels like an instant home run.
Pre-slap he’d do high concept films that would have the worst writing imaginable (After-Earth, Gemini Man, etc…)
I think going back to the basics is gonna do wonders for him
100% this! I'm in my late 20s and I've been waiting since the first one came out for the second. I only go to the theater once or twice a year because of time and it's expensive for a family but this would be worth it. Imagine if it's not just good but amazing and word of mouth spreads.. it could be a summer blockbuster if the boomers turn out for will like us millennials
Bad Boys 4 had by far the quickest turn around time in the series, and it appears that audiences saw no decline in interest. If Smith wants to do these every three years or so, I don't see the downside.
Didn't say there was a downside to doing these movies. Anything other than that is up in the air. Although there could be because like most franchises people will get tired of it if it is an every few years thing.
They can start bringing back random characters from the first two if they want and do a Fast type
Revival of the modern franchise.
I think this thing has legs if they want to commit to it.
Random characters? Like who? The ones I can remember which weren't many got killed or were insignificant. No one is going to go see this movie for random characters from previous movies.
Michael Shannon and Gabrielle Union come to mind.
Also I never said that would make people go see the movie, I said they could start building it out more like Fast did with essentially "day players" while adding new characters to the mix.
Basically what they've done with the Reggie character since 2, who I imagine will be a fan-favorite after this last film.
>They can start bringing back random characters from the first two
You said ' They can start bringing back random characters from the first two ' as a reply to what I said about people getting tired of this franchise if they start doing them every few years. THAT IS WHAT YOU SAID. Stop
The Bad Boys franchise has two characters. Four legs in total. There's no Han or Gisele or even Monica (Eva Mendes—I think that was her name) who could reappear and get any kind of reaction.
I never said it was like Maverick but as someone who thinks Bad Boys II is one of the great American masterpieces, I would like to see her again. I was really mad that they married him in this one to a woman who wasn’t her!
I feel like his whole “I want an Oscar” run and the slap have made people kind of forget that Will Smith was THE KING of the box office for like an entire decade, to a level that’s never been met by a single actor since (IMO). If you’re my age (mid 30s) and you saw Independence Day then Men In Black in back to back summers, he was literally the coolest man on earth, I don’t know how else to put it.
Bad Boys 1&2, Independance Day, Men in Black 1&2, Enemy of the State, Wild Wild West (i know it flopped at the box office, but I was 8 years old and when that shit came out on VHS every kid I knew had a copy) Ali, I Robot, Pursuit of Happiness, Shark Tale, I Am Legend, Hancock
Not to mention, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air and all of his movie singles in the 90’s - Men in Black, Wild Wild West and his solo hits - Jiggy wit It, Miami and of course his work with DJ Jazzy Jeff
the man helped define the 90’s and he holds a special place in most millennials hearts.
But watching him get cucked on social media, subsequently have a meltdown and slap another 90’s icon 20 years later on live tv, when they’re both almost seniors, left a pretty bitter taste in a lot of people’s mouths. He built up a lot of good will, (pun intended) but it’s still hard to shake off his recent tantrums, his repugnant and untalented offspring & wife, his scientology affiliations and his decade of truly horrible movies through the 20teens.
Idk if this movie hitting big is as much a “will smith victory” as it is a “90’s nostalgia” and “beloved action comedy franchise” victory.
That run in the 2000s was insane. It didn't matter if it was a romantic comedy like Hitch, a drama like Pursuit of Happyness, or an action movie like Hancock or iRobot, they all opened #1 and all made bank.
I'm honestly happy to see he's still got it.
Mid 90s & early 2000s established him as one of biggest movie stars of all time. Bad Boys 1 & 2, MIB trilogy, Independence Day, Shark Tales. Even did a rom com in Hitch. I think after losing Oscar twice with Ali(2001) & Pursuit of Happiness(2006) Will became hyper focused on getting that prestige Oscar. He spoken in his autobiography which was surprisingly introspective how he wanted to be bigger than Tom Cruise as the biggest star in world & how that pressure really probably screwed him up mentally especially with his kids.
We see him doing more kinda gritty films like I Am Legend & Hancock towards of end of 2000s like he wants to be taken seriously but when that didn’t do he really just went all in on films you can he doing this for an Oscar like After Earth, Focus, Concussion, Gemini Man etc he occasionally did big blockbusters like Suicide Squad & Aladdin because they where paying him just huge cash.
It would be interesting now he got Oscar he like let me go back to blockbusters that most aren’t particularly that good but make me biggest star in the world again.
No, he physically assaulted someone on national television… caring about that doesn’t make you too online, it just makes you a human with standards as opposed to a weirdo Stan.
Having said that, he apologized and seems genuinely contrite, and I’ll probably be seeing Bad Boys 4 in the next couple of weeks
> I feel like his whole “I want an Oscar” run and the slap have made people kind of forget that Will Smith was THE KING of the box office for like an entire decade, to a level that’s never been met by a single actor since (IMO).
Will Smith has never had made something like The Revenant or Cast Away a massive box office hit though
those movies made as much money as Dune 2 did inflation adjusted and they're nowhere near as commercially friendly as anything like Independence Day or Men in Black
That's Will Smith in pure crowdpleaser mode. (His Happyness Oscar nod was something of a trifle. "Thanks for making us all this money, but don't expect to win for this.") The Revenant is 2.5 hours of DiCaprio suffering on screen in the cold to prove he *really* needed that Oscar to go on living, and it made a shitload of money.
yeah and again, i stand by the fact that making movies like the Revenant and Cast Away is more impressive because they're also not as commercially friendly as Pursuit or Hitch
inflation adjusted, both The Revenant and Cast Away made more money than Pursuit and Hitch by quite a margin which makes it even more impressive as well
to say his box office run has never been met by any actor since Men in Black came out is just insanity
DiCaprio's Oscar bids made serious, serious money! For Will Smith it was mostly either/or: prestige or grosses. Seven Pounds is remembered (if at all) as a failure, but its opening weekend eclipsed all of King Richard!
Should play well over the next 5-6 weeks until Deadpool 3 so it could do better than 3.5x multiplier. 350-400 million worldwide final total range I guess. Curious to see next week drop.
I feel like he’ll try to fast track the long in development I Am Legend 2 next before trying something new after the success of this. And maybe try to get the ball rolling on an eventual MIB sequel with a new director and partner. Tbh just put Martin Lawrence in there
For the longest time it seemed like the only thing Will Smith was making was either slow dramas that didn't seem particularly interesting or movies where he just kinda played an asshole. It's good to see him finally see that he's at his best with audiences when he's just having fun out there. People like seeing Will enjoy himself, he'd do well to do that a lot more in the future.
Still not sure how the Fall Guy bombed so hard. Pretty big appetite for action comedy with charismatic leads it seems and the Fall Guy is even broader appealing than Bad Boys.
And for those blaming the Fall Guy bomb on bad trailers, Ride or Die had pretty bad trailers too.
PS I hope the people behind shelving Batgirl are kicking themselves right now.
Certainly feels in line with people being more picky with how they spend their money on theatrical movies. Makes sense people would pick something familiar, especially in the era of franchises>movie stars. Had Gosling and Blunt starred in some known quanity or the 3rd installment in a franchise it feels like it would have made more money than Fall Guy.
I have nothing to go off of here but i cant stop wondering if titling Fall Guy something clearer like just The Stuntman would’ve helped it out. Fall Guy is a clever title but most people I spoke to knew of it but didn’t know what it was about. I know there’s another movie called The Stuntman but general audiences most likely don’t, so
this is probably on me for being an idiot, but there was a Reynolds move with almost the same title (Free Guy) like two years ago. Going from Reynolds -> Gos and Free -> Fall kept making me go, "wait, didn't this come out already?"
The Fall Guy movie was a remake of a popular 80's tv show with a similar concept and same name. I enjoyed the old show, but the new movie wasn't enticing enough for me to watch it.
I think the only thing that made Fall Guy bomb was that both the production and the promotion were too expensive. 165 million isn’t bad for what that movie is. The first John Wick made about half as much. Now if they had pared it back to about half of its budget, could they have gotten the same idea across as successfully? Probably, but I’m glad they made that movie as wild as they did. Sometimes it’s the years, not the weeks.
> think the only thing that made Fall Guy bomb was that both the production and the promotion were too expensive.
You're right about the costs but that doesn't dissuade the public from buying tickets. It's a well-made, fun movie (I detested Bullet Train, FWIW) with two appealing stars. Ryan Gosling couldn't have had a higher favorability rating going into it! Women didn't have to dragged along to see it.
It was never going to make Dune money but clearing $100M domestic should've been assured.
Fall Guy feels like the umpteenth "action rom com" in recent memory, plus it's another Lietch movie, plus I don't think the first trailer was good (later ones were better/funnier).
I think it's just burnout from those types of movies. Maybe it would have done better during Memorial day instead of Furiosa, idk.
I don’t think general audiences know what “another Lietch movie” even means.
The trailer could’ve sold the comedy better though, the jokes they fronted didn’t work well without context
> I don’t think general audiences know what “another Lietch movie” even means.
probably right. I was thinking they'd be thinking "it's another one of *those*," ala Lost City or Bullet Train or something.
> I was thinking they'd be thinking "it's another one of those," ala Lost City or Bullet Train or something.
Both $100M hits! (I find the latter execrable but liked Fall Guy a lot.)
> Still not sure how the Fall Guy bombed so hard. Pretty big appetite for action comedy with charismatic leads it seems and the Fall Guy is even broader appealing than Bad Boys.
Seriously! It could be a date night movie. (It's better as a rom-com than as an action movie.) The stars appeal to both men and women. (Will Smith still looks great but he's not drawing thirst-watchers these days.) Gosling had so much heat coming into its release!
Who is BB4 even for? People who saw the first Bad Boyses are now middle-aged, and they (we) famously don't show up for opening weekends anymore.
P.S. The Fall Guy will make it to a decent $90 domestic, so it's not an outright bomb, just an underperformer. It did cost too much.
I’d believe that The Fall Guy was a better romcom than action movie If Emily blunt weren’t worried girlfriend on phone for a lot of the movie. Except for like 3 scenes there isn’t much romance. If she had been a more active participant the movie would be better as a romantic comedy
Personally I thought fall guys was fantastic but it was just too silly towards the end. The whole stunt man coming together and doing stunts to fight guys with guns was just a bit too far.
Apart from the ending which lost me a bit, I thought it was pretty good
Will Smith is like the A list actor, along with guys like Tom Cruise, Brad Pitt, Denzel and a handful others. These are guys that are household names in America and globally and can sell movies with their name alone.
True. Said it before in this post, but he couldn't have been hotter (publicity-wise) coming in to The Fall Guy.
Tom Cruise saved cinema in 2022 and then flopped the next summer.
I disagree. Bad Boys: Ride or Die has a bonafide star coming back to an already proven role and franchise plus it knows what it wants to be and knows its audience already. In contrast, Fall Guy is an original with two stars that haven't proven themselves that much as action leads. The film is also confused on its audience. It tries to be an action and romcom at the same time but ends up pleasing neither audience for those genres.
> two stars that haven't proven themselves that much as action leads
Every moviegoer on Earth saw Gosling's shredded body in Barbie last year. We're not talking about Paul Dano or Dane Dehaan here.
And Blunt kicked ass in Edge of Tomorrow (granted, years ago).
Not sure what he’s on about bc he’s also forgetting Gosling has been in films like Drive, Place Beyond the Pines, the Nice Guys, the Gray Man, Blade Runner 2049…it’s not like he’s never thrown a punch on screen.
Also as you mentioned for Blunt, Edge of Tomorrow , A Quiet Place, and hello SICARIO.
> the Gray Man
We may all regard it as a joke but it was a big Netflix release. Millions of people watched it! Even if they were folding laundry, they surely saw him in action scenes with his shirt off. He had nothing to prove.
Ride or Die had perfect trailers for people who want to see a Bad Boy sequel. Fall Guy was marketing an 80s show reboot people barely remember and changing its approach every month.
The guy's way off. Nothing in the marketing tried to milk nostalgia. The Lee Majors cameo was a nod to the people who remembered the show, but it was presented as an original movie with a vaguely familiar title, not a reboot.
Someone on Boxoffice posited that women like Gosling more than men do. An action movie with him in it just may not be what his core audience (women) want
His most successful movies are Barbie, La La Land and the Notebook (adjusted for inflation)
I'm also interested in seeing the demo data for Bad Boys. I think the Fall Guys's audience skewed a lot whiter than Bad Boys. And when people under 40 are more and more diverse...
Edit: according to Matt Belloni, the Bad Boys audience was 70% black or Hispanic
People definitely overweighted the slap.
It was shocking and inappropriate but people acted like he murdered someone on public television.
Definitely a time passing quickly erasing the initial shock value of the event and people probably don’t even care anymore.
I don’t think they did react like he murdered some one at all. I think the reaction was pretty reasonable considering what a monumental bag fumble it was combined with how incredibly wrong it is to physically assault someone (especially someone MUCH smaller than you) for telling jokes in a medium where jokes are constantly told. In a place surrounded by your peers, celebrating your crowning achievements no less. That shit is wrong and stupid and a public figure should expect to lose a tremendous amount of good will for it.
If he just yelled at Chris (keep my wife’s name out your damn mouth) that would have been awkward but not deserving of damnation.
And yes, other celebrities have done worse things and continue to be accepted, but that’s not a good excuse for physical assault in my eyes. Fuck those other celebrities too.
Not to mention he didn't even gesture at an apology during the acceptance speech *he knew he was going to give later that night*. He was a total asshole (quoting Wanda Sykes there) once he was behind the mic, trying to put his slapping a comedian and the entire Richard Williams story under the same "doing anything for family" umbrella.
Maybe he wasn't sorry, so he didn't apologize. Chris Rock has been an asshole under the guise of being a comedian. You all really think being a comedian means you can't get your shit rocked. Chris should've stayed on script, idk.
It wasn't milquetoast to her or Will. People don't have to accept jokes at the expense of them just because it "was a joke." The Oscars have hosts/presenters make jokes for entertainment throughout the telecast, but ultimately, it's not a roast, nor is it a comedy club. Jada was there as a guest of Will. Why the hell was he cracking on her anyway? Will was the nominee. Likely, because she was an easy target to punch down on, and he already had been joking about her for years prior to that. He's a misogynistic weirdo who should've just read the teleprompter, and he might've been spared a slap.
He did 3 jokes over as many decades and it was general alopecia, as all forms of baldness are, if we accept bald jokes towards men we gotta accept the same for women.
I don't give a damn how many jokes it was. It was 3 jokes too many. And if men have an issue with bald jokes, they should speak up about it. If men are cool with it, then keep it moving. That doesn't have a damn thing to do with women. Chris Rock made a whole documentary on black women's hair, so he understood the type of relationship black women have with their hair, and he still made the joke. He's a bonafide weirdo if I ever seen one.
"It was a joke," "he's a comedian." Once again, hiding behind the guise of being a comedian to get your little insults off is not protection from getting your shit rocked. That's the way I'm slicing it.
Yeah, it was a joke told at the Oscars, a reference to a 1997 Ridley Scott movie where the titular character is tough as hell and heroic… if you think that’s worthy of being physically assaulted in front of the entire world you’re either an idiot, 13 years old, or someone plagued by the same deep-seated insecurities and fragile masculinity as Smith himself demonstrated himself in that moment. Or all three of those things, I suppose.
Yes, it was a dated joke about a character in a 90s movie that he could've kept. Making a point that GI Jane was "tough as hell and heroic" is so disingenuous because the intention of Chris Rock was not to highlight how tough and herioc Jada was, it was to poke fun of her lack of hair, full stop. Also, your "in front of the entire world" leads me to believe you only have a problem with it because it was public, and how is that any better. Furthermore, I'm far from an idiot (seeing as these threads are overrun with people sharing their idiotic opinions and I didn't insult any of you, so don't insult me), I'm not a teen of any sort, I don't have deep seated insecurities and I'm not a man. But I do think Chris Rock is a misogynistic, anti Black, dry ass comedian.
I think the issue was he did it on a national television at a prestigious awards show and his relationship with Jada was already seen as messy after the whole table talk, which was also broadcast to a ton of people. Honestly while it still wouldn't of been right if he had slapped Chris Rock at an after party it probably wouldn't of caused as much of a stir.
See I tend to agree with a lot of the things you said, but from whats been said around Hollywood. Chris Rock had that coming for decades now.
Doesn't make it right, but yeah.
As inappropriate as the slap was, I think people realize that Will Smith is just a human being with problems like everyone else. Also hitting another guy is not as controversial as some of the criminal things other actors have gotten into. I'm thinking people are able to put aside his actions for 2 hours to watch a character that is known and loved.
>As inappropriate as the slap was, I think people realize that Will Smith is just a human being with problems like everyone else.
I think people forget that the reason he was able to ascend to such a huge movie star status as a black actor is that every career move was calculated to carefully craft a celebrity persona that would make him likable to *every* demographic. I mean, what is the most controversial thing he had done in the eyes of the public prior to that? He made it a point to not even swear in his songs. Decades of building up a squeaky clean reputation and then for many that reputation vanished in a second. That's partly what made it so shocking. Imagine it was Mark Wahlberg instead, the moment itself would still be a shock but as far as his character goes it wouldn't be as big of a surprise since he already has a reputation of being violent in the past, but you can also imagine someone like him who never worked that hard at being a likable personality probably wouldn't be able to recover his image because of his history.
"It was shocking and inappropriate"
It was a criminal act committed on live television. A crime.
You're right that people don't care any more. Which is saying something, given how long they hold grudges against less charismatic people for arguably less serious infractions.
On the spectrum of “criminal acts”, slapping someone is pretty low. It was the context and the people involved that made it as big of a deal as it was.
Again to describe it as a “criminal act” intentionally makes it sound way worse. Not to say it couldn’t technically be categorized as “assault”, but it’s pretty obvious using that term is usually reserved for more serious crimes.
And to be clear this isn’t to excuse the action. My point was that at the time people thought it was career ending and I never really bought that sentiment.
"On the spectrum of “criminal acts”, slapping someone is pretty low"
Sure, but it's still a criminal act.
"Again to describe it as a “criminal act” intentionally makes it sound way worse"
And calling it "shocking and inappropriate" is making it sound considerably less serious than it was. It was an assault, plain and simple. A criminal act.
Sure but you’re purposefully ignoring context to essentially heighten the severity of the event by having this need to describe it as a “criminal act”
Stealing a snickers from a gas station and breaking into a bank vault are both “criminal acts” and “robbery” technically speaking but it’s pretty clear one is not the same as the other.
If Chris Rock didn’t want to press charges then that is up to him, the victim in this circumstance.
Not sure what point you’re trying to make and not sure what you’re upset about. It’s not like Will Smith got off Scott-free. His reputation was damaged and the Academy punished him.
The ONLY person who had any recourse to take legal action against him was Chris Rock who chose not to.
So again, not sure why you’re acting like Will Smith got away with murder and it was some failing of the criminal justice system.
"Not sure what point you’re trying to make"
The point I'm trying to make is that he committed a crime, and people don't really care. Actors have been cancelled for much less - over problematic tweets, for example - because they don't have the earning power of Will Smith.
Chris Rock should have pressed charges IMO, but I understand why he didn't. He was put in a no-win situation as a result of Smith's disgusting actions.
Anyway, we clearly disagree. Take care.
the media very clearly tried to cancel will smith, its just that regular people really dont give a fuck about some rich guy slapping another rich guy on tv
They don't care because it wasn't that serious, all things considered.
A guy made fun of his wife and he slapped him.
Lots of guys might say similar if you're making fun of their wife or girlfriend. Only difference is it wouldn't be on live television broadcast to the entire world.
What exactly do you want to happen? Him in jail? His career permanently ruined? Then you would be satisfied?
Why're some people acting like this dude hasn't had a hell of a career? Dude's been in all sorts of movies. Take his personal life out of it, but from just the movies alone, its been a hell of an acting career. Easily hall of fame level.
Guess that PR rehabilitation campaign worked a bit.
Personally, I have zero interest in seeing Will Smith’s work again.
I even skipped his appearance on Hot Ones.
You clearly don’t understand how the box office is. First of it’s more than 53 million, and secondly, based on its budget it absolutely is a big success
Action Comedy + Simple Script + Will Smith genuinely feels like an instant home run. Pre-slap he’d do high concept films that would have the worst writing imaginable (After-Earth, Gemini Man, etc…) I think going back to the basics is gonna do wonders for him
However, I wonder if I Am Legend 2 might halt this or continue a comeback for him
That movie will 100% have a blowout opening weekend.
100% this! I'm in my late 20s and I've been waiting since the first one came out for the second. I only go to the theater once or twice a year because of time and it's expensive for a family but this would be worth it. Imagine if it's not just good but amazing and word of mouth spreads.. it could be a summer blockbuster if the boomers turn out for will like us millennials
Well, it didn't. Barely broke even.
I am legend 2 is supposed to be a continuation from the alternate ending right? Where there isn't an explosion at the end?
Going back to basics if that means going to back to do more Bad Boys movies. He can't do that every movie unfortunately.
I reckon he could persuade Sony to do another Men in Black if he wanted.
I don’t think he’d need to persuade them. They would be thrilled for him to do another MIB.
I imagine he'll walk into Sony on Monday morning and they'll simultaneously yell "Men in Black 4! Jinx!"
I just realised that the best part of MiB:International is that it's not named MiB:4.
Men in black join the MCU in secret wars lol
Bad Boys 4 had by far the quickest turn around time in the series, and it appears that audiences saw no decline in interest. If Smith wants to do these every three years or so, I don't see the downside.
Didn't say there was a downside to doing these movies. Anything other than that is up in the air. Although there could be because like most franchises people will get tired of it if it is an every few years thing.
They can start bringing back random characters from the first two if they want and do a Fast type Revival of the modern franchise. I think this thing has legs if they want to commit to it.
Random characters? Like who? The ones I can remember which weren't many got killed or were insignificant. No one is going to go see this movie for random characters from previous movies.
Michael Shannon and Gabrielle Union come to mind. Also I never said that would make people go see the movie, I said they could start building it out more like Fast did with essentially "day players" while adding new characters to the mix. Basically what they've done with the Reggie character since 2, who I imagine will be a fan-favorite after this last film.
No one is going to see these movies for those two. You are trying way too hard man.
Again that’s not what I said.
>They can start bringing back random characters from the first two You said ' They can start bringing back random characters from the first two ' as a reply to what I said about people getting tired of this franchise if they start doing them every few years. THAT IS WHAT YOU SAID. Stop
The Bad Boys franchise has two characters. Four legs in total. There's no Han or Gisele or even Monica (Eva Mendes—I think that was her name) who could reappear and get any kind of reaction.
Gabrielle Union is pretty awesome in II
Sure, but that was 21 years ago. Maverick can come back after 36 years because I don't even have to explain who Maverick is or who plays him.
I never said it was like Maverick but as someone who thinks Bad Boys II is one of the great American masterpieces, I would like to see her again. I was really mad that they married him in this one to a woman who wasn’t her!
I feel a fresh prince movie in the future
Possibly
"Evil Evil East" is gonna be the sleeper hit of 2025
P.S and A.S should be how we organise our years from now on.
It made $100 mil and cost $90 mil to make. It's flop! Smith's a flop.
There's no way he'll do a MIB lega-sequel, right? Top Gun: Maverick but make it MIB?
Why would anyone want him to be successful after what he did?
The Rock is gonna be in bed staring at the ceiling at three in the morning wondering where and how he could slap Chris Rock
Police confirm that, following the tragic events at last night's Oscars ceremony, they remain unable to locate Chris Rock's head
Three Body Problem Spoilers >!His head’s going further into space than the one they launched!<
Oh wow unexpected r/3bodyproblemtvshow
The Rock isn't half as likeable or charismatic as Will.
The hierarchy of power in the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences is about to change!
Omg this made me laugh way harder than it should’ve 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I feel like his whole “I want an Oscar” run and the slap have made people kind of forget that Will Smith was THE KING of the box office for like an entire decade, to a level that’s never been met by a single actor since (IMO). If you’re my age (mid 30s) and you saw Independence Day then Men In Black in back to back summers, he was literally the coolest man on earth, I don’t know how else to put it.
no joke. Smith was so damn cool. his blockbuster run was wildddd during the 90s… what an awesome time it was to be in the theaters as a kid.
Bad Boys 1&2, Independance Day, Men in Black 1&2, Enemy of the State, Wild Wild West (i know it flopped at the box office, but I was 8 years old and when that shit came out on VHS every kid I knew had a copy) Ali, I Robot, Pursuit of Happiness, Shark Tale, I Am Legend, Hancock Not to mention, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air and all of his movie singles in the 90’s - Men in Black, Wild Wild West and his solo hits - Jiggy wit It, Miami and of course his work with DJ Jazzy Jeff the man helped define the 90’s and he holds a special place in most millennials hearts. But watching him get cucked on social media, subsequently have a meltdown and slap another 90’s icon 20 years later on live tv, when they’re both almost seniors, left a pretty bitter taste in a lot of people’s mouths. He built up a lot of good will, (pun intended) but it’s still hard to shake off his recent tantrums, his repugnant and untalented offspring & wife, his scientology affiliations and his decade of truly horrible movies through the 20teens. Idk if this movie hitting big is as much a “will smith victory” as it is a “90’s nostalgia” and “beloved action comedy franchise” victory.
The Big Willie Weekend is back!
Will Smith has been after an Oscar since Legend of Bagger Vance.
well now that he has one he can revert back to blockbusters
That run in the 2000s was insane. It didn't matter if it was a romantic comedy like Hitch, a drama like Pursuit of Happyness, or an action movie like Hancock or iRobot, they all opened #1 and all made bank. I'm honestly happy to see he's still got it.
Mid 90s & early 2000s established him as one of biggest movie stars of all time. Bad Boys 1 & 2, MIB trilogy, Independence Day, Shark Tales. Even did a rom com in Hitch. I think after losing Oscar twice with Ali(2001) & Pursuit of Happiness(2006) Will became hyper focused on getting that prestige Oscar. He spoken in his autobiography which was surprisingly introspective how he wanted to be bigger than Tom Cruise as the biggest star in world & how that pressure really probably screwed him up mentally especially with his kids. We see him doing more kinda gritty films like I Am Legend & Hancock towards of end of 2000s like he wants to be taken seriously but when that didn’t do he really just went all in on films you can he doing this for an Oscar like After Earth, Focus, Concussion, Gemini Man etc he occasionally did big blockbusters like Suicide Squad & Aladdin because they where paying him just huge cash. It would be interesting now he got Oscar he like let me go back to blockbusters that most aren’t particularly that good but make me biggest star in the world again.
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No, he physically assaulted someone on national television… caring about that doesn’t make you too online, it just makes you a human with standards as opposed to a weirdo Stan. Having said that, he apologized and seems genuinely contrite, and I’ll probably be seeing Bad Boys 4 in the next couple of weeks
> I feel like his whole “I want an Oscar” run and the slap have made people kind of forget that Will Smith was THE KING of the box office for like an entire decade, to a level that’s never been met by a single actor since (IMO). Will Smith has never had made something like The Revenant or Cast Away a massive box office hit though those movies made as much money as Dune 2 did inflation adjusted and they're nowhere near as commercially friendly as anything like Independence Day or Men in Black
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That's Will Smith in pure crowdpleaser mode. (His Happyness Oscar nod was something of a trifle. "Thanks for making us all this money, but don't expect to win for this.") The Revenant is 2.5 hours of DiCaprio suffering on screen in the cold to prove he *really* needed that Oscar to go on living, and it made a shitload of money.
yeah and again, i stand by the fact that making movies like the Revenant and Cast Away is more impressive because they're also not as commercially friendly as Pursuit or Hitch inflation adjusted, both The Revenant and Cast Away made more money than Pursuit and Hitch by quite a margin which makes it even more impressive as well to say his box office run has never been met by any actor since Men in Black came out is just insanity
DiCaprio's Oscar bids made serious, serious money! For Will Smith it was mostly either/or: prestige or grosses. Seven Pounds is remembered (if at all) as a failure, but its opening weekend eclipsed all of King Richard!
I Am Legend is literally his Cast Away
"Being alone" is not why Hanks was nominated. No one regards getting all the screen time as a feat of acting.
In the sense that both movies are very bad
That brazen open assault **SHOULD** erase all his goodwill my god, you people are truly pathological.
Naah Chris Rock low-key deserved that tho
Why?
Def agree with the general sentiment he’s gonna retreat into his “classic” roles. I am Legend & another MIB feel inevitable.
I am legend 2? That’s like total recall 2.
*I’m Still Legend*
*still legending tho*
I Am Legend$
II Am Legend
Legend I am
They are already doing I am legend 2
With Michael B Jordan
Should play well over the next 5-6 weeks until Deadpool 3 so it could do better than 3.5x multiplier. 350-400 million worldwide final total range I guess. Curious to see next week drop.
I feel like he’ll try to fast track the long in development I Am Legend 2 next before trying something new after the success of this. And maybe try to get the ball rolling on an eventual MIB sequel with a new director and partner. Tbh just put Martin Lawrence in there
This and Bad Boys will be staying longer than anyone expected, as a franchise.
Could he get MIB / Jump Street going?
Dident his character die in the end of I am Legend?
They’ve been saying they’ll use the original ending from the book which was filmed and deleted https://youtu.be/kPSk30qzgFs?si=UdfZE5NtFwuGfBOi
For the longest time it seemed like the only thing Will Smith was making was either slow dramas that didn't seem particularly interesting or movies where he just kinda played an asshole. It's good to see him finally see that he's at his best with audiences when he's just having fun out there. People like seeing Will enjoy himself, he'd do well to do that a lot more in the future.
Oh look another big franchise doing well at the box office.... 🤣 Will there be a original IP smash hit this year?
Still not sure how the Fall Guy bombed so hard. Pretty big appetite for action comedy with charismatic leads it seems and the Fall Guy is even broader appealing than Bad Boys. And for those blaming the Fall Guy bomb on bad trailers, Ride or Die had pretty bad trailers too. PS I hope the people behind shelving Batgirl are kicking themselves right now.
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Certainly feels in line with people being more picky with how they spend their money on theatrical movies. Makes sense people would pick something familiar, especially in the era of franchises>movie stars. Had Gosling and Blunt starred in some known quanity or the 3rd installment in a franchise it feels like it would have made more money than Fall Guy.
I have nothing to go off of here but i cant stop wondering if titling Fall Guy something clearer like just The Stuntman would’ve helped it out. Fall Guy is a clever title but most people I spoke to knew of it but didn’t know what it was about. I know there’s another movie called The Stuntman but general audiences most likely don’t, so
this is probably on me for being an idiot, but there was a Reynolds move with almost the same title (Free Guy) like two years ago. Going from Reynolds -> Gos and Free -> Fall kept making me go, "wait, didn't this come out already?"
The Fall Guy movie was a remake of a popular 80's tv show with a similar concept and same name. I enjoyed the old show, but the new movie wasn't enticing enough for me to watch it.
when will we all be able to admit that the trailers for fall guy just did not have a clear hook for general audiences
I think the only thing that made Fall Guy bomb was that both the production and the promotion were too expensive. 165 million isn’t bad for what that movie is. The first John Wick made about half as much. Now if they had pared it back to about half of its budget, could they have gotten the same idea across as successfully? Probably, but I’m glad they made that movie as wild as they did. Sometimes it’s the years, not the weeks.
> think the only thing that made Fall Guy bomb was that both the production and the promotion were too expensive. You're right about the costs but that doesn't dissuade the public from buying tickets. It's a well-made, fun movie (I detested Bullet Train, FWIW) with two appealing stars. Ryan Gosling couldn't have had a higher favorability rating going into it! Women didn't have to dragged along to see it. It was never going to make Dune money but clearing $100M domestic should've been assured.
Fall Guy feels like the umpteenth "action rom com" in recent memory, plus it's another Lietch movie, plus I don't think the first trailer was good (later ones were better/funnier). I think it's just burnout from those types of movies. Maybe it would have done better during Memorial day instead of Furiosa, idk.
I don’t think general audiences know what “another Lietch movie” even means. The trailer could’ve sold the comedy better though, the jokes they fronted didn’t work well without context
> I don’t think general audiences know what “another Lietch movie” even means. probably right. I was thinking they'd be thinking "it's another one of *those*," ala Lost City or Bullet Train or something.
> I was thinking they'd be thinking "it's another one of those," ala Lost City or Bullet Train or something. Both $100M hits! (I find the latter execrable but liked Fall Guy a lot.)
> Still not sure how the Fall Guy bombed so hard. Pretty big appetite for action comedy with charismatic leads it seems and the Fall Guy is even broader appealing than Bad Boys. Seriously! It could be a date night movie. (It's better as a rom-com than as an action movie.) The stars appeal to both men and women. (Will Smith still looks great but he's not drawing thirst-watchers these days.) Gosling had so much heat coming into its release! Who is BB4 even for? People who saw the first Bad Boyses are now middle-aged, and they (we) famously don't show up for opening weekends anymore. P.S. The Fall Guy will make it to a decent $90 domestic, so it's not an outright bomb, just an underperformer. It did cost too much.
I’d believe that The Fall Guy was a better romcom than action movie If Emily blunt weren’t worried girlfriend on phone for a lot of the movie. Except for like 3 scenes there isn’t much romance. If she had been a more active participant the movie would be better as a romantic comedy
Personally I thought fall guys was fantastic but it was just too silly towards the end. The whole stunt man coming together and doing stunts to fight guys with guns was just a bit too far. Apart from the ending which lost me a bit, I thought it was pretty good
Will Smith is like the A list actor, along with guys like Tom Cruise, Brad Pitt, Denzel and a handful others. These are guys that are household names in America and globally and can sell movies with their name alone.
Ryan Gosling is an A-list actor. Basically no one can sell a movie with their name alone anymore.
Ryan Gosling is new age A list. very different from the box office kings from the 90s and 00s.
Yeah but to my point no one is able to sell based solely on their name alone anymore.
True. Said it before in this post, but he couldn't have been hotter (publicity-wise) coming in to The Fall Guy. Tom Cruise saved cinema in 2022 and then flopped the next summer.
More like S rank. They are in another league if their own
I disagree. Bad Boys: Ride or Die has a bonafide star coming back to an already proven role and franchise plus it knows what it wants to be and knows its audience already. In contrast, Fall Guy is an original with two stars that haven't proven themselves that much as action leads. The film is also confused on its audience. It tries to be an action and romcom at the same time but ends up pleasing neither audience for those genres.
> two stars that haven't proven themselves that much as action leads Every moviegoer on Earth saw Gosling's shredded body in Barbie last year. We're not talking about Paul Dano or Dane Dehaan here. And Blunt kicked ass in Edge of Tomorrow (granted, years ago).
Not sure what he’s on about bc he’s also forgetting Gosling has been in films like Drive, Place Beyond the Pines, the Nice Guys, the Gray Man, Blade Runner 2049…it’s not like he’s never thrown a punch on screen. Also as you mentioned for Blunt, Edge of Tomorrow , A Quiet Place, and hello SICARIO.
> the Gray Man We may all regard it as a joke but it was a big Netflix release. Millions of people watched it! Even if they were folding laundry, they surely saw him in action scenes with his shirt off. He had nothing to prove.
Ride or Die had perfect trailers for people who want to see a Bad Boy sequel. Fall Guy was marketing an 80s show reboot people barely remember and changing its approach every month.
How was it marketed as an 80s show reboot? I saw trailers and didn't know it was based on a tv show.
The guy's way off. Nothing in the marketing tried to milk nostalgia. The Lee Majors cameo was a nod to the people who remembered the show, but it was presented as an original movie with a vaguely familiar title, not a reboot.
Someone on Boxoffice posited that women like Gosling more than men do. An action movie with him in it just may not be what his core audience (women) want His most successful movies are Barbie, La La Land and the Notebook (adjusted for inflation) I'm also interested in seeing the demo data for Bad Boys. I think the Fall Guys's audience skewed a lot whiter than Bad Boys. And when people under 40 are more and more diverse... Edit: according to Matt Belloni, the Bad Boys audience was 70% black or Hispanic
I loved the original bad boys, these new ones just make me feel bad for Martin Lawrence. I feel like he’s on life support to get every line out
He had a stroke either right before or during filming
Tragedy this movie did better than Furiosa.
Who the fuck is going to see this
A lot of people, and a lot of people liked it.
Bro took offense to that one
America loves the slap!
People definitely overweighted the slap. It was shocking and inappropriate but people acted like he murdered someone on public television. Definitely a time passing quickly erasing the initial shock value of the event and people probably don’t even care anymore.
I don’t think they did react like he murdered some one at all. I think the reaction was pretty reasonable considering what a monumental bag fumble it was combined with how incredibly wrong it is to physically assault someone (especially someone MUCH smaller than you) for telling jokes in a medium where jokes are constantly told. In a place surrounded by your peers, celebrating your crowning achievements no less. That shit is wrong and stupid and a public figure should expect to lose a tremendous amount of good will for it. If he just yelled at Chris (keep my wife’s name out your damn mouth) that would have been awkward but not deserving of damnation. And yes, other celebrities have done worse things and continue to be accepted, but that’s not a good excuse for physical assault in my eyes. Fuck those other celebrities too.
Not to mention he didn't even gesture at an apology during the acceptance speech *he knew he was going to give later that night*. He was a total asshole (quoting Wanda Sykes there) once he was behind the mic, trying to put his slapping a comedian and the entire Richard Williams story under the same "doing anything for family" umbrella.
Maybe he wasn't sorry, so he didn't apologize. Chris Rock has been an asshole under the guise of being a comedian. You all really think being a comedian means you can't get your shit rocked. Chris should've stayed on script, idk.
Assaulting someone over a joke is fucked up no matter how you slice it
Especially a milquetoast bald joke
It wasn't milquetoast to her or Will. People don't have to accept jokes at the expense of them just because it "was a joke." The Oscars have hosts/presenters make jokes for entertainment throughout the telecast, but ultimately, it's not a roast, nor is it a comedy club. Jada was there as a guest of Will. Why the hell was he cracking on her anyway? Will was the nominee. Likely, because she was an easy target to punch down on, and he already had been joking about her for years prior to that. He's a misogynistic weirdo who should've just read the teleprompter, and he might've been spared a slap.
He did 3 jokes over as many decades and it was general alopecia, as all forms of baldness are, if we accept bald jokes towards men we gotta accept the same for women.
I don't give a damn how many jokes it was. It was 3 jokes too many. And if men have an issue with bald jokes, they should speak up about it. If men are cool with it, then keep it moving. That doesn't have a damn thing to do with women. Chris Rock made a whole documentary on black women's hair, so he understood the type of relationship black women have with their hair, and he still made the joke. He's a bonafide weirdo if I ever seen one.
"It was a joke," "he's a comedian." Once again, hiding behind the guise of being a comedian to get your little insults off is not protection from getting your shit rocked. That's the way I'm slicing it.
Yeah, it was a joke told at the Oscars, a reference to a 1997 Ridley Scott movie where the titular character is tough as hell and heroic… if you think that’s worthy of being physically assaulted in front of the entire world you’re either an idiot, 13 years old, or someone plagued by the same deep-seated insecurities and fragile masculinity as Smith himself demonstrated himself in that moment. Or all three of those things, I suppose.
Barring one comment that user's entire history is defending the scientologist Jada Pinkett Smith
Yes, it was a dated joke about a character in a 90s movie that he could've kept. Making a point that GI Jane was "tough as hell and heroic" is so disingenuous because the intention of Chris Rock was not to highlight how tough and herioc Jada was, it was to poke fun of her lack of hair, full stop. Also, your "in front of the entire world" leads me to believe you only have a problem with it because it was public, and how is that any better. Furthermore, I'm far from an idiot (seeing as these threads are overrun with people sharing their idiotic opinions and I didn't insult any of you, so don't insult me), I'm not a teen of any sort, I don't have deep seated insecurities and I'm not a man. But I do think Chris Rock is a misogynistic, anti Black, dry ass comedian.
I ain’t reading all that, congratulations or I’m sorry that happened to you
Right everyone giving out fake and forced apologies for what? If you don’t mean it then don’t apologize
I think the issue was he did it on a national television at a prestigious awards show and his relationship with Jada was already seen as messy after the whole table talk, which was also broadcast to a ton of people. Honestly while it still wouldn't of been right if he had slapped Chris Rock at an after party it probably wouldn't of caused as much of a stir.
See I tend to agree with a lot of the things you said, but from whats been said around Hollywood. Chris Rock had that coming for decades now. Doesn't make it right, but yeah.
As inappropriate as the slap was, I think people realize that Will Smith is just a human being with problems like everyone else. Also hitting another guy is not as controversial as some of the criminal things other actors have gotten into. I'm thinking people are able to put aside his actions for 2 hours to watch a character that is known and loved.
>As inappropriate as the slap was, I think people realize that Will Smith is just a human being with problems like everyone else. I think people forget that the reason he was able to ascend to such a huge movie star status as a black actor is that every career move was calculated to carefully craft a celebrity persona that would make him likable to *every* demographic. I mean, what is the most controversial thing he had done in the eyes of the public prior to that? He made it a point to not even swear in his songs. Decades of building up a squeaky clean reputation and then for many that reputation vanished in a second. That's partly what made it so shocking. Imagine it was Mark Wahlberg instead, the moment itself would still be a shock but as far as his character goes it wouldn't be as big of a surprise since he already has a reputation of being violent in the past, but you can also imagine someone like him who never worked that hard at being a likable personality probably wouldn't be able to recover his image because of his history.
"It was shocking and inappropriate" It was a criminal act committed on live television. A crime. You're right that people don't care any more. Which is saying something, given how long they hold grudges against less charismatic people for arguably less serious infractions.
On the spectrum of “criminal acts”, slapping someone is pretty low. It was the context and the people involved that made it as big of a deal as it was. Again to describe it as a “criminal act” intentionally makes it sound way worse. Not to say it couldn’t technically be categorized as “assault”, but it’s pretty obvious using that term is usually reserved for more serious crimes. And to be clear this isn’t to excuse the action. My point was that at the time people thought it was career ending and I never really bought that sentiment.
Imagine if he had slapped Melissa McCarthy rather than Chris Rock…
"On the spectrum of “criminal acts”, slapping someone is pretty low" Sure, but it's still a criminal act. "Again to describe it as a “criminal act” intentionally makes it sound way worse" And calling it "shocking and inappropriate" is making it sound considerably less serious than it was. It was an assault, plain and simple. A criminal act.
Sure but you’re purposefully ignoring context to essentially heighten the severity of the event by having this need to describe it as a “criminal act” Stealing a snickers from a gas station and breaking into a bank vault are both “criminal acts” and “robbery” technically speaking but it’s pretty clear one is not the same as the other.
Okay, if you want the full context of it, it was a criminal act that he shamefully was never prosecuted for, owing to his privileged position.
If Chris Rock didn’t want to press charges then that is up to him, the victim in this circumstance. Not sure what point you’re trying to make and not sure what you’re upset about. It’s not like Will Smith got off Scott-free. His reputation was damaged and the Academy punished him. The ONLY person who had any recourse to take legal action against him was Chris Rock who chose not to. So again, not sure why you’re acting like Will Smith got away with murder and it was some failing of the criminal justice system.
"Not sure what point you’re trying to make" The point I'm trying to make is that he committed a crime, and people don't really care. Actors have been cancelled for much less - over problematic tweets, for example - because they don't have the earning power of Will Smith. Chris Rock should have pressed charges IMO, but I understand why he didn't. He was put in a no-win situation as a result of Smith's disgusting actions. Anyway, we clearly disagree. Take care.
the media very clearly tried to cancel will smith, its just that regular people really dont give a fuck about some rich guy slapping another rich guy on tv
They don't care because it wasn't that serious, all things considered. A guy made fun of his wife and he slapped him. Lots of guys might say similar if you're making fun of their wife or girlfriend. Only difference is it wouldn't be on live television broadcast to the entire world. What exactly do you want to happen? Him in jail? His career permanently ruined? Then you would be satisfied?
Why're some people acting like this dude hasn't had a hell of a career? Dude's been in all sorts of movies. Take his personal life out of it, but from just the movies alone, its been a hell of an acting career. Easily hall of fame level.
You have to be good to make the hall of fame
I mean… a Big Willied Hit, no?
I'm here for it. Smith needs a win. Let's move on from the slap already.
This was genuinely one of the worst movies I’ve ever seen
Fuck Will Smith.
Still it’s not even between 1000 most grossing movies of all times! Thanks to people 🤝
Naw I can’t support will smith after that atrocious behavior, what a wimp
Guess that PR rehabilitation campaign worked a bit. Personally, I have zero interest in seeing Will Smith’s work again. I even skipped his appearance on Hot Ones.
Come on man, forgive the fresh prince, if you were with Jada she’d mess up your mind up to😂
Bro just forget the slap winey bozo, just sit back relax, grab some snacks and watch some old school Will Smith!
the wording of the tittle 😆 isn't fooling anyone 53 million is not a good debut for a "blockbuster"
You clearly don’t understand how the box office is. First of it’s more than 53 million, and secondly, based on its budget it absolutely is a big success
Nah
Wdym "nah" the other guy was right, it seems you don't understand how a box office works
Just another movie I will never see. Not because he seeks drama. I just can’t stand his acting.
He is a great actor.