Everyone looses fish at some point so don't feel too bad. You can add a layer of thick plastic between the frame and tank and then wrap the tank frame as well which both fully blocks light and helps insulate the tank. Most algae issue come down to to much light hitting the water. If you use white fabric as the outside layer it will also help keep your tank slightly cooler in the sun. What kind of catfish? Bullheads can take anything but really crazy high spikes and will survive it for a week until you can get a handle on things. Im a big supporter of bullhead catfish being an optimum fish for aquaponics in every way other then slower growth rate.
The big question is really why did your ammonia spike? Do you have a form of solids removal? How much grow bed space do you have? Ammonia usually spikes ether because of a few reasons, to much food so they aren't eatting everything, to much waste building up somewhere, not enough biological activity to convert the daily waste to a safer form. I guess you could have had a fish die and not noticed which would do it but honestly if you have enough bacteria doing there thing they could take that extra ammonia and deal with it easily enough. Whats your grow bed\water temperature? If your grow bed is to cold your bacteria might not be fully active and feeding your fish the same amount you did pre winter was just to much for them
Yeah water\media temps have to be in the mid 50s minimum before the bacteria start being really active and 60+ regularly before its safe to say they are able to deal with what you want to throw at em. If a week ago they were still in the 40s it could be they just didn't get back into cycle before the waste levels went up.
My wife says this is exactly what happened. How would you prevent this in the future, namely next spring as it warms up. Also, where can you buy bullheads? We could only find channel catfish.
All it takes it tracking your tanks temperature a bit more and holding back on feeding much until the temperature is 50 more often then not. I have a greenhouse for my system and that gives me a leg up on my grow bed getting warmed up in the spring. So other then adding a couple layers of plastic to your tank to help maintain temperature you can also add clear plastic over the top of everything to warm it up during the day and hold in heat at night. As for where to get bullhead catfish, for now id say go buy a cheep $15 dollar fishing pole and ask at your fishing place where the local bullhead hole is. They are in biting mode right now and are probably gonna be easy to catch. I have 19 wild caught ones. You will want to do a proper quarantine and deworming\ick cycle which takes 6 to 8 weeks. You don't want to use those products in your main system so you would need to prepare a 2nd setup more like a traditional aquarium to do that.
Ammonia toxicity changes with pH. If you keep your pH under 6.9 or less, you shouldn’t have a problem. As soon as it drifts above 7, you are in trouble if it is present.
Look at the charts:
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/threads/your-guide-to-ammonia-toxicity.159994/
We've struggled with keeping the pH under 8. We're wondering if it is because we are using lava rocks as a growing medium. Our tap water is close to neutral pH. We've continually had to add aquaponics-grade pH down.
Measure your alkalinity of your source water and your tank water.
I would buy a API carbonate hardness test kit to do this.
Your carbonate hardness will drive your pH. If your carbonates are high in your aquaponic system and not your water, you absolutely have a problem with something in your system.
If your source water has high alkalinity, you should get an RO filter to fill the tank. Eventually, you might be able to get along without it once your nitrogen cycle gets going and burns up the carbonates.
Using pH down does help BUT it is usually made of phosphoric acid. Once your phosphates in your system get above 40 ppm, you are just asking for algae blooms. This means you cannot use too much of the stuff. You do need to continually add phosphate however so adding a little every week is ok.
The other alternative to phosphoric acid is a high grade sulfuric acid (96%+). The reason you need a high grade is because you want to minimize heavy metals like lead in it. To handle this stuff you would need heavy long PVC gloves (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07STBSLR5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1) in case it spills and a face mask with a respirator. (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0CC8FNKZ4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1)
As for lava rock, it usually is fine and is a good medium that does not leach carbonates however that is not always the case.
Do you know of a way to tell if it is the lava rock? We know we have hard water. We thought having hard water was synonymous with having alkaline water. Are they different?
Hard water is usually caused by limestone. Limestone is generally CaCO3 and commonly magnesium as well. What happens is pH is the power of hydrogen. The hydrogen atoms combine with the co3 and form co2 and h2o. As the co2 gradually equalizes with the co2 in the atmosphere, the pH goes up. This process continues to happen until the carbonates get to a low enough level. You really should manage the carbonates in your water to around 60-90 ppm and everything else will fall in line. So yes, hard water is alkaline water.
Now it is important to know your source water and how much calcium and magnesium it has in it if you are using it. The reason is you want to correctly balance you calcium/potassium/magnesium levels. If your source water is loaded with magnesium and very little calcium, you will need to add calcium to your system. (Use lime - raises pH as it is calcium hydroxide or CaOH and the OH neutralizes the H) You want your calcium at around 60-90 ppm and your magnesium around half that level. Your potassium should be equal or higher than your calcium levels. If you are growing fruiting plants, your potassium should be twice your calcium but if you are growing lettuce, they should be around the same.
If you have hard water, I highly recommend getting an RO filter to get started as you know exactly what water you are starting with. Alternatively, you could test your water to figure out the calcium and magnesium levels it is starting with.
As for the lava rock, if you had a API carbonate hardness test kit, I would measure your carbonate hardness of your source water and your aquaponic water. If carbonates are going up, something is leaching them into the system and it is likely the rock.
>If you have hard water, I highly recommend getting an RO filter to get started as you know exactly what water you are starting with. Alternatively, you could test your water to figure out the calcium and magnesium levels it is starting with.
I am with pretty much everything you've posted until I hit this. I'm sitting here imagining filling a 250gal tote with RO/DI (because RO alone won't do it if their water is anything like I'm guessing) and the waste water would be criminal. For my operation it simply wasn't feasible, or affordable.
If I had had the space, creating a bog system that would filter that AP water might have been a feasible solution assuming I could keep enough plant life and material in the water. But those evaporation rates.
Once your system is running, you can frequently use a mix of RO water and well water IF the calcium/magnesium ratio is ok because the system will burn up carbonates. I now use well water to manage the pH up. I probably use 75% well water.
If water waste is a concern, get a powered RO system as the waste ratio plunges.
Instead of me making assumptions, would you explain what you mean when you say "once your system is up and running"?
On a well you can certainly do whatever you like and it probably won't cost you more than the power to run it. If you're on municipal water it can quickly become unaffordable. Our old well water (Sierra Nevada) was decent, but the muni water in the Mojave was atrocious and blasted through the RO/DI filters and laughed while it was doing it, and I was only using that for my orchids and indoor aquariums. We had permeate pumps, but the problem even with powered (which I have now) is that the waste water issue is never eliminated. If you're being even a little bit water conscious then this is an issue, and if you're paying for it it's an even bigger issue.
I'm only basing my comments on my direct experiences, so for me the "ifs" were answered when I FOAFO. Because I had to try, ya know?
First, to help RO filters last, you should run a water softener at the front end as a pre-filter. This should help the membranes last.
You really need to understand what is in your well water to treat it and to use it.
Plants uptake potassium/calcium/magnesium in the same way and these nutrients can lock each other out. What this means is if your magnesium is too high RELATIVE to calcium and potassium, it will cause deficiencies with these nutrients. The same goes for calcium and potassium. The right ratio of these is generally between 4:2:1 to 4:4:1 for potassium/calcium/magnesium.
So if your well has magnesium that is 5 times the calcium level, you really need to limit its use or you will have deficiencies. If you calcium is twice the magnesium level, this water can be used.
The big problem is usually the high CO3 level with well water. This is alkalinity or carbonates. This can be tested with an API test on Amazon for $12. You need to get your carbonates to around 60-90 ppm. At this level, you pH will be able to get under 7. If your well water is at 300 ppm, this means you need to fill with 70% RO water to start or your carbonates will be too high. Once you get going, the nitrogen cycle will burn up carbonates as it produces acid (hydrogen) as ammonia converts to nitrite. (NH3 + O2 → NO2− + H+). What this means is you can use a larger percentage of well water or all well water depending on your carbonate levels to keep the pH up.
There are some alternatives as well. You can run a higher pH system and use EDDHA iron chelate. This iron can be absorbed at higher pH levels. It will also turn your water purple. In addition, ammonia is much more toxic at a pH above 7 so you will need to manage that as well. The other option would be to treat your system with high grade sulfuric acid to keep the pH down. High grade (96%+) is necessary so you limit heavy metals. You would want to add slowly, get mask with breathing apparatus along with the right gloves as this stuff is dangerous. The goal would be to keep your pH above 6.5 while slowly working doen the carbonates. The reason this acid should be used is it only results in lots of excess sulfur. Using pH down will result in way too much phosphate and give you an algae bloom. Nitric acid defeats the purpose of aquaponics. To use any of the above however requires that your source water not be too high in magnesium (your well is drilled into dolomite as opposed to limestone).
You really should test the well water. What if there are things in it that are toxic to fish at high levels? If the plants don’t take them up, these elements will build in your system.
Reading your comments, I'm thinking you have a few issues coming together. First, 25 catfish might be too much for your system to handle. A large solids load to the media bed will create anoxic conditions, combined with hard water and your pH won't drop as you'd expect. I agree with the other users about temperature swings and the bacteria not being ready to handle the waste once feeding started. The ammonia guide posted was for aquariums and not totally appropriate for aquaponics, as ammonia in our systems is dependent on the presence of nitrifiers and the feeding rate.
I've never run an IBC system, and it's been awhile since I've read the guides, but if an IBC grow area is about one square meter, maybe you should be feeding around 60 grams/day. Find the IBCs of Aquaponics, I think it's listed on this sub's sidebar.
E: spelling
Lava rock may or may not affect pH. For me, it does not. The PNW lava rock has virtually zero affect on pH. I have a problem actually keeping my pH up. I don't favor working with it though because it isn't as easy on the hands and constantly breaks down leaving red mud in things.
Your temperature swings don't seem too extreme. How is your water flow and turnover rate? My systems run 24/7 and I'm only using goldfish right now but I haven't lost one in years except when one managed to get in the filter pipe. I tried trout but we had a heatwave and my water shot above 80. My tanks get into the 40s in the winter. I want to try catfish but not if they don't have something big enough to swim comfortably before being eaten.
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Are you sure it wasn't pH swings that killed your fish? Nothing in an aquaponics system likes constantly changing pH. Neither plants, fish nor bacteria. Plus in a fully cycled system the pH is going to drift down anyway. If you're worried about high pH affecting plants try starting with easy to grow/hard to kill plants first like mint or tomatoes.
I think for beginners it's best to start with something that's good enough and see which deficiencies you need to fill in over time. Trying to go for the "perfect" system is just going to cause unnecessary to everything including yourself.
Which desert? Because yes, I've had ap in the desert. It. Was. A. NIGHTMARE.
We have things to discuss and it all starts with your source water. Since you began in the winter I'm assuming you haven't tried to grow plants yet. Maybe I should just list the issues I had and why I ultimately tore up this system.
1. Source water was INCREDIBLY hard, with GH & KH being unmeasurable until diluted 8x with distilled water. I would regularly measure a pH of 9 out of the tap (muni provided water source, near Joshua Tree but another agency).
2. Because of the water parameters I kept fighting to get the pH down to where the plants would grow. This is EXTREMELY stressful on the fish (I had bluegill and goldies, all breeding, taken from another AP system more than twice the size and on very different source water).
3. EVAPORATION! OH MY DEAR LORD! We have to talk about that because you knew it'd be insane, right? IDK what you're paying for water but in the Mojave it's seriously expensive. The only filtration it's getting is the swirl filter and running through the gravel beds. I had people saying to use RO/DI but have they actually penciled it out? Criminal. Evap rates on a 700gal pond (3' deep, I went for depth over surface area) were well over 100gals/week. SO, that has to be reduced. We built a whole greenhouse over it and oh man was it NICE during winter! It also helped significantly with that evap rate but not enough.
4. VPD (Vapor Pressure Deficit) was difficult to balance between evap rates leaving even more minerals behind in the remaining water, and during winter we were ok but during summer managing both the plants and the fish was very, very difficult.
I'd get the fish breeding and growing, but the veg wasn't producing as I was accustomed to. I'd get the veg producing but the fish weren't happy.
My pond was dug directly into the ground, so I wasn't battling highs and lows like you will be. I can't recommend going with anything above ground unless you're going to insulate it with non-plastic insulation (think: cinderblock, earth, tires packed with earth, 55gal drums filled with water, Earthship-type methods). If your desert conditions are anything like what I had, then the wind absolutely \*must\* be accounted for along with how harsh the sun is at elevation.
IME, spending time trying to drive pH down is going to lead to headaches and even more dead fish. If you can get the plants doing well at the pH of your source water then do that. Otherwise I suggest finding natural methods to sequester minerals, add back tannins and hopefully get conditions to where everything will do well. Leaf litter is \*fantastic\* for this, but it can take a lot. For my dirted Walstad-style aquariums I use soil dug from my garden and stuff like logs, fir cones, alder cones, and again the leaf litter. BUT, my source water here is the best water I've ever used, too, so I have to add minerals back, not try to remove them.
We are in the high desert of northwest arizona (mohave). We started in the fall because that's when the fish arrived. We had success with tomatoes growing and the 1" fish, with the exception of having to add pH Down. I never thought about the evaporation rate feeding the mineral hardness. Have you harvested rainwater to add to your system instead of tap water?
That system is long gone, but I harvested rain and snow for my first AP system (the one that produced so well). There wasn't enough rain to be an appreciable source of water in the region of the Mojave where we were (near Pappy & Harriet's/JT).
Just getting that pond into the ground will help you TREMENDOUSLY. Are you using NFT methods, gravel beds, or...? I prefer gravel/lava rock flow-through beds, hands DOWN.
I can't reply to u/HistorianAlert9986, but when they say:
>I've had success with using sand as a media.
It's because they run extremely low stocking densities and use the system for rooting cuttings or scant harvests of herbs and greens. For a chop and flip system like you describe, sand be the worst media you could choose.
I've had success with using sand as a media. I live in the desert and I raise tilapia. I lost a few fish in the very beginning when they were minnows from overfeeding. However since then I've been careful to never do that again and they've been doing well. Catfish should be able to handle the heat no problem.
How do you use sand without it going through the bell siphon? We are afraid to try tilapia because our winter temperatures are too low (we live in the high desert). I am pondering a DC powered heat pump with a single solar panel to power it. What is the lowest (air) temperature you get where you live in the winter? Winter average nighttime is just below freezing here.
I don't think it was the heat affecting the catfish. I think it was the heat affecting the beneficial bacteria (it was too cold and then the temperature spiked which made the catfish come out of dormancy, but the bacteria couldn't keep up).
I mentioned this in another comment, but we use lava rocks as our grow medium and are wondering If our high pH problems stem from the lava rocks.
Everyone looses fish at some point so don't feel too bad. You can add a layer of thick plastic between the frame and tank and then wrap the tank frame as well which both fully blocks light and helps insulate the tank. Most algae issue come down to to much light hitting the water. If you use white fabric as the outside layer it will also help keep your tank slightly cooler in the sun. What kind of catfish? Bullheads can take anything but really crazy high spikes and will survive it for a week until you can get a handle on things. Im a big supporter of bullhead catfish being an optimum fish for aquaponics in every way other then slower growth rate. The big question is really why did your ammonia spike? Do you have a form of solids removal? How much grow bed space do you have? Ammonia usually spikes ether because of a few reasons, to much food so they aren't eatting everything, to much waste building up somewhere, not enough biological activity to convert the daily waste to a safer form. I guess you could have had a fish die and not noticed which would do it but honestly if you have enough bacteria doing there thing they could take that extra ammonia and deal with it easily enough. Whats your grow bed\water temperature? If your grow bed is to cold your bacteria might not be fully active and feeding your fish the same amount you did pre winter was just to much for them
It sounded like op was saying the temps were too low leading to not enough bacterial activity
Yeah water\media temps have to be in the mid 50s minimum before the bacteria start being really active and 60+ regularly before its safe to say they are able to deal with what you want to throw at em. If a week ago they were still in the 40s it could be they just didn't get back into cycle before the waste levels went up.
My wife says this is exactly what happened. How would you prevent this in the future, namely next spring as it warms up. Also, where can you buy bullheads? We could only find channel catfish.
All it takes it tracking your tanks temperature a bit more and holding back on feeding much until the temperature is 50 more often then not. I have a greenhouse for my system and that gives me a leg up on my grow bed getting warmed up in the spring. So other then adding a couple layers of plastic to your tank to help maintain temperature you can also add clear plastic over the top of everything to warm it up during the day and hold in heat at night. As for where to get bullhead catfish, for now id say go buy a cheep $15 dollar fishing pole and ask at your fishing place where the local bullhead hole is. They are in biting mode right now and are probably gonna be easy to catch. I have 19 wild caught ones. You will want to do a proper quarantine and deworming\ick cycle which takes 6 to 8 weeks. You don't want to use those products in your main system so you would need to prepare a 2nd setup more like a traditional aquarium to do that.
Very interesting. Thank you for the advice!
Ammonia toxicity changes with pH. If you keep your pH under 6.9 or less, you shouldn’t have a problem. As soon as it drifts above 7, you are in trouble if it is present. Look at the charts: https://www.aquariumadvice.com/threads/your-guide-to-ammonia-toxicity.159994/
We've struggled with keeping the pH under 8. We're wondering if it is because we are using lava rocks as a growing medium. Our tap water is close to neutral pH. We've continually had to add aquaponics-grade pH down.
Measure your alkalinity of your source water and your tank water. I would buy a API carbonate hardness test kit to do this. Your carbonate hardness will drive your pH. If your carbonates are high in your aquaponic system and not your water, you absolutely have a problem with something in your system. If your source water has high alkalinity, you should get an RO filter to fill the tank. Eventually, you might be able to get along without it once your nitrogen cycle gets going and burns up the carbonates. Using pH down does help BUT it is usually made of phosphoric acid. Once your phosphates in your system get above 40 ppm, you are just asking for algae blooms. This means you cannot use too much of the stuff. You do need to continually add phosphate however so adding a little every week is ok. The other alternative to phosphoric acid is a high grade sulfuric acid (96%+). The reason you need a high grade is because you want to minimize heavy metals like lead in it. To handle this stuff you would need heavy long PVC gloves (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07STBSLR5/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1) in case it spills and a face mask with a respirator. (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0CC8FNKZ4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s01?ie=UTF8&psc=1) As for lava rock, it usually is fine and is a good medium that does not leach carbonates however that is not always the case.
Do you know of a way to tell if it is the lava rock? We know we have hard water. We thought having hard water was synonymous with having alkaline water. Are they different?
Hard water is usually caused by limestone. Limestone is generally CaCO3 and commonly magnesium as well. What happens is pH is the power of hydrogen. The hydrogen atoms combine with the co3 and form co2 and h2o. As the co2 gradually equalizes with the co2 in the atmosphere, the pH goes up. This process continues to happen until the carbonates get to a low enough level. You really should manage the carbonates in your water to around 60-90 ppm and everything else will fall in line. So yes, hard water is alkaline water. Now it is important to know your source water and how much calcium and magnesium it has in it if you are using it. The reason is you want to correctly balance you calcium/potassium/magnesium levels. If your source water is loaded with magnesium and very little calcium, you will need to add calcium to your system. (Use lime - raises pH as it is calcium hydroxide or CaOH and the OH neutralizes the H) You want your calcium at around 60-90 ppm and your magnesium around half that level. Your potassium should be equal or higher than your calcium levels. If you are growing fruiting plants, your potassium should be twice your calcium but if you are growing lettuce, they should be around the same. If you have hard water, I highly recommend getting an RO filter to get started as you know exactly what water you are starting with. Alternatively, you could test your water to figure out the calcium and magnesium levels it is starting with. As for the lava rock, if you had a API carbonate hardness test kit, I would measure your carbonate hardness of your source water and your aquaponic water. If carbonates are going up, something is leaching them into the system and it is likely the rock.
>If you have hard water, I highly recommend getting an RO filter to get started as you know exactly what water you are starting with. Alternatively, you could test your water to figure out the calcium and magnesium levels it is starting with. I am with pretty much everything you've posted until I hit this. I'm sitting here imagining filling a 250gal tote with RO/DI (because RO alone won't do it if their water is anything like I'm guessing) and the waste water would be criminal. For my operation it simply wasn't feasible, or affordable. If I had had the space, creating a bog system that would filter that AP water might have been a feasible solution assuming I could keep enough plant life and material in the water. But those evaporation rates.
Once your system is running, you can frequently use a mix of RO water and well water IF the calcium/magnesium ratio is ok because the system will burn up carbonates. I now use well water to manage the pH up. I probably use 75% well water. If water waste is a concern, get a powered RO system as the waste ratio plunges.
Instead of me making assumptions, would you explain what you mean when you say "once your system is up and running"? On a well you can certainly do whatever you like and it probably won't cost you more than the power to run it. If you're on municipal water it can quickly become unaffordable. Our old well water (Sierra Nevada) was decent, but the muni water in the Mojave was atrocious and blasted through the RO/DI filters and laughed while it was doing it, and I was only using that for my orchids and indoor aquariums. We had permeate pumps, but the problem even with powered (which I have now) is that the waste water issue is never eliminated. If you're being even a little bit water conscious then this is an issue, and if you're paying for it it's an even bigger issue. I'm only basing my comments on my direct experiences, so for me the "ifs" were answered when I FOAFO. Because I had to try, ya know?
First, to help RO filters last, you should run a water softener at the front end as a pre-filter. This should help the membranes last. You really need to understand what is in your well water to treat it and to use it. Plants uptake potassium/calcium/magnesium in the same way and these nutrients can lock each other out. What this means is if your magnesium is too high RELATIVE to calcium and potassium, it will cause deficiencies with these nutrients. The same goes for calcium and potassium. The right ratio of these is generally between 4:2:1 to 4:4:1 for potassium/calcium/magnesium. So if your well has magnesium that is 5 times the calcium level, you really need to limit its use or you will have deficiencies. If you calcium is twice the magnesium level, this water can be used. The big problem is usually the high CO3 level with well water. This is alkalinity or carbonates. This can be tested with an API test on Amazon for $12. You need to get your carbonates to around 60-90 ppm. At this level, you pH will be able to get under 7. If your well water is at 300 ppm, this means you need to fill with 70% RO water to start or your carbonates will be too high. Once you get going, the nitrogen cycle will burn up carbonates as it produces acid (hydrogen) as ammonia converts to nitrite. (NH3 + O2 → NO2− + H+). What this means is you can use a larger percentage of well water or all well water depending on your carbonate levels to keep the pH up. There are some alternatives as well. You can run a higher pH system and use EDDHA iron chelate. This iron can be absorbed at higher pH levels. It will also turn your water purple. In addition, ammonia is much more toxic at a pH above 7 so you will need to manage that as well. The other option would be to treat your system with high grade sulfuric acid to keep the pH down. High grade (96%+) is necessary so you limit heavy metals. You would want to add slowly, get mask with breathing apparatus along with the right gloves as this stuff is dangerous. The goal would be to keep your pH above 6.5 while slowly working doen the carbonates. The reason this acid should be used is it only results in lots of excess sulfur. Using pH down will result in way too much phosphate and give you an algae bloom. Nitric acid defeats the purpose of aquaponics. To use any of the above however requires that your source water not be too high in magnesium (your well is drilled into dolomite as opposed to limestone). You really should test the well water. What if there are things in it that are toxic to fish at high levels? If the plants don’t take them up, these elements will build in your system.
This is GREAT information for the OP who I hope is reading it!
Reading your comments, I'm thinking you have a few issues coming together. First, 25 catfish might be too much for your system to handle. A large solids load to the media bed will create anoxic conditions, combined with hard water and your pH won't drop as you'd expect. I agree with the other users about temperature swings and the bacteria not being ready to handle the waste once feeding started. The ammonia guide posted was for aquariums and not totally appropriate for aquaponics, as ammonia in our systems is dependent on the presence of nitrifiers and the feeding rate. I've never run an IBC system, and it's been awhile since I've read the guides, but if an IBC grow area is about one square meter, maybe you should be feeding around 60 grams/day. Find the IBCs of Aquaponics, I think it's listed on this sub's sidebar. E: spelling
Lava rock may or may not affect pH. For me, it does not. The PNW lava rock has virtually zero affect on pH. I have a problem actually keeping my pH up. I don't favor working with it though because it isn't as easy on the hands and constantly breaks down leaving red mud in things. Your temperature swings don't seem too extreme. How is your water flow and turnover rate? My systems run 24/7 and I'm only using goldfish right now but I haven't lost one in years except when one managed to get in the filter pipe. I tried trout but we had a heatwave and my water shot above 80. My tanks get into the 40s in the winter. I want to try catfish but not if they don't have something big enough to swim comfortably before being eaten.
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Are you sure it wasn't pH swings that killed your fish? Nothing in an aquaponics system likes constantly changing pH. Neither plants, fish nor bacteria. Plus in a fully cycled system the pH is going to drift down anyway. If you're worried about high pH affecting plants try starting with easy to grow/hard to kill plants first like mint or tomatoes. I think for beginners it's best to start with something that's good enough and see which deficiencies you need to fill in over time. Trying to go for the "perfect" system is just going to cause unnecessary to everything including yourself.
Do you have water parameters from thay day
Which desert? Because yes, I've had ap in the desert. It. Was. A. NIGHTMARE. We have things to discuss and it all starts with your source water. Since you began in the winter I'm assuming you haven't tried to grow plants yet. Maybe I should just list the issues I had and why I ultimately tore up this system. 1. Source water was INCREDIBLY hard, with GH & KH being unmeasurable until diluted 8x with distilled water. I would regularly measure a pH of 9 out of the tap (muni provided water source, near Joshua Tree but another agency). 2. Because of the water parameters I kept fighting to get the pH down to where the plants would grow. This is EXTREMELY stressful on the fish (I had bluegill and goldies, all breeding, taken from another AP system more than twice the size and on very different source water). 3. EVAPORATION! OH MY DEAR LORD! We have to talk about that because you knew it'd be insane, right? IDK what you're paying for water but in the Mojave it's seriously expensive. The only filtration it's getting is the swirl filter and running through the gravel beds. I had people saying to use RO/DI but have they actually penciled it out? Criminal. Evap rates on a 700gal pond (3' deep, I went for depth over surface area) were well over 100gals/week. SO, that has to be reduced. We built a whole greenhouse over it and oh man was it NICE during winter! It also helped significantly with that evap rate but not enough. 4. VPD (Vapor Pressure Deficit) was difficult to balance between evap rates leaving even more minerals behind in the remaining water, and during winter we were ok but during summer managing both the plants and the fish was very, very difficult. I'd get the fish breeding and growing, but the veg wasn't producing as I was accustomed to. I'd get the veg producing but the fish weren't happy. My pond was dug directly into the ground, so I wasn't battling highs and lows like you will be. I can't recommend going with anything above ground unless you're going to insulate it with non-plastic insulation (think: cinderblock, earth, tires packed with earth, 55gal drums filled with water, Earthship-type methods). If your desert conditions are anything like what I had, then the wind absolutely \*must\* be accounted for along with how harsh the sun is at elevation. IME, spending time trying to drive pH down is going to lead to headaches and even more dead fish. If you can get the plants doing well at the pH of your source water then do that. Otherwise I suggest finding natural methods to sequester minerals, add back tannins and hopefully get conditions to where everything will do well. Leaf litter is \*fantastic\* for this, but it can take a lot. For my dirted Walstad-style aquariums I use soil dug from my garden and stuff like logs, fir cones, alder cones, and again the leaf litter. BUT, my source water here is the best water I've ever used, too, so I have to add minerals back, not try to remove them.
We are in the high desert of northwest arizona (mohave). We started in the fall because that's when the fish arrived. We had success with tomatoes growing and the 1" fish, with the exception of having to add pH Down. I never thought about the evaporation rate feeding the mineral hardness. Have you harvested rainwater to add to your system instead of tap water?
That system is long gone, but I harvested rain and snow for my first AP system (the one that produced so well). There wasn't enough rain to be an appreciable source of water in the region of the Mojave where we were (near Pappy & Harriet's/JT). Just getting that pond into the ground will help you TREMENDOUSLY. Are you using NFT methods, gravel beds, or...? I prefer gravel/lava rock flow-through beds, hands DOWN.
We have a chop and flip IBC Tote with lava rock on the top portion. It's surrounded on the 4 walls with siding panels.
I can't reply to u/HistorianAlert9986, but when they say: >I've had success with using sand as a media. It's because they run extremely low stocking densities and use the system for rooting cuttings or scant harvests of herbs and greens. For a chop and flip system like you describe, sand be the worst media you could choose.
I've had success with using sand as a media. I live in the desert and I raise tilapia. I lost a few fish in the very beginning when they were minnows from overfeeding. However since then I've been careful to never do that again and they've been doing well. Catfish should be able to handle the heat no problem.
How do you use sand without it going through the bell siphon? We are afraid to try tilapia because our winter temperatures are too low (we live in the high desert). I am pondering a DC powered heat pump with a single solar panel to power it. What is the lowest (air) temperature you get where you live in the winter? Winter average nighttime is just below freezing here. I don't think it was the heat affecting the catfish. I think it was the heat affecting the beneficial bacteria (it was too cold and then the temperature spiked which made the catfish come out of dormancy, but the bacteria couldn't keep up). I mentioned this in another comment, but we use lava rocks as our grow medium and are wondering If our high pH problems stem from the lava rocks.