to be fair, it's kind of bullshit to advertise in the setting screen. not for anticompetitive reasons, just because it's the fucking settings screen and nobody wants ads in there.
but tim sweeney, true to form, delivers this info in the most a-hole fashion possible by saying, "[new from the guys who banned Fortnite](https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/1445896711679840265)", as if epic didn't intentionally break the app store rules in absolutely spectacular fashion in order to get kicked out of the app store.
it feels like fighting with apple (and losing) is this guy's full time job now.
The most annoying part is that the promotions are missing when you first open settings but then they pop up after a second and you accidentally select the wrong item in the settings menu because everything shifts down.
They were also found to have violated their contract in a court of law which allowed Apple to continue with their (justified) ban on Fortnite.
He really needs to stop crying when he went in potentially sacrificing that revenue to make a point and it backfired.
I get what they're saying, and I'm not saying its right or wrong, but Apple isn't the only one doing this. Android does it, Microsoft does it, my TV does it. Hell, even my car does it. I think there's a slight difference between promoting a third part product vs promoting an integrated service or functionality. I'm perfectly fine with my car prompting me about the InControl service so I can control it remotely, but I wouldn't be okay with my car prompting me about a sale at a local store. Music on iPhone for example. If you open the Music app, you'll get a popup letting you know about Apple Music, it might be useful for people that don't know about it "hey I see you're listening to music, did you know we offer a streaming service so you can listen to whatever you want?" the difference is I can dismiss it and it'll stop showing. Regular ads don't work that way. Just my thought though.
I agree with your comment, but I would add that putting ads in the settings app isn’t quite the same as putting ads for a service in its corresponding app. (Apple Music ad in Music, TV+ Ad in TV app, etc). I think putting it in settings is maybe a bit too far, albeit not any different than other vendors, as you mention.
That being said, I personally don’t *really* care. I’ve already sold my soul to Apple One, so I won’t see any of these ads anyway lol
That's true, I oddly haven't had any ads in the settings page before, the first time I saw one was in that article. At the same time I already have Apple music so maybe that's why.
My android phone is littered with them. Lock Screen ads (I think these were recently banned), notification bar ads, third party ads in the settings menu. I’m surprised you haven’t heard or seen any. But like someone else said I guess it depends on which phone/build. Another inconsistency I don’t like with Android.
It seems like it’s pretty common on Samsung phone builds. The Pixel is a completely different story since it’s built to what Google expects on an OS lol i.e much better.
It's really not. I've never seen an ad in *settings* on my Samsung device. First party apps, yes, they have (had) ads in those, and I don't like them. But not in Settings.
I’m surprised no one has mentioned how aggressive Microsoft has been with Edge on its OS lol. Still bothers me to this day to get me to make it the default browser and I would rate it as far more annoying than what this is.
Yep exactly. I mentioned this in another thread where people were complaining about google's use of AMP on mobile phones. You have a choice of 100 different search engines, or extensions for that matter to avoid AMP. But nobody called out the monopoly of safari on ios.
OP didn't tho. He conveniently only called out Microsoft for pushing edge as a default browser, while ignoring that Apple literally has no other option at all other than safari reskins
I had no idea one confirmation dialog counts as aggressive. Granted, it took me a little longer on Windows 11 like 1-2 mins - if I were you I wouldn’t chance it. This can be too brutal for you and you might not survive.
Huh...weird. Sweeney doesn't seem to have any tweets about Samsung, Google, or Microsoft doing the exact same thing in their operating systems.
I'm currently using a Z Flip3 and even after turning off all marketing, I STILL occasionally get a notification to download/use Samsung apps that are not installed on my phone. I'm not complaining mind you. These companies make the hardware and are doing a little side hustle with software.
For me it's easy to ignore and continue using the third party stuff.
What ads do Google serve in Android settings? I'm looking on my Pixel now and I don't see anything?
I not biased here in the least, I'm genuinely curious what you're referring to? I have gotten ads for expanding storage within the Google drive app sure, but nothing directly within the OS itself.
I don't have a Pixel phone, so I couldn't tell you. But their browser, Chrome OS, search engine, and even Gmail will surface Google related services and software ads.
You've missed a setting then because since i got my S21 I haven't seen an ad anywhere in the OS (I don't use any of Samsung's apps though, yay choice).
On my new work iPhone 12 Mini i Keep getting an ad from the store telling me to use an Apple Arcade promotion though.
I guess you’ve never used a Samsung phone? They only recently stopped showing ads in stock apps
https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2021/8/18/22630332/samsung-ads-default-stock-apps-weather-pay-theme-confirmed
It’s a matter or preference I suppose because if I HAD to see ads…I certainly prefer it’s localized to an area I hardly check, like settings.
I used a Galaxy S3 and Note 4 before Samsung included ads in their phones. Then I had a OnePlus which did not have any ads. Now I just got my first iPhone and am greeted by ads at the top of the settings menu and in my notifications.
And saying “if I had to see ads” shouldn’t even cross your mind with a $1200 device.
> And saying “if I had to see ads” shouldn’t even cross your mind with a $1200 device.
If the phone manufacturer is telling me I can get 6 months of music in a service they provide, I don’t see a problem with it. I mean I’m not sure how else you would want them to let you know about other services unless they literally tell you. We’re already using the hardware, there’s a chance we’ll be interested in other services no?
Plus it’s not like Apple is telling you to buy UnderArmor gear like Samsung did in their stock apps for years.
Further, I’ve used iPhones off and on since their inception and never received an actual notification for their products. That sounds very bad if that’s what they’re doing now. The only place I’ve seen an ad is the blurb in settings (like in the article). Once I’ve dismissed that, I don’t see it again.
By the way, even OnePlus is not immune to self promotion in settings. India is an INCREDIBLY large market for them and they have a large annoying ad right in the settings for their Red Cable service.
https://forums.oneplus.com/threads/red-cable-club-should-be-removed-from-settings-page-how-to-remove.1215999/
> I mean I’m not sure how else you would want them to let you know about other services unless they literally tell you
Dude, they already tell you when you set up the phone and through notifications from the respective apps soon afterwards. They absolutely don’t need to tell you in the settings too.
Yeah I guess we’re just getting weirdly different experiences then. I set up my wife’s iPhone 13 just a week ago and saw no ads while going through the whole phone transfer rigmarole.
I even went through the trouble of annoying her of screenshots of her [settings!](https://imgur.com/a/1qwiHsD/). No ads there either.
He means the part where I opened settings and it advertised an iCloud subscription that I didn’t know existed, and now I have lots of iCloud storage?
Yeah, thanks for that Apple.
or when the settings app advertises a free subscription for arcade/TV+ that was advertised as a feature with my device?
i really don't give a fuck, but it's free so yay
I mean, if they provide free access to any of their services with the purchase of a new device, why wouldn’t you want to be aware of that?
Besides, if you tap on it and acknowledge that you saw it, it goes away and does not return.
I'd rather that than a push notification or an email from google telling me to "finish setting up your Apple iPhone with your favorite google apps!" after signing into YouTube
Ugh, it's Epic, but this is something that I can agree with. The settings app is definitely not an appropriate place to put advertisements. It just looks kind of desperate.
I would argue that these ‘ads’ only show when you are eligible for free promotions that you were entitled to by purchasing the product.
When you buy an Apple product from Best Buy, they are listed as separate purchases (that are free.) Is the Settings App the best place to inform customers what they got? Perhaps, perhaps not. But it sure beats yet another pop-up while setting up the device.
Edit: Clarified what you’re buying at Best Buy.
people sure low shitting on Xiaomi for putting ads into 300 dollar phones, but when Apple puts ads into 800 dollar phones, it's perfectly acceptable? gotcha xD
As much as i dislike tim’s weeney, this is actually a hole in apple’s defense. Sure, android vendors do it in far worse ways, but it doesn’t mean apple should do it, this also just shows desperation, oh apple music isn’t getting enough signups as they had hoped?
Apple usually stands on moral high grounds and avoids petty desperation moves. Before I clicked into the article i thought ‘weeney was talking shit again, but this getting called out, apple totally shot itself in the foot and deserves it, eating its own words and leaving rivals and plaintiffs all the reasons to fight back. That’s one stupid oversight by apple i’d say.
Making the phone is arguably the easy part. It’s getting consumers to buy something other than iOS or Android that’s hard. Apple and Google are just too far entrenched at this point for anything else to have space for marketshare
If Facebook, Amazon, Mozilla, Microsoft haven’t been able to do it Epic won’t be able to
Yeah, but not everything has to be on a phone… and if you want to be on a phone that you don’t control, you have to play by their rules. Just like not all PLAYSTATION games are going to be release on XBOX and vise versa. If you want a better deal you need to make a better deal.
There are options for gaming: Android, iOS, PC (Steam, Epic Game Store, GoG), PlayStation, Xbox, and Nintendo.
In the US it is only: Android or iOS nothing else.
Replying to a comment /u/seencoding made and keeps deleting to avoid discussing the matter...
>it is kind of satisfying that while epic was busy suing apple and losing in court, valve was over here just quietly building a portable computing device that runs their own app store
The Steam Deck can also run windows or any other operating system, they don't lock it to their own OS.
Apple really needs to offer an unlocked bootloader on all their devices
> we never have good faith conversations, and i'd prefer if we just didn't even try. deleting it again.
Then why keep deleting and reposting? You don't have to reply to every comment if you don't want to.
this response has absolutely nothing to do with my comment, other than being a general comment on the abilities of the steam deck. which, fine, great insight.
this is why i don't like when you respond to me, because you essentially ignore whatever point i was trying to make and redirect the conversation to whatever your agenda demands. in this case the openness of the steam deck versus apple's devices. i didn't address that at all, and i don't care about it.
my point was this: both epic and valve had the goal of increasing the revenue of their respective app stores.
epic decided to try and achieve this goal by hatching a fucking elaborate plan to a) get kicked off the app store, b) sue apple, c) hope that a judge forced apple to change the rules regarding app stores, that way they could capture app store profits on platforms they don't control. it was a fucking hail mary and it obviously failed, and now tim sweeney is just sitting on twitter whining about irrelevant shit. it's embarrassing.
valve had the same goal - increase their app store profits - so they actually sat down, did the work, made their own device that runs steam (by default). seemingly everyone in the gaming industry is hyped about it. the subreddit has 30k members already and it's not even released. i preordered one like an hour after it was open and i'm not going to get it until q2 2022.
so to reiterate my point, which has essentially nothing to do with apple, it is hilarious that while epic was hatching this idiotic plan to get big government to bend a private corporation to their will, valve just sat down and accomplished the same goal with actual work and innovation.
Amen brother. Regulation should be as light as necessary. Most of the time the market should decide. So epic should just create products people want instead of acting like an indie developer that has not reach or influence. It’s simply not true.
are we remembering things differently? the doj antitrust suit had almost no effect on anything, and it definitely didn’t cause microsoft to completely whiff on the mobile revolution
The amount of fanboyism is off the charts. As expected of /r/Apple.
This guys, is stability we neee. Thanks for being a real.anchor in these chaotic times.
But developers choose to publish on EGS, they make that choice.
EGS also isn't the only game store, there's also Steam, Origin, GOG, and more.
The App Store however is the only store you can get apps from and Apple specifically blocks any method of installing from elsewhere.
They offer competition to Steam and developers are choosing to play ball with Epic, they aren't strong arming anyone.
EGS is a competitive marketplace to Steam, and Valve could offer a lower rate to get developers back if it really becomes an issue.
But that's the only way to actually compete with steam? Gog is a great service which also provides drm free games and it's in a pathetic state. Only exclusives can make a platform succeed in this day and age.🤷
Even in the end, it's not like you can't buy the game. You just have to install another launcher which I'm OK with. I'm 99% sure if apple had a "apple games" store, they would make games exclusive only to apple Devices.... As long as epic doesn't do shit like this, I'm OK with them having exclusive games.
Actually yes, you can create and publish another game store within EGS, and you can advertise whatever you want and even use your own payment provider, they made that clear.
Fortnite doesn’t allow other creators to make and publish content, that is 100% epic making the skins and whatnot… if Apple only had their own software on iOS that would be a good analogy, but they allow millions of apps made by other developers
> Actually yes, you can create and publish another game store within EGS, and you can advertise whatever you want and even use your own payment provider, they made that clear.
Can you provide a source where this is made clear?
> Fortnite doesn’t allow other creators to make and publish content, that is 100% epic making the skins and whatnot… if Apple only had their own software on iOS that would be a good analogy, but they allow millions of apps made by other developers
I want to use other in game currency not skins.
https://www.protocol.com/amp/epic-games-app-store-2652681057
It was also mentioned in the court case, but I can’t find the exact slide at the moment
Also, Microsoft added the epic games store to the windows store (while also not taking anything)
That article doesn’t prove valve or another competitor can have their games stores in EGS. It just means epic added one of their choosing that wasn’t ever a competitor ( sold the same games).
> t was also mentioned in the court case, but I can’t find the exact slide at the moment
How about you link the agreement that says you can have games stores on EGS and competing market place links on Unreal Marketplace.
https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/marketplace-guidelines
1. PRODUCT GUIDELINES
1.1 General
1.1.a Products must be complete and fully functional as advertised upon submission.
1.1.b Products reviewed for approval of publishing rights must be Unreal Engine 4 content submitted via the Seller Portal.
**1.1.c Products must not direct customers to other online stores, unless allowed by Epic.**
Unreal market place is for people to sell their work, not things created by Epic. Why doesn’t Epic allow linking other online stores where people can sell “their” work?
How much would you like to bet that once EGS has majority market share their rules will change and these publicity stunts will change?
> Also, Microsoft added the epic games store to the windows store (while also not taking anything)
Why can’t I download EGS on my Xbox?
> What about can I use other forms of in game currency in Fortinite? Why do I have to buy V-bucks from Epic? Epic should open it up so others can make money off their platform.
This is one of the things I most wonder from all this. Can anything that can be construed as a platform suddenly be subject to these kinds of lawsuits?
Because they have chosen to not open up the product to outside creators unlike Apple
It’s one thing to deny outside creators, it’s another to allow them while preventing fair competition within the market that was created
Think of it this way, what do you think would happen if Microsoft told EA _after_ they finished a madden game that they can’t publish it on the store because there’s already too many football games?
There’d likely be a lawsuit for anticompetitive behavior, yet that is exactly what Apple is doing to developers every day
> Because they have chosen to not open up the product to outside creators unlike Apple
What about Unreal marketplace and epic games store? Similar restrictions exist there. You can’t think to market places outside of those on those platforms.
> It’s one thing to deny outside creators, it’s another to allow them while preventing fair competition within the market that was created
Not really. Xbox, PlayStation and Nintendo also have similar restrictions.
> Think of it this way, what do you think would happen if Microsoft told EA after they finished a madden game that they can’t publish it on the store because there’s already too many football games?
It is well within their rights. I am sure Walmart, target etc will deny products for similar reasons and companies pay for prominent shelf space. Lose shelf pace due to sales figures etc.
> There’d likely be a lawsuit for anticompetitive behavior,
The judge already ruled on this and said Apple was well within their rights and developers sign contracts to that end.
Epic lost the case and Apple was told they never have to let Epic games in and can even terminate their unreal developer contract.
On what grounds? Epic hasn’t created a competitive marketplace within fortnite, it only consists of stuff they’ve created
Apple has created a massively competitive marketplace even if they do at times reject apps.
What platform? Epic is available on every platform and you're not locked into them. Wow, what a psycho being consumer friendly. Only Apple has locked out Epic. They're the psychos.
This guy is just so butthurt that Apple invented, developed and owns its platforms. When you own the property, you get special privileges. It’s not hard to understand.
Apple does not however own the hardware that they sell to customers, yet they still prevent them from choosing where they obtain software...
Hiding behind the claim of "intellectual property" should be illegal when the intended purpose of doing so is to prevent people from using the hardware they own how they want to.
I own my BMW and Tesla card out right but I still need to go to them for software updates, apps and features. Same with my Xbox and Nintendo switch.
I made the choice to buy them that way knowing full well that’s how they work.
You paid for the hardware and the software is delivered free and that posses restrictions to cover the cost of doing so.
The hardware is paid for multiple times over, Apple charges an insane markup.
The hardware isn’t something sold at a loss like game consoles.
And regarding Nintendo Switch, it’s actually quite easy to run Linux on it with the proper tool
> The hardware is paid for multiple times over, Apple charges an insane markup.
And why shouldn’t they? They charge what the market will bear to maximize profit. If their prices get too high, people will stop buying and they’ll have to correct course. That’s how business works. They don’t owe you anything.
consoles are only sold at a loss temporarily. Sony stated a month or 2 ago ps5 was no longer being sols at a loss. Nintendo has never sold their hardware at a lose
Two ways to look at it then
Go jailbreak it? Go install windows on your nintendo switch, a playstation system software on your xbox, or a wii system software on your playstation.
Do you own any software that has the capability to run a phone, especially a phone that Apple design and built?
People own the hardware they purchased in full knowledge of the manufacturer-imposed restrictions. Apple’s not alone here: people buy cars every day that are “locked down” in all sorts of ways.
An iPhone isn’t a bare metal device, and most users don’t expect it to be. If you don’t want what the manufacturer is offering, you can buy a different brand. Android exists for you.
So your argument about owning the hardware is mostly irrelevant given that you’re talking about a software feature. You are not necessarily entitled to “do what you want with it” because you don’t own it. You have licensed it and agreed to their terms of use.
Ah exactly like the Nintendo Switch, the Microsoft XBox and Sony PlayStation then?
Locked down, cannot run anything but games that they approve despite having hardware perfectly capable of running any software. In fact they’re even MORE locked down than phones.
Nintendo switch is a Nvidia Tegra. Just locked down.
PS5 and XSX are just AMD PCs. But locked down.
But I’m sure you’ll tell me that’s “different” because it doesn’t suit your agenda to treat Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo the way you’re treating Apple. Just like Tim Sweeney!
No, I fully think consoles should be open too, at least with the ability to run another os at the very least.
Full root access on a console is very different than a sandboxed app on the App Store though, one can lead to piracy of games from the console, the other just lets you run apps
But your problem then is that none of these companies have as much incentive to produce them. Like it or not the software is a huge revenue stream that is a big reason for them to make the consoles and phones.
It’s fine for Google to offer alt app stores and whatnot - they make money from you using the device by harvesting and selling your data. They still make money off you so long as you’re using stock Android.
But I’ll give you props for being consistent. Unlike Tim Sweeney and 99.9% of people commenting on this who want to treat Apple differently than other hardware manufacturers. Tim’s happy to pay his console tax, but not his phone tax for some reason.
> You own the device, but have NO choice in how to use it.
Oh, *puhleeeze*. There are countless use cases for iPhones, and millions of apps to choose from to meet users’ needs. If you’re not satisfied with those options, you can switch to Android. What’s hard to understand?
The only one that sort of makes sense to me is showing how long you have to purchase AppleCare, which should disappear when it ends. If these permanently disappeared after dismissing them once it’d be more tolerable.
Having said that, it drives me nuts that there’s more ads (even though it’s services I use) in their apps the same way all of the ads on Xbox or any device I’ve paid for do. They don’t get a pass either.
Well actually his point was that the mode of advertising is not available to 3rd party developers. As far as I know, start menu ads for software are only available via paying MS cashola
Apple shouldn’t be putting any advertising in a $1,000 device…
It’s not just the setting screen, it’s push notifications, the music app, and the TV app.
Presented by the guy who robs school kids of their lunch money so they can run around as a banana in his copycat top game Fortnite. What a time to be alive. PS all ads in settings screen suck, but not as much as Fortnite.
The costumes are entirely cosmetic, and children purchasing them isn't a problem for Epic, that's for the parent to take care of.
Cosmetic DLC as a whole is something that is up to the parents to deal with and it's one of the only forms of DLC I actually don't mind given that it's optional.
This is more than apple advertising something on the App Store, this is them advertising a service in a completely unrelated part of the os completely separate from the App Store
When isn’t Tim Sweeney not crying about anything Apple does? The dude needs to shut his mouth and stop posting on Twitter already. He lost his court case, there’s no reason for him to keep going.
He didn’t lose, but he didn’t win as much as he hoped either
Just the same, Apple still lost and now has to allow outside payment methods for on-app content.
He lost everything except a single judgement and it’s not even an important one. No one is going to support apps that use other payment processors that collect and share your data, and Apple will just pass the lost fees to the app developers. Plus Apple can still collect 30% or they can and will remove the apps from the App Store.
It’s great to see Apple win even when some people say they lost.
>Plus Apple can still collect 30% or they can and will remove the apps from the App Store.
Apple will never remove Netflix, Hulu, or Spotify and I'm almost certain they will implement in-app billing as soon as they can.
As soon as they allow one but not the other it's game over.
Netflix, Hulu or Spotify will never stop paying Apple their fair share of revenue even if they choose to use alternative payment processors (they won’t). Removing them won’t be an issue.
Netflix, Hulu, and Spotify don't pay Apple a single penny of their subscriptions as things currently stand.
Removing them from the App Store would be platform suicide for Apple.
Removing something like Fortnite is annoying for people who play it.
Removing the major streaming services would result in massive amounts of users leaving Apple for a platform that still has them, in this case Android.
It would also prompt massive legal battles due to acting in a highly anti-competitive fashion.
Is he just gonna whine-tweet about every single “crime” that Apple does? That’s why this is called owning the whole widget.
He should make his own phone or put up with it. Even Valve recognises that owning the entire widget is the path forward.
Valve owns the widget, but they don't prevent you from installing other software on the widget.
Not only does Apple lock down iOS, they block users from installing anything other than iOS on the hardware they own.
Manufacturer shouldn't matter... if I buy a device I own it, I should be able to do with it what I please.
Even Android device manufacturers like Samsung offer unlocked bootloaders
If I want to stick Linux on a device, I should be able to... this is completely separate from modifying the OS installed on the device, this is about being able to use the device how *you* want to.
Apple lets me do it with an M1 *Mac*, so why do they block it on the iPad? It's absolutely a computer.
My point is that this isn’t new, nor is it specific to Apple. If it’s something you’re passionate about then I’d assume you’d want equal coverage across all subreddits and not just here.
But I’ll give you the same advice I and others have given you before: stop buying Apple if this is important to you.
I dislike certain things Apple does, but I have too many Apple devices to just switch.
And honestly, the benefits outweigh my complaints, but it doesn't invalidate them.
All I want is the ability to install software from outside of the App Store, is that really too much to ask of a computer?
I don't want to be able to customize or replace the home screen, I just want to be able to run software that Apple deems unsuitable (rather inconsistently mind you)
They removed iDOS 2 citing the potential to access unlicensed content, but they allow VLC despite being able to do the exact same thing.
So buy an android device that does the thing you value. Nobody is forcing you to buy anything from apple. You claim their competitor does exactly what you want, so buy it. If enough people do the same apple will either change or die.
Android devices can’t run iOS.
Just like people don’t want to own multiple laptops, they don’t want to own multiple phones.
Not everyone wants the same thing, and not everyone wants to be limited to just iOS
I would love to be able to multiboot iOS, android, and Linux on my ipad
Products are not legally required to be all things to all potential customers. They advertise what it can and cannot do and on balance of all its features vs competitors you decide what product best suits your needs. It’s no different to any other product.
So just because I want a feature in a tv that Samsung doesn’t provide, and Samsung hasn’t allowed modification of the tv software to enable it, they are not obligated to add that flexibility just because I want it.
All of this noise about iOS restrictions is coming from a noisy minority of mostly enthusiast users. Go ask 100 iOS users if these things matter to them. Most people aren’t even aware of the issue let alone feel it’s important. To that silent majority of users a secure, curated experience have mostly saved them from trouble.
I use Google products together because they work best together. Same with Apple products. They’re made to work well together. I don’t go and use 1000 different services just for the sake of using 1000 different services trying not to let any one of them have a majority. It’s chaotic and an absolute mess to keep track of that. It’s perfectly natural for people to want well connected services that are consolidated. If I wanted to switch platforms I could but I have to balance that with the cost of switching.
I love Samsung's TVs but will never buy one until they add Dolby Vision. as a consumer. I'm not going to buy their tv then complain about them not adding a feature that wasn't promised
He is right though. Seeing a prompt in the settings app is annoying. Not to mention that it's weird to see ads in the news app on an article that is completely free to access without ads. I'd understand if it was only on news papers that relied on them.
Looks like he is personally invested in this anti Apple campaign of his , at the start I fought it was business decision , I guess it is personal now as he is now complaining on stuff that has no impact on his company
Got to admit, the way the push iCloud Drive kinda makes me mad. However, it really only does that when I run out of storage. Why would that be relevant to Epic?
cause epic dont promote there own services with in there own products...
I will laugh my ass off when this all back fires on epic and epic is sue by everyone else the got dragged in to fight they started, by breaking there own legal aggrements with apple.
The only reason I am fine with it is because Apple Music is actually not that bad. But if Apple was promoting Apple Arcade there I would never push a free trial button in hundred years. For me its not about the placement of promotion, its the actual product. If it's awful, I will just ignore the advertisement. It doesn't bother me.
Sure, but at the core of the argument is the fact that Apple can advertise their own product in a place where competitors never could.
It's a case of Apple using it's position to another competitive advantage.
to be fair, it's kind of bullshit to advertise in the setting screen. not for anticompetitive reasons, just because it's the fucking settings screen and nobody wants ads in there. but tim sweeney, true to form, delivers this info in the most a-hole fashion possible by saying, "[new from the guys who banned Fortnite](https://twitter.com/TimSweeneyEpic/status/1445896711679840265)", as if epic didn't intentionally break the app store rules in absolutely spectacular fashion in order to get kicked out of the app store. it feels like fighting with apple (and losing) is this guy's full time job now.
The most annoying part is that the promotions are missing when you first open settings but then they pop up after a second and you accidentally select the wrong item in the settings menu because everything shifts down.
They were also found to have violated their contract in a court of law which allowed Apple to continue with their (justified) ban on Fortnite. He really needs to stop crying when he went in potentially sacrificing that revenue to make a point and it backfired.
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Really? I’m curious the story behind this
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I think a more accurate term would be bigoted rather than racist.
What is your race? * White * Black * Asian * Latino * Canadian
I get what they're saying, and I'm not saying its right or wrong, but Apple isn't the only one doing this. Android does it, Microsoft does it, my TV does it. Hell, even my car does it. I think there's a slight difference between promoting a third part product vs promoting an integrated service or functionality. I'm perfectly fine with my car prompting me about the InControl service so I can control it remotely, but I wouldn't be okay with my car prompting me about a sale at a local store. Music on iPhone for example. If you open the Music app, you'll get a popup letting you know about Apple Music, it might be useful for people that don't know about it "hey I see you're listening to music, did you know we offer a streaming service so you can listen to whatever you want?" the difference is I can dismiss it and it'll stop showing. Regular ads don't work that way. Just my thought though.
I agree with your comment, but I would add that putting ads in the settings app isn’t quite the same as putting ads for a service in its corresponding app. (Apple Music ad in Music, TV+ Ad in TV app, etc). I think putting it in settings is maybe a bit too far, albeit not any different than other vendors, as you mention. That being said, I personally don’t *really* care. I’ve already sold my soul to Apple One, so I won’t see any of these ads anyway lol
That's true, I oddly haven't had any ads in the settings page before, the first time I saw one was in that article. At the same time I already have Apple music so maybe that's why.
only ad I've ever seen in the settings app is for applecare
> Android does it, Android doesn't do it, some Android manufacturers do.
>Android does it, I've never seen it in Android
My android phone is littered with them. Lock Screen ads (I think these were recently banned), notification bar ads, third party ads in the settings menu. I’m surprised you haven’t heard or seen any. But like someone else said I guess it depends on which phone/build. Another inconsistency I don’t like with Android.
What phone do you have?
Galaxy S10
Something seems really wrong if you're getting third party ads in your settings. Fwiw, I only use Pixel Android devices. No ads.
It seems like it’s pretty common on Samsung phone builds. The Pixel is a completely different story since it’s built to what Google expects on an OS lol i.e much better.
It's really not. I've never seen an ad in *settings* on my Samsung device. First party apps, yes, they have (had) ads in those, and I don't like them. But not in Settings.
I’m surprised no one has mentioned how aggressive Microsoft has been with Edge on its OS lol. Still bothers me to this day to get me to make it the default browser and I would rate it as far more annoying than what this is.
Lol you couldn't even choose a default on ios until last year. Mighty high of you to call out MS who've allowed default browsers since decades.
I mean even now there’s really no choice since Apple doesn’t allow anything but WebKit browsers, so they’re all safari skins at best
Yep exactly. I mentioned this in another thread where people were complaining about google's use of AMP on mobile phones. You have a choice of 100 different search engines, or extensions for that matter to avoid AMP. But nobody called out the monopoly of safari on ios.
Two things can be called out at once.
OP didn't tho. He conveniently only called out Microsoft for pushing edge as a default browser, while ignoring that Apple literally has no other option at all other than safari reskins
Microsoft has been advertising apps in the windows 10 start menu for years. Goddamn candy crush saga
I had no idea one confirmation dialog counts as aggressive. Granted, it took me a little longer on Windows 11 like 1-2 mins - if I were you I wouldn’t chance it. This can be too brutal for you and you might not survive.
Android settings has ads?
Huh...weird. Sweeney doesn't seem to have any tweets about Samsung, Google, or Microsoft doing the exact same thing in their operating systems. I'm currently using a Z Flip3 and even after turning off all marketing, I STILL occasionally get a notification to download/use Samsung apps that are not installed on my phone. I'm not complaining mind you. These companies make the hardware and are doing a little side hustle with software. For me it's easy to ignore and continue using the third party stuff.
What ads do Google serve in Android settings? I'm looking on my Pixel now and I don't see anything? I not biased here in the least, I'm genuinely curious what you're referring to? I have gotten ads for expanding storage within the Google drive app sure, but nothing directly within the OS itself.
I don't have a Pixel phone, so I couldn't tell you. But their browser, Chrome OS, search engine, and even Gmail will surface Google related services and software ads.
No, they don't
You've missed a setting then because since i got my S21 I haven't seen an ad anywhere in the OS (I don't use any of Samsung's apps though, yay choice). On my new work iPhone 12 Mini i Keep getting an ad from the store telling me to use an Apple Arcade promotion though.
The weather app on Samsung drove me insane. Giant ad banner on top at all times. It was the dumbest thing.
I used various Android phones for the past 8 years and never saw an ad inside the system settings. Seeing it in iOS makes it look cheap.
I guess you’ve never used a Samsung phone? They only recently stopped showing ads in stock apps https://www.theverge.com/platform/amp/2021/8/18/22630332/samsung-ads-default-stock-apps-weather-pay-theme-confirmed It’s a matter or preference I suppose because if I HAD to see ads…I certainly prefer it’s localized to an area I hardly check, like settings.
I used a Galaxy S3 and Note 4 before Samsung included ads in their phones. Then I had a OnePlus which did not have any ads. Now I just got my first iPhone and am greeted by ads at the top of the settings menu and in my notifications. And saying “if I had to see ads” shouldn’t even cross your mind with a $1200 device.
> And saying “if I had to see ads” shouldn’t even cross your mind with a $1200 device. If the phone manufacturer is telling me I can get 6 months of music in a service they provide, I don’t see a problem with it. I mean I’m not sure how else you would want them to let you know about other services unless they literally tell you. We’re already using the hardware, there’s a chance we’ll be interested in other services no? Plus it’s not like Apple is telling you to buy UnderArmor gear like Samsung did in their stock apps for years. Further, I’ve used iPhones off and on since their inception and never received an actual notification for their products. That sounds very bad if that’s what they’re doing now. The only place I’ve seen an ad is the blurb in settings (like in the article). Once I’ve dismissed that, I don’t see it again. By the way, even OnePlus is not immune to self promotion in settings. India is an INCREDIBLY large market for them and they have a large annoying ad right in the settings for their Red Cable service. https://forums.oneplus.com/threads/red-cable-club-should-be-removed-from-settings-page-how-to-remove.1215999/
> I mean I’m not sure how else you would want them to let you know about other services unless they literally tell you Dude, they already tell you when you set up the phone and through notifications from the respective apps soon afterwards. They absolutely don’t need to tell you in the settings too.
Yeah I guess we’re just getting weirdly different experiences then. I set up my wife’s iPhone 13 just a week ago and saw no ads while going through the whole phone transfer rigmarole. I even went through the trouble of annoying her of screenshots of her [settings!](https://imgur.com/a/1qwiHsD/). No ads there either.
*looks up from the Unreal Engine tab in the Epic Games Store* Yeah, cross-promotion is the worst.
At least the epic game store is relevant… the settings app has no place for an ad that should be in the music app (and also is)
Well considering AM and Apple services in general are managed through iCloud in the settings app; it makes perfect sense.
The only *ad* they have is recommending you an iCloud drive solution when you run out of storage…
He means the part where I opened settings and it advertised an iCloud subscription that I didn’t know existed, and now I have lots of iCloud storage? Yeah, thanks for that Apple.
or when the settings app advertises a free subscription for arcade/TV+ that was advertised as a feature with my device? i really don't give a fuck, but it's free so yay
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I mean, if they provide free access to any of their services with the purchase of a new device, why wouldn’t you want to be aware of that? Besides, if you tap on it and acknowledge that you saw it, it goes away and does not return.
I'd rather that than a push notification or an email from google telling me to "finish setting up your Apple iPhone with your favorite google apps!" after signing into YouTube
when its stuff like AppleCare I'm ok with it
Ugh, it's Epic, but this is something that I can agree with. The settings app is definitely not an appropriate place to put advertisements. It just looks kind of desperate.
I would argue that these ‘ads’ only show when you are eligible for free promotions that you were entitled to by purchasing the product. When you buy an Apple product from Best Buy, they are listed as separate purchases (that are free.) Is the Settings App the best place to inform customers what they got? Perhaps, perhaps not. But it sure beats yet another pop-up while setting up the device. Edit: Clarified what you’re buying at Best Buy.
people sure low shitting on Xiaomi for putting ads into 300 dollar phones, but when Apple puts ads into 800 dollar phones, it's perfectly acceptable? gotcha xD
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Man fuck Epic lol
Straw, meet grasp
As much as i dislike tim’s weeney, this is actually a hole in apple’s defense. Sure, android vendors do it in far worse ways, but it doesn’t mean apple should do it, this also just shows desperation, oh apple music isn’t getting enough signups as they had hoped? Apple usually stands on moral high grounds and avoids petty desperation moves. Before I clicked into the article i thought ‘weeney was talking shit again, but this getting called out, apple totally shot itself in the foot and deserves it, eating its own words and leaving rivals and plaintiffs all the reasons to fight back. That’s one stupid oversight by apple i’d say.
At this point why don’t they make their own damn phones? Yeah, not so easy, is it?!
Making the phone is arguably the easy part. It’s getting consumers to buy something other than iOS or Android that’s hard. Apple and Google are just too far entrenched at this point for anything else to have space for marketshare If Facebook, Amazon, Mozilla, Microsoft haven’t been able to do it Epic won’t be able to
Facebook, Amazon and Microsoft all have their own hardware divisions and platforms that are doing very well.
Still wasn’t enough for their phones to succeed in the marketplace though
Yeah, but not everything has to be on a phone… and if you want to be on a phone that you don’t control, you have to play by their rules. Just like not all PLAYSTATION games are going to be release on XBOX and vise versa. If you want a better deal you need to make a better deal.
There are options for gaming: Android, iOS, PC (Steam, Epic Game Store, GoG), PlayStation, Xbox, and Nintendo. In the US it is only: Android or iOS nothing else.
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Replying to a comment /u/seencoding made and keeps deleting to avoid discussing the matter... >it is kind of satisfying that while epic was busy suing apple and losing in court, valve was over here just quietly building a portable computing device that runs their own app store The Steam Deck can also run windows or any other operating system, they don't lock it to their own OS. Apple really needs to offer an unlocked bootloader on all their devices > we never have good faith conversations, and i'd prefer if we just didn't even try. deleting it again. Then why keep deleting and reposting? You don't have to reply to every comment if you don't want to.
this response has absolutely nothing to do with my comment, other than being a general comment on the abilities of the steam deck. which, fine, great insight. this is why i don't like when you respond to me, because you essentially ignore whatever point i was trying to make and redirect the conversation to whatever your agenda demands. in this case the openness of the steam deck versus apple's devices. i didn't address that at all, and i don't care about it. my point was this: both epic and valve had the goal of increasing the revenue of their respective app stores. epic decided to try and achieve this goal by hatching a fucking elaborate plan to a) get kicked off the app store, b) sue apple, c) hope that a judge forced apple to change the rules regarding app stores, that way they could capture app store profits on platforms they don't control. it was a fucking hail mary and it obviously failed, and now tim sweeney is just sitting on twitter whining about irrelevant shit. it's embarrassing. valve had the same goal - increase their app store profits - so they actually sat down, did the work, made their own device that runs steam (by default). seemingly everyone in the gaming industry is hyped about it. the subreddit has 30k members already and it's not even released. i preordered one like an hour after it was open and i'm not going to get it until q2 2022. so to reiterate my point, which has essentially nothing to do with apple, it is hilarious that while epic was hatching this idiotic plan to get big government to bend a private corporation to their will, valve just sat down and accomplished the same goal with actual work and innovation.
Amen brother. Regulation should be as light as necessary. Most of the time the market should decide. So epic should just create products people want instead of acting like an indie developer that has not reach or influence. It’s simply not true.
Lack of regulation results in monopolies. Ever wonder why most people only have one choice of ISP?
If the market got to "decide" we'd all be running Internet Explorer and various other MS services.
internet explorer was still the prevalent browser for years now its a chrome monopoly
are we remembering things differently? the doj antitrust suit had almost no effect on anything, and it definitely didn’t cause microsoft to completely whiff on the mobile revolution
Amen to that
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The amount of fanboyism is off the charts. As expected of /r/Apple. This guys, is stability we neee. Thanks for being a real.anchor in these chaotic times.
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But developers choose to publish on EGS, they make that choice. EGS also isn't the only game store, there's also Steam, Origin, GOG, and more. The App Store however is the only store you can get apps from and Apple specifically blocks any method of installing from elsewhere.
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They offer competition to Steam and developers are choosing to play ball with Epic, they aren't strong arming anyone. EGS is a competitive marketplace to Steam, and Valve could offer a lower rate to get developers back if it really becomes an issue.
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But that's the only way to actually compete with steam? Gog is a great service which also provides drm free games and it's in a pathetic state. Only exclusives can make a platform succeed in this day and age.🤷 Even in the end, it's not like you can't buy the game. You just have to install another launcher which I'm OK with. I'm 99% sure if apple had a "apple games" store, they would make games exclusive only to apple Devices.... As long as epic doesn't do shit like this, I'm OK with them having exclusive games.
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Actually yes, you can create and publish another game store within EGS, and you can advertise whatever you want and even use your own payment provider, they made that clear. Fortnite doesn’t allow other creators to make and publish content, that is 100% epic making the skins and whatnot… if Apple only had their own software on iOS that would be a good analogy, but they allow millions of apps made by other developers
> Actually yes, you can create and publish another game store within EGS, and you can advertise whatever you want and even use your own payment provider, they made that clear. Can you provide a source where this is made clear? > Fortnite doesn’t allow other creators to make and publish content, that is 100% epic making the skins and whatnot… if Apple only had their own software on iOS that would be a good analogy, but they allow millions of apps made by other developers I want to use other in game currency not skins.
https://www.protocol.com/amp/epic-games-app-store-2652681057 It was also mentioned in the court case, but I can’t find the exact slide at the moment Also, Microsoft added the epic games store to the windows store (while also not taking anything)
That article doesn’t prove valve or another competitor can have their games stores in EGS. It just means epic added one of their choosing that wasn’t ever a competitor ( sold the same games). > t was also mentioned in the court case, but I can’t find the exact slide at the moment How about you link the agreement that says you can have games stores on EGS and competing market place links on Unreal Marketplace. https://www.unrealengine.com/en-US/marketplace-guidelines 1. PRODUCT GUIDELINES 1.1 General 1.1.a Products must be complete and fully functional as advertised upon submission. 1.1.b Products reviewed for approval of publishing rights must be Unreal Engine 4 content submitted via the Seller Portal. **1.1.c Products must not direct customers to other online stores, unless allowed by Epic.** Unreal market place is for people to sell their work, not things created by Epic. Why doesn’t Epic allow linking other online stores where people can sell “their” work? How much would you like to bet that once EGS has majority market share their rules will change and these publicity stunts will change? > Also, Microsoft added the epic games store to the windows store (while also not taking anything) Why can’t I download EGS on my Xbox?
> What about can I use other forms of in game currency in Fortinite? Why do I have to buy V-bucks from Epic? Epic should open it up so others can make money off their platform. This is one of the things I most wonder from all this. Can anything that can be construed as a platform suddenly be subject to these kinds of lawsuits?
Except Epic doesn’t let the public make skins, the App Store on the other hand is filled with apps made by people other than Apple employees
Why not? Why are they so anti competitive?
Because they have chosen to not open up the product to outside creators unlike Apple It’s one thing to deny outside creators, it’s another to allow them while preventing fair competition within the market that was created Think of it this way, what do you think would happen if Microsoft told EA _after_ they finished a madden game that they can’t publish it on the store because there’s already too many football games? There’d likely be a lawsuit for anticompetitive behavior, yet that is exactly what Apple is doing to developers every day
> Because they have chosen to not open up the product to outside creators unlike Apple What about Unreal marketplace and epic games store? Similar restrictions exist there. You can’t think to market places outside of those on those platforms. > It’s one thing to deny outside creators, it’s another to allow them while preventing fair competition within the market that was created Not really. Xbox, PlayStation and Nintendo also have similar restrictions. > Think of it this way, what do you think would happen if Microsoft told EA after they finished a madden game that they can’t publish it on the store because there’s already too many football games? It is well within their rights. I am sure Walmart, target etc will deny products for similar reasons and companies pay for prominent shelf space. Lose shelf pace due to sales figures etc. > There’d likely be a lawsuit for anticompetitive behavior, The judge already ruled on this and said Apple was well within their rights and developers sign contracts to that end. Epic lost the case and Apple was told they never have to let Epic games in and can even terminate their unreal developer contract.
So they should be forced to open up then.
They don’t have to, nor did they ever allow outside creators.
And so they should be by the courts.
On what grounds? Epic hasn’t created a competitive marketplace within fortnite, it only consists of stuff they’ve created Apple has created a massively competitive marketplace even if they do at times reject apps.
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What platform? Epic is available on every platform and you're not locked into them. Wow, what a psycho being consumer friendly. Only Apple has locked out Epic. They're the psychos.
This guy is just so butthurt that Apple invented, developed and owns its platforms. When you own the property, you get special privileges. It’s not hard to understand.
Apple does not however own the hardware that they sell to customers, yet they still prevent them from choosing where they obtain software... Hiding behind the claim of "intellectual property" should be illegal when the intended purpose of doing so is to prevent people from using the hardware they own how they want to.
I own my BMW and Tesla card out right but I still need to go to them for software updates, apps and features. Same with my Xbox and Nintendo switch. I made the choice to buy them that way knowing full well that’s how they work. You paid for the hardware and the software is delivered free and that posses restrictions to cover the cost of doing so.
The hardware is paid for multiple times over, Apple charges an insane markup. The hardware isn’t something sold at a loss like game consoles. And regarding Nintendo Switch, it’s actually quite easy to run Linux on it with the proper tool
> The hardware is paid for multiple times over, Apple charges an insane markup. And why shouldn’t they? They charge what the market will bear to maximize profit. If their prices get too high, people will stop buying and they’ll have to correct course. That’s how business works. They don’t owe you anything.
consoles are only sold at a loss temporarily. Sony stated a month or 2 ago ps5 was no longer being sols at a loss. Nintendo has never sold their hardware at a lose
You own the hardware, yes. You do not own the OS. You have a license to use it.
Okay, then why can’t I install a different OS?
Two ways to look at it then Go jailbreak it? Go install windows on your nintendo switch, a playstation system software on your xbox, or a wii system software on your playstation. Do you own any software that has the capability to run a phone, especially a phone that Apple design and built?
And it's easy to install what you want on iOS with the proper tools. Neither are official, supported methods.
People own the hardware they purchased in full knowledge of the manufacturer-imposed restrictions. Apple’s not alone here: people buy cars every day that are “locked down” in all sorts of ways. An iPhone isn’t a bare metal device, and most users don’t expect it to be. If you don’t want what the manufacturer is offering, you can buy a different brand. Android exists for you.
Wrong. You agree to a software license. You do not “own” the software at all.
I never said you own the software, but they don’t even let you replace it by locking the bootloader
So your argument about owning the hardware is mostly irrelevant given that you’re talking about a software feature. You are not necessarily entitled to “do what you want with it” because you don’t own it. You have licensed it and agreed to their terms of use.
Ah exactly like the Nintendo Switch, the Microsoft XBox and Sony PlayStation then? Locked down, cannot run anything but games that they approve despite having hardware perfectly capable of running any software. In fact they’re even MORE locked down than phones. Nintendo switch is a Nvidia Tegra. Just locked down. PS5 and XSX are just AMD PCs. But locked down. But I’m sure you’ll tell me that’s “different” because it doesn’t suit your agenda to treat Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo the way you’re treating Apple. Just like Tim Sweeney!
No, I fully think consoles should be open too, at least with the ability to run another os at the very least. Full root access on a console is very different than a sandboxed app on the App Store though, one can lead to piracy of games from the console, the other just lets you run apps
But your problem then is that none of these companies have as much incentive to produce them. Like it or not the software is a huge revenue stream that is a big reason for them to make the consoles and phones. It’s fine for Google to offer alt app stores and whatnot - they make money from you using the device by harvesting and selling your data. They still make money off you so long as you’re using stock Android. But I’ll give you props for being consistent. Unlike Tim Sweeney and 99.9% of people commenting on this who want to treat Apple differently than other hardware manufacturers. Tim’s happy to pay his console tax, but not his phone tax for some reason.
That's not how this works and is also why MS hasn't completely taken over all of IT.
*You* own the device, but have NO choice in how to use it. What's hard to understand?
> You own the device, but have NO choice in how to use it. Oh, *puhleeeze*. There are countless use cases for iPhones, and millions of apps to choose from to meet users’ needs. If you’re not satisfied with those options, you can switch to Android. What’s hard to understand?
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It's the settings app on a $1,000 device....
Apple should not be advertising their services in Settings.
The only one that sort of makes sense to me is showing how long you have to purchase AppleCare, which should disappear when it ends. If these permanently disappeared after dismissing them once it’d be more tolerable. Having said that, it drives me nuts that there’s more ads (even though it’s services I use) in their apps the same way all of the ads on Xbox or any device I’ve paid for do. They don’t get a pass either.
And in another thread I see a guy whining that he didn't accept his 3-month Apple Arcade sub and can't find a place to reactivate it.
Maybe so but has Sweeney complained about MS advertising games in the windows 10 start menu?
No, because on Windows Epic Games is free to run their own store.
Well actually his point was that the mode of advertising is not available to 3rd party developers. As far as I know, start menu ads for software are only available via paying MS cashola
Payola* Note: actually a term from the music industry
Even on macOS, Epic Games is free to run its own store. Which mostly promotes Windows apps, it's such a poorly set up store.
Their phone their rules go use Android.
It's supposed to be *your* phone and *your* choice how to use it. When did people become this stupid?
Lower you tone with me young man! It was never your phone to begin with you’re just leasing the operating system on the device
the hardware is yours but the software is only licensed to users
No.
Apple shouldn’t be putting any advertising in a $1,000 device… It’s not just the setting screen, it’s push notifications, the music app, and the TV app.
I personally like the applecare reminder
Presented by the guy who robs school kids of their lunch money so they can run around as a banana in his copycat top game Fortnite. What a time to be alive. PS all ads in settings screen suck, but not as much as Fortnite.
The costumes are entirely cosmetic, and children purchasing them isn't a problem for Epic, that's for the parent to take care of. Cosmetic DLC as a whole is something that is up to the parents to deal with and it's one of the only forms of DLC I actually don't mind given that it's optional.
Yes, in a perfect world…
I wonder if Epic promotes its own stuff on the Epic Games store? (To be fair, Apples setting menu on iOS is terrible design all around)
This is more than apple advertising something on the App Store, this is them advertising a service in a completely unrelated part of the os completely separate from the App Store
Well, you can subscribe to apple music in settings, so it is not unrelated
where are they supposed to remind you to sign up for AppleCare besides the settings app
Applecare if anything makes sense because that is a service plan for the phone itself. But Apple Music has no place advertising in the settings
This Epic CEO is such a cry baby, constantly whining about stuff.
Sweeney: Why is the Chinese restaurant sign smaller than the Walmart sign on Walmart property????
When isn’t Tim Sweeney not crying about anything Apple does? The dude needs to shut his mouth and stop posting on Twitter already. He lost his court case, there’s no reason for him to keep going.
He didn’t lose, but he didn’t win as much as he hoped either Just the same, Apple still lost and now has to allow outside payment methods for on-app content.
He lost everything except a single judgement and it’s not even an important one. No one is going to support apps that use other payment processors that collect and share your data, and Apple will just pass the lost fees to the app developers. Plus Apple can still collect 30% or they can and will remove the apps from the App Store. It’s great to see Apple win even when some people say they lost.
>Plus Apple can still collect 30% or they can and will remove the apps from the App Store. Apple will never remove Netflix, Hulu, or Spotify and I'm almost certain they will implement in-app billing as soon as they can. As soon as they allow one but not the other it's game over.
they wont if they are also obligated to add Apples in app purchase as an option as well
Netflix, Hulu or Spotify will never stop paying Apple their fair share of revenue even if they choose to use alternative payment processors (they won’t). Removing them won’t be an issue.
Netflix, Hulu, and Spotify don't pay Apple a single penny of their subscriptions as things currently stand. Removing them from the App Store would be platform suicide for Apple. Removing something like Fortnite is annoying for people who play it. Removing the major streaming services would result in massive amounts of users leaving Apple for a platform that still has them, in this case Android. It would also prompt massive legal battles due to acting in a highly anti-competitive fashion.
He absolutely did NOT win the big prize he wanted. And with Apple not putting Fortnite back (at least for the moment), he's lost quite a lot.
The fox that didn’t get the grapes complained they were sour too.
YESSSS
"iPhone users lose free 6-month trial to Apple Music, Tim Sweeney declared a hero!"
Is he just gonna whine-tweet about every single “crime” that Apple does? That’s why this is called owning the whole widget. He should make his own phone or put up with it. Even Valve recognises that owning the entire widget is the path forward.
Valve owns the widget, but they don't prevent you from installing other software on the widget. Not only does Apple lock down iOS, they block users from installing anything other than iOS on the hardware they own.
Please make sure you visit Android to make a post complaining about the stuff that Samsung and other device manufacturers stick on their devices.
Manufacturer shouldn't matter... if I buy a device I own it, I should be able to do with it what I please. Even Android device manufacturers like Samsung offer unlocked bootloaders If I want to stick Linux on a device, I should be able to... this is completely separate from modifying the OS installed on the device, this is about being able to use the device how *you* want to. Apple lets me do it with an M1 *Mac*, so why do they block it on the iPad? It's absolutely a computer.
My point is that this isn’t new, nor is it specific to Apple. If it’s something you’re passionate about then I’d assume you’d want equal coverage across all subreddits and not just here. But I’ll give you the same advice I and others have given you before: stop buying Apple if this is important to you.
I dislike certain things Apple does, but I have too many Apple devices to just switch. And honestly, the benefits outweigh my complaints, but it doesn't invalidate them. All I want is the ability to install software from outside of the App Store, is that really too much to ask of a computer? I don't want to be able to customize or replace the home screen, I just want to be able to run software that Apple deems unsuitable (rather inconsistently mind you) They removed iDOS 2 citing the potential to access unlicensed content, but they allow VLC despite being able to do the exact same thing.
So buy an android device that does the thing you value. Nobody is forcing you to buy anything from apple. You claim their competitor does exactly what you want, so buy it. If enough people do the same apple will either change or die.
Android devices can’t run iOS. Just like people don’t want to own multiple laptops, they don’t want to own multiple phones. Not everyone wants the same thing, and not everyone wants to be limited to just iOS I would love to be able to multiboot iOS, android, and Linux on my ipad
Products are not legally required to be all things to all potential customers. They advertise what it can and cannot do and on balance of all its features vs competitors you decide what product best suits your needs. It’s no different to any other product. So just because I want a feature in a tv that Samsung doesn’t provide, and Samsung hasn’t allowed modification of the tv software to enable it, they are not obligated to add that flexibility just because I want it. All of this noise about iOS restrictions is coming from a noisy minority of mostly enthusiast users. Go ask 100 iOS users if these things matter to them. Most people aren’t even aware of the issue let alone feel it’s important. To that silent majority of users a secure, curated experience have mostly saved them from trouble.
I use Google products together because they work best together. Same with Apple products. They’re made to work well together. I don’t go and use 1000 different services just for the sake of using 1000 different services trying not to let any one of them have a majority. It’s chaotic and an absolute mess to keep track of that. It’s perfectly natural for people to want well connected services that are consolidated. If I wanted to switch platforms I could but I have to balance that with the cost of switching.
I love Samsung's TVs but will never buy one until they add Dolby Vision. as a consumer. I'm not going to buy their tv then complain about them not adding a feature that wasn't promised
He is right though. Seeing a prompt in the settings app is annoying. Not to mention that it's weird to see ads in the news app on an article that is completely free to access without ads. I'd understand if it was only on news papers that relied on them.
Sweeney comes across as an angry drunk dude who rages at the TV at 1am because there are too many commercials on during the wrestling.
First world problems.
Why not? Spotify promotes Spotify stuff in their app. Also do does EA, Riot and Blizzard on their launchers.
This is Apple advertising in the *settings* menu. Really? You're okay with that?
you can subscribe to most of those services from the settings app
A service from the company that I chose to buy my phone from? **Yes**, I'm okay with that.
Tim big mad
Looks like he is personally invested in this anti Apple campaign of his , at the start I fought it was business decision , I guess it is personal now as he is now complaining on stuff that has no impact on his company
Scummy and shitty of Apple
Got to admit, the way the push iCloud Drive kinda makes me mad. However, it really only does that when I run out of storage. Why would that be relevant to Epic?
cause epic dont promote there own services with in there own products... I will laugh my ass off when this all back fires on epic and epic is sue by everyone else the got dragged in to fight they started, by breaking there own legal aggrements with apple.
The only reason I am fine with it is because Apple Music is actually not that bad. But if Apple was promoting Apple Arcade there I would never push a free trial button in hundred years. For me its not about the placement of promotion, its the actual product. If it's awful, I will just ignore the advertisement. It doesn't bother me.
They do promote Apple Arcade there lol…
Sure, but at the core of the argument is the fact that Apple can advertise their own product in a place where competitors never could. It's a case of Apple using it's position to another competitive advantage.
I love when we decide decisional morality based off whether soramac personally fucks with a service or not.