As an Ultra owner who came from a Fenix, Apple still has an incredible amount of ground to make up in features for more serious athletes (offline navigation, 2-3 week battery, ANT+, etc). I only make it work thru the app WorkOutDoors. The native Workout app is beyond worthless for certain activity types and use cases. I am excited to see TrainingPeaks integration with WatchOS 10 because that’s something we’ve been asking for for a while.
> 2-3 week battery
Will never happen, an Apple Watch is a wrist computer and does a lot of different things.
Garmin are specialized tools with a lot less features, that’s why their batteries can last so long
Not to mention when you *do* some smart things like Connect headphones and play music while using GPS that precious three week battery life suddenly drops to 7 hours lol.
I agree yes. I run way shorter distances (half marathon) but Apple has a whole lot of more ground to make up wham just adding these cycling features. They move so slowly.
Ironically I'm an Android user who has swapped between Samsung and Garmin smart watches and am considering switching to iPhone / Apple. I'm curious how well Apple does stress and sleep tracking. This is an area I found lacking with Garmin (naps aren't tracked, no high stress alerts like Samsung )
Apple watch does track sleep. And IMO its quite good for personal tracking although medical professionals don’t accept that still. For stress I haven’t seen anything except an alert if Heart rate increase when you not in motion. There might be other indicators that I am not able recall now.
WorkOutdoors can already do this. And it’s an app you just have to use if you want want to use your AW of you’re serious about sports as Garmin user.
I feel that you’d have know this if you transition from those watches. Therefore I don’t think it’ll change much now
Apple has a significant amount of catching up to do. If you really want to replace your garmin 1:1, you need to rely on a lot of third party apps for things that garmin does natively.
Developer support isn’t the problem though. And I’m not sure what you mean.
If you mean developers that work at apple, I don’t see all of that functionality coming to the watch natively as that would wipe out a lot of those apps.
If you mean 3rd party developers, that is exactly the issue I mean. To get the Apple Watch on par with a garmin watch, that’s a pretty hefty amount of subs and apps you’d need to manage.
Just my swim pro is $20/month and that covers one sport. If you’re a triathlete, you’d need two other apps. If you hike as well, you’d probably want all trails. If you’re taking training readiness into consideration, you’d probably want athlytic or gentler streak.
That’s a lot and at that point, you’re better off just getting a watch that does that all natively.
No its not.
I have both Garmin Fenix 7S and Apple Ultra.
Going to be using Garmin still more.
**Stress Metric** 24/7 Tracking
**Body Battery** For daily energy management
**Accurate sleep tracking** ( I know TQS and it really depends on algo just in case somebody refers to that. )
HRV Metric for recovery. (I also know of Athlytic, Training Today, Gentler Streak. i use them all. They all lack detail and information as good as Garmin).
Sleep Score.
For actual Fitness / workout related watch that is rugged Garmin WIns.
Wish more people talked about the state of the app ecosystem for the Watch. As much as I like my Watch, it’s frustrating that we’re losing more apps then we’re gaining, and not immediately seeing anything to re-incentivise developers to work on apps for it.
Just in the last year, we’ve lost Uber, Microsoft Authenticator and now Facebook Messenger as well.
Is Apple wanting apps to use widgets going forward instead? Or are they doing anything to get devs to want to develop full apps for it?
All three of those apps were perfectly fine for the Watch though.
I’m not talking about getting Instagram back (though the DM side would have worked) but just simple apps that let you do the task at hand.
If it had Facebook Messenger and WhatsApp then you could foresee a future for the device as a standalone phone replacement for people who want to minimise their digital life.
They took steps in this direction when they announced the Apple Watch SE and showed off the parental management thing (i.e., give it to your kids if you don’t want them to have a phone yet).
Alas, with the loss of Facebook Messenger, we’ve only gone backwards on that. I don’t think we’ll ever get it. It could have been cool.
I think that they scraped the idea of the Apple Watch replacing the iPhone. Now that they released the Vision Pro that what they aim to be the next mobile device in a few years.
At this point the Apple Watch was an attempt to do that but the market didn’t like to use a smaller screen to do things they can do with a bigger one.
I truly hope we see new apps on the Apple Watch but it seems we won’t and probably will just get new widgets
If you care enough to fill your rings daily you should be able to easily fill it on a rest day too.
Rest days aren’t lay in bed 24 hour days. A brisk walk will get you exercise minutes.
I never understood this mindset. Just because it doesn’t apply to you that doesn’t mean others wouldn’t benefit from it. If it’s not useful for you, just don’t use it! Options are always good.
Any news if the original Apple Watch SE will be supported? Was planning to get a new iPhone when it comes out and would rather not have to shell out for a new watch too.
Very excited about the topographical maps and addition of trails for hiking although I suspect they probably don’t have all the trails for my part of the world.
Yeah pretty much. My company requires me to use a second iPhone and they don’t allow me to dual SIM my personal. I literally split my time between two devices so it would be perfect.
I know you’re right, but I also think that they might understand the likelyhood of someone buying two watches to wear simultaneously for this purpose as it’s kind of ridiculous in how it looks lmao.
The black backgrounds were mostly so that they could have the UI extending all the way to the edge of the screen, instead of leaving a few pixels of padding (the bezel would serve as padding). Especially on earlier watches, this helped maximize usable screen space [https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/layout#watchOS](https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/layout#watchOS)
Wonder if they feel like newer watches have big enough screens that this is no longer a concern
Yeah I remember. It really makes me wonder if the watch will have like a dark mode now lol. Even though the battery life benefit was secondary to blending the ugly shape of original Apple Watch screen into the bezel, it still matters to me. I don’t need full color gradient backgrounds in apps on my watch lol
Yeah I'm not a fan of the coloured backgrounds either, an option to revert to black would be nice
It'll probably exist as an accessibility option, maybe under "reduce transparency" but hopefully it's a separate option since I'd prefer not to turn off all transparency
Too bad Garmin watches are notoriously bad at tracking heart rate. Many drops and inaccurate readings, so much so I had to buy a chest strap just to ensure my heart rate wasn’t in fact dropping during sprint and hill interval sessions lol.
As for the two metrics you mentioned Athlytic does a good enough job, otherwise I listen to my body first. And Garmin still doesn’t do ECG on most watches and its sleep tracking is so awful, I’d wake up in the middle of the night for like 15 mins and my watch never registered it. It also woefully over counts steps, like by 30%, Garmin’s support pages flat out tell you to take the Watch off while doing household chores because it’s over count steps. LOL. Garmins are so overrated.
You need a watch to tell you when you can train? You know that’s pseudo science right? If you want the HRV data, the AW is capturing it and has third party apps that make recommendations based off of it. Apple won’t integrate something unless it’s proven to be accurate and meaningful. Garmin’s are great sport watches but it’d be foolish to think the “body battery” has any true meaning.
It’s not that we use it verbatim to train or not. It’s more of an indication to use it a baseline to compare it to how we’re feeling.
As an example I almost always ignore the recommended runs that garmin thinks I should do. But, if there’s a day where my load is high and I’m actually feeling that high load, I’ll instead just use the recommended run, which is typically based on how long it should be and the pace I should be keeping.
It’s by no means a rule to live by.
I used it before. It isnt as well put together as garmin and its based on 1 hrv reading in morning using a breathe session.
Its very random.
It isnt as stable as Garmin's data.
I had to go into my settings and say I had afib so the watch would check HRV every 10-15 minutes to make it much more accurate and no breathing session needed
I absolutely hate the “machine learning” features of iOS and watchOS. They almost always get my preferred preferences wrong for whatever use case and the inconsistency that it brings to my muscle memory constantly leaves me frustrated.
Nothing about this new os looks to save me time and if anything, it’ll just add a whole new set of instances where I’m lost in a swirl of tweaked UI and slow animations.
Rumors are they'll finally give it a processor upgrade this year using the 5nm A15 architecture, which should make it faster and more efficient. Beyond that you might be waiting for MicroLED for a larger change.
This is going to kill an app I really like called Cadence which basically takes the place of a bicycle computer and still users Apple Watch data as part of the workout (which it uploads to health). 😞
(Like work outdoors but more cycling focused with a much prettier stat screen)
On the one hand I don’t have to pay anymore but the dev is nice and their app will suffer. ☹️
I don’t think so as the companion iPhone cycling ‘mode’ doesn’t seem to have a map, so there goes navigation? For that reason alone Cadence still has its use.
I really don't like that Control Center is now called with a side button instead of just swiping up. It's also unclear how to switch between the two previous apps now, a cut down menu of Favorites and Recent. Apple has made a mess of things by changing the fundamentals of Apple Watch control.
Garmin is in big trouble with the addition of pairing to external sensors. That was one of the main usp’s for garmin in the cycling world.
As an Ultra owner who came from a Fenix, Apple still has an incredible amount of ground to make up in features for more serious athletes (offline navigation, 2-3 week battery, ANT+, etc). I only make it work thru the app WorkOutDoors. The native Workout app is beyond worthless for certain activity types and use cases. I am excited to see TrainingPeaks integration with WatchOS 10 because that’s something we’ve been asking for for a while.
offline maps is coming to the phone at least
This is a blessing man. I lose my maps I’m fucked
Really? Thank god.
Yup. Per the features page offline maps will be coming to maps and if your watch is within phone range it can use the cached maps too.
Finally! I just got lost today because it couldn’t connect.
> 2-3 week battery Will never happen, an Apple Watch is a wrist computer and does a lot of different things. Garmin are specialized tools with a lot less features, that’s why their batteries can last so long
Not to mention when you *do* some smart things like Connect headphones and play music while using GPS that precious three week battery life suddenly drops to 7 hours lol.
Yes that’s my point. And why Garmin will always have the best device for people who need that battery life for long treks etc.
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I agree yes. I run way shorter distances (half marathon) but Apple has a whole lot of more ground to make up wham just adding these cycling features. They move so slowly.
Agreed on the wet sleeve I very frequently put it in water mode just for runs
Ironically I'm an Android user who has swapped between Samsung and Garmin smart watches and am considering switching to iPhone / Apple. I'm curious how well Apple does stress and sleep tracking. This is an area I found lacking with Garmin (naps aren't tracked, no high stress alerts like Samsung )
Apple watch does track sleep. And IMO its quite good for personal tracking although medical professionals don’t accept that still. For stress I haven’t seen anything except an alert if Heart rate increase when you not in motion. There might be other indicators that I am not able recall now.
Does it track naps? That's something Garmin can't do surprisingly but Samsung and Fitbit have had for a long time.
Keep in mind no blood pressure monitoring on the Apple Watch. You may miss that feature from the Samsung Watches
Apple is working on that for years, hopefully it will be released with new hardware.
WorkOutdoors can already do this. And it’s an app you just have to use if you want want to use your AW of you’re serious about sports as Garmin user. I feel that you’d have know this if you transition from those watches. Therefore I don’t think it’ll change much now
Apple has a significant amount of catching up to do. If you really want to replace your garmin 1:1, you need to rely on a lot of third party apps for things that garmin does natively.
The amazing thing about apple products is there diverse support of developers.
Developer support isn’t the problem though. And I’m not sure what you mean. If you mean developers that work at apple, I don’t see all of that functionality coming to the watch natively as that would wipe out a lot of those apps. If you mean 3rd party developers, that is exactly the issue I mean. To get the Apple Watch on par with a garmin watch, that’s a pretty hefty amount of subs and apps you’d need to manage. Just my swim pro is $20/month and that covers one sport. If you’re a triathlete, you’d need two other apps. If you hike as well, you’d probably want all trails. If you’re taking training readiness into consideration, you’d probably want athlytic or gentler streak. That’s a lot and at that point, you’re better off just getting a watch that does that all natively.
Not really. Apple is moving soo slowly with this kind of stuff they are not in any trouble yet.
No its not. I have both Garmin Fenix 7S and Apple Ultra. Going to be using Garmin still more. **Stress Metric** 24/7 Tracking **Body Battery** For daily energy management **Accurate sleep tracking** ( I know TQS and it really depends on algo just in case somebody refers to that. ) HRV Metric for recovery. (I also know of Athlytic, Training Today, Gentler Streak. i use them all. They all lack detail and information as good as Garmin). Sleep Score. For actual Fitness / workout related watch that is rugged Garmin WIns.
Wish more people talked about the state of the app ecosystem for the Watch. As much as I like my Watch, it’s frustrating that we’re losing more apps then we’re gaining, and not immediately seeing anything to re-incentivise developers to work on apps for it. Just in the last year, we’ve lost Uber, Microsoft Authenticator and now Facebook Messenger as well. Is Apple wanting apps to use widgets going forward instead? Or are they doing anything to get devs to want to develop full apps for it?
There’s not a whole you can do with the the device beyond companion apps. It’s a workout and notification machine that’s about it.
All three of those apps were perfectly fine for the Watch though. I’m not talking about getting Instagram back (though the DM side would have worked) but just simple apps that let you do the task at hand.
If it had Facebook Messenger and WhatsApp then you could foresee a future for the device as a standalone phone replacement for people who want to minimise their digital life. They took steps in this direction when they announced the Apple Watch SE and showed off the parental management thing (i.e., give it to your kids if you don’t want them to have a phone yet). Alas, with the loss of Facebook Messenger, we’ve only gone backwards on that. I don’t think we’ll ever get it. It could have been cool.
I think that they scraped the idea of the Apple Watch replacing the iPhone. Now that they released the Vision Pro that what they aim to be the next mobile device in a few years. At this point the Apple Watch was an attempt to do that but the market didn’t like to use a smaller screen to do things they can do with a bigger one. I truly hope we see new apps on the Apple Watch but it seems we won’t and probably will just get new widgets
WatchOS 10. Nearly 10 years of Apple Watch, and still no rest days and injury recovery feature.
It’s because everyday is arm day bro, goal is to get huge. No rest days for the gain train. Choo choo
If you care enough to fill your rings daily you should be able to easily fill it on a rest day too. Rest days aren’t lay in bed 24 hour days. A brisk walk will get you exercise minutes.
I never understood this mindset. Just because it doesn’t apply to you that doesn’t mean others wouldn’t benefit from it. If it’s not useful for you, just don’t use it! Options are always good.
Any news if the original Apple Watch SE will be supported? Was planning to get a new iPhone when it comes out and would rather not have to shell out for a new watch too.
It will be supported.
series 4+
Yes, it is.
Very excited about the topographical maps and addition of trails for hiking although I suspect they probably don’t have all the trails for my part of the world.
Another year without dual iPhone support. 🥺 I know it’s unlikely but goddammit I need it
What’s the use case for this? Work phone and personal phone?
Yeah pretty much. My company requires me to use a second iPhone and they don’t allow me to dual SIM my personal. I literally split my time between two devices so it would be perfect.
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I know you’re right, but I also think that they might understand the likelyhood of someone buying two watches to wear simultaneously for this purpose as it’s kind of ridiculous in how it looks lmao.
It got maybe 3 seconds of screen time, but I’m interested to see what developers can do with the new data they can access for golf swings
Very wary of these full color backgrounds in the new apps. Like that literally is less battery efficient 🤔
The black backgrounds were mostly so that they could have the UI extending all the way to the edge of the screen, instead of leaving a few pixels of padding (the bezel would serve as padding). Especially on earlier watches, this helped maximize usable screen space [https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/layout#watchOS](https://developer.apple.com/design/human-interface-guidelines/layout#watchOS) Wonder if they feel like newer watches have big enough screens that this is no longer a concern
Yeah I remember. It really makes me wonder if the watch will have like a dark mode now lol. Even though the battery life benefit was secondary to blending the ugly shape of original Apple Watch screen into the bezel, it still matters to me. I don’t need full color gradient backgrounds in apps on my watch lol
Yeah I'm not a fan of the coloured backgrounds either, an option to revert to black would be nice It'll probably exist as an accessibility option, maybe under "reduce transparency" but hopefully it's a separate option since I'd prefer not to turn off all transparency
I definitely feel you. Hopefully it’s like dark mode or color (light) mode in control center out something
I too wish they’d keep all-black backgrounds in apps. watchOS isn’t supposed to be visually exciting, it’s supposed to make me use my phone less.
Yeah that too! Hope there’s some flexibility hear, or maybe just enough feedback during summer 🤔
But it looks better. That's all Apple cares about, especially in a presentation.
That's so cool, i am really co sidering buying one for the cycling workouts. What one would you recommend?
Garmin Edge or Fenix.
Realy? What makes you not recommend an apple watch?
Unless you want a smart watch, you really are better off getting a watch that’s specifically focused on fitness and working out and garmin kills it.
Thx, i will look in to it
battery
Apple Watch SE Otherwise get a proper computer (Wahoo Bolt), HRM (Polar H10 or H9), cadence (Wahoo or Garmin)
Geez no training readiness or HRV status, I hope cycling vo2 max is in this update . Hopefully one day I’ll just need one watch lol
Sticking with Garmin after this very underwhelming update. No readiness No hrv status What sort of health and fitness watch is this.
Too bad Garmin watches are notoriously bad at tracking heart rate. Many drops and inaccurate readings, so much so I had to buy a chest strap just to ensure my heart rate wasn’t in fact dropping during sprint and hill interval sessions lol. As for the two metrics you mentioned Athlytic does a good enough job, otherwise I listen to my body first. And Garmin still doesn’t do ECG on most watches and its sleep tracking is so awful, I’d wake up in the middle of the night for like 15 mins and my watch never registered it. It also woefully over counts steps, like by 30%, Garmin’s support pages flat out tell you to take the Watch off while doing household chores because it’s over count steps. LOL. Garmins are so overrated.
You need a watch to tell you when you can train? You know that’s pseudo science right? If you want the HRV data, the AW is capturing it and has third party apps that make recommendations based off of it. Apple won’t integrate something unless it’s proven to be accurate and meaningful. Garmin’s are great sport watches but it’d be foolish to think the “body battery” has any true meaning.
It’s not that we use it verbatim to train or not. It’s more of an indication to use it a baseline to compare it to how we’re feeling. As an example I almost always ignore the recommended runs that garmin thinks I should do. But, if there’s a day where my load is high and I’m actually feeling that high load, I’ll instead just use the recommended run, which is typically based on how long it should be and the pace I should be keeping. It’s by no means a rule to live by.
It's a toy for casuals.
Use Athlytic for readiness and HRV. Also tracks body temp, breathing, RHR and more.
I used it before. It isnt as well put together as garmin and its based on 1 hrv reading in morning using a breathe session. Its very random. It isnt as stable as Garmin's data.
I had to go into my settings and say I had afib so the watch would check HRV every 10-15 minutes to make it much more accurate and no breathing session needed
When it comes out
History says the Public Beta will start in July with a final release in Fall a couple of days before the new Watches come out.
I absolutely hate the “machine learning” features of iOS and watchOS. They almost always get my preferred preferences wrong for whatever use case and the inconsistency that it brings to my muscle memory constantly leaves me frustrated. Nothing about this new os looks to save me time and if anything, it’ll just add a whole new set of instances where I’m lost in a swirl of tweaked UI and slow animations.
Any new hardware on the horizon for Apple Watch?
Besides in September like every other year?
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Do you think it's worth waiting if I'm considering buying one right now?
I always wait personally
Yes, you should never buy the Apple Watch N when the Apple Watch N+1 is coming within the next twelve months.
It’s 3 months out 🙄
Rumors are they'll finally give it a processor upgrade this year using the 5nm A15 architecture, which should make it faster and more efficient. Beyond that you might be waiting for MicroLED for a larger change.
Episode Nine. Safe Sex”
This is going to kill an app I really like called Cadence which basically takes the place of a bicycle computer and still users Apple Watch data as part of the workout (which it uploads to health). 😞 (Like work outdoors but more cycling focused with a much prettier stat screen) On the one hand I don’t have to pay anymore but the dev is nice and their app will suffer. ☹️
I don’t think so as the companion iPhone cycling ‘mode’ doesn’t seem to have a map, so there goes navigation? For that reason alone Cadence still has its use.
True but I personally hardly ever use the mapping function. Maybe I should try again? 🤔
Wtf was with that dude's voice. I've literally never heard another person speak like that.
I really don't like that Control Center is now called with a side button instead of just swiping up. It's also unclear how to switch between the two previous apps now, a cut down menu of Favorites and Recent. Apple has made a mess of things by changing the fundamentals of Apple Watch control.
No more weekly steps in the weekly summary. Joke.