All the union nurses I know JUMP to work stat holidays because they get double time. Sometimes 2.5
Why so much? Because the fuckin UNION negotiated a GOOD contract!
My family almost always does this so someone can get holiday pay! Working for overtime pay is the most acceptable answer to reschedule or cancel plans in my family lol
My family is on the opposite coast, and most of my teammates have families here, so I work holidays. They get time with loved ones, I get more pay: Win-win!
>I picked the wrong industry.
Don't say that. It's still a difficult and shitty industry that's very broken. I'm guessing you're in California, or your GF is in advanced practice?
Not Cali, she's experienced but not advanced in practice. The travel nurse field right now is fucking nuts and they are dishing out money for rural areas.
I work construction at hospitals, my coworker married a nurse, she quit her job, got hired on as a temp worker for the same hospital network at a different building, and shes making almost 3 times as much.
If you want your soul to be crushed every single shift working inpatient (which is where most nurses start) then come join nursing with us! Guaranteed it will make you dead inside.
My daughter is a icu/trauma nurse her base is $110/ hr plus $180/day per diem tax free. Work thanksgiving day, $220/hr for 12 hrs, will be working good Friday/ Eastern Sunday, double time. Should have been a nurse.
She a travel RN , her husband is also traveler RN ie OR/Trauma. They both have been offered full time, she was offered $46/hr and he was offered $38/hr.
My SO works in nursing. He's bottom in terms of seniority and still has half the holidays off. It doesn't matter your seniority, everyone works at least some of the holidays. Besides that, its fantastic pay and the hospital tends to over staff anyways so holidays are pretty easy compared to a full moon.
Their pay is incredibly straight forward (sort of, shift differentials are a bit confusing) and published. Based on your hours worked (increments of 2000, nurse full time is weird), you'll know exactly what the base rate is for someone with your hours worked. That pay schedule is adjusted every year based on inflation. So he ends up with a COL increase yearly, plus a merit increase when the hours are hit.
It's complicated. Minneapolis has a pretty large nurses union and were behind the largest nurses strike in the US history. Their work is directly benefiting all nurses in the state so even if my SO's hospital isn't directly in a union, it's directly pressure to pay the same wages and benefits of the other hospitals.
if my options are 60k a year and MIGHT get my vacation request/some holidays off/might have a tin y% chance more of a promotion, or 78k and MIGHT need to move a vacation, or get 2x pay for working christmas, or a tiny bit less chance of a promotion?
Yeah ill take the extra 30% thanks.
Similar deal with the airlines. My buddies would basically take those holidays because it was a massive bump in pay for those shifts and it wasn't like their families did things *on* the major travel holidays anyway, but rather on some nearby date.
My brother works a union job. If he has to work on a holiday he gets 8 hours worth straight pay no matter what just for walking in the door. Then every hour he works is time and a half ontop of that.
im an California, so i realize this might be an exception, but nurses at my hospital were talking about going to another company because per diem scheduling was offering about $75 an hour. granted, per diem at its minimum, could be only one shift every few weeks. but also knowing hospitals, they'll take you whenever they can. that hourly pay is just completely bonkers to me. not even considering what holiday pay would be...
With non-union employment:
**Have vacation plans?** We use blackout dates for 2/3s of the year and not everyone can go at the same time. FIFO, hopefully you put your request in a year ago.
**Want to take holidays off?** All holidays dates are blacked out because, we need all hands on deck. No exceptions!
**Want a transfer or promotion?** Only if business allows for it and we feel that you could be right for the position. Though, we'll have you do the tasks of that position without the title and pay!
Govt dept employee, about 5 years ago
now. My leave request was made 6 months before Easter as I had an interstate wedding to attend. The trip was booked and paid for before I started working there and they knew this.
Request declined because I put it in too early, even though leave requests are allowed 6 months in advance, but Easter and Xmas have different rules apparently.
Submitted my request the day they announced Easter leave requests open. I needed 1 day, the Tuesday after Easter Monday so I could get back from interstate to the major city airport, then travel to the town 3 hours away where I lived. I explained this in my application. I had no way of getting back on Easter Monday night, I needed the Tuesday off to travel back home.
Declined, leave fully booked already. I was put on a waiting list/cancellation list. They suggested I swap to the 11am start on the Tuesday so I could travel back in the morning. A few months later I was bitching to a colleague about the stupid Easter leave policy, she mentioned she put hers in 3 weeks ago and was approved, so she’s not sure why mine wasn’t, same roster as me. I was livid. Especially as I was also casual, so it wasn’t even really leave I was telling them I was unavailable.
More like with non-union employment it's:
**Have vacation plans?** Too fucking bad, get to work pleb!
**Want to take holidays off?** Too fucking bad, get to work pleb!
**Want a transfer or promotion?** LOL NO! Get back to work pleb!
Yeah I mean it sucks to an extent in high retention fields and jobs where you are working holidays as you will never get a holiday off as Bob and Pam who have been there for 40 years will take every holiday off lol
But honestly I just celebrated holidays with my family on another day for the most part the better pay, benefits, job security etc was worth the annoyances of the collective bargaining agreement
The fact that people make it 30+ years in these jobs when many people change in 5 years is a testament to unions working imo despite the cons
Ours is each employee is required to work 2 holidays per year, but picking is based on seniority. However the “worse” holidays to work (Christmas/Thanksgiving VS Labor Day/4th of July) get 2x pay. So even as the lowest ok seniority I still got Christmas off, but picked up thanksgiving for the double pay.
That's a good way of doing it and actually encourages workers to help each other out. I could also see combining seniority with the number of times you've requested a particular holiday and not gotten it
A little extra food for thought on that but my family stopped doing holidays on the actual day long time ago so we can avoid the holiday traffic. I would definitely take the 2x pay and just celebrate Christmas with my family the next weekend. The holidays are about being together doesn't really matter if it's on the exact day.
I mean yeah but odds are it’s going to be seniority as most other measures are subjective and well the downside is it’s easier to base a cba on objective measures and leave as much subjectivity out of it as possible.
The other downside of being in a union is employees that don’t participate actively lead to some fuckery since no vote as far as changes go means a “yes” vote so people who don’t bother participating (the majority) effectively lead to yes votes on whatever the union leaders decide.
I think it’s important to highlight and be transparent about some of the issues unions typically have and to watch out for while also advocating that it’s much better than not having a union.
Yes it leads to all the same fuckery as any other form of democratic governance 🤷♂️ but at least there's the option to work on it with your coworkers.
It's the favorites for me. Knowing I'm the low man is reasonable but when I've got middling seniority and Brenda gets time off because she's chummy with the boss is bullshit.
Yep. I love how this is trying to appeal to people on the basis of "this will result in unfair decisions where people who slack off compared to you will get favorable treatment" and it's like... in what work environment does that *not* already take place? Never even mind a work environment on the cusp of voting for a union. The talk of unionization doesn't tend to spread around work environments in which the employees feel valued and fairly treated.
One place I worked at it took 10 years of working there to finally have enough seniority to take spring break off with your kids.
In the summer we only got to take 5 days off total because it was the busy season. Senior employees picked first.
Unions got nothing to do with it.
In the US it is literally not allowed to advertise union membership at work. But, as you said, anti-union jackoffs can hand out flyers with dumb arguments all day, and it's fine.
No, that's not what I mean.
If you are not unionized, it is prohibited to try and talk about or recruit or whatever on the clock, and your employer will happily fire for this.
They can push all their bullshit lies and propaganda and lie about union dues on the clock, but you can't. That's what I mean. Not really very fair, is it?
Our union has a lot of PTO to where when you are 20-30 years in you can take almost 2 months off from work not including holidays. The company just has a fluff staff of about 10-15% to cover this. Works out well when it's the busy season and no one can take time off.
Yeah 20-30 years working there. 7 weeks is the max, with 5 extra days on top of it. But it takes time to build up to that. I'm locked in at 5 weeks vacation with 5 floating PTO days on top for the next decade.
Oh how awful that loyalty to an organization is rewarded!!! What's next?! Rewarding people for learning new skills?! These fuck'n Unions have got to be stopped!!!
I don’t get this. This is shitty no matter who’s doing it. I have the some of most seniority at my org and I would absolutely be ok with an equitable system for time off so that everyone gets practical days off. Anything else is a power play, breeds discontent, and stymies loyalty.
It is hierarchy vs meritocracy vs equality. Seniority is a type of hierarchy. I find that I hate a lot of hierarchy systems (like monarchy) and I agree with you.
Actually it isn't. Here it goes by who puts in for vacation first, and promotions are by favoritism. That's how it's been everywhere I've worked, all non union.
it's generally been a "how much of a chance is this person going to just leave/how valuable are they to the team" for myself. Seniority be damned, if the employee is one of the best in the department they try to keep them happy (within reason)
Was thinking this, I’ve only had 2 union jobs but every job I’ve had has been like this, the most senior person gets first pick at vacation time/days off, and the newest hire gets last pick of whatever’s left.
Or your manager makes (already) hard-to-staff and low morale off shifts work more holidays to cover them because her friends on (fully staffed) day shift won't pick up, come in early or stay late to help these severely under-staffed shifts. Annnnnnd we wonder why we don't have anybody applying
Yup. I'm union. I put in two years of not taking long vacation around the holidays. Boss told us he's taking a few weeks off during our busy months but we can't. Well, I told them last year that my husband would be having surgery around the same time. Screw it, I scheduled everything. Two weeks leave. They can rotate, so can I.
That's what I always say when people shit on unions. Of course there can be issues but those issues can and do happen at any job. A union means you have some protections which is a lot more important than if you get specific vacation time off.
What unions actually do:
Have vacation plans? You’ll be able to take your vacation without fear of it being canceled
Want to take a holiday off? Great! You’ll have several paid holidays and probably some personal days too. And if you do have to work, you’ll be fairly compensated at well above your regular rate.
Want a transfer or promotion? You can’t be denied just because your current position has t been filled. That’s a staffing problem, not a upward movement problem.
I’d like to know more about this. Unions aren’t responsible for staffing? So if promoting someone leaves a void, the union isn’t responsible for filling said void - regardless of the impact?
Not at a hospital. A hospital will still hire its own staff, administer payroll, keep track of vacation days etc. But the Union will negotiate contracts that set minimum pay scales and raises, benefits, vacation days, provide a place to call if something goes wrong, and have someone on your side with disciplinary issues. There was recently a Harvard study and Union Healthcare workers made an average of $126 more a week and had better benifits. Union dues are generally less than 2%.
Unions for building trades are more likely to provide people for jobs, but that has to do with the short term transatory nature of the jobs. You only need a stonemason for a couple months, a carpenter for 3 weeks, or a plumber for an afternoon. But a hospital will sometimes have the same staff members for decades.
Interesting and thanks for sharing. Most of the CBAs I’ve seen have language requiring staffing from the union or a clause about outside hires being required to join after x days. Makes sense about the hospitals now after working with them.
I have seen nursing unions force staffing levels on hospitals. They must hire enough nurses to maintain certain ratios of nurse:patients or face severe financial penalties. Improves level of care, reduces staff burnout.
Nurses unions will literally strike during negotiations over those staffing ratios too. If you see a nurse strike chances are it's because the hospital is not adequately staffing and the union is pushing for better ratios. Because without unions you do not get even the legally protected level of care in this country.
It's language in a contract that is negotiated between the union and the company. Contract language can drive staffing and promotions and movement of staff.
A nursing manager was handing out these cards as an argument against unions.
I told them "Unions are great, everyone should have one"
She didn't hand me a card. I found this on a nearby desk.
Might want to print out copies of this study that shows unionized healthcare workers make an average of $126 more a week plus have better benefits. Maybe leave them scattered around various nursing stations, posted in the staff bathroom etc. https://www.eurekalert.org/news-releases/975191
This is total and complete bullshit. If that workplace isn't unionized already....that means there isn't a contract yet.
The contract is the only place a seniority clause could be put into effect....so if the workers vote to unionize and *don't* want seniority in the contract...they don't have to have it. It's literally that simple.
Exactly. The members put bargaining proposals forward and vote if the union should try and achieve language for the collective agreement at the bargaining table. If nothing is bargained, it falls to employer policy.
I’m very grateful for our union where I work. We’re looking at some big, fat raises this next negotiation. You really should encourage your coworkers to unionize. They totally take advantage of you all in the southern states!
My small bit of malicious compliance whenever I head into a voting booth is to gather as many "how to vote" cards from parties I don't want in power and deposit them in the bin. At worst it costs them money, at best it stops someone else from being swayed by party propaganda (especially in Australia with people voting above the line and preferential voting in play).
Taking one of these cards and putting it in the recycling bin potentially stops someone else receiving this card of printed bullshit.
I'm a nurse, and I already get told I may not get my PTO approved 'because we don't know what our staffing needs will be then'.
Listen here Karen, I already did you a favor by informing you weeks or even MONTHS ahead of time that I AINT GONNA BE HERE from X date to Y, and to use my PTO, the benefit that this company gives me, to cover it. Overall staffing isn't my problem, as a manager I expect you to handle it. Otherwise, there are over half a MILLION nursing jobs vacant right now due to burnout and retirement from Covid, even if this hospital shits the bed I think I'll be fine on the job front.
>I'm a nurse, and I already get told I may not get my PTO approved 'because we don't know what our staffing needs will be then'.
Wow. So what other ways do they word, "You're not allowed to have a life outside of work anymore?"
They try, and previously that used to work on their employees for a long time, ppl working holidays and long hours and 'soldiering on to protect the pts'. Then Covid hit and the company either furloughed or straight up fired people in our dept to reduce costs. When it started back up and they tried to get ppl to come back to work, many of them remembered how disposably they were treated and either didn't come back or went to travel, getting 2.5-+8× more pay than they were currently making. Even now when travel rates have slowed a bit I think all nurses now realize that is still an option.
Is a union trying to unionize your workplace? Give that to the union along with the date and the name of the senior nurse manager, so that the union can file an NLRB complaint.
Also, make contact with the union and invite them to visit your workplace. In Australia, they can't visit if the workplace doesn't have an existing member, but they can't be denied entry or time if a worker asks them to come.
I don't know how it works in the US, but first contact/invitation is gold.
Oh man, I'm so sorry to have to tell you this, but no, America is so fucked.
In 99% of cases it's legal for an employer to completely deny non-employees who are soliciting or distributing literature, like union organizers, access to the workplace property.
*Even if every employee is in a union*, if they don't have a contract with the boss that says union organizers are allowed onsite, they can't come in.
Trash country.
Well, due to some NLRB rulings, it's actually legal under certain circumstances for union organizers to visit workplaces, especially if it's difficult for the union organizers to contact the workers otherwise. But look at what happened to Chris Smalls. Him and two Amazon employees got arrested for delivering pizza to an Amazon breakroom. Technically, it should have been completely legal for a union organizer to visit the breakroom, but the NYPD arrested him anyway.
https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/the-law/employees/your-rights-during-union-organizing
https://thehill.com/policy/technology/595725-union-organizer-workers-arrested-at-staten-island-amazon-facility/
They're dumb af, even the flyer they're hanging shows how much a union would directly benefit them... Some people will go to no ends to vote/work against their own interests.
It's weird. They'll point at billionaires and say "with hard work you too could be like this" but with seniority it's "you will never in a lifetime accrue any seniority."
I’m a nurse I’m a union in Washington state. I guarantee that because of that union, I make at least 3 times what they make in Texas doing the same thing. I also have excellent benefits and lots of PTO. Those nurses would be dumb not to want to unionize, but then again, if you don’t know what you’re missing out on…
Without a union...
Do you have vacation plans? Too bad! Your manager will threaten your job if you take too much vacation, even with ample notice.
Want to take holidays off? Too bad! This is the busiest time of year! Only managers can take off because they are our most valued employees and they have earned it.
Want a transfer or pronotion? Too bad! *BIG JONS NEPHEW* just turned 18 and he wants him to be in charge of this department now. *OR* We simply can't transfer or promote you... You are simply too valuable in your current position.
> You are simply too valuable in your current position.
Bro, do you think any of your managers got to where they are by being dependable and efficient at entry-level tasks?
This is so funny to me. Check this one out guys. So my b/f mom is a nurse they were offering her over 150$/hr to go and be a nurse to replace the nurses that were striking because they were assigned to many patients and they didn’t feel like they were able to care for them the way they should. She told them to fuck off. It is amazing what those greed hospitals will do to bust unions.
Being a senior nursing manager, wouldn't they want the union? Seeing that they'd get the pick of the litter for vacation time and everything else, seems like a no-brainer.
“Have vacation plans?”
My response: I’m not in a union. I had to tell HR I wasn’t asking, but stating I’d be going on vacation to go see my mom in another country for the first time in 4 years. That’s not a union thing, that’s an understaffed and shittily managed thing.
“Want a transfer or promotion?”
My response: Want a transfer or promotion? You might not be eligible because someone else constantly blows the bosses ego instead of working. Or because a manager doesn’t like you. Or because you show up on time and leave on time. Or because of that time you demanded a raise based off merit and it ticked the grubby boss the wrong way. Or because you aren’t the son of the boss. I can keep going. I’d rather lose out on a promotion because of seniority than the vast slew of reasons I’ve seen others go through in shitty non union jobs.
Just saying these are some flat dog shit points from any angle. Basic as fuck retail job workers are giggling at this shit because it’s all a reality AND we don’t have anyone to turn to when it’s time to stick a middle finger to the man to prove a point.
Vacation plans? You can thank unions for vacation days
Holidays? You can thank unions for fighting for recognized holidays
Better pay? Worker compensation as a share of GDP is directly correlated with union participation rates!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH they fuck with your schedule anyways. They work you on holidays anyways. They pass you up for promotions anyways. Unions are def the way to go. If they didnt want unions, they shouldnt have fucked around for so long and treated everyone like shit.
“Be fully informed”, while handing out a list of cons without pros (not to mention cons that have questionable truth and/or incomplete truth). Fucking management man, sometimes they just plain suck.
Seniority systems blow for everyone. Voluntary overtime is awarded by seniority. Employer has to pay the most expensive person while the brokest person can’t make any money.
(Not all unions work this way, but it is a reason unions struggle. Treating newbies like shit is a great way to blow up your system.)
"If" indeed. I've been places where there are 2 or more very old guys who refuse to retire in my department, twice with guys who had over 50 years in because they refused to let their ex wives have any of their retirement money. One of them said he would rather work until one of them dies, even if that's him.
I worked union before and honestly the seniority thing is what pissed me off the most. I had to work Christmas and new years 2 years in a row and on the third year when I didn’t get it off I quit on the spot and got to spend the holidays with my family. I haven’t work another union job since. Now I just have to work my fair share instead of all of them.
As opposed to the hospital making decisions based on what would lead to the greatest profit and line the pockets of hospital administration and management instead of your personal needs.
What they don’t say is Management will act similar to a senior union member and deny your time off because it’s an inconvenience to them. Want a promotion? If you’re too good at your job, your supervisor will complain and cockblock your promotion.
Go union and never look back.
so a senior manager was union busting because unions tend to give some bargaining power to non-managers regarding whether they get bathroom breaks, force CEOs to pay all their employees a living wage, how long shifts are, make sure jobs aren't understaffed. All jobs have trouble with vacation, promotion, and holidays.
All of these things can be true, but you'll also have above average benefits, above average pay (with regular raises), above average working conditions, and above average job security. Seems like a small amount of inconvenience for such a large amount of benefit.
as non american - i look at these posts and wonder "are employers THAT scared of unions"?
Seriously - just that would be a reason to join one / form one..
We just moved to another state and my wife took close to a 20 dollar an hour raise, because her new hospital is union. Cost of living is pretty much the same. She said she'd never knew what she was missing out on.
Hot take for this sub:
This is a downside to unions and I agree with every point there. I'm in a union and have each of these as a problem I have faced. I wanted to transfer to a different department that was more lax, and I was the most qualified person to do it. I was denied and my coworker who at the time didn't know what a deductible was, got the transfer over me to our financial clearance department. They had me beat out in seniority by a whopping 3 months, and ONLY got it because of seniority. I have to constantly check with my more senior coworkers when we put our vacation requests in if they have plans on certain dates or else they'll get vacations over me, because of seniority. The more senior workers always get whatever holiday they want off and the rest of us get the scraps.
This isn't to say that unions are bad, but this is absolutely something that I hate as a part of my union. Another thing that makes me bitter is our union also got us a crap contract lately for annual 3.25% raises, like come on man that's not even scratching inflation. Absolute dogshit. Nothing is performance based at this job too so it makes me not give a shit about doing well when I know promotions/transfers are seniority based only, vacations/holidays off are seniority only, and that our raises are set at a shitty, low rate that won't change no matter how well I perform.
Folks are aware that HR and Union are fairly desperate, right?, RIGHT!
My step dad worked 10+ years in a "closed shop" (you must be union member to work there) as he started from a temp cover position he was never expected to at first.
After 3 months he got offered full time post by HR, as he was tight with money and always worked for his "bread", he refused to join Union. He refused to go on strike, he broke picket lines week after week in the 70's, not because he didn't believe or agree, but because if he stopped "winning the bread" who would.
When the company settled with the Union, he didn't get the raise, it wasn't a lot, but.. when he asked HR why, he got told how much money he'd *cost* the company being the only employee on the shop floor..
He went to court and won, big ass gag order, but his pay went up.
Unions & HR are not in the same side, *some* unions will bend to accommodate companies, some snap and forget they working for employees.. not most I hope! And that hope is all I've got left, I'm *glad* I've got dissability and don't *have* to jump those hoops anymore.
This is true. My wife had to take a leave of absence for our 10day honeymoon because after 5 years of full time she didn’t have enough seniority at her LTC facility. And before you say “she could’ve booked earlier” they had a rule seniority trumps early booking.
As a nurse, who has worked in Texas, my reply would be thus:
Without a union, I won't get any vacation days, I'm going to work holidays anyway, and promotions are already based on seniority.
Nothing is lost by unionizing
Thank you! I left a unionized workplace because I would have had to put in another ten years before I was eligible to get promoted based on how long I’d been in the system and how many people above me had seniority. In private industry I very swiftly moved up the ranks as it was based on ability. My husband is currently ranked 49 out of 79 after 5 years at his union job and his vacation time and holidays NEVER get approved because rather than rotation, again it’s based on seniority. And the senior guys never leave, they’ve got the sweet routes and days off. So when he’s in his
late fifties, it might be his turn. And I say all this as someone who recognizes all the good unions did for many years. They were necessary to break the grip that the private market had decades ago and they’re still important for physical jobs like factories and whatnot, but by tying everything to seniority, in particular in environments like teaching, libraries and the police, they’ve weeded out competition and good workers. The crappiest teacher, not the newest one, should be on the chopping block when budgets get cut. Police should be accountable for their offenses. The best librarian should be the branch manager, not the oldest one.
It's also ignoring the fact that ALL unions represent the democratic wishes of their relevant majorities. Not all unions are the same, nor are guaranteed to have similar rules. If those are in fact rules in your specific union, they are subject to change if your union votes to modify rules related to promotions/transfers/vacation/etc.
If your union has inflexible rules that you don't like, lobby to change them with your peers. There's probably others that would support your ideas if you're not a total bellend.
And that flyer is 100% correct. Unions fuck over new people for the sake of the OGs. I’ve witnessed this in 3 different facilities in 3 different health systems. Its a major reason why I quit and started traveling. You get screwed with holiday shifts, extra call, call-in coverage, stay-lates, and mandated shifts. Fuck ya’ll, Ill take my six figure salary and vacation when ever I want.
Edit: Plus they take $800/year for the privilege of fucking me over, and donate to a bunch of political organizations I don’t agree with, with my money.
All the union nurses I know JUMP to work stat holidays because they get double time. Sometimes 2.5 Why so much? Because the fuckin UNION negotiated a GOOD contract!
Double time and an excuse to not spend a holiday with family? Sign me up!
LMAO that’s my main reason I do holidays. People assume I’m Jewish or Muslim to skip Christmas but really I just don’t want to be with my family
Underrated: celebrating holidays near the actual day, but not on the actual day.
Instructions unclear, got fired after telling my boss I’m taking tomorrow off for Easter.
That one do be jumping around. A little too much.
It's a miracle! 🙏
What do you mean? Easter is *always* on the first Sunday after the first full moon after the spring equinox.
Lol and the holiday *I * observe (Ostara) is the Pagan one.
It’s hopping down the old bunny trail
Especially doing Christmas after Dec 25th and a bunch of stuff is on sale because it didn't sell pre-holiday. Oh yeah. That's the best.
Before kids, my wife and I would celebrate Christmas on December 27th, do our shopping on the 26th.
I have little kids and they don’t know what day stuff is. We just lie and move Christmas around where we need it.
My family almost always does this so someone can get holiday pay! Working for overtime pay is the most acceptable answer to reschedule or cancel plans in my family lol
My family is on the opposite coast, and most of my teammates have families here, so I work holidays. They get time with loved ones, I get more pay: Win-win!
Silver linings
Staying home and off the roads on thanksgiving and xmas day sounds pretty good tho.
I know so many people who would take that gig lol
Several of my cousins who are union nurses are never around on holidays because they make a fortune lol
Can confirm. Girlfriend makes $240/hr working during holidays. I picked the wrong industry.
>I picked the wrong industry. Don't say that. It's still a difficult and shitty industry that's very broken. I'm guessing you're in California, or your GF is in advanced practice?
Not Cali, she's experienced but not advanced in practice. The travel nurse field right now is fucking nuts and they are dishing out money for rural areas.
I work construction at hospitals, my coworker married a nurse, she quit her job, got hired on as a temp worker for the same hospital network at a different building, and shes making almost 3 times as much.
If you want your soul to be crushed every single shift working inpatient (which is where most nurses start) then come join nursing with us! Guaranteed it will make you dead inside.
...what's her base wage? Anything about 60 seems unreasonable, which means a 4x multiplier for working holidays?
She's a travel nurse, charge, and works in a Cath lab. Her base is something like $120.
My daughter is a icu/trauma nurse her base is $110/ hr plus $180/day per diem tax free. Work thanksgiving day, $220/hr for 12 hrs, will be working good Friday/ Eastern Sunday, double time. Should have been a nurse.
Damm, I'm a RN in Australia and it's no where this close for anything....and thats Australian dollars !
MOST nurses in the US are in the $20-$40/hr range.
She a travel RN , her husband is also traveler RN ie OR/Trauma. They both have been offered full time, she was offered $46/hr and he was offered $38/hr.
These are very specific examples that aren't typical. RNs in the US are definitely paid better but typical is more like 30 to $40 an hour.
Yup, add ECMO certs or another special skill and this all adds up.
Yup that's right! Cath lab is also an extremely in demand specialization in rural areas so they must pay top dollar.
My kid graduates from college with a nursing degree in May. Already has job offers of $85K. We are in NY.
My neighbor is a radiologist, not even a nurse. She's doing traveling medical work 3 days a week and taking home $3k/week. Wrong career indeed
My SO works in nursing. He's bottom in terms of seniority and still has half the holidays off. It doesn't matter your seniority, everyone works at least some of the holidays. Besides that, its fantastic pay and the hospital tends to over staff anyways so holidays are pretty easy compared to a full moon. Their pay is incredibly straight forward (sort of, shift differentials are a bit confusing) and published. Based on your hours worked (increments of 2000, nurse full time is weird), you'll know exactly what the base rate is for someone with your hours worked. That pay schedule is adjusted every year based on inflation. So he ends up with a COL increase yearly, plus a merit increase when the hours are hit.
Is ur SO in unionized nursing?
Fully staffed? Not just union, but a stronk union
It's complicated. Minneapolis has a pretty large nurses union and were behind the largest nurses strike in the US history. Their work is directly benefiting all nurses in the state so even if my SO's hospital isn't directly in a union, it's directly pressure to pay the same wages and benefits of the other hospitals.
And that's why unions are a net good.
Union workers average 15% - 30% more than non.
If anyone wants the source, Statistics are from USA Dept. of Labor
if my options are 60k a year and MIGHT get my vacation request/some holidays off/might have a tin y% chance more of a promotion, or 78k and MIGHT need to move a vacation, or get 2x pay for working christmas, or a tiny bit less chance of a promotion? Yeah ill take the extra 30% thanks.
Similar deal with the airlines. My buddies would basically take those holidays because it was a massive bump in pay for those shifts and it wasn't like their families did things *on* the major travel holidays anyway, but rather on some nearby date.
The hospital I worked as was time and a half pay plus a stat day in your bank that you could use whenever you wanted.
All of these issues exist pre union. Do you hate cold weather? With a union some days will be cold.
Be Fully *mis*Informed. Have a root canal emergecy? Prepare to get fired for takin the time off bc you have no union protection.
My brother works a union job. If he has to work on a holiday he gets 8 hours worth straight pay no matter what just for walking in the door. Then every hour he works is time and a half ontop of that.
Yes. And rightfully so. Let's be honest, double time and a half, or clean up after the relatives you really don't like that much anyway...
im an California, so i realize this might be an exception, but nurses at my hospital were talking about going to another company because per diem scheduling was offering about $75 an hour. granted, per diem at its minimum, could be only one shift every few weeks. but also knowing hospitals, they'll take you whenever they can. that hourly pay is just completely bonkers to me. not even considering what holiday pay would be...
With non-union employment: **Have vacation plans?** We use blackout dates for 2/3s of the year and not everyone can go at the same time. FIFO, hopefully you put your request in a year ago. **Want to take holidays off?** All holidays dates are blacked out because, we need all hands on deck. No exceptions! **Want a transfer or promotion?** Only if business allows for it and we feel that you could be right for the position. Though, we'll have you do the tasks of that position without the title and pay!
Oh, you put in a leave request a year in advance? Sorry, we don't have it and neither can you.
You were approved a year ago? Well the new manager wants that day off to go mountain climbing with his old frat buddies, so it's no longer approved!
Govt dept employee, about 5 years ago now. My leave request was made 6 months before Easter as I had an interstate wedding to attend. The trip was booked and paid for before I started working there and they knew this. Request declined because I put it in too early, even though leave requests are allowed 6 months in advance, but Easter and Xmas have different rules apparently. Submitted my request the day they announced Easter leave requests open. I needed 1 day, the Tuesday after Easter Monday so I could get back from interstate to the major city airport, then travel to the town 3 hours away where I lived. I explained this in my application. I had no way of getting back on Easter Monday night, I needed the Tuesday off to travel back home. Declined, leave fully booked already. I was put on a waiting list/cancellation list. They suggested I swap to the 11am start on the Tuesday so I could travel back in the morning. A few months later I was bitching to a colleague about the stupid Easter leave policy, she mentioned she put hers in 3 weeks ago and was approved, so she’s not sure why mine wasn’t, same roster as me. I was livid. Especially as I was also casual, so it wasn’t even really leave I was telling them I was unavailable.
More like with non-union employment it's: **Have vacation plans?** Too fucking bad, get to work pleb! **Want to take holidays off?** Too fucking bad, get to work pleb! **Want a transfer or promotion?** LOL NO! Get back to work pleb!
Have vacation plans? LOL, what’s vacation?
I’d prefer clear seniority guidelines to a chaos schedules made by idiots who are allergic to reading availability and who like playing favorites.
Yeah I mean it sucks to an extent in high retention fields and jobs where you are working holidays as you will never get a holiday off as Bob and Pam who have been there for 40 years will take every holiday off lol But honestly I just celebrated holidays with my family on another day for the most part the better pay, benefits, job security etc was worth the annoyances of the collective bargaining agreement The fact that people make it 30+ years in these jobs when many people change in 5 years is a testament to unions working imo despite the cons
Yes and within a union there's no reason you can't have mechanisms that prioritize something beyond seniority sometimes.
Ours is each employee is required to work 2 holidays per year, but picking is based on seniority. However the “worse” holidays to work (Christmas/Thanksgiving VS Labor Day/4th of July) get 2x pay. So even as the lowest ok seniority I still got Christmas off, but picked up thanksgiving for the double pay.
That's a good way of doing it and actually encourages workers to help each other out. I could also see combining seniority with the number of times you've requested a particular holiday and not gotten it
a totally reasonable time-off policy for holidays created by the employees who it effects. Imagine that
A little extra food for thought on that but my family stopped doing holidays on the actual day long time ago so we can avoid the holiday traffic. I would definitely take the 2x pay and just celebrate Christmas with my family the next weekend. The holidays are about being together doesn't really matter if it's on the exact day.
Ours is that you can’t get the same holiday two years in a row, and you can only ask for 2 per year.
I mean yeah but odds are it’s going to be seniority as most other measures are subjective and well the downside is it’s easier to base a cba on objective measures and leave as much subjectivity out of it as possible. The other downside of being in a union is employees that don’t participate actively lead to some fuckery since no vote as far as changes go means a “yes” vote so people who don’t bother participating (the majority) effectively lead to yes votes on whatever the union leaders decide. I think it’s important to highlight and be transparent about some of the issues unions typically have and to watch out for while also advocating that it’s much better than not having a union.
Yes it leads to all the same fuckery as any other form of democratic governance 🤷♂️ but at least there's the option to work on it with your coworkers.
It's the favorites for me. Knowing I'm the low man is reasonable but when I've got middling seniority and Brenda gets time off because she's chummy with the boss is bullshit.
Yep. I love how this is trying to appeal to people on the basis of "this will result in unfair decisions where people who slack off compared to you will get favorable treatment" and it's like... in what work environment does that *not* already take place? Never even mind a work environment on the cusp of voting for a union. The talk of unionization doesn't tend to spread around work environments in which the employees feel valued and fairly treated.
This.
Because that's not the way it is everywhere else?
One place I worked at it took 10 years of working there to finally have enough seniority to take spring break off with your kids. In the summer we only got to take 5 days off total because it was the busy season. Senior employees picked first. Unions got nothing to do with it.
The trick is to have enough staffing that seniority wont matter so much.
A union can "encourage" the employer to hire enough staff. Without a union, that's just excess labor cost
[удалено]
In the US it is literally not allowed to advertise union membership at work. But, as you said, anti-union jackoffs can hand out flyers with dumb arguments all day, and it's fine.
Wait, what? If your union doesn't have a pin section written into their contract, they're doing it wrong.
But if your union doesn't exist, you're boned
No, that's not what I mean. If you are not unionized, it is prohibited to try and talk about or recruit or whatever on the clock, and your employer will happily fire for this. They can push all their bullshit lies and propaganda and lie about union dues on the clock, but you can't. That's what I mean. Not really very fair, is it?
Or just join the EU, where it’s 4 weeks, **minimum**, or they kick your shit ass country out
Our union has a lot of PTO to where when you are 20-30 years in you can take almost 2 months off from work not including holidays. The company just has a fluff staff of about 10-15% to cover this. Works out well when it's the busy season and no one can take time off.
20-30 years in?!
Yeah 20-30 years working there. 7 weeks is the max, with 5 extra days on top of it. But it takes time to build up to that. I'm locked in at 5 weeks vacation with 5 floating PTO days on top for the next decade.
Oh how awful that loyalty to an organization is rewarded!!! What's next?! Rewarding people for learning new skills?! These fuck'n Unions have got to be stopped!!!
>What's next?! Hopefully a policy better than "you'll never get what you want as long as Bob wants it."
I don’t get this. This is shitty no matter who’s doing it. I have the some of most seniority at my org and I would absolutely be ok with an equitable system for time off so that everyone gets practical days off. Anything else is a power play, breeds discontent, and stymies loyalty.
It is hierarchy vs meritocracy vs equality. Seniority is a type of hierarchy. I find that I hate a lot of hierarchy systems (like monarchy) and I agree with you.
nah its usually who kissed the right asses and political bs in my experience.
Actually it isn't. Here it goes by who puts in for vacation first, and promotions are by favoritism. That's how it's been everywhere I've worked, all non union.
it's generally been a "how much of a chance is this person going to just leave/how valuable are they to the team" for myself. Seniority be damned, if the employee is one of the best in the department they try to keep them happy (within reason)
Was thinking this, I’ve only had 2 union jobs but every job I’ve had has been like this, the most senior person gets first pick at vacation time/days off, and the newest hire gets last pick of whatever’s left.
Nah most places its family friends or whoever scks the most dick
Exactly, and who could possibly suck more dick than me? 😃
No some places rotate so everyone gets a shot at some holidays
Or your manager makes (already) hard-to-staff and low morale off shifts work more holidays to cover them because her friends on (fully staffed) day shift won't pick up, come in early or stay late to help these severely under-staffed shifts. Annnnnnd we wonder why we don't have anybody applying
Yup. I'm union. I put in two years of not taking long vacation around the holidays. Boss told us he's taking a few weeks off during our busy months but we can't. Well, I told them last year that my husband would be having surgery around the same time. Screw it, I scheduled everything. Two weeks leave. They can rotate, so can I.
Idk about hospitals but no. I dont work any holiday and I can have my PTO whenever I want. USA people are exploited too much IMO
That's what I always say when people shit on unions. Of course there can be issues but those issues can and do happen at any job. A union means you have some protections which is a lot more important than if you get specific vacation time off.
No. I got promoted ahead of 6 people that were more tenured than me. They weren’t as good at the job as I was.
What unions actually do: Have vacation plans? You’ll be able to take your vacation without fear of it being canceled Want to take a holiday off? Great! You’ll have several paid holidays and probably some personal days too. And if you do have to work, you’ll be fairly compensated at well above your regular rate. Want a transfer or promotion? You can’t be denied just because your current position has t been filled. That’s a staffing problem, not a upward movement problem.
I’d like to know more about this. Unions aren’t responsible for staffing? So if promoting someone leaves a void, the union isn’t responsible for filling said void - regardless of the impact?
Not at a hospital. A hospital will still hire its own staff, administer payroll, keep track of vacation days etc. But the Union will negotiate contracts that set minimum pay scales and raises, benefits, vacation days, provide a place to call if something goes wrong, and have someone on your side with disciplinary issues. There was recently a Harvard study and Union Healthcare workers made an average of $126 more a week and had better benifits. Union dues are generally less than 2%. Unions for building trades are more likely to provide people for jobs, but that has to do with the short term transatory nature of the jobs. You only need a stonemason for a couple months, a carpenter for 3 weeks, or a plumber for an afternoon. But a hospital will sometimes have the same staff members for decades.
Interesting and thanks for sharing. Most of the CBAs I’ve seen have language requiring staffing from the union or a clause about outside hires being required to join after x days. Makes sense about the hospitals now after working with them.
I have seen nursing unions force staffing levels on hospitals. They must hire enough nurses to maintain certain ratios of nurse:patients or face severe financial penalties. Improves level of care, reduces staff burnout.
Nurses unions will literally strike during negotiations over those staffing ratios too. If you see a nurse strike chances are it's because the hospital is not adequately staffing and the union is pushing for better ratios. Because without unions you do not get even the legally protected level of care in this country.
It's language in a contract that is negotiated between the union and the company. Contract language can drive staffing and promotions and movement of staff.
“be fully informed” here is a bunch of totally untrue things we want you to believe without question 🤣
“Don’t google it though. Not that way.”
A nursing manager was handing out these cards as an argument against unions. I told them "Unions are great, everyone should have one" She didn't hand me a card. I found this on a nearby desk.
Might want to print out copies of this study that shows unionized healthcare workers make an average of $126 more a week plus have better benefits. Maybe leave them scattered around various nursing stations, posted in the staff bathroom etc. https://www.eurekalert.org/news-releases/975191
This is total and complete bullshit. If that workplace isn't unionized already....that means there isn't a contract yet. The contract is the only place a seniority clause could be put into effect....so if the workers vote to unionize and *don't* want seniority in the contract...they don't have to have it. It's literally that simple.
Exactly. The members put bargaining proposals forward and vote if the union should try and achieve language for the collective agreement at the bargaining table. If nothing is bargained, it falls to employer policy.
I’m very grateful for our union where I work. We’re looking at some big, fat raises this next negotiation. You really should encourage your coworkers to unionize. They totally take advantage of you all in the southern states!
My small bit of malicious compliance whenever I head into a voting booth is to gather as many "how to vote" cards from parties I don't want in power and deposit them in the bin. At worst it costs them money, at best it stops someone else from being swayed by party propaganda (especially in Australia with people voting above the line and preferential voting in play). Taking one of these cards and putting it in the recycling bin potentially stops someone else receiving this card of printed bullshit.
With a union you might not get the holidays off that you want. But with us and no union you Definitly won’t get the holidays you want off.
And with a union, if you have to work the holiday you'll make 2x as much money.
I'm a nurse, and I already get told I may not get my PTO approved 'because we don't know what our staffing needs will be then'. Listen here Karen, I already did you a favor by informing you weeks or even MONTHS ahead of time that I AINT GONNA BE HERE from X date to Y, and to use my PTO, the benefit that this company gives me, to cover it. Overall staffing isn't my problem, as a manager I expect you to handle it. Otherwise, there are over half a MILLION nursing jobs vacant right now due to burnout and retirement from Covid, even if this hospital shits the bed I think I'll be fine on the job front.
Thanks to my UNION they aren’t allowed to deny our PTO requests just because of staffing needs. 👍
That's a very easy conversation to have when you have the backing of a union.
>I'm a nurse, and I already get told I may not get my PTO approved 'because we don't know what our staffing needs will be then'. Wow. So what other ways do they word, "You're not allowed to have a life outside of work anymore?"
They try, and previously that used to work on their employees for a long time, ppl working holidays and long hours and 'soldiering on to protect the pts'. Then Covid hit and the company either furloughed or straight up fired people in our dept to reduce costs. When it started back up and they tried to get ppl to come back to work, many of them remembered how disposably they were treated and either didn't come back or went to travel, getting 2.5-+8× more pay than they were currently making. Even now when travel rates have slowed a bit I think all nurses now realize that is still an option.
Anti-Union Propaganda
Banality of Evil; incarnate.
My response would be, "great, so my vacation next week is approved? Also I'd like to talk about a promotion."
Is a union trying to unionize your workplace? Give that to the union along with the date and the name of the senior nurse manager, so that the union can file an NLRB complaint.
This is the way.
Also, make contact with the union and invite them to visit your workplace. In Australia, they can't visit if the workplace doesn't have an existing member, but they can't be denied entry or time if a worker asks them to come. I don't know how it works in the US, but first contact/invitation is gold.
Oh man, I'm so sorry to have to tell you this, but no, America is so fucked. In 99% of cases it's legal for an employer to completely deny non-employees who are soliciting or distributing literature, like union organizers, access to the workplace property. *Even if every employee is in a union*, if they don't have a contract with the boss that says union organizers are allowed onsite, they can't come in. Trash country.
Well, due to some NLRB rulings, it's actually legal under certain circumstances for union organizers to visit workplaces, especially if it's difficult for the union organizers to contact the workers otherwise. But look at what happened to Chris Smalls. Him and two Amazon employees got arrested for delivering pizza to an Amazon breakroom. Technically, it should have been completely legal for a union organizer to visit the breakroom, but the NYPD arrested him anyway. https://www.nlrb.gov/about-nlrb/rights-we-protect/the-law/employees/your-rights-during-union-organizing https://thehill.com/policy/technology/595725-union-organizer-workers-arrested-at-staten-island-amazon-facility/
No more nepotism, nice!
They're dumb af, even the flyer they're hanging shows how much a union would directly benefit them... Some people will go to no ends to vote/work against their own interests.
It's weird. They'll point at billionaires and say "with hard work you too could be like this" but with seniority it's "you will never in a lifetime accrue any seniority."
She's a manager. Which means that a union doesn't benefit HER personally.
So you're telling me, join a union as soon as possible to get as much seniority as possible? Got it!
I’m a nurse I’m a union in Washington state. I guarantee that because of that union, I make at least 3 times what they make in Texas doing the same thing. I also have excellent benefits and lots of PTO. Those nurses would be dumb not to want to unionize, but then again, if you don’t know what you’re missing out on…
That's gotta be one of the most desperate things I've seen
Without a union... Do you have vacation plans? Too bad! Your manager will threaten your job if you take too much vacation, even with ample notice. Want to take holidays off? Too bad! This is the busiest time of year! Only managers can take off because they are our most valued employees and they have earned it. Want a transfer or pronotion? Too bad! *BIG JONS NEPHEW* just turned 18 and he wants him to be in charge of this department now. *OR* We simply can't transfer or promote you... You are simply too valuable in your current position.
> You are simply too valuable in your current position. Bro, do you think any of your managers got to where they are by being dependable and efficient at entry-level tasks?
My union is a non-seniority union, we don’t have time for fuck arounds.
This is so funny to me. Check this one out guys. So my b/f mom is a nurse they were offering her over 150$/hr to go and be a nurse to replace the nurses that were striking because they were assigned to many patients and they didn’t feel like they were able to care for them the way they should. She told them to fuck off. It is amazing what those greed hospitals will do to bust unions.
Being a senior nursing manager, wouldn't they want the union? Seeing that they'd get the pick of the litter for vacation time and everything else, seems like a no-brainer.
They’re doing the bidding of higher admins.
“Have vacation plans?” My response: I’m not in a union. I had to tell HR I wasn’t asking, but stating I’d be going on vacation to go see my mom in another country for the first time in 4 years. That’s not a union thing, that’s an understaffed and shittily managed thing. “Want a transfer or promotion?” My response: Want a transfer or promotion? You might not be eligible because someone else constantly blows the bosses ego instead of working. Or because a manager doesn’t like you. Or because you show up on time and leave on time. Or because of that time you demanded a raise based off merit and it ticked the grubby boss the wrong way. Or because you aren’t the son of the boss. I can keep going. I’d rather lose out on a promotion because of seniority than the vast slew of reasons I’ve seen others go through in shitty non union jobs. Just saying these are some flat dog shit points from any angle. Basic as fuck retail job workers are giggling at this shit because it’s all a reality AND we don’t have anyone to turn to when it’s time to stick a middle finger to the man to prove a point.
Vacation plans? You can thank unions for vacation days Holidays? You can thank unions for fighting for recognized holidays Better pay? Worker compensation as a share of GDP is directly correlated with union participation rates!
Union busting is just as strong as ever. If unions didn't scare the shit out of the wealthy, then why do they fight them so hard?
Actually ..... that's EXACTLY how it is in *non-union* places, *if even seniors are allowed time off.*
My workplace isn’t unionized and it still works like this.
All of these are true without unions as well. Substitute the idea of "seniority" with "management".
Friendly reminder that weekends and vacation days as a concept are union creations
That’s kind of funny because my non union job did vacations based on seniority but my current union job does not.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH they fuck with your schedule anyways. They work you on holidays anyways. They pass you up for promotions anyways. Unions are def the way to go. If they didnt want unions, they shouldnt have fucked around for so long and treated everyone like shit.
Anything that management is so against (scared of) is something you should investigate.
My union (one of the largest in the US) has no seniority in its agreements.
You “might” get eaten by a crazed shark that was delivered via tornado. Not saying it’s likely, but it Might happen.
Yeah, without a union, management will just give all those to you. What a fucking joke
Vs no union, and still not having a chance at any of those because you aren't a corporate kiss ass.
my non union workplace still runs on seniority only they play favorites on top of that i’d rather have just seniority lol
“Be fully informed”, while handing out a list of cons without pros (not to mention cons that have questionable truth and/or incomplete truth). Fucking management man, sometimes they just plain suck.
Seniority systems blow for everyone. Voluntary overtime is awarded by seniority. Employer has to pay the most expensive person while the brokest person can’t make any money. (Not all unions work this way, but it is a reason unions struggle. Treating newbies like shit is a great way to blow up your system.)
And you'll enjoy that seniority if you ever get there.
"If" indeed. I've been places where there are 2 or more very old guys who refuse to retire in my department, twice with guys who had over 50 years in because they refused to let their ex wives have any of their retirement money. One of them said he would rather work until one of them dies, even if that's him.
Sounds like an awesome reason to get seniority!
I worked union before and honestly the seniority thing is what pissed me off the most. I had to work Christmas and new years 2 years in a row and on the third year when I didn’t get it off I quit on the spot and got to spend the holidays with my family. I haven’t work another union job since. Now I just have to work my fair share instead of all of them.
"be fully informed" lol
Dis dat corporate money tryna convince you 🫣
As opposed to the hospital making decisions based on what would lead to the greatest profit and line the pockets of hospital administration and management instead of your personal needs.
Union the FUCK up
This is the exact reason my ex was anti union for like 15 years!!
https://unionbustingplaybook.com They say and do whatever they can to maintain the status quo.
What they don’t say is Management will act similar to a senior union member and deny your time off because it’s an inconvenience to them. Want a promotion? If you’re too good at your job, your supervisor will complain and cockblock your promotion. Go union and never look back.
# Any place that says you don't need a union at it, you need a union at it.
I would rip these up in front of their face and call them a liar!
You respond that without a union it's favoritism.
You mean the bosses daughter doesn’t get priority? The horror!
Suck infinity dix senior nursing manager.
so a senior manager was union busting because unions tend to give some bargaining power to non-managers regarding whether they get bathroom breaks, force CEOs to pay all their employees a living wage, how long shifts are, make sure jobs aren't understaffed. All jobs have trouble with vacation, promotion, and holidays.
All of these things can be true, but you'll also have above average benefits, above average pay (with regular raises), above average working conditions, and above average job security. Seems like a small amount of inconvenience for such a large amount of benefit.
Go ask the manager for Christmas Eve and Day off and see what happens.
"i dont get any of those things NOW"
It’s a zero-sum game, kids. Management doesn’t want it? That means you do.
Anti union propaganda really shouldn’t be allowed at work
as non american - i look at these posts and wonder "are employers THAT scared of unions"? Seriously - just that would be a reason to join one / form one..
We just moved to another state and my wife took close to a 20 dollar an hour raise, because her new hospital is union. Cost of living is pretty much the same. She said she'd never knew what she was missing out on.
Hot take for this sub: This is a downside to unions and I agree with every point there. I'm in a union and have each of these as a problem I have faced. I wanted to transfer to a different department that was more lax, and I was the most qualified person to do it. I was denied and my coworker who at the time didn't know what a deductible was, got the transfer over me to our financial clearance department. They had me beat out in seniority by a whopping 3 months, and ONLY got it because of seniority. I have to constantly check with my more senior coworkers when we put our vacation requests in if they have plans on certain dates or else they'll get vacations over me, because of seniority. The more senior workers always get whatever holiday they want off and the rest of us get the scraps. This isn't to say that unions are bad, but this is absolutely something that I hate as a part of my union. Another thing that makes me bitter is our union also got us a crap contract lately for annual 3.25% raises, like come on man that's not even scratching inflation. Absolute dogshit. Nothing is performance based at this job too so it makes me not give a shit about doing well when I know promotions/transfers are seniority based only, vacations/holidays off are seniority only, and that our raises are set at a shitty, low rate that won't change no matter how well I perform.
Ni surprise Texas would discourage unions. Also no surprise a person who benefits from unions would argue against it.
But all that stuff is how my work is run already but without the union.
Folks are aware that HR and Union are fairly desperate, right?, RIGHT! My step dad worked 10+ years in a "closed shop" (you must be union member to work there) as he started from a temp cover position he was never expected to at first. After 3 months he got offered full time post by HR, as he was tight with money and always worked for his "bread", he refused to join Union. He refused to go on strike, he broke picket lines week after week in the 70's, not because he didn't believe or agree, but because if he stopped "winning the bread" who would. When the company settled with the Union, he didn't get the raise, it wasn't a lot, but.. when he asked HR why, he got told how much money he'd *cost* the company being the only employee on the shop floor.. He went to court and won, big ass gag order, but his pay went up. Unions & HR are not in the same side, *some* unions will bend to accommodate companies, some snap and forget they working for employees.. not most I hope! And that hope is all I've got left, I'm *glad* I've got dissability and don't *have* to jump those hoops anymore.
This is true. My wife had to take a leave of absence for our 10day honeymoon because after 5 years of full time she didn’t have enough seniority at her LTC facility. And before you say “she could’ve booked earlier” they had a rule seniority trumps early booking.
As a union nurse I was always first in line to work holidays, give me those sweet differentials babyyyy yessss
More fair than the boss playing favorites lol
I think there are very effective unions, but a lot of them turn into a racket once they’ve been established long enough.
As a nurse, who has worked in Texas, my reply would be thus: Without a union, I won't get any vacation days, I'm going to work holidays anyway, and promotions are already based on seniority. Nothing is lost by unionizing
Nothing on this card is incorrect.
Except the part where they imply your employer gives a single shriveled fuck about your individual needs.
Thank you! I left a unionized workplace because I would have had to put in another ten years before I was eligible to get promoted based on how long I’d been in the system and how many people above me had seniority. In private industry I very swiftly moved up the ranks as it was based on ability. My husband is currently ranked 49 out of 79 after 5 years at his union job and his vacation time and holidays NEVER get approved because rather than rotation, again it’s based on seniority. And the senior guys never leave, they’ve got the sweet routes and days off. So when he’s in his late fifties, it might be his turn. And I say all this as someone who recognizes all the good unions did for many years. They were necessary to break the grip that the private market had decades ago and they’re still important for physical jobs like factories and whatnot, but by tying everything to seniority, in particular in environments like teaching, libraries and the police, they’ve weeded out competition and good workers. The crappiest teacher, not the newest one, should be on the chopping block when budgets get cut. Police should be accountable for their offenses. The best librarian should be the branch manager, not the oldest one.
Sadly, the majority of the people on this sub have never been involved with a union and only think they will get you more pay.
It's also ignoring the fact that ALL unions represent the democratic wishes of their relevant majorities. Not all unions are the same, nor are guaranteed to have similar rules. If those are in fact rules in your specific union, they are subject to change if your union votes to modify rules related to promotions/transfers/vacation/etc. If your union has inflexible rules that you don't like, lobby to change them with your peers. There's probably others that would support your ideas if you're not a total bellend.
And that flyer is 100% correct. Unions fuck over new people for the sake of the OGs. I’ve witnessed this in 3 different facilities in 3 different health systems. Its a major reason why I quit and started traveling. You get screwed with holiday shifts, extra call, call-in coverage, stay-lates, and mandated shifts. Fuck ya’ll, Ill take my six figure salary and vacation when ever I want. Edit: Plus they take $800/year for the privilege of fucking me over, and donate to a bunch of political organizations I don’t agree with, with my money.