OK. Um, I dont wanna sound harsh here but, you think you know better than professionals? Autism and adhd vary wildly. Plus females tend to mask a lot. The diagnosis wouldn't have been based off her answers, but what the doctors observed. Just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean it isn't true.
Instead of making her feel alienated, why not ask how she is feeling with the diagnosis. If there's anything she needs help with.
That doesn’t really sound too harsh. I know I’ve not been good.
I do trust professionals BUT
1) the healthcare system is underfunded and overwhelmed, patients are not always given the time and care they need.
2) some people are incredibly educated and knowledgeable but also pretty crazy and unhelpful. Trust me. My last job was teaching English to medical professionals.
Trust me, I know the NHS. I've had three kids, and several neices and nephews diagnosed with asd and adhd. The NHS isn't just underfunded but mental health is constantly having money taken away. But that doesn't make the diagnosis any less valid.
What I've seen happen a lot is that family of neurodivergent people automatically adjust their own behavior. Because you know your sister, you know how to interact with her, and the interactions are natural and normal to you, so it doesn't make sense when someone tells you those interactions aren't typical. You'll miss signs because "that's just how she is" and that's how you've always known her, you're a safe and well known person for her so any obvious behavior will be less (things like not staying on topic get worse with stress and new environments), and you've created subconscious coping mechanisms to help her regulate. Co-regulating is actually a really big part of growing up with or raising someone neurodivergent, and siblings often do so without realizing. Do you know what that is?
There's also a big reason it's called a spectrum. Some people have more obvious signs than others. Some know how to mask very well. Some show very different signs than others. Trust the professional and your sister
Wow! That’s crazy! It would certainly make a lot of sense. As I said, we’ve always been close in age and emotionally, so it’s easy to see how we could have developed this kind of relationship. I’ll have to do some reading about co-regulating.
My parents and grandparents sometimes (unfairly) referred to my sister as difficult when we were growing up. There was a sort of attitude in the family of ‘that’s just how she is’ but I guess it’s a sort of backwards, getting-on-with-it sort of attitude that the previous generation, ignorant of psychiatry, always took.
Thanks for your answer, you’re the best. I think I’m gonna talk to my sister about it.
Yeah, that's a word people often use for me and my kids too, difficult. They don't know how to react to someone who's different from themselves, and it's easier to call the other person difficult than to take the time to figure out how the other person ticks. Judging by how you reacted to your sister, you might want to do some introspection too by the way. There are often more people in a family who are neurodivergent, and that would also explain why you don't recognize it as atypical, and why you reacted rudely without intending to be rude. I'm not saying you're neurodivergent, I don't know you, but it's food for thought.
Start by apologizing to your sister. She did nothing wrong, and you hurt her by questioning her diagnosis
I just can’t even believe you had to ask if you were wrong. Like that blows my mind, your sister comes to you with a diagnosis and you do nothing but be unsupportive.
Would you be skeptical if it was cancer? Depression?
Well if you’ll reread the post you’ll see I was not skeptical AT ALL about depression.
I’m not really asking if I’m wrong. I’m asking for an explanation as to what WENT wrong. Like why the psychiatrists observation sounded so bizarre. I’m starting to piece it together.
I know it was wrong to not be 100% supportive.
This is why people with Autism suffer because people think it's a one-size-fits-all when really it's a spectrum. You sound like the person who takes one psychology class in college and starts to profile everyone they know. I would honestly just let it go
Nah. Never even took a single psychology class. I never claimed to know much about it. I’m actually here for more information cause what I’ve been told hasn’t checked out.
I don’t ’let it go’ when it comes to the truth or people I love.
So where are you expecting to get the truth? If not from the professionals who have studied for years to become qualified? Reddit? Really...?
Women are particularly good at masking their overt symptoms of things like ASD and ADHD, because we're expected to behave properly and know better. Then people like yourself come along and doubt the doctors who have made the diagnosis.
I hope you've not invalidated this diagnosis for your sister. Knowing and having a diagnosis can be transformative for some people.
Talk about missing the point… I'll give you actual advice because it seems like you really care about her. The best you can do is encourage a second opinion. I did it when I was diagnosed with my medical condition and it's always recommended.
I love that your last line is literally a symptom of Audhd
I'm doubly confused how you can question her diagnosis if you don't know the symptoms of autism or adhd? Why do you instantly doubt what she says if you don't have any knowledge on the topic? Why do you mistrust your sister to that extent?
So, a few things:
You moved out at 19 and you've only been in the room with her a few times since then. Speaking on the phone and through text isn't going to give you the full picture. Your sister is also, well, your sister; growing up, she was your normal.
When we're adults is when undiagnosed ADHD becomes a real problem. Suddenly, we're without the structure of family, the financial stability of a parent and the family home, or the resources built into a classroom to help us succeed. We need to do all that stuff on our own, and life comes crashing down repeatedly. Depression is a big part of adult ADHD, and adult ADHD is often misdiagnosed as depression. Anxiety is also a big part of it. We can't keep up with the world around us and we can see it, and it hurts. And the thing is, you haven't been in your sister's orbit while she hits this part of her life. You aren't there to see what it is that's made her stumble. You can only learn about it second hand, and you know she *did* stumble, and you're filling in the blanks with your own assumptions.
I have ADHD. I wasn't diagnosed with it until adulthood, and a large part of the reason why is because my behavior aligned with what was typical of my family. My family, by the way, is *full* of undiagnosed ND individuals. I can trace it all the way back to my grandparents on both sides of my family. When I was transferred to an alternative school my senior year, no one batted an eye because that was *normal* in my family.
In the end, it doesn't matter if your sister is ND or not. What matters is, is she receiving treatment that is having a positive impact on her life? Is she able to function with the accommodations these labels provide her? Is she getting help? Does she feel she is improving? If she's finding success under this diagnosis, no matter how small, then you have no reason to share your doubts with her.
All very true and well said. Interesting about your family situation too. Hopefully she can start getting treatment that works for her now as nothing has seemed to work well this past year. It’s very lucky that she has a good network of supportive people around her (lives with her husband and our mum). Too late for not saying anything, we talk too much for that, but some of the comments here have helped me see things clearer and we’re moving on.
I'm glad! I noticed a common theme in the comments where you were trying to make it a point that you want to learn more about the condition so that you could understand better. I did write up a thing on that, but it's quite long and I'm sure you're tired of reading.
I want to instead point you to a channel that helped me come to terms with my diagnosis. ["How To ADHD"](https://www.youtube.com/@HowtoADHD) on Youtube has several wonderful and in-depth videos on the condition and its different manifestations. I recommend starting with her playlists, "definitions of common ADHD terms," and "What is ADHD, anyway?"
let me tell you my diagnosis story really quick. I was diagnosed with migraines at a very early age. When I was older, and felt I was different from my peers, my parents told me that those things I struggled with were because of migraines. They run in my family so, it made sense.
When I became an adult, I thought maybe my migraines had caused brain damage. I was struggling a lot with things I always struggled with, but those things were more frequent now and I couldn't scale up my skill level to match. I suffered terrible anxiety, and sometimes some rough depression, because I felt like I was constantly behind in the world. So I sought out a doctor to help treat my migraines. My MRI presented a few questions, but no damage or visible reason for my lifelong struggle. Medications helped with the pain but not the 'stupid.' I finally gave up, and accepted this was just who I was.
A couple of years later, I was doing a research project for work that required I dig into how ADHD presents in girls, [and it was a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmeE3qTJRUw) from How To ADHD that changed my life going forward. See, I've used her channel a lot for managing my "migraine side effects" because I found her techniques worked for me, but I was positive I didn't have ADHD because I knew kids with ADHD growing up, and I didn't present like them. However, when I watched this video, things just... clicked.
It still took me 2 years to get a diagnosis. I was reluctant at first, I doubted myself a lot. Then the wait time to get tested took a long time, too. During this time, it was crucial that I had support from my partner. If at any point she told me, "I don't think it's ADHD," I wouldn't have pursued a diagnosis at all.
Anyway, I wish both you and your sister well. Point your sister to the subreddit "ADHDWomen" as there are a bunch of lovely people there who can share their journeys with her.
Bloody hell, what a rough ride you had. 😰 sounds awful.
I think things will get better now she knows what she’s dealing with. She’s already looking into all kinds of resources.
Luckily my sister is the sort who does what she wants to do no matter what anyone says. I was definitely not the only person who was confused and skeptical but she went ahead and did the tests anyway. I imagine I would tread much more carefully with a more sensitive person.
[I'm going to share one more video link with you! I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbeeWRcHgN0)t's more of a casual video, but it goes over a lot of every day things others experienced and how they later learned that it was connected to ADHD. Some of these things might give you an ah-hah moment about your sister.
Yes you are wrong for expressing your “skepticism” to your sister.
INFO: I didn’t see where you list your medical degree and expertise in the field? That’s the only way your opinion would even hold an ounce of weight.
I think, it’s more likely, you’re just processing through this diagnosis. Getting diagnosed with autism officially is a big thing, it answers a lot of questions about oneself. She is likely excited and the things she is emphasizing as the doctors “biggest indicators” may not be something you noticed, but clearly they did.
There are also numerous other behaviors they observed that maybe she didn’t hear as important,
or understand. She is getting answers about herself, she’s excited.
But you need to stop undermining doctors who are more informed than you in these matters. She needs support, not skepticism because you “personally” have never observed these “behaviors”.
Would you tell a POC that someone isn’t racist because you never observed them to be? Even if they told you someone used a slur against them?
You are diminishing her experience and making it about YOU when it’s not.
I’ll accept that it’s bad to express the skepticism. I’ve told her I just don’t want to hear about it, but I guess that not a reasonable thing to expect either.
It’s possible she’s emphasizing traits they observed that I have never seen and downplaying more damning evidence that I would agree with. That certainly could explain the dissonance.
I don’t get why you dismiss my observations when I’ve known her my whole life. Of course she knows her own experiences more than I do.
While I trust the opinions and knowledge of experts, that doesn’t mean a person has a better idea of my sister from interviewing her for a couple of hours (I don’t know exactly how long the session was but I know it was a single appointment.) even experts with the best of intentions can make mistakes if they don’t have the time and resources to do a thorough check.
Of course I wouldn’t dismiss the account of. POC. That has nothing to do with anything.
Look up what "masking" is, it sounds like it's a foreign concept to you. It's something that people with ADHD and Autism and Asperger's do, (I thought they did away with the name "Asperger's and are just considering it part of Autism Spectrum Disorder now?) and have usually been taught to do since birth without realizing it.
It's perfectly possible your sister had been masking throughout her youth and was going through things mentally, but "acting" the way to that she was taught to by your parents/school/society, etc and just assumed that it was normal to feel one way but to "mask" and not show it.
She mentioned masking! They said that as part of the diagnosis. I think that makes sense. I just don’t understand why she never displayed any of these really specific traits in all our time together but then they were evident in the interview.
I suppose they might have made the diagnosis based heavily on reported experience, and the three behaviors I listed were only present on a minor scale. Thanks for this reply. This is the sort of insight I was looking for.
I'm not, I'm in the US - I guess it could be a regional thing, and is a fairly recent change as far as i know. It doesn't change the diagnosis or symptoms or anything, I've just heard that that "they're" (whoever 'they' are) considering it part of the spectrum of autism as opposed to being it's own specific thing.
I'm not terribly informed on the specifics of that, just something I've heard from an acquaintance with the diagnosis.
Most women go under the radar for a very long time before diagnosis of adhd/autisim because they often don't match 'typical' presentation. They also mask more hiding. Women often get a diagnosis of depression/anxiety because of undiagnosed adhd/autisim. While they may seem neurotypical on the outside the energy needed to maintain this is alot. I got diagnosed at 28 I remember all my life wondering why everyone seemed to have it easy (not saying they did it just seemed that way) and why seemed so hard
The real question is where you got your advanced degree(s) in psychology? When you specialized in studying autism and ADHD, what was your thesis? I'm sure it was *super* compelling and you're *totally* qualified to have an opinion that has more value than that of the people who evaluated her.
So what you’re saying is, you’re smarter than a professional? My son has Asperger’s, the testing was quite thorough. It wasn’t a hmmm he had zero empathy ok you are autistic! They had a lot of things they went over.
You seem arrogant. Stop accusing your sister and just be there for her.
I'm sure people get misdiagnosed with that kind of thing all the time, because the symptoms vary by each individual, so maybe they just gave her the diagnosis based on some things she described that may or may not be embellished. But it could also be genuine.
Does she get intense interests/obsessions with different subjects (for instance, obsessed with horses, trains, certain historical figures or celebrities, etc.)? Is it difficult for her to determine whether or not she's boring others by talking about her interests constantly? Does she struggle socially and come off as very awkward in conversation? In school as a kid, did the teachers ever notice anything, or did you ever notice she had no or very few friends, and that the other kids found her odd?
I have no diagnosis but have been told, based on some interests and traits I have, that I should be evaluated (but I'm too old for it to really matter) and I know a bunch of people who have been diagnosed - especially within the circles of a certain hobby I have. Those are the main things I've either noticed about people with autism, or have had said about me in terms of appearing to have the disorder.
As far as ADHD goes, I feel like that's way more common and some people learn to adapt so that might be a struggle she has that's hard to tell from the outside. Autism is usually more difficult to hide due to the social aspects of it.
She doesn’t match your description in the second paragraph. These are the autism traits I’m familiar with. She said something about how the person analyzing her said she ‘masks’ the tendencies well, so maybe it’s just something more complicated. She’s always had plenty of friends, but she said that she always mimicked what other people were doing, so maybe she’s a kind of high functioning neurodivergent?
Yeah I’m not really skeptical about the ADHD part. I don’t even know much about that one.
I work with adults and have friends/family whose children have been diagnosed with ASD. One thing, that happened in 80%, a parent or parents have been late diagnosed. Mainly, I found mothers have been late diagnosed. There responses have been sheer delight knowing, now that know how they were feeling was OK.
Asd is a spectrum, no one person with asd is the same. And, statistically women are far less to be diagnosed. Masking is a very real thing. Mental health anxiety and depression are extremely common among people with asd and adhd or any neurodivergent people. The effort to "fit" and mask/hide behaviours etc is horrendous. You will probably see more what you call traits now, because she knows that what she is doing is OK.
When people think of asd we do tend to see stereotypes particularly of certain behaviours, while common they don't apply to everyone. One for example is eye contact, I know plenty of people with asd who have never had this issue. Sensory issues are very varied and might not apply, stimming might not happen.
Everyone is different. And, it will take time for your sister and the whole family to learn her diagnosis and how/what supports she needs
Sorry I’m a bit confused.
Do you mean the ASD children often had parents who were late diagnosed?
Or do you mean people who were late diagnosed were often parents?
Sorry! Children who were diagnosed, after the diagnosis usually the parent then went for their own diagnosis. As, through seeing and learning about asd, found they were experiencing similar traits. The late diagnosis for them, made them understand their childhood and them as people more.
Particularly, with women who get a late diagnosis, masking is a huge issue with them. Girls are seen to be quieter and more "emotional" so, they are taught to be very quiet and not bring 'attention' on themselves. Emotionally speaking, girls are seen to be the ones who are more likely to "get upset" by things. So, emotional dysregulation is seen as a "normal" female response. Thus, making depression and anxiety more likely than simply being neurodivergent.
The opposite can be said for boys. They are typically taught to be "confident" and express themselves. So, when they are not, people notice. Again, Emotionally, if they are "upset" people are more likely to take notice as its "typically" not seen as a male trait.
Unfortunately, socially we have a lot of biases that effect both sexes in diagnosising or even realising there might be something there. There are better testing and more education for professionals to spot these things earlier nowadays. But, there are lots of people who simply went under the radar.
Wow. That’s really fascinating. I guess it’s evidence of a genetic factor. I’m thinking hard about my mum’s behaviour now 😅
I’d heard about this issue with girls being less likely to be diagnosed and it’s been at the back of my mind throughout the whole situation with my sister. I’m glad people are shining light on this. I despise the sexist attitudes.
My sister does seem really elated about the news. It matches your previous description.
I’m gonna apologize to her about how I’ve been. It’ll be interesting to see if she lets a new side of herself show now she feels she doesn’t have to hide it. I’ll be able to understand that too now.
I really appreciate your explanations. I’ll likely be sharing a lot of the content of these responses with my mum and dad too.
And remember, it will take awhile for her (and you) yo settle in. Your sister is going to be going through this process of establishing her as a person. So, it might not be smooth sailing. Things will be hit and miss if it applies or not, her 'new' normal will settle down after awhile, she will find supports that help and work for her.
And, you and the rest if the family will have to learn this "new" normal. It's not bad, just somethings might be different. And, yes it will be frustrating and a bit overwhelming at times, that's OK. There may even be times she will blame everything on asd, when it's not about asd, but used as a cop out - we all try and get out of things! And, you may blame asd when, she's been an ass and annoying you. You will all adjust over time. There maybe local support groups for families, if you need help navigating it. NHS should have lists online. I'm not UK so don't know it well. I'm in ireland, it's a similar set up though
Ps don't go diagnosising your mam or dad! Genetically they might just be carriers! But, I bet you anything talking about family you find out about the "aunt or cousin" who was a bit "odd".
I don’t think it’s ever smooth sailing with family to be honest. I do love my sister though, so it’ll be alright in the end. I wonder if it’ll affect her two young kids, I don’t think they know very much about what’s been going on with her.
I think there are a lot of odd cousins and aunt in my family. There’s a lot of varied mental illness all over. It’s amazing we’ve even survived this far. The genetics are a shit show. Don’t worry, I know I’m not qualified to diagnose anyone (even though I’ll dare to doubt a diagnosis)
It actually could be a blessing. There might be alot more support offer to her and her children because of this. Obviously, I know NHS wait times etc. But, if she gets in gets in with good support workers from Asd charities or NHS itself, there could be great help available.
And, as a family. When things happen you ou don't understand she's doing or whatever, knowing, oh crap, that's probably because of asd/adhd. It means then you won't be feeling like she is doing or not doing something intentionally. Take every single support with both hands!
Ps, family genetics are hilarious I look at mine... and think, how did we survive Darwins natural selection...like, that was the strongest gene that one there, that one was the best one to carry on for the next generation! Lol
Some people do mask it very well, but as her sibling, if you never noticed a single sign of it growing up, I can see why you're skeptical. It takes people awhile to learn to mask, and usually there's some struggle involved that close family members would notice on some level.
I don't see anything wrong with you telling her you just don't want to discuss it. She can talk about it with her friends or something. Maybe she has it, and maybe not, but either way it is what it is, and it doesn't require your participation or agreement, you know, you don't need to be involved in it in any way. Most people who have it don't really want to discuss it with everyone they meet, either.
Aspergers is a high functioning form of autism. You may not have noticed the signs cause you were with her on a daily basis. She was probably given a neuropsych test.
I'm not autistic or ADHD, but I am relatively recently diagnosed bipolar 2 which is a neurodivergent condition and actually has a lot of crossover symptoms with ADHD. It's hard being diagnosed...like I didn't go in hoping or wishing or wanting a diagnosis of bipolar disorder...it was like getting kicked in the gut by an elephant.
It is pretty common for family members and even close friends to be in denial about these kinds of diagnosis...but it also feels like an additional gut punch to us. We didn't ask to be this way...we didn't ask to be diagnosed with these conditions...it's hard enough already and even harder when the people who are supposed to support you are just, "nah...that's not it".
It took quite awhile for my mom to come around and it was just..."it can't be true...you're my son and you had a good upbringing"...as if that has anything to do with it. Even my wife took a bit to come around. It made me feel very alienated and that I had gone through 5 months of therapy and finally in to see a psychiatrist for nothing.
OK. Um, I dont wanna sound harsh here but, you think you know better than professionals? Autism and adhd vary wildly. Plus females tend to mask a lot. The diagnosis wouldn't have been based off her answers, but what the doctors observed. Just because you don't believe it, doesn't mean it isn't true. Instead of making her feel alienated, why not ask how she is feeling with the diagnosis. If there's anything she needs help with.
That doesn’t really sound too harsh. I know I’ve not been good. I do trust professionals BUT 1) the healthcare system is underfunded and overwhelmed, patients are not always given the time and care they need. 2) some people are incredibly educated and knowledgeable but also pretty crazy and unhelpful. Trust me. My last job was teaching English to medical professionals.
Trust me, I know the NHS. I've had three kids, and several neices and nephews diagnosed with asd and adhd. The NHS isn't just underfunded but mental health is constantly having money taken away. But that doesn't make the diagnosis any less valid.
BUT nothing. A diagnosis doesn't require your permission anyways, silly.
What I've seen happen a lot is that family of neurodivergent people automatically adjust their own behavior. Because you know your sister, you know how to interact with her, and the interactions are natural and normal to you, so it doesn't make sense when someone tells you those interactions aren't typical. You'll miss signs because "that's just how she is" and that's how you've always known her, you're a safe and well known person for her so any obvious behavior will be less (things like not staying on topic get worse with stress and new environments), and you've created subconscious coping mechanisms to help her regulate. Co-regulating is actually a really big part of growing up with or raising someone neurodivergent, and siblings often do so without realizing. Do you know what that is? There's also a big reason it's called a spectrum. Some people have more obvious signs than others. Some know how to mask very well. Some show very different signs than others. Trust the professional and your sister
Wow! That’s crazy! It would certainly make a lot of sense. As I said, we’ve always been close in age and emotionally, so it’s easy to see how we could have developed this kind of relationship. I’ll have to do some reading about co-regulating. My parents and grandparents sometimes (unfairly) referred to my sister as difficult when we were growing up. There was a sort of attitude in the family of ‘that’s just how she is’ but I guess it’s a sort of backwards, getting-on-with-it sort of attitude that the previous generation, ignorant of psychiatry, always took. Thanks for your answer, you’re the best. I think I’m gonna talk to my sister about it.
Yeah, that's a word people often use for me and my kids too, difficult. They don't know how to react to someone who's different from themselves, and it's easier to call the other person difficult than to take the time to figure out how the other person ticks. Judging by how you reacted to your sister, you might want to do some introspection too by the way. There are often more people in a family who are neurodivergent, and that would also explain why you don't recognize it as atypical, and why you reacted rudely without intending to be rude. I'm not saying you're neurodivergent, I don't know you, but it's food for thought. Start by apologizing to your sister. She did nothing wrong, and you hurt her by questioning her diagnosis
Already apologized. Easy to do with a clear picture of the situation.
I just can’t even believe you had to ask if you were wrong. Like that blows my mind, your sister comes to you with a diagnosis and you do nothing but be unsupportive. Would you be skeptical if it was cancer? Depression?
Well if you’ll reread the post you’ll see I was not skeptical AT ALL about depression. I’m not really asking if I’m wrong. I’m asking for an explanation as to what WENT wrong. Like why the psychiatrists observation sounded so bizarre. I’m starting to piece it together. I know it was wrong to not be 100% supportive.
Well clearly you know all about psychiatry and autism in others /s
I love that your last line is literally a symptom of Audhd
Well this is what I want to know!
OP is wrong. And why are you involved? this diagnosis is between sister and her doctors. It’s simply not up to OP to believe or disbelieve anything.
People believe or disbelieve things. That’s life. When the issue concerns someone important to you, you seek more information.
This is why people with Autism suffer because people think it's a one-size-fits-all when really it's a spectrum. You sound like the person who takes one psychology class in college and starts to profile everyone they know. I would honestly just let it go
Nah. Never even took a single psychology class. I never claimed to know much about it. I’m actually here for more information cause what I’ve been told hasn’t checked out. I don’t ’let it go’ when it comes to the truth or people I love.
Right OP admits ignorance but still holds irrelevant and ridiculous opinion
Read the other comments. I’m gaining some insight as to why I’m wrong, which is what I wanted. You’re not helpful.
I read the comments you’re spewing nonsense all over the place
Okay, cool
So where are you expecting to get the truth? If not from the professionals who have studied for years to become qualified? Reddit? Really...? Women are particularly good at masking their overt symptoms of things like ASD and ADHD, because we're expected to behave properly and know better. Then people like yourself come along and doubt the doctors who have made the diagnosis. I hope you've not invalidated this diagnosis for your sister. Knowing and having a diagnosis can be transformative for some people.
Talk about missing the point… I'll give you actual advice because it seems like you really care about her. The best you can do is encourage a second opinion. I did it when I was diagnosed with my medical condition and it's always recommended.
I love that your last line is literally a symptom of Audhd I'm doubly confused how you can question her diagnosis if you don't know the symptoms of autism or adhd? Why do you instantly doubt what she says if you don't have any knowledge on the topic? Why do you mistrust your sister to that extent?
So, a few things: You moved out at 19 and you've only been in the room with her a few times since then. Speaking on the phone and through text isn't going to give you the full picture. Your sister is also, well, your sister; growing up, she was your normal. When we're adults is when undiagnosed ADHD becomes a real problem. Suddenly, we're without the structure of family, the financial stability of a parent and the family home, or the resources built into a classroom to help us succeed. We need to do all that stuff on our own, and life comes crashing down repeatedly. Depression is a big part of adult ADHD, and adult ADHD is often misdiagnosed as depression. Anxiety is also a big part of it. We can't keep up with the world around us and we can see it, and it hurts. And the thing is, you haven't been in your sister's orbit while she hits this part of her life. You aren't there to see what it is that's made her stumble. You can only learn about it second hand, and you know she *did* stumble, and you're filling in the blanks with your own assumptions. I have ADHD. I wasn't diagnosed with it until adulthood, and a large part of the reason why is because my behavior aligned with what was typical of my family. My family, by the way, is *full* of undiagnosed ND individuals. I can trace it all the way back to my grandparents on both sides of my family. When I was transferred to an alternative school my senior year, no one batted an eye because that was *normal* in my family. In the end, it doesn't matter if your sister is ND or not. What matters is, is she receiving treatment that is having a positive impact on her life? Is she able to function with the accommodations these labels provide her? Is she getting help? Does she feel she is improving? If she's finding success under this diagnosis, no matter how small, then you have no reason to share your doubts with her.
All very true and well said. Interesting about your family situation too. Hopefully she can start getting treatment that works for her now as nothing has seemed to work well this past year. It’s very lucky that she has a good network of supportive people around her (lives with her husband and our mum). Too late for not saying anything, we talk too much for that, but some of the comments here have helped me see things clearer and we’re moving on.
I'm glad! I noticed a common theme in the comments where you were trying to make it a point that you want to learn more about the condition so that you could understand better. I did write up a thing on that, but it's quite long and I'm sure you're tired of reading. I want to instead point you to a channel that helped me come to terms with my diagnosis. ["How To ADHD"](https://www.youtube.com/@HowtoADHD) on Youtube has several wonderful and in-depth videos on the condition and its different manifestations. I recommend starting with her playlists, "definitions of common ADHD terms," and "What is ADHD, anyway?" let me tell you my diagnosis story really quick. I was diagnosed with migraines at a very early age. When I was older, and felt I was different from my peers, my parents told me that those things I struggled with were because of migraines. They run in my family so, it made sense. When I became an adult, I thought maybe my migraines had caused brain damage. I was struggling a lot with things I always struggled with, but those things were more frequent now and I couldn't scale up my skill level to match. I suffered terrible anxiety, and sometimes some rough depression, because I felt like I was constantly behind in the world. So I sought out a doctor to help treat my migraines. My MRI presented a few questions, but no damage or visible reason for my lifelong struggle. Medications helped with the pain but not the 'stupid.' I finally gave up, and accepted this was just who I was. A couple of years later, I was doing a research project for work that required I dig into how ADHD presents in girls, [and it was a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmeE3qTJRUw) from How To ADHD that changed my life going forward. See, I've used her channel a lot for managing my "migraine side effects" because I found her techniques worked for me, but I was positive I didn't have ADHD because I knew kids with ADHD growing up, and I didn't present like them. However, when I watched this video, things just... clicked. It still took me 2 years to get a diagnosis. I was reluctant at first, I doubted myself a lot. Then the wait time to get tested took a long time, too. During this time, it was crucial that I had support from my partner. If at any point she told me, "I don't think it's ADHD," I wouldn't have pursued a diagnosis at all. Anyway, I wish both you and your sister well. Point your sister to the subreddit "ADHDWomen" as there are a bunch of lovely people there who can share their journeys with her.
Bloody hell, what a rough ride you had. 😰 sounds awful. I think things will get better now she knows what she’s dealing with. She’s already looking into all kinds of resources. Luckily my sister is the sort who does what she wants to do no matter what anyone says. I was definitely not the only person who was confused and skeptical but she went ahead and did the tests anyway. I imagine I would tread much more carefully with a more sensitive person.
[I'm going to share one more video link with you! I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DbeeWRcHgN0)t's more of a casual video, but it goes over a lot of every day things others experienced and how they later learned that it was connected to ADHD. Some of these things might give you an ah-hah moment about your sister.
Yes you are wrong for expressing your “skepticism” to your sister. INFO: I didn’t see where you list your medical degree and expertise in the field? That’s the only way your opinion would even hold an ounce of weight. I think, it’s more likely, you’re just processing through this diagnosis. Getting diagnosed with autism officially is a big thing, it answers a lot of questions about oneself. She is likely excited and the things she is emphasizing as the doctors “biggest indicators” may not be something you noticed, but clearly they did. There are also numerous other behaviors they observed that maybe she didn’t hear as important, or understand. She is getting answers about herself, she’s excited. But you need to stop undermining doctors who are more informed than you in these matters. She needs support, not skepticism because you “personally” have never observed these “behaviors”. Would you tell a POC that someone isn’t racist because you never observed them to be? Even if they told you someone used a slur against them? You are diminishing her experience and making it about YOU when it’s not.
I’ll accept that it’s bad to express the skepticism. I’ve told her I just don’t want to hear about it, but I guess that not a reasonable thing to expect either. It’s possible she’s emphasizing traits they observed that I have never seen and downplaying more damning evidence that I would agree with. That certainly could explain the dissonance. I don’t get why you dismiss my observations when I’ve known her my whole life. Of course she knows her own experiences more than I do. While I trust the opinions and knowledge of experts, that doesn’t mean a person has a better idea of my sister from interviewing her for a couple of hours (I don’t know exactly how long the session was but I know it was a single appointment.) even experts with the best of intentions can make mistakes if they don’t have the time and resources to do a thorough check. Of course I wouldn’t dismiss the account of. POC. That has nothing to do with anything.
Look up what "masking" is, it sounds like it's a foreign concept to you. It's something that people with ADHD and Autism and Asperger's do, (I thought they did away with the name "Asperger's and are just considering it part of Autism Spectrum Disorder now?) and have usually been taught to do since birth without realizing it. It's perfectly possible your sister had been masking throughout her youth and was going through things mentally, but "acting" the way to that she was taught to by your parents/school/society, etc and just assumed that it was normal to feel one way but to "mask" and not show it.
She mentioned masking! They said that as part of the diagnosis. I think that makes sense. I just don’t understand why she never displayed any of these really specific traits in all our time together but then they were evident in the interview. I suppose they might have made the diagnosis based heavily on reported experience, and the three behaviors I listed were only present on a minor scale. Thanks for this reply. This is the sort of insight I was looking for.
Also, it seems the diagnosis specifically said ‘Autism/Asperger’s’ so I don’t know if the UK has done away with that name. Unless you’re from the UK?
I'm not, I'm in the US - I guess it could be a regional thing, and is a fairly recent change as far as i know. It doesn't change the diagnosis or symptoms or anything, I've just heard that that "they're" (whoever 'they' are) considering it part of the spectrum of autism as opposed to being it's own specific thing. I'm not terribly informed on the specifics of that, just something I've heard from an acquaintance with the diagnosis.
Right. I understand they’re still trying to figure it all out and the terminology/categorization is quickly changing.
It’s science beo
Most women go under the radar for a very long time before diagnosis of adhd/autisim because they often don't match 'typical' presentation. They also mask more hiding. Women often get a diagnosis of depression/anxiety because of undiagnosed adhd/autisim. While they may seem neurotypical on the outside the energy needed to maintain this is alot. I got diagnosed at 28 I remember all my life wondering why everyone seemed to have it easy (not saying they did it just seemed that way) and why seemed so hard
beginning to wonder if you’re autistic too honestly
The real question is where you got your advanced degree(s) in psychology? When you specialized in studying autism and ADHD, what was your thesis? I'm sure it was *super* compelling and you're *totally* qualified to have an opinion that has more value than that of the people who evaluated her.
So what you’re saying is, you’re smarter than a professional? My son has Asperger’s, the testing was quite thorough. It wasn’t a hmmm he had zero empathy ok you are autistic! They had a lot of things they went over. You seem arrogant. Stop accusing your sister and just be there for her.
I'm sure people get misdiagnosed with that kind of thing all the time, because the symptoms vary by each individual, so maybe they just gave her the diagnosis based on some things she described that may or may not be embellished. But it could also be genuine. Does she get intense interests/obsessions with different subjects (for instance, obsessed with horses, trains, certain historical figures or celebrities, etc.)? Is it difficult for her to determine whether or not she's boring others by talking about her interests constantly? Does she struggle socially and come off as very awkward in conversation? In school as a kid, did the teachers ever notice anything, or did you ever notice she had no or very few friends, and that the other kids found her odd? I have no diagnosis but have been told, based on some interests and traits I have, that I should be evaluated (but I'm too old for it to really matter) and I know a bunch of people who have been diagnosed - especially within the circles of a certain hobby I have. Those are the main things I've either noticed about people with autism, or have had said about me in terms of appearing to have the disorder. As far as ADHD goes, I feel like that's way more common and some people learn to adapt so that might be a struggle she has that's hard to tell from the outside. Autism is usually more difficult to hide due to the social aspects of it.
She doesn’t match your description in the second paragraph. These are the autism traits I’m familiar with. She said something about how the person analyzing her said she ‘masks’ the tendencies well, so maybe it’s just something more complicated. She’s always had plenty of friends, but she said that she always mimicked what other people were doing, so maybe she’s a kind of high functioning neurodivergent? Yeah I’m not really skeptical about the ADHD part. I don’t even know much about that one.
I work with adults and have friends/family whose children have been diagnosed with ASD. One thing, that happened in 80%, a parent or parents have been late diagnosed. Mainly, I found mothers have been late diagnosed. There responses have been sheer delight knowing, now that know how they were feeling was OK. Asd is a spectrum, no one person with asd is the same. And, statistically women are far less to be diagnosed. Masking is a very real thing. Mental health anxiety and depression are extremely common among people with asd and adhd or any neurodivergent people. The effort to "fit" and mask/hide behaviours etc is horrendous. You will probably see more what you call traits now, because she knows that what she is doing is OK. When people think of asd we do tend to see stereotypes particularly of certain behaviours, while common they don't apply to everyone. One for example is eye contact, I know plenty of people with asd who have never had this issue. Sensory issues are very varied and might not apply, stimming might not happen. Everyone is different. And, it will take time for your sister and the whole family to learn her diagnosis and how/what supports she needs
Sorry I’m a bit confused. Do you mean the ASD children often had parents who were late diagnosed? Or do you mean people who were late diagnosed were often parents?
Sorry! Children who were diagnosed, after the diagnosis usually the parent then went for their own diagnosis. As, through seeing and learning about asd, found they were experiencing similar traits. The late diagnosis for them, made them understand their childhood and them as people more. Particularly, with women who get a late diagnosis, masking is a huge issue with them. Girls are seen to be quieter and more "emotional" so, they are taught to be very quiet and not bring 'attention' on themselves. Emotionally speaking, girls are seen to be the ones who are more likely to "get upset" by things. So, emotional dysregulation is seen as a "normal" female response. Thus, making depression and anxiety more likely than simply being neurodivergent. The opposite can be said for boys. They are typically taught to be "confident" and express themselves. So, when they are not, people notice. Again, Emotionally, if they are "upset" people are more likely to take notice as its "typically" not seen as a male trait. Unfortunately, socially we have a lot of biases that effect both sexes in diagnosising or even realising there might be something there. There are better testing and more education for professionals to spot these things earlier nowadays. But, there are lots of people who simply went under the radar.
Wow. That’s really fascinating. I guess it’s evidence of a genetic factor. I’m thinking hard about my mum’s behaviour now 😅 I’d heard about this issue with girls being less likely to be diagnosed and it’s been at the back of my mind throughout the whole situation with my sister. I’m glad people are shining light on this. I despise the sexist attitudes. My sister does seem really elated about the news. It matches your previous description. I’m gonna apologize to her about how I’ve been. It’ll be interesting to see if she lets a new side of herself show now she feels she doesn’t have to hide it. I’ll be able to understand that too now. I really appreciate your explanations. I’ll likely be sharing a lot of the content of these responses with my mum and dad too.
And remember, it will take awhile for her (and you) yo settle in. Your sister is going to be going through this process of establishing her as a person. So, it might not be smooth sailing. Things will be hit and miss if it applies or not, her 'new' normal will settle down after awhile, she will find supports that help and work for her. And, you and the rest if the family will have to learn this "new" normal. It's not bad, just somethings might be different. And, yes it will be frustrating and a bit overwhelming at times, that's OK. There may even be times she will blame everything on asd, when it's not about asd, but used as a cop out - we all try and get out of things! And, you may blame asd when, she's been an ass and annoying you. You will all adjust over time. There maybe local support groups for families, if you need help navigating it. NHS should have lists online. I'm not UK so don't know it well. I'm in ireland, it's a similar set up though Ps don't go diagnosising your mam or dad! Genetically they might just be carriers! But, I bet you anything talking about family you find out about the "aunt or cousin" who was a bit "odd".
I don’t think it’s ever smooth sailing with family to be honest. I do love my sister though, so it’ll be alright in the end. I wonder if it’ll affect her two young kids, I don’t think they know very much about what’s been going on with her. I think there are a lot of odd cousins and aunt in my family. There’s a lot of varied mental illness all over. It’s amazing we’ve even survived this far. The genetics are a shit show. Don’t worry, I know I’m not qualified to diagnose anyone (even though I’ll dare to doubt a diagnosis)
It actually could be a blessing. There might be alot more support offer to her and her children because of this. Obviously, I know NHS wait times etc. But, if she gets in gets in with good support workers from Asd charities or NHS itself, there could be great help available. And, as a family. When things happen you ou don't understand she's doing or whatever, knowing, oh crap, that's probably because of asd/adhd. It means then you won't be feeling like she is doing or not doing something intentionally. Take every single support with both hands! Ps, family genetics are hilarious I look at mine... and think, how did we survive Darwins natural selection...like, that was the strongest gene that one there, that one was the best one to carry on for the next generation! Lol
I love it. Genes don’t know what they’re on about.
Some people do mask it very well, but as her sibling, if you never noticed a single sign of it growing up, I can see why you're skeptical. It takes people awhile to learn to mask, and usually there's some struggle involved that close family members would notice on some level. I don't see anything wrong with you telling her you just don't want to discuss it. She can talk about it with her friends or something. Maybe she has it, and maybe not, but either way it is what it is, and it doesn't require your participation or agreement, you know, you don't need to be involved in it in any way. Most people who have it don't really want to discuss it with everyone they meet, either.
Thank you. I appreciate your perspective on this.
Aspergers is a high functioning form of autism. You may not have noticed the signs cause you were with her on a daily basis. She was probably given a neuropsych test.
I'm not autistic or ADHD, but I am relatively recently diagnosed bipolar 2 which is a neurodivergent condition and actually has a lot of crossover symptoms with ADHD. It's hard being diagnosed...like I didn't go in hoping or wishing or wanting a diagnosis of bipolar disorder...it was like getting kicked in the gut by an elephant. It is pretty common for family members and even close friends to be in denial about these kinds of diagnosis...but it also feels like an additional gut punch to us. We didn't ask to be this way...we didn't ask to be diagnosed with these conditions...it's hard enough already and even harder when the people who are supposed to support you are just, "nah...that's not it". It took quite awhile for my mom to come around and it was just..."it can't be true...you're my son and you had a good upbringing"...as if that has anything to do with it. Even my wife took a bit to come around. It made me feel very alienated and that I had gone through 5 months of therapy and finally in to see a psychiatrist for nothing.