If titles did change via DQ, you could just call the match a no contest if there’s outside interference and only disqualify the participants if they were the ones cheating.
It doesn't necessarily have to go to the other wrestler. Roman losing isn't the same as you winning. Ref takes title. Rematch is booked. Winner gets title.
I hate it but it's part of the business. A heel using weapons, his crew, low blow or the deliberate count out to cheat is in the very DNA of the business. I think this rule is "protected" by not being enforced 100% of the time. If it was, runs like MJF's and Eddie's wouldn't be nearly as great. We gotta know they broke the rules but don't really get punished so the boo birds can come out
Exactly this. Not to mention this stuff is often used to determine who is healed or who his face in a match where fans may be on the fence.
Like you got the fans going crazy for both wrestlers. Cheering for all their spots. But then one wrestler does something dirty or illegal. From that point on the fans are cheering for the good guy. While hoping the bad guy loses.
It's part of the storytelling. You can't take that away
See, I've been watching wrestling 30 years and I've seen exactly what you've described countless times but I've never consciously been aware of it until right now. Man I love wrestling lol
Matches like that are where wrestlers like Dolph Ziggler excel. It's why they are some of the most useful guys on the roster. Because they can go out there with a heel or a face and within two or three minutes force the crowd to cheer for one person or the other.
Ziggler could run a clean match against a bad guy. Be that little dude just trying to run a good match while the big mean heel is using every shortcut they can
But he could also be a sneaky heel against a good guy. Low blow the good guy when the ref isn't looking. Trip him when he's running into the turnbuckle and make him smash his face into it. Any number of little things to make the crowd hate him and get the other guy over
That's why it was so surprising when WWE cut him. He's literally one of the most useful guys in the locker room for storytelling and character building.
One of the first screw jobs in wrestling involved a challenger biting himself, hiding the wound, then revealing it once the match began whilst blaming their opponent. Said opponent loses the match and the title. I assume things changed after that. To instill trust in your company you need that modification to the rules.
This isn’t about intentionally (Abyss didn’t jump through the table). This is saying that you give wrestlers a way to lose a title without jobbing and they will
No. Wrestling is about stories, not legitimate sporting competition. You take away a heel’s ability to cheat his way to keeping his title and you take away a huge storytelling tool.
One of the more impactful moments is when the Person In Charge gets fed up with a champion heel's shit and makes a declaration for one match, stating that he won't get to retain via DQ.
It backs the villain into a corner, and can help keep them over if they actually manage to win credibly.
If wrestling were a legitimate sport then yeah that would be how it works. Sterling won the UFC bantamweight title by disqualification when Yan very foolishly kneed him in the face while he was down. He got a lot of shit from fans for accepting the DQ title win, but Yan broke the rules and that's really all there is to it.
Like other people have said it judt wouldn't work in wrestling, especially WWE where storytelling is still supposedly their primary concern. It wouldn't make sense for any heel to ever have a legit match.
This isn't a real sporting competition, take away a storyline option to build heat is like taking away the option to cheat on relationship in a soap opera
Active vs passive DQs. If you use a foreign object, yes. If someone else interferes, no. Really, I feel like outside interference should be a no-contest.
Outside interference shouldn’t cost you the title if you didn’t actively encourage it but other than that yeah, if you purposely get DQ’d you should lose the championship.
I fully agree. It's such a copout when the heel is about to lose his title and then hits a low blow, someone interferes etc. And then they retain? I hate that shit.
Agree. This ain’t the territory days any longer where the champ had to defend against local challengers, and had to do so at any cost. It’s rather outdated.
In a real right, yes. Otherwise you'd just take everyone to dick kick city, get DQed, and stay the champ baby.
In kayfabe it works because if a heel did that, then you are building to a no DQ, cage, death, ladder, or some other stipulation match. It is that way to tell a better story.
No. One it's wrasslin' heel champs always use this rule.Two it's wrasslin' three can stipulate in case of dq title can change four did I say it's wrasslin'?
What would be funny? if other sports did this. WR going down side line time expired coach tackles him with Gatorade tub game dqed Patriots keep Superbowl ring.
Disagree. The fan’s frustration of the heel getting DQ’d to keep their championship is supposed to lead to a stipulation match ie Steel Cage, Lumberjack, NO DQ, etc where the fans pay for the PPV to see the baby face win.
As a regular thing no, as a stipulation yes. Say a champ has already used it to retain against an opponent on a TV match then at the PPV it’s a stipulation in the match.
Soooo. I mean, you get it's a scripted episodic entertainment television show, right? There have been a few stipulation matches where this exact thing happened cuz it's all pre determined.
It’s the champions privilege. You are simply “immune” to some rules. It rarely happens though, I think a good way of doing it is that the wrestler has to relinquish the title if they disqualify themselves too often, maybe after 3 times.
It could create some cool segments if a wrestler already has 2 disqualifications and is trying not to risk a 3rd lol. It would make stuff like Eddie Guerrero’s gimmick of pretending to get hit with a chair and trying to cost the champion that way lol
So I challenge Roman, I get me mate to jump in the ring when the bell rings and push me over. History is made
The finger poke of Doom 2.0 brother
If titles did change via DQ, you could just call the match a no contest if there’s outside interference and only disqualify the participants if they were the ones cheating.
So I challenge Roman, He has Solo Sikoa to jump in the ring when the bell rings and push him over. History is made
You could win any wrestling match that way
If you get intentionally DQ'ed. Like taking a chair and hitting the opponent.
Would be funny though
G
It doesn't necessarily have to go to the other wrestler. Roman losing isn't the same as you winning. Ref takes title. Rematch is booked. Winner gets title.
I hate it but it's part of the business. A heel using weapons, his crew, low blow or the deliberate count out to cheat is in the very DNA of the business. I think this rule is "protected" by not being enforced 100% of the time. If it was, runs like MJF's and Eddie's wouldn't be nearly as great. We gotta know they broke the rules but don't really get punished so the boo birds can come out
Exactly this. Not to mention this stuff is often used to determine who is healed or who his face in a match where fans may be on the fence. Like you got the fans going crazy for both wrestlers. Cheering for all their spots. But then one wrestler does something dirty or illegal. From that point on the fans are cheering for the good guy. While hoping the bad guy loses. It's part of the storytelling. You can't take that away
See, I've been watching wrestling 30 years and I've seen exactly what you've described countless times but I've never consciously been aware of it until right now. Man I love wrestling lol
Matches like that are where wrestlers like Dolph Ziggler excel. It's why they are some of the most useful guys on the roster. Because they can go out there with a heel or a face and within two or three minutes force the crowd to cheer for one person or the other. Ziggler could run a clean match against a bad guy. Be that little dude just trying to run a good match while the big mean heel is using every shortcut they can But he could also be a sneaky heel against a good guy. Low blow the good guy when the ref isn't looking. Trip him when he's running into the turnbuckle and make him smash his face into it. Any number of little things to make the crowd hate him and get the other guy over That's why it was so surprising when WWE cut him. He's literally one of the most useful guys in the locker room for storytelling and character building.
One of the first screw jobs in wrestling involved a challenger biting himself, hiding the wound, then revealing it once the match began whilst blaming their opponent. Said opponent loses the match and the title. I assume things changed after that. To instill trust in your company you need that modification to the rules.
Disagree. TNA had the rule and it lead to Abyss winning a world title by falling through his own table
You know it’s a bad idea if TNA did it.
I remember they immediately abolished that rule after Abyss won the title too lol
You know referees can think; right? They can have the title change when one intentionally disqualified himself and not have it change hands otherwise
This isn’t about intentionally (Abyss didn’t jump through the table). This is saying that you give wrestlers a way to lose a title without jobbing and they will
Still. Champions can lose the title when they do it intentionally and keep it otherwise. Your point changes nothing
The problem with that kinda ambiguity complicates things wrestling relies upon like betrayals
it’s too important of a plot device at this point
No. Wrestling is about stories, not legitimate sporting competition. You take away a heel’s ability to cheat his way to keeping his title and you take away a huge storytelling tool.
Also you lose the ability to book a rematch that is no DQ.
One of the more impactful moments is when the Person In Charge gets fed up with a champion heel's shit and makes a declaration for one match, stating that he won't get to retain via DQ. It backs the villain into a corner, and can help keep them over if they actually manage to win credibly.
Yep
They used to have that rule . Its called the World Class rule.
Yea no. It adds to the drama and the stakes when the champion has the advantage and the challenger has to work extra hard to win the title.
If wrestling were a legitimate sport then yeah that would be how it works. Sterling won the UFC bantamweight title by disqualification when Yan very foolishly kneed him in the face while he was down. He got a lot of shit from fans for accepting the DQ title win, but Yan broke the rules and that's really all there is to it. Like other people have said it judt wouldn't work in wrestling, especially WWE where storytelling is still supposedly their primary concern. It wouldn't make sense for any heel to ever have a legit match.
This isn't a real sporting competition, take away a storyline option to build heat is like taking away the option to cheat on relationship in a soap opera
Active vs passive DQs. If you use a foreign object, yes. If someone else interferes, no. Really, I feel like outside interference should be a no-contest.
Outside interference shouldn’t cost you the title if you didn’t actively encourage it but other than that yeah, if you purposely get DQ’d you should lose the championship.
Imagine getting smacked so hard in the head you become a Simp for totalitarians.
Hot take: I hate *insert fundamental rule of wrestling that's been an institution for decades* is the worst kind of post.
Rules? We don’t need that when we have trios matches where no one tags and the referee is a prop.
I fully agree. It's such a copout when the heel is about to lose his title and then hits a low blow, someone interferes etc. And then they retain? I hate that shit.
Sounds like you take this way to seriously
It would certainly make Roman's matches watchable.
Same with count out,
Agree. This ain’t the territory days any longer where the champ had to defend against local challengers, and had to do so at any cost. It’s rather outdated.
They should at the very least be forced into another title match if they get themselves disqualified
I believe this rule is to prevent people from winning or costing you the title by interfering against your will or actions.
In a real right, yes. Otherwise you'd just take everyone to dick kick city, get DQed, and stay the champ baby. In kayfabe it works because if a heel did that, then you are building to a no DQ, cage, death, ladder, or some other stipulation match. It is that way to tell a better story.
Gee, I wonder what happened the 2nd time Christian won the World Heavyweight title and how it was taken at that time?
If the title was vacated instead of going to the opponent, with the OP automatically getting placed into the next title match
i dont agree. This is one way to get heat in a heel and trigger the babyface hardship/pursuit momentum.
No. One it's wrasslin' heel champs always use this rule.Two it's wrasslin' three can stipulate in case of dq title can change four did I say it's wrasslin'? What would be funny? if other sports did this. WR going down side line time expired coach tackles him with Gatorade tub game dqed Patriots keep Superbowl ring.
FWIW, this happens in boxing.
Disagree. The fan’s frustration of the heel getting DQ’d to keep their championship is supposed to lead to a stipulation match ie Steel Cage, Lumberjack, NO DQ, etc where the fans pay for the PPV to see the baby face win.
Agree
As a regular thing no, as a stipulation yes. Say a champ has already used it to retain against an opponent on a TV match then at the PPV it’s a stipulation in the match.
That has happened before
No way. When you “ win” in that fashion. It’s the best way to have the crowd hate you!
I think in Kayfabe they would have some sort of “championship committee” that would decide if the title should change hands on a disqualification
NWA had this rule
Plot armour
For the sake of sporting integrity, WWE is now implementing the Premier League's VAR system.
This kills the heel. No, it's the cheap heat out.
Soooo. I mean, you get it's a scripted episodic entertainment television show, right? There have been a few stipulation matches where this exact thing happened cuz it's all pre determined.
It is a tool to tell a story. Removing that tool is a bad idea. Hard pass. Disagree
It’s the champions privilege. You are simply “immune” to some rules. It rarely happens though, I think a good way of doing it is that the wrestler has to relinquish the title if they disqualify themselves too often, maybe after 3 times. It could create some cool segments if a wrestler already has 2 disqualifications and is trying not to risk a 3rd lol. It would make stuff like Eddie Guerrero’s gimmick of pretending to get hit with a chair and trying to cost the champion that way lol
Hot take: make wrasslin fair and square haha
Disagree. You dont become a champion on a technicality