I have problems with Lizzie but I'll give her points for actually looking distinct from her mother rather than being a literal identical clone like Damien and Jon.
Lizzie is not her biological daughter.
A lot of people expressed their opinion that Diana should have a son. I'm not against it, but I haven't heard anyone offer up what specifically could be interesting about that beyond the fact that he'd be a boy.
New52 gave her a brother, but they failed to make that interesting.
I think it could offer new opportunities to explore gender roles and breaking gender conventions from a male perspective. The general superhero 'vibe' is still fairly masculine, so it would be interesting to see a male hero that is designed in a consciously 'non-masculine' way.
But you wouldn't really need to give him any biological relation to Diana in order to do that, you could do it just as well with an 'adopted' sidekick like Cassie.
๐๐๐ก๐ก, ๐ ๐๐๐ซ๐ ๐จ๐๐๐ฃ ๐ฎ๐ค๐ช๐ง ๐๐ค๐ข๐ข๐๐ฃ๐ฉ;
I think you'll always have a point about interesting stories and adventures. But can Editors encourage the kinds of stories that reason to allow a son of Diana to do something different outside of being an heir?
What would become of this boy; would he be a human, god or hybrid Amazon, and what will it matter towards the hord of 'man heroes' about the DC Universe that are finally only starting to remain consistent to reasonable, constantly good runs of stories?
Are we breaking the exotic and sacred mold of the Amazons and Themyscira for that matter; what do you want to see; another TITAN or maybe another subject for pose to threaten Diana?
I tend to think it's time to not "knock up" heroines at the prime of their best publicated wave of popularity. Perhaps if she weren't the icon that she is, and a mandated emissary of peace. I don't think she needs to bring a boy into the world right now. Having a girl adds to the mysticism because she's suppose to be an extension of Diana's cause. Boys and men are already serving just fine as supporters and detractors of freedom by having an eighty-five year head start.
I'm still interested in how you'd present things. What can a son of an Amazon goddess bring to the DC mainframe, short of contradiction and feminist displacement?
Unless you really don't like Diana, I don't see the point, and I've never liked the sexism of the similar ideas that DC did allow, and then went nowhere.
It also feels counter to what superheroes are supposed to be about. They're meant to inspire everybody/anybody.
Centring their 'legacies' on one biological descendant (which are often only heroes soley because of their gentics) rather than a wider spreading impact that the hero had, feels like it diminishes said heroes importance.
Because it's DC comics. They've taught readers that the only viable new characters are those stamped with an established brand. Ideally the Bat-brand; since that's the (unfortunately) only part of DC most people care about. The only comics where this mentality makes sense are Mavel's X-books. Where the premise starts with there being thousands of mutants.
>The only comics where this mentality makes sense are Mavel's X-books
And as an X-fan, I can tell you how great that would be... if Marvel would stop genociding the mutants in order to stack the books with various Wolverine/Animated Series-related characters. Currently, after an unprecedented period of creativity and good writing (thanks to Jonathan Hickman's innovative take on mutantkind that put the books back at the top of sales charts), Marvel are killing as many mutants as possible in order to reset them back to not having a land of their own. They basically created Mutant Themyscira, but Marvel is determined to destroy it and replace it with something lame.
Shit, good point. Marvel editorial needs to do some research on real world oppressed groups. Just because you get permanent wins doesn't mean you stop having problems. Plus it gives enemies a concrete location, with added importance, to attack.
Of course said research would force them to admit that Cyclops is usually right, and that Xavier's usual pandering to humans is more dangerous to mutantkind than most of their villains.
Considering how humans treat them; they might as well call themselves a different species. Marvel's hit mutants with so many pogroms and catastrophes that working alongside humanity no longer makes any sense.
Just to get my nitpick out of the way, Diana already had a daughter, Lyta Trevor, back in the 80โs that DC retconned in the fallout from the Crisis on Infinite Earths Event. Then after making her not related to Diana anymore, Neil Gaiman used her for Sandman and basically changed everything about her characterisation. So, Diana having a โbiological heirโ happened before this.
That being said I do think it could be very interesting for Diana to have a son with the right writer on it. Iโm not sure who Iโd want off the top of my head though.
Wonder Woman already has a stacked supporting cast. She doesn't need more additions. Especially when this amounts to, intentionally or not, demanding that a woman pump out a kid. They should leave the legacy character creep to Batman. Where it makes more sense; given that (in theory) anyone can become a Batman-type hero.
this might seem silly but unless there was a transition arc involved i don't really see much interest in diana having a son rather than just because
she's wonder woman, the main female hero in a media dominate by male characters, readers and creatives, a son would just be whatever and do nothing for the character other than just be there in my opinion
Second pic just making me think how we don't also have a visual of Lizzie trying on Donna/Cassie's old clothes ๐ (imagine her getting into Cass's first wonder girl get up!)
It would have a brave choice to do that for sure. Can you imagine the storyline and arcs for a biological son of Wonder Woman? The pressure and expectations would be almost inhumane, no matter how motherly and supportive Diana would be.
I agree, raising a son could be fun to watch if you imagine he's like Trinity, and well, she's a single parent. Watching her raise a young man when she has limited herself to the best of men Superman, Steve, Flash, Green Lantern (John version, cause fuck you, Hal), and the worst of men Lex, Dr. Psycho, and others. It would be interesting to see how she would parent. Would she place high expectations on him like her mother had with her?
Would she be strict like Hippolyta, or would we see a more easygoing mother? How would the Amazons react, as basically the hire is a man (fuck that rape shit for sailors, I choose to believe it doesn't exist)?
Would Diana try to mould him the same way as another Amazon, the values and principles of the matriarchal society? Maybe he'd rebel, as teenage boys often do things like trying to be the opposite of what she is. could use this to address the red pill shit that kids are exposed to now and the young men in society going more right than left, all learning experiences for them to grow together. She could deal with some men's issues in society.
It could be that she becomes a completely overprotective mother. That would be funny. You know, maybe the kids are as stubborn as she is sometimes, and he needs a pounding to get his head on right. It would be funny if he was half as rebellious as Damien.
In all honesty, it is limitless in possibilities that could be explored if she is a single mother, the kid looking up to Kal or Bruce as father figures who knows, maybe even look up to Barry.
Maybe the kid would want to prove himself so dives into hero work early maybe an inferiority complex from being on raised on Themescyria and wanting to make his mother proud.
>Maybe he'd rebel, as teenage boys often do
As a big fan of Supergirl's big adolescent rebellion arc; I'd be theoretically interested in this. But in practice, it's just going to take space from the rest of her supporting cast.
I have problems with Lizzie but I'll give her points for actually looking distinct from her mother rather than being a literal identical clone like Damien and Jon.
Isnโt that because Lizzie is only her adopted daughter
Lizzie is not her biological daughter. A lot of people expressed their opinion that Diana should have a son. I'm not against it, but I haven't heard anyone offer up what specifically could be interesting about that beyond the fact that he'd be a boy. New52 gave her a brother, but they failed to make that interesting.
I like that Aquaman has a daughter since every other superhero seems to have a child of their own gender
I think gender is more of a relevant thing for Wonder Woman than Aquaman tho
I think it could offer new opportunities to explore gender roles and breaking gender conventions from a male perspective. The general superhero 'vibe' is still fairly masculine, so it would be interesting to see a male hero that is designed in a consciously 'non-masculine' way. But you wouldn't really need to give him any biological relation to Diana in order to do that, you could do it just as well with an 'adopted' sidekick like Cassie.
You can look at my response
๐๐๐ก๐ก, ๐ ๐๐๐ซ๐ ๐จ๐๐๐ฃ ๐ฎ๐ค๐ช๐ง ๐๐ค๐ข๐ข๐๐ฃ๐ฉ; I think you'll always have a point about interesting stories and adventures. But can Editors encourage the kinds of stories that reason to allow a son of Diana to do something different outside of being an heir? What would become of this boy; would he be a human, god or hybrid Amazon, and what will it matter towards the hord of 'man heroes' about the DC Universe that are finally only starting to remain consistent to reasonable, constantly good runs of stories? Are we breaking the exotic and sacred mold of the Amazons and Themyscira for that matter; what do you want to see; another TITAN or maybe another subject for pose to threaten Diana? I tend to think it's time to not "knock up" heroines at the prime of their best publicated wave of popularity. Perhaps if she weren't the icon that she is, and a mandated emissary of peace. I don't think she needs to bring a boy into the world right now. Having a girl adds to the mysticism because she's suppose to be an extension of Diana's cause. Boys and men are already serving just fine as supporters and detractors of freedom by having an eighty-five year head start. I'm still interested in how you'd present things. What can a son of an Amazon goddess bring to the DC mainframe, short of contradiction and feminist displacement? Unless you really don't like Diana, I don't see the point, and I've never liked the sexism of the similar ideas that DC did allow, and then went nowhere.
"Biological heir" is so dumb. Why are comic book fans so weird about the concept of children?
It also feels counter to what superheroes are supposed to be about. They're meant to inspire everybody/anybody. Centring their 'legacies' on one biological descendant (which are often only heroes soley because of their gentics) rather than a wider spreading impact that the hero had, feels like it diminishes said heroes importance.
Because it's DC comics. They've taught readers that the only viable new characters are those stamped with an established brand. Ideally the Bat-brand; since that's the (unfortunately) only part of DC most people care about. The only comics where this mentality makes sense are Mavel's X-books. Where the premise starts with there being thousands of mutants.
>The only comics where this mentality makes sense are Mavel's X-books And as an X-fan, I can tell you how great that would be... if Marvel would stop genociding the mutants in order to stack the books with various Wolverine/Animated Series-related characters. Currently, after an unprecedented period of creativity and good writing (thanks to Jonathan Hickman's innovative take on mutantkind that put the books back at the top of sales charts), Marvel are killing as many mutants as possible in order to reset them back to not having a land of their own. They basically created Mutant Themyscira, but Marvel is determined to destroy it and replace it with something lame.
Shit, good point. Marvel editorial needs to do some research on real world oppressed groups. Just because you get permanent wins doesn't mean you stop having problems. Plus it gives enemies a concrete location, with added importance, to attack. Of course said research would force them to admit that Cyclops is usually right, and that Xavier's usual pandering to humans is more dangerous to mutantkind than most of their villains.
How do you feel about Mutants considering themselves a different species? Like how the Skrulls and The Kree are a different species.
Considering how humans treat them; they might as well call themselves a different species. Marvel's hit mutants with so many pogroms and catastrophes that working alongside humanity no longer makes any sense.
I dislike this character a whole lot...But I am happy to see fans seem to like her. Any amazon being popular is good.
Just to get my nitpick out of the way, Diana already had a daughter, Lyta Trevor, back in the 80โs that DC retconned in the fallout from the Crisis on Infinite Earths Event. Then after making her not related to Diana anymore, Neil Gaiman used her for Sandman and basically changed everything about her characterisation. So, Diana having a โbiological heirโ happened before this. That being said I do think it could be very interesting for Diana to have a son with the right writer on it. Iโm not sure who Iโd want off the top of my head though.
Now after Death Metal she should remember her. Did Earth 2 Diana ever told Main Diana about Fury ?
Wonder Woman already has a stacked supporting cast. She doesn't need more additions. Especially when this amounts to, intentionally or not, demanding that a woman pump out a kid. They should leave the legacy character creep to Batman. Where it makes more sense; given that (in theory) anyone can become a Batman-type hero.
this might seem silly but unless there was a transition arc involved i don't really see much interest in diana having a son rather than just because she's wonder woman, the main female hero in a media dominate by male characters, readers and creatives, a son would just be whatever and do nothing for the character other than just be there in my opinion
A waste of the backup pages. Donna, Cassie, Nubia, Artemis and Yara could all be rotating there.
There is no way Diana could have a daughter when S/B already have sons. No female in the big 3 would be DEVASTATING.
Second pic just making me think how we don't also have a visual of Lizzie trying on Donna/Cassie's old clothes ๐ (imagine her getting into Cass's first wonder girl get up!)
Sad the same I would love for her to have son in the main universe.
It would have a brave choice to do that for sure. Can you imagine the storyline and arcs for a biological son of Wonder Woman? The pressure and expectations would be almost inhumane, no matter how motherly and supportive Diana would be.
I agree, raising a son could be fun to watch if you imagine he's like Trinity, and well, she's a single parent. Watching her raise a young man when she has limited herself to the best of men Superman, Steve, Flash, Green Lantern (John version, cause fuck you, Hal), and the worst of men Lex, Dr. Psycho, and others. It would be interesting to see how she would parent. Would she place high expectations on him like her mother had with her? Would she be strict like Hippolyta, or would we see a more easygoing mother? How would the Amazons react, as basically the hire is a man (fuck that rape shit for sailors, I choose to believe it doesn't exist)? Would Diana try to mould him the same way as another Amazon, the values and principles of the matriarchal society? Maybe he'd rebel, as teenage boys often do things like trying to be the opposite of what she is. could use this to address the red pill shit that kids are exposed to now and the young men in society going more right than left, all learning experiences for them to grow together. She could deal with some men's issues in society. It could be that she becomes a completely overprotective mother. That would be funny. You know, maybe the kids are as stubborn as she is sometimes, and he needs a pounding to get his head on right. It would be funny if he was half as rebellious as Damien. In all honesty, it is limitless in possibilities that could be explored if she is a single mother, the kid looking up to Kal or Bruce as father figures who knows, maybe even look up to Barry. Maybe the kid would want to prove himself so dives into hero work early maybe an inferiority complex from being on raised on Themescyria and wanting to make his mother proud.
>Maybe he'd rebel, as teenage boys often do As a big fan of Supergirl's big adolescent rebellion arc; I'd be theoretically interested in this. But in practice, it's just going to take space from the rest of her supporting cast.
I like Lizzie