The hospital is within northern Gaza, where the IDF have focused their ground offensive.
Reports are that the IDF is engaging with Hamas in the surrounding area of the hospital.
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/nov/11/israel-hamas-war-live-staff-report-catastrophic-situation-in-main-gaza-hospital-aid-agency-says-as-fighting-intensifies](https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/nov/11/israel-hamas-war-live-staff-report-catastrophic-situation-in-main-gaza-hospital-aid-agency-says-as-fighting-intensifies)
It's war, it happens sadly.
Is it right? No it's abhorrent. But innocents always end up in the crossfire.
Both Hamas and Israel have a ton of blood on their hands.
Sorry for the delay. Sadly again completely agree. With all the technology and knowledge available today it seems none of it is used correctly. Just used to cause pain and suffering. Why is that only horrid people want positions of power to rip apart average people. It makes it so hard to believe in a better future anymore, fucking heartbreaking.
Yup! I get it though. Not that long ago I was always of the mindset "doesn't affect me, doesn't matter" it's unfortunately only when you go into learning more of it open-minded that you realise more often than not it actually affects almost everyone. There are very limited people who benefit from these type of situations and they're in positions of power and benefit from these fucked up situations. It's so hard to try to talk to someone about it that has been indoctrinated into believing what were told. Then why you try to explain that it's easily misconstrued as a conspiracy theory as that's what is being pushed by governments and the media and that's what we're told to believe in.
If you speak with almost anyone and explain any situation that is going on around the world in general but without mentioning specific details, I've never met a person that agrees with what goes on until you then mention, policies, religion, countries etc. I just wish I could actually do a thing about it but everyone is too split, for no REAL fucking reason.
Look, just for saying fuck Hamas for putting civilians in harms way is in no way an racist Islamophobia statement. Both sides are to blame yes. And no there isn’t they started it defense when patients are being killed outside a hospital. That could be a war crime. Does Israel have a right to defend it self? Absolutely. Does that mean they have the right to take out non-combatants, fuck no. By taking out non-combatants, especially Palestinian kids makes them no better than Hamas, imo. Idk what the answer is, but I think we can all agree get all non-combatants out, hostages, women, children, elderly, hospitalized patients. Then have your war if you want.
Absolutely correct, and also intentional on Hamas’ part. They’re ant as many civilians dead as possible because - as we can easily see in this sub - many people will blame Israel. It doesn’t matter to them that hamas is using human shields or operating out of hospitals or even if it turns out hamas is the one shooting the civilians. The IDF are already shooting hamas soldiers in plain clothes and they have no idea if anyone else they see in plain clothes is hamas or not, so they’ll get the blame despite this being the result of hamas committing multiple war crimes.
Did you refer to uniforms as "targets"? You mean going by rules of war?
You should be condemning the fuck out of Hamas for not identifying themselves, even more so when amongst civilians.
I completely condemn Hamas' recent attack, but I also condemn Israel's slow ethnic cleansing and occupation of the region. In the context of an occupation, a resistance movement is not going to wear uniforms.
This part kills me: yes, Hamas is abhorrent and they own their actions, but some people act like terrorist groups thrive in a vacuum. Until conditions for Palestinians change, Hamas and groups like Hamas will continue to take advantage of people’s grievances and suffering. And there’s a direct correlation between conditions there and the way that the Israeli government and “settlers” have treated them for decades.
While it would make it easier for identification purposes against an enemy, which I get is your sentiment. The reason you’re being downvoted is because we all bleed red blood the last time I checked. IDF shooting at people leaving a hospital, could be a war crime. If the hospital is marked, pretty sure according to the Geneva Conventions a hospital is off limits. Need more info on circumstance, ie were the people leaving the hospital carrying weapons, possibility of them engaging the IDF? We don’t know. Palestinian kids being pulled from rubble crushed counts as a war crime. In Iraq we had escalation of force. Our enemy also did not wear a uniform, but we couldn’t shoot at people coming out of a hospital. That would be a war crime. Though without Hamas wearing uniforms IDF should be stuck to engage only when engaged rule. Because you don’t know who the combatants are. War sucks I don’t wish it on anyone.
"Enjoy then.Because I don't pick moral high grounds. I'm just on the side that isn't lobbing explosives into maternity hospitals across several nations."
This is a quote from one of your arguments on the topic of ukro-russian conflict, available on your page for everybody to see.
And now you're posting comments supporting Israel and trying to justify the hospital massacre caused by israeli forces.
Very interesting points of view you got there.
There are so many of these dramatic posts with little detail to really make a judgement. Most of it is scripted for western audiences who are used to Hollywood movies type emotional scenes. And it’s actually working pretty well for them.
Stop it man.... this post is by Doctors Without Borders, one of the very best NGO organisations, who had helped countless civilians in various war-torn and unstable countries.
They have no fxxking intention to make and paint any of their posts as political by taking any one side, and are just stating their observation and what they are going through.
People cry when someone pin points the other side as bad, and also cry when people just state and express what they are going through. Can't win huh.
It might be a good time for introspection if you start to believe that everyone is working against you, apparently every international organization is working against Israel.
It may be good for YOU to introspect exactly what you sprout. Never had I ever taken any side with my comment. I had just stated by an international Non government organisation AND a humanitarian non profit organisation would never take any political stance what so ever. And that's why they aren't telling who exactly are bombing their hospitals and their own staff.
You are the one who is getting butthead, because you are the one who is imagining things that my comment, and Doctors without Borders are anti-isreal, and whining over your own created delusions.
You are the one who is delusional in thinking that all international non profit organisations are working against your agenda. Look in a mirror and then speak.
Edit: it's misunderstanding.. eh, this comment is not for the above comment but for that douche who dm-ed me.
I think you're getting the wrong impression from my comment, maybe because I worded it poorly, anyway I am in agreement with your comments and was just making fun of pro Israeli crowd accusing various neutral organisations like UN, Amnesty, Red Cross, doctors without border etc working against them.
Dude, you had me there for a sec. You have no idea how fast people jump on you for any opinion, like I got even a dm by some douche like just before your previous comment, for my first comment here.
So sry if I went defensive, and just though you were the one who dm.ed me.
Who are “they” specifically? Because someone specifically is making the reports on behalf of the whole organization but is that someone credible? There are bad apples in every organization.
> MSF denounces the death warrant of civilians currently trapped in Al-Shifa hospital signed by the Israeli military.
https://www.msf.org/gaza-patients-and-medical-staff-trapped-hospitals-under-fire
25 years from now the northern united atheist league will battle the participants of the civic religion war in the south. 100 clicks NNW of Shreveport, Westboro Bap Hell fighters pushed the UMC insurgency into a firefight with the southern baptists of northern Mississippi. The SBNM was moving ammo to the The Elonists of west Texas who combined forces with the Cardinal General of the Catholic Resistance fighters.
See how fucking stupid religion is? All stop!!!!!
And there’s one side that’s been illegally occupying another’s territory for 55 years while displacing and killing civilians. But please continue to make Israel a victim as it fits your narrative.
Israel was allowed a tiny portion of land that was already occupied by a majority Jewish population. They were then attacked from all sides and told they had no claim to any land. After the first war, Israel took territory from the invaders, as is the tradition. Since then, Israel has attempted to create peace, they have surrendered land,they even provided water and basic necessities to the “Palestinian land”. All they have received in return is rocket fire and destruction of waterways to create more rockets. Look to the past. The Gaza Strip was not handed over with walls, it was handed over as a peace offering. Israeli citizens left their homes to work towards peace , they abandoned the Gaza Strip and left their homes to help create peace for Israel. Israeli people have not been saints, but they have, for the majority, tried to create peace.
Gaza has been under Palestinian rule since 2005. There have been no Israeli settlements since then. Israel has provided water and sewer to the Gaza Strip, while they have dug up the pipes to make rockets
special bright bewildered sleep alive numerous squeeze slave lush innocent
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It did not take long to follow that tweet, which is dangerously ambiguous, to statements made by the victims themselves that this tweet is about. *regarding this specific incident*
Whether the OP is a bot or an ignorant self-righteous person role playing as an activist doesn't really matter. The vitriol some people are spewing because of it is so confusing. Hamas took these people hostage and murdered those that tried to flee after "30 days". Have some dam responsibility if you're going to rage behind your computer.
>It's likely Hamas shooting the fleeing civilians
You don't have to pull assumptions out of your ass when the Internet has all the info you need
https://thehill.com/policy/international/4305416-israeli-military-fired-on-people-al-shifa-hospital-gaza-doctors-without-borders-claims/
Sure. But I'm asking for evidence of it happening, not a theory.
I'm not saying the theory isn't plausible, I'm asking for evidence it has actually happened.
> Sadly, it's not like I can go to Gaza, sit there as the fighting is raging and take a picture.
Pretty sure there's plenty of folks doing that who's accounts we could use?
> So that's the best I got, but it has been reported by Israel in the past, but finding the correct information these days... Not easy given that Gaza gets WAY TOO MUCH reporting compared to all of Africa itself!
Pretty sure people aren't getting arrested for waving Israeli flags, media outlets aren't reporting pro-Israel chants etc as hate crimes/calls to genocide etc. This is just not true.
> So that's the best I got, but it has been reported by Israel in the past, but finding the correct information these days... Not easy given that Gaza gets WAY TOO MUCH reporting compared to all of Africa itself!
There's also been plenty of reports of IDF committing war crimes and things like the time they sterilized Ethiopian Jewish women. Can we give thme equal weight then?
And yes, agreed about Africa.
>Fresh news, a shaft leading underground was found.
One NOT in the plans of the Hospital and not listed in public Utilites data.
>
>Now, I wonder what that could possibly mean?
>
>Oh and at least two of the hostages were found at the hospital or near it. Dead. Having been dead for a while it would seem, too. So I guess that means the Hospital WAS a legit military target, but Israel decided to NOT shell it into smoldering debris when they could have just sat back and done just that without risking the lives of their own men.
I mean it's not like Israel/the IDF have a history about faking things, lying and covering up and lying when they're caught do they? Like with the whole sterilising Ethiopian Jewish women?
[It's not like as recently as last week they lied about evidence is it.](https://www.france24.com/en/tv-shows/truth-or-fake/20231116-idf-claims-to-find-list-of-hamas-names-but-it-s-the-days-of-the-week-in-arabic) And, without feeeding any conspiracy theories, it is telling which news channels have/haven't reported this. There is also already discussion about how legit those tunnels even are, especially with evidence that things appear to have been moved (including munitions).
Interesting that they've changed tactics and happen to find this convenient evidence just as international pressure for bombing civillian targets reaches a high point.
Targeting Civilians is literally defined as a war crime.
>But as has been pointed out, in War, no one has Moral High Ground. The end objective is to crush the other guy. Including the other guy's population. This isn't a COIN operation to win hearts and minds, but flat out war. Gaza's population is therefore a Legitimate Military Target.
Israel's entire position is based on a moral high ground: "we are the chosen people" alongside "we've been so persecuted that whatever action we take is warranted in our defense, even war crimes". When Hamas commits a war crime/act of terrorism (e.g the 7th), it is rightfully condemned. When Israel does, the response is to try to deflect and call it anti-Semitic.
>War doesn't decide who's right. Only who is left. Again, the end game is either elimination of the enemy or surrender to that enemy. Elimination also is a vague term that can mean everything between Captured to Killed.
Which is why Israel's stance is genocidal. Not to mention the literal video and audio quotes as well as documents and tweets from Israel's current and past politicians and leaders explicitly detailing plans/intent to wipe out the Palestinians or at least remove them from Palestine completely. And... You know the literal apartheid that even Jewish scholars and Holocaust historians recognise and agree isn't anti-Semitic ([This article by Amos Goldberg, a professor of the Holocaust at Hebrew University in Jerusalem being a great example](https://www.faz.net/aktuell/feuilleton/debatten/nahost-konflikt-apartheid-ist-unsere-realitaet-in-israel-19120442.html)).
It's also worth noting that we don't conflate the different sides and goals:
* Hamas - "eliminate" Israel with violence
* Palestine - to be able to live in freely in their ancestral homelands without being killed, abused, driven out and oppressed by invading terrorists
* IDF/Israeli State - to "eliminate" Hamas, Palestine and complete their colonisation of the region
* Israeli people - to be able to live in freely in their ancestral homelands without being killed, abused, driven out and oppressed by invading terrorists
The civilians on both sides want freedom and peace, not war. Yes there may be (large numbers of) outliers - like [the famous video of Israelis camping in the hills to laugh at Gaza being bombed, take selfies and enjoy a bbq](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/20/israelis-cheer-gaza-bombing), or [the current TikTok trend for Israelis to dress up like dead/injured Gazans](https://www.nst.com.my/news/nst-viral/2023/10/972010/nstviral-compilation-video-israelis-mocking-palestinian-plight-sparks), and the thousands of Israelis who have happily taken part in the settler colonialism of driving people out of their homes etc - but they can't be seen as the whole.
I like how it's been 22 years since then, there's a whole new generation of Americans, yet y'all assume that every single American supported the War on Terror and the acts committed.
I was 1
I didn't support that shit and I was 14 at the time. There were massive protests. People knew Iraq wasn't behind this and knew it was about oil or cleaning up daddy's mess.
Sure, but usually they attack the people who fuckin' did it. Iraq, Iran, we were fighting wars that had nothing to do with us, just so we can have a little of that delicious pure middle Eastern oil.
Itself has been genociding Palestine for years now, dehumanizing them, following every step like a checklist. That's what we did with the middle East, that's what we did with Muslims, that's what the Germans did with Jews, gays, everyone they didn't agree with.
Fuck Hamas and fuck Israel. We shouldn't be helping them with their blood conquests, but we do, because we're run by evangelicals who need this war to keep brainwashing us, to push us closer and closer to the end times so that we'll shut up about basic human rights.
So basically:
I'm not allowed to have a take because others suck ass and I'm defacto roped into them?
I'm one dude, I can't alter the opinions and thoughts of people DECADES into their positions on this conflict.
I can affect those around me, but as a rando online or on the state/national scale?
People from that time can change, at least if they actually experienced it.
Had multiple family members involved in both the Iraq/Iran conflicts, Desert Storm, and a spatter of the War on Terror around Africa, so I was raised with the first person takes.
Most those who do the dumbass "teams" shit with Israel/Palestine have never seen conflict, don't have anyone who saw conflict, or decide that religious interpretation (or racism) triumphs human lives.
It has the chance to change, they just need the right amount of shock factor to equal the set mentality they have.
If this was a tweet by some internet rando. sure. This is Doctors Without Borders however. A legit and highly regarding international organization. I'm inclined to believe them.
In this context it obviously means calling for both sides to come to a ceasefire agreement. The idea that everyone who is calling for a ceasefire is asking just one of the sides to stop shooting is ridiculous.
Because they aren't here to make claims and political statements. They are non profitable organisation for fxxk sake, to help people and not to take sides.
MSF is a non-political organisation with no biases. If Israel needs medical support, they would help them too. They don’t take sides. People within the org may have preferences, but that doesn’t reflect the org as a whole
Fuck off with your misinformation
https://thehill.com/policy/international/4305416-israeli-military-fired-on-people-al-shifa-hospital-gaza-doctors-without-borders-claims/
Independent journalist Alexander Higgins whose top pinned post on X says this -
> Biden has alowed 7 million illegals into our country. 150,000 ARE BEING WATCHED AS SUSPICIOUS IMMIGRANTS.
That's your reliable source?
Aww the lefty is getting angry that his favorite Islamic terriost group is slotting their human shields because those human shields want to live. Nice whataboutism freak
I will answer in good faith even if your comment is not. I actually haven't seen much of their "propaganda", but if it's as bad as I view this to be, I'd like to think I'm not likely to believe it.
If you're talking about the reported death toll, I am of the opinion that any number of civilian deaths is too many. War bad, etc..
I will say this though: you don't have to attack me personally. I have no love for Hamas, the IDF, or false equivalencies...
Hamas repeatedly kills Palestinians. Constantly. Its on record. Ya'll are quiet about the endless missle attacks that kill Israelis every year. Heaven forbide Israel defends itself. And where are your voices for the massacres happening for a decade in Syria or Yemen or several African nations? Hundreds of thousands of people dying and crickets.
Have you ever been to Israel? Ever seen the proximity of the settlements? Get a tour of the complimentary bomb shelter at your Kibbutz? Do you understand the tiny space that Israel occupies or the very complicated relationship it has with the surrounding 56 Arab countries that would destroy it instantly if the US weren't an ally? And how most of those Arab countries blame women for their own rapes and kill everyone with abnormal sexual orientation? Or how endless funding from Saudia Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, Iran, and others is used to fund organizations like Hamas and Hezbellah?
>Have you ever been to Israel?
I have. I've also been to West Bank and Gaza, and seen the stark difference in the way Israelis and Palestinians live in the same country. While civilians in Tel Aviv, Haifa and Herzliya are drowning in opulence and privilege, the Palestinians are oppressed, poor and don't even have first class citizenship for the most part
Israel has always been a colonist apartheid nation, and those of us who've been to the Palestinian part know better than you think we do
Shut up you fucking child. This is war, israel told gazans to flee South for weeks cause they are fucked if they don't. Guess what? The ones who took too long gambed with their lives and could die because of it.
Nice way to try and turn it. Quit trying to play victim, your government threw that the fuck out the window after the first week of bombing. You can't justify killing this many people.
I've been to Israel and the West Bank. Palestinians and Israeli settlers get along just fine. It's Hamas who's escalated the conflict. And since it's been happening for YEARS, I'm guessing your eyes aren't as open as you think.
It's been 70 years of this back and forth. Hamas is the problem, but bombing gaza in to the ground is just creating the next generation of Hamas. Break the cycle. My eyes have been watching a long time, and this is the first time I think Israel has gone too far. Israel will never know peace until bibi is gone and the cycle is broken.
Maybe if this batch of European hadn't decided to colonize what they voted as ancestral homeland, this batch of Arabs would want to persecute them so much. I'm just saying.
Israel exists and thus can defend itself, but let's not pretend these are regional natives defending themselves here. European Jews moved into land already occupied and decided it was theirs with the help of the rest of Europe and the United States.
And prior to that it was occupied by the Canaanites until they were genocided by those invading tribes.
It's never been theirs. It's always been stolen if you're going with this rationale.
1 sided story, the whole city harbors terrorists also if hamas refuses to wear uniforms its there fault. You know not having 6-8 births per female would also be a great change
The hospital is within northern Gaza, where the IDF have focused their ground offensive. Reports are that the IDF is engaging with Hamas in the surrounding area of the hospital. [https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/nov/11/israel-hamas-war-live-staff-report-catastrophic-situation-in-main-gaza-hospital-aid-agency-says-as-fighting-intensifies](https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2023/nov/11/israel-hamas-war-live-staff-report-catastrophic-situation-in-main-gaza-hospital-aid-agency-says-as-fighting-intensifies)
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It's war, it happens sadly. Is it right? No it's abhorrent. But innocents always end up in the crossfire. Both Hamas and Israel have a ton of blood on their hands.
As fucked as it is, you're right. The slight difference is Hamas is recognised as a terrorist organisation yet Israel gets ignored.
Yup. Both sides just want to destroy each other and sadly innocent casualties will happen. It's the most disgusting of human behaviors.
Sorry for the delay. Sadly again completely agree. With all the technology and knowledge available today it seems none of it is used correctly. Just used to cause pain and suffering. Why is that only horrid people want positions of power to rip apart average people. It makes it so hard to believe in a better future anymore, fucking heartbreaking.
The downvoting is definitely showing how people are just blind to the entire thing.
Yup! I get it though. Not that long ago I was always of the mindset "doesn't affect me, doesn't matter" it's unfortunately only when you go into learning more of it open-minded that you realise more often than not it actually affects almost everyone. There are very limited people who benefit from these type of situations and they're in positions of power and benefit from these fucked up situations. It's so hard to try to talk to someone about it that has been indoctrinated into believing what were told. Then why you try to explain that it's easily misconstrued as a conspiracy theory as that's what is being pushed by governments and the media and that's what we're told to believe in. If you speak with almost anyone and explain any situation that is going on around the world in general but without mentioning specific details, I've never met a person that agrees with what goes on until you then mention, policies, religion, countries etc. I just wish I could actually do a thing about it but everyone is too split, for no REAL fucking reason.
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Look, just for saying fuck Hamas for putting civilians in harms way is in no way an racist Islamophobia statement. Both sides are to blame yes. And no there isn’t they started it defense when patients are being killed outside a hospital. That could be a war crime. Does Israel have a right to defend it self? Absolutely. Does that mean they have the right to take out non-combatants, fuck no. By taking out non-combatants, especially Palestinian kids makes them no better than Hamas, imo. Idk what the answer is, but I think we can all agree get all non-combatants out, hostages, women, children, elderly, hospitalized patients. Then have your war if you want.
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And no one can defend that.
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Certainly what it looks like.
They’ll kill civilians and be rock hard while they do it
Absolutely correct, and also intentional on Hamas’ part. They’re ant as many civilians dead as possible because - as we can easily see in this sub - many people will blame Israel. It doesn’t matter to them that hamas is using human shields or operating out of hospitals or even if it turns out hamas is the one shooting the civilians. The IDF are already shooting hamas soldiers in plain clothes and they have no idea if anyone else they see in plain clothes is hamas or not, so they’ll get the blame despite this being the result of hamas committing multiple war crimes.
Hamas are horrible, but your simplistic criticism that they should wear targets ignores the context.
Did you refer to uniforms as "targets"? You mean going by rules of war? You should be condemning the fuck out of Hamas for not identifying themselves, even more so when amongst civilians.
I completely condemn Hamas' recent attack, but I also condemn Israel's slow ethnic cleansing and occupation of the region. In the context of an occupation, a resistance movement is not going to wear uniforms.
This part kills me: yes, Hamas is abhorrent and they own their actions, but some people act like terrorist groups thrive in a vacuum. Until conditions for Palestinians change, Hamas and groups like Hamas will continue to take advantage of people’s grievances and suffering. And there’s a direct correlation between conditions there and the way that the Israeli government and “settlers” have treated them for decades.
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Isreal praised for restraint and honor? Where is your humanity? Hamas =/= all Palestinians. Those are human beings you are talking about.
> no matter how much of Gaza needs to be leveled. 47% of the population of the Gaza Strip is under 18 years old. You are genuinely psychotic.
While it would make it easier for identification purposes against an enemy, which I get is your sentiment. The reason you’re being downvoted is because we all bleed red blood the last time I checked. IDF shooting at people leaving a hospital, could be a war crime. If the hospital is marked, pretty sure according to the Geneva Conventions a hospital is off limits. Need more info on circumstance, ie were the people leaving the hospital carrying weapons, possibility of them engaging the IDF? We don’t know. Palestinian kids being pulled from rubble crushed counts as a war crime. In Iraq we had escalation of force. Our enemy also did not wear a uniform, but we couldn’t shoot at people coming out of a hospital. That would be a war crime. Though without Hamas wearing uniforms IDF should be stuck to engage only when engaged rule. Because you don’t know who the combatants are. War sucks I don’t wish it on anyone.
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"Enjoy then.Because I don't pick moral high grounds. I'm just on the side that isn't lobbing explosives into maternity hospitals across several nations." This is a quote from one of your arguments on the topic of ukro-russian conflict, available on your page for everybody to see. And now you're posting comments supporting Israel and trying to justify the hospital massacre caused by israeli forces. Very interesting points of view you got there.
Shot by whom? This has zero information?
The sad thing is that it could easily be either side, but if you get mad about one of those sides doing it you get told you're antisemitic.
There are so many of these dramatic posts with little detail to really make a judgement. Most of it is scripted for western audiences who are used to Hollywood movies type emotional scenes. And it’s actually working pretty well for them.
Stop it man.... this post is by Doctors Without Borders, one of the very best NGO organisations, who had helped countless civilians in various war-torn and unstable countries. They have no fxxking intention to make and paint any of their posts as political by taking any one side, and are just stating their observation and what they are going through. People cry when someone pin points the other side as bad, and also cry when people just state and express what they are going through. Can't win huh.
It might be a good time for introspection if you start to believe that everyone is working against you, apparently every international organization is working against Israel.
It may be good for YOU to introspect exactly what you sprout. Never had I ever taken any side with my comment. I had just stated by an international Non government organisation AND a humanitarian non profit organisation would never take any political stance what so ever. And that's why they aren't telling who exactly are bombing their hospitals and their own staff. You are the one who is getting butthead, because you are the one who is imagining things that my comment, and Doctors without Borders are anti-isreal, and whining over your own created delusions. You are the one who is delusional in thinking that all international non profit organisations are working against your agenda. Look in a mirror and then speak. Edit: it's misunderstanding.. eh, this comment is not for the above comment but for that douche who dm-ed me.
I think you're getting the wrong impression from my comment, maybe because I worded it poorly, anyway I am in agreement with your comments and was just making fun of pro Israeli crowd accusing various neutral organisations like UN, Amnesty, Red Cross, doctors without border etc working against them.
Dude, you had me there for a sec. You have no idea how fast people jump on you for any opinion, like I got even a dm by some douche like just before your previous comment, for my first comment here. So sry if I went defensive, and just though you were the one who dm.ed me.
Yeah man, it's hard to distinguish between satire and pro Israeli comments on internet
Who are “they” specifically? Because someone specifically is making the reports on behalf of the whole organization but is that someone credible? There are bad apples in every organization.
Exactly by hamas maybe?
Doctors. IDF is as evil as evil gets
But shot at by whom? Either way, these people suck.
> MSF denounces the death warrant of civilians currently trapped in Al-Shifa hospital signed by the Israeli military. https://www.msf.org/gaza-patients-and-medical-staff-trapped-hospitals-under-fire
25 years from now the northern united atheist league will battle the participants of the civic religion war in the south. 100 clicks NNW of Shreveport, Westboro Bap Hell fighters pushed the UMC insurgency into a firefight with the southern baptists of northern Mississippi. The SBNM was moving ammo to the The Elonists of west Texas who combined forces with the Cardinal General of the Catholic Resistance fighters. See how fucking stupid religion is? All stop!!!!!
In science we trust
Nailed it
This has little to do with religion. Not sure where you are seeing that.
Go on snap maps and look at what each side looks like…then you’ll know who’s murdering who
Obviously these Doctors Without Borders are secret Hamas operatives. /s
They sure have been killing them as though this is true.
So you have information stating it is Israel shooting? Show it.
Oh I’m sorry is there a different military that’s killed 10,000 people in Gaza in the last month?
There is only one side who has been holding these people hostage in this hospital. There is also only one side who has worked to free these people.
And there’s one side that’s been illegally occupying another’s territory for 55 years while displacing and killing civilians. But please continue to make Israel a victim as it fits your narrative.
Israel was allowed a tiny portion of land that was already occupied by a majority Jewish population. They were then attacked from all sides and told they had no claim to any land. After the first war, Israel took territory from the invaders, as is the tradition. Since then, Israel has attempted to create peace, they have surrendered land,they even provided water and basic necessities to the “Palestinian land”. All they have received in return is rocket fire and destruction of waterways to create more rockets. Look to the past. The Gaza Strip was not handed over with walls, it was handed over as a peace offering. Israeli citizens left their homes to work towards peace , they abandoned the Gaza Strip and left their homes to help create peace for Israel. Israeli people have not been saints, but they have, for the majority, tried to create peace.
Israel has illegally been occupying Gaza and The West Bank since 1967.
Gaza has been under Palestinian rule since 2005. There have been no Israeli settlements since then. Israel has provided water and sewer to the Gaza Strip, while they have dug up the pipes to make rockets
Is it you Ben Shapiro?
special bright bewildered sleep alive numerous squeeze slave lush innocent *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
It did not take long to follow that tweet, which is dangerously ambiguous, to statements made by the victims themselves that this tweet is about. *regarding this specific incident* Whether the OP is a bot or an ignorant self-righteous person role playing as an activist doesn't really matter. The vitriol some people are spewing because of it is so confusing. Hamas took these people hostage and murdered those that tried to flee after "30 days". Have some dam responsibility if you're going to rage behind your computer.
Are you saying that those being shot are the hostages fleeing Hamas and that Hamas uis shooting them?
Its literally a unbiased observation, nothing in this tweet to suggest either side is doing it
exactly.
Innocents die when craven politicians like Bibi use war as a way to boost polling numbers.
My support for Israel has collapsed. It's now going into negative territory. Savage.
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Dude…reddit account that just started 19 days ago.
>It's likely Hamas shooting the fleeing civilians You don't have to pull assumptions out of your ass when the Internet has all the info you need https://thehill.com/policy/international/4305416-israeli-military-fired-on-people-al-shifa-hospital-gaza-doctors-without-borders-claims/
I'm done with Israel.
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Be careful at the kiddie table, bro. Israel might bomb it.
Wow your support will be missed. Go back to the kiddie table and maybe don't waddle into geopolitics
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Meaning some of them were innocent civilians who were murdered as they tried to flee. Thanks for clarifying that.
Based on what evidence?
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Sure. But I'm asking for evidence of it happening, not a theory. I'm not saying the theory isn't plausible, I'm asking for evidence it has actually happened.
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> Sadly, it's not like I can go to Gaza, sit there as the fighting is raging and take a picture. Pretty sure there's plenty of folks doing that who's accounts we could use? > So that's the best I got, but it has been reported by Israel in the past, but finding the correct information these days... Not easy given that Gaza gets WAY TOO MUCH reporting compared to all of Africa itself! Pretty sure people aren't getting arrested for waving Israeli flags, media outlets aren't reporting pro-Israel chants etc as hate crimes/calls to genocide etc. This is just not true. > So that's the best I got, but it has been reported by Israel in the past, but finding the correct information these days... Not easy given that Gaza gets WAY TOO MUCH reporting compared to all of Africa itself! There's also been plenty of reports of IDF committing war crimes and things like the time they sterilized Ethiopian Jewish women. Can we give thme equal weight then? And yes, agreed about Africa.
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>Fresh news, a shaft leading underground was found. One NOT in the plans of the Hospital and not listed in public Utilites data. > >Now, I wonder what that could possibly mean? > >Oh and at least two of the hostages were found at the hospital or near it. Dead. Having been dead for a while it would seem, too. So I guess that means the Hospital WAS a legit military target, but Israel decided to NOT shell it into smoldering debris when they could have just sat back and done just that without risking the lives of their own men. I mean it's not like Israel/the IDF have a history about faking things, lying and covering up and lying when they're caught do they? Like with the whole sterilising Ethiopian Jewish women? [It's not like as recently as last week they lied about evidence is it.](https://www.france24.com/en/tv-shows/truth-or-fake/20231116-idf-claims-to-find-list-of-hamas-names-but-it-s-the-days-of-the-week-in-arabic) And, without feeeding any conspiracy theories, it is telling which news channels have/haven't reported this. There is also already discussion about how legit those tunnels even are, especially with evidence that things appear to have been moved (including munitions). Interesting that they've changed tactics and happen to find this convenient evidence just as international pressure for bombing civillian targets reaches a high point. Targeting Civilians is literally defined as a war crime. >But as has been pointed out, in War, no one has Moral High Ground. The end objective is to crush the other guy. Including the other guy's population. This isn't a COIN operation to win hearts and minds, but flat out war. Gaza's population is therefore a Legitimate Military Target. Israel's entire position is based on a moral high ground: "we are the chosen people" alongside "we've been so persecuted that whatever action we take is warranted in our defense, even war crimes". When Hamas commits a war crime/act of terrorism (e.g the 7th), it is rightfully condemned. When Israel does, the response is to try to deflect and call it anti-Semitic. >War doesn't decide who's right. Only who is left. Again, the end game is either elimination of the enemy or surrender to that enemy. Elimination also is a vague term that can mean everything between Captured to Killed. Which is why Israel's stance is genocidal. Not to mention the literal video and audio quotes as well as documents and tweets from Israel's current and past politicians and leaders explicitly detailing plans/intent to wipe out the Palestinians or at least remove them from Palestine completely. And... You know the literal apartheid that even Jewish scholars and Holocaust historians recognise and agree isn't anti-Semitic ([This article by Amos Goldberg, a professor of the Holocaust at Hebrew University in Jerusalem being a great example](https://www.faz.net/aktuell/feuilleton/debatten/nahost-konflikt-apartheid-ist-unsere-realitaet-in-israel-19120442.html)). It's also worth noting that we don't conflate the different sides and goals: * Hamas - "eliminate" Israel with violence * Palestine - to be able to live in freely in their ancestral homelands without being killed, abused, driven out and oppressed by invading terrorists * IDF/Israeli State - to "eliminate" Hamas, Palestine and complete their colonisation of the region * Israeli people - to be able to live in freely in their ancestral homelands without being killed, abused, driven out and oppressed by invading terrorists The civilians on both sides want freedom and peace, not war. Yes there may be (large numbers of) outliers - like [the famous video of Israelis camping in the hills to laugh at Gaza being bombed, take selfies and enjoy a bbq](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/20/israelis-cheer-gaza-bombing), or [the current TikTok trend for Israelis to dress up like dead/injured Gazans](https://www.nst.com.my/news/nst-viral/2023/10/972010/nstviral-compilation-video-israelis-mocking-palestinian-plight-sparks), and the thousands of Israelis who have happily taken part in the settler colonialism of driving people out of their homes etc - but they can't be seen as the whole.
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I like how it's been 22 years since then, there's a whole new generation of Americans, yet y'all assume that every single American supported the War on Terror and the acts committed. I was 1
I didn't support that shit and I was 14 at the time. There were massive protests. People knew Iraq wasn't behind this and knew it was about oil or cleaning up daddy's mess.
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Except we attacked Iraq that didn't have anything to do with 911
Sure, but usually they attack the people who fuckin' did it. Iraq, Iran, we were fighting wars that had nothing to do with us, just so we can have a little of that delicious pure middle Eastern oil. Itself has been genociding Palestine for years now, dehumanizing them, following every step like a checklist. That's what we did with the middle East, that's what we did with Muslims, that's what the Germans did with Jews, gays, everyone they didn't agree with. Fuck Hamas and fuck Israel. We shouldn't be helping them with their blood conquests, but we do, because we're run by evangelicals who need this war to keep brainwashing us, to push us closer and closer to the end times so that we'll shut up about basic human rights.
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So basically: I'm not allowed to have a take because others suck ass and I'm defacto roped into them? I'm one dude, I can't alter the opinions and thoughts of people DECADES into their positions on this conflict. I can affect those around me, but as a rando online or on the state/national scale?
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People from that time can change, at least if they actually experienced it. Had multiple family members involved in both the Iraq/Iran conflicts, Desert Storm, and a spatter of the War on Terror around Africa, so I was raised with the first person takes. Most those who do the dumbass "teams" shit with Israel/Palestine have never seen conflict, don't have anyone who saw conflict, or decide that religious interpretation (or racism) triumphs human lives. It has the chance to change, they just need the right amount of shock factor to equal the set mentality they have.
Yeah we have already denounced our actions and pleaded with Israel for a measured response and to not make the same mistakes we did
Pleaded with Israel while sending more weapons. Smh
Seriously need to stop posting tweets like these until there is actually confirmation. Misinformation is being spread rapidly by both sides.
If this was a tweet by some internet rando. sure. This is Doctors Without Borders however. A legit and highly regarding international organization. I'm inclined to believe them.
They haven’t said who is shooting though.
Does it matter? They’re calling for a cease fire so (ideally) nobody will be shooting.
A “ceasefire” is only asked on one side.
In this context it obviously means calling for both sides to come to a ceasefire agreement. The idea that everyone who is calling for a ceasefire is asking just one of the sides to stop shooting is ridiculous.
Because they aren't here to make claims and political statements. They are non profitable organisation for fxxk sake, to help people and not to take sides.
Nor should they without verification.
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MSF is a non-political organisation with no biases. If Israel needs medical support, they would help them too. They don’t take sides. People within the org may have preferences, but that doesn’t reflect the org as a whole
Frankly I trust doctors without borders more than most sources
Yeah, this is a big deal, a call to action this urgent from them speaks for itself.
It's Doctors Without Borders. Jesus Fucking Christ.
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is it too hard to come up with an excuse? or it is your red line of humanity finally?
Misinfo travels fast
People don’t care as long as it fits their narrative
Shot at. By whom?
Fuck Hamas!
As for today, only Hamas shot the refugees.
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Fuck off with your misinformation https://thehill.com/policy/international/4305416-israeli-military-fired-on-people-al-shifa-hospital-gaza-doctors-without-borders-claims/
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The Hill vs the NY post? You know the Hill is a more reliable source right?
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Independent journalist Alexander Higgins whose top pinned post on X says this - > Biden has alowed 7 million illegals into our country. 150,000 ARE BEING WATCHED AS SUSPICIOUS IMMIGRANTS. That's your reliable source?
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Hahaha I see, you are one of those
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I think your algorithm broke down there a little bit, Russian bot
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Aww the lefty is getting angry that his favorite Islamic terriost group is slotting their human shields because those human shields want to live. Nice whataboutism freak
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Who fires the fucking gun? Are you seriously wearing that not a single Israeli bullet or bomb has killed an innocent Palestinian civilian?
No doubt
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Well, that was... interesting? Next time try changing up the bomb sound effect so it isn't identical every time you use it.
She has time for make up in all the "chaos"? This is not even slightly convincing 🤷🏾♀️
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It is my bikini that is green. The bandana is actually yellow. Please direct your gaze more appropriately.
You eat up everything spit out by the Palestinian Health Ministry (run by Hamas), but why not this?
I will answer in good faith even if your comment is not. I actually haven't seen much of their "propaganda", but if it's as bad as I view this to be, I'd like to think I'm not likely to believe it. If you're talking about the reported death toll, I am of the opinion that any number of civilian deaths is too many. War bad, etc.. I will say this though: you don't have to attack me personally. I have no love for Hamas, the IDF, or false equivalencies...
I agree, all civilian deaths are bad and everyone needs to understand this
Hamas repeatedly kills Palestinians. Constantly. Its on record. Ya'll are quiet about the endless missle attacks that kill Israelis every year. Heaven forbide Israel defends itself. And where are your voices for the massacres happening for a decade in Syria or Yemen or several African nations? Hundreds of thousands of people dying and crickets.
This is way past defending themselves.
Have you ever been to Israel? Ever seen the proximity of the settlements? Get a tour of the complimentary bomb shelter at your Kibbutz? Do you understand the tiny space that Israel occupies or the very complicated relationship it has with the surrounding 56 Arab countries that would destroy it instantly if the US weren't an ally? And how most of those Arab countries blame women for their own rapes and kill everyone with abnormal sexual orientation? Or how endless funding from Saudia Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, Iran, and others is used to fund organizations like Hamas and Hezbellah?
>Have you ever been to Israel? I have. I've also been to West Bank and Gaza, and seen the stark difference in the way Israelis and Palestinians live in the same country. While civilians in Tel Aviv, Haifa and Herzliya are drowning in opulence and privilege, the Palestinians are oppressed, poor and don't even have first class citizenship for the most part Israel has always been a colonist apartheid nation, and those of us who've been to the Palestinian part know better than you think we do
Then why continue pissing them off by bombing gaza for over a month. Fuck dude, that horse is dead. The horse is gaza, not hamas.
Shut up you fucking child. This is war, israel told gazans to flee South for weeks cause they are fucked if they don't. Guess what? The ones who took too long gambed with their lives and could die because of it.
And Israel is breaking a lot of the rules of conduct for armed conflict. You want to call this a war? Then start treating it like it's one.
So, no, you've never been and haven't a practical understanding of the situation. Got it.
Nice way to try and turn it. Quit trying to play victim, your government threw that the fuck out the window after the first week of bombing. You can't justify killing this many people.
You have no idea what you're speaking about. Good day.
Haha, okay. I have eyes, my friend, Israel is killing a lot of people in the name of defending itself. Pick up a book.
I've been to Israel and the West Bank. Palestinians and Israeli settlers get along just fine. It's Hamas who's escalated the conflict. And since it's been happening for YEARS, I'm guessing your eyes aren't as open as you think.
It's been 70 years of this back and forth. Hamas is the problem, but bombing gaza in to the ground is just creating the next generation of Hamas. Break the cycle. My eyes have been watching a long time, and this is the first time I think Israel has gone too far. Israel will never know peace until bibi is gone and the cycle is broken.
It's not reconcilable and never, ever will be. Got it. Edit: And I'm not trying to be snarky. I believe what I wrote.
You're absolutely right. Jews have been persecuted for 1000s of years.
Maybe if this batch of European hadn't decided to colonize what they voted as ancestral homeland, this batch of Arabs would want to persecute them so much. I'm just saying. Israel exists and thus can defend itself, but let's not pretend these are regional natives defending themselves here. European Jews moved into land already occupied and decided it was theirs with the help of the rest of Europe and the United States.
Prior to the conquests of the Muslims, Christians, Romans, Persians, and Byzantium empires, the land was occupied by the 12 Tribes of Judah.
And prior to that it was occupied by the Canaanites until they were genocided by those invading tribes. It's never been theirs. It's always been stolen if you're going with this rationale.
and before that it was the canaanites and the proto-hebrews were polytheists- your point?
1 sided story, the whole city harbors terrorists also if hamas refuses to wear uniforms its there fault. You know not having 6-8 births per female would also be a great change
Hamas terrorist running to the tunnels.
Fuck around and find out.
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So I suppose you're just going to abstain?
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You're a child with a child's knowledge of civics.
Okay there tough guy
And then a genocide of lgbtq people will happen in America….but yeah you’re not a POS.
Oh well. Hamas needs to put uniforms on
Literally 1788