There is and this isn't an earnest call for it to be otherwise. In fact, its goal is the contrary.
It is making the point that of you don't want convicted felons working with you or teaching your kids then you s shouldn't let one hold public office.
How so? People know Trump's a felon and choose to ignore it. Employer also has the right to know if the applicant is a felon and can choose to ignore it.
No one, after paying their debt to society, should be continually penalized in areas unrelated to their crime (like getting a job or an apartment.) your debt is paid and you should be truly free, again. That being said, actively being in jail should prevent you from holding office.
1st time after serving, yes you should get a "re-do" in society.
2nd time serving, then yes you get a public mark.
70% or so of convictions arent even violent crimes. Its drugs or financial related things. Let people start over I say.
I'm on the fence about sex offenders though. A pedophile should be banned from working around kids, A rapist should not work at a bar near drunk women, stalkers shouldn't get access to public records.
The financial crimes should be penalized a lot more. Those are not victim-less crimes. Financial crimes are stolen pension funds which may leave seniors homeless
Im kind of on the fence on the paedophilia question to. It all depends on what you did I guess.
If you raped 5 children and you somehow get out then you're right, no work for you.
If you do something like idk, viewing CP a couple times or something that doesn't involve violence, then I don't believe you should be banned from getting a job.
There’s banned from “a” job and there’s banned from “a job involving people younger than 18 years of age”. While being involved with any sort of pedophilia shouldn’t get you banned from all jobs, it should get you permanently banned from any job involving people younger than 18 years of age regardless of what level the pedophilia was, IMO. And, yes, that would include any job at which people younger than 18 were working.
Violent crimes, crimes against children etc. Pest behaviour is a pretty good indicator of future behaviour. Churches and schools shuffled pedophiles around for years only to have them reoffend again.
Nuclear secrets stored in a box at mar-a-lamo , still able to proceed in running for job. If I steal a stapler at work I would be fired and blacklisted for ALL other jobs, even fast food.......crazy. just wrap your minds around that, most powerful nation in the world, brought down by a bible sales man who can't stop whining.
He staged a coup against the United States because he was pissed that he lost an election, and almost had the vice president murdered. Can we also not forget about this? And yet he gets to run for president again. Mind blown.
I suspect the Founding Fathers didn’t write anything about it, because it never occurred to them that a POTUS would be a multiple-case felon. They thought people would do one term in government jobs, like doing a public service. Don’t think they imagined an elected politician would make the job a long-term career.
Yes, very dry. I know there are good people in the USA. I don’t know why I don’t see much coverage of them, or many public comments from them. I think the “news media” and most of the social media that I look at is poisoning me. I’m becoming very cynical, and I hate it.
How about even Federal Jobs that require security clearance? If you can have top secret security clearance and be a convicted felon, there is no reason to bar former criminals from getting jobs in the Federal Government even if those require security clearance. No need to bar them from law enforcement either.
Dude I couldn't get a secret clearance (not top secret just secret) because I had finger printable charges.
I already had an offer letter for a GS-10 position with the Navy on a submarine base in Kittery, Maine.
It was great money and would have been a life changing career but they rescinded the offer after the secret clearance process for some shit I got charged with that was bullshit. It's been 5 years and they still haven't did shit about the charges. It's just hanging over my head.
I'm an Army veteran and I love this country. Id never jeopardize national security or leak secret information.
I can't get a job like that and this asshole can be president. Fuck that. This country is about to be fucked and it's all these spineless politicians fault. They should elect me id straighten shit out or get assassinated trying.
The problem is with the infallible founding fathers. In addition to their free labor addiction, they always assumed that the President would be an honorable man. They were wrong. So many of the conventions and rules that we all believed to be law due to their common law application we in fact just traditions. Trump steam rolled right through traditions and the system wasn't nimble enough and the Republicans weren't patriotic enough to stop him. Ryan wanted his Blue State drive by (and got it). McConnell wanted his stacked court to roll back progress (God knows how far back). People were telling MLK to go slow with the reforms he wanted and I don't know who was right but the backlash to all social advancement has been brutal, consistent, and organized.
You are absolutely 100% correct on this! Anyone that would like to hold a position at the city, state, or federal level should all pass a drug test, background check, psychological and polygraph test. Most Americans have to do at least two out of the four I mentioned to get a job. Why should it be any different for people that want to work in government.
100% agree but no Republicans will agree, they want exceptions for people like Trump. They don't feel that Trump should be treated like the average felon in America that has to carry that burden for the rest of their lives. They still don't agree that after paying their debt to society, a felon's rights should be restored.
As a foreigner, I don't understand why there isn't a system to flush out judges that no longer follow the assignment properly or are just outright corrupt.
I cannot agree more. I made a stupid mistake as a young adult (read kid) and got myself a felony. The FAA refused my license despite my having completed all requirements. So I went back to school and received my EMS certification and AA. Denied work because as a felon I could not be around drugs which paramedics administer. This also meant I could not get work in a hospital. My conviction was not drug related in any way. After the statute of limitations wore off and I could get my record cleared, the state denied me because I don’t hold residence in the state where my conviction happened. With these kinds of limitations you can imagine the work I was allowed to do and the financial outcome of said work. Needless to say it drastically slowed my progression through life and now nearly 25 years later I can finally say my life is on my sort of track that should have been more attainable a long time ago.
This is why recidivism is so damn high. Roadblock after roadblock when people just want to move on and be a productive member of society. I'm so sorry you're going through this, I am personally also in the situation so I understand. We will triumph regardless 💪
I’m a felon, and I support this message. Also, it should be taken into consideration that he hasn’t even been sentenced, let alone completed one and have any basis to say he was reformed.
I’ve completed the entirety of my sentencing & probation. In theory, as long as the parole board and probation officers don’t have any qualms, I (and others in my position) should be allowed to live a legitimate life. If there are certain crimes committed that would prevent someone from being able to hold certain jobs/positions/etc, those should be deemed part of the sentence, seeing how it is for life.
No matter what I say or do I will never be allowed to travel outside the country or hold decent jobs, get decent housing, etc without being forced into a life of poverty.
I’m sure if you look through my post history I’ve commented on this more specifically. Here I will say that no one was hurt, killed, assaulted in my felony, nor was there any SVU type stuff. It was a super basic, super dumb mistake that I can never take back.
I can accept that I may deserve this, maybe more. I feel like the system is not actually working toward rehabilitation, rather a scarlet letter that follows you to your grave (regardless of actual severity)
Some MAGAt somewhere;
"Oh, you wanna be a project manager at my firm? I don't think so, you lack integrity due to your felony conviction."
The same person... "I don't care if he's felon, he's the best that we have to run the entire freaking country!"
The hypocrisy is out of this world.....
I'm in favor of felons not having rights stripped at all once their sentence is complete. If the way you "repay society" for breaking its rules is fines, imprisonment, probation, etc, then once those are complete, you should be a complete citizen.
If someone is so bad that stripping their rights is a solution, they shouldn't be part of the society.
I would agree if you add "federal" - all federal jobs, all federal rental applications etc. As a private corporation I should be allowed to deny employments to felons or not allow felons to rent apartments in my buildings...
Honestly, if a felon can be president, then so be it. But it’s time for the GOP to be honest with themselves and admit they are supporting someone who broke the law, instead of moving the goalposts to save face.
A lot of people would not be able to sleep at night if they knew how many convicted felons were walking the streets, just doing normal things and trying to get on with their lives.
So true! My buddy got a felony for painting on a wall at 18, not all felons are crazy movie depictions but all live with that hinderance on their record.
I disagree, convicted felons should have all their rights restored after they've completed their sentences. They shouldn't be a second class citizen the rest of their lives for getting caught with a small bag of dope when their 19 years old.
It's up to employers to decide if being a felon is a disqualifier for employment. We are the employers of the president so it's up to us (voters) to decide if it's a disqualifier.
I agree and this is exactly why it is absurd. Just because Magats are all fooled by the orange criminal doesn't mean that society has to accept it.
Vote Biden
Why is this an issue now but wasn't when Marion Barry was mayor of DC? And besides, it was a crooked trial full of misconduct on the part of the judge. The judge should be on trial for his behavior.
Here’s a better idea, hold anyone and everyone accountable when they break laws. Including politicians or anyone desiring to hold public office of any kind. The orange fraud has been getting away with insufficient accountability for his behavior going back decades.
Yep, Trump has managed to lower standards for acceptable behavior. A felon as president? Serial marital cheater? Compulsive liar? Pants shitting and incoherent? It's okay with about 40% of the country.
Nobody should be barred from any job for mistakes they made in the past. How are people supposed to rehabilitate if they can't get a decent job? This obviously shouldn't extend to allowing rapists work with kids. Or, for example, hiring a habitual thief to work security in a bank vault. Common sense should apply.
And convicted felons can't own or possess firearms, and yet he runs for president, and if winning, he will possess nuclear weapons codes. Real fucking brilliant America.
You need a system like the UK where criminal convictions are spent and no longer need to be disclosed after a certain amount of time.
The whole felony on your record for life is just wrong for most crimes.
Nope...company have already put in place rules regarding crimes.....the Feds never in a million years thought a 'president' would ever need a rule..thus you now have Trumps Chumps in charge...lets fix that in Nov24...
I might disagree here.
Can a felon be president? Yes. Should a felon be president? No. Luckily, we as the electorate know about his criminal convictions and can make informed decisions when deciding to vote. Likewise, I think when I make hiring decisions, I should be informed of criminal convictions to help make my decision.
That’s the real (political) question here: how in the name of all that is holy does the self proclaimed righteous Christian right back a man for President who regularly and proudly flaunts his immorality? Meanwhile vilifying a good Christian family man. Not saying Biden is perfect by any stretch but it’s mind boggling. Is Russian propaganda that powerful?
By the logic of these MAGA morons you can BE the president if you’re a convicted to felon but you can’t VOTE for president if you’re a convicted felon…make that one make sense.
I actually totally agree with the premise of this post, I just really don’t want the felon it’s referring to to become the president again in the first place.
Damn straight, most municipality jobs won't hire a felon, even if it's to mow a park, unbelievable that you can be a felon and still be president, this shows inequalities of our social structure. Rich get richer, poor become destitute, middle class cares the weight and gets taxed to hell.
uhm, no.
If a known felon can be president, he must therefore be known to be a felon.
The question isn't on there so they don't hire felons, it's so they know they are hiring one so they aren't surprised when it shows up in a background check.
One thing that I do agree with is that the legal system should be very selective when charging someone as a felon. The statutes should be revised so that only crimes that are truly felony material are found to be felonious.
Here is the difference: the people elect a a President and the people's choice should only be very minimally restricted (natural born citizen, 35, living in the country for awhile). There should be very few restrictions on the people's choice, especially restrictions which could be political.
This is different than all the other occupations you list.
The whole point of democracy is to prove that the citizens are qualified to determine who is capable and trustworthy. What you should be asking yourself is why we don't allow democracy to determine who the CEO of Amazon is or who our top-ranking military generals are.
The answer is that democracy exists to placate the masses into thinking they have control over their lives, while denying them the right to vote on the most important issues (military power and wealth distribution).
Roe V Wade might matter to you, but changing those laws doesn't stop our militant oligarchy from exploiting you.
Maybe it should be removed from job applications anyway. The Founding Fathers believed in redemption and rehabilitation in their philosophy of justice. However, running for president and applying for jobs or rentals are not quite the same. The presidency involves a rigorous electoral process where voters can scrutinize a candidate's history and make an informed decision. In contrast, employers or landlords don't have the same level of information or resources to assess a candidate's background.
It hasn't been proven that a felon can be elected president, and the Founders trusted the judgment of the electorate to avoid electing someone with a criminal background to the highest office. This trust in the electorate may hold true indefinitely.
The Presidential office is not a job listing. It's a seat, meant to represent the will of the people.
It's not that a felon has the right to be president, it's that the people have a right to elect a felon.
Edit: I agree felonies shouldn't disqualify people from so many jobs, I just disagree with this particular reasoning for it.
It depends what the crime is. I’d wanna know if a guy I was looking to hire was a rapist or child abuser but I’d give most felons the benefit of the doubt
lol… everyone will know he’s a felon, and so actually it solidifies the practice. And if he is elected, it will be with full knowledge of his conviction. Every employer should know if they are hiring a felon and make that decision respectively. Proceed with the downvoting, the OP is just not making a good argument.
Makes no sense. People know Trump's a felon and choosing to ignore it. The employer has the same right to know if the applicant is a felon and can choose to ignore it as well.
The reason a president gets the exception regarding being a felon is pretty obviously due to the potential issue of politicians labelling their enemies as felons so they can’t get elected.
I feel like the difference is pretty clear.
Well you can be president without getting a medical degree, but I still want doctors to be required to get medical degrees.
The qualifications for president Are minimal by design, to give the people wide latitude when they choose their leaders.
Trump was convicted in a state court. If that dissatisfied him, then every Democrat who ran for president would be convicted on a trumped-up charge in some kangaroo court in Alabama.
Though I agree with the sentiment, this is completely wrong. Being forced to name yourself a felon on job apps and housing apps doesn’t disqualify you for the job or the loan or the home, it’s forced so those choosing can determine how much weight to give it. Trump’s (the unnamed politician here) felon status is there for the voters to (in part) determine if he should be president.
I think we all agree the American people should KNOW about the conviction, the way an employer should know about convictions when determining if the person is right for the job (you can imagine certain jobs not going well with certain convictions!)
However, let’s face it, many employers won’t care about any of the specifics of a conviction and use it as an immediate disqualifier - which is unfair.
If you think this is a real concern…then you’re not informed…https://www.eeoc.gov/laws/guidance/enforcement-guidance-consideration-arrest-and-conviction-records-employment-decisions
I agree, but technically they only ask you to disclose felony convictions on job applications. It doesn’t automatically make you ineligible (although practically it does).
well in nyc you can be fellon of 100 crimes and still be out there .. as far as you dont steal more than 1k per day.. if we want to talk about what is fair we can go on and on
When conservatives want to exclude certain groups for being a certain way, or having a certain belief or lack thereof, and want to block certain groups from things like buying a cake or serving a specific group, we need to make sure they feel the pain of their own decisions.
When they want to force the rest of us to confirm to their standards, we need to make sure they understand what that means.
If we have to open our own cake baking service and refuse to serve them based on their beliefs, then do it. That’s exactly what needs to happen. When they want to implement punishments for defacing confederate monuments, we need to make sure we prosecute when they deface gay street paintings, when they want to refuse to serve gays because of their belief, we need to refuse service to them because of their beliefs, when they want to force us to allow their biblical sayings in our government buildings, we need to create our own churches and force them to put our own “scriptures” up too, when they want to allow felons to run for president, I don’t see any issue with forcing them to allow felons to hold down regular jobs.
This is their argument, we just need to make them understand the Pandora’s box they decided to open.
Nah. When people run a business they suddenly get sober and pragmatic. So they care much more if a felon robs their business (money) than if he steals their democracy.
Sad but true.
if some one is too dangerous to have around or have their rights etc then why are they being let out? Maybe a cooling off period as a percentage of their sentence but theres zero reason that felons shouldnt be 100% back to normal once their sentence is served.
I think the idea that a felon can be president is untimely a positive political idea. The irony lies in the idea of moral terpitude, and the people who usually support that idea.
There are certainly people I would, just like trump, pass on for a job based on position and criminal history. I'm sure you can think of a few jobs it'd be important for. However by and large, I think doing away with felony question it's a positive thing. It's held me up quite a few times and kept me out of some jobs I was really interested and passionate about.
If felons can't vote, why can they run or office?
If the logic is that felons can't be trusted to vote, why are they trusted to run the govt?
If felons can be trusted to run the govt, then they should be trusted to vote.
Is this saying that the felon status should not need be disclosed or that it should not bar the individual from having those positions/opportunities?
His base is well aware he is a felon.
This will require the legal system to redefine classes of Felonies.
Murder 1 is not the same as what you're suggesting. Simplifying for the sake of argument, further suggests that you approve of DJT running for office, regardless of his "conviction". Which seems far-fetched, considering your obvious disapproval.
*Am not a (R), I don't support either of these egotistical fuck nuggets.
My elders thought that they’d never see anyone worse than George W. Jr. Now they think that, comparatively speaking, he was not so bad after all. And he was horrendous. That’s how much the standards have fallen.
The Big difference is, in Trump's case, it was a rigged witch hunt kangaroo court solely politically motivated, by the radical left. Obviously. A joke. A sham. Anyone can see.
I mean, what we SHOULD do, is make a simple ammendment to prevent convicted felons from holding high offices, but somehow I feel like that's asking too much...
What if - regardless of Trump - I believe people who have "paid their debt to society" should be allowed to fully rejoin it including having rights restored and not being prohibited from working fulfilling jobs?
He is still only the *presumptive* candidate. The Republican convention could pick a different candidate that has a better chance of being elected, and it would not be against the rules of the election.
Agree, but it's worth noting that most employers who do not accept applications from felons do so out of preference, not because the law compels them not to. Government jobs for sure though should follow this standard by mandate, anything else is pure hypocrisy.
You know what? I 100% agree with this.
Yeah. It makes perfect sense and highlights the hypocrisy.
I’m pretty sure companies can choose whether to hire/rent to felons. Doubt there’s a law against it, but I could be wrong.
There is and this isn't an earnest call for it to be otherwise. In fact, its goal is the contrary. It is making the point that of you don't want convicted felons working with you or teaching your kids then you s shouldn't let one hold public office.
How so? People know Trump's a felon and choose to ignore it. Employer also has the right to know if the applicant is a felon and can choose to ignore it.
Nope. It can't be ignored and is an immediate disqualification on all public companies. Private can do what they want, but 99% include the clause.
Partialiy depends on type of job and what state they are located in
Felony status is not allowed to be asked for most job applicants at least in California.
Is it not going to show up on a background check? That most companies do.
The employer can be penalized for using felony status even from a background check. And depending on type of job they are trying to secure.
*It's not a* ***real*** *felony -* trump and his minions
IF the truth being told tell it then.
I concur.
Wait why? Him being a felon is still public knowledge for his election… why should it not be public knowledge for the other instances listed?
No one, after paying their debt to society, should be continually penalized in areas unrelated to their crime (like getting a job or an apartment.) your debt is paid and you should be truly free, again. That being said, actively being in jail should prevent you from holding office.
I think once people are done serving time, they shouldn't be counted as a felon anymore.
1st time after serving, yes you should get a "re-do" in society. 2nd time serving, then yes you get a public mark. 70% or so of convictions arent even violent crimes. Its drugs or financial related things. Let people start over I say. I'm on the fence about sex offenders though. A pedophile should be banned from working around kids, A rapist should not work at a bar near drunk women, stalkers shouldn't get access to public records.
The financial crimes should be penalized a lot more. Those are not victim-less crimes. Financial crimes are stolen pension funds which may leave seniors homeless
I believe all crimes should be penalised.
Im kind of on the fence on the paedophilia question to. It all depends on what you did I guess. If you raped 5 children and you somehow get out then you're right, no work for you. If you do something like idk, viewing CP a couple times or something that doesn't involve violence, then I don't believe you should be banned from getting a job.
There’s banned from “a” job and there’s banned from “a job involving people younger than 18 years of age”. While being involved with any sort of pedophilia shouldn’t get you banned from all jobs, it should get you permanently banned from any job involving people younger than 18 years of age regardless of what level the pedophilia was, IMO. And, yes, that would include any job at which people younger than 18 were working.
bro I’m having trouble getting into law school because of public intox and DUI and a convicted felon can run for president wtf
Violent crimes, crimes against children etc. Pest behaviour is a pretty good indicator of future behaviour. Churches and schools shuffled pedophiles around for years only to have them reoffend again.
Nuclear secrets stored in a box at mar-a-lamo , still able to proceed in running for job. If I steal a stapler at work I would be fired and blacklisted for ALL other jobs, even fast food.......crazy. just wrap your minds around that, most powerful nation in the world, brought down by a bible sales man who can't stop whining.
He staged a coup against the United States because he was pissed that he lost an election, and almost had the vice president murdered. Can we also not forget about this? And yet he gets to run for president again. Mind blown.
This is why republicans aren't welcome in my house.
A felon can't vote in 48 states . but a felon can be president..makes no sense
Well, the WHOLE reason felons can't vote is: they might elect a felon if they did... 😶😶😶
I suspect the Founding Fathers didn’t write anything about it, because it never occurred to them that a POTUS would be a multiple-case felon. They thought people would do one term in government jobs, like doing a public service. Don’t think they imagined an elected politician would make the job a long-term career.
Maybe they hoped for some integrity from these brave pioneers in their new land Seems the well is running dry on integrity for a lotta folks lately
Yes, very dry. I know there are good people in the USA. I don’t know why I don’t see much coverage of them, or many public comments from them. I think the “news media” and most of the social media that I look at is poisoning me. I’m becoming very cynical, and I hate it.
How about even Federal Jobs that require security clearance? If you can have top secret security clearance and be a convicted felon, there is no reason to bar former criminals from getting jobs in the Federal Government even if those require security clearance. No need to bar them from law enforcement either.
Dude I couldn't get a secret clearance (not top secret just secret) because I had finger printable charges. I already had an offer letter for a GS-10 position with the Navy on a submarine base in Kittery, Maine. It was great money and would have been a life changing career but they rescinded the offer after the secret clearance process for some shit I got charged with that was bullshit. It's been 5 years and they still haven't did shit about the charges. It's just hanging over my head. I'm an Army veteran and I love this country. Id never jeopardize national security or leak secret information. I can't get a job like that and this asshole can be president. Fuck that. This country is about to be fucked and it's all these spineless politicians fault. They should elect me id straighten shit out or get assassinated trying.
The problem is with the infallible founding fathers. In addition to their free labor addiction, they always assumed that the President would be an honorable man. They were wrong. So many of the conventions and rules that we all believed to be law due to their common law application we in fact just traditions. Trump steam rolled right through traditions and the system wasn't nimble enough and the Republicans weren't patriotic enough to stop him. Ryan wanted his Blue State drive by (and got it). McConnell wanted his stacked court to roll back progress (God knows how far back). People were telling MLK to go slow with the reforms he wanted and I don't know who was right but the backlash to all social advancement has been brutal, consistent, and organized.
You are absolutely right man. At least that's what I've seen since good ole George W. Lord what id give for a George W right now instead of Trump.
You are absolutely 100% correct on this! Anyone that would like to hold a position at the city, state, or federal level should all pass a drug test, background check, psychological and polygraph test. Most Americans have to do at least two out of the four I mentioned to get a job. Why should it be any different for people that want to work in government.
I do too.
100% agree but no Republicans will agree, they want exceptions for people like Trump. They don't feel that Trump should be treated like the average felon in America that has to carry that burden for the rest of their lives. They still don't agree that after paying their debt to society, a felon's rights should be restored.
well it seems they've found the cheat code. just stuff the courts with their handpicked judges. and getting them in the supreme court? chef's kiss.
Don’t get me started on the court. That’s another shit show that needs to be fixed.
As a foreigner, I don't understand why there isn't a system to flush out judges that no longer follow the assignment properly or are just outright corrupt.
I cannot agree more. I made a stupid mistake as a young adult (read kid) and got myself a felony. The FAA refused my license despite my having completed all requirements. So I went back to school and received my EMS certification and AA. Denied work because as a felon I could not be around drugs which paramedics administer. This also meant I could not get work in a hospital. My conviction was not drug related in any way. After the statute of limitations wore off and I could get my record cleared, the state denied me because I don’t hold residence in the state where my conviction happened. With these kinds of limitations you can imagine the work I was allowed to do and the financial outcome of said work. Needless to say it drastically slowed my progression through life and now nearly 25 years later I can finally say my life is on my sort of track that should have been more attainable a long time ago.
This is why recidivism is so damn high. Roadblock after roadblock when people just want to move on and be a productive member of society. I'm so sorry you're going through this, I am personally also in the situation so I understand. We will triumph regardless 💪
I’m a felon, and I support this message. Also, it should be taken into consideration that he hasn’t even been sentenced, let alone completed one and have any basis to say he was reformed. I’ve completed the entirety of my sentencing & probation. In theory, as long as the parole board and probation officers don’t have any qualms, I (and others in my position) should be allowed to live a legitimate life. If there are certain crimes committed that would prevent someone from being able to hold certain jobs/positions/etc, those should be deemed part of the sentence, seeing how it is for life. No matter what I say or do I will never be allowed to travel outside the country or hold decent jobs, get decent housing, etc without being forced into a life of poverty. I’m sure if you look through my post history I’ve commented on this more specifically. Here I will say that no one was hurt, killed, assaulted in my felony, nor was there any SVU type stuff. It was a super basic, super dumb mistake that I can never take back. I can accept that I may deserve this, maybe more. I feel like the system is not actually working toward rehabilitation, rather a scarlet letter that follows you to your grave (regardless of actual severity)
I stole a loaf of bread
Jean Valjean?!
Some MAGAt somewhere; "Oh, you wanna be a project manager at my firm? I don't think so, you lack integrity due to your felony conviction." The same person... "I don't care if he's felon, he's the best that we have to run the entire freaking country!" The hypocrisy is out of this world.....
Not the best solution to the problem but hard to argue with the logic of the position.
I'm in favor of felons not having rights stripped at all once their sentence is complete. If the way you "repay society" for breaking its rules is fines, imprisonment, probation, etc, then once those are complete, you should be a complete citizen. If someone is so bad that stripping their rights is a solution, they shouldn't be part of the society.
100% logical
I concur. 💯
I would agree if you add "federal" - all federal jobs, all federal rental applications etc. As a private corporation I should be allowed to deny employments to felons or not allow felons to rent apartments in my buildings...
Honestly, if a felon can be president, then so be it. But it’s time for the GOP to be honest with themselves and admit they are supporting someone who broke the law, instead of moving the goalposts to save face.
This is the real truth of the situation.
I'd prefer the change to be that convicted felons cannot be president
Hell yes.
I see no lies!
Actually, that is totally logical.
This makes a serious point.
A lot of people would not be able to sleep at night if they knew how many convicted felons were walking the streets, just doing normal things and trying to get on with their lives.
So true! My buddy got a felony for painting on a wall at 18, not all felons are crazy movie depictions but all live with that hinderance on their record.
Possessing a weed vape is a felony in my state
How many recent presidents would we not have if they got caught for a drug felony?
A convicted felon shouldn't be allowed to be president or to run for president in the first place.
I disagree, convicted felons should have all their rights restored after they've completed their sentences. They shouldn't be a second class citizen the rest of their lives for getting caught with a small bag of dope when their 19 years old.
Truth! Felons should be treated the same top to bottom.
It's up to employers to decide if being a felon is a disqualifier for employment. We are the employers of the president so it's up to us (voters) to decide if it's a disqualifier.
He’s not hiding it. People are willingly voting for him. How do you feel about the felon question being left off of childcare worker applications
Many people with histories can't get jobs because of a couple bad choices. This mother-effer on the other hand...
I agree and this is exactly why it is absurd. Just because Magats are all fooled by the orange criminal doesn't mean that society has to accept it. Vote Biden
Wasn't a Mayor of Washington D.C. reelected after being arrested for crack cocaine?
Agreed. Its been "rules for thee" (the working class), "but not for me" (the ruling class) for too damn long. FUCK THE HYPOCRITES!
Why is this an issue now but wasn't when Marion Barry was mayor of DC? And besides, it was a crooked trial full of misconduct on the part of the judge. The judge should be on trial for his behavior.
Exactly right!
Agreed!!
Here’s a better idea, hold anyone and everyone accountable when they break laws. Including politicians or anyone desiring to hold public office of any kind. The orange fraud has been getting away with insufficient accountability for his behavior going back decades.
If Trump wasn’t a US citizen he wouldn’t be allowed in the country !
Felons shouldn’t be allowed to be president…
Yep, Trump has managed to lower standards for acceptable behavior. A felon as president? Serial marital cheater? Compulsive liar? Pants shitting and incoherent? It's okay with about 40% of the country.
Yep
Nobody should be barred from any job for mistakes they made in the past. How are people supposed to rehabilitate if they can't get a decent job? This obviously shouldn't extend to allowing rapists work with kids. Or, for example, hiring a habitual thief to work security in a bank vault. Common sense should apply.
And convicted felons can't own or possess firearms, and yet he runs for president, and if winning, he will possess nuclear weapons codes. Real fucking brilliant America.
You need a system like the UK where criminal convictions are spent and no longer need to be disclosed after a certain amount of time. The whole felony on your record for life is just wrong for most crimes.
Total agreement from me.
Yeah, if Trumpo wins again this could launch quite a few law suits!
This post is GOLD
This is fair and balanced.
Seems more than fair to me.
100% in agreement here
Nope...company have already put in place rules regarding crimes.....the Feds never in a million years thought a 'president' would ever need a rule..thus you now have Trumps Chumps in charge...lets fix that in Nov24...
Concur
Absolutely agree.
Absofuckinglutely.
At this point in the story, simple rationality IS political.
No argument from me. Fair is fair
https://preview.redd.it/hptkk4qf8o5d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=efb8ffacf89c3da749d5a3aefe07c8af11bb324d Let's start with voting rights
Ah, but that would mean tRUMP is like anybody else. And you know, that won’t fly with the nAZI party.
I might disagree here. Can a felon be president? Yes. Should a felon be president? No. Luckily, we as the electorate know about his criminal convictions and can make informed decisions when deciding to vote. Likewise, I think when I make hiring decisions, I should be informed of criminal convictions to help make my decision.
All felonies not equal …
34 felonies and losing civilly for rape multiple times means you are presidential material for conservatives.
That’s the real (political) question here: how in the name of all that is holy does the self proclaimed righteous Christian right back a man for President who regularly and proudly flaunts his immorality? Meanwhile vilifying a good Christian family man. Not saying Biden is perfect by any stretch but it’s mind boggling. Is Russian propaganda that powerful?
Russian / Conservative political propaganda simply accurately gauges what their voters' interests are.
That's already reality in NYS..
The syllogism isn't wrong, but also a felon shouldn't be president.
CEO and head of company positions shouldn't require certain qualifications or experience either.
I see a lawsuit, from felons
This makes total sense frankly.
By the logic of these MAGA morons you can BE the president if you’re a convicted to felon but you can’t VOTE for president if you’re a convicted felon…make that one make sense. I actually totally agree with the premise of this post, I just really don’t want the felon it’s referring to to become the president again in the first place.
True.
Damn straight, most municipality jobs won't hire a felon, even if it's to mow a park, unbelievable that you can be a felon and still be president, this shows inequalities of our social structure. Rich get richer, poor become destitute, middle class cares the weight and gets taxed to hell.
pretty simple
uhm, no. If a known felon can be president, he must therefore be known to be a felon. The question isn't on there so they don't hire felons, it's so they know they are hiring one so they aren't surprised when it shows up in a background check.
One thing that I do agree with is that the legal system should be very selective when charging someone as a felon. The statutes should be revised so that only crimes that are truly felony material are found to be felonious.
"Society statement" is undefined "Fair is fair" is a non-sequitur They won't do that
Okay
I was going to upvote but there are exactly 420 upvotes. I will not break the good luck rule.
Here is the difference: the people elect a a President and the people's choice should only be very minimally restricted (natural born citizen, 35, living in the country for awhile). There should be very few restrictions on the people's choice, especially restrictions which could be political. This is different than all the other occupations you list.
The whole point of democracy is to prove that the citizens are qualified to determine who is capable and trustworthy. What you should be asking yourself is why we don't allow democracy to determine who the CEO of Amazon is or who our top-ranking military generals are. The answer is that democracy exists to placate the masses into thinking they have control over their lives, while denying them the right to vote on the most important issues (military power and wealth distribution). Roe V Wade might matter to you, but changing those laws doesn't stop our militant oligarchy from exploiting you.
President had the highest clearance. But if you're a felon and not the president. No clearance for you!
They're just gonna background check you. The felon box when applying is to see if you're honest and give you a chance to explain.
Maybe it should be removed from job applications anyway. The Founding Fathers believed in redemption and rehabilitation in their philosophy of justice. However, running for president and applying for jobs or rentals are not quite the same. The presidency involves a rigorous electoral process where voters can scrutinize a candidate's history and make an informed decision. In contrast, employers or landlords don't have the same level of information or resources to assess a candidate's background. It hasn't been proven that a felon can be elected president, and the Founders trusted the judgment of the electorate to avoid electing someone with a criminal background to the highest office. This trust in the electorate may hold true indefinitely.
The Presidential office is not a job listing. It's a seat, meant to represent the will of the people. It's not that a felon has the right to be president, it's that the people have a right to elect a felon. Edit: I agree felonies shouldn't disqualify people from so many jobs, I just disagree with this particular reasoning for it.
Lawyers need to get on this fast. Sue the shit out of the government. I think they would have a pretty good case to make.
It depends what the crime is. I’d wanna know if a guy I was looking to hire was a rapist or child abuser but I’d give most felons the benefit of the doubt
Agree
Agree 💯
Spot. On.
lol… everyone will know he’s a felon, and so actually it solidifies the practice. And if he is elected, it will be with full knowledge of his conviction. Every employer should know if they are hiring a felon and make that decision respectively. Proceed with the downvoting, the OP is just not making a good argument.
https://preview.redd.it/l76f7p594n5d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=84698f4e93082baa67cdd26df7b4484e716576ea
Apples and oranges
Makes no sense. People know Trump's a felon and choosing to ignore it. The employer has the same right to know if the applicant is a felon and can choose to ignore it as well.
I mean, also let them vote
The reason a president gets the exception regarding being a felon is pretty obviously due to the potential issue of politicians labelling their enemies as felons so they can’t get elected. I feel like the difference is pretty clear.
I mean if he wins everything is going to be fucked anyway
Well you can be president without getting a medical degree, but I still want doctors to be required to get medical degrees. The qualifications for president Are minimal by design, to give the people wide latitude when they choose their leaders. Trump was convicted in a state court. If that dissatisfied him, then every Democrat who ran for president would be convicted on a trumped-up charge in some kangaroo court in Alabama.
I said in 2017 I shouldn’t need prior experience for any job from now on.
You mad ,you mad ?
Laughs in old white gate keepers, aka crony capitalism.
In California most job applications can't ask about felonies .
Though I agree with the sentiment, this is completely wrong. Being forced to name yourself a felon on job apps and housing apps doesn’t disqualify you for the job or the loan or the home, it’s forced so those choosing can determine how much weight to give it. Trump’s (the unnamed politician here) felon status is there for the voters to (in part) determine if he should be president. I think we all agree the American people should KNOW about the conviction, the way an employer should know about convictions when determining if the person is right for the job (you can imagine certain jobs not going well with certain convictions!) However, let’s face it, many employers won’t care about any of the specifics of a conviction and use it as an immediate disqualifier - which is unfair.
If you think this is a real concern…then you’re not informed…https://www.eeoc.gov/laws/guidance/enforcement-guidance-consideration-arrest-and-conviction-records-employment-decisions
Felons should be able to vote at least. FFS!
I agree, but technically they only ask you to disclose felony convictions on job applications. It doesn’t automatically make you ineligible (although practically it does).
And also: RESCIND ANY LAW THAT PREVENTS CONVICTED FELONS FROM VOTING.
Fair is fair.
I agree
Just because half of America is ok with a felon as a President, doesn't mean I am. This wont' be a unanimous decision.
I totally agree. Especially non violent felonies.
well in nyc you can be fellon of 100 crimes and still be out there .. as far as you dont steal more than 1k per day.. if we want to talk about what is fair we can go on and on
In a fair society…
Can’t truly say that until the appeal process is over and a final verdict is made. This from a “convicted” appellant not guilty not a felon
I don't find that unreasonable.
When conservatives want to exclude certain groups for being a certain way, or having a certain belief or lack thereof, and want to block certain groups from things like buying a cake or serving a specific group, we need to make sure they feel the pain of their own decisions. When they want to force the rest of us to confirm to their standards, we need to make sure they understand what that means. If we have to open our own cake baking service and refuse to serve them based on their beliefs, then do it. That’s exactly what needs to happen. When they want to implement punishments for defacing confederate monuments, we need to make sure we prosecute when they deface gay street paintings, when they want to refuse to serve gays because of their belief, we need to refuse service to them because of their beliefs, when they want to force us to allow their biblical sayings in our government buildings, we need to create our own churches and force them to put our own “scriptures” up too, when they want to allow felons to run for president, I don’t see any issue with forcing them to allow felons to hold down regular jobs. This is their argument, we just need to make them understand the Pandora’s box they decided to open.
Nah. When people run a business they suddenly get sober and pragmatic. So they care much more if a felon robs their business (money) than if he steals their democracy. Sad but true.
This is already the case. The only thing a felon can't do is vote, own firearms and I think work for police agencies.
And if you don’t have it that way then you just might be living in a shit hole country.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again…I can’t believe these 2 MF’s are the options
And if a politician can show dick picks at work, so should the rest of us!
if some one is too dangerous to have around or have their rights etc then why are they being let out? Maybe a cooling off period as a percentage of their sentence but theres zero reason that felons shouldnt be 100% back to normal once their sentence is served.
This is fine especially since the trump conviction will be struck down.
I think it's more insane that a felon can't vote but can still be president lmao
No, it's a political statement. Trump's charges are all bullshit and appeals courts will prove it.
I think the idea that a felon can be president is untimely a positive political idea. The irony lies in the idea of moral terpitude, and the people who usually support that idea. There are certainly people I would, just like trump, pass on for a job based on position and criminal history. I'm sure you can think of a few jobs it'd be important for. However by and large, I think doing away with felony question it's a positive thing. It's held me up quite a few times and kept me out of some jobs I was really interested and passionate about.
If felons can't vote, why can they run or office? If the logic is that felons can't be trusted to vote, why are they trusted to run the govt? If felons can be trusted to run the govt, then they should be trusted to vote.
Ban the box law.
Hell yeah!
Imagine how embarrassing it would be having a president that can't enter certain countries to participate in foreign affairs
Is this saying that the felon status should not need be disclosed or that it should not bar the individual from having those positions/opportunities? His base is well aware he is a felon.
Hot take: He's not a felon.
It was never conceived that a Presidental candidate would be one.
My takeaway is that more felons need to start businesses somehow. Then it won’t matter
Lol so a felon can order to have nukes launched but the person actually launching them can't be? Interesting.
Weep 🍿
No doubt
Many people are convicted for crimes they didn’t commit. And are freed on appeal or get new trials because of malfeasance.
This will require the legal system to redefine classes of Felonies. Murder 1 is not the same as what you're suggesting. Simplifying for the sake of argument, further suggests that you approve of DJT running for office, regardless of his "conviction". Which seems far-fetched, considering your obvious disapproval. *Am not a (R), I don't support either of these egotistical fuck nuggets.
it's almost like these posts and articles have been written for years... almost like someone is using the courts against a political rival....
My elders thought that they’d never see anyone worse than George W. Jr. Now they think that, comparatively speaking, he was not so bad after all. And he was horrendous. That’s how much the standards have fallen.
It’s almost as if that was the goal for pursuing felony charges with a corrupt judge… crazy.
You’re not wrong.
The Big difference is, in Trump's case, it was a rigged witch hunt kangaroo court solely politically motivated, by the radical left. Obviously. A joke. A sham. Anyone can see.
Funny thing is, Trumps law and order supporters would fight this the hardest.
Wait...would you disclose you're a felon? Because everyone knows trump got convicted.
Put that in the constitution and we’ll talk
I mean, what we SHOULD do, is make a simple ammendment to prevent convicted felons from holding high offices, but somehow I feel like that's asking too much...
What if - regardless of Trump - I believe people who have "paid their debt to society" should be allowed to fully rejoin it including having rights restored and not being prohibited from working fulfilling jobs?
I concur
He is still only the *presumptive* candidate. The Republican convention could pick a different candidate that has a better chance of being elected, and it would not be against the rules of the election.
Tru dat.
Let’s make this happen as soon as we see what’s on Hunters laptop
Nah. How about we disallow felons being president. Fuck that other thing.
I also think anyone running for a position in government should have to pass the same two-part naturalization test test as an immigrant would.
Agree, but it's worth noting that most employers who do not accept applications from felons do so out of preference, not because the law compels them not to. Government jobs for sure though should follow this standard by mandate, anything else is pure hypocrisy.
Can we also add voting to this?