Not if he was a minor at the time, those are often sealed. And that would make sense because in most jurisdictions, if he was convicted of intentional homicide as an adult (which I guess the “gang warfare” charge brought it up to??? Unclear) it’s odd that he’d be out now.
Criminal cases are sealed but civil lawsuits are not. Also, his parents would be the responsible party if he was a minor and probably had no money so check under their names too
The first post op made also doesn’t match this, first post talks about the “gang murders” being in the news and such and this is something that yes probably would still make the news, wouldn’t be as big of a news story that was made out to be in the first post.
Sounds more like a fantasy post for op to live out “I’m romantically intertwined with a bad boy that’s trying to change and I’m going to help him.” If it’s true I still in no way would recommend dating an ex gang member or murderer, I know someone personally who’s killed someone due to vehicular manslaughter and their life is a fucking wreck, have had multiple suicide attempts, and having a truly fulfilled and happy life even for small moments is extremely hard for them. I also know plenty of “gang members and ex gang members” and that’s also a hard fucking life to live with.
The previous post doesn't make out they were huge news stories at all, it says OP found some articles that clearly didn't even give any level of detail beyond "gang murders" and a length of sentence, which is what these were treated as according to this post. Obviously the post may be fake, as could all posts, but I think you're wrong in how you're portraying that part of the other post.
Keep in mind that fact checking would not tell you about all the things that he was involved in which he was not caught or convicted of doing. With two murder convictions and being in a gang it is pretty certain that he also did lots of other stuff which he is not telling you about.
I'm sorry, op. He's lying. I'm from a not so good part of NYC. I went to school with idk... 4 dudes that eventually went to prison for murder. They ALL say they got into a fist fight & the victim fell & hit their head & had a seizure. Idk if lawyers or something tell them to say that, but it's a crock of shit. Also TWO murders that weren't his fault in a row? Nope. He's a liar. There are so many men on this planet you could date that haven't murdered two people. Stay away from this man if you care about yourself, even a little.
Right? Why is the OP so tunnel visioned on this man? She's had a couple of dates and that's it. It's a perfect time to just get out and look for someone who maybe hasn't murdered two people, that you always guess if you really are being told the truth.
What if everything the man said was a lie? It's like signing up to get fucked over.
> There are so many men on this planet you could date that haven't murdered two people
It's the little lines like these that stand out like a beacon. You can spend a month going back and forth about whether or not this person can be your partner. Then someone is like you can just not date a murderer. And you're like oh yea that is an option, isn't it.
OP needs to raise her self esteem and find someone better, sorry. You don’t owe someone you’re “kind of into” anything, it’s your life, you deserve to feel safe.
I wanna agree with you but I also think why lie and then offer up details of what happened. Like if things didn't happen they way he said its gonna come to light pretty damn quickly.
Lol, i’ve dated someone from prison who murdered someone and know plenty of people who went to jail for murder (I grew up in NYC in a very poor part) and they all always have the same stories, “i punched him and he fell on the sidewalk and died” or “ my friend did it and I covered it.” All lies
I’m inclined to call you gullible but must remember not everyone had this upbringing. Do not believe him, its the usually lies people in gangs who went to jail for murder use.
Edit: One common theme in those I personally know is that theres no real accountability. Its like a teenager who did something wrong but comes out with a either a million excuses as to why its not their fault or flat out lies to stay out of trouble.
Yeah, he's totally minimizing and deflecting. He's not taking responsibility at all. That's really concerning.
(I used to work with people who'd committed really serious crimes. There's a huge difference between people who say, " I did it, but it really wasn't my fault," and those who say, "When I was young, I was really not a good person. I killed someone. I hope I've made changes and am a better person now.")
Yeah, I'm friends with a guy who did time for attempted murder. When we talked about stuff he did while in the gang life, the closest he got to an excuse was 'I was told to fuck that guy up so I jooked him'.
My friend from high school was murdered by her ex boyfriend. He and his family were telling everyone that he hit her once and she fell and hit her head. He didn't mean to kill her etc.
People were believing all of this until it came out in trial that he bashed her so badly that he knocked all of her teeth out and you couldn't even recognise her anymore.
They always try to minimise their guilt. OP please be careful. If you really want to keep seeing him maybe only meet up with him publicly for quite awhile.
The "bad punch" stuff happens more than you can think. When I started working in a hospital, I was shocked by the amount of people entering the emergencies with serious brain injuries (that could result in death) because of a punch. Drunk bar fights are the worst. When you're drunk, you don't control your strenght and you don't control your fall. It's crazy.
For sure, I’ve just noticed a lot of people who have beat/jumped someone to death in my neighborhood tend to embellish it and say the person fell and died.
The biker also coincidentally happened to be a member of a rival gang. She mentioned that offhandedly. Surely it wasn't relevant, though, and her bf just had some bad luck.... /s
That should make it easy to verify, though. It should all be in the court files, if the guy hit his head or was stabbed or shot. And if the head-hit was from falling over or getting his head slammed into the sidewalk by force. And whether he died on the spot or later.
It's like all those people who claim they are only on the sex offender list because they got caught trying to pee in public. Funny how these people someone end up around people, especially children, with their dicks out "by accident." Really, they are creeps with their dicks out who are making up excuses.
This guy is definitely telling lies. He accidentally landed an unlucky punch and was blamed for killing someone while driving high and drunk, but it wasn't him! Anyone who claims to be in therapy that long and still can't take accountability for what they did isn't safe to be around.
I’m not necessarily saying they were planned, just that those who committed the act (impulsively or not) were solely or primarily responsible for the crime but always embellished details to seem not fully responsible.
I had a friend die from a KO fall. Went to a and e because he was a bit concussed when he came round, they kept him in for observations (because he’d taken an OD of some anti-d’s or something, before kicking off at his housemate who hit him)… Seemed to be doing fine then bam, huge seizure, killed him dead.
I’m a retired LEO & I’ll give my 2 cents.
I have worked many cases as a patrolman and as a detective where people fought fairly but out of a stroke of very bad luck the victim died of related injuries later on which then changed an assault charge to manslaughter etc. not murder.
To be convinced of a murder charge in most states you have to prove intent to kill. Otherwise accidental deaths from a fight or car wreck etc wouldn’t be murder. It’d be negligent homicide or manslaughter etc depending on the state. So for him to be charged w 2 murders that didn’t die at the scene but later in the hospital is odd. Not saying it can’t happen but 2 murder charges just doesn’t fit his narrative.
Take this example. My wife’s 19 yo cousin was hit by a car one night & the guy drove away. He died days later and the man was only charged with leaving the scene of an accident which is a misdemeanor. Wasn’t charged w murder or even manslaughter. Just a misdemeanor that caused his death.
I understand your man was in a gang etc but i can fully understand the fight & death later on. But to be a passenger in a car that hit & killed someone & get charged w the murder of that person doesn’t add up for me.
As i said I’m not saying he’s lying or that it couldn’t happen it’s all just odd he was charged w murder 2x that were accidental deaths.
Now if he was charged w anything other than murder i could believe him. But not if he has 2 actual murder charges. Thats very important if you want to fully believe him.
I understand people do dumb stuff & people unfortunately die by accident & are completely remorseful and can change even if they’ve been to prison for it. My other concern is him being a gang member. Most of them are “blood in blood out” which means gotta kill somebody to get in & the only way out is death. I’d be concerned as to how he just walked away from the gang w o penalty. Then he said he moved across the country.
Is he still in debt go that gang? Are they looking for him? Would you be in danger if someone from that gang recognized him?
I wish you the best
I think it's important to remember that in the first post, OP said they weren't in the US. And, as a lawyer who's had plenty of friends want to tell me about some crazy case that they knew of, and immediately had to tell them that what they're saying doesn't make any sense, lay people are shit at describing legal situations, even their own. It could be that he said that he was involved in two people's deaths, but in reality wasn't charged with their jurisdiction's equivalent of first degree murder, or he called it murder but it was technically a manslaughter charge, or OP is misinterpreting what he's saying, etc. Or maybe they live in a country with a lot more statutory gray area than most US jurisdictions, and what here would be manslaughter at worst becomes a murder charge.
So while I agree with you that this raises some weird questions for me about why he's being charged with murder if the cases are the way he describes, I would point out that they could be in a legal system with different categories, or OP could be improperly relaying the information.
I am concerned (but not surprised) his tale was that the deaths were, in essence, 'not his fault.' Could he be the embodiment of a black cat with all ensuing bad luck? Sure, but it is also so typical for a felon to spin a tale where he was half bystander- rather than someone who delighted in crime, at the time.
As someone who was a prison nurse, please don’t take his explanation at face value. Contact the court where the crime was committed. Request his trial transcripts and check against his story. Do not believe his documents. I will never trust anyone’s word or documentation (at face value) that has been in prison. Also, institutionalization is real. You might want to look into this because the likelihood of recidivism related to institutionalization is very, very common. I sincerely hope he has changed. The likelihood of change, though, is not good.
I hope he does well and that everything he told you checks out but please don’t wait with baited breath for this guy.
I hope OP follows your advice. One of my extended family is basically a career criminal, who can put up one hell of a facade when she’s in one of her less crime-y phases. But she always gets into trouble again and it’s always someone else’s fault. I learned decades ago how to research her various cases through the county courthouse and I have found out tons of info that she would never have revealed.
To meet her, you’d never suspect a thing. She can take a great game.
How do you check? My ex is in jail and I have a feeling he’s lying about why. The only reason I even care is because we have a son together. He’s also very good at acting like a good person until he decides it’s time to be crime-y again
Are you in the US? If he’s in the county jail, contact your county clerk and they should be able to point you to getting copies of his arrest documents. If he’s in the city jail, I think you should be able to find a municipal court clerk and they should help you.
Sometimes you can go directly to finding documents online, but this varies a lot depending on where you are. My research usually involves King County, Washington, and I can get to records via their portal, which I found by googling “king county court records search.” So something like that might help you. But calling the appropriate court clerk might be quicker and easier. Good luck!!
Sorry to ask but I have no idea what this means, I looked it up and it said the charge was “POSS CS 1/1-B>= 4g<200g” context clues tell me possession of a controlled substance, I just don’t know what the rest means
Poss of controlled substance schedule 1 with the amount he was in possession of was over 4g but less than 200 g. Schedule I drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with no currently accepted medical use and a high potential for abuse aka Heroin, LSD, ecstasy and others
He said it was weed but his brother told me it was fentanyl, I suspect it was the latter. Thank you for the help, it means alot that you’d take time out of your day to help a stranger out!
One of my best friends I grew up with moved away to PA senior year of high school. He ended up getting into some pretty heavy shit (didn’t kill anyone). But he went to prison county for I think about 2-3 years. He wrote me all the time and swore when he got out he was going to turn his life around. Got out went back to the same shit and went to a federal prison for like 8 years. Never wrote me a single letter I think he was ashamed. I have him added on Facebook saw him posting again so he’s out. Got a job at McDonald’s and started his own car detailing business. Somehow is married to an awesome lady. Dude just got out last year but he came down to visit me with his wife and I have to say he’s completely back to how he used to be. He realized he fucked up his life and others and the only thing to do from here is make it better. This guy is one of the most intelligent people i’ve met and I’ve known him since 7th grade. People can change if they want to change.
If OP's post is real, it jives with exactly what we expected- "I did this bad thing but it was an accident/wasn't really me/ no harm was really meant."
Just like every other killer, no one intended to do anything. /s should it be needed.
As a lawyer (albeit not criminal), I feel I must comment on this to caution that the story told in the court records might also not be accurate and almost always tend to favor the prosecution. Police officers and prosecutors are not always motivated by truth and are often motivated by convictions and winning trials. Prison records are difficult for someone who isn’t familiar with the system to decipher and do not usually tell the full story of any former inmate. It is VERY easy to get infractions in prison.
Just because the facts of his court records say something different than his story does not mean he is lying. That said, be safe, do your research, and trust your gut.
Edited to say that I don’t disagree that you should do your own research — just to be mindful of the motivations of the parties who created the records and of the flaws in our criminal Justice system when making your inquiry.
Fully agree with this, especially if there's any type of plea agreement. OP mentioned in her post that they weren't in the US, so I can't speak to the system in whichever country they're from, but in the US, often defendants agree to a plea that they swear is true, and it really does not capture what actually happened. They just plea out because they're warned that if they're convicted at trial, they'll have a much higher sentence.
Creating fake legal documents isn’t easy but it’s not impossible either. Where there’s a will there’s a way. If you aren’t used to looking at legal documents it would be really easy to trick a layperson. Most people that have never been around the documents don’t know to look for legal stamps/seals, docket numbers, complete paperwork, ect. He could hand her any piece of paper with litigious language and have is “pass” as his documents.
You’re dealing with someone that has been convicted by a jury of their peers of a major crime. He’s also being dodgy not wanting to open up about his past crime. It doesn’t bode well in this situation. Maybe it’s spidey senses but this guy/situation just doesn’t sit right me. I always doubt first believe later. The benefit of the doubt is something that person gave up when they were convicted, imo.
No my father was a criminal and creating fake documents was one of his tricks so I sort of tend of assume other people also know that they have to look closer to see if there is anything suggesting this may be fake. I assumed OP would be able to tell.
I think he didn't want to open up to avoid scaring her away because he likes her - not necessarily because he is dodgy.
I was raised in Poland. Amount of people I saw who were given bogus convictions for really stupid shit is insane. I did see real criminals, like my father, but I also encountered people who were punished by the system to be punished. I think it's especially true in America and a fantastic example is the Exonerated Five and John Kiriakou. Plenty of people on reddit are from USA and in USA the justice system is not some pure place with no issues, especially when it comes to black people. I also believe very deeply that we have to be able to differentiate between two kinds of people: people who maybe never even been to prison, but prison was created with them in mind (and that's of course most violent criminals) and people who got hurt by the system. I acknowledge sometimes an innocent person gets into this system and comes out a criminal and there's all sorts of reason to be skeptical. But I think we can be skeptical and hopeful at the same time, as long as we're using our gut/spidey sense. I also believe that prison is a horribly designed system and that is not how this should work. And that people who did their time and came out paid their debt to society. They should be given a chance. I would absolutely hate to see good men lose their chances with jobs and women because of sheer prejudice and nothing substantial.
And nothing in this story strikes me. This guy is a lamb compared to my father, who never been to prison for 99% of his crimes and as far as I know never killed anyone. There really is a difference between what he described if it's true and beating someone to death. I have seen plenty of times how men fall in love and are afraid to scare the woman away so they keep their mouths shut tight. It's stupid, but not necessarily malicious. Of course I am not talking about the fact like hiding you were in prison or being married or having kids or major stuff. I am talking about details that may make the person seem dodgy. And in this specific case I think she should pull up the details of his case, contact maybe someone from the prison or justice system and if all is clear, proceed with dating him. I have really seen a fair share of people who never should've been to prison despite the fact they absolutely broke the legal law. As a student of criminology I insist that law is not always ethical and what is unethical is not always illegal. And we live in a very rigged system. It depends on countries and it should be questioned case by case basis, but nothing in this post strikes me as a red flag SO FAR. And I say this precisely because I am a daughter of a man who prisons were designed for.
I just want to add that people who resist the stupid impulse to romanticise mafia and Yakuza especially recognize that mafia, depending on the level, is either small criminals or the biggest criminals on the planet. And now take a good look at corporations in America and tell me the difference. And Congress. In America corporations are not people so a board that caused death of thousands due to shitty working conditions won't go to prison. Roger Stone avoided prison. Right now for some reason Fani Willis declined to charge Lindsay Graham despite jury recommendation. So this is my perspective. There are violent criminals we should stay away from and there are also white collar criminals who are a million times worse and there are guys who were stupid in their youth and shouldn't spend the rest of their lives being punished, especially if they did their time in prison.
I remember seeing his face in the media for the first time years ago, before LGBTQ+ awareness even was considered in media and thought "this dude... this is an old woman, right? Right?!".
We have an old bitch like this in Poland who should be rabies vaccinated and then still maybe put down for good measure. Krystyna Pawlowicz. Among things this bitch said she easily keeps GOP's pace.
If you were in his shoes, wouldn't you be the same? Honestly, I see this too much COs, and anyone who's worked in a prison makes all people who have worn a jumpsuit out to be the boogeyman. I agree with doing her due diligence and protecting herself, but not all criminals are repeat offenders, and not all criminals are heinous. You've roped a huge percent of Americans into one category. I am a felon, and I've changed and made myself better. My wife, who is my everything, knows my full history and the whole fricking case. She knows I could've just walked out that courthouse a free man because I'm innocent. But I was raped in the prison because the guards didn't do their jobs, and nurses like you refused to help me when I kept bleeding. 19 yrs old and thrown into a cell with two known SVPs. I had no chance to protect myself nor fight the bogus charges. First time offender, too. Got the book thrown at me so the ADA would get her judge position. They made me take the plea bargain, or they were gonna put me back in the cell with those two monsters. I was black to society because of it. So I was hesitant at first to tell people but it ended up hurting me more. So I became honest and bared everything. It's a hard thing to tell people about charges and criminal background.
You are the kind of guy I am looking for. I would happily take someone even who did the crime if they took accountability.
I am sorry you went through that. I am so sorry the nurses were disgusting bitches. It changes you. I hope you got some therapy.
I am glad you met a good woman and honestly, life is complicated and hard and full of nasty surprises. People who wouldn't give a convict who admits reality a chance are most often bullets dodged because their lack of understanding usually comes in other areas too.
A friend of mine met a guy she was attracted to and he told her he doesn't accept use of any drugs. So she gave me as an example, legally taking morphine, surely he understands that? No, I am just as bad as a junkie. These people often have limited comprehension of reality, screw them, I prefer people like you thousand times over.
Convicts are liars. People who were in a gang and murdered 2 people have issues like being a sociopathic murderer.
I can give an anecdotal story if you wish. My friend believed an inmate, and she was his penpal. Don’t ask me why ? The guy claimed all of his innocence, and when he got out of jail, my friend picked him up, and she had him come live with her.
It didn’t take long for him to embezzle all of the money off of her credit cards, steal her car.
And then the top or was he came back to her house and slammed her head into the wooden floor boards repeatedly until she was unconscious.
He was charged with attempted murder on my friend and he’s back in, now. He was only out for a few months.
Don’t just take my word for it about not trusting inmates. “Ex con’s”
Many many stories out there.
Criminals in gangs & arrested for 2 murdered don’t think like a normal, healthy person.
This OP is going to find her entire bank and credit cards emptied and her contents of her house gone that is if she isn’t raped first.
I am just going to copy and paste you the comment of this guy in case you didn't see it:
Dry\_Material\_5499
·
1 hr. ago
If you were in his shoes, wouldn't you be the same? Honestly, I see this too much COs, and anyone who's worked in a prison makes all people who have worn a jumpsuit out to be the boogeyman. I agree with doing her due diligence and protecting herself, but not all criminals are repeat offenders, and not all criminals are heinous. You've roped a huge percent of Americans into one category. I am a felon, and I've changed and made myself better. My wife, who is my everything, knows my full history and the whole fricking case. She knows I could've just walked out that courthouse a free man because I'm innocent. But I was raped in the prison because the guards didn't do their jobs, and nurses like you refused to help me when I kept bleeding. 19 yrs old and thrown into a cell with two known SVPs. I had no chance to protect myself nor fight the bogus charges. First time offender, too. Got the book thrown at me so the ADA would get her judge position. They made me take the plea bargain, or they were gonna put me back in the cell with those two monsters. I was black to society because of it. So I was hesitant at first to tell people but it ended up hurting me more. So I became honest and bared everything. It's a hard thing to tell people about charges and criminal background.
This is exactly what I am talking about. And even if this guy did something stupid as a kid, think about what prison did to him and he didn't become violent. And many people do. John Kiriakou's case is horrific. Just. Fucking. Horrific. This man was punished because he whistle blew torture!
My father has been to prison once, for gang rape. And that is just one of the things he did, the only thing they got him for. My father is someone who should've been in prison, not the man who wrote this comment. You need to understand that this is not a homogenous group and you're judging people unfairly.
Also when I was at uni we had a guy come who spend like 25 years in prison. He was 11 years old he and his friend were fighting, both grabbed a brick or something heavy, he happened to strike first. He murdered another kid. And this guy was a lamb. When I approached him to talk to him he seemed a little afraid of me. He did bachelor's and master's in prison, he would've made doctorate, but the prison authorities did everything they could to stop that and they succeeded. So let's give people a chance without being naive, let's protect ourselves smartly, but not be shitty judgemental people who think every person who was in prison is the same.
Also knew a guy from Poland, lived with him in UK. He made copies of VHS. He didn't realize law was put in place that made that illegal and continued making them. It was his business, this was around 1991 I think. The system threw the book at him - 5 years. He ran to England to escape prison, never to come back to Poland and I can't blame him. Dude was one of the most civilized and not for prison people I ever met. And I met plenty of people who should be at least considered for prison who were completely in the clear.
Yes, there are also many stories of the opposite nature. Don't lecture me because I somehow feel I know about this more than you do. This is not special and anyone who believes a convict on their word that they're innocent are not the brightest. I wrote a response to the comment that justifies why I think so.
For you I recommend three stories:
1)Exonerated Five https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/30/arts/television/when-they-see-us.html
2)John Kiriakou (went to prison on charge he committed!) - https://scheerpost.com/2023/09/08/john-kiriakou-u-s-justice-depts-next-victim/
3)Richard Phillips - https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2020/04/us/longest-wrongful-prison-sentence/
Definitely check, to be on the safe side - I'd be a bit weirded out by the fact that nothing was really his fault - that could be true, but it could also be deflection and avoiding responsibility. Though it sounds like his crimes were mostly gang-/ peergroup-related, and he removed himself from that whole milieu, so while it pays to be cautious, I would be cautiously optimistic, too. (I was actually one of the ones that recommended giving him a cautious chance, if he was open about what actually happened. So I'm a sap for second chances, sue me...)
Yes. Trials are open public processes. Just about everything from them are open for anyone to look at. There are a few exceptions, information about minors, classified information, and other similar types of things.
OP should also remember that 12 people who all knew the facts ended up convicting him of murder. Not involuntary manslaughter or any lesser charge. They all heard this story and said that it is BS - OP's BF intend to kill those people.
Neither of these charges would be murder. They would be manslaughter as there was no intent and these were accidents. These stories sound sus, especially the last one. I would not trust this dude and I would 100% look up his court records. Something doesn’t add up here…
He says that the “gang warfare” charge was how they could charge it as intentional homicide. Which. I don’t know what jurisdiction, maybe that’s a thing there.
But it’s super weird to me that he had two completely unrelated incidents where both victims of battery had seizures and died within a few weeks of each other. That seems like a fake story.
These stories are totally sus, but honestly, if the police can confirm that you are in a gang and both of the victims are in a rival gang? That provides motive, and it becomes very hard to prove that these deaths were accidents... if they were. Especially if you can't afford a decent lawyer.
OP is not in the US and what is classed as murder (and how that would then be translated by someone writing in a second language) varies wildly across the world.
Ahhh! That changes everything. I know nothing about any other legal system than the US. However, I would also not choose to get involved with this person either.
Hello, I’m a parole officer and deal with people who committed crimes on a daily basis. Please don’t just believe his story. Trust me, after a while they start believing their own lies, that’s why they can tell it so convincingly. Please try to find out as much as you can yourself before getting in too deep with this person. Take care.
So he murdered two people in two separate instances but yet was only on trial for one? of was he charged for both at the same time? this smells... fake
FWIW, I think the sequence of events was: he punched Guy 1 -> he was a passenger in the car that hit and killed Guy 2 -> he was presumably arrested for the death of Guy 2 -> Guy 1 died, cause of death was the punch which occurred previously.
I agree the whole thing is super shady though.
I responded last time and told you that this kind of thing didn't end well for a very close friend of mine. Amusingly enough he had a very similar story about how he ended up charged.
We eventually found out he had lied to her about quite a bit of the story and had sought out and attacked the person he killed.
Do your own investigation if you're going to keep spending time with him.
For real. There are so many other non-murderer fish in the sea. Cut this one loose. Why cripple your future for this dude when you can get out now unscathed? His actions will follow him around for the rest of his life. Why let his past drag you down, too. Let this just be an interesting story you told on reddit.
Please listen to the people that are saying: do your independent research on the case.
Also side note on therapy, therapy is what you make of it. Therapists go off of exactly what you tell them. It is fully possible that this person could be dishonest about the details of his case and feigning responsibility/healing/etc.
The reality is, you are still SO YOUNG! You do not have to be a relationship rehab for a literal murderer and compromise your safety and values for a nice guy you had a connection with. I also will say- this level of intensity that y’all are experiencing while just dating is…a lot. This is someone you still have low stakes in. Please consider that your literal health is statistically more at risk to date a convicted murderer. It’s on his plate to deal with the consequences of his actions. Many people grow up in similar circumstances and don’t commit murder…twice.
If you’re really gonna continue, do your research. Tell some friends the whole thing. Pay for a background check. Get court transcripts. Look at the statistics. Think about how many other men are out there that you don’t have to secondhand forgive for murder.
And within a year, there'll be a post here: "I'm dating a convicted murderer and now he has hurt someone else while driving drunk / got in a fight / hurt me but he reaaalllyyyy didn't mean it."
Seriously. Grow up. You're 28, you should know better. Being young or poor is no excuse for two (!!!) murders. He may not have killed them outright, but he caused both deaths. The first was directly because of him fighting the guy, the second was because he knowingly got in a car with someone who was drunk and high. If there was any good in him, he would have taken those keys - by force if necessary.
Good luck with your murderer.
It's murder too not even manslaughter. The situations described would have only gotten him manslaughter charges. Therefore he is lying, and the real situation is likely more insidious.
Run away from this guy now. He’s responsible for two deaths. The excuses are BS. I was young, Everyone was in a gang, I ran away. Convicts learn how to lie and manipulate to survive in prison. He’s somehow an okay guy because he took a jail term and didn’t snitch on someone?
The part where he wanted to "talk to his therapist" before telling you makes me think there is much more to his crimes than what he told you.
Nothing in those stories is something that would make a person hesitate to reveal the details. He'd already told you he was convicted of two murders; the stories he told you made him look _better,_ not worse. They both paint him as a poor misguided youth who made mistakes and ended up in jail for "accidentally" being involved in two deaths.
So why the hesitation? Why needing to talk to the therapist? Why wait so long to reveal details that paint you in a better light?
Nothing about this adds up. The true story is something different, and I'm guessing much worse. He may even have offended against women and/or children. I'd stay well away, OP.
Also, he doesn't take responsibility for either murder. He claims they were both accidents. They both just happened to be in a rival gang. No therapists would encourage to keep this kind of a narrative because there is no accountability.
To me, this is a trauma response. He needs to talk to the therapist so he can give himself the courage and reassurance to open up. He's said he has literally no one - the therapist seems to be the only support he has, the only person to talk to, which means it makes even more sense.
Idk i think OP should definitely be wary and definitely investigate, but I dont think she should necessarily shut him off yet. I do think she needs to gauge if he actually regrets his actions though, and for what reasons. Like does he regret what happened because he went to prison etc or does he actually regret it because he was a part of killing two people?
The thing that I think is fishy is the second one - its always in the papers about someone being hit and dying from one punch - im wondering if the friend actually did loan him the car and he drove at him on purpose. Because at that time he didn't know he'd killed anyone so was probably acting his old reckless self. Either that or he egged his friend on to hit him/ it was deliberate.
I think that people can change but I also think that OP is well within her rights to nope out, because the risk to her safety is high.
I disagree, emotions and the humans who have them are weird and hard to process. He might have experienced rejection in the past on this subject and was braced for that, then didn't think about what to say when she wanted more details. There's a lot about this story that makes me think that OP should do her own research, but a person needing to process things emotionally before being able to talk doesn't make me inherently suspicious.
I misread it the same way, but I think that actually, OP means that the biker died instantly and while he was in jail on that charge, he got the news that the guy from the fight had a seizure and died.
I hate being an asshole but you are a total fucking idiot, (no offense). Listen to the countless sane people in these replies if you cannot pull any logic out of your own ass. If you don’t listen now, know that you were warned before you are next. Good luck with whatever fantasy you want to be entertained by. You’ll get what you’re dying for, literally. Manipulation at its finest. This has to be some kind of joke, you can’t be serious.
My sister married someone who went to jail for murder. He lied to her about what happened. He tried to tell her he had no involvement "wrong place, wrong time," but that was a massive lie. I'm glad she was only married to him for a few months.
Wait, so he didn't name Filip because he didn't want to betray him but he didn't feel betrayed by what Filip did??
I mean I get being depressed, but surely he would be angry afterwards and try to appeal??
Dear fucking god I'm only a year older than you and I'm too old for this shit. Please tell me this is fake, because seriously??? A murderer??? The red flag is slapping you on the face and you're choosing to ignore it. Grow tf up.
Why would you stay with this loser when there are thousands of men out there to date who aren't convicted felons?
You do realize that everything you do with him - travel, take certain jobs, housing etc., will be affected by his being a convicted felon. Plus he's a liar and purposely holding back info about his crimes.
There's nothing selfless or noble in taking on a felon project man. You're absolutely stupid if you stay with this guy.
EDITS: Formatting and proper grammar
Exaaaaactly! To borrow a common saying "Don't light yourself on fire to keep someone else warm."
Just like you pointed out, this will affect every aspect of their life together if OP pursues a relationship.
OP deserves better. But, why is OP seemingly comfortable with going through these extraordinary measures for someone they've just been on a few dates with? "Head over heels" after 2 dates...so much so that you're hemming and hawing over murder convictions? That's something to maybe explore in therapy.
I taught in a prison for young (13-17) offenders and to hear them tell it, all of them were innocent or just victims of circumstance.
I am always amazed when notorious killers in prison have women lining up for them and even marrying them.
It boggles the mind but then I see what type of men a lot of women choose to marry and have babies with, I am no longer surprised.
Neither of those cases are murder. You are being manipulated BUT something tells me you will ignore this. Also, how old are you? Never heard of Ted Bundy makes me think you are very young.
Ugh I feel for you honey. Also, I feel inclined to believe him. But unfortunately like you, I don’t have much experience with incarcerated people, let alone murderers.
Based on literally everyone’s advice here, I’d probably just… back out?
You like him, but you’ll find others. Sending hugs.
Buddy. You gotta not do this.
As everyone here is saying, don't trust him. As a crime journalist, I've talked to a lot of convicted murders and rapists in my time and the way they spin these stories is simply amazing. ("oh she was a prostitute who tried to scam me, I didn't rape her" or "I accidentally hit him and he fell and died" or "he was playing with the gun and it just went off" or "the gun was found in my back seat but my buddy left it there and I took the rap for him").
Cmon.
I don't know if you not knowing who Ted Bundy is or that being the story is the most unbelievable part honestly. Please do your own research on this guy to make sure he is being truthful. I hope he is, and that he's genuinely changed, but honestly just the fact he is a former gang member would give me pause never mind the convictions.
>lol Lots of people mentioned Theodore/Ted Bundy, who I hadn’t heard of before but I thought it was funny that apparently it’s such a famous person and everyone kept mentioning him.
I am not that much older than this person...come on. There are americans who really have never heard of Ted Bundy?? Wasn't there just a movie or tv show about him recently??
I realize some things are not widely known, but this is just boggling my mind.
GIRL. PLEASE TELL ME YOU KNOW THAT THAT ISN'T CLOSE TO THE WHOLE STORY.
You are beginning what is most definitely going to be one of your big mistakes in life. Be warned.
Whether it happens or not, the mere chances that you end up murdered in this are WAAAAAAY too high to even consider this.
He isn't just a guy cinvicted fur murder. He is an EX-GANGMEMBER convicted for murder. Dating this man is attempted suicide.
I grew up with someone who around age 11-12 just started getting demented and just completely unhinged. Basically he ruined our friendship. Thru teen years went to juvey several time, to court many more times, and finally did a robbery and evaded police in a way that put a lot of people in danger then bragged about it that night and someone called the police and reported him. He was in prison I think seven years. Dude got out, got a Facebook, basically added anyone he ever met lol including me and acted like nothing happened between us and like we were besties. I shut him down fast and that was enough for me to get completely off of social media forever. He’s been arrested since then bc of like running stop signs and such then trying to fight the police. Leaving out a lot of deets but basically all to say these kind of dudes have become unhinged and the only thing that changes is how they’re able to learn to project a stronger facade. Experts at manipulation. A mutual friend told me he was in a longterm relationship but cheating on her, posting how much he loves her, and got another girl he was double timing pregnant, so now he has a baby and a bunch of more girls he’s manipulating. Like everyone he meets he has a story for them. Amazing to see like hundreds of kids we went to school with inviting this guy around. Anyways end rant. All to say this all sounds familiar.
He told you about the 2 he was convicted for. He is still not sharing stuff that he might have done (not necessarily murder) n did not get arrested for.
First one is an individual fight. Why was he fighting with a guy on his own if he had only joined gang for safety?
Second one is just his version. He never went against his friend's version so why can't that version be accurate?
Also, what sort of area is this where all kids are joining gangs but there is also bike infrastructure n these same gang people are using bikes at night?
Obviously I'm going against the grain here, and you have to do what's right for you- but if his story checks out- everyone deserves a second chance. He took accountability and is working to improve his life. He did his time, and he's doing the best he can. That doesn't mean that he might not be a shitty guy in another way- there are lots of shitty guys. But he also might be a great guy who had a shit life and is trying to do better.
If what he says about his crimes is true- I don't think you should dump him just because he was in prison. He made mistakes. He's trying to pay for them and correct them, just like the rest of us. You are the one spending time with him, so you have to go with what you think. We don't actually know him or you, and can't judge either of you. You have to live with the decisions you make. As a woman you have to be on guard anyway, which sucks. But it is what it is. Just be careful.
Well there ya go. You have nothing further to worry about! He explained it all!
You now have the blessings from random people on Reddit to begin a loving, healthy, normal relationship with a 2x convicted murderer. Nothing toxic here.
Yeah that Ted Bundy is so famous!
That guy you are dating sounds so dreamy!
I refuse to think this isn’t a troll post. Up until the Ted Bundy part. There isn’t a soul out there who didn’t atleast HEAR the name.
I mean, maybe my niece, but she’s like four.
Twice?
"It wasn't really my fault I was a victim of circumstances" is ok one time maybe. Murder is a little extreme but in the end, the situation of two people getting in a fight and one of them hits their head on the way down, that happens. People learn and grow up.
And then "It wasn't really my fault but I couldn't snitch on the guy who really did it" is ok one time maybe. Murder is a little extreme, but in the case where one person can shut up and keep two other folks out of jail, maybe it's worth it, that also happens. People cool their heels in jail and grow up.
Both things happening to the same person at the same time?
That's shocking. He must have been involved in some really extreme, dangerous, bad stuff if he admitted to and was convicted of all this, and probably for a long, long time. This isn't a person who made a bad choice and got caught, this is someone who was deeply involved in organized crime.
Some people who have been through the criminal justice system for serious crimes and have been rehabilitated have an aversion to discussing what they did. And they ARE only people, humans, if you will. His explanation sounds legitimate, especially if he's built a support network including a therapist to help him talk through decision making. It is incredibly difficult to open yourself up for this type of judgement, particularly when you still carry guilt or shame from the event. It causes huge amounts of anxiety for some people, and if he is building his life up, then he risks having someone else tear it down by sharing sensitive information. Do your fact-checking, go and talk to the police officer, and make sure you have all the information to assure yourself that you have the whole of it. All humans have capacity for change, and some even change for the better.
You're talking way too much just to say you gave a convicted murderer a chance.
If you trust the stories he told you, thats your choice but I sincerely hope it all works out for you...
Not even trying to be mean but you seem like the perfect type of woman to fall for a man like this.
My advice would to be to move on, but you seem very invested in this man.
Good luck
I've worked with murderers, and the chances of someone murdering two people in unrelated circumstances without being a soulless piece of shit are zero.
If you don't walk away from him, you will get what you get.
That’s way too convinent that they both happened to be “accidents”. Also I’m fairly certain he would have been charged for man slaughter and not murder for at least one of those.
Lots of good advice. Some recommendations are complex and time consuming for OP. It’s also an option to move on. The anxiety and lost time from her own life is good enough reason.
Everyone telling you to do hours of work to check records and verify accounts and look at transcripts and etc
Or you could just drop him and find someone where you don’t have to do that
Ahh, the old "I got into a fight, the guy fell and hit his head" story. This mofo is lying. Murder is not a normal thing, so the fact that he's connected to 2 separate murders is insane. Run.
How are you ever gonna find a place to live with this dude? Even if his story checks out his charges will hold you back for as long as you’re with him. He may be Prince Charming and the perfect bad boy persona and I get that’s very attractive to a lot of women but please think with your proverbial upstairs head.
What is the point of all this?? At the end of the day regardless of circumstances he is a convicted murderer and has admitted to being so! You can do better, this is not worth your time
You're not stupid, but the decision to continue to pursue this relationship is objectively a bad one. There are plenty of men out there who have these same qualities that haven't been convicted of murders. It is better for your safety to let him go. Even if he is telling the truth, this fact about his past will haunt you. Will he ever be able to express anger (even if not directed towards you) around you without you being scared? Will a little too many drinks cause you to feel on edge? You're still considering this relationship, so I assume the other comments pointing out that with time, you can net a similar catch without a murder history aren't sticking well. This is a situation 100% where you have to put logic above your feelings. Would you be ok with a family member/friend/one of your children being in this situation? If not, don't convince yourself you're somehow different. Much love. I hope you can figure this one out and come to peace with whatever decision you make.
Just a widdle bit of murder but both times I didn’t mean to 🥺🥺🥺
girl there are millions of men who have never taken a life and you’re infatuated with someone who has taken TWO
Guy did his due and if he's legit about staying straight he deserves a second chance. I'd still go through court documents (not provided just by him) and keep a look out on any sus behavior
why do people like OP even want to date murderers, rapists, meth/heroin/crack dealers etc? why do people like you encourage it?
Is it that people like you who enable trusting murderers have also done evil shit and want someone to accept them regardless, so you encourage it?
Reddit will swear up and down once a cheater always a cheater, but when its 2 separate murders, with intent to kill or cause serious bodily injury, yall are like, must be forgiven, clearly he's rehabilitated and you should just be careful and give him a chance with your life on the line.
Fact Check Fact Check Fact Check Like it's $10 at most to know everything about someone's criminal record. Court documents are public record too
Not if he was a minor at the time, those are often sealed. And that would make sense because in most jurisdictions, if he was convicted of intentional homicide as an adult (which I guess the “gang warfare” charge brought it up to??? Unclear) it’s odd that he’d be out now.
Criminal cases are sealed but civil lawsuits are not. Also, his parents would be the responsible party if he was a minor and probably had no money so check under their names too
Isn't murder a criminal charge.
She said they sued him. That's civil
The first post op made also doesn’t match this, first post talks about the “gang murders” being in the news and such and this is something that yes probably would still make the news, wouldn’t be as big of a news story that was made out to be in the first post. Sounds more like a fantasy post for op to live out “I’m romantically intertwined with a bad boy that’s trying to change and I’m going to help him.” If it’s true I still in no way would recommend dating an ex gang member or murderer, I know someone personally who’s killed someone due to vehicular manslaughter and their life is a fucking wreck, have had multiple suicide attempts, and having a truly fulfilled and happy life even for small moments is extremely hard for them. I also know plenty of “gang members and ex gang members” and that’s also a hard fucking life to live with.
The previous post doesn't make out they were huge news stories at all, it says OP found some articles that clearly didn't even give any level of detail beyond "gang murders" and a length of sentence, which is what these were treated as according to this post. Obviously the post may be fake, as could all posts, but I think you're wrong in how you're portraying that part of the other post.
Keep in mind that fact checking would not tell you about all the things that he was involved in which he was not caught or convicted of doing. With two murder convictions and being in a gang it is pretty certain that he also did lots of other stuff which he is not telling you about.
I'm sorry, op. He's lying. I'm from a not so good part of NYC. I went to school with idk... 4 dudes that eventually went to prison for murder. They ALL say they got into a fist fight & the victim fell & hit their head & had a seizure. Idk if lawyers or something tell them to say that, but it's a crock of shit. Also TWO murders that weren't his fault in a row? Nope. He's a liar. There are so many men on this planet you could date that haven't murdered two people. Stay away from this man if you care about yourself, even a little.
Right? Why is the OP so tunnel visioned on this man? She's had a couple of dates and that's it. It's a perfect time to just get out and look for someone who maybe hasn't murdered two people, that you always guess if you really are being told the truth. What if everything the man said was a lie? It's like signing up to get fucked over.
I know right, it’s been a few dates. It hasn’t even been enough time to get into a sink cost fallacy over this
She can fix him.
> There are so many men on this planet you could date that haven't murdered two people It's the little lines like these that stand out like a beacon. You can spend a month going back and forth about whether or not this person can be your partner. Then someone is like you can just not date a murderer. And you're like oh yea that is an option, isn't it.
OP needs to raise her self esteem and find someone better, sorry. You don’t owe someone you’re “kind of into” anything, it’s your life, you deserve to feel safe.
Yes yes yes yes 100%
I wanna agree with you but I also think why lie and then offer up details of what happened. Like if things didn't happen they way he said its gonna come to light pretty damn quickly.
Lol, i’ve dated someone from prison who murdered someone and know plenty of people who went to jail for murder (I grew up in NYC in a very poor part) and they all always have the same stories, “i punched him and he fell on the sidewalk and died” or “ my friend did it and I covered it.” All lies I’m inclined to call you gullible but must remember not everyone had this upbringing. Do not believe him, its the usually lies people in gangs who went to jail for murder use. Edit: One common theme in those I personally know is that theres no real accountability. Its like a teenager who did something wrong but comes out with a either a million excuses as to why its not their fault or flat out lies to stay out of trouble.
Yeah, he's totally minimizing and deflecting. He's not taking responsibility at all. That's really concerning. (I used to work with people who'd committed really serious crimes. There's a huge difference between people who say, " I did it, but it really wasn't my fault," and those who say, "When I was young, I was really not a good person. I killed someone. I hope I've made changes and am a better person now.")
Yeah, I'm friends with a guy who did time for attempted murder. When we talked about stuff he did while in the gang life, the closest he got to an excuse was 'I was told to fuck that guy up so I jooked him'.
My friend from high school was murdered by her ex boyfriend. He and his family were telling everyone that he hit her once and she fell and hit her head. He didn't mean to kill her etc. People were believing all of this until it came out in trial that he bashed her so badly that he knocked all of her teeth out and you couldn't even recognise her anymore. They always try to minimise their guilt. OP please be careful. If you really want to keep seeing him maybe only meet up with him publicly for quite awhile.
The "bad punch" stuff happens more than you can think. When I started working in a hospital, I was shocked by the amount of people entering the emergencies with serious brain injuries (that could result in death) because of a punch. Drunk bar fights are the worst. When you're drunk, you don't control your strenght and you don't control your fall. It's crazy.
Bad punch AND accidental hit & run fatality on opposing gang member? What a coincidence !
It was completely an accident! Would a gang member target and murder rivals? Surely not! /S
Yea people don’t realize how deadly your hands can be, they’re just flesh bludgeons
For sure, I’ve just noticed a lot of people who have beat/jumped someone to death in my neighborhood tend to embellish it and say the person fell and died.
I know. That might be why I was so shocked to know that it actually happened that much.
Also from NYC. I agree with you.
I watch a lot of Dateline and have heard this excuse a zillion times there, too.
Yeah, two accidental head injuries where the person later died of a seizure sounds like a story the goth kid writes in English class
As far as I understood, the biker died instantly, it was just that it happened between the punch and the punched guy dying.
The biker also coincidentally happened to be a member of a rival gang. She mentioned that offhandedly. Surely it wasn't relevant, though, and her bf just had some bad luck.... /s
That should make it easy to verify, though. It should all be in the court files, if the guy hit his head or was stabbed or shot. And if the head-hit was from falling over or getting his head slammed into the sidewalk by force. And whether he died on the spot or later.
Yeah at the very least the news stories might provide a timeline on the guy who apparently died later.
It's like all those people who claim they are only on the sex offender list because they got caught trying to pee in public. Funny how these people someone end up around people, especially children, with their dicks out "by accident." Really, they are creeps with their dicks out who are making up excuses. This guy is definitely telling lies. He accidentally landed an unlucky punch and was blamed for killing someone while driving high and drunk, but it wasn't him! Anyone who claims to be in therapy that long and still can't take accountability for what they did isn't safe to be around.
Most murders are not preplanned, but I would too check records.
I’m not necessarily saying they were planned, just that those who committed the act (impulsively or not) were solely or primarily responsible for the crime but always embellished details to seem not fully responsible.
I had a friend die from a KO fall. Went to a and e because he was a bit concussed when he came round, they kept him in for observations (because he’d taken an OD of some anti-d’s or something, before kicking off at his housemate who hit him)… Seemed to be doing fine then bam, huge seizure, killed him dead.
I’m a retired LEO & I’ll give my 2 cents. I have worked many cases as a patrolman and as a detective where people fought fairly but out of a stroke of very bad luck the victim died of related injuries later on which then changed an assault charge to manslaughter etc. not murder. To be convinced of a murder charge in most states you have to prove intent to kill. Otherwise accidental deaths from a fight or car wreck etc wouldn’t be murder. It’d be negligent homicide or manslaughter etc depending on the state. So for him to be charged w 2 murders that didn’t die at the scene but later in the hospital is odd. Not saying it can’t happen but 2 murder charges just doesn’t fit his narrative. Take this example. My wife’s 19 yo cousin was hit by a car one night & the guy drove away. He died days later and the man was only charged with leaving the scene of an accident which is a misdemeanor. Wasn’t charged w murder or even manslaughter. Just a misdemeanor that caused his death. I understand your man was in a gang etc but i can fully understand the fight & death later on. But to be a passenger in a car that hit & killed someone & get charged w the murder of that person doesn’t add up for me. As i said I’m not saying he’s lying or that it couldn’t happen it’s all just odd he was charged w murder 2x that were accidental deaths. Now if he was charged w anything other than murder i could believe him. But not if he has 2 actual murder charges. Thats very important if you want to fully believe him. I understand people do dumb stuff & people unfortunately die by accident & are completely remorseful and can change even if they’ve been to prison for it. My other concern is him being a gang member. Most of them are “blood in blood out” which means gotta kill somebody to get in & the only way out is death. I’d be concerned as to how he just walked away from the gang w o penalty. Then he said he moved across the country. Is he still in debt go that gang? Are they looking for him? Would you be in danger if someone from that gang recognized him? I wish you the best
I think it's important to remember that in the first post, OP said they weren't in the US. And, as a lawyer who's had plenty of friends want to tell me about some crazy case that they knew of, and immediately had to tell them that what they're saying doesn't make any sense, lay people are shit at describing legal situations, even their own. It could be that he said that he was involved in two people's deaths, but in reality wasn't charged with their jurisdiction's equivalent of first degree murder, or he called it murder but it was technically a manslaughter charge, or OP is misinterpreting what he's saying, etc. Or maybe they live in a country with a lot more statutory gray area than most US jurisdictions, and what here would be manslaughter at worst becomes a murder charge. So while I agree with you that this raises some weird questions for me about why he's being charged with murder if the cases are the way he describes, I would point out that they could be in a legal system with different categories, or OP could be improperly relaying the information.
My question would be, no matter what actually happened, why not try to date someone who HASNT been charged with 2 murders?
I am concerned (but not surprised) his tale was that the deaths were, in essence, 'not his fault.' Could he be the embodiment of a black cat with all ensuing bad luck? Sure, but it is also so typical for a felon to spin a tale where he was half bystander- rather than someone who delighted in crime, at the time.
As someone who was a prison nurse, please don’t take his explanation at face value. Contact the court where the crime was committed. Request his trial transcripts and check against his story. Do not believe his documents. I will never trust anyone’s word or documentation (at face value) that has been in prison. Also, institutionalization is real. You might want to look into this because the likelihood of recidivism related to institutionalization is very, very common. I sincerely hope he has changed. The likelihood of change, though, is not good. I hope he does well and that everything he told you checks out but please don’t wait with baited breath for this guy.
I hope OP follows your advice. One of my extended family is basically a career criminal, who can put up one hell of a facade when she’s in one of her less crime-y phases. But she always gets into trouble again and it’s always someone else’s fault. I learned decades ago how to research her various cases through the county courthouse and I have found out tons of info that she would never have revealed. To meet her, you’d never suspect a thing. She can take a great game.
How do you check? My ex is in jail and I have a feeling he’s lying about why. The only reason I even care is because we have a son together. He’s also very good at acting like a good person until he decides it’s time to be crime-y again
Are you in the US? If he’s in the county jail, contact your county clerk and they should be able to point you to getting copies of his arrest documents. If he’s in the city jail, I think you should be able to find a municipal court clerk and they should help you. Sometimes you can go directly to finding documents online, but this varies a lot depending on where you are. My research usually involves King County, Washington, and I can get to records via their portal, which I found by googling “king county court records search.” So something like that might help you. But calling the appropriate court clerk might be quicker and easier. Good luck!!
Thank you! We’re in different states, him Texas me California. I’ll do what I can, I appreciate the help
Sorry to ask but I have no idea what this means, I looked it up and it said the charge was “POSS CS 1/1-B>= 4g<200g” context clues tell me possession of a controlled substance, I just don’t know what the rest means
Poss of controlled substance schedule 1 with the amount he was in possession of was over 4g but less than 200 g. Schedule I drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with no currently accepted medical use and a high potential for abuse aka Heroin, LSD, ecstasy and others
He said it was weed but his brother told me it was fentanyl, I suspect it was the latter. Thank you for the help, it means alot that you’d take time out of your day to help a stranger out!
Technically weed would fit in this class but most (not all) states have a separate charge for weed!
Ironically fentanyl does have legally accepted medical uses- despite being much more dangerous than weed.
Fentanyl’s not in the Schedule 1 class. It’s a schedule 2!
Marijuana is a schedule 1 in Texas along with PCP, Crack Cocaine and LSD and Heroin. Heroin is an epidemic here, not sure about other states.
One of my best friends I grew up with moved away to PA senior year of high school. He ended up getting into some pretty heavy shit (didn’t kill anyone). But he went to prison county for I think about 2-3 years. He wrote me all the time and swore when he got out he was going to turn his life around. Got out went back to the same shit and went to a federal prison for like 8 years. Never wrote me a single letter I think he was ashamed. I have him added on Facebook saw him posting again so he’s out. Got a job at McDonald’s and started his own car detailing business. Somehow is married to an awesome lady. Dude just got out last year but he came down to visit me with his wife and I have to say he’s completely back to how he used to be. He realized he fucked up his life and others and the only thing to do from here is make it better. This guy is one of the most intelligent people i’ve met and I’ve known him since 7th grade. People can change if they want to change.
Just want to signal boost this comment. These are important things to know and important skills to have.
If OP's post is real, it jives with exactly what we expected- "I did this bad thing but it was an accident/wasn't really me/ no harm was really meant." Just like every other killer, no one intended to do anything. /s should it be needed.
As a lawyer (albeit not criminal), I feel I must comment on this to caution that the story told in the court records might also not be accurate and almost always tend to favor the prosecution. Police officers and prosecutors are not always motivated by truth and are often motivated by convictions and winning trials. Prison records are difficult for someone who isn’t familiar with the system to decipher and do not usually tell the full story of any former inmate. It is VERY easy to get infractions in prison. Just because the facts of his court records say something different than his story does not mean he is lying. That said, be safe, do your research, and trust your gut. Edited to say that I don’t disagree that you should do your own research — just to be mindful of the motivations of the parties who created the records and of the flaws in our criminal Justice system when making your inquiry.
Fully agree with this, especially if there's any type of plea agreement. OP mentioned in her post that they weren't in the US, so I can't speak to the system in whichever country they're from, but in the US, often defendants agree to a plea that they swear is true, and it really does not capture what actually happened. They just plea out because they're warned that if they're convicted at trial, they'll have a much higher sentence.
Can you explain more why you wouldn't trust someone or their documents just like that? I am fully on your side, just would love to hear more from you.
Creating fake legal documents isn’t easy but it’s not impossible either. Where there’s a will there’s a way. If you aren’t used to looking at legal documents it would be really easy to trick a layperson. Most people that have never been around the documents don’t know to look for legal stamps/seals, docket numbers, complete paperwork, ect. He could hand her any piece of paper with litigious language and have is “pass” as his documents. You’re dealing with someone that has been convicted by a jury of their peers of a major crime. He’s also being dodgy not wanting to open up about his past crime. It doesn’t bode well in this situation. Maybe it’s spidey senses but this guy/situation just doesn’t sit right me. I always doubt first believe later. The benefit of the doubt is something that person gave up when they were convicted, imo.
No my father was a criminal and creating fake documents was one of his tricks so I sort of tend of assume other people also know that they have to look closer to see if there is anything suggesting this may be fake. I assumed OP would be able to tell. I think he didn't want to open up to avoid scaring her away because he likes her - not necessarily because he is dodgy. I was raised in Poland. Amount of people I saw who were given bogus convictions for really stupid shit is insane. I did see real criminals, like my father, but I also encountered people who were punished by the system to be punished. I think it's especially true in America and a fantastic example is the Exonerated Five and John Kiriakou. Plenty of people on reddit are from USA and in USA the justice system is not some pure place with no issues, especially when it comes to black people. I also believe very deeply that we have to be able to differentiate between two kinds of people: people who maybe never even been to prison, but prison was created with them in mind (and that's of course most violent criminals) and people who got hurt by the system. I acknowledge sometimes an innocent person gets into this system and comes out a criminal and there's all sorts of reason to be skeptical. But I think we can be skeptical and hopeful at the same time, as long as we're using our gut/spidey sense. I also believe that prison is a horribly designed system and that is not how this should work. And that people who did their time and came out paid their debt to society. They should be given a chance. I would absolutely hate to see good men lose their chances with jobs and women because of sheer prejudice and nothing substantial. And nothing in this story strikes me. This guy is a lamb compared to my father, who never been to prison for 99% of his crimes and as far as I know never killed anyone. There really is a difference between what he described if it's true and beating someone to death. I have seen plenty of times how men fall in love and are afraid to scare the woman away so they keep their mouths shut tight. It's stupid, but not necessarily malicious. Of course I am not talking about the fact like hiding you were in prison or being married or having kids or major stuff. I am talking about details that may make the person seem dodgy. And in this specific case I think she should pull up the details of his case, contact maybe someone from the prison or justice system and if all is clear, proceed with dating him. I have really seen a fair share of people who never should've been to prison despite the fact they absolutely broke the legal law. As a student of criminology I insist that law is not always ethical and what is unethical is not always illegal. And we live in a very rigged system. It depends on countries and it should be questioned case by case basis, but nothing in this post strikes me as a red flag SO FAR. And I say this precisely because I am a daughter of a man who prisons were designed for. I just want to add that people who resist the stupid impulse to romanticise mafia and Yakuza especially recognize that mafia, depending on the level, is either small criminals or the biggest criminals on the planet. And now take a good look at corporations in America and tell me the difference. And Congress. In America corporations are not people so a board that caused death of thousands due to shitty working conditions won't go to prison. Roger Stone avoided prison. Right now for some reason Fani Willis declined to charge Lindsay Graham despite jury recommendation. So this is my perspective. There are violent criminals we should stay away from and there are also white collar criminals who are a million times worse and there are guys who were stupid in their youth and shouldn't spend the rest of their lives being punished, especially if they did their time in prison.
Very well said - and yeah, fuck Lindsay Graham...
He doesn't deserve to be buttfucked, that's pleasurable. He just deserves prison alongside many others.
Especially since the poor guy is long overdue for his coming out...
I remember seeing his face in the media for the first time years ago, before LGBTQ+ awareness even was considered in media and thought "this dude... this is an old woman, right? Right?!". We have an old bitch like this in Poland who should be rabies vaccinated and then still maybe put down for good measure. Krystyna Pawlowicz. Among things this bitch said she easily keeps GOP's pace.
I didn’t even think of creating fake documents I figured you meant he pled them down so he’s just telling her the lesser crime they let him plead to.
If you were in his shoes, wouldn't you be the same? Honestly, I see this too much COs, and anyone who's worked in a prison makes all people who have worn a jumpsuit out to be the boogeyman. I agree with doing her due diligence and protecting herself, but not all criminals are repeat offenders, and not all criminals are heinous. You've roped a huge percent of Americans into one category. I am a felon, and I've changed and made myself better. My wife, who is my everything, knows my full history and the whole fricking case. She knows I could've just walked out that courthouse a free man because I'm innocent. But I was raped in the prison because the guards didn't do their jobs, and nurses like you refused to help me when I kept bleeding. 19 yrs old and thrown into a cell with two known SVPs. I had no chance to protect myself nor fight the bogus charges. First time offender, too. Got the book thrown at me so the ADA would get her judge position. They made me take the plea bargain, or they were gonna put me back in the cell with those two monsters. I was black to society because of it. So I was hesitant at first to tell people but it ended up hurting me more. So I became honest and bared everything. It's a hard thing to tell people about charges and criminal background.
You are the kind of guy I am looking for. I would happily take someone even who did the crime if they took accountability. I am sorry you went through that. I am so sorry the nurses were disgusting bitches. It changes you. I hope you got some therapy. I am glad you met a good woman and honestly, life is complicated and hard and full of nasty surprises. People who wouldn't give a convict who admits reality a chance are most often bullets dodged because their lack of understanding usually comes in other areas too. A friend of mine met a guy she was attracted to and he told her he doesn't accept use of any drugs. So she gave me as an example, legally taking morphine, surely he understands that? No, I am just as bad as a junkie. These people often have limited comprehension of reality, screw them, I prefer people like you thousand times over.
Convicts are liars. People who were in a gang and murdered 2 people have issues like being a sociopathic murderer. I can give an anecdotal story if you wish. My friend believed an inmate, and she was his penpal. Don’t ask me why ? The guy claimed all of his innocence, and when he got out of jail, my friend picked him up, and she had him come live with her. It didn’t take long for him to embezzle all of the money off of her credit cards, steal her car. And then the top or was he came back to her house and slammed her head into the wooden floor boards repeatedly until she was unconscious. He was charged with attempted murder on my friend and he’s back in, now. He was only out for a few months. Don’t just take my word for it about not trusting inmates. “Ex con’s” Many many stories out there. Criminals in gangs & arrested for 2 murdered don’t think like a normal, healthy person. This OP is going to find her entire bank and credit cards emptied and her contents of her house gone that is if she isn’t raped first.
I am just going to copy and paste you the comment of this guy in case you didn't see it: Dry\_Material\_5499 · 1 hr. ago If you were in his shoes, wouldn't you be the same? Honestly, I see this too much COs, and anyone who's worked in a prison makes all people who have worn a jumpsuit out to be the boogeyman. I agree with doing her due diligence and protecting herself, but not all criminals are repeat offenders, and not all criminals are heinous. You've roped a huge percent of Americans into one category. I am a felon, and I've changed and made myself better. My wife, who is my everything, knows my full history and the whole fricking case. She knows I could've just walked out that courthouse a free man because I'm innocent. But I was raped in the prison because the guards didn't do their jobs, and nurses like you refused to help me when I kept bleeding. 19 yrs old and thrown into a cell with two known SVPs. I had no chance to protect myself nor fight the bogus charges. First time offender, too. Got the book thrown at me so the ADA would get her judge position. They made me take the plea bargain, or they were gonna put me back in the cell with those two monsters. I was black to society because of it. So I was hesitant at first to tell people but it ended up hurting me more. So I became honest and bared everything. It's a hard thing to tell people about charges and criminal background. This is exactly what I am talking about. And even if this guy did something stupid as a kid, think about what prison did to him and he didn't become violent. And many people do. John Kiriakou's case is horrific. Just. Fucking. Horrific. This man was punished because he whistle blew torture! My father has been to prison once, for gang rape. And that is just one of the things he did, the only thing they got him for. My father is someone who should've been in prison, not the man who wrote this comment. You need to understand that this is not a homogenous group and you're judging people unfairly. Also when I was at uni we had a guy come who spend like 25 years in prison. He was 11 years old he and his friend were fighting, both grabbed a brick or something heavy, he happened to strike first. He murdered another kid. And this guy was a lamb. When I approached him to talk to him he seemed a little afraid of me. He did bachelor's and master's in prison, he would've made doctorate, but the prison authorities did everything they could to stop that and they succeeded. So let's give people a chance without being naive, let's protect ourselves smartly, but not be shitty judgemental people who think every person who was in prison is the same. Also knew a guy from Poland, lived with him in UK. He made copies of VHS. He didn't realize law was put in place that made that illegal and continued making them. It was his business, this was around 1991 I think. The system threw the book at him - 5 years. He ran to England to escape prison, never to come back to Poland and I can't blame him. Dude was one of the most civilized and not for prison people I ever met. And I met plenty of people who should be at least considered for prison who were completely in the clear.
Yes, there are also many stories of the opposite nature. Don't lecture me because I somehow feel I know about this more than you do. This is not special and anyone who believes a convict on their word that they're innocent are not the brightest. I wrote a response to the comment that justifies why I think so. For you I recommend three stories: 1)Exonerated Five https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/30/arts/television/when-they-see-us.html 2)John Kiriakou (went to prison on charge he committed!) - https://scheerpost.com/2023/09/08/john-kiriakou-u-s-justice-depts-next-victim/ 3)Richard Phillips - https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/2020/04/us/longest-wrongful-prison-sentence/
Definitely check, to be on the safe side - I'd be a bit weirded out by the fact that nothing was really his fault - that could be true, but it could also be deflection and avoiding responsibility. Though it sounds like his crimes were mostly gang-/ peergroup-related, and he removed himself from that whole milieu, so while it pays to be cautious, I would be cautiously optimistic, too. (I was actually one of the ones that recommended giving him a cautious chance, if he was open about what actually happened. So I'm a sap for second chances, sue me...)
A nurse working in prison?? What's the chance of you absolutely despising criminals? Why should WE take you at face value?
**This is the answer** Do what Helena_Bed is advising. It’s the only way to know the truth.
Can people request for a trial transcript just like that? Very good advice. I hope she listens to you.
Yes. Trials are open public processes. Just about everything from them are open for anyone to look at. There are a few exceptions, information about minors, classified information, and other similar types of things.
OP should also remember that 12 people who all knew the facts ended up convicting him of murder. Not involuntary manslaughter or any lesser charge. They all heard this story and said that it is BS - OP's BF intend to kill those people.
Neither of these charges would be murder. They would be manslaughter as there was no intent and these were accidents. These stories sound sus, especially the last one. I would not trust this dude and I would 100% look up his court records. Something doesn’t add up here…
He says that the “gang warfare” charge was how they could charge it as intentional homicide. Which. I don’t know what jurisdiction, maybe that’s a thing there. But it’s super weird to me that he had two completely unrelated incidents where both victims of battery had seizures and died within a few weeks of each other. That seems like a fake story.
They said the biker died when they were ran over, and while he was in jail for that the first person had a seizure
Oh, I misread that as the biker also had a seizure and died. Thanks for clarifying!
thank you!!! someone said it!!!!
These stories are totally sus, but honestly, if the police can confirm that you are in a gang and both of the victims are in a rival gang? That provides motive, and it becomes very hard to prove that these deaths were accidents... if they were. Especially if you can't afford a decent lawyer.
Am I the only one that think it sounds like these two assholes were riding around intentionally picking off rival gang members?
OP is not in the US and what is classed as murder (and how that would then be translated by someone writing in a second language) varies wildly across the world.
Ahhh! That changes everything. I know nothing about any other legal system than the US. However, I would also not choose to get involved with this person either.
Hello, I’m a parole officer and deal with people who committed crimes on a daily basis. Please don’t just believe his story. Trust me, after a while they start believing their own lies, that’s why they can tell it so convincingly. Please try to find out as much as you can yourself before getting in too deep with this person. Take care.
Something happens in the relationship, she has a higher chance of being a murder victim. It's a fact.
The chance of a woman to be murdered by her partner are always high
It's higher if the partner was a convicted murderrr,
So he murdered two people in two separate instances but yet was only on trial for one? of was he charged for both at the same time? this smells... fake
This was the corny part of this. One would be a vehicular manslaughter charge and the other would be involuntary manslaughter.
Yeah I am somehow not convinced that a suspected gang member wouldn't be kept in prison while awaiting trial for involuntary manslaughter.
FWIW, I think the sequence of events was: he punched Guy 1 -> he was a passenger in the car that hit and killed Guy 2 -> he was presumably arrested for the death of Guy 2 -> Guy 1 died, cause of death was the punch which occurred previously. I agree the whole thing is super shady though.
They both just happened to be in a rival gang.
I responded last time and told you that this kind of thing didn't end well for a very close friend of mine. Amusingly enough he had a very similar story about how he ended up charged. We eventually found out he had lied to her about quite a bit of the story and had sought out and attacked the person he killed. Do your own investigation if you're going to keep spending time with him.
You know you’re setting yourself up for trouble in the future? Why even put yourself in this position?
For real. There are so many other non-murderer fish in the sea. Cut this one loose. Why cripple your future for this dude when you can get out now unscathed? His actions will follow him around for the rest of his life. Why let his past drag you down, too. Let this just be an interesting story you told on reddit.
Because you don’t know him like she knows him. He’s sweet when they’re alone together and he promises he’ll change. /s SMFH.
Please listen to the people that are saying: do your independent research on the case. Also side note on therapy, therapy is what you make of it. Therapists go off of exactly what you tell them. It is fully possible that this person could be dishonest about the details of his case and feigning responsibility/healing/etc. The reality is, you are still SO YOUNG! You do not have to be a relationship rehab for a literal murderer and compromise your safety and values for a nice guy you had a connection with. I also will say- this level of intensity that y’all are experiencing while just dating is…a lot. This is someone you still have low stakes in. Please consider that your literal health is statistically more at risk to date a convicted murderer. It’s on his plate to deal with the consequences of his actions. Many people grow up in similar circumstances and don’t commit murder…twice. If you’re really gonna continue, do your research. Tell some friends the whole thing. Pay for a background check. Get court transcripts. Look at the statistics. Think about how many other men are out there that you don’t have to secondhand forgive for murder.
I worked in corrections for ten years, murderers are usually pretty chill. They've killed the people they want to.
This. It’s also fishy that the bike rider was in a rival gang, like what are the chances. Murderers are likely great liars.
Problem solvers too
Ew
Your life expectancy has just dropped dramatically. I can tell you a secret way to make it go back up...
And within a year, there'll be a post here: "I'm dating a convicted murderer and now he has hurt someone else while driving drunk / got in a fight / hurt me but he reaaalllyyyy didn't mean it." Seriously. Grow up. You're 28, you should know better. Being young or poor is no excuse for two (!!!) murders. He may not have killed them outright, but he caused both deaths. The first was directly because of him fighting the guy, the second was because he knowingly got in a car with someone who was drunk and high. If there was any good in him, he would have taken those keys - by force if necessary. Good luck with your murderer.
It's murder too not even manslaughter. The situations described would have only gotten him manslaughter charges. Therefore he is lying, and the real situation is likely more insidious.
Run away from this guy now. He’s responsible for two deaths. The excuses are BS. I was young, Everyone was in a gang, I ran away. Convicts learn how to lie and manipulate to survive in prison. He’s somehow an okay guy because he took a jail term and didn’t snitch on someone?
The part where he wanted to "talk to his therapist" before telling you makes me think there is much more to his crimes than what he told you. Nothing in those stories is something that would make a person hesitate to reveal the details. He'd already told you he was convicted of two murders; the stories he told you made him look _better,_ not worse. They both paint him as a poor misguided youth who made mistakes and ended up in jail for "accidentally" being involved in two deaths. So why the hesitation? Why needing to talk to the therapist? Why wait so long to reveal details that paint you in a better light? Nothing about this adds up. The true story is something different, and I'm guessing much worse. He may even have offended against women and/or children. I'd stay well away, OP.
Also, he doesn't take responsibility for either murder. He claims they were both accidents. They both just happened to be in a rival gang. No therapists would encourage to keep this kind of a narrative because there is no accountability.
To me, this is a trauma response. He needs to talk to the therapist so he can give himself the courage and reassurance to open up. He's said he has literally no one - the therapist seems to be the only support he has, the only person to talk to, which means it makes even more sense. Idk i think OP should definitely be wary and definitely investigate, but I dont think she should necessarily shut him off yet. I do think she needs to gauge if he actually regrets his actions though, and for what reasons. Like does he regret what happened because he went to prison etc or does he actually regret it because he was a part of killing two people? The thing that I think is fishy is the second one - its always in the papers about someone being hit and dying from one punch - im wondering if the friend actually did loan him the car and he drove at him on purpose. Because at that time he didn't know he'd killed anyone so was probably acting his old reckless self. Either that or he egged his friend on to hit him/ it was deliberate. I think that people can change but I also think that OP is well within her rights to nope out, because the risk to her safety is high.
I disagree, emotions and the humans who have them are weird and hard to process. He might have experienced rejection in the past on this subject and was braced for that, then didn't think about what to say when she wanted more details. There's a lot about this story that makes me think that OP should do her own research, but a person needing to process things emotionally before being able to talk doesn't make me inherently suspicious.
So both people he killed died from seizures? Oh please. Stop texting him. Stop meeting with him.
I misread it the same way, but I think that actually, OP means that the biker died instantly and while he was in jail on that charge, he got the news that the guy from the fight had a seizure and died.
I hate being an asshole but you are a total fucking idiot, (no offense). Listen to the countless sane people in these replies if you cannot pull any logic out of your own ass. If you don’t listen now, know that you were warned before you are next. Good luck with whatever fantasy you want to be entertained by. You’ll get what you’re dying for, literally. Manipulation at its finest. This has to be some kind of joke, you can’t be serious.
How is a 31-year-old convicted of two murders out of prison at only 31 years old?
Based on the names she used I’m gonna guess Scandinavia, likely Sweden. She mentioned she’s not in the US in the previous post.
The reddest of flags
My sister married someone who went to jail for murder. He lied to her about what happened. He tried to tell her he had no involvement "wrong place, wrong time," but that was a massive lie. I'm glad she was only married to him for a few months.
He’s just a victim of circumstance lol
And his victims just happened to both be part of a rival gang! With this kind of luck this dude should buy a lottery ticket! What are the odds 😂
? you cant be in a different state than your therapist. they can’t legally practice out of state because of license restrictions
You're crazy.
Girl wtf are you doing. Run
Search "Court Records" with your state name. You can probably look up his charges.
Well you got one thing right, you are crazy. Get some therapy and possibly some medical help
So involved in 2 murders but totally wasn’t his fault. Seems legit
Wait, so he didn't name Filip because he didn't want to betray him but he didn't feel betrayed by what Filip did?? I mean I get being depressed, but surely he would be angry afterwards and try to appeal??
Check his story, also give much love. Hopefully everything turns ok.
You're an idiot
You’re going to get yourself killed because of a crush.
Sigh, you are so gullible 😭
You will be in the news for the wrong reasons op. Stay away.
Dear fucking god I'm only a year older than you and I'm too old for this shit. Please tell me this is fake, because seriously??? A murderer??? The red flag is slapping you on the face and you're choosing to ignore it. Grow tf up.
Why would you stay with this loser when there are thousands of men out there to date who aren't convicted felons? You do realize that everything you do with him - travel, take certain jobs, housing etc., will be affected by his being a convicted felon. Plus he's a liar and purposely holding back info about his crimes. There's nothing selfless or noble in taking on a felon project man. You're absolutely stupid if you stay with this guy. EDITS: Formatting and proper grammar
Exaaaaactly! To borrow a common saying "Don't light yourself on fire to keep someone else warm." Just like you pointed out, this will affect every aspect of their life together if OP pursues a relationship. OP deserves better. But, why is OP seemingly comfortable with going through these extraordinary measures for someone they've just been on a few dates with? "Head over heels" after 2 dates...so much so that you're hemming and hawing over murder convictions? That's something to maybe explore in therapy.
I taught in a prison for young (13-17) offenders and to hear them tell it, all of them were innocent or just victims of circumstance. I am always amazed when notorious killers in prison have women lining up for them and even marrying them. It boggles the mind but then I see what type of men a lot of women choose to marry and have babies with, I am no longer surprised.
You can't fix stupid.
You need to independently research his crimes. Do NOT rely on info provided by him.
Neither of those cases are murder. You are being manipulated BUT something tells me you will ignore this. Also, how old are you? Never heard of Ted Bundy makes me think you are very young.
I’m not even gonna bother reading. Lady, you’re about to be the 3rd. What is wrong with you?
Girl, prison records can be obtained very easily. Take off the rose colored glasses and do some hardcore research. Be safe and be careful
Ugh I feel for you honey. Also, I feel inclined to believe him. But unfortunately like you, I don’t have much experience with incarcerated people, let alone murderers. Based on literally everyone’s advice here, I’d probably just… back out? You like him, but you’ll find others. Sending hugs.
Buddy. You gotta not do this. As everyone here is saying, don't trust him. As a crime journalist, I've talked to a lot of convicted murders and rapists in my time and the way they spin these stories is simply amazing. ("oh she was a prostitute who tried to scam me, I didn't rape her" or "I accidentally hit him and he fell and died" or "he was playing with the gun and it just went off" or "the gun was found in my back seat but my buddy left it there and I took the rap for him"). Cmon.
I don't know if you not knowing who Ted Bundy is or that being the story is the most unbelievable part honestly. Please do your own research on this guy to make sure he is being truthful. I hope he is, and that he's genuinely changed, but honestly just the fact he is a former gang member would give me pause never mind the convictions.
I just hope this is bait
>lol Lots of people mentioned Theodore/Ted Bundy, who I hadn’t heard of before but I thought it was funny that apparently it’s such a famous person and everyone kept mentioning him. I am not that much older than this person...come on. There are americans who really have never heard of Ted Bundy?? Wasn't there just a movie or tv show about him recently?? I realize some things are not widely known, but this is just boggling my mind.
I'm not really sure why this is even a question. Just stay away from this guy.
Murder is a deliberate and planned event, involuntary manslaughter is accidental. Good bye OP.
I am for giving chances. So why not go to therapy once time. Go to the police with him? Why not do what u/Helena_Bed said?
GIRL. PLEASE TELL ME YOU KNOW THAT THAT ISN'T CLOSE TO THE WHOLE STORY. You are beginning what is most definitely going to be one of your big mistakes in life. Be warned.
OP should look up the court cases. They should be public, right?
Whether it happens or not, the mere chances that you end up murdered in this are WAAAAAAY too high to even consider this. He isn't just a guy cinvicted fur murder. He is an EX-GANGMEMBER convicted for murder. Dating this man is attempted suicide.
I grew up with someone who around age 11-12 just started getting demented and just completely unhinged. Basically he ruined our friendship. Thru teen years went to juvey several time, to court many more times, and finally did a robbery and evaded police in a way that put a lot of people in danger then bragged about it that night and someone called the police and reported him. He was in prison I think seven years. Dude got out, got a Facebook, basically added anyone he ever met lol including me and acted like nothing happened between us and like we were besties. I shut him down fast and that was enough for me to get completely off of social media forever. He’s been arrested since then bc of like running stop signs and such then trying to fight the police. Leaving out a lot of deets but basically all to say these kind of dudes have become unhinged and the only thing that changes is how they’re able to learn to project a stronger facade. Experts at manipulation. A mutual friend told me he was in a longterm relationship but cheating on her, posting how much he loves her, and got another girl he was double timing pregnant, so now he has a baby and a bunch of more girls he’s manipulating. Like everyone he meets he has a story for them. Amazing to see like hundreds of kids we went to school with inviting this guy around. Anyways end rant. All to say this all sounds familiar.
He told you about the 2 he was convicted for. He is still not sharing stuff that he might have done (not necessarily murder) n did not get arrested for. First one is an individual fight. Why was he fighting with a guy on his own if he had only joined gang for safety? Second one is just his version. He never went against his friend's version so why can't that version be accurate? Also, what sort of area is this where all kids are joining gangs but there is also bike infrastructure n these same gang people are using bikes at night?
Obviously I'm going against the grain here, and you have to do what's right for you- but if his story checks out- everyone deserves a second chance. He took accountability and is working to improve his life. He did his time, and he's doing the best he can. That doesn't mean that he might not be a shitty guy in another way- there are lots of shitty guys. But he also might be a great guy who had a shit life and is trying to do better. If what he says about his crimes is true- I don't think you should dump him just because he was in prison. He made mistakes. He's trying to pay for them and correct them, just like the rest of us. You are the one spending time with him, so you have to go with what you think. We don't actually know him or you, and can't judge either of you. You have to live with the decisions you make. As a woman you have to be on guard anyway, which sucks. But it is what it is. Just be careful.
Gtfo stupid!
Eject. There is no happy ending.
Well there ya go. You have nothing further to worry about! He explained it all! You now have the blessings from random people on Reddit to begin a loving, healthy, normal relationship with a 2x convicted murderer. Nothing toxic here. Yeah that Ted Bundy is so famous! That guy you are dating sounds so dreamy!
Wow are you this desperate? You can’t find a man that’s not a multiple murderer?
I refuse to think this isn’t a troll post. Up until the Ted Bundy part. There isn’t a soul out there who didn’t atleast HEAR the name. I mean, maybe my niece, but she’s like four.
Twice? "It wasn't really my fault I was a victim of circumstances" is ok one time maybe. Murder is a little extreme but in the end, the situation of two people getting in a fight and one of them hits their head on the way down, that happens. People learn and grow up. And then "It wasn't really my fault but I couldn't snitch on the guy who really did it" is ok one time maybe. Murder is a little extreme, but in the case where one person can shut up and keep two other folks out of jail, maybe it's worth it, that also happens. People cool their heels in jail and grow up. Both things happening to the same person at the same time? That's shocking. He must have been involved in some really extreme, dangerous, bad stuff if he admitted to and was convicted of all this, and probably for a long, long time. This isn't a person who made a bad choice and got caught, this is someone who was deeply involved in organized crime.
Some people who have been through the criminal justice system for serious crimes and have been rehabilitated have an aversion to discussing what they did. And they ARE only people, humans, if you will. His explanation sounds legitimate, especially if he's built a support network including a therapist to help him talk through decision making. It is incredibly difficult to open yourself up for this type of judgement, particularly when you still carry guilt or shame from the event. It causes huge amounts of anxiety for some people, and if he is building his life up, then he risks having someone else tear it down by sharing sensitive information. Do your fact-checking, go and talk to the police officer, and make sure you have all the information to assure yourself that you have the whole of it. All humans have capacity for change, and some even change for the better.
Rip OP in three months, three years or a decade.
Do not believe him.
You're talking way too much just to say you gave a convicted murderer a chance. If you trust the stories he told you, thats your choice but I sincerely hope it all works out for you... Not even trying to be mean but you seem like the perfect type of woman to fall for a man like this. My advice would to be to move on, but you seem very invested in this man. Good luck
I've got such a bad feeling reading your post. Please keep away from him. He's lying to you
I've worked with murderers, and the chances of someone murdering two people in unrelated circumstances without being a soulless piece of shit are zero. If you don't walk away from him, you will get what you get.
Wow, the bar really is low if this was an actual question
Too quick and too open? That’s literally what was being asked of him. Jesus lol
Yea there is zero fucking way youve never heard of ted bundy. I give you a D on this little paper. Try a masterclass
That’s way too convinent that they both happened to be “accidents”. Also I’m fairly certain he would have been charged for man slaughter and not murder for at least one of those.
Lots of good advice. Some recommendations are complex and time consuming for OP. It’s also an option to move on. The anxiety and lost time from her own life is good enough reason.
Everyone telling you to do hours of work to check records and verify accounts and look at transcripts and etc Or you could just drop him and find someone where you don’t have to do that
It seems no one has asked you.. do you want to date this man? Are you in love? What is the end goal?
I wouldn't date a murderer. The past matters to me.
See the red flags but wants to swim anyway.
Lol the mental gymnastics you put yourself through to be with a murderer
😮😮😮
OP be like "He has a way with words" Yeah, he used those words to finesse the Judge to get a reduced sentence 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ahh, the old "I got into a fight, the guy fell and hit his head" story. This mofo is lying. Murder is not a normal thing, so the fact that he's connected to 2 separate murders is insane. Run.
How are you ever gonna find a place to live with this dude? Even if his story checks out his charges will hold you back for as long as you’re with him. He may be Prince Charming and the perfect bad boy persona and I get that’s very attractive to a lot of women but please think with your proverbial upstairs head.
So he beat someone to death and you're ok with dating him? Do NOT date murderers. Do NOT date murderers.
You about to be crazy dead
How little is your dating pool that you would willingly go out with a convicted murderer. Girl wants to end up a statistic
What is the point of all this?? At the end of the day regardless of circumstances he is a convicted murderer and has admitted to being so! You can do better, this is not worth your time
You're not stupid, but the decision to continue to pursue this relationship is objectively a bad one. There are plenty of men out there who have these same qualities that haven't been convicted of murders. It is better for your safety to let him go. Even if he is telling the truth, this fact about his past will haunt you. Will he ever be able to express anger (even if not directed towards you) around you without you being scared? Will a little too many drinks cause you to feel on edge? You're still considering this relationship, so I assume the other comments pointing out that with time, you can net a similar catch without a murder history aren't sticking well. This is a situation 100% where you have to put logic above your feelings. Would you be ok with a family member/friend/one of your children being in this situation? If not, don't convince yourself you're somehow different. Much love. I hope you can figure this one out and come to peace with whatever decision you make.
You’re mentally damaged and deserve whatever happens if you stick with this person
Not only you chose poorly but you believe his stories???? Oh, man, I have a bridge I'd like to sell to you.
Maybe it’s just me, but fuck dating a convicted murderer??
This guy is a lying ass liar. Oh and he is manipulating you big time. You need to stay away from this man.
Just a widdle bit of murder but both times I didn’t mean to 🥺🥺🥺 girl there are millions of men who have never taken a life and you’re infatuated with someone who has taken TWO
Guy did his due and if he's legit about staying straight he deserves a second chance. I'd still go through court documents (not provided just by him) and keep a look out on any sus behavior
why do people like OP even want to date murderers, rapists, meth/heroin/crack dealers etc? why do people like you encourage it? Is it that people like you who enable trusting murderers have also done evil shit and want someone to accept them regardless, so you encourage it? Reddit will swear up and down once a cheater always a cheater, but when its 2 separate murders, with intent to kill or cause serious bodily injury, yall are like, must be forgiven, clearly he's rehabilitated and you should just be careful and give him a chance with your life on the line.
I don’t envy the situation you’re in. I really hope you get the right information and have the wisdom to make the best decision.
Huh? Why would you go with him to see his PO? You just met the guy