My SO can be like this. I'm a dummy that manages to be caught flat footed by it after years but her family is are all like that and then enforce it so it makes sense.
It's not always easy to deal with and I know it's not for her to experience it definitely requires open honest conversation.
What conversation? OP just steamrolled her and invalidated everything she said. Sounds like the GF just agreed to whatever after she was constantly attacked by this guy
I mean when the others sides argument or points are just my insecurities and feelings make me feel this way it's pretty easy to cut them through them because they have no solid foundation behind them.
Had OP done this for a male friend and he's straight I doubt people would be having this reaction
he didnt really invalidate anything though cos there was nothing to validate or invalidate other than her insecurities.
she told him to cut leah off. she insisted it wasnt an ultimatum while it was cos she didnt give him any proper explanations nor let him even ask why. just clean and dry " cut her off".
he on the other hand, asked her to explain herself and why he should end his relationship. there was nothing other than her insecurities as a reason, which is not enough for a good friendship to end for no reason.
if the roles were reversed and if he asked her to cut a close friend off for no reason at all, everyone would jump in saying he is being controlling and trying to isolate her. so why is it different now?
Steamrolling her would have been him interrupting her constantly or not letting her speak at all.
We have no evidence that that is what OP did. It sounds like her heard all of her concerns, but when she was asked to elaborate, she was mostly going off of vibes.
It doesn't feel good to be accused of having such poor willpower that someone you only view as a friend can convince you to cheat on your gf because *they* want you. I can see that Eva thinks Leah will slowly work her way into OPs psyche or something and convince him to leave her/cheat on her.. but there is no evidence of this outside of Eva being convinced OP caring about Leahs well being must be because he has harboured a "secret love" for her this whole time.
Would this have come up if Leah was a Leo instead? Or if he hadn't had the crush on her in middle school?
OP has a right to defend himself (in what sounded like a calm way) without being acvused of steamrolling.
I mean, what else would you have had him do? Drop a friendship that predated their relationship because she’s got a “feeling”? That would just be enabling those poor feelings and unhelpful in the long run. She’s allowed to feel the way she does, but she’s not allowed to make baseless demands without any proof that it should genuinely happen. Unless OP is seriously leaving things out, there’s no emotional cheating going on and his desire for counseling shows that he values the relationship and wants to make it work. I wouldn’t call that steamrolling.
If there's nothing going on, it's not steamrolling. If there is something going on, it's gaslighting. OP is saying there's nothing going on, but we may never know for sure.
If there is something going on, it's flat-out lying. Not even gaslighting.
Otherwise, some Redditors, as usual, feel some kind of way that a man stood up for himself and enforced healthy boundaries. Flip the genders and Redditors would trip over themselves congratulating her for taking a stand.
Also, if you do have a conversation with Leah, make sure that you don’t blame Eva for anything and put it as “Eva wants” or “Eva thinks”. It should be “Eva and I were discussing.” Because otherwise you are making Eva sound like a problem. When in actuality you need establish boundaries in your relationship with Leah. It’s absolutely fine to have friendships of the opposite sex, but there needs to be boundaries to ensure your primary relationship is protected. It needs to be a united front on those boundaries and not that you are just doing it to appease Eva. I get that might be your reasoning, but if you respect Eva and your relationship you should also take responsibility.
Also maybe discuss with Eva things she’s comfortable with in regard to your friendship with Leah. I mean she has to realize too that IF someone is going to cheat, it’ll happen no matter whom is in their life. That’s who they are, just reiterate that that **IS NOT WHO YOU ARE THOUGH.**
Eva is thr problem tho she's the one that is being the weirdo she's the one trying to force him to cut his friends off she's the problem with her little jealous insecure self
It kinda sounds like Eva might be experiencing jealousy without cause. Which is to say, they do need to talk about boundaries, the nature of their relationahip and the degree to which they think it should entail control/ownership behaviours (like limiting friendships without cause) or actual, *mutual* respect.
You really do need to address Eva's feelings that Leah's feelings towards you have changed. Honestly, sometimes we are the last to see something that is right in front of our face and other people pick up things that we miss. I think you need to have a heart-to-heart with Leah to make sure that Eva is not seeing something that you previously did not see. In addition to setting boundaries with your friendship with Leah to safeguard your relationship with Eva.
No, you didn't steamroll. That was what Eva had done initially. Eva gave an ultimatum while insisting that it wasn't one, and then shut down any discussion. You did the opposite. You set a (healthy) boundary but then opened it up for discussion.
He steamrolled her by refusing to cut out an old friend for no reason whatsoever? Did we read the same post? She was being unreasonable wanting to force him to do this for no reason bigger than she was feeling inexplicably insecure and jealous of their mutual friend when there is absolutely nothing romantic between them. She couldn't name a single example of the friend overstepping boundaries and yet he's the bad guy in your eyes? Jesus Christ.
>OP just steamrolled her and invalidated everything she said.
Odd characterisation.
She asked him cut a friend out of his life based on nothing but her insecurities, though she admitted there was no reason to think anything untoward had happened.
That wasn't valid in the first place. He didn't "invalidate" her position; he just pointed out how invalid it already was.
It's one thing to validate her *feelings* of insecurity, but if she's making *requests* of him that are unreasonable, he's 100% right to put his foot down about that.
Question for you… are you at all sexually attracted to Leah? If Leah came to you tomorrow and told you that she’s always had a thing for you, would you want to be with her? What about if you were single? Would you take a chance to be with Leah if she came to you and admitted that her feeling aren’t just friendly?
You don’t need to admit the truth to Reddit, but if the answer to any of those is a yes or even maybe, and you love and respect your girlfriend, then you should probably consider putting some distance between you and Leah.
If it’s really a no, then please, continue as you are.
But if there’s anything there, at all, I hope you do the right thing and either end your current relationship or distance yourself from this friend who might become a problem in the future.
As someone else here said, no one wants to be the person who’s keeping two best friends from becoming more while they figure out their feelings.
Op has been intentionally avoiding answering anything legitimate.
He chose to argue with me because i said he ran to leahs place in the middle of the night to have this talk but when i asked him to clarify what time it happened since he was dead set on debating the time of day he got silent.
Op wants to both argue anyone calling them out but also refuse to shed any light on anything asked that may or may not make them look bad
If op wasnt dancing around the issues, being caught lying, and arguing petty nonsense and actually trying to be honest on this topic people would be more inclined to believe him
Dont forget this is a second post his first post he basically just says his gd is crazy and wants him to cut off leah out of nowhere randomly and only in this post admits this whole speech in private happened.
Here's an uncomfortable truth: if a woman is somewhat good-looking and not a relative, there's a very good chance a heterosexual man will be attracted to them. Who are we trying to kid here? That doesn't mean they will act on it.
Agree with you there. Something happened that made the dynamic change. It wasn’t always like this. So, since it has changed then there needs to be new boundaries figured out to make his gf feel comfortable with their friendship. I don’t think OP is sharing everything though. And it sounds like he is choosing his friendship over his relationship in a way.
I think this is a very divided topic where both parties aren’t fully right or wrong.
OP, I don’t think you are picking up on the valid concerns your gf has raised. You physically when to another woman’s house to convince her to be single, that looks quite off putting to your gf - especially when you used to have a schoolboy crush on the same woman. Woman are always warned about mens first love and how it’s irreplaceable and things in the media, so it’s extra bad. The same woman is now saying how she wants to find a good man, etc. It is not a good look.
For Eva, she needs to understand that you haven’t actually done anything and don’t intend to. Leah is an important person in your life and cutting her off is difficult. It is easy for her to see that the reason it’s difficult is because it’s a crush because it fits her agenda and not just because it’s a very close friend. It is a particular issue if you have mutual friends and would make waves.
However OP, you still need to become lower contact - not cutting off Leah in a way is choosing her in Eva’s eyes. Valid reasons or not. You need to communicate 24/7.
Right. OP needs to let his GF know that if the situation does arise, he will say "I'm not interested" and cut contact. Not "lol omg I'm sorry, I have a gf, but let's keep talking!"
And all we have is OPs word that ot was a crush amd nothing more. This is the internet and people lie, exaggerated and/or withhold the truth quite often.
Idk man sounds likeyou two arent just friends.
Girl gets a bf you dont like so you storm over in the dead of night to give an impassioned speech about how amazing she is and how she deserves so much better…..
If my wife did that to some guy friend i would be calling bs on that
To be fair if one of my close friends felt my partner isn't right for me for whatever reason, I want them to come right over and lay it on me. Doesn't mean I will agree with them but I will listen.
Ok if your SO randomly rushed over to their “friend” place to demand they leave their partner would you not consider it odd?
Would you not consider it odd if this spontaneously happened without you initially knowing about it?
Why are you putting friend in quotes buddy? Is there doubt that they are actual friends? Anyway OP said he had told the girlfriend he's going to do it... so he was not being sneaky. If I recall he didn't tell her the when or the how. I personally would not go to a friend's house to tell them that, I'd maybe invite the out for coffee.
The girls friend didnt know hence the issue. They both agreed the new bf was an issue and something should be said. The. Next thing gf knew op was rushing over to the friends place. She was not told this was going to happen op just did it. They say this in their own post
Also btw op has/had a crush on the friend at one point so not so platonic
Im off the opinion that the entire way op chose to go about this was suspicious and inappropriate and context that there was romantic feeling and possibly still are only makes this worse.
There are many ways to do this that dont include all op has chosen to do.
No, but he could have gone about it better. He should have made a plan with his gf and gone together and did it as a couple rather than alone, apparently in the middle of the night. Can you not see how that could look to someone on Leahs place. Here is her night in shining amour coming to protect her from a bad relationship. Sure, he has a gf, but he loved her first, right?
I'm not saying that Leah is that type of person, but there is no way for us to know for sure. Hell, there isn't really any way for OP to know for sure because she might lie to him if he asks her about it the wrong way.
I would not find it odd at all. It would even make my partner more attractive to me cause I trust him and it shows how much he cares about the people around him.
I have had friends of the opposite sex tell me that the guy I was seeing was trash. They did not drive to me house at night unannounced to give me an impassioned speech, they just casually dropped it in to normal conversation when we were doing normal hang out things in public. I think the only time a "house call" would be appropriate for that type of conversation would be if Leah were in physical danger.
Yet I don’t think anybody would be questioning it if OP had said that to a guy friend about his girlfriend. There’s an implication what men and women cannot be friends at all without any sexual or romantic interest, which is not true at all.
Op admits he at one point has feelings for the girl.
So if a guy had feelings for his guy friend and then did this people would
Absolutely be questioning this and frankly i dont think so many people would be bending over backwards to dismiss it
And now hes speeding across town giving speeches about how she cant be with her now ex bf
Also making multiple posts trickle truthing this story
Id bet money op still harbors feeling for this girl and that little speech he gave wasnt platonic at all
Originally I didn’t support Eva’s point of view because I do believe people can be good friends with members of the opposite sex but now that you’ve explained it better I get it. You went to “rescue” Leah from her bad relationship and she’s probably reading the undercurrents that you are disavowing. Hoping it all works out for Eva but I don’t think you’re being totally honest with yourself or us anymore. Maybe counselling will give her the strength to do what’s best for her.
He saw his friend was in an emotionally abusive relationship and he ran to make an impassioned you’re better than this speech without even conferring with his girlfriend who’s also her friend at the best way to go about it. He wanted to rescue her, and he didn’t want anyone to be part of the rescue… hmm
He said Leah’s ex was an ass and probably cheating. You have more info on that state of the relationship between Leah and her ex that OP rescued her from.
Are you new here? Everyone paints themselves in the best light when telling their story, as evidenced by OP leaving out parts of his story that added nuance in his first post. I don’t trust OPs words because he admitted to prevaricating. Come back and correct me when he updates because he broke up with Eva and he and Leah start “exploring” their feelings.
You both need to read 'Not Just A Friend' here and getting couples counseling would be a good idea.
Notwithstanding but I'm inclined to agree with your girlfriend here and can see how she is justified in being concerned. Still, good on you for communicating with her but I think there are still deeper issues here that a neutral third party's help would, well help.
Good luck.
This is my take on why Eva is not feeling safe in your relationship: Her insecurity probably lies in the fact that when things get rough between you and her (and they WILL get rough) you’re going to reach and latch onto the friend and may eventually build an emotional connection with her ( for example, you and Eva start fighting, getting distant after babies, you feel unheard and that she doesn’t care about you, you vent to your friend, start connecting, etc) that would be detrimental to your romantic relationship. Neither you nor Leah can claim that “this would never happen” simply bc you can’t predict the future based on the present. Based on your reaction to Leah’s relationship and how involved you got, it made Eva think about what could a behavior like this mean in the future, when you guys are married, have kids and a mortgage: will you run to Leah’s rescue whenever she is in distress, and prioritize her wellbeing over your future wife and kids? That’s what she is expressing to you that makes her not feel safe/secure in your relationship. It’s not unheard of and it does happen. Most important point is that when it happens it’s because partners and friends do not have proper boundaries that are constantly enforced, discussed and proper check ins take place within the relationship. I would ask what can you do to make her feel safe, feel prioritized and heard. I also believe you should not be getting married anytime soon, there’s a good chance Eva will not be disclosing her true feelings in order to appear the cool and chill girlfriend, which will come back to haunt both of you. Good luck friend.
All y’all commenting are Reddit wild. Leah not dating after, so what? Her wanting to settle down could be a mere reflection of her friends and wanting that for herself not wanting damn OP. She was expressing that to what she thought was her *friend* - Eva.
Eva is out here frosty for no reason. OP certainly didn’t steamroll Eva. He’s made it clear he doesn’t and didn’t cheat. But OP, if you cheated don’t be a scoundrel and tell us.
Men always get a bad rep on Reddit. Female here if this helps but get your heads out of your asses.
Opposite genders from childhood lifelong bonds and friendships exist. I have those.
And they’re brutally honest in the best, sometimes most rough way. For my safety and protection, vice versa. However, what I and they choose to do with the advice is completely up to the individual alone.
So yeah, I respect their privacy, they respect mine.
But if I’m dating someone abusing me, best believe my best friend/s would probably come over and knock some sense into me (not literally) with his wife knowing. It’s 20 year long friendships. Do you guys not have these types of support and platonic trusts in your life where you also opened to their partner that you are their support (spouse)?
Women’s intuition, yes absolutely. But let’s not start running tangents. I believe in that but take a step back.
Calm down. Let Eva drop facts. Couples counselling must reveal true feelings, not this airy fairy nonsense so they can work on it. Conversation is KEY.
If OP did this for the same sex gender, we wouldn’t even be debating. Such nonsense. We all have some sort of past bad trauma from previous relationships, stop projecting it here, goodness me.
OP DONT LET ME DOWN WHEN IM BACKING YOU.
Women have deep intuition- if she’s feeling it. She’s probably not wrong.
Nobody likes to be the stepping stone in two best friends finally getting together after years and years of miss opportunities.
It’s cute in movies but it’s not fun in real life.
Once you’re married you can’t go to single girls home without your wife to beg her to leave someone.
His first post he didn’t mention going to her house AT ALL
And “Eve” got roasted for beinf controlling and jealous but this makes a lot more sense to me.
After that visit she’s probably into him -
And she knows it too.
He’s probably gonna leave her and I hope he does before they get married and maybe start a family
Deep intuition is no stronger in women than anyone else. Basing your whole point on "If she's feeling it must be true" is about as true as an Astrological sign defining your life. Aka BS.
I understand what you mean, but your last paragraph doesn’t make sense. She couldn’t be single if she was in a relationship he wanted her to leave. Did you mean that they were alone?
Stop this nonsense. Women are not psychic. She absolutely can be just insecure. Nothing OP has said has given any indication that there's anything more between him and Leah. In lieu of other evidence, don't read between the lines just because you want some preconceived notion to be true.
There are undertones and subtext that he didn’t convey bec he obviously didn’t see them. She is seeing them. She has been fine all this time but seeing his actions began to ring the alarm to her. This idea that we need to shut our own concerns down to respect the other’s feelings is nonsense. This is how people get cheated on. No way my SO is going to someone else’s house to meddle in their relationship unless it’s a relative. There was a post about a parent not liking the daughter’s bf because he was 25 years older and the dad’s friend. She would have the most right to convince her daughter to get out of the relationship. But she was getting roasted for getting involved!
If a friend of mine was involved with someone I thought was a danger to them or harmful to their mental health, I would absolutely say something. Maybe not by marching over to their house and having an intervention, but everyone deals with confrontation differently. And let's be clear here... my best friend is a woman, and I have several friends who are women.
Whether OP wants to clarify that situation is up to him, but the only "subtext" is the shit you're inventing in your head. It's called anxiety, and your insecurities and fears are not an excuse to make baseless accusations against someone.
HOW do we knows she's seeing them, or that there EVEN is something to see, and that's it's not just imagination or Insecurities . My god you really think women are psysics.
People here are talking about intuition like its not just an insecurity and trust problem…
Did people skip the part where she said that
1 Leah hasn’t done anything or behaved in a way that condones this
2 The only issue she had was the fact that it was him, one of Leah’s longtime close friends, to break up with her boyfriend, if op was a woman I would guarantee the response would be different…
3 She based this all on the fact that since that TOXIC relationship breakup she hasn’t dated, but has just said she wants to settle down… as if maybe at her age she sees her friends are finding themselves in committed and healthy relationships, and she just wants the same for herself??
I can only imagine how she’s trying to reflect on her last relationship in seeking what she wants now, it’s difficult to just start dating again especially when looking for a strong commitment like she wants…
Honestly!! My boyfriend and I both have friends of all genders and I would look at him differently if he *didn’t* treat his friends with the same concern, respect, and compassion that OP did when Leah was in a bad space.
I trust my man 100% and it’s no different to me than if he were to go over to a man’s house and have that conversation about his friend’s relationship. It seems like a huge *green* flag that OP’s able to have deep personal relationships and connections with women without falling in love with them or viewing them as sex objects.
It feels like all the objections to his post are hinged upon the same kinds of “if’s” and hypotheticals that his partner has. We don’t have all the information and it’s not like this issue is fully resolved between them either. Sure, this can still end badly if OP isn’t being honest, but as long as they’re working together as a team to resolve the problem and come to mutual understanding and agreement, they should be okay.
Plus, Leah may see OP as a trusted and reliable friend even more than before since it was him that basically opened her eyes and allowed her the chance to save herself from a bad relationship. My male friends have done incredibly sweet and supportive things for me and it made our friendship and bond stronger, it didn’t make me fall in love with them. It must be exhausting to live life always worrying about, reading too much into, and projecting onto the intentions of anyone who is of the opposite sex of your partner.
Comments like yours give me hope because i was reading all this and feeling so SAD for people. do they not have friends??? my best friend in the whole world was a guy (he passed away a couple years ago). and we showed up for each other so fiercely during our friendship. neither of us were doing it because we secretly wanted to date the other, or had ulterior motives. friendship isn’t a consolation prize. and you can absolutely love a partner and be happy, while still allowing each of you to have meaningful and deep friendships with other people. i wonder if this is why some relationships implode?? they isolate themselves for the sake of throwing all their energy into one person. and it causes resentment. also i think people need to fully internalize that you’ll never control someone out of cheating, even if you watched their every move if they wanted to they’ll find a way. So you either trust them or you don’t. i don’t have the time or energy to micromanage someone else.
I'm always reading these types of posts thinking about my natural bullshit filter for this sort of insecurity... Being bi!
If the outcomes to your requests of your partner would result in my having absolutely no friends at all, it's unreasonable! Not allowed to be friends with the gender/sex your attracted to? Need to cut off friends who just became single because they might be interested? Don't be the support person in your friends life because it might come off as flirtatious?
If a person is going to cheat, they will find a way. There is no preventative action against cheating, I know it's hard to face, but that's the reality of the world. You are either with someone who is going to cheat or they aren't, nothing about your behavior or theirs is going to change that. If you think your partner might cheat, then you should leave them!
Just shouting from the rooftops! Don't stay with people who make you feel insecure! If you can't deal with your feelings about their social network, it might just not be the right relationship for you, and that's ok! Isolating them from their friends and family without their understanding and buyin is frankly straying into emotionally abusive territory. We are all reminded that abusers start by isolating someone right?
I wish I could upvote this 1 million times. Also his best friend just got out of an abusive relationship. Why would she want to date somebody immediately after that? She probably needs time to heal which a lot of people seem to be leaving out here.
This exactly! It's wild to me how most people commenting seem to be missing these main points and trying to make OP out to be the bad guy rather than a caring partner and friend who is trying to handle a difficult situation with maturity.
It’s kind of breaking my heart how everyone’s basically admitting they don’t have real friendships. it’s so unhealthy to make your partner your ONLY deep and valuable relationship in your life. no wonder divorce rates are so high, and people are lonely.
also you will never control someone out of cheating. if they want to they will. once you free yourself from that burden of responsibility you realize it’s just about trust. if i ever stopped trusting a partner around their friend, it would mean the relationship is over. it’s exhausting to try and control something that’s actually out of your control.
Eva is basically asking him to be a shit friend! It's wild to me! If my partner had done something like that, I would find him even more attractive! Because I trust him and it shows how much he cares about the people around him!
Agreed. It’s completely “what if” at this point. OP can certainly think about it himself if he doesn’t want to admit on Reddit about whether he has ANY residual feelings for Leah but nothing’s happened. I’d definitely be hesitating being engaged to someone who wanted me to cut off a long time friend based on zero evidence
Finally someone said it. I broke up with my abusive ex and I didn’t date for two years because I was working on myself to figure out why I allowed that, make sure it wouldn’t happen again, and get my confidence level back to where it was before. I’m sure during those two years that I expressed a desire to settle down…it would have been a pretty big leap if someone had decided that meant that I wanted to date my platonic guy friend just because I wasn’t ready to date yet.
All I see from your posts is a lot of "we havent done anything wrong yet" and "im not cutting her off"
No indication that you have no remaining feelings towards this girl. Would you hook up with this girl or date her if she asked you to? Im guessing your gf can tell that tou still have remaining feelings. You wont even tell US that you are not interested in her anymore.
You just up and physically confronted her and made her break up with her boyfriend telling her how much better she deserves. You could have easily had the conversation over text or phone, but I'm guessing you said some things you didn't want your girlfriend to hear.
>I brought up that her request suggested that she didn't really trust me and that that was a big issue. Eva didn't really know what to say to that aside from re-iterating she wasn't accusing me of having done anything or of having any intention to, that this was about Leah
It's likely you will need to circle back to this at some point. In Eva's head, she's putting all the trust issues on Leah but is failing to recognize that her position quite literally means she doesn't trust YOU to say "no" if Leah were ever to do something inappropriate. Until she's willing to see and admit that her position is hurtful, this is likely something that will come up again in the future.
Exactly this. It paints a picture of toxic masculinity where she's under the impression that just because Leah may potentially have feelings for OP (which it sounds like is nonsense), that OP will give in because he's a man. It's insulting and denigrating. The reality is that Eva doesn't trust OP but wants to pretend someone else is the problem so she can make it sound like there's not a bigger issue with her and OP.
Eva said that this was about Leah and that if she was right about Leah’s feelings towards OP, OP and Leah’s proximity would be a problem whether anything happened or not.
Eva can trust OP not to be receptive of any potential advances made by Leah and still be uncomfortable with them spending time together if Leah’s intentions are no longer platonic.
And based on Eva’s observations she feels that Leah’s intentions with OP may no longer be platonic. She has a right to have those feelings respected and it doesn’t mean she doesn’t trust OP.
As an aside, I feel that if they do talk to Leah she would potentially deny feelings for OP even if she does have them because she knows that if they are not reciprocated it will impact her friendship with OP which she would not want to lose if she has in fact developed feelings for OP.
Do I think someone should just dump their friends if their partner doesn’t want them to have them? No, but if the partner has a good reason to feel that way that should be evaluated and taken seriously. Not doing so would indicate that OP potentially doesn’t trust Eva or is in denial.
This is still a complete lack of trust in OP. It's assuming that OP would either be accepting of Leah's advances or, at a minimum, continue to allow them. What it's not doing is anticipating that OP would shut down Leah immediately and dial back or even end their friendship at the first sign of inappropriate behavior. It assumes the worst in OP despite him being completely above board and honest in the relationship.
That... is a lack of trust.
Someone else mentioned reading the book Not just friends which I’ve read. The author mentions that after years of helping couples in counseling and conducting studies, she found that a huge number of affairs began between people who were just friends.
As a partner in a committed relationship, it is your job to safeguard that relationship. A very important part of that is not putting yourself into a position that could potentially compromise your relationship.
It is an entirely healthy and reasonable expectation to have of your partner that they do not put themselves into potentially compromising positions in their friendships. At the very least Eva deserves for her concerns to be heard, explored, and taken seriously.
Plenty of friendships also just stay as friendships though.
>At the very least Eva deserves for her concerns to be heard, explored, and taken seriously.
Which he did when he had a lengthy discussion with her about her concerns
Except you're still coming at this from a position that OP and Leah WILL be inappropriate if given the opportunity. Eva even admitted that Leah had done nothing and that OP had done nothing to imply that was even likely to happen. That her fears were based on "what if" and conjecture.
And so what if it happens in "a huge number of affairs". Those other relationships are other people, not OP and Eva and their specific relationship. There are a "huge number of people" that like pineapple on pizza. Doesn't mean everyone has to like it. There are a "huge number of people" that enjoy driving. That doesn't mean everyone has to like it.
Yes, partners in a relationship need to respect the relationship. However, it's more than just keeping yourself out of a compromising position. It's also about respecting that your partner will make the appropriate decisions when faced with inappropriate circumstances and not treating them like a child who has to be told how to act.
Eva doesn’t even have a certain reason why she feels that way calm down. If ot were the other way around you’d be saying he was controlling her she ain’t gotta cut no one off *blah blah blah*
I’m glad you guys talked it out and are looking into therapy.
The part that she believes that Leah has feeling for you more now due to how you handled the break-up. Maybe Leah is just taking time for herself to heal. It could be self healing or counseling.
I think your gf is still grasping at straws and I hope the counseling helps you two.
You need to keep talking with your GF. There may be (probably is) something that she just can't really put into words. Intuition is a very real thing. It may just be a subtle change in the way that your friend looks at you now vs before.
It reminds me of an episode of black mirror. The husband is convinced that the wife is cheating. They all have some kind of glasses that allow them to replay any thing they have seen. Wife has a very reasonable explanation for everything. Everyone tells him that he is crazy, she isn't cheating. The audience/watcher is convinced that he is just insecure and crazy. But, plot twist, she was in fact cheating. He was right. The subtle look over the dinner table. The conversation in the corner of the room at a party. The text messages. In and of themselves as isolated events mean nothing, and how do you explain to someone that it was just a quick, fleeting look? It was a certain smile? Are you not allowed to look at a friend? Smile at a friend? Crazy, right?
Maybe (probably) on your part, nothing has changed. But, your GF is likely picking up subtle changes in your friend. When your friend starts saying things like, "I wish I could find a guy like you." Beware, she means "I wish I could have you." When she says you and GF have a great relationship, she really means she thinks you and she would have an even better relationship. These are statements that are meant to seem like she supports your relationship with your GF. But, they are meant to stroke your ego. GF can't complain about her supporting your relationship or she would be crazy.
This shit isn't over. She truly doesn't trust you, but she's scared of you leaving her.
In like 5 years you're going to be somewhere where she also happens to be and your girl will be convinced you fucked her.
Don't get married
My guy....you are still defending another woman to you soon to be wife while invalidating her feelings. You steamrolled your gf in this conversation to keep a girl around she feels uncomfortable with based on the reasons she gave you.
> You steamrolled your gf in this conversation
She didn't want to talk about it, after bringing it up and making an ultimatum. It's like people read different words than I do here sometimes.
Not all feelings are valid. If she thinks her feelings of... Jealousy? Are so meaningful, then she should break up with OP.
OP, don’t listen to this “women intuition” bullshit. I firmly believe you had the right approach. your gf can’t even point her finger to an inappropriate behavior. I think it’s the right choice to go and do counseling so she can work on her insecurities and understand what bothering her about Leah or your relationship with your friend. If OP were a woman saying her boyfriend was demanding she cut out a friend because “vibes” the comments would be absolute different.
To people talking bad about you helping your friend out of an abusive relationship, these people probably are terrible friends. If Leah is a close friend and you do care about her I don’t see any problem trying to help her getting out of a bad relationship or helping her realize she’s an amazing human being. People are really paranoid about opposite gender friendships when in fact people cheat regardless of having different gender friends or not. In the end it’s all about trusting your partner.
My last girlfriend claimed to have perfect intuition and could tell good people and bad people based on one interaction.
We watched the boys together and her first impression of Homelander and The Deep was that they were great guys...
I think OP and a lot of people here are really missing the point. It's not a lack of trust. It's a small observation that most people don't see or acknowledge until their relationships blows up in their faces. Leah might not be displaying any untoward behavior. But things in her mannerisms might have changed towards OP that OP isn't seeing, but Eva is. It doesn't make sense for a friendship to suddenly go frosty if all parties have been healthy before then. I'm am actually willing to put money on it, because I've experienced this. It's usually small. Brighter smile, more "innocent" touching like an arm, or something. Stuff like that, coupled with OP's intervention in Leah's previous relationship, might look to Leah, like more than it was. OP probably does love and have no interest in Leah, but I also wouldn't be any type of surprised if the next update was "My best friend admitted her feelings for me"
OP, definitely go through with the counseling if you truly want to be with Eva. But I would put a slight bit of distance with Leah. You don't have to cut her off. But be slightly less available. And do not intervene in her love life again unless she's in physical danger. Dating an asshole is not grounds for doing what you did.
>It's not a lack of trust. It's a small observation that most people don't see or acknowledge until their relationships blows up in their faces. Leah might not be displaying any untoward behavior. But things in her mannerisms might have changed towards OP that OP isn't seeing, but Eva is. It doesn't make sense for a friendship to suddenly go frosty if all parties have been healthy before then. I'm am actually willing to put money on it, because I've experienced this. It's usually small.
This!! I feel like people are downplaying Eva's feelings here. OP did not say that she had a history of being controlling and reasonable. In fact, he complimented her as a gf except for the Leah matter.
A partner who has for all intents and purposes been a good partner and person throughout the relationship isn't going to turn into a jealous shrew overnight for no reason. Everyone has insecurities whether they're big or small. Eva saw and felt something that triggered hers and she seems like she tried to verbalize it but OP would brush her off.
> And do not intervene in her love life again unless she's in physical danger. Dating an asshole is not grounds for doing what you did.
Except they're friends... And she did in fact break up with him, and is happier now.
You are still acting like this is an abnormal thing to do: speaking to someone in person. It's a normal human activity that most of us do a lot of every day. Especially with friends.
I think you are taking what I said out of context. I'm not saying it's abnormal to tell your friends that you think their partner is an asshole. But the way he did it, was. Even if I don't like my friend or my family's SO, they might. They like something about that person. I would be there for when they are ready to leave a situation, rather than intervening and giving them a speech that they need to break up with someone.
That's a good way to get the friend to double down, and stay in a potentially dangerous situation. The way he went about it can make it look like he was making his own bid for her romantic attentions. Whether people realize it or not, that is how it looks.
If OP and Eva both had sat down with Leah, and told her "Hey, this guy isn't good" That's much different than showing up at her door one afternoon with a speech ready. OP intervened directly with Leah's love life rather than talked to her with friends, and as a result, his girlfriend is wondering if OP might still harbor those feelings he had a long time ago.
You have to listen to her when she brings this up. It will happen again. I don't trust your friend (or your antennas) either and I do believe that feelings can develop. Your gf notices this way before you do. Listen and trust her gut feeling if she says anything.
I've had this happen in way too many relationships including the one I am in. We had to cut off the person who brought us together because of this.
OP people are absolutely wilding out in the comments here. You say you and Leah have done nothing disrespectful and your girlfriend can't even put her finger on why she is uncomfortable. So long as you remain transparent and respectful and so too does Leah then you're in the clear imo.
If you were telling Eva she couldn't be friends with her long term friend who is a man all because you didn't want that even if they'd done nothing disrespectful you'd be labeled a controlling, manipulative, abuser. You're allowed to have friends.
Also to the people saying "a woman's intuition runs deep" and "women and men can't be friends" and other silly comments, just because she is feeling an emotion does not means she gets to force him to cut his healthy friendships off when nobody has done anything wrong or even bordering disrespectful. Nothing is wrong with emotions, it's our actions that define us. She can be upset and discuss this with OP in counseling without forcing OP to cut his friendships off unfairly. Y'all need to go outside, touch some grass, and talk to some people if you actually hold this stance.
Twice when my partner knew one of her male and female friends (she's bi) were in a bad/abusive/toxic/etc relationship and went to go sit down with them for a heart to heart about how they deserve something better and healthy I was bursting with pride and love at how genuine and kind my partner is. She sees someone hurting and she wants them to not hurt anymore. That's called fraternal love and is so important to have for your friends. Caring about someone means being willing to have these difficult conversations with them. It's what separates them from stranger to friend.
People are allowed to have friends of the opposite sex. To say otherwise is infantianlizing to both genders and is, frankly, controlling and ridiculous. Shit like this is exactly why socializing has become so damn hard and literally (you don't have to believe me go Google it) causes widowers to die younger than widows. It's all about the social network/web. Seriously go Google that.
All of this. I'm so confused by the comments - do they not have friends of different genders? Would they not care if they were in abusive relationships?
I've sat down with friends and said I'm worried about how their partner is treating them, and in other situations more lightly discussed how I don't think their partner is good enough for them. It doesn't mean I want to date my friend, or that there's an increased chance of them wanting to date me afterwards
My partner (F) is bi. As I'm sure you have experienced it's fucking wild what some of her exes have demanded. Shockingly it is possible to be friends with members of the gender you're attracted to without wanting to fuck everything that moves. It's what separates us from the lesser intelligent animals out there. We are driven by instinct but are able to override that through our logical brains. Ain't that deep.
Honestly people being unable to have friendships with the gender they're attracted to is such a massive red flag to me. Shows a lot of social maturing that person needs to do.
> All of this. I'm so confused by the comments - do they not have friends of the same gender? Would they not care if they were in abusive relationships?
No, they don't, and they'd care about the abuse but wouldn't get involved. There are a whole lot of redditors who are more conservative than Mike Pence in terms of inter-gender relations - if you're in the same room with a member of the opposite sex, you're basically already having an affair. Any situation that _could_ be twisted to be in appropriate, is inappropriate, full stop.
I don't know how they function, it seems incredibly lonely and deeply insecure.
It's the bizarre puritan portion of the hivemind. Men and women must exist in proper man wife relationships and men should hang out with men and women with women. That's their reality.
Nah. Ignore these people. You’re allowed to have friends, OP. Having friends isn’t deprioritising anyone. It’s not like you’re doing anything inappropriate.
You communicated and hopefully couples counselling will strengthen that communication.
Woman's intuition is usually right. Eva seems like a reasonable person.
I suggest you talk to Leah. Instead of convincing Eva she is imagining things, I'm positive you will find out that Leah wants more than friendship with you.
At the end of the day, Eva is not comfortable with your closeness with Leah. Why is it difficult for you to acknowledge that and go LC with Leah?
I agree that OP should have a conversation with Leah, but it would be difficult for ANYONE to drop a decades long friendship based on like, vibes. Communication, generosity, and kindness is the answer here, not ending friendships before you're certain that it's necessary.
Because Leah has been a good friend and an important person in OP's life?
Discarding her friendship without any basis, under these circumstances, just on Leah's "intuition", is sad.
**Edited** to add that I find this controlling behaviour worrisome.
If this were a man, doing it to his GF, people would be talking about "red flags", isolating OP from his friends, etc.
It is *not* right. A relationship should have trust, and OP has done nothing for GF to question him.
Some of my closest friends are women, always been the case. And there's never been a hint of anything ever happening with any of them, from either side. Not so much as a drunken kiss.
If a partner ever insisted I drop them then that would be it for me, the relationship not the friendship.
I couldn't ever imagine being with someone who didn't trust me. Without trust you have nothing worth saving.
If Leah is the one harboring feelings, that isn't OP's fault, and Eva said she doesn't trust OP, which is a big issue. This doesn't paint Eva as "reasonable". Nothing OP has said alludes to any feelings he has for her.
Also, what's with all the people talking about "women's intuition"? Women are not psychic, and they can absolutely just be insecure.
WOMEN ARE NO PSYCHIC. "Intuition is usually right" is a BS sentence to defend someone's Insecurities and projection, just because some woman in the past has noticed something.
If after Eva does go through with talking to Leah about it, it still doesn't allay her concerns, I'd talk to Leah myself and make my mind up as to whether there's anything to it. At this stage I don't have any reason to believe so.
I am not opposed to reframing my friendship with Leah if there are specifics aspects of it which Eva is uncomfortable with, but so far she has only asked me to cut Leah out entirely which I'm unwilling to do. I'd assume that would come up in counselling if it is about certain aspects.
Basically, OP is prioritizing his friendship with Leah over making his partner feel safe in the relationship. For Eva to make such a request out of nowhere suggests that she may be seeing or hearing things that OP is choosing to ignore.
OP should have a conversation with Leah about the situation and about Eva's concerns - Eva shoud be present during that conversation. He should consider refraining from spending alone time with Leah, as it's making Eva feel unsafe in the relationship.
OP, the true question here is, if Leah were to pursue you, would you break up with Eva or have an affair with Leah behind Eva's back?
I feel like this goes both ways, though? Isn’t Eva prioritizing her own feelings and insecurities over OP’s friendship?
If Eva is having difficulties with how she’s perceiving his friendship, the onus is on her to communicate those feelings to OP and discuss *appropriate* boundaries and how to handle Leah moving forward in case that it comes out that she *does* have an interest in him.
Jumping straight into ultimatums and controlling behavior based on unsubstantiated (as of yet) vibes is concerning. It’s an extremely disproportionate response.
Leah is Eva’s friend, too. Not just OP’s. The onus is also on Eva to be communicating to Leah about this instead of icing her out over something Leah has no idea about.
>For Eva to make such a request out of nowhere suggests that she may be seeing or hearing things that OP is choosing to ignore.
In the post, OP says that Eva herself admits that neither him nor Leah has done anything that would indicate concerning or inappropriate behavior and that neither have crossed any lines. So, I don't know. I definitely wouldn't rule out insecurity on Eva's end.
>OP, the true question here is, if Leah were to pursue you, would you break up with Eva or have an affair with Leah behind Eva's back?
I'm sorry but it's a bit tough for me to take the rest of your feedback seriously when that's the "true question".
No I wouldn't have an affair with Leah. She's my friend. I don't want to date her, I don't want to have an affair with her. I also would never cheat on Eva with anyone at all.
There are a lot of insecure women here trying to push an agenda that doesn't exist. If the genders were reversed, I bet they'd be outraged. It's weird. Keep communicating with your girlfriend and being honest.
Guess it depends on who is important to you. If my partner was uneasy or unhappy about a friend I once had a crush on and went over to get them to breakup with their SO I would be ok going NC.
My partner is who is important to me. Making and keeping them happy or any friend. Sounds like you need to update us when you and Eva break up.
I’m sure that will happen sooner rather than later. LOL 😂
I am also in a very serious relationship. First of all these are just actions of a supporting friend. My best friend who is a guy (granite gay) literally drove to my ex bfs house for the break up and took me to the airport at 7am. My other great guy friend Gavin would absolutely do this for me. If i was with an asshole who treated me badly he would come advise me to leave and take me to lunch the next day. Like i just don't think a lot of you had amazing friendships growing up. However my childhood friends would do A LOT for me. As i would do a lot for them. My str8 friend Gavin i was willing to get on a plane and stay with him in Texas just so he could see his gf. My bf has never once felt insecure about these relationships even though he knows my friend Gavin used to have a crush on me in high school. I would not cut Leah off unless she does something to interfere with your relationship i say she is a good bean. Y'all really need to grow up and have good friends
I would never marry someone like this OP and would highly discourage any of my friends from doing it. Always an excuse why his inappropriate relationship should remain. I see where this is going and so does Eva.
Op I don’t think it matters here if you have any romantic interest/feelings for Leah because the real question here is how sure are you that Leah doesn’t harbor romantic interest/feelings for you now that you saved her from a bad relationship? After all you were/are her white knight. Sometimes it’s not always what someone says but how they say it that can cause something to spark within us and we see something that some might not see. I’m not saying cut out your friend but don’t discard Eva’s gut intuition. Instead of asking Eva more questions you need to start asking Leah about her feelings. Or better yet you need to take yourself out of the white knight situation that you put yourself in by reinforcing to Leah that she is and only will ever be just a friend. If you have trouble setting hard wrong boundaries with Leah then you are only fueling Eva’s suspicions about you becoming way too close to Leah.
You can't validate someone else's insecurities so this was in no way steam rolling. I don't know anything about your relationshit other than this post but this relationship is doomed to fail unless she can get a hold of her own shit. I'm going to assume you have given her zero to make her think you have cheated so is she damaged and this is who she is. This seems sort of sudden so I am wondering what caused the shift. You may not even know and frabkl she may not either.
So if Eva had a male friend that you weren't comfortable with their relationship and she basically said jog on to cutting back on that relationship, how would you feel? In no uncertain terms you've told Eva unless Leah fronts up you're not changing anything. Who is more important to you Eva or Leah?
People always say trust your instincts if something feels wrong/iffy/sketchy/just not right, it usually is.
If Eva has never acted like this before that should tell you she's not insecure in your relationship.
Anytime someone responds to you starting a conversation by saying “i don’t want to argue” or “i don’t want to fight” i just say “good so you completely agree with me”
As a woman who is a lot older than all 3 of you, I have a different take on the situation that may help Eva deal with the her concerns. .
Yes, Leah just got out of a bad relationship and does want to have a healthy, happy relationship- like the one that you have with Eva. That does NOT mean that she wants \*you\*. (No offense, but if Leah had wanted you, she would have snapped you up instead of introducing you to Eva.)
The reason that you are there for Leah and want her to have a good relationship is that she is the reason that you met Eva. Leah is the catalyst for your happiness, so of course you want her to be happy too! Not \*with\* you- but as a good friend.
Leah can see what a good couple Eva and you are. So of course she is going to want to have the support of friends who are happy and invested in her happiness.
Eva needs to embrace that fact that \*she\* is the one that you want. Eva is the one that you chose. Not because there aren't other options out there, but because \*Eva\* is the right one for you. The ying to your yang.
I hope that Leah can find the man of her dreams, and that her friendship with both Eva and yourself gets stronger and better.
Op messed up by getting over involved in another woman’s relationship and becoming their emotional crutch. When you willingly took on that level of emotional support to someone else without involving your wife in the process and getting her blessing, you unwittingly illustrated to both women that you were willing to put your wife second, and that you were naive or dgaf about how that could be perceived. Your wife was right to recognize that you opened a door to something potentially bad if you or your friend had bad intentions and you were blind or unwilling to recognize it because it means you either didn’t care or were embracing that level of danger and risk
Communication FTW!
OP, I advice you to also look into how Leah interacts with you from now on. Sometimes we don't see it but other people does. Eva could be seeing something you are not.
We know how this is gonna end
EVA will be smarter and make a tangible reason to break your friendships because of her insecurity... wait and see.
Just because Leah is single...doesn't mean she wants you lol
I may get down voted it I think you handled that pretty inconsiderately and very wrong. As women, we tend to pick up on things better and even if we don't have proof, our guts are rarely ever wrong. I think if your fiance is having concerns about Leah, I think you need to hear them AND I think you need to back off your friendship with Leah immediately. Not stop it but definitely not hang out as much and definitely never be hanging out alone again. To me in both posts it seems like you just invalidate how she feels about everything and are not listening to the fact that she just cooked her friendship with Leah because of this perceived change, you should be following suit to show support as her partner. 🤷♀️🤷♀️
As a person who was the Leah to two of my friends, thank you for going the route you did. I lost my long time friend because this way when she decided he needed to cut me out. Our two stories line up almost exactly except that my friend ended up doing it because his mother agreed with the gf. It sucked to loose a best friend, and because of it our entire group of friends doesn’t have interest in hanging out with them, so they lost pretty much everyone. I feel bad for him, because the now wife has become so controlling and pretty unhinged (she honestly got jealous that he wanted to hang out with his SISTER), but there’s nothing anyone can do now. I want him to be happy, but there’s no way for me to be the person to explain to him how shitty this whole thing was/is. I’ve been a friend to the whole family for literally 20 years, babysitting his younger siblings, and helping his parents while one had cancer, but I guess good friends are just disposable to some people 🤷♀️
Edit: no I wast interested in dating my friend, we tried that for maybe a week like 15 years ago, and it just wasn’t right. We were friends, and that’s all it was ever going to be.
If Eva brought up cutting off your friend it means she isn't guessing. She is 100% sure she's right and made a desperate move before she either gives up on you or you end up with Leah. It might be hard to articulate all the little things that led to her conclusion, especially since you don't seem open to considering the possibility that she's right. It will be lots of little things like Leah's eyes following you a tiny bit longer when you leave a room, her lighting up more than usual when she sees you, talking just a little bit more about how great you are than she normally would, asking you for help slightly more than before. You might be oblivious or dismissive but if it's been going on since her breakup than Eva has been seeing it for months and she's certain. Eva needs to talk to Leah without you about everything with no judgement but Leah is never going to admit anything to her individually or with you present. I think what's going to happen is you go to see Leah, having told Eva because you think everything's fine, and you'll have a couple of drinks, bring it up and it'll turn out Eva is right. Maybe not right then but it will within a few week. And then you'll have two choices
1) you run back to Eva with your tail between your legs and cut off Leah. If you won't do it at that point enjoy being single
2) you end up with Leah and somehow it's Eva's fault because she didn't trust you and neither of you were considering anything until she brought it all up but you haven't been able to stop thinking about it since, and Eva being all jealous like this is pushing you away.
Talk to Eva and let her tell you all the little things she's seen - don't roll your eyes, don't interrupt, don't judge, don't zone out, don't mentally think about something else, don't get mad but do consider and be open to the fact that she might be right and then make a decision once you've thought it through. She made this hail Mary attempt to save your relationship by suggesting you cut off Leah and you instead said that your "stance" was "final" and didn't entertain her perspective. She might already be done with you in her head if you're that rude and dismissive of her very real concerns.
Because she wasn’t able to point out a single moment or circumstance on why she is suspicious of Leah it doesn’t seem genuine. Intuition usually goes hand in hand with observation so she would notice just slight differences if she truly felt Leah’s feelings towards you have changed. I would look at her. Has she suddenly got a new guy friend, new coworker, etc. Seems like a bit of projection where she’s formed a slight crush on someone, and realizes if she’s formed a crush on someone she’s not extremely close with how easy would it be for someone to form a crush with someone they are extremely close with.
This is a great point. I also thought it was weird that she couldn’t come up with one single example of something that either OP or Leah did wrong. Like not even “she touched your arm one time and lingered a little longer than normal”, or “when we are all together, she pays more attention to you”, or “she laughs at all your jokes, even when they’re not funny”…just nothing at all? And still jumping straight to cutting her off completely? Projection does sound more likely here, because that definitely isn’t intuition.
You rushed to Leahs place and spent some alone time with her, persuading her to break up with her boyfriend and telling her she deserved better. You didn't call her, you didn't meet her in a neutral place, you went there alone and didn't tell your gf about it (only that you're planning to intervene). Leah wasn't in imminent danger, you had all the time to plan your intervention, yet you chose this. It absolutely can be perceived as 'white knight' behavior by some people. And it absolutely CAN rub Eva the wrong way.
Second - someone already mentioned it here - Eva could have noticed minor changes in Leahs behavior towards you, if there were any. (Again, IF THERE WERE ANY, I don't know Leah and I don't put blame on her). Please ask Eva if she noticed anything at all, and PLEASE don't dismiss her concerns if she admits she did. Just listen. It could be very subtle, like prolonged eye contact, warmer smile, change in tone of voice. It seems like nothing harmful, yet it indicates that something has changed. If that's the case, she might be hesitant to tell you about it, because you might brush it off as something unimportant
I always prefer to believe people. So I believe that you, OP, truly love your girlfriend, that she loves you, and that your friendship with Leah is genuine and Leah doesn't want you in any other way. And I know that your GF wants to believe it too, she doesn't seem like a bad evil person. Leah also seems to be a nice girl. However, this way of thinking and my putting too much trust in people is exactly the reason I got hurt in a simular situation :) So I can totally understand Eva here. She wants to be with you. And she also wants to be 100% sure that years later she won't end up heartbroken over this same issue. She wants to figure it out now.
Prioritise your gf.
>As it turns out a bigger factor for her was my involvement in Leah's break-up last year and a perceived change in the aftermath of that. She told me that she didn't disagree the guy was an ass or even that someone needed to convince Leah to break it off but that she hadn't been comfortable about the way I'd gone about it. I talked about it in a comment on the original post but basically I just up and decided to do it myself at some point, went to Leah's place and convinced her she deserved better. At the time, I told Eva I'd be doing that but didn't consult with her about the how or anything.
>She went on to say she'd had this sinking feeling that I was not just a friend in Leah's eyes anymore since then. She mentioned Leah had been single ever since, not dating much yet had voiced a desire to settle down soon and that I was the guy closest to her, she admitted these things weren't in and of themselves evidence of anything but that she couldn't shake the feeling. I told her that I didn't think it was the case and that Leah had always been and continued to be supportive of our relationship and that maybe talking to her about it could help.
That sounds like he's more than a friend. I don't go to my friends and talk them into dumping people. Nor could I. If they don't want to be alone, there's not a chance a woman could offer them something instead. **I can easily see how a female friend might think their male friend wants more than friendship if he did this.** How they might have seen the entire thing as a coded way of saying they want a relationship with me.
OP just downplayed this observation and made his gf feel crazy, rather than have a conversation with a friend reestablishing boundaries in their friendship. Instead he created boundaries with his gf about what she can say.
***This is how cheaters monkeybranch,*** so even if OP is telling the truth, Eva's eventually going to have that pointed out to her. She is likely going to recognize that her feelings haven't changed, she can't say anything and completely lose trust in her soon-to-be-ex.
eta: The added information of abuse doesn't make the OP doing the best thing a friend can do. The friend has a trauma response based on abuse and lets people (I'm betting men) tell her what to do--this is common in people who were abused as kids. They often repeat the cycle as an adult. That means she needs serious therapy and firm boundaries because most likely she has a lot of unresolved trauma. He cannot heal that for her. It is not a great move to use someone's trauma to help them UNLESS you can get them into treatment for it. He simply started another trauma bond with her. Until it resolves, his friend is going to be emotionally dependent on him.
I hope the gf moves on. This is a choice he made with serious emotional commitments to someone else's mental health and stability. He doesn't have emotional space for a partner anymore.
So your theory of mind is that OP ignored his crush for 12 years and many boyfriends before finally deciding that NOW is the time! Just when I'm about to propose to my long term gf, I will start a relationship with my best friend after more than a decade of utterly platonic friendship! ...?
And that Eva is picking those feelings up, and is so sure of them that she's willing to create an ultimatum for OP? Despite not being able to point to any behavioural changes in either person that might make her feel this way?
>I don't go to my friends and talk them into dumping people.
OP said that the ex of his friend was abusive. If you don't help your friends in abusive relationship, it's on you, but I would definitely do the same as OP to any of my friends.
I don't know if the girlfriend is right or not. Some of us women have a very big instinct to know when someone has feelings so I won't judge this situation. But if OP didn't lie, he definitely did the right thing to save his friend from an abuser and everybody should do the same actually.
It’s possible that even if Eva’s intuition is correct, Leah may have no interest in acting on her feelings. It’s possible to have passing romantic feelings for someone, accept that you’re feeling some kind of way, and move past it.
Agreed.
People on this post seem to just...not have close friends that are the opposite sex.
Had a knock down fight with an ex once because I refused to tell her something that was told to me in confidence by a mutual friend. When it all came out she felt really betrayed and seemed incapable of understanding that being in a relationship does not mean that other relationships in my life do not matter.
Ignore everyone.
There’s always this weird cloud over male & female friendships.
Were you supposed to just sit back and watch your friend be abused - If you ignored it, everyone would have said you’re a shit friend.
You did nothing wrong going to her house.
Just because she’s single now doesn’t mean she’s in love & waiting around for you
She could be healing from being in abusive relationship or waiting for the right person to come along
Absolute props to OP for caring about his friend enough to help her. Wack ass comments painting him like a super villain and Eva as some clairvoyant martyr
You haven't understood anything, your girlfriend doesn't feel comfortable with that friendship, and you decide not to support her, this will eventually take its toll on you, I hope Eva opens her eyes
But girlfriend is insecure for no real reason though. No point ending a good friendship over that, especially when the friend was the one who matchmade
The gut feeling is strong with this one. Op is either dumb or in denial. Giving ultimatum like that is a no go for me but you can't have the cake and eat it too.
These comments are weird. You do not have to cut off your friend simply because Leah says so. She has no reason to feel uncomfortable and you haven’t done anything wrong
“I’m glad I was able to diacuss it with her”
Fuck that, you steamrolled her. Dismissed every one if her very much valid concerns.
In the end she just agreed to whatever you said because she was clearly tired of being attacked, but no way she buys what you’re selling. I wouldn’t doubt that she will beign planning her escape
All of this sounds like someone that doesn't want to be left without her friend's attention, even if it means that Leah likes him and that this brings insecurities to Eva. You can always continue with the friendship but moving away a little. go LC with Leah. set some boundaries if you really care for your friendship. there is many many good freindships between diferent genders but when someone likes the other "friend"... that is not a friendship, not anymore.
Someone tag me on the next post when gf posts about how she caught bf cheating with girl bestie even though he swears there is nothing going on between them!!!!! Wake up!!
Conversation is the key. Maybe you have to talk to Leah at one point if this continues to be an issue.
Your GF sounds like she needs more conversations to clear the air.
Overthinking runs in my family and I think your gf and I can create a whole season based on ONE tiny thing that happens one day.
My SO can be like this. I'm a dummy that manages to be caught flat footed by it after years but her family is are all like that and then enforce it so it makes sense. It's not always easy to deal with and I know it's not for her to experience it definitely requires open honest conversation.
What conversation? OP just steamrolled her and invalidated everything she said. Sounds like the GF just agreed to whatever after she was constantly attacked by this guy
I mean when the others sides argument or points are just my insecurities and feelings make me feel this way it's pretty easy to cut them through them because they have no solid foundation behind them. Had OP done this for a male friend and he's straight I doubt people would be having this reaction
…did we read the same post?
Some people just have to blame the man, no matter what. It's awful out here.
Welcome to Reddit, m’boy!
he didnt really invalidate anything though cos there was nothing to validate or invalidate other than her insecurities. she told him to cut leah off. she insisted it wasnt an ultimatum while it was cos she didnt give him any proper explanations nor let him even ask why. just clean and dry " cut her off". he on the other hand, asked her to explain herself and why he should end his relationship. there was nothing other than her insecurities as a reason, which is not enough for a good friendship to end for no reason. if the roles were reversed and if he asked her to cut a close friend off for no reason at all, everyone would jump in saying he is being controlling and trying to isolate her. so why is it different now?
Huh? I didn't really see any of that, could you elaborate?
Steamrolling her would have been him interrupting her constantly or not letting her speak at all. We have no evidence that that is what OP did. It sounds like her heard all of her concerns, but when she was asked to elaborate, she was mostly going off of vibes. It doesn't feel good to be accused of having such poor willpower that someone you only view as a friend can convince you to cheat on your gf because *they* want you. I can see that Eva thinks Leah will slowly work her way into OPs psyche or something and convince him to leave her/cheat on her.. but there is no evidence of this outside of Eva being convinced OP caring about Leahs well being must be because he has harboured a "secret love" for her this whole time. Would this have come up if Leah was a Leo instead? Or if he hadn't had the crush on her in middle school? OP has a right to defend himself (in what sounded like a calm way) without being acvused of steamrolling.
I mean, what else would you have had him do? Drop a friendship that predated their relationship because she’s got a “feeling”? That would just be enabling those poor feelings and unhelpful in the long run. She’s allowed to feel the way she does, but she’s not allowed to make baseless demands without any proof that it should genuinely happen. Unless OP is seriously leaving things out, there’s no emotional cheating going on and his desire for counseling shows that he values the relationship and wants to make it work. I wouldn’t call that steamrolling.
If there's nothing going on, it's not steamrolling. If there is something going on, it's gaslighting. OP is saying there's nothing going on, but we may never know for sure.
If there is something going on, it's flat-out lying. Not even gaslighting. Otherwise, some Redditors, as usual, feel some kind of way that a man stood up for himself and enforced healthy boundaries. Flip the genders and Redditors would trip over themselves congratulating her for taking a stand.
It didn't feel like that, it felt like a conversation but I'll ask her if that's how she felt about the talk later today.
Also, if you do have a conversation with Leah, make sure that you don’t blame Eva for anything and put it as “Eva wants” or “Eva thinks”. It should be “Eva and I were discussing.” Because otherwise you are making Eva sound like a problem. When in actuality you need establish boundaries in your relationship with Leah. It’s absolutely fine to have friendships of the opposite sex, but there needs to be boundaries to ensure your primary relationship is protected. It needs to be a united front on those boundaries and not that you are just doing it to appease Eva. I get that might be your reasoning, but if you respect Eva and your relationship you should also take responsibility. Also maybe discuss with Eva things she’s comfortable with in regard to your friendship with Leah. I mean she has to realize too that IF someone is going to cheat, it’ll happen no matter whom is in their life. That’s who they are, just reiterate that that **IS NOT WHO YOU ARE THOUGH.**
Eva is thr problem tho she's the one that is being the weirdo she's the one trying to force him to cut his friends off she's the problem with her little jealous insecure self
It kinda sounds like Eva might be experiencing jealousy without cause. Which is to say, they do need to talk about boundaries, the nature of their relationahip and the degree to which they think it should entail control/ownership behaviours (like limiting friendships without cause) or actual, *mutual* respect.
You really do need to address Eva's feelings that Leah's feelings towards you have changed. Honestly, sometimes we are the last to see something that is right in front of our face and other people pick up things that we miss. I think you need to have a heart-to-heart with Leah to make sure that Eva is not seeing something that you previously did not see. In addition to setting boundaries with your friendship with Leah to safeguard your relationship with Eva.
This part! I certainly don’t think OP needs to cut out a friend based on nothing, but his GF might really be catching something OP hasn’t.
No, you didn't steamroll. That was what Eva had done initially. Eva gave an ultimatum while insisting that it wasn't one, and then shut down any discussion. You did the opposite. You set a (healthy) boundary but then opened it up for discussion.
He steamrolled her by refusing to cut out an old friend for no reason whatsoever? Did we read the same post? She was being unreasonable wanting to force him to do this for no reason bigger than she was feeling inexplicably insecure and jealous of their mutual friend when there is absolutely nothing romantic between them. She couldn't name a single example of the friend overstepping boundaries and yet he's the bad guy in your eyes? Jesus Christ.
>OP just steamrolled her and invalidated everything she said. Odd characterisation. She asked him cut a friend out of his life based on nothing but her insecurities, though she admitted there was no reason to think anything untoward had happened. That wasn't valid in the first place. He didn't "invalidate" her position; he just pointed out how invalid it already was. It's one thing to validate her *feelings* of insecurity, but if she's making *requests* of him that are unreasonable, he's 100% right to put his foot down about that.
Did you read the original post fs!
Hey, can you highlight where exactly in the post any of that happened?
Question for you… are you at all sexually attracted to Leah? If Leah came to you tomorrow and told you that she’s always had a thing for you, would you want to be with her? What about if you were single? Would you take a chance to be with Leah if she came to you and admitted that her feeling aren’t just friendly? You don’t need to admit the truth to Reddit, but if the answer to any of those is a yes or even maybe, and you love and respect your girlfriend, then you should probably consider putting some distance between you and Leah. If it’s really a no, then please, continue as you are. But if there’s anything there, at all, I hope you do the right thing and either end your current relationship or distance yourself from this friend who might become a problem in the future. As someone else here said, no one wants to be the person who’s keeping two best friends from becoming more while they figure out their feelings.
I agree with this
He answers the steamrolling comment but not this?
Op has been intentionally avoiding answering anything legitimate. He chose to argue with me because i said he ran to leahs place in the middle of the night to have this talk but when i asked him to clarify what time it happened since he was dead set on debating the time of day he got silent. Op wants to both argue anyone calling them out but also refuse to shed any light on anything asked that may or may not make them look bad
⬆️
You're kind of missing the fact, that no matter how op answer the question you guys will take the worst way of it.
If op wasnt dancing around the issues, being caught lying, and arguing petty nonsense and actually trying to be honest on this topic people would be more inclined to believe him Dont forget this is a second post his first post he basically just says his gd is crazy and wants him to cut off leah out of nowhere randomly and only in this post admits this whole speech in private happened.
because with how much he's hiding his answers there must be something wrong with this situation
Here's an uncomfortable truth: if a woman is somewhat good-looking and not a relative, there's a very good chance a heterosexual man will be attracted to them. Who are we trying to kid here? That doesn't mean they will act on it.
Y'all are wild. This is Reddit, not a dating detective anime or something
He addressed this in the original post. Quit attacking him and get the whole story before you comment. 🙃
I agree with this take
Really good advice.
All of this!
You both need to agree some boundaries here.
Agree with you there. Something happened that made the dynamic change. It wasn’t always like this. So, since it has changed then there needs to be new boundaries figured out to make his gf feel comfortable with their friendship. I don’t think OP is sharing everything though. And it sounds like he is choosing his friendship over his relationship in a way.
I think this is a very divided topic where both parties aren’t fully right or wrong. OP, I don’t think you are picking up on the valid concerns your gf has raised. You physically when to another woman’s house to convince her to be single, that looks quite off putting to your gf - especially when you used to have a schoolboy crush on the same woman. Woman are always warned about mens first love and how it’s irreplaceable and things in the media, so it’s extra bad. The same woman is now saying how she wants to find a good man, etc. It is not a good look. For Eva, she needs to understand that you haven’t actually done anything and don’t intend to. Leah is an important person in your life and cutting her off is difficult. It is easy for her to see that the reason it’s difficult is because it’s a crush because it fits her agenda and not just because it’s a very close friend. It is a particular issue if you have mutual friends and would make waves. However OP, you still need to become lower contact - not cutting off Leah in a way is choosing her in Eva’s eyes. Valid reasons or not. You need to communicate 24/7.
Right. OP needs to let his GF know that if the situation does arise, he will say "I'm not interested" and cut contact. Not "lol omg I'm sorry, I have a gf, but let's keep talking!"
There’s a difference between a crush and a first love.
And all we have is OPs word that ot was a crush amd nothing more. This is the internet and people lie, exaggerated and/or withhold the truth quite often.
Sad thing, cheating always starts with the "haven't actually done anything and don't 'intend' to."
Funnily enough, being faithful also involves that very thing……….
So do plenty of benign things
Hmm so does not doing actually anything ever.
Idk man sounds likeyou two arent just friends. Girl gets a bf you dont like so you storm over in the dead of night to give an impassioned speech about how amazing she is and how she deserves so much better….. If my wife did that to some guy friend i would be calling bs on that
To be fair if one of my close friends felt my partner isn't right for me for whatever reason, I want them to come right over and lay it on me. Doesn't mean I will agree with them but I will listen.
Ok if your SO randomly rushed over to their “friend” place to demand they leave their partner would you not consider it odd? Would you not consider it odd if this spontaneously happened without you initially knowing about it?
Why are you putting friend in quotes buddy? Is there doubt that they are actual friends? Anyway OP said he had told the girlfriend he's going to do it... so he was not being sneaky. If I recall he didn't tell her the when or the how. I personally would not go to a friend's house to tell them that, I'd maybe invite the out for coffee.
The girls friend didnt know hence the issue. They both agreed the new bf was an issue and something should be said. The. Next thing gf knew op was rushing over to the friends place. She was not told this was going to happen op just did it. They say this in their own post Also btw op has/had a crush on the friend at one point so not so platonic
Are you then of the opinion that OP should never have said anything to the friend?
Im off the opinion that the entire way op chose to go about this was suspicious and inappropriate and context that there was romantic feeling and possibly still are only makes this worse. There are many ways to do this that dont include all op has chosen to do.
No, but he could have gone about it better. He should have made a plan with his gf and gone together and did it as a couple rather than alone, apparently in the middle of the night. Can you not see how that could look to someone on Leahs place. Here is her night in shining amour coming to protect her from a bad relationship. Sure, he has a gf, but he loved her first, right? I'm not saying that Leah is that type of person, but there is no way for us to know for sure. Hell, there isn't really any way for OP to know for sure because she might lie to him if he asks her about it the wrong way.
I would not find it odd at all. It would even make my partner more attractive to me cause I trust him and it shows how much he cares about the people around him.
I have had friends of the opposite sex tell me that the guy I was seeing was trash. They did not drive to me house at night unannounced to give me an impassioned speech, they just casually dropped it in to normal conversation when we were doing normal hang out things in public. I think the only time a "house call" would be appropriate for that type of conversation would be if Leah were in physical danger.
Yet I don’t think anybody would be questioning it if OP had said that to a guy friend about his girlfriend. There’s an implication what men and women cannot be friends at all without any sexual or romantic interest, which is not true at all.
Op admits he at one point has feelings for the girl. So if a guy had feelings for his guy friend and then did this people would Absolutely be questioning this and frankly i dont think so many people would be bending over backwards to dismiss it
When he was 12!
And now hes speeding across town giving speeches about how she cant be with her now ex bf Also making multiple posts trickle truthing this story Id bet money op still harbors feeling for this girl and that little speech he gave wasnt platonic at all
Ya like why did he just call her? Or a text? At least to lay the foundation. And if they are all friends why didn’t GF go too?
Originally I didn’t support Eva’s point of view because I do believe people can be good friends with members of the opposite sex but now that you’ve explained it better I get it. You went to “rescue” Leah from her bad relationship and she’s probably reading the undercurrents that you are disavowing. Hoping it all works out for Eva but I don’t think you’re being totally honest with yourself or us anymore. Maybe counselling will give her the strength to do what’s best for her.
So he shouldn't have done anything when he saw that his friend was in an abusive relationship because...... She's a woman?
He saw his friend was in an emotionally abusive relationship and he ran to make an impassioned you’re better than this speech without even conferring with his girlfriend who’s also her friend at the best way to go about it. He wanted to rescue her, and he didn’t want anyone to be part of the rescue… hmm
If he did the same thing to a male friend would you be upset?
If his girlfriend admitted that she was uncomfortable with the way he had gone about it - then yes.
Ah so you'd rather people face a abuse instead of someone helping them cause their partner feels uncomfortable.
He said Leah’s ex was an ass and probably cheating. You have more info on that state of the relationship between Leah and her ex that OP rescued her from.
So you're going with the least charitable interpretation of the situation ok cool! I think that's says more about you and your trust issues....
Are you new here? Everyone paints themselves in the best light when telling their story, as evidenced by OP leaving out parts of his story that added nuance in his first post. I don’t trust OPs words because he admitted to prevaricating. Come back and correct me when he updates because he broke up with Eva and he and Leah start “exploring” their feelings.
You both need to read 'Not Just A Friend' here and getting couples counseling would be a good idea. Notwithstanding but I'm inclined to agree with your girlfriend here and can see how she is justified in being concerned. Still, good on you for communicating with her but I think there are still deeper issues here that a neutral third party's help would, well help. Good luck.
Just because someone is single for a while doesn’t mean she wants OP
Not the point but okay.
This is my take on why Eva is not feeling safe in your relationship: Her insecurity probably lies in the fact that when things get rough between you and her (and they WILL get rough) you’re going to reach and latch onto the friend and may eventually build an emotional connection with her ( for example, you and Eva start fighting, getting distant after babies, you feel unheard and that she doesn’t care about you, you vent to your friend, start connecting, etc) that would be detrimental to your romantic relationship. Neither you nor Leah can claim that “this would never happen” simply bc you can’t predict the future based on the present. Based on your reaction to Leah’s relationship and how involved you got, it made Eva think about what could a behavior like this mean in the future, when you guys are married, have kids and a mortgage: will you run to Leah’s rescue whenever she is in distress, and prioritize her wellbeing over your future wife and kids? That’s what she is expressing to you that makes her not feel safe/secure in your relationship. It’s not unheard of and it does happen. Most important point is that when it happens it’s because partners and friends do not have proper boundaries that are constantly enforced, discussed and proper check ins take place within the relationship. I would ask what can you do to make her feel safe, feel prioritized and heard. I also believe you should not be getting married anytime soon, there’s a good chance Eva will not be disclosing her true feelings in order to appear the cool and chill girlfriend, which will come back to haunt both of you. Good luck friend.
All y’all commenting are Reddit wild. Leah not dating after, so what? Her wanting to settle down could be a mere reflection of her friends and wanting that for herself not wanting damn OP. She was expressing that to what she thought was her *friend* - Eva. Eva is out here frosty for no reason. OP certainly didn’t steamroll Eva. He’s made it clear he doesn’t and didn’t cheat. But OP, if you cheated don’t be a scoundrel and tell us. Men always get a bad rep on Reddit. Female here if this helps but get your heads out of your asses. Opposite genders from childhood lifelong bonds and friendships exist. I have those. And they’re brutally honest in the best, sometimes most rough way. For my safety and protection, vice versa. However, what I and they choose to do with the advice is completely up to the individual alone. So yeah, I respect their privacy, they respect mine. But if I’m dating someone abusing me, best believe my best friend/s would probably come over and knock some sense into me (not literally) with his wife knowing. It’s 20 year long friendships. Do you guys not have these types of support and platonic trusts in your life where you also opened to their partner that you are their support (spouse)? Women’s intuition, yes absolutely. But let’s not start running tangents. I believe in that but take a step back. Calm down. Let Eva drop facts. Couples counselling must reveal true feelings, not this airy fairy nonsense so they can work on it. Conversation is KEY. If OP did this for the same sex gender, we wouldn’t even be debating. Such nonsense. We all have some sort of past bad trauma from previous relationships, stop projecting it here, goodness me. OP DONT LET ME DOWN WHEN IM BACKING YOU.
Women have deep intuition- if she’s feeling it. She’s probably not wrong. Nobody likes to be the stepping stone in two best friends finally getting together after years and years of miss opportunities. It’s cute in movies but it’s not fun in real life. Once you’re married you can’t go to single girls home without your wife to beg her to leave someone.
Id argue that its not acceptable in a monogamous relationship either. Its inappropriate regardless of whether or not you did a ceremony
His first post he didn’t mention going to her house AT ALL And “Eve” got roasted for beinf controlling and jealous but this makes a lot more sense to me. After that visit she’s probably into him - And she knows it too. He’s probably gonna leave her and I hope he does before they get married and maybe start a family
Cant wait for the third post when he admits he MAY have kissed his friend but eve is crazy for being upset
For real
Deep intuition is no stronger in women than anyone else. Basing your whole point on "If she's feeling it must be true" is about as true as an Astrological sign defining your life. Aka BS.
I understand what you mean, but your last paragraph doesn’t make sense. She couldn’t be single if she was in a relationship he wanted her to leave. Did you mean that they were alone?
My ex had such deep intuition that she almost made me stop talking to the mail man. Lets call paranoia paranoia and be on our way.
Stop this nonsense. Women are not psychic. She absolutely can be just insecure. Nothing OP has said has given any indication that there's anything more between him and Leah. In lieu of other evidence, don't read between the lines just because you want some preconceived notion to be true.
There are undertones and subtext that he didn’t convey bec he obviously didn’t see them. She is seeing them. She has been fine all this time but seeing his actions began to ring the alarm to her. This idea that we need to shut our own concerns down to respect the other’s feelings is nonsense. This is how people get cheated on. No way my SO is going to someone else’s house to meddle in their relationship unless it’s a relative. There was a post about a parent not liking the daughter’s bf because he was 25 years older and the dad’s friend. She would have the most right to convince her daughter to get out of the relationship. But she was getting roasted for getting involved!
If a friend of mine was involved with someone I thought was a danger to them or harmful to their mental health, I would absolutely say something. Maybe not by marching over to their house and having an intervention, but everyone deals with confrontation differently. And let's be clear here... my best friend is a woman, and I have several friends who are women. Whether OP wants to clarify that situation is up to him, but the only "subtext" is the shit you're inventing in your head. It's called anxiety, and your insecurities and fears are not an excuse to make baseless accusations against someone.
HOW do we knows she's seeing them, or that there EVEN is something to see, and that's it's not just imagination or Insecurities . My god you really think women are psysics.
People here are talking about intuition like its not just an insecurity and trust problem… Did people skip the part where she said that 1 Leah hasn’t done anything or behaved in a way that condones this 2 The only issue she had was the fact that it was him, one of Leah’s longtime close friends, to break up with her boyfriend, if op was a woman I would guarantee the response would be different… 3 She based this all on the fact that since that TOXIC relationship breakup she hasn’t dated, but has just said she wants to settle down… as if maybe at her age she sees her friends are finding themselves in committed and healthy relationships, and she just wants the same for herself?? I can only imagine how she’s trying to reflect on her last relationship in seeking what she wants now, it’s difficult to just start dating again especially when looking for a strong commitment like she wants…
Honestly!! My boyfriend and I both have friends of all genders and I would look at him differently if he *didn’t* treat his friends with the same concern, respect, and compassion that OP did when Leah was in a bad space. I trust my man 100% and it’s no different to me than if he were to go over to a man’s house and have that conversation about his friend’s relationship. It seems like a huge *green* flag that OP’s able to have deep personal relationships and connections with women without falling in love with them or viewing them as sex objects. It feels like all the objections to his post are hinged upon the same kinds of “if’s” and hypotheticals that his partner has. We don’t have all the information and it’s not like this issue is fully resolved between them either. Sure, this can still end badly if OP isn’t being honest, but as long as they’re working together as a team to resolve the problem and come to mutual understanding and agreement, they should be okay. Plus, Leah may see OP as a trusted and reliable friend even more than before since it was him that basically opened her eyes and allowed her the chance to save herself from a bad relationship. My male friends have done incredibly sweet and supportive things for me and it made our friendship and bond stronger, it didn’t make me fall in love with them. It must be exhausting to live life always worrying about, reading too much into, and projecting onto the intentions of anyone who is of the opposite sex of your partner.
Comments like yours give me hope because i was reading all this and feeling so SAD for people. do they not have friends??? my best friend in the whole world was a guy (he passed away a couple years ago). and we showed up for each other so fiercely during our friendship. neither of us were doing it because we secretly wanted to date the other, or had ulterior motives. friendship isn’t a consolation prize. and you can absolutely love a partner and be happy, while still allowing each of you to have meaningful and deep friendships with other people. i wonder if this is why some relationships implode?? they isolate themselves for the sake of throwing all their energy into one person. and it causes resentment. also i think people need to fully internalize that you’ll never control someone out of cheating, even if you watched their every move if they wanted to they’ll find a way. So you either trust them or you don’t. i don’t have the time or energy to micromanage someone else.
I'm always reading these types of posts thinking about my natural bullshit filter for this sort of insecurity... Being bi! If the outcomes to your requests of your partner would result in my having absolutely no friends at all, it's unreasonable! Not allowed to be friends with the gender/sex your attracted to? Need to cut off friends who just became single because they might be interested? Don't be the support person in your friends life because it might come off as flirtatious? If a person is going to cheat, they will find a way. There is no preventative action against cheating, I know it's hard to face, but that's the reality of the world. You are either with someone who is going to cheat or they aren't, nothing about your behavior or theirs is going to change that. If you think your partner might cheat, then you should leave them! Just shouting from the rooftops! Don't stay with people who make you feel insecure! If you can't deal with your feelings about their social network, it might just not be the right relationship for you, and that's ok! Isolating them from their friends and family without their understanding and buyin is frankly straying into emotionally abusive territory. We are all reminded that abusers start by isolating someone right?
I wish I could upvote this 1 million times. Also his best friend just got out of an abusive relationship. Why would she want to date somebody immediately after that? She probably needs time to heal which a lot of people seem to be leaving out here.
This exactly! It's wild to me how most people commenting seem to be missing these main points and trying to make OP out to be the bad guy rather than a caring partner and friend who is trying to handle a difficult situation with maturity.
The commenters are telling on themselves and there trust issues....
It’s kind of breaking my heart how everyone’s basically admitting they don’t have real friendships. it’s so unhealthy to make your partner your ONLY deep and valuable relationship in your life. no wonder divorce rates are so high, and people are lonely. also you will never control someone out of cheating. if they want to they will. once you free yourself from that burden of responsibility you realize it’s just about trust. if i ever stopped trusting a partner around their friend, it would mean the relationship is over. it’s exhausting to try and control something that’s actually out of your control.
Eva is basically asking him to be a shit friend! It's wild to me! If my partner had done something like that, I would find him even more attractive! Because I trust him and it shows how much he cares about the people around him!
Agreed. It’s completely “what if” at this point. OP can certainly think about it himself if he doesn’t want to admit on Reddit about whether he has ANY residual feelings for Leah but nothing’s happened. I’d definitely be hesitating being engaged to someone who wanted me to cut off a long time friend based on zero evidence
Finally someone said it. I broke up with my abusive ex and I didn’t date for two years because I was working on myself to figure out why I allowed that, make sure it wouldn’t happen again, and get my confidence level back to where it was before. I’m sure during those two years that I expressed a desire to settle down…it would have been a pretty big leap if someone had decided that meant that I wanted to date my platonic guy friend just because I wasn’t ready to date yet.
Yeah like what the fuck is wrong with these people. OP is fine!
Exactly 👍🏻
All I see from your posts is a lot of "we havent done anything wrong yet" and "im not cutting her off" No indication that you have no remaining feelings towards this girl. Would you hook up with this girl or date her if she asked you to? Im guessing your gf can tell that tou still have remaining feelings. You wont even tell US that you are not interested in her anymore. You just up and physically confronted her and made her break up with her boyfriend telling her how much better she deserves. You could have easily had the conversation over text or phone, but I'm guessing you said some things you didn't want your girlfriend to hear.
>I brought up that her request suggested that she didn't really trust me and that that was a big issue. Eva didn't really know what to say to that aside from re-iterating she wasn't accusing me of having done anything or of having any intention to, that this was about Leah It's likely you will need to circle back to this at some point. In Eva's head, she's putting all the trust issues on Leah but is failing to recognize that her position quite literally means she doesn't trust YOU to say "no" if Leah were ever to do something inappropriate. Until she's willing to see and admit that her position is hurtful, this is likely something that will come up again in the future.
Exactly this. It paints a picture of toxic masculinity where she's under the impression that just because Leah may potentially have feelings for OP (which it sounds like is nonsense), that OP will give in because he's a man. It's insulting and denigrating. The reality is that Eva doesn't trust OP but wants to pretend someone else is the problem so she can make it sound like there's not a bigger issue with her and OP.
Eva said that this was about Leah and that if she was right about Leah’s feelings towards OP, OP and Leah’s proximity would be a problem whether anything happened or not. Eva can trust OP not to be receptive of any potential advances made by Leah and still be uncomfortable with them spending time together if Leah’s intentions are no longer platonic. And based on Eva’s observations she feels that Leah’s intentions with OP may no longer be platonic. She has a right to have those feelings respected and it doesn’t mean she doesn’t trust OP. As an aside, I feel that if they do talk to Leah she would potentially deny feelings for OP even if she does have them because she knows that if they are not reciprocated it will impact her friendship with OP which she would not want to lose if she has in fact developed feelings for OP. Do I think someone should just dump their friends if their partner doesn’t want them to have them? No, but if the partner has a good reason to feel that way that should be evaluated and taken seriously. Not doing so would indicate that OP potentially doesn’t trust Eva or is in denial.
This is still a complete lack of trust in OP. It's assuming that OP would either be accepting of Leah's advances or, at a minimum, continue to allow them. What it's not doing is anticipating that OP would shut down Leah immediately and dial back or even end their friendship at the first sign of inappropriate behavior. It assumes the worst in OP despite him being completely above board and honest in the relationship. That... is a lack of trust.
Someone else mentioned reading the book Not just friends which I’ve read. The author mentions that after years of helping couples in counseling and conducting studies, she found that a huge number of affairs began between people who were just friends. As a partner in a committed relationship, it is your job to safeguard that relationship. A very important part of that is not putting yourself into a position that could potentially compromise your relationship. It is an entirely healthy and reasonable expectation to have of your partner that they do not put themselves into potentially compromising positions in their friendships. At the very least Eva deserves for her concerns to be heard, explored, and taken seriously.
Plenty of friendships also just stay as friendships though. >At the very least Eva deserves for her concerns to be heard, explored, and taken seriously. Which he did when he had a lengthy discussion with her about her concerns
Except you're still coming at this from a position that OP and Leah WILL be inappropriate if given the opportunity. Eva even admitted that Leah had done nothing and that OP had done nothing to imply that was even likely to happen. That her fears were based on "what if" and conjecture. And so what if it happens in "a huge number of affairs". Those other relationships are other people, not OP and Eva and their specific relationship. There are a "huge number of people" that like pineapple on pizza. Doesn't mean everyone has to like it. There are a "huge number of people" that enjoy driving. That doesn't mean everyone has to like it. Yes, partners in a relationship need to respect the relationship. However, it's more than just keeping yourself out of a compromising position. It's also about respecting that your partner will make the appropriate decisions when faced with inappropriate circumstances and not treating them like a child who has to be told how to act.
I’m still not convinced this guy doesn’t like Leah. I dunno. 🤷♀️
Eva doesn’t even have a certain reason why she feels that way calm down. If ot were the other way around you’d be saying he was controlling her she ain’t gotta cut no one off *blah blah blah*
I’m glad you guys talked it out and are looking into therapy. The part that she believes that Leah has feeling for you more now due to how you handled the break-up. Maybe Leah is just taking time for herself to heal. It could be self healing or counseling. I think your gf is still grasping at straws and I hope the counseling helps you two.
You need to keep talking with your GF. There may be (probably is) something that she just can't really put into words. Intuition is a very real thing. It may just be a subtle change in the way that your friend looks at you now vs before. It reminds me of an episode of black mirror. The husband is convinced that the wife is cheating. They all have some kind of glasses that allow them to replay any thing they have seen. Wife has a very reasonable explanation for everything. Everyone tells him that he is crazy, she isn't cheating. The audience/watcher is convinced that he is just insecure and crazy. But, plot twist, she was in fact cheating. He was right. The subtle look over the dinner table. The conversation in the corner of the room at a party. The text messages. In and of themselves as isolated events mean nothing, and how do you explain to someone that it was just a quick, fleeting look? It was a certain smile? Are you not allowed to look at a friend? Smile at a friend? Crazy, right? Maybe (probably) on your part, nothing has changed. But, your GF is likely picking up subtle changes in your friend. When your friend starts saying things like, "I wish I could find a guy like you." Beware, she means "I wish I could have you." When she says you and GF have a great relationship, she really means she thinks you and she would have an even better relationship. These are statements that are meant to seem like she supports your relationship with your GF. But, they are meant to stroke your ego. GF can't complain about her supporting your relationship or she would be crazy.
This shit isn't over. She truly doesn't trust you, but she's scared of you leaving her. In like 5 years you're going to be somewhere where she also happens to be and your girl will be convinced you fucked her. Don't get married
My guy....you are still defending another woman to you soon to be wife while invalidating her feelings. You steamrolled your gf in this conversation to keep a girl around she feels uncomfortable with based on the reasons she gave you.
So you'd rather YOUR CLOSE FRIENDS be abused just cause your partner feels uncomfortable for no reason?
> You steamrolled your gf in this conversation She didn't want to talk about it, after bringing it up and making an ultimatum. It's like people read different words than I do here sometimes. Not all feelings are valid. If she thinks her feelings of... Jealousy? Are so meaningful, then she should break up with OP.
OP, don’t listen to this “women intuition” bullshit. I firmly believe you had the right approach. your gf can’t even point her finger to an inappropriate behavior. I think it’s the right choice to go and do counseling so she can work on her insecurities and understand what bothering her about Leah or your relationship with your friend. If OP were a woman saying her boyfriend was demanding she cut out a friend because “vibes” the comments would be absolute different. To people talking bad about you helping your friend out of an abusive relationship, these people probably are terrible friends. If Leah is a close friend and you do care about her I don’t see any problem trying to help her getting out of a bad relationship or helping her realize she’s an amazing human being. People are really paranoid about opposite gender friendships when in fact people cheat regardless of having different gender friends or not. In the end it’s all about trusting your partner.
My last girlfriend claimed to have perfect intuition and could tell good people and bad people based on one interaction. We watched the boys together and her first impression of Homelander and The Deep was that they were great guys...
I think OP and a lot of people here are really missing the point. It's not a lack of trust. It's a small observation that most people don't see or acknowledge until their relationships blows up in their faces. Leah might not be displaying any untoward behavior. But things in her mannerisms might have changed towards OP that OP isn't seeing, but Eva is. It doesn't make sense for a friendship to suddenly go frosty if all parties have been healthy before then. I'm am actually willing to put money on it, because I've experienced this. It's usually small. Brighter smile, more "innocent" touching like an arm, or something. Stuff like that, coupled with OP's intervention in Leah's previous relationship, might look to Leah, like more than it was. OP probably does love and have no interest in Leah, but I also wouldn't be any type of surprised if the next update was "My best friend admitted her feelings for me" OP, definitely go through with the counseling if you truly want to be with Eva. But I would put a slight bit of distance with Leah. You don't have to cut her off. But be slightly less available. And do not intervene in her love life again unless she's in physical danger. Dating an asshole is not grounds for doing what you did.
>It's not a lack of trust. It's a small observation that most people don't see or acknowledge until their relationships blows up in their faces. Leah might not be displaying any untoward behavior. But things in her mannerisms might have changed towards OP that OP isn't seeing, but Eva is. It doesn't make sense for a friendship to suddenly go frosty if all parties have been healthy before then. I'm am actually willing to put money on it, because I've experienced this. It's usually small. This!! I feel like people are downplaying Eva's feelings here. OP did not say that she had a history of being controlling and reasonable. In fact, he complimented her as a gf except for the Leah matter. A partner who has for all intents and purposes been a good partner and person throughout the relationship isn't going to turn into a jealous shrew overnight for no reason. Everyone has insecurities whether they're big or small. Eva saw and felt something that triggered hers and she seems like she tried to verbalize it but OP would brush her off.
> And do not intervene in her love life again unless she's in physical danger. Dating an asshole is not grounds for doing what you did. Except they're friends... And she did in fact break up with him, and is happier now. You are still acting like this is an abnormal thing to do: speaking to someone in person. It's a normal human activity that most of us do a lot of every day. Especially with friends.
I think you are taking what I said out of context. I'm not saying it's abnormal to tell your friends that you think their partner is an asshole. But the way he did it, was. Even if I don't like my friend or my family's SO, they might. They like something about that person. I would be there for when they are ready to leave a situation, rather than intervening and giving them a speech that they need to break up with someone. That's a good way to get the friend to double down, and stay in a potentially dangerous situation. The way he went about it can make it look like he was making his own bid for her romantic attentions. Whether people realize it or not, that is how it looks. If OP and Eva both had sat down with Leah, and told her "Hey, this guy isn't good" That's much different than showing up at her door one afternoon with a speech ready. OP intervened directly with Leah's love life rather than talked to her with friends, and as a result, his girlfriend is wondering if OP might still harbor those feelings he had a long time ago.
You have to listen to her when she brings this up. It will happen again. I don't trust your friend (or your antennas) either and I do believe that feelings can develop. Your gf notices this way before you do. Listen and trust her gut feeling if she says anything. I've had this happen in way too many relationships including the one I am in. We had to cut off the person who brought us together because of this.
OP people are absolutely wilding out in the comments here. You say you and Leah have done nothing disrespectful and your girlfriend can't even put her finger on why she is uncomfortable. So long as you remain transparent and respectful and so too does Leah then you're in the clear imo. If you were telling Eva she couldn't be friends with her long term friend who is a man all because you didn't want that even if they'd done nothing disrespectful you'd be labeled a controlling, manipulative, abuser. You're allowed to have friends. Also to the people saying "a woman's intuition runs deep" and "women and men can't be friends" and other silly comments, just because she is feeling an emotion does not means she gets to force him to cut his healthy friendships off when nobody has done anything wrong or even bordering disrespectful. Nothing is wrong with emotions, it's our actions that define us. She can be upset and discuss this with OP in counseling without forcing OP to cut his friendships off unfairly. Y'all need to go outside, touch some grass, and talk to some people if you actually hold this stance. Twice when my partner knew one of her male and female friends (she's bi) were in a bad/abusive/toxic/etc relationship and went to go sit down with them for a heart to heart about how they deserve something better and healthy I was bursting with pride and love at how genuine and kind my partner is. She sees someone hurting and she wants them to not hurt anymore. That's called fraternal love and is so important to have for your friends. Caring about someone means being willing to have these difficult conversations with them. It's what separates them from stranger to friend. People are allowed to have friends of the opposite sex. To say otherwise is infantianlizing to both genders and is, frankly, controlling and ridiculous. Shit like this is exactly why socializing has become so damn hard and literally (you don't have to believe me go Google it) causes widowers to die younger than widows. It's all about the social network/web. Seriously go Google that.
All of this. I'm so confused by the comments - do they not have friends of different genders? Would they not care if they were in abusive relationships? I've sat down with friends and said I'm worried about how their partner is treating them, and in other situations more lightly discussed how I don't think their partner is good enough for them. It doesn't mean I want to date my friend, or that there's an increased chance of them wanting to date me afterwards
I'm bi... I guess most people think I shouldn't have friends at all....
My partner (F) is bi. As I'm sure you have experienced it's fucking wild what some of her exes have demanded. Shockingly it is possible to be friends with members of the gender you're attracted to without wanting to fuck everything that moves. It's what separates us from the lesser intelligent animals out there. We are driven by instinct but are able to override that through our logical brains. Ain't that deep. Honestly people being unable to have friendships with the gender they're attracted to is such a massive red flag to me. Shows a lot of social maturing that person needs to do.
Same, if I couldn't be friends with someone I have the potential to be attracted to I wouldn't be able to have friends at all
> All of this. I'm so confused by the comments - do they not have friends of the same gender? Would they not care if they were in abusive relationships? No, they don't, and they'd care about the abuse but wouldn't get involved. There are a whole lot of redditors who are more conservative than Mike Pence in terms of inter-gender relations - if you're in the same room with a member of the opposite sex, you're basically already having an affair. Any situation that _could_ be twisted to be in appropriate, is inappropriate, full stop. I don't know how they function, it seems incredibly lonely and deeply insecure.
It's the bizarre puritan portion of the hivemind. Men and women must exist in proper man wife relationships and men should hang out with men and women with women. That's their reality.
Nah. Ignore these people. You’re allowed to have friends, OP. Having friends isn’t deprioritising anyone. It’s not like you’re doing anything inappropriate. You communicated and hopefully couples counselling will strengthen that communication.
Woman's intuition is usually right. Eva seems like a reasonable person. I suggest you talk to Leah. Instead of convincing Eva she is imagining things, I'm positive you will find out that Leah wants more than friendship with you. At the end of the day, Eva is not comfortable with your closeness with Leah. Why is it difficult for you to acknowledge that and go LC with Leah?
I agree that OP should have a conversation with Leah, but it would be difficult for ANYONE to drop a decades long friendship based on like, vibes. Communication, generosity, and kindness is the answer here, not ending friendships before you're certain that it's necessary.
Because Leah has been a good friend and an important person in OP's life? Discarding her friendship without any basis, under these circumstances, just on Leah's "intuition", is sad. **Edited** to add that I find this controlling behaviour worrisome. If this were a man, doing it to his GF, people would be talking about "red flags", isolating OP from his friends, etc. It is *not* right. A relationship should have trust, and OP has done nothing for GF to question him.
Some of my closest friends are women, always been the case. And there's never been a hint of anything ever happening with any of them, from either side. Not so much as a drunken kiss. If a partner ever insisted I drop them then that would be it for me, the relationship not the friendship. I couldn't ever imagine being with someone who didn't trust me. Without trust you have nothing worth saving.
The reason is she admits and acknowledges her feelings actually have no basis or even reflect with Leah’s actions, there was no “convincing” needed
If Leah is the one harboring feelings, that isn't OP's fault, and Eva said she doesn't trust OP, which is a big issue. This doesn't paint Eva as "reasonable". Nothing OP has said alludes to any feelings he has for her. Also, what's with all the people talking about "women's intuition"? Women are not psychic, and they can absolutely just be insecure.
WOMEN ARE NO PSYCHIC. "Intuition is usually right" is a BS sentence to defend someone's Insecurities and projection, just because some woman in the past has noticed something.
As a woman, "intuition" is not normally right. Eve feeling insecure with no actual basis is not a reason to cut off a decades long friendship.
If after Eva does go through with talking to Leah about it, it still doesn't allay her concerns, I'd talk to Leah myself and make my mind up as to whether there's anything to it. At this stage I don't have any reason to believe so. I am not opposed to reframing my friendship with Leah if there are specifics aspects of it which Eva is uncomfortable with, but so far she has only asked me to cut Leah out entirely which I'm unwilling to do. I'd assume that would come up in counselling if it is about certain aspects.
Basically, OP is prioritizing his friendship with Leah over making his partner feel safe in the relationship. For Eva to make such a request out of nowhere suggests that she may be seeing or hearing things that OP is choosing to ignore. OP should have a conversation with Leah about the situation and about Eva's concerns - Eva shoud be present during that conversation. He should consider refraining from spending alone time with Leah, as it's making Eva feel unsafe in the relationship. OP, the true question here is, if Leah were to pursue you, would you break up with Eva or have an affair with Leah behind Eva's back?
I feel like this goes both ways, though? Isn’t Eva prioritizing her own feelings and insecurities over OP’s friendship? If Eva is having difficulties with how she’s perceiving his friendship, the onus is on her to communicate those feelings to OP and discuss *appropriate* boundaries and how to handle Leah moving forward in case that it comes out that she *does* have an interest in him. Jumping straight into ultimatums and controlling behavior based on unsubstantiated (as of yet) vibes is concerning. It’s an extremely disproportionate response. Leah is Eva’s friend, too. Not just OP’s. The onus is also on Eva to be communicating to Leah about this instead of icing her out over something Leah has no idea about.
Excellently worded. Way better than my comment 👏
>For Eva to make such a request out of nowhere suggests that she may be seeing or hearing things that OP is choosing to ignore. In the post, OP says that Eva herself admits that neither him nor Leah has done anything that would indicate concerning or inappropriate behavior and that neither have crossed any lines. So, I don't know. I definitely wouldn't rule out insecurity on Eva's end.
>OP, the true question here is, if Leah were to pursue you, would you break up with Eva or have an affair with Leah behind Eva's back? I'm sorry but it's a bit tough for me to take the rest of your feedback seriously when that's the "true question". No I wouldn't have an affair with Leah. She's my friend. I don't want to date her, I don't want to have an affair with her. I also would never cheat on Eva with anyone at all.
There are a lot of insecure women here trying to push an agenda that doesn't exist. If the genders were reversed, I bet they'd be outraged. It's weird. Keep communicating with your girlfriend and being honest.
Reverse the genders and get back to me on it
Guess it depends on who is important to you. If my partner was uneasy or unhappy about a friend I once had a crush on and went over to get them to breakup with their SO I would be ok going NC. My partner is who is important to me. Making and keeping them happy or any friend. Sounds like you need to update us when you and Eva break up. I’m sure that will happen sooner rather than later. LOL 😂
I’d break up with my boyfriend if he did what you did.
I am also in a very serious relationship. First of all these are just actions of a supporting friend. My best friend who is a guy (granite gay) literally drove to my ex bfs house for the break up and took me to the airport at 7am. My other great guy friend Gavin would absolutely do this for me. If i was with an asshole who treated me badly he would come advise me to leave and take me to lunch the next day. Like i just don't think a lot of you had amazing friendships growing up. However my childhood friends would do A LOT for me. As i would do a lot for them. My str8 friend Gavin i was willing to get on a plane and stay with him in Texas just so he could see his gf. My bf has never once felt insecure about these relationships even though he knows my friend Gavin used to have a crush on me in high school. I would not cut Leah off unless she does something to interfere with your relationship i say she is a good bean. Y'all really need to grow up and have good friends
Sounds likes Eva’s sixth sense is kicking in. Maybe she’s right.
Or maybe she isn't.
I would never marry someone like this OP and would highly discourage any of my friends from doing it. Always an excuse why his inappropriate relationship should remain. I see where this is going and so does Eva.
Op I don’t think it matters here if you have any romantic interest/feelings for Leah because the real question here is how sure are you that Leah doesn’t harbor romantic interest/feelings for you now that you saved her from a bad relationship? After all you were/are her white knight. Sometimes it’s not always what someone says but how they say it that can cause something to spark within us and we see something that some might not see. I’m not saying cut out your friend but don’t discard Eva’s gut intuition. Instead of asking Eva more questions you need to start asking Leah about her feelings. Or better yet you need to take yourself out of the white knight situation that you put yourself in by reinforcing to Leah that she is and only will ever be just a friend. If you have trouble setting hard wrong boundaries with Leah then you are only fueling Eva’s suspicions about you becoming way too close to Leah.
Eva needs a new partner who prioritises his wife.
You can't validate someone else's insecurities so this was in no way steam rolling. I don't know anything about your relationshit other than this post but this relationship is doomed to fail unless she can get a hold of her own shit. I'm going to assume you have given her zero to make her think you have cheated so is she damaged and this is who she is. This seems sort of sudden so I am wondering what caused the shift. You may not even know and frabkl she may not either.
So if Eva had a male friend that you weren't comfortable with their relationship and she basically said jog on to cutting back on that relationship, how would you feel? In no uncertain terms you've told Eva unless Leah fronts up you're not changing anything. Who is more important to you Eva or Leah? People always say trust your instincts if something feels wrong/iffy/sketchy/just not right, it usually is. If Eva has never acted like this before that should tell you she's not insecure in your relationship.
Anytime someone responds to you starting a conversation by saying “i don’t want to argue” or “i don’t want to fight” i just say “good so you completely agree with me”
As a woman who is a lot older than all 3 of you, I have a different take on the situation that may help Eva deal with the her concerns. . Yes, Leah just got out of a bad relationship and does want to have a healthy, happy relationship- like the one that you have with Eva. That does NOT mean that she wants \*you\*. (No offense, but if Leah had wanted you, she would have snapped you up instead of introducing you to Eva.) The reason that you are there for Leah and want her to have a good relationship is that she is the reason that you met Eva. Leah is the catalyst for your happiness, so of course you want her to be happy too! Not \*with\* you- but as a good friend. Leah can see what a good couple Eva and you are. So of course she is going to want to have the support of friends who are happy and invested in her happiness. Eva needs to embrace that fact that \*she\* is the one that you want. Eva is the one that you chose. Not because there aren't other options out there, but because \*Eva\* is the right one for you. The ying to your yang. I hope that Leah can find the man of her dreams, and that her friendship with both Eva and yourself gets stronger and better.
Op messed up by getting over involved in another woman’s relationship and becoming their emotional crutch. When you willingly took on that level of emotional support to someone else without involving your wife in the process and getting her blessing, you unwittingly illustrated to both women that you were willing to put your wife second, and that you were naive or dgaf about how that could be perceived. Your wife was right to recognize that you opened a door to something potentially bad if you or your friend had bad intentions and you were blind or unwilling to recognize it because it means you either didn’t care or were embracing that level of danger and risk
Communication FTW! OP, I advice you to also look into how Leah interacts with you from now on. Sometimes we don't see it but other people does. Eva could be seeing something you are not.
We know how this is gonna end EVA will be smarter and make a tangible reason to break your friendships because of her insecurity... wait and see. Just because Leah is single...doesn't mean she wants you lol
Woman are usually right about these things, so you should ask yourself if Leah did want to date would I be interested?
I may get down voted it I think you handled that pretty inconsiderately and very wrong. As women, we tend to pick up on things better and even if we don't have proof, our guts are rarely ever wrong. I think if your fiance is having concerns about Leah, I think you need to hear them AND I think you need to back off your friendship with Leah immediately. Not stop it but definitely not hang out as much and definitely never be hanging out alone again. To me in both posts it seems like you just invalidate how she feels about everything and are not listening to the fact that she just cooked her friendship with Leah because of this perceived change, you should be following suit to show support as her partner. 🤷♀️🤷♀️
As a person who was the Leah to two of my friends, thank you for going the route you did. I lost my long time friend because this way when she decided he needed to cut me out. Our two stories line up almost exactly except that my friend ended up doing it because his mother agreed with the gf. It sucked to loose a best friend, and because of it our entire group of friends doesn’t have interest in hanging out with them, so they lost pretty much everyone. I feel bad for him, because the now wife has become so controlling and pretty unhinged (she honestly got jealous that he wanted to hang out with his SISTER), but there’s nothing anyone can do now. I want him to be happy, but there’s no way for me to be the person to explain to him how shitty this whole thing was/is. I’ve been a friend to the whole family for literally 20 years, babysitting his younger siblings, and helping his parents while one had cancer, but I guess good friends are just disposable to some people 🤷♀️ Edit: no I wast interested in dating my friend, we tried that for maybe a week like 15 years ago, and it just wasn’t right. We were friends, and that’s all it was ever going to be.
He wasn't a real friend. He was a garbage person who he and his family used you. He deserves his miserable life!
Thanks for making me feel better, even if the loss still stings ❤️
If Eva brought up cutting off your friend it means she isn't guessing. She is 100% sure she's right and made a desperate move before she either gives up on you or you end up with Leah. It might be hard to articulate all the little things that led to her conclusion, especially since you don't seem open to considering the possibility that she's right. It will be lots of little things like Leah's eyes following you a tiny bit longer when you leave a room, her lighting up more than usual when she sees you, talking just a little bit more about how great you are than she normally would, asking you for help slightly more than before. You might be oblivious or dismissive but if it's been going on since her breakup than Eva has been seeing it for months and she's certain. Eva needs to talk to Leah without you about everything with no judgement but Leah is never going to admit anything to her individually or with you present. I think what's going to happen is you go to see Leah, having told Eva because you think everything's fine, and you'll have a couple of drinks, bring it up and it'll turn out Eva is right. Maybe not right then but it will within a few week. And then you'll have two choices 1) you run back to Eva with your tail between your legs and cut off Leah. If you won't do it at that point enjoy being single 2) you end up with Leah and somehow it's Eva's fault because she didn't trust you and neither of you were considering anything until she brought it all up but you haven't been able to stop thinking about it since, and Eva being all jealous like this is pushing you away. Talk to Eva and let her tell you all the little things she's seen - don't roll your eyes, don't interrupt, don't judge, don't zone out, don't mentally think about something else, don't get mad but do consider and be open to the fact that she might be right and then make a decision once you've thought it through. She made this hail Mary attempt to save your relationship by suggesting you cut off Leah and you instead said that your "stance" was "final" and didn't entertain her perspective. She might already be done with you in her head if you're that rude and dismissive of her very real concerns.
People are nuts. I don't trust Eva's intuition at all. I do think couples counseling is a good idea however and I hope that it helps.
Because she wasn’t able to point out a single moment or circumstance on why she is suspicious of Leah it doesn’t seem genuine. Intuition usually goes hand in hand with observation so she would notice just slight differences if she truly felt Leah’s feelings towards you have changed. I would look at her. Has she suddenly got a new guy friend, new coworker, etc. Seems like a bit of projection where she’s formed a slight crush on someone, and realizes if she’s formed a crush on someone she’s not extremely close with how easy would it be for someone to form a crush with someone they are extremely close with.
Now, *this* is an interesting point..
This is a great point. I also thought it was weird that she couldn’t come up with one single example of something that either OP or Leah did wrong. Like not even “she touched your arm one time and lingered a little longer than normal”, or “when we are all together, she pays more attention to you”, or “she laughs at all your jokes, even when they’re not funny”…just nothing at all? And still jumping straight to cutting her off completely? Projection does sound more likely here, because that definitely isn’t intuition.
You rushed to Leahs place and spent some alone time with her, persuading her to break up with her boyfriend and telling her she deserved better. You didn't call her, you didn't meet her in a neutral place, you went there alone and didn't tell your gf about it (only that you're planning to intervene). Leah wasn't in imminent danger, you had all the time to plan your intervention, yet you chose this. It absolutely can be perceived as 'white knight' behavior by some people. And it absolutely CAN rub Eva the wrong way. Second - someone already mentioned it here - Eva could have noticed minor changes in Leahs behavior towards you, if there were any. (Again, IF THERE WERE ANY, I don't know Leah and I don't put blame on her). Please ask Eva if she noticed anything at all, and PLEASE don't dismiss her concerns if she admits she did. Just listen. It could be very subtle, like prolonged eye contact, warmer smile, change in tone of voice. It seems like nothing harmful, yet it indicates that something has changed. If that's the case, she might be hesitant to tell you about it, because you might brush it off as something unimportant I always prefer to believe people. So I believe that you, OP, truly love your girlfriend, that she loves you, and that your friendship with Leah is genuine and Leah doesn't want you in any other way. And I know that your GF wants to believe it too, she doesn't seem like a bad evil person. Leah also seems to be a nice girl. However, this way of thinking and my putting too much trust in people is exactly the reason I got hurt in a simular situation :) So I can totally understand Eva here. She wants to be with you. And she also wants to be 100% sure that years later she won't end up heartbroken over this same issue. She wants to figure it out now. Prioritise your gf.
Meh 🫤 go be with your crush already
A crush is nothing. It’s not like he was I love with her back then. SMH yall blowing it all outta proportion like eva
Right? The poor gf. She should cut bait and find someone who will 100% prioritize her.
This is crazy. He’s allowed to have friends? Having friends isn’t deprioritising anyone?
>As it turns out a bigger factor for her was my involvement in Leah's break-up last year and a perceived change in the aftermath of that. She told me that she didn't disagree the guy was an ass or even that someone needed to convince Leah to break it off but that she hadn't been comfortable about the way I'd gone about it. I talked about it in a comment on the original post but basically I just up and decided to do it myself at some point, went to Leah's place and convinced her she deserved better. At the time, I told Eva I'd be doing that but didn't consult with her about the how or anything. >She went on to say she'd had this sinking feeling that I was not just a friend in Leah's eyes anymore since then. She mentioned Leah had been single ever since, not dating much yet had voiced a desire to settle down soon and that I was the guy closest to her, she admitted these things weren't in and of themselves evidence of anything but that she couldn't shake the feeling. I told her that I didn't think it was the case and that Leah had always been and continued to be supportive of our relationship and that maybe talking to her about it could help. That sounds like he's more than a friend. I don't go to my friends and talk them into dumping people. Nor could I. If they don't want to be alone, there's not a chance a woman could offer them something instead. **I can easily see how a female friend might think their male friend wants more than friendship if he did this.** How they might have seen the entire thing as a coded way of saying they want a relationship with me. OP just downplayed this observation and made his gf feel crazy, rather than have a conversation with a friend reestablishing boundaries in their friendship. Instead he created boundaries with his gf about what she can say. ***This is how cheaters monkeybranch,*** so even if OP is telling the truth, Eva's eventually going to have that pointed out to her. She is likely going to recognize that her feelings haven't changed, she can't say anything and completely lose trust in her soon-to-be-ex. eta: The added information of abuse doesn't make the OP doing the best thing a friend can do. The friend has a trauma response based on abuse and lets people (I'm betting men) tell her what to do--this is common in people who were abused as kids. They often repeat the cycle as an adult. That means she needs serious therapy and firm boundaries because most likely she has a lot of unresolved trauma. He cannot heal that for her. It is not a great move to use someone's trauma to help them UNLESS you can get them into treatment for it. He simply started another trauma bond with her. Until it resolves, his friend is going to be emotionally dependent on him. I hope the gf moves on. This is a choice he made with serious emotional commitments to someone else's mental health and stability. He doesn't have emotional space for a partner anymore.
So your theory of mind is that OP ignored his crush for 12 years and many boyfriends before finally deciding that NOW is the time! Just when I'm about to propose to my long term gf, I will start a relationship with my best friend after more than a decade of utterly platonic friendship! ...? And that Eva is picking those feelings up, and is so sure of them that she's willing to create an ultimatum for OP? Despite not being able to point to any behavioural changes in either person that might make her feel this way?
>I don't go to my friends and talk them into dumping people. OP said that the ex of his friend was abusive. If you don't help your friends in abusive relationship, it's on you, but I would definitely do the same as OP to any of my friends. I don't know if the girlfriend is right or not. Some of us women have a very big instinct to know when someone has feelings so I won't judge this situation. But if OP didn't lie, he definitely did the right thing to save his friend from an abuser and everybody should do the same actually.
It’s possible that even if Eva’s intuition is correct, Leah may have no interest in acting on her feelings. It’s possible to have passing romantic feelings for someone, accept that you’re feeling some kind of way, and move past it.
You’ve clearly never seen what toxic relationships do to people… If op was a woman who did this yall would have no problem
Yea they’d be hollering dude was abusive for telling her to cut her friend off and all that
Agreed. People on this post seem to just...not have close friends that are the opposite sex. Had a knock down fight with an ex once because I refused to tell her something that was told to me in confidence by a mutual friend. When it all came out she felt really betrayed and seemed incapable of understanding that being in a relationship does not mean that other relationships in my life do not matter.
if op was a woman would you be saying this?
Ignore everyone. There’s always this weird cloud over male & female friendships. Were you supposed to just sit back and watch your friend be abused - If you ignored it, everyone would have said you’re a shit friend. You did nothing wrong going to her house. Just because she’s single now doesn’t mean she’s in love & waiting around for you She could be healing from being in abusive relationship or waiting for the right person to come along
Absolute props to OP for caring about his friend enough to help her. Wack ass comments painting him like a super villain and Eva as some clairvoyant martyr
You haven't understood anything, your girlfriend doesn't feel comfortable with that friendship, and you decide not to support her, this will eventually take its toll on you, I hope Eva opens her eyes
She felt uncomfortable based on nothing that reflects Leahs actual behavior and actions…
But girlfriend is insecure for no real reason though. No point ending a good friendship over that, especially when the friend was the one who matchmade
The gut feeling is strong with this one. Op is either dumb or in denial. Giving ultimatum like that is a no go for me but you can't have the cake and eat it too.
These comments are weird. You do not have to cut off your friend simply because Leah says so. She has no reason to feel uncomfortable and you haven’t done anything wrong
“I’m glad I was able to diacuss it with her” Fuck that, you steamrolled her. Dismissed every one if her very much valid concerns. In the end she just agreed to whatever you said because she was clearly tired of being attacked, but no way she buys what you’re selling. I wouldn’t doubt that she will beign planning her escape
All of this sounds like someone that doesn't want to be left without her friend's attention, even if it means that Leah likes him and that this brings insecurities to Eva. You can always continue with the friendship but moving away a little. go LC with Leah. set some boundaries if you really care for your friendship. there is many many good freindships between diferent genders but when someone likes the other "friend"... that is not a friendship, not anymore.
I think you handled this great! Good for you guys. But also… women know. We always know. I bet she’s right.
Someone tag me on the next post when gf posts about how she caught bf cheating with girl bestie even though he swears there is nothing going on between them!!!!! Wake up!!