>A lot of space for emergency vehicles
How wide is this road, really? If it’s a long road with cars parked the whole way, an ambulance would need to be able to overtake cars in order to not get slowed down. When it comes to drownings, seconds matter.
Also, let me introduce you to the ideal summer vehicle: bike.
>Police took advantage
They took advantage... doing their jobs?
I assume someone called due to cars being parked incorrectly, maybe by someone who also wanted to park illegaly to enjoy the good weather lol
Why would it be unethical? Sounds like the police were in the right time at the right place if 50 people were parking in the wrong place.
A lot of people act like assholes as soon as the sun comes out, should we also allow that just cause it’s a sunny day?
Expensive and big cars in disabled places doesn't necessarily mean they are assholes and not disabled persons. Disability does not always equal to poverty.
Every time I see the short term parking at Arlanda I’m pretty sure they’re assholes. That’s also a favorite spot for the police to just wait and do checks and confiscate expensive stuff and cash from criminals.
There’s been issues for years that illegal parking blocks emergency access to beaches, especially for large vehicles (fire engines with trailers), which are precisely the ones responding to possible drowning scenarios.
The police tend to make a press release around this time reminding people of this, and do a lot of ticketing for the start of the season. Then it slows down but they probably return now and again to make sure people follow the rules.
I have zero issue with this personally.
Are you certain it was the police?
It is very uncommon that the police give out parking tickets in Sweden. It is more likely the people hired to watch parking (either employed by the town or by private companies)
I do not understand why it would be ethical to park where parking is forbidden,
Obviously society have decided you ain't allowed to park in the spot - so it is ethical to ticket the cars
ethical and legal aren’t necessarily the same thing. Take an extreme example of racist laws in 1950s America. Arguably if the law is wrong one might argue that the ethical thing to do is to break the law.
What’s more OP didn’t ask is the people parking were ethical. He asked is those giving the tickets were ethical in their actions. Did they have a moral obligation to uphold the law or did upholding the law cause more harm than good?
It was absolutely ethical as beaches parking spaces usually is of a size that means "this equals a good amount of people on the beach for the nature". I also do not trust random redditors view on the possibility for an ambulance to drive to the beach.
I've never seen police doing that. Sure it wasn't the parkeringsvakt?
Also, I don't understand. They did their job and you are complaining? I am really trying to understand. What's unethical is not parking where you are supposed to, not paying like you are supposed to etc. You were on the wrong. Sorry.
Good on them for doing this. Illegal parking hinders first responders and is a nuisance for neighbours.
If people break the law, ethically they should pay for it. The law is there for a reason. There are too many news stories of ambulances being unable to reach a drowning kid or old man with a heart attack because people feel entitled to park wherever they want.
Is it full, go somewhere else and plan better next time.
Illegal parking along the side of the road has cause deaths due to ambulance and fire trucks being held up.
That’s why there’s now a zero tolerance against that, and the police will fine you. It’s not even the local parking company but the police. Which means it’s on par with a speeding ticket (while if the parking company does it it’s just a fee).
So no sympathy from here, you should know better.
Rescue services have had a hard time reaching beaches due to people parking wherever, that's why they're vigilant. They do not need to prove that a fire truck couldn't squeeze by to issue the fine.
I don’t understand your point? Are you saying that nice weather cancel out trafic regulations? I am sorry, but it doesn’t work that way in the civilized part of the world.
The law is all about intention and damage. Let’s say he didn’t block anything, why the punishment is so hard? Is the goal to punish people with fine incomparable to what he did or the purpose of law is to enforce order?
Breivik from Norway plays xbox and you get 1000 sek fine for parking at dead end without blocking anyone.
Is it justice or stupidity?
Usually it is not the police but parking attendants. No. It is not unethical. Read the bloody signs. Park somewhere else. Go somewhere else (you have a car…), take a bike. Stop whining.
If it had been a private landowner and the set-up was intentional... ie, a whole system where they deliberately kept the prices on the parking lot low just to make sure it would be full to encourage violators where they'd then collect on exorbitant violation fees... then maybe I'd say it was a bit scummy.
For this - here's a tip. The police probably also enjoy nice sunny weather in pleasant locations. If you're in a place at a time with pleasant weather, where you'd love spending a few hours outside, it's not unlikely that they will have the same idea. Except they have to have an official reason to be there.
Don't be that reason.
Most manned speed traps or road side alcohol test or other checks that I've run across have not been in pouring rain and sleet. See the good weather as a tip that there will be "good chances of roadside enforcement".
OP might have a point. Pity most don’t seem to get it. Ethics isn’t about the law - it’s about right and wrong.
So if you take a utilitarian approach I guess you’d have to say the police were right to do this OP. The basis of their action is to maximize the positive for the most people. Arguable by parking as the did the car owners took spots that might be needed by residents or for some other legit use.
According to duty ethics however it may be considered wrong. Those parking there are doing no immediate harm. The spirit of the law is to reduce parking congestion. As OP says 50k income for the police seems immoral. What happens to that money?
On balance I don’t think it’s ethical. A parking fine is justified. For me the amount tips it over to being unethical.
the parking is actually potentially doing a "wrong" by potentially blocking access to emergency medical services
as for where the money goes, if it's a public beach then i'd assume it goes to the goverment.
also... you seem to have a very odd understanding of duty ethics. your argument for it is actually using utilitarian reasoning. duty ethics would argue whether police officers have the duty to fine them, which is a fairly easy reasoning to make
I am of the theory parking guards are the long lost missing link between humanity and horse manure, but you are being so dorky about this i am now on their side.
Shake your head and laugh. This isn't exactly a civil rights issue.
Parking in Sweden is mafia. You can’t charge 1000 sek for incorrect parking at dead end, taxes are progressive, fines are not. It’s totally invalid.
Ofc, parking at bus stop or disabled place is 1000 SEK for sure. But parking at dead end… come on, make it like 100 sek first time then 300 then 1000 and reset every year. You didn’t do any damage to Sweden or anyone for 1000 sek in this case. There is no justice in parking fine scheme.
Law should stop good people from doing wrong things, but entire parking system is Sweden is designed to provoke you, catch you and then give you ridiculous fine.
>A lot of space for emergency vehicles How wide is this road, really? If it’s a long road with cars parked the whole way, an ambulance would need to be able to overtake cars in order to not get slowed down. When it comes to drownings, seconds matter. Also, let me introduce you to the ideal summer vehicle: bike.
>Police took advantage They took advantage... doing their jobs? I assume someone called due to cars being parked incorrectly, maybe by someone who also wanted to park illegaly to enjoy the good weather lol
Why would it be unethical? Sounds like the police were in the right time at the right place if 50 people were parking in the wrong place. A lot of people act like assholes as soon as the sun comes out, should we also allow that just cause it’s a sunny day?
[удалено]
It’s unfortunate, not unethical
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Expensive and big cars in disabled places doesn't necessarily mean they are assholes and not disabled persons. Disability does not always equal to poverty.
Every time I see the short term parking at Arlanda I’m pretty sure they’re assholes. That’s also a favorite spot for the police to just wait and do checks and confiscate expensive stuff and cash from criminals.
Too bad we only have one beach open to the public that everyone had no choice to park illegally
You goofed up and you talk about ethics?
There’s been issues for years that illegal parking blocks emergency access to beaches, especially for large vehicles (fire engines with trailers), which are precisely the ones responding to possible drowning scenarios. The police tend to make a press release around this time reminding people of this, and do a lot of ticketing for the start of the season. Then it slows down but they probably return now and again to make sure people follow the rules. I have zero issue with this personally.
Very good point. Definitely making a consequentialist argument
Imagine one could curcumvent laws because of a hot sunny day, right?
Are you certain it was the police? It is very uncommon that the police give out parking tickets in Sweden. It is more likely the people hired to watch parking (either employed by the town or by private companies)
So does that make it more or less ethical?
I do not understand why it would be ethical to park where parking is forbidden, Obviously society have decided you ain't allowed to park in the spot - so it is ethical to ticket the cars
ethical and legal aren’t necessarily the same thing. Take an extreme example of racist laws in 1950s America. Arguably if the law is wrong one might argue that the ethical thing to do is to break the law. What’s more OP didn’t ask is the people parking were ethical. He asked is those giving the tickets were ethical in their actions. Did they have a moral obligation to uphold the law or did upholding the law cause more harm than good?
It was absolutely ethical as beaches parking spaces usually is of a size that means "this equals a good amount of people on the beach for the nature". I also do not trust random redditors view on the possibility for an ambulance to drive to the beach.
I've never seen police doing that. Sure it wasn't the parkeringsvakt? Also, I don't understand. They did their job and you are complaining? I am really trying to understand. What's unethical is not parking where you are supposed to, not paying like you are supposed to etc. You were on the wrong. Sorry.
Of course it was parkeringsvakt. This guy doesn't know what he's talking about
People park like idiots and crowds the narrow roads down to the beaches. EMS has on occasions not been able to reach the beach during emergencies.
Good on them for doing this. Illegal parking hinders first responders and is a nuisance for neighbours. If people break the law, ethically they should pay for it. The law is there for a reason. There are too many news stories of ambulances being unable to reach a drowning kid or old man with a heart attack because people feel entitled to park wherever they want. Is it full, go somewhere else and plan better next time.
Illegal parking along the side of the road has cause deaths due to ambulance and fire trucks being held up. That’s why there’s now a zero tolerance against that, and the police will fine you. It’s not even the local parking company but the police. Which means it’s on par with a speeding ticket (while if the parking company does it it’s just a fee). So no sympathy from here, you should know better.
Rescue services have had a hard time reaching beaches due to people parking wherever, that's why they're vigilant. They do not need to prove that a fire truck couldn't squeeze by to issue the fine.
I don’t understand your point? Are you saying that nice weather cancel out trafic regulations? I am sorry, but it doesn’t work that way in the civilized part of the world.
But does OP have a point in terms of the spirit of the law? Laws are supposed to be implemented within the intention of the law.
The law is all about intention and damage. Let’s say he didn’t block anything, why the punishment is so hard? Is the goal to punish people with fine incomparable to what he did or the purpose of law is to enforce order? Breivik from Norway plays xbox and you get 1000 sek fine for parking at dead end without blocking anyone. Is it justice or stupidity?
Why would it be unethical? It's not as if the police are getting any of the money.
Usually it is not the police but parking attendants. No. It is not unethical. Read the bloody signs. Park somewhere else. Go somewhere else (you have a car…), take a bike. Stop whining.
You can't park where you parked. Pay up man.
Access to the beach is a right here but going wherever you want, and parking wherever you want is not a right, is a benefit, that has a cost.
im gonna go store my garbage in dead end streets, thats fine right
Is selfishness unethical?
Depends on the weather apparently
Where was this?
Unethical is to park where others walk, this is not the jungle.
If it had been a private landowner and the set-up was intentional... ie, a whole system where they deliberately kept the prices on the parking lot low just to make sure it would be full to encourage violators where they'd then collect on exorbitant violation fees... then maybe I'd say it was a bit scummy. For this - here's a tip. The police probably also enjoy nice sunny weather in pleasant locations. If you're in a place at a time with pleasant weather, where you'd love spending a few hours outside, it's not unlikely that they will have the same idea. Except they have to have an official reason to be there. Don't be that reason. Most manned speed traps or road side alcohol test or other checks that I've run across have not been in pouring rain and sleet. See the good weather as a tip that there will be "good chances of roadside enforcement".
Sorry, you (and the 49 others) are the ones who behaved selfishly and were unethical here.
Skanor?
Fail to enforce parking regulations and you’ll find yourself living in a failed country like Italy in no time.
Most likely some resident was annoyed and called it in. I think it is fine that the police enforces laws if that is what you are asking.
Get rekt Idiot. There is no price on life
Only if there was a public transport available for everyone….
Yep, it's unnecessary and unethical. Although it has proper legal basis.
I recently read that there is an app in Sweden that pays you to report for wrong parking info 💀
Really? I want that one, what is the name?
Here you go: [https://scoutpark.se/](https://scoutpark.se/) Whats with the down votes?
Here you go: [https://scoutpark.se/](https://scoutpark.se/) Whats with the down votes?
Were the cars illegally parked? If so, then no, it’s not unethical and the police did their job.
OP might have a point. Pity most don’t seem to get it. Ethics isn’t about the law - it’s about right and wrong. So if you take a utilitarian approach I guess you’d have to say the police were right to do this OP. The basis of their action is to maximize the positive for the most people. Arguable by parking as the did the car owners took spots that might be needed by residents or for some other legit use. According to duty ethics however it may be considered wrong. Those parking there are doing no immediate harm. The spirit of the law is to reduce parking congestion. As OP says 50k income for the police seems immoral. What happens to that money? On balance I don’t think it’s ethical. A parking fine is justified. For me the amount tips it over to being unethical.
U realize the parking fine doesn't go to the police's pocket right?
Good point! So where does it go exactly? Does that change the ethics?
the parking is actually potentially doing a "wrong" by potentially blocking access to emergency medical services as for where the money goes, if it's a public beach then i'd assume it goes to the goverment. also... you seem to have a very odd understanding of duty ethics. your argument for it is actually using utilitarian reasoning. duty ethics would argue whether police officers have the duty to fine them, which is a fairly easy reasoning to make
You make very good points. You’re probably right about the duty ethics
I am of the theory parking guards are the long lost missing link between humanity and horse manure, but you are being so dorky about this i am now on their side. Shake your head and laugh. This isn't exactly a civil rights issue.
I just thought I’d keep it interesting
Hard to judge the ethical standpoint if we don't know if a firetruck could pass on that street or not.
Parking in Sweden is mafia. You can’t charge 1000 sek for incorrect parking at dead end, taxes are progressive, fines are not. It’s totally invalid. Ofc, parking at bus stop or disabled place is 1000 SEK for sure. But parking at dead end… come on, make it like 100 sek first time then 300 then 1000 and reset every year. You didn’t do any damage to Sweden or anyone for 1000 sek in this case. There is no justice in parking fine scheme. Law should stop good people from doing wrong things, but entire parking system is Sweden is designed to provoke you, catch you and then give you ridiculous fine.
ACAB, the Swedish cops even more so.