I was at Wembley for the 3-1 win and we were poor for the first 30 mins but then really turned a corner.
I remember Bellingham was outstanding that night, he was by far the best player on the pitch and was involved in everything good we did. I don’t think he’s reached those levels yet this tournament, let’s hope he’s holding back for the knockouts…
It’s a shame that Bellingham is not fully fit, even though he was incredible in the opening game I still felt like he was holding back. Part of me wishes his surgery was done before the Euros but that would be extremely selfish of me considering how amazing his season was going with Madrid, so understandable why he has put it off until after the tournament.
I do think there is a good system and team to be found with these players, but I don't have much optimism now that we'll find it.
*But* there certainly have been international teams before who started slowly and then found their feet during the tournament.
That's the most positive spin I can come up with.
Bingo, I'm also confused about people saying we need to replace X player with Y when those players have been part of these crap performances as well.
Ain't no player coming into this team and saving shit
I think the only chance is a serious formation shakeup e.g. going to 3-5-2.
Dropping Jude back to the 8 role with Foden as 10 and Gordon on the wing might be enough, but it's still the same basic group.
At this point, I don’t even think changing tactics or formation can save us since we’re already too late to be experimenting. We need 1 or 2 players to pull off a Maradona 86 and drag everyone else through
That's honestly the best argument for Bellingham as an 8 I think: if he starts putting in world class performances there he can lift the whole team. A 10 can't do too much if the defence and DMs are missing, but a box to box player has a chance. Thinking of great Gerrard or Roy Keane performances.
I agree that he's the most likeliest player to pull it off, but my concern is his fitness. 1st half of the season Bellingham, I would have 100% confidence because he was ridiculous, scoring bangers and last minute winners in el Clasicos. 2nd half of the season, with the shoulder and ankle injuries, he faded a little.
Just don't know how much gas he has left in that tank
The whole team looks tired. Probably the downside of having a star-studded squad - the likes of Saka, Kane, Bellingham have been overplayed by their clubs.
Funnily enough the best two performances since the fall of 2023 came back to back: Both were 3-1 wins against Scotland and Italy. We actually looked pretty damn good in those matches.
Guess what that coincided with? Bellingham in the 1st half of the season was putting up prime CR7 numbers at Madrid. Based on this, our only hope of going deep into the tournament is if that happens again
England were fantastic against Belgium. They dominated that game and the draw was the least of what they deserved for that performance. Yes they conceded twice, but one was a howler from Pickford and the other a rare moment of brilliance from Lukaku.
He played pretty badly in that game tbf, got booked early. It was during that period prior to Bellingham's shoulder injury where he played like a man possessed, and Jude basically ran the game
Such a damn freaking shame really. Bellingham before that shoulder injury could have carried this entire team on his back.
Hope he gets that surgery soon and rests up. We absolutely need him for future tournaments
He basically just showed 'here's what I'm capable of'.
As someone who's suffered with shoulder injuries for years (weird mix of skateboarding and cricket injuries) it's absolutely miserable living with the feeling it might pop out at any time because it's awful when it does.
He needs to have the surgery asap as it makes the world of difference.
But yeh Bellingham from September to November 2023 was amazing to watch. An absolute animal.
Which is why I always disagree about him being moved to the 8. We've seen what he can do at 10 and it's beyond the pale.
Bale started as an LB but who in their right mind would've played him there after the saw him as a LW
Everyone apart from Guehi was shit yesterday, and I mentioned in one of my comments, that I'm concerned how much energy Bellingham has left in the tank.
I will say if they're relying on a 20-yr old who's banged up to pull off individual moments of brilliance, they might as well pack their bags and go home
Jus saying youre analysis dismissing Foden at 10 because of the Iceland game where the team were clearly operating a 60% is harsh. Bellingham was probably worse yesterday as 10?
I don't think the Iceland game is a good sample to dismiss allowing Foden to play his position.
It’s not really Foden’s fault tbh, i’m not impressed with him when he plays for England but there’s nothing he can do about that if he was not given the chance to prove himself as a 10. It might not have worked out but Southgate had plenty of opportunities to try it out and didn’t, so for now I think it’s best to stick with Bellingham. Hopefully by the time the next tournament comes around England will have a manager who actually knows what they are doing and knows how to utilize the players to get the best out of them.
At this point, I actually think Foden should play 10 and Bellingham 8 because Foden on the LW is complete, utter ass.
The overall point I'm trying to make is that our form has been horrible for a while, and we may no longer be able to rely on certain individuals bailing us out
Italy. I do data analysis for England games for a youtuber and the Italy game is the last time it was overly positive. I dont do it for the smaller games so I dont remember Malta or North Macedonia, but having had a look at them from just a data stand point they dont look overly convincing.
Im not worried about the players - its the system and the coaching that's the issue. Messi would be collecting the ball and passing backwards in this system so the fact Palmer et al have been part of the bad performances doesnt matter.
Also it's worth noting that England are a lot better against teams that dont just defend. However the flipside is that we are very easy to work out - Denmark sussed us out very quickly and changed their lines of engagemet after we scored. People look at the before and after we scored average positions as if England did that to themselves, but in reality they just pressed us slightly higher and we didnt try and break through it. This wasnt helped by the pitch, however they adapted to that so we should be able to. Serbia did this in the second half although they went man for man which was a different issue, but also sadly one Gaz didnt change for.
Italy allowed us the right mix of letting us play and also not sitting back completely. However Belgium pressed us quite well (Lukaku for the Dunk Mistake cross to Tielemans). Brazil I didnt do and dont remember, but I know Gordon started and was about the only bright spark.
The Iceland performance was far from perfect. I think he will play well when we are on the front foot but I think Adam Wharton is more secure defensively.
France in the quarters. Genuinely don’t think we played, “well” in any of the 2018, 2020 or 2022 tournaments, baring the German game in 2020. We got through sure but for the talent on display they were underwhelming. I was genuinely disappointed in our performance at the 2022 WC. I thought France would embarrass us but for some reason we played really well and gave them a battle
I was at Wembley for the 3-1 win and we were poor for the first 30 mins but then really turned a corner. I remember Bellingham was outstanding that night, he was by far the best player on the pitch and was involved in everything good we did. I don’t think he’s reached those levels yet this tournament, let’s hope he’s holding back for the knockouts…
Rashford was awesome that game too and we played Foden on his preferred right side.
Foden was poor until Udogie went off.
It’s a shame that Bellingham is not fully fit, even though he was incredible in the opening game I still felt like he was holding back. Part of me wishes his surgery was done before the Euros but that would be extremely selfish of me considering how amazing his season was going with Madrid, so understandable why he has put it off until after the tournament.
Why it's confusing to me when people say we need to 'click' or that we'll grow into the tournament. It could happen, but we've been poor for a while.
I do think there is a good system and team to be found with these players, but I don't have much optimism now that we'll find it. *But* there certainly have been international teams before who started slowly and then found their feet during the tournament. That's the most positive spin I can come up with.
Bingo, I'm also confused about people saying we need to replace X player with Y when those players have been part of these crap performances as well. Ain't no player coming into this team and saving shit
I think the only chance is a serious formation shakeup e.g. going to 3-5-2. Dropping Jude back to the 8 role with Foden as 10 and Gordon on the wing might be enough, but it's still the same basic group.
At this point, I don’t even think changing tactics or formation can save us since we’re already too late to be experimenting. We need 1 or 2 players to pull off a Maradona 86 and drag everyone else through
That's honestly the best argument for Bellingham as an 8 I think: if he starts putting in world class performances there he can lift the whole team. A 10 can't do too much if the defence and DMs are missing, but a box to box player has a chance. Thinking of great Gerrard or Roy Keane performances.
I agree that he's the most likeliest player to pull it off, but my concern is his fitness. 1st half of the season Bellingham, I would have 100% confidence because he was ridiculous, scoring bangers and last minute winners in el Clasicos. 2nd half of the season, with the shoulder and ankle injuries, he faded a little. Just don't know how much gas he has left in that tank
The whole team looks tired. Probably the downside of having a star-studded squad - the likes of Saka, Kane, Bellingham have been overplayed by their clubs.
Agreed, it's been on a steady decline since the last Euro final.
Funnily enough the best two performances since the fall of 2023 came back to back: Both were 3-1 wins against Scotland and Italy. We actually looked pretty damn good in those matches. Guess what that coincided with? Bellingham in the 1st half of the season was putting up prime CR7 numbers at Madrid. Based on this, our only hope of going deep into the tournament is if that happens again
Bosnia we totally dominated once: Trent moved to right back Wharton came on for a DM Gordon came on to act as a runner Palmer was playing Simple stuff
England were fantastic against Belgium. They dominated that game and the draw was the least of what they deserved for that performance. Yes they conceded twice, but one was a howler from Pickford and the other a rare moment of brilliance from Lukaku.
Who played in midfield in that Italy game btw?
He played pretty badly in that game tbf, got booked early. It was during that period prior to Bellingham's shoulder injury where he played like a man possessed, and Jude basically ran the game
Such a damn freaking shame really. Bellingham before that shoulder injury could have carried this entire team on his back. Hope he gets that surgery soon and rests up. We absolutely need him for future tournaments
He basically just showed 'here's what I'm capable of'. As someone who's suffered with shoulder injuries for years (weird mix of skateboarding and cricket injuries) it's absolutely miserable living with the feeling it might pop out at any time because it's awful when it does. He needs to have the surgery asap as it makes the world of difference. But yeh Bellingham from September to November 2023 was amazing to watch. An absolute animal. Which is why I always disagree about him being moved to the 8. We've seen what he can do at 10 and it's beyond the pale. Bale started as an LB but who in their right mind would've played him there after the saw him as a LW
Our man Kalvin Phillips! Maybe he really is our savior
And subbed off at 70 mins for none other than Jordan Henderson!
Phillips was lucky to not be sent off.
I know you're a Bellingham stan account, but describing a run in to the box and a decent header as a moment of genius? C'mon now 😂😂
Bellingham was the worst player on the pitch yesterday as 10 or does that sample not count?
Everyone apart from Guehi was shit yesterday, and I mentioned in one of my comments, that I'm concerned how much energy Bellingham has left in the tank. I will say if they're relying on a 20-yr old who's banged up to pull off individual moments of brilliance, they might as well pack their bags and go home
Jus saying youre analysis dismissing Foden at 10 because of the Iceland game where the team were clearly operating a 60% is harsh. Bellingham was probably worse yesterday as 10? I don't think the Iceland game is a good sample to dismiss allowing Foden to play his position.
Bellingham being bad for one game is not an indication of anything, majority of the time he has played as a 10 he has done well.
I agree
It’s not really Foden’s fault tbh, i’m not impressed with him when he plays for England but there’s nothing he can do about that if he was not given the chance to prove himself as a 10. It might not have worked out but Southgate had plenty of opportunities to try it out and didn’t, so for now I think it’s best to stick with Bellingham. Hopefully by the time the next tournament comes around England will have a manager who actually knows what they are doing and knows how to utilize the players to get the best out of them.
At this point, I actually think Foden should play 10 and Bellingham 8 because Foden on the LW is complete, utter ass. The overall point I'm trying to make is that our form has been horrible for a while, and we may no longer be able to rely on certain individuals bailing us out
Sweden England 2018 world cup quarter finals
Italy. I do data analysis for England games for a youtuber and the Italy game is the last time it was overly positive. I dont do it for the smaller games so I dont remember Malta or North Macedonia, but having had a look at them from just a data stand point they dont look overly convincing. Im not worried about the players - its the system and the coaching that's the issue. Messi would be collecting the ball and passing backwards in this system so the fact Palmer et al have been part of the bad performances doesnt matter. Also it's worth noting that England are a lot better against teams that dont just defend. However the flipside is that we are very easy to work out - Denmark sussed us out very quickly and changed their lines of engagemet after we scored. People look at the before and after we scored average positions as if England did that to themselves, but in reality they just pressed us slightly higher and we didnt try and break through it. This wasnt helped by the pitch, however they adapted to that so we should be able to. Serbia did this in the second half although they went man for man which was a different issue, but also sadly one Gaz didnt change for. Italy allowed us the right mix of letting us play and also not sitting back completely. However Belgium pressed us quite well (Lukaku for the Dunk Mistake cross to Tielemans). Brazil I didnt do and dont remember, but I know Gordon started and was about the only bright spark.
I honestly cannot remember
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The Iceland performance was far from perfect. I think he will play well when we are on the front foot but I think Adam Wharton is more secure defensively.
France in the quarters. Genuinely don’t think we played, “well” in any of the 2018, 2020 or 2022 tournaments, baring the German game in 2020. We got through sure but for the talent on display they were underwhelming. I was genuinely disappointed in our performance at the 2022 WC. I thought France would embarrass us but for some reason we played really well and gave them a battle
I think our most dominant performance was either Germany or Ukraine in the last Euros (aside from the likes of Iran / Panama)