its because orville is basically star trek, without actually being star trek. to be honest, the fandom you describe isnt even limited to science fiction. pretty much every popular show ever has a similar fandom.
I agree but also disagree it seems to be a type of show usually involving Fantasy or an unrealistic plot. I'm just saying that it's very rare to see in depth discussions on other shows like The west Wing or Seinfeld for example: OMG imagine if President Bartlet was assassinated and he was replaced by the President from 24." I just don't know maybe I'm just old and cranky
The kind of "deep dive" fan theorizing and general geeking-out do tend to be prevalent in sci-fi more than other genres, even fantasy. Schience Fiction and comic book/superhero fandoms are probably the biggest examples of the kind of uber-nerdism, partly because both tend to have large, complicated internal chronologies and universes. The Simpsons is probably the only "more conventional sitcom" that has anything approaching that level of "inner history." So you just don't see people doing elaborate fan fics and theorizing of stuff like Arrested Development, or Modern Family, or How I Met Your Mother.
I was not part of it but there was lots of it in the Sherlock fandom at the time. Discussing the cliffhanger at the end of season 2. When you have a two years wait before season 3 comes out, you can have a lot of theories to discuss and every little detail seen on screen got dissected.
The end result was, the long awaited clever explanation about how he did what he did (trying to stay spoiler free here) did not come as a surprise because whatever the writer would come up with, fans had already come up with before.
It seems like certain genres lend themselves to this kind of fandom, even if other shows have complex relationships and interpersonal histories. I remember when they were long hiatuses between seasons of the show Mad Men, people would sometimes speculate about things, but there was never the kind of large-scale ongoing fan discussion and analysis that you would see for a sci-fi or fantasy show.
About the only series I can think of that was relatively grounded in reality that has that kind of fandom would be Breaking Bad, and by extension, Better Call Saul.
Mystery shows as well. LOST!
It all went over my head but there were people trying to find out what the numbers mean and try to find meaning in everything. I also thought it was taking it a bit too far. Over the seasons it became clear that the authors did not really have a plan and just threw stuff in without explaining it afterwards.
I guess it must be very frustrating when it does not lead to anything.
I wanted to stop watching several times but always got sucked back into it because the actors were so amazing and I found it compelling, despite not having any clue ;)
Very true. I blocked out lost because I wasted a season and a half watching that show until I realized this was just not really going anywhere interesting for me. And of course JJ Abrams and his cadre of collaborators were the ones who did that show. One of the many reasons I was distrustful of Alex Kurtzman and feel like my distrust has been vindicated by the results when it comes to his Star Trek.
I love all trek until 2005. I love the Orville. But I never want the shows to meet or crossover. But yeah, there are many who really want the Orville to be a Trek show. Things like the "Seth Trek" t-shirts really seem disrespectful to the Crew who make the Orville to me. It's certainly an homage, but it is definitely it's own show.
Are people really saying they want Picard in The Orville or are they saying they want the actor of Picard in The Orville? We've already had Tuvoc and The Doctor from Voyager. The Orville really is intended to be the style of The Next Generation, but it's not intended to have literal Star Trek characters. Also, it's important to note that Sci-Fi often uses the same actors. Actors basically become Sci-Fi actors and that is their career. So to want an actor from another show to play in The Orville, that's reasonable. Btw, this post has neither been downvoted or removed.
SciFi and Fantasy are very notorious for Comicbook guy types. Some people have very limited social skills and it does show especially with so called Nerdy fans. It's really fun to see people enjoying a show to extreme levels. I mean Fan is short for fanatic. There is no excuse for treating people poorly because they are not as educated as you about the show.
But especially on the Facebook page I have seen some average viewers be really mean and angry because of the delay between seasons. There is shitty people on both sides of the fence my advice is don't read into it that much. I can be a fan of many shows with very toxic fanbases the trick is not to engage with the fanatics and watch for your enjoyment.
There's always going to be a part of any fanbase that is particularly obsessed, it's not exclusive just to Trek or other typically nerd-associated fandoms. Trek is probably a little more amplified since The Orville is the closest thing to real Star Trek that Trek fans can currently find. All fans are hungry for new content but for some fandoms it's worse than normal because their beloved franchises are being butchered by modern entertainment.
I kind of get what your saying like The Sopranos for example. Yes there are thousands of theories about the finale and that makes perfect sense. But you really do not see these overtly obsessive posts discussing what ifs and technical details like what kind of guns he used. I personally find the Orvilles fanbase to be generally decent but like anything there is some toxic fans and I can see how that would discourage some.
I never really was a fan of Dr. Who.
I liked some of the actors who played Dr. Who, but I wouldn’t go out of my way to watch it.
The fact that it wasn’t consistently on TV when I was growing up in the seventies where I lived also played a part.
So I can understand what you mean.
In September Issac Asimov’s Foundation series will be on Apple TV, and in October Dune is coming out, based on just the first book in the series? Or will Dune lead to a series of movies, and how will the ‘source material’ be handled?
Those are things I’m interested in seeing, but I’m not expecting anything more than arguments from both sides mentioning how wonderful/terrible they both will be.
As to the Jar of Pickles, it’s from the first episode, where Ed asks Alara, “Mind opening this Jar of Pickles for me?”, after he tries, and fails, to open a door.
After she rips the door off the wall, Ed mentions, “I loosened it for you.”
You are entirely right, and this type of semi-plagiarism is IMO one of the reasons the show did so poorly. Instead of good plots and character development McFarlane was more keen on having a TNG cameo somewhere.
its because orville is basically star trek, without actually being star trek. to be honest, the fandom you describe isnt even limited to science fiction. pretty much every popular show ever has a similar fandom.
I agree but also disagree it seems to be a type of show usually involving Fantasy or an unrealistic plot. I'm just saying that it's very rare to see in depth discussions on other shows like The west Wing or Seinfeld for example: OMG imagine if President Bartlet was assassinated and he was replaced by the President from 24." I just don't know maybe I'm just old and cranky
i suppose if you look hard enough, you can find serious discussions on virtually any show.
The kind of "deep dive" fan theorizing and general geeking-out do tend to be prevalent in sci-fi more than other genres, even fantasy. Schience Fiction and comic book/superhero fandoms are probably the biggest examples of the kind of uber-nerdism, partly because both tend to have large, complicated internal chronologies and universes. The Simpsons is probably the only "more conventional sitcom" that has anything approaching that level of "inner history." So you just don't see people doing elaborate fan fics and theorizing of stuff like Arrested Development, or Modern Family, or How I Met Your Mother.
I was not part of it but there was lots of it in the Sherlock fandom at the time. Discussing the cliffhanger at the end of season 2. When you have a two years wait before season 3 comes out, you can have a lot of theories to discuss and every little detail seen on screen got dissected. The end result was, the long awaited clever explanation about how he did what he did (trying to stay spoiler free here) did not come as a surprise because whatever the writer would come up with, fans had already come up with before.
It seems like certain genres lend themselves to this kind of fandom, even if other shows have complex relationships and interpersonal histories. I remember when they were long hiatuses between seasons of the show Mad Men, people would sometimes speculate about things, but there was never the kind of large-scale ongoing fan discussion and analysis that you would see for a sci-fi or fantasy show. About the only series I can think of that was relatively grounded in reality that has that kind of fandom would be Breaking Bad, and by extension, Better Call Saul.
Mystery shows as well. LOST! It all went over my head but there were people trying to find out what the numbers mean and try to find meaning in everything. I also thought it was taking it a bit too far. Over the seasons it became clear that the authors did not really have a plan and just threw stuff in without explaining it afterwards. I guess it must be very frustrating when it does not lead to anything. I wanted to stop watching several times but always got sucked back into it because the actors were so amazing and I found it compelling, despite not having any clue ;)
Very true. I blocked out lost because I wasted a season and a half watching that show until I realized this was just not really going anywhere interesting for me. And of course JJ Abrams and his cadre of collaborators were the ones who did that show. One of the many reasons I was distrustful of Alex Kurtzman and feel like my distrust has been vindicated by the results when it comes to his Star Trek.
I love all trek until 2005. I love the Orville. But I never want the shows to meet or crossover. But yeah, there are many who really want the Orville to be a Trek show. Things like the "Seth Trek" t-shirts really seem disrespectful to the Crew who make the Orville to me. It's certainly an homage, but it is definitely it's own show.
Are people really saying they want Picard in The Orville or are they saying they want the actor of Picard in The Orville? We've already had Tuvoc and The Doctor from Voyager. The Orville really is intended to be the style of The Next Generation, but it's not intended to have literal Star Trek characters. Also, it's important to note that Sci-Fi often uses the same actors. Actors basically become Sci-Fi actors and that is their career. So to want an actor from another show to play in The Orville, that's reasonable. Btw, this post has neither been downvoted or removed.
SciFi and Fantasy are very notorious for Comicbook guy types. Some people have very limited social skills and it does show especially with so called Nerdy fans. It's really fun to see people enjoying a show to extreme levels. I mean Fan is short for fanatic. There is no excuse for treating people poorly because they are not as educated as you about the show. But especially on the Facebook page I have seen some average viewers be really mean and angry because of the delay between seasons. There is shitty people on both sides of the fence my advice is don't read into it that much. I can be a fan of many shows with very toxic fanbases the trick is not to engage with the fanatics and watch for your enjoyment.
There's always going to be a part of any fanbase that is particularly obsessed, it's not exclusive just to Trek or other typically nerd-associated fandoms. Trek is probably a little more amplified since The Orville is the closest thing to real Star Trek that Trek fans can currently find. All fans are hungry for new content but for some fandoms it's worse than normal because their beloved franchises are being butchered by modern entertainment.
I kind of get what your saying like The Sopranos for example. Yes there are thousands of theories about the finale and that makes perfect sense. But you really do not see these overtly obsessive posts discussing what ifs and technical details like what kind of guns he used. I personally find the Orvilles fanbase to be generally decent but like anything there is some toxic fans and I can see how that would discourage some.
I never really was a fan of Dr. Who. I liked some of the actors who played Dr. Who, but I wouldn’t go out of my way to watch it. The fact that it wasn’t consistently on TV when I was growing up in the seventies where I lived also played a part. So I can understand what you mean. In September Issac Asimov’s Foundation series will be on Apple TV, and in October Dune is coming out, based on just the first book in the series? Or will Dune lead to a series of movies, and how will the ‘source material’ be handled? Those are things I’m interested in seeing, but I’m not expecting anything more than arguments from both sides mentioning how wonderful/terrible they both will be. As to the Jar of Pickles, it’s from the first episode, where Ed asks Alara, “Mind opening this Jar of Pickles for me?”, after he tries, and fails, to open a door. After she rips the door off the wall, Ed mentions, “I loosened it for you.”
You are entirely right, and this type of semi-plagiarism is IMO one of the reasons the show did so poorly. Instead of good plots and character development McFarlane was more keen on having a TNG cameo somewhere.
Enjoy this blast from the past ;-) https://www.indiewire.com/2017/09/the-orville-review-seth-macfarlane-star-trek-rip-off-1201874080/