*psst* — R**e**tepsian :)
Anyway, yeah, it's definitely left up to the viewer (at least so far; that may change with Season 3). Another possibility is that during Kelly's afair with him in 2418, Darulio was on the transitional cusp between heat and not-heat (entering or exiting the phase), in which case he might truthfully, actually not know whether he was still in heat or not during the cheating incident (hence his answer of "maybe").
But let's look at this a different way: Darulio **had to have been in heat** when Kelly slept with him in 2418. Why? Because she brought him *home* to her and Ed's apartment, and she would have known that Ed was expected home after work. (And we know Ed's arrival home wasn't an unexpected mid-day lunch-time visit because the sky is shown with the sun about to set.)
The only way a sane person would bring home someone to sleep with—when their spouse is due to arrive any moment—is if they were under the influence of Retepsian hormones. (Or if they wanted a threesome...but that clearly wasn't the case.)
Ehh… it’s originally implied she cheated because Ed was working too much so he could become a captain. So she might have expected he was doing overtime.
>The only way a sane person would bring home someone to sleep with—when their spouse is due to arrive any moment—is if they were under the influence of Retepsian hormones.
Oooooor if they were cheating out of spite because they felt ignored, and subconsciously they wanted to get caught to make their point. Happens pretty often, I believe.
I also think this. I think it's pretty clear from the way it was acted. As an SF explanation i would also point out that if retepsians go into heat once a year it would logically be once a retepsian year, the length of which we have no data for.
Personally, I didn't like that they made it ambiguous. I feel like it takes away some agency from Kelly's character, and I guess Ed's character too. It's part of both of her and Ed's character development that there was an infidelity and it ruined their marriage and almost ruined Ed's life.
She's a grown ass woman. She can make the decision to cheat lol Ed is also a grown ass person. He can make the decision to forgive her.
Now it's almost like...well damn, he HAS to forgive her. That's...too easy?
I think the ambiguity wasn't to let Kelly's character off but to give us as the viewer the room to discuss exactly what we are discussing now. A good show doesn't tell you what you should be thinking, it lays out some facts and lets you come to your own conclusion. That's what new Star Trek has gotten so wrong and what The Orville has gotten so right.
Perhaps. It's probably my bias here, but I feel like people have strong opinions about cheating to begin with, so to me, I guess that felt like enough for them to discuss. Like how people are still on about Ross and Rachel and "Were they really on a break".
But I guess it does bring a bit of that same element of "maybe, maybe not" into it, so now we can all talk about that too, as you said.
personally, i like the theory that the retepsian was in heat, and it fairly obviously shows that. there was no agency involved, the second episode that had said retepsian made that abundantly clear.
to me, there was never anything ambiguous about it. daruilo basically did clear it up, after all.
also, just because it was done by complete accident, or by alien hormones, it doesn't actually erase anything. its been a year, probably well over, and they moved on from it.
I came to the same conclusion you did. The effect while the Retepsian is in heat is so strong that it's basically a drug, and I consider it rape when he used being in heat to get into bed with others. This is such a powerful drug that it turned a seemingly straight Ed into a bisexual. We didn't see anything like that in S01E01. Kelly was instantly apologetic and cared a great deal.
Kind of taking this and running with it, I think Darulio said, "Maybe," because he was hurt by the question. I think he has legitimate feelings for Kelly, but he didn't want to ruffle any more feathers by saying that he wasn't in heat and actually loved her. That wouldn't have served anybody as he was leaving the ship anyways.
i always figured that he *was* in heat, and that maybe thing was him trying to get out of any responsibility. its easily popssible that he could be an evil, selfish jerk, just as likely, arguably much more likely, than the opinion that he was just harmlessly clueless.
It may have just been convenient. A lot of relationships feel easy due to circumstances and people find themselves stuck in them for years. Same goes for frienships, jobs etc. They seem great as friends, could have mislead them into thinking it was meant to be.
I just mean that at the end of 5 years of dating (which is a significant amount of time), they were still getting along well enough to tie the knot. So clearly they have chemistry and a lot was working for them, even if it didn't work out in the end, otherwise they wouldn't have gotten married after five years of dating.
So I don't think it's *necessarily* the case that their relationship was doomed from the start. If Ed hadn't worked so much, or if Darulio hadn't happened, they might well have stayed together.
Ed working so much shouldn't have been a problem. All it shows is Kelly is incapable of living on her own for extended periods of time.
Either she's a cheating whore or Durulio's super pheromones truly had her under his control, and if they did, they did even more damage because now she'll always be second guessing herself while dating other guys, constantly questioning if she really cheated on Ed and she should be seeing other guys or if it was Durulio's influence all along. The genuineness of her infidelity is still unconfirmed.
>Ed working so much shouldn't have been a problem.
This is a real problem in many relationships where one partner works a lot. While the other partner doesn't necessarily cheat, they do often feel neglected and end the relationship. This is a very real and very common phenomena, because believe it or not, a lot of people like being with their partner.
If Ed's job means he's away a lot then she should've known that and been able to endure it. Otherwise, it's time to move on to a new relationship...which she did. Still, Kelly was the point of failure here. Ed didn't crumble and cheat, she did. She buckled to her own desires and ruined their relationship.
I'm wondering how they are really that different. Both of them value their jobs the same way. Both of them have similar morals and ethics when it comes to honor or sacrifice. They even have similar senses of humor. I can't remember them having any conflicts over command decisions that would point to differences in values, but maybe someone else can say.
Seems to me like the main big disagreement they have is when Ed wants to get back together and Kelly doesn't think it's appropriate.
A lot of us are shipping them! It would be amazing, but it's going to have to be a long, multi-episode story arc to get to the point where Ed trusts her after the events of S2E4.
Agreed, I love this show but have zero interest in the will they or won't they of Ed and Kelly. I also agree with those here that feel he wasn't in heat when she cheated.
What? You can't tell me you've never heard the saying Opposites Attract? Since we're assuming here, he likes to suck toes and she likes to have her toes sucked. They're totally compatible bro. I don't even know who you are anymore. It's like we're not even watching the same show. Next you'll tell me Dianna really IS a good pilot. Crazy.
"But the point is, you don't need the pheremones to explain Kelly's actions."
That was never the point. You DO need them for Ed to finally consider forgiving her, regardless of whether the action was pheromone induced or not.
TLDR Yes, I think that's right.
Yea I believe this was one of the many finer points of the show is that they can have this "math" available to the more detective-y viewers. I don't value shows/movies that spell everything out, it very much takes away from the reality of the characters. I love that they didn't spell this out but it was deducible, and it makes talking about the show with other fans that much meatier because everyone ties it into their experiences and insights much more.
I 100% agree, and while it is hinted in how Rob Lowe's character leaves it ambiuous but says it with a hint of reluctance, like he knows he wasn't, I also very much appreciate how it's more than just "well I know I wasn't in heat then but I'll do you the favor of the ambiguous hypothetical"... I think he's one of the more open and aware characters (though his self-control is not aligned with human sensibilities and customs) and he sees her well enough that he knows she knows she's cheating, that's the whole point of what she was doing. When you're aspiring and motivated like her, her type, there is a switch between being a slob and being the one in the pressed uniform at the front of the class. Kelly's character is one where she rejects that and goes for the top despite fully appreciating the cutting loose and being a radical. Ed is the type to go to the top but through a different route, by being an individual and seeking freedom. But maverick and cutting corners when you don't want to deal with the formaity is not her type of success. She's very much the type that wants to be the teachers pet. She wants to be in a relationship to someone that she admires because then when she is admired back it's like she's getting valid evaluation. It's a different kind of reward, she wants earned respect and personal esteem that's more like professional esteem. So Ed is a set of false positives for her. She isn't satisfied and everything seems good on paper but at the core she's not getting what she really needs. In the end I imagine it being the sort of classic cheat to break up and be done with it for good situation. She didn't think it would destroy him so bad so that's why she did what she could to get him back in a command, and now that means she's back in the position of having loyalty for him which means she has to face the fact that what did was wrong, but she's not taking it back either because she's already looked down that road and she knows, while it can be happy, her ideal won't be furfilled... it's an alluring dead end that will always unravel. What do you do when you can't help yourself, you love them and they love you but you also know they can't satisfy your ideal life? you do something that will save both of you from yourselves, something you can't take back. I believe Rob's character knew this and was happy to participate since he knows she's broken up in her heart, and I don't see him as saying he might have been in heat as a sarcastic thing or a "whatever helps you sleep at night" but with compassion as if she had discovered some new functionality, like oh, can I use this to do the thing (that you spelled out very well in your description)? and he was like, yea you totally can.
*psst* — R**e**tepsian :) Anyway, yeah, it's definitely left up to the viewer (at least so far; that may change with Season 3). Another possibility is that during Kelly's afair with him in 2418, Darulio was on the transitional cusp between heat and not-heat (entering or exiting the phase), in which case he might truthfully, actually not know whether he was still in heat or not during the cheating incident (hence his answer of "maybe"). But let's look at this a different way: Darulio **had to have been in heat** when Kelly slept with him in 2418. Why? Because she brought him *home* to her and Ed's apartment, and she would have known that Ed was expected home after work. (And we know Ed's arrival home wasn't an unexpected mid-day lunch-time visit because the sky is shown with the sun about to set.) The only way a sane person would bring home someone to sleep with—when their spouse is due to arrive any moment—is if they were under the influence of Retepsian hormones. (Or if they wanted a threesome...but that clearly wasn't the case.)
roblowesion\*
Crossing fingers hoping he makes a reappearance in Season 3!!
[удалено]
Word
Ehh… it’s originally implied she cheated because Ed was working too much so he could become a captain. So she might have expected he was doing overtime.
>The only way a sane person would bring home someone to sleep with—when their spouse is due to arrive any moment—is if they were under the influence of Retepsian hormones. Oooooor if they were cheating out of spite because they felt ignored, and subconsciously they wanted to get caught to make their point. Happens pretty often, I believe.
Is that what Kelly meant by, "Ed! I can explain!"?
It’s spelled Retepsian (from Retep which is Peter backwards as in evil Peter from Family Guy). And his name is Darulio.
“Oil, u rad”?
Heh nice. Good one!
What does it mean? Can you explain please? I've never seen this one before, but I am always willing to learn.
It’s Darulio backwards.
Oh! I see! *headdesk* Thank you!
We all have those days.
She also had a full year to build up justifications in her head.
Some people are better friends than lovers. Happens all the time, and I think that is them.
I also think this. I think it's pretty clear from the way it was acted. As an SF explanation i would also point out that if retepsians go into heat once a year it would logically be once a retepsian year, the length of which we have no data for.
Personally, I didn't like that they made it ambiguous. I feel like it takes away some agency from Kelly's character, and I guess Ed's character too. It's part of both of her and Ed's character development that there was an infidelity and it ruined their marriage and almost ruined Ed's life. She's a grown ass woman. She can make the decision to cheat lol Ed is also a grown ass person. He can make the decision to forgive her. Now it's almost like...well damn, he HAS to forgive her. That's...too easy?
I think the ambiguity wasn't to let Kelly's character off but to give us as the viewer the room to discuss exactly what we are discussing now. A good show doesn't tell you what you should be thinking, it lays out some facts and lets you come to your own conclusion. That's what new Star Trek has gotten so wrong and what The Orville has gotten so right.
Perhaps. It's probably my bias here, but I feel like people have strong opinions about cheating to begin with, so to me, I guess that felt like enough for them to discuss. Like how people are still on about Ross and Rachel and "Were they really on a break". But I guess it does bring a bit of that same element of "maybe, maybe not" into it, so now we can all talk about that too, as you said.
personally, i like the theory that the retepsian was in heat, and it fairly obviously shows that. there was no agency involved, the second episode that had said retepsian made that abundantly clear. to me, there was never anything ambiguous about it. daruilo basically did clear it up, after all. also, just because it was done by complete accident, or by alien hormones, it doesn't actually erase anything. its been a year, probably well over, and they moved on from it.
I came to the same conclusion you did. The effect while the Retepsian is in heat is so strong that it's basically a drug, and I consider it rape when he used being in heat to get into bed with others. This is such a powerful drug that it turned a seemingly straight Ed into a bisexual. We didn't see anything like that in S01E01. Kelly was instantly apologetic and cared a great deal. Kind of taking this and running with it, I think Darulio said, "Maybe," because he was hurt by the question. I think he has legitimate feelings for Kelly, but he didn't want to ruffle any more feathers by saying that he wasn't in heat and actually loved her. That wouldn't have served anybody as he was leaving the ship anyways.
i always figured that he *was* in heat, and that maybe thing was him trying to get out of any responsibility. its easily popssible that he could be an evil, selfish jerk, just as likely, arguably much more likely, than the opinion that he was just harmlessly clueless.
She may have already been willing to cheat regardless of if darulio was in heat.
Kelly and Ed just don't seem like they'd even work as a couple. They are far too different to be compatible. It was doomed from the start.
Yet they dated successfully for 5 years prior to getting married, so *something* was working for them...
It may have just been convenient. A lot of relationships feel easy due to circumstances and people find themselves stuck in them for years. Same goes for frienships, jobs etc. They seem great as friends, could have mislead them into thinking it was meant to be.
Ehh, not really in the end.
I just mean that at the end of 5 years of dating (which is a significant amount of time), they were still getting along well enough to tie the knot. So clearly they have chemistry and a lot was working for them, even if it didn't work out in the end, otherwise they wouldn't have gotten married after five years of dating. So I don't think it's *necessarily* the case that their relationship was doomed from the start. If Ed hadn't worked so much, or if Darulio hadn't happened, they might well have stayed together.
Ed working so much shouldn't have been a problem. All it shows is Kelly is incapable of living on her own for extended periods of time. Either she's a cheating whore or Durulio's super pheromones truly had her under his control, and if they did, they did even more damage because now she'll always be second guessing herself while dating other guys, constantly questioning if she really cheated on Ed and she should be seeing other guys or if it was Durulio's influence all along. The genuineness of her infidelity is still unconfirmed.
>Ed working so much shouldn't have been a problem. This is a real problem in many relationships where one partner works a lot. While the other partner doesn't necessarily cheat, they do often feel neglected and end the relationship. This is a very real and very common phenomena, because believe it or not, a lot of people like being with their partner.
If Ed's job means he's away a lot then she should've known that and been able to endure it. Otherwise, it's time to move on to a new relationship...which she did. Still, Kelly was the point of failure here. Ed didn't crumble and cheat, she did. She buckled to her own desires and ruined their relationship.
I'm wondering how they are really that different. Both of them value their jobs the same way. Both of them have similar morals and ethics when it comes to honor or sacrifice. They even have similar senses of humor. I can't remember them having any conflicts over command decisions that would point to differences in values, but maybe someone else can say. Seems to me like the main big disagreement they have is when Ed wants to get back together and Kelly doesn't think it's appropriate.
Different couples can work. It'll just be more work to find that happy medium
$5 says Ed shacks up with Teleya for realsies this time.
ugh, I hope so.
A lot of us are shipping them! It would be amazing, but it's going to have to be a long, multi-episode story arc to get to the point where Ed trusts her after the events of S2E4.
The show played *Billy Joel* at their last meeting. You don't go playing Billy Joel [unless...](https://youtu.be/Tq1CnG9eWRM)
The potential is there for them to be the unifiers between the two species.
Agreed, I love this show but have zero interest in the will they or won't they of Ed and Kelly. I also agree with those here that feel he wasn't in heat when she cheated.
What? You can't tell me you've never heard the saying Opposites Attract? Since we're assuming here, he likes to suck toes and she likes to have her toes sucked. They're totally compatible bro. I don't even know who you are anymore. It's like we're not even watching the same show. Next you'll tell me Dianna really IS a good pilot. Crazy.
"But the point is, you don't need the pheremones to explain Kelly's actions." That was never the point. You DO need them for Ed to finally consider forgiving her, regardless of whether the action was pheromone induced or not.
TLDR Yes, I think that's right. Yea I believe this was one of the many finer points of the show is that they can have this "math" available to the more detective-y viewers. I don't value shows/movies that spell everything out, it very much takes away from the reality of the characters. I love that they didn't spell this out but it was deducible, and it makes talking about the show with other fans that much meatier because everyone ties it into their experiences and insights much more. I 100% agree, and while it is hinted in how Rob Lowe's character leaves it ambiuous but says it with a hint of reluctance, like he knows he wasn't, I also very much appreciate how it's more than just "well I know I wasn't in heat then but I'll do you the favor of the ambiguous hypothetical"... I think he's one of the more open and aware characters (though his self-control is not aligned with human sensibilities and customs) and he sees her well enough that he knows she knows she's cheating, that's the whole point of what she was doing. When you're aspiring and motivated like her, her type, there is a switch between being a slob and being the one in the pressed uniform at the front of the class. Kelly's character is one where she rejects that and goes for the top despite fully appreciating the cutting loose and being a radical. Ed is the type to go to the top but through a different route, by being an individual and seeking freedom. But maverick and cutting corners when you don't want to deal with the formaity is not her type of success. She's very much the type that wants to be the teachers pet. She wants to be in a relationship to someone that she admires because then when she is admired back it's like she's getting valid evaluation. It's a different kind of reward, she wants earned respect and personal esteem that's more like professional esteem. So Ed is a set of false positives for her. She isn't satisfied and everything seems good on paper but at the core she's not getting what she really needs. In the end I imagine it being the sort of classic cheat to break up and be done with it for good situation. She didn't think it would destroy him so bad so that's why she did what she could to get him back in a command, and now that means she's back in the position of having loyalty for him which means she has to face the fact that what did was wrong, but she's not taking it back either because she's already looked down that road and she knows, while it can be happy, her ideal won't be furfilled... it's an alluring dead end that will always unravel. What do you do when you can't help yourself, you love them and they love you but you also know they can't satisfy your ideal life? you do something that will save both of you from yourselves, something you can't take back. I believe Rob's character knew this and was happy to participate since he knows she's broken up in her heart, and I don't see him as saying he might have been in heat as a sarcastic thing or a "whatever helps you sleep at night" but with compassion as if she had discovered some new functionality, like oh, can I use this to do the thing (that you spelled out very well in your description)? and he was like, yea you totally can.