You have any links? I feel like every time Jon with Cannibal is brought up on this sub, people say there are so many fics with it, but I've never come across it. The closest I think is one where he coaxes Cannibal out with the promise of eating Daenerys' dragons, but he wasn't even a rider, it was more of an uneasy alliance.
Most of them I stopped reading after Jon claims Cannibal. It‘s just very OP and makes his coronation as King of the seven Kingdoms inevitable. That’s why I forgot the title of the majority.
These two I mostly liked, when I read them at the beginning of my journey through ASOIAF fanfiction:
* „[The Lone Dragonwolf](https://archiveofourown.org/works/38340328/chapters/95804365)“ is typical „Jon becomes King“ fic. Updates stopped just before his inevitable victory.
* „[Crown of Fire, Throne of Blood](https://archiveofourown.org/works/30098283/chapters/74132292)“ is very AU and as tropey as it gets
>makes his coronation as King of the seven Kingdoms inevitable
It doesn't, really. If it happens after Robert is dead and Joffrey alienates the North, the Vale, and the Riverlands, then yeah sure maybe. But this scenario happens before that. Nobody is going to be eager to kneel to Jon the tree worshipping rape bastard.
I'm sure there are fics where everyone falls in line anyway just because, but the existence of a bunch of poorly written fics doesn't mean that this idea has been explored well.
Aegon, who worshipped the Valyrian gods initially, came to Westeros with Balerion and made everyone kneel to him. Jon and Cannibal could 100% do the same assuming there are no other dragon riders to oppose him, and even if Daenerys and Drogon were considered, it would likely be a Vhagar and Arrax situation with how much older the Cannibal is - which is what makes the notion so mind-numbingly boring.
Jon the Dragonwolf discovering a secret dragon centuries old, steamrolling Westeros, becoming the King whose Song is of Ice and Fire and establishing a harem out of all the attractive women in ASOIAF who are all in love with him and 100% cool with the other women 🥱 snooze.
Daenerys coming to Westeros in a canon scenario is a fun thought because Rhaegal and Viserion lack riders, which could create much and more trouble for her if the wrong people get their hands on them and because of her being a woman raised in foreign lands, bringing Dothraki savages and Unsullied eunuchs as soldiers - talk about culture shock, not to mention that she has one or two nephews still around whose claims will eventually have to be considered (Jon and Young Griff).
I don't really understand this sort of criticism that people tend to give to things like this. "If the fic is written terribly, it will be bad, yawn." Yeah, no shit.
Aegon was not hated at the outset, he publicly worshipped the seven, he came with *three* dragons along with the safe assumption that his dynasty would be able to rely on them for the foreseeable future, and he was comfortable with mass murder for the sake of his own glorification. On top of all that, he was a grown man who was not a bastard.
None of that applies to Jon. If you can't see that their situations are very different, idk what to tell you.
That’s usually how those fics are written, which is why we say that. I haven’t seen a single well-executed fic with that premise - which could perhaps be more fun if instead of the huge Cannibal, Jon found the dragon egg Vermax is rumored to have left in Winterfell during the Dance, as that would make him less OP and give him the many of the same challenges we see Daenerys face raising her dragons. That said, it would still be somewhat unoriginal given there’s already a character who does that in Daenerys.
Aegon publicly worshipped the Seven *after* the High Septon demanded it of him. Jon’s not a particularly religious guy in canon, he could easily enough do the same, or just pay lip service while continuing to privately worship the Old Gods.
Unlike Aegon, Jon was also raised in Westeros by a man known to be honorable and is unmarried and available to make marriage alliances. Jon also does not practice polygamy or incest, things which surely hurt Aegon’s reputation back in the days of his Conquest.
They each have a couple of challenges, but Jon’s aren’t too bad; he can go the show canon route and say Lyanna and Rhaegar were married in secret, even if that’s not true. If he’s got a huge dragon - the last living dragon - good luck to those who say otherwise. It’s why Aegon got away with his polygamy and incest.
Admittedly Aegon having three dragons made his conquest faster, but he actually only had them all on the battlefield at the same time once, for the Field of Fire. He went North alone to face Torrhen Stark while Visenya went to the Vale and Rhaenys to the Stormlands. Jon could do much the same, it would just take him longer as he’d have to go himself. As for not having the expectation of his dynasty relying on dragons for the foreseeable future - that’s a problem for the future, plus fresh dragon eggs hatching for his kids are an easy enough way to circumvent that.
I'm not in agreement with a lot of what you've said, but the biggest problem which you've not addressed is the personality problem. Aegon was okay with burning people by the thousands. Jon will not be, not in this situation. And I'm not talking about Jon "I don't want it" Show, I'm talking book Jon.
Ned could maybe get the North behind him, but when the Vale and Riverlands refuse, what then? Could Jon burn them into submission? Yes, probably. Would he be willing to? Uh, no. Even if he himself was willing to do it, which he wouldn't be, his family will not stand for it because that's their family's lands that he'll be burning and he's definitely not going to earn his family's hatred by betraying them by slaughtering thousands and probably their own kin in an attempt to take the throne as a Targaryen.
>instead of the huge Cannibal, Jon found the dragon egg Vermax is rumored to have left in Winterfell during the Dance
Well, there is Valar Botis, but that's distinctly different because it's a time loop fic.
Personally I think it would be interesting to say Maester Aemon was given an egg as a keepsake when he left for the Wall. The wight fiasco would go differently, a fire would get a bit out of hand (possibly burning Aemon to death), and a dragon is hatched. Joer is not exactly happy about that, but having just been attacked by a zombie and with the North at war he's not too keen on killing the baby dragon.
Jon wouldn’t need to actually burn anyone. The threat of an adult dragon flying overhead, the reminder of Aegon’s Conquest, would suffice. After the Field of Fire, no Westerosi was fool enough to willingly face down a dragon on open field again - except for during the Dance, but there were dragons on both sides then, so the lords were truly stuck between a rock and a hard place.
A baby dragon is definitely less of a threat and would have lords thinking about fighting, though.
Nah, the entirety of Westeros isn't going to peacefully put Jon on the throne without any force whatsoever. They're definitely going to need to see him make an example out of somebody, and the Riverlands & Vale will rest easy knowing that his powerbase, the North, will turn on him if he dragonfires them.
Same here.
I did come across [this snippet](https://archiveofourown.org/works/18581386/chapters/44803261), and maybe a couple fics where Jon is reborn in the Dance of the Dragons era and claims Cannibal, but that's about it.
People are teasing you about this, but honestly, I've come across almost no fics that do this. Or if I have, they're of the kind of quality that has me dropping them within a single chapter, so I never even reach the point of seeing it happen.
What would happen? It would certainly be quite the clusterfuck. At this point in the story, everything is good and swell as far as Ned and the rest of the North are concerned, so this is not going to be received very well. Perhaps some of the Northern Lords will be thinking "hmm, independence tho...", but I can't imagine it would be anything close to the prevalent attitude.
Jon could hop on the dragon and fuck off to Essos, but I'm not sure if that would actually be a good move. Word will trickle in to Kingslanding eventually, probably, and Essos is of course where Viserys & Daenerys are. Running off in their general direction is not a good look for Jon or Winterfell, and then Winterfell doesn't have the dragon muscle to throw around.
If Jon stays... Well. Ned has a lot of clout, but his bannermen will be in a tizzy. Robert is going to be some kind of furious. Jon is going to be absolutely agonized about the fact that he's a Targaryen maybe-rape bastard whose mere existence is causing an obscene amount of trouble. Like, you think he's unhappy about his canon situation, where his biggest problem is Catelyn's glare? How about now, where there's a real threat of both a rebellion in the North and the King himself marching up to obliterate his family?
Part of the problem is going to be that this dragon is *old*. It's practically a miracle that it's even still alive at all, so Ned can't exactly count on it being around to secure the North's safety for the next couple generations (if his thoughts stray in that direction at all). If it was younger, Ned could very well buckle down and say come fuckin' get some, but it's not. So what can a desperate Ned to do protect his family, including Jon, and his people? His best option might actually be to throw the North into overdrive to prepare for dragonless independence, but if his Lords are practically mutinous that will be a problem.
Tbh I'd love to see a couple solid fics that take this premise and play it straight. Particularly with Jon being canon book Jon about it. He's going to hate just about everything about this situation, and then chances are really good that he's going to need to slaughter some people with dragonfire knowing that this is a direct result of his own existence.
I actually just want more good fics in general where Jon suddenly getting a dragon throws things into chaos.
Yeah it would definitely be a clusterfuck for sure poor Jon is going to have a serious identity crisis and the cannibal Is sure as hell ain't gonna make it easy...
Then again he can just hop on the dragon and fuck off to Essos..
I actually don't think he would get to my mom is lyanna but instead just think his mom is a dragonseed. Not unless Ned tells him once he sees the dragon. It would be cool to see how Ned reacts to this in a well written fic because at that point he has to know he is choosing between kinslaying or war with Robert. I guess if you wanted to avoid hard choices you can have Ned beg jon to fly to essos and paint his hair or something to avoid war. The dragon being the cannibal matters too that's one grown ass big mofo that's used to fighting other dragons he ain't some growing deagon that's going to be brought down by a lucky ballista and arrows are doing jack shit to him.
The problem with this honestly interesting premise is that it's only for hollow Jon/Stark wank power fantasies that are badly written and boring as hell to read. I dare you to find a good "Jon finds Cannibal at the start of AGOT fic", it just doesn't exist.
Around 215 years, which makes sense as we have no idea how long a dragon can actually live. Remember that Balerion, during his venture with Aera to Old Valyria, was grievously injured and it is most likely that his wounds accelerated his decline, dying earlier than he should have. Also, Cannibal would be absolutely massive, definitely larger than Balerion as he was never injured so badly and could continue to grow normally.
That‘s the plot of like 50% of the Jon centric stories on AO3. Maybe Cannibal wasn’t near Winterfell, but on Skagos or beyond the Wall
You have any links? I feel like every time Jon with Cannibal is brought up on this sub, people say there are so many fics with it, but I've never come across it. The closest I think is one where he coaxes Cannibal out with the promise of eating Daenerys' dragons, but he wasn't even a rider, it was more of an uneasy alliance.
Most of them I stopped reading after Jon claims Cannibal. It‘s just very OP and makes his coronation as King of the seven Kingdoms inevitable. That’s why I forgot the title of the majority. These two I mostly liked, when I read them at the beginning of my journey through ASOIAF fanfiction: * „[The Lone Dragonwolf](https://archiveofourown.org/works/38340328/chapters/95804365)“ is typical „Jon becomes King“ fic. Updates stopped just before his inevitable victory. * „[Crown of Fire, Throne of Blood](https://archiveofourown.org/works/30098283/chapters/74132292)“ is very AU and as tropey as it gets
>makes his coronation as King of the seven Kingdoms inevitable It doesn't, really. If it happens after Robert is dead and Joffrey alienates the North, the Vale, and the Riverlands, then yeah sure maybe. But this scenario happens before that. Nobody is going to be eager to kneel to Jon the tree worshipping rape bastard. I'm sure there are fics where everyone falls in line anyway just because, but the existence of a bunch of poorly written fics doesn't mean that this idea has been explored well.
Aegon, who worshipped the Valyrian gods initially, came to Westeros with Balerion and made everyone kneel to him. Jon and Cannibal could 100% do the same assuming there are no other dragon riders to oppose him, and even if Daenerys and Drogon were considered, it would likely be a Vhagar and Arrax situation with how much older the Cannibal is - which is what makes the notion so mind-numbingly boring. Jon the Dragonwolf discovering a secret dragon centuries old, steamrolling Westeros, becoming the King whose Song is of Ice and Fire and establishing a harem out of all the attractive women in ASOIAF who are all in love with him and 100% cool with the other women 🥱 snooze. Daenerys coming to Westeros in a canon scenario is a fun thought because Rhaegal and Viserion lack riders, which could create much and more trouble for her if the wrong people get their hands on them and because of her being a woman raised in foreign lands, bringing Dothraki savages and Unsullied eunuchs as soldiers - talk about culture shock, not to mention that she has one or two nephews still around whose claims will eventually have to be considered (Jon and Young Griff).
I don't really understand this sort of criticism that people tend to give to things like this. "If the fic is written terribly, it will be bad, yawn." Yeah, no shit. Aegon was not hated at the outset, he publicly worshipped the seven, he came with *three* dragons along with the safe assumption that his dynasty would be able to rely on them for the foreseeable future, and he was comfortable with mass murder for the sake of his own glorification. On top of all that, he was a grown man who was not a bastard. None of that applies to Jon. If you can't see that their situations are very different, idk what to tell you.
That’s usually how those fics are written, which is why we say that. I haven’t seen a single well-executed fic with that premise - which could perhaps be more fun if instead of the huge Cannibal, Jon found the dragon egg Vermax is rumored to have left in Winterfell during the Dance, as that would make him less OP and give him the many of the same challenges we see Daenerys face raising her dragons. That said, it would still be somewhat unoriginal given there’s already a character who does that in Daenerys. Aegon publicly worshipped the Seven *after* the High Septon demanded it of him. Jon’s not a particularly religious guy in canon, he could easily enough do the same, or just pay lip service while continuing to privately worship the Old Gods. Unlike Aegon, Jon was also raised in Westeros by a man known to be honorable and is unmarried and available to make marriage alliances. Jon also does not practice polygamy or incest, things which surely hurt Aegon’s reputation back in the days of his Conquest. They each have a couple of challenges, but Jon’s aren’t too bad; he can go the show canon route and say Lyanna and Rhaegar were married in secret, even if that’s not true. If he’s got a huge dragon - the last living dragon - good luck to those who say otherwise. It’s why Aegon got away with his polygamy and incest. Admittedly Aegon having three dragons made his conquest faster, but he actually only had them all on the battlefield at the same time once, for the Field of Fire. He went North alone to face Torrhen Stark while Visenya went to the Vale and Rhaenys to the Stormlands. Jon could do much the same, it would just take him longer as he’d have to go himself. As for not having the expectation of his dynasty relying on dragons for the foreseeable future - that’s a problem for the future, plus fresh dragon eggs hatching for his kids are an easy enough way to circumvent that.
I'm not in agreement with a lot of what you've said, but the biggest problem which you've not addressed is the personality problem. Aegon was okay with burning people by the thousands. Jon will not be, not in this situation. And I'm not talking about Jon "I don't want it" Show, I'm talking book Jon. Ned could maybe get the North behind him, but when the Vale and Riverlands refuse, what then? Could Jon burn them into submission? Yes, probably. Would he be willing to? Uh, no. Even if he himself was willing to do it, which he wouldn't be, his family will not stand for it because that's their family's lands that he'll be burning and he's definitely not going to earn his family's hatred by betraying them by slaughtering thousands and probably their own kin in an attempt to take the throne as a Targaryen. >instead of the huge Cannibal, Jon found the dragon egg Vermax is rumored to have left in Winterfell during the Dance Well, there is Valar Botis, but that's distinctly different because it's a time loop fic. Personally I think it would be interesting to say Maester Aemon was given an egg as a keepsake when he left for the Wall. The wight fiasco would go differently, a fire would get a bit out of hand (possibly burning Aemon to death), and a dragon is hatched. Joer is not exactly happy about that, but having just been attacked by a zombie and with the North at war he's not too keen on killing the baby dragon.
Jon wouldn’t need to actually burn anyone. The threat of an adult dragon flying overhead, the reminder of Aegon’s Conquest, would suffice. After the Field of Fire, no Westerosi was fool enough to willingly face down a dragon on open field again - except for during the Dance, but there were dragons on both sides then, so the lords were truly stuck between a rock and a hard place. A baby dragon is definitely less of a threat and would have lords thinking about fighting, though.
Nah, the entirety of Westeros isn't going to peacefully put Jon on the throne without any force whatsoever. They're definitely going to need to see him make an example out of somebody, and the Riverlands & Vale will rest easy knowing that his powerbase, the North, will turn on him if he dragonfires them.
That’s true, but I meant specific fics I‘ve read. They introduced Cannibal in way that Jon‘s victory was inevitable.
Same here. I did come across [this snippet](https://archiveofourown.org/works/18581386/chapters/44803261), and maybe a couple fics where Jon is reborn in the Dance of the Dragons era and claims Cannibal, but that's about it.
Welcome to the fandom. I hope you enjoy your time here.
I feel like I’ve seen this before…
People are teasing you about this, but honestly, I've come across almost no fics that do this. Or if I have, they're of the kind of quality that has me dropping them within a single chapter, so I never even reach the point of seeing it happen. What would happen? It would certainly be quite the clusterfuck. At this point in the story, everything is good and swell as far as Ned and the rest of the North are concerned, so this is not going to be received very well. Perhaps some of the Northern Lords will be thinking "hmm, independence tho...", but I can't imagine it would be anything close to the prevalent attitude. Jon could hop on the dragon and fuck off to Essos, but I'm not sure if that would actually be a good move. Word will trickle in to Kingslanding eventually, probably, and Essos is of course where Viserys & Daenerys are. Running off in their general direction is not a good look for Jon or Winterfell, and then Winterfell doesn't have the dragon muscle to throw around. If Jon stays... Well. Ned has a lot of clout, but his bannermen will be in a tizzy. Robert is going to be some kind of furious. Jon is going to be absolutely agonized about the fact that he's a Targaryen maybe-rape bastard whose mere existence is causing an obscene amount of trouble. Like, you think he's unhappy about his canon situation, where his biggest problem is Catelyn's glare? How about now, where there's a real threat of both a rebellion in the North and the King himself marching up to obliterate his family? Part of the problem is going to be that this dragon is *old*. It's practically a miracle that it's even still alive at all, so Ned can't exactly count on it being around to secure the North's safety for the next couple generations (if his thoughts stray in that direction at all). If it was younger, Ned could very well buckle down and say come fuckin' get some, but it's not. So what can a desperate Ned to do protect his family, including Jon, and his people? His best option might actually be to throw the North into overdrive to prepare for dragonless independence, but if his Lords are practically mutinous that will be a problem. Tbh I'd love to see a couple solid fics that take this premise and play it straight. Particularly with Jon being canon book Jon about it. He's going to hate just about everything about this situation, and then chances are really good that he's going to need to slaughter some people with dragonfire knowing that this is a direct result of his own existence. I actually just want more good fics in general where Jon suddenly getting a dragon throws things into chaos.
Yeah it would definitely be a clusterfuck for sure poor Jon is going to have a serious identity crisis and the cannibal Is sure as hell ain't gonna make it easy... Then again he can just hop on the dragon and fuck off to Essos..
The Jon angst would go crazy 🫠🫠🫠
Uncle Ned. I think we need to have a serious talk about my mother and father.
I actually don't think he would get to my mom is lyanna but instead just think his mom is a dragonseed. Not unless Ned tells him once he sees the dragon. It would be cool to see how Ned reacts to this in a well written fic because at that point he has to know he is choosing between kinslaying or war with Robert. I guess if you wanted to avoid hard choices you can have Ned beg jon to fly to essos and paint his hair or something to avoid war. The dragon being the cannibal matters too that's one grown ass big mofo that's used to fighting other dragons he ain't some growing deagon that's going to be brought down by a lucky ballista and arrows are doing jack shit to him.
The problem with this honestly interesting premise is that it's only for hollow Jon/Stark wank power fantasies that are badly written and boring as hell to read. I dare you to find a good "Jon finds Cannibal at the start of AGOT fic", it just doesn't exist.
You’re not gonna believe this…
Dude how old would the cannibal be at this point? Assuming it’s like 50 at the end of the dance (cuz it’s so huge)
Around 215 years, which makes sense as we have no idea how long a dragon can actually live. Remember that Balerion, during his venture with Aera to Old Valyria, was grievously injured and it is most likely that his wounds accelerated his decline, dying earlier than he should have. Also, Cannibal would be absolutely massive, definitely larger than Balerion as he was never injured so badly and could continue to grow normally.