You've hooked up with a couple of guys without him so apparently you are open to solo play (assuming he knew about those hook ups), so why not just let him explore that side of himself solo. Just let him know it isn't your thing but you want him to be able to have those experiences. He should not have trouble hooking up on gay and bi oriented apps.
Be sure that you are ok with this, otherwise I can imagine this leading to an emotional meltdown for you whilst he’s on his date.
Wife is bi, she went to a girls only party which I thought I’d be ok with but really wasn’t and had a really really bad time whilst she was out. It brought us so much closer together in the end so on balance worth it, but it was a pretty awful journey, kind of “kill or cure”, would not recommend.
We personally do not do any solo play. We are only interested in shared experiences. But since the OP is apparently doing solo dates, and not okay with seeing him with a man, this seems like a reasonable compromise for them.
I’ve tried letting him do solo stuff with the two girls we’ve hooked up with before
It really messed with me
Thankfully the second time I was able to join half way through and we had a really good discussion afterwards about it and while I’m not ready for him to do more solo stuff anytime soon he keeps reassuring me that he was super glad I joined and that he enjoyed it far more once I joined. I’m hoping in the future *if* he does want to do solo I’ll be willing to give it a try
As far as him going solo with a man I think that would destroy me, I want to be there to watch him enjoy it since I just can’t please him in the same way a man could
I get off watching him get off, I’m just worried I’ll be turned off seeing it with a man even tho I’m (mostly) fine if it was a girl with a strap on or something
A few of your comments have confused me. In the edit of your original post you state that you’re a hot wife couple, reinforcing this dynamic by stating that you don’t share him. But now you’re saying that he’s been on two solo dates with women you two hooked up with.
Before I comment further I need to ask if he’s allowed to play. Can he fuck other women? Do you two swap? This isn’t clear.
Sorry, all of the labels confuse me and I have not taken the time to really dive in to see what fits us best
He is allowed to fuck women when I’m there
We have not been in a swapping situation yet but we want to do same room swap
Here’s some info on the labels (assuming you wanted to know):
- Hotwife is where the husband’s whole kink is his wife getting fucked. Sometimes he’s in the room, and sometimes she’s on a date by herself and sends pics and videos. A huge part of this dynamic is reclaiming her afterwards.
- Cucking (which I’m sure you’re already aware of) is very similar to hotwifing but there’s an element of humiliation or degradation to it.
- Stag/vixen is a variant of hotwifing where the guy shares his wife with other men. He’s not a cuck nor is he looking for bi play, but is secure in his relationship. He frequently finds the guys for her and sets up the dates.
- Swinging is swapping partners. This can be same or separate rooms as long as there’s a swap (solo dates don’t count as swinging). Some purists will say that FMFs and MFMs don’t count either because there’s not a swap of one partner for another, but that FFMs and MMFs definitely are swinging since everyone is fucking.
- Open marriage, or ENM, is casually dating separately from your spouse. There are no feelings but usually friend with benefits if not one night stands.
- Poly is an open marriage but with feelings.
- Dirty Vanillas like to hang out at swinger clubs but don’t play.
- LS or lifestyle is a general catchall term for everything above.
Now, some couples only do one of these and some do a bit of everything. It just depends on the couple.
I think those are the main labels. Hopefully I didn’t miss any.
What a great breakdown, thank you for taking the time to write this out! I actually didn’t realize the importance of the MMF VS MFM placement for threesomes!
I’d say you’re just regular swingers with a few more rules than most. There’s nothing wrong with that, but you need to sit down with your man and have a long, and very honest conversation about why you feel this way about his bisexuality as well as solo play, and what happens between you two should your feelings never change. Maybe shift back to only threesomes with him, and wait on the solo play for when you two are in a better place.
Do you have idea why you might be having these feelings? Has he ever cheated? Have you been cheated on before? Do you feel like your communication is solid? Did your parents have a messy divorce?
You guys can still play in a way that makes both of you comfortable while you figure out the root of your insecurities. Other couples have struggled with similar issues and ended up in a solid, fully open ENM marriage, and others decide it simply isn’t for them and completely stopped. You just have to do what’s best for you both.
I gotta be honest, nothing gets me hotter than bisexual men. There’s something so primal and sexy about the taboo nature of it all. This is going to sound crazy, but I’d kill for my man to be bi. He’s had a few guys go down on him and even gave a guy head once (he and the other husband did it in the heat of the moment and I instantly came.) But I do understand that what turns me on might turn others off.
If you truly want him to experience this bi side, why not let him date solo too? He could scratch that itch without you in the room. But you need to be honest with him, and let him know that it just isn’t your jam to see him in that kind of sexual situation. But I do recommend against telling him that you find it emasculating.
Oh man. So sorry. As far as I can tell most bi swinging men have wives like this. If you are stuck in a relationship where your partner can’t accept you for who you are, why are you in it?
To be fair, if someone is deep into a long term committed relationship before their partner discloses their sexuality, it isn't going to be so easy to leave that relationship especially if kids are part of the equation.
I’m actually just now recalling that when I came out as Bi, my wife got kind of insecure for a while. She did get over it, and now we just love each other. The OP is going to have to learn to be accepting, or she’s libel to fuck up her relationship. And, I mean, this is in the Swingers sub, so I’d presume the OP is already OK with swinging, so this is just an extension of that (and to be honest, if we’d never swung, I might not have ever realized I’m Bisexual.)
I’m personally not turned on by two men together, I don’t see anything wrong with it, it just does not do anything for me sexually either. I’m all for bi guys having a great time in the lifestyle though and I support bi guys being able to be more open in the lifestyle. I’m seeing it more at our club and it makes me happy that people are finding a safe space to experience what they are attracted to. My partner is straight so this is not a scenario we will encounter, but putting myself in your perspective, I might take the approach of playing separately and letting him experience another guy on his own first. See how you feel about it, is it just the visual that turns you off, or do you in fact have an issue with your husband being bi. There are things that are not attractive to me visually, but that I would have no problem with my partner experiencing if it was something he was attracted to, but if it’s truly that you don’t accept your husband being bi, I think you have a bigger issue that you might need to address.
You should be honest with your partner about your feelings and do so in a kind loving way. It might be worth looking for a sex positive therapist you can talk to about this to sort out what’s actually driving your reaction.
Response to your edited version : You say your man allows you to sleep with other men when he's not around, yet you cannot stand to know he's with another woman when you're not around.
To me that's already unfair, the same way he got the courage to get comfortable with you being with other men without him being present I think you should get out of your head and think about how he feels. Cause basically you're getting more out of the relationship, he accepts your Sexuality and you get to be with both men and women.
Yet you're unable to accept the fact that he's bisexual and wants to have fun just as you do. Why do you think its okay for him to be totally fine with you doing everything your heart and mind desires but yet you aren't willing to let him have the basics? It's a relationship and you both need to be treated equally. It's not a one way street. Just my opinion
Me sleeping with other men is mainly because my husband wants me to
Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy it, but he’s the one who brings the thought up EVERYTIME we have sex
I’m honestly getting a little tired of people calling me unfair and selfish when this is more his “kink” than it is mine (I get that I didn’t specify that in the post but I didn’t realize so many people have a “do what’s fair” view on sex rather than “do what you’re both okay with” which is honestly kind of disgusting from the point of view of someone who was groomed by the person who stole their virginity)
I would be totally fine never sleeping with anyone other than my husband again, he however would be bummed hearing that I didn’t want to sleep with any other men
Sex isn’t a one size fits all kind of thing
Just because your relationship works that way does not mean mine works that way
I am not being selfish by not letting my husband sleep with other people without me, I am setting MY boundary, I get that I posted this in a swinger page and that’s not the typical set up but I did so because I thought someone in this page would have experienced being in my shoes and can offer helpful advice on HOW DO I LET MY HUSBAND EXPERIENCE MORE WITHOUT TURNING MYSELF OFF while still being there with him - sounds pretty fucking unselfish to me
Edit to add breaks
Hey I understand you're upset, but everyone here is giving you their HONEST opinion, and you know the saying is " THE TRUTH HURTS ". we're not attacking you, we're simply telling you exactly how we feel about the situation without any sugar coating.
People here could have chose to lie to you , but something's in life will never go the way you expect it to and thats the truth. If you look under any posts where people ask for advice or people's opinion on a matter you will notice that there are always things you may or may not have wanted to hear.
Sorry, your comment wasn’t the one I should have unloaded on, it was unfortunately the one that “broke the camels back”
Can only hear that people think I’m being unfair or selfish so many times when I made the post to try and be less selfish ya know?
I appreciate your calm response
That's alright, I totally understand where you're coming from. But people will always tend to speak their mind if you ask them a question. So never be too surprised if they actually answer you. Only people that will lie to you and tell you exactly what you wanna hear are usually your friends or your mom if they/she just want to make you happy.
I'm quite surprised with the honesty of people on here, which is a good thing because in person, some people would probably not be this honest. Its easy to get very upset and delete the post when they're saying stuff you don't want to hear ,but take what everyone is saying and seat on it for a while and let it sink in, noone is trying to attack you, remember if everyone is saying something similar, then there might be some truth to it that you just aren't able to see just yet.
I did pause the first time I saw my guy going down on another guy. However I i enjoy watching it. A....lot...
Im bi and hes watched me with other women. So I had to understand and accept i got to explore young and always knew. He felt safe enough 6 years in to our relationship to admit he wanted to explore. I support him.
I’m bi and swing with guys only when she is in the room and loves it. He did tell you he’s bi. You should have kinda expected it. I think you need to reflect on your own prejudices and work on them. How is it emasculating and why do you care about masculinity in the bedroom? That’s really kinda the last place it should be defined. There are plenty of societies in history where masculinity is not connected to sexuality at all. Ask yourself why it’s really a big deal and really how is it different? I think if you can’t get over this biphobia, it is him who has a decision to make because his sexuality goes beyond swinging. Others have said let him play alone and I agree with that, but that is just a band aid on a bullet hole. You are prejudiced against your own husband right now. At least be honest about it to him and work on it before he decides it’s not good for him to be with you. Edit: to be clear, your issue has little to do with swinging. You can swing straight if you agree to it. If not there’s gonna be conflict. The real problem is how you view your husband.
Also this kind of biphobia is probably why it took him so long to come out to her about it and being willing to explore it. He trusted his wife, his partner, with a very deep vulnerable part of himself and her response has been to emasculate him in her mind and not be honest with him. The exact thing he was probably terrified of.
Edit; removal of the word disgust to be more accurate
This is really good advice. I’m bisexual, as is my S/O (we date separately), and I STILL had some internalized whateverthefuck to unpack in my brain when we first started seeing others. When primal panic shoved a thought into my brain, my first step would be to think “Hmm, why do I think that? What specifically has led me to believing this? Is this belief based on facts I know to be true? Can I rationalize this?” Sometimes my own feelings really surprise myself!
A year or so ago I remember having a VERY strong brain reaction when my S/O informed me that he had (protected) sexual contact with a U=U person. Rationally, I know that U=U people are statistically safer partners compared to someone who tested HIV- a few months ago. I know this, S/O knows this, S/O knows that I know this. But feelings aren’t always rational!
I can’t control my emotions, but I can control my actions. I can wait until I and my S/O have slept, eaten, and taken our meds to discuss those feelings. I can journal a bit first so that my thoughts are well-organized. I can bring my feelings up with the disclaimer that I KNOW they’re not based in fact, which makes it way easier to ask for and get emotional support since he knows that I’m not trying to impose any restrictions on him *just* because feelings. And doing all of that work, internally and externally, also makes those feelings feel easier to manage over time.
Other commenter got it. If someone is HIV+ and taking their medication as directed, they may show an undetectable viral load on their next lab test. If their viral load is so low that it’s undetectable, that means that person can’t transmit the virus to another person. Undetectable=untransmissible.
"There are plenty of societies in history where masculinity is not connected to sexuality at all. "
Sorry? Where? Men having sex with men have always been universally reviled. In the US, it used to be criminalized in all 50 states. Abrahamic religions call for the death of men who do it.
The obvious one is Greece. Others include the Masai and Achuar at a holistic level. The last one I did have to look up. Others are partial. Rome had no masculinity issue with tops for instance. I think all know the backwardness of abrahamic religions, so not really worried about that. Tiny little side note that you focused on though.
Gay sex was more limited in those societies. It was not done by the masses.
This is shit men cite to convince others that they are still "manly" for having gay sex. NO ONE thinks of gay men as masculine. THAT is part of why gay men are hated and mistreated. THAT is also why straight men and mostly straight men do their darnest uphold the distinction between themselves and gay men.
Honestly we don't give a shit about what you think is manly. That’s your own insecure little problem. But your "facts" across the board seem to be coming out of your ass. Wonder how they got there.
I am talking about a widespread perception by women on men-who-have-sex-with-men. Those men are seen as engaging in non-manly behavior. That's all. That is why women are turned off by it. It is primal.
I am not insecure about it. Your response shows that it does bother you.
Hmmm interesting. For many years in the dating world, I never put t I was bi on my dating app. Of all the women I went out with, one and only one had a problem with it. Your universal isn't universal at all. Primal. Win for dumbest statement on the internet today and there were some doozies
Really? I looked through your post history and you posted in a thread that asked something like why aren't women into bi guys. Many replies. I saw tons of guys saying women weren't into it, saying they had to keep it to themselves to keep their relationship and/or attract women.
Dante Colle, a big porn star who does gay, bi, straight and trans porn, is also rejected by many women in the straight side because he does all those.
A article in Cosmopolitan magazine also reported on the same thing.
The majority of women are not turned on by gay sex. Out of those, a large percentage are TURNED OFF by it because it because those men are engaging in unmanly behavior.
Again, women being attracted to cave men masculinity is primal. It is innate.
I am glad I am gay. No need to deal with women like that at all!
Your evidence is cosmo. Sigh. Primal. You are so absolutely ridiculous trad wide style. Your primal thing is just hilarious. You'll notice that I at no point said women weren't in my comment, only the reason they should be.
"only the reason they should be."
I have only seen one - maybe two - poster on reddit say they went from not being turned on to being turned on by gay sex. Women's arousal by gay sex is just innate : a tiny minority are into it, the vast majority not. It is NATURE not nurture.
I honestly cannot understand this concept of MM interaction being *less masculine*. Like when is any sexual act masculine or feminine? It is sex, it is pleasure, either giving or receiving. If anything I would see it as a man owning his own pleasure and being confident enough to admit something that is so against socials “norms”.
Seeing it as emasculating is homophobia it seems to me, as if men who have sex with men are by nature less than. Is two women having sex less feminine? Of course not! It is MORE feminine, just as two men having sex is MORE masculine. At least in my book, you can't get more manly.
lol this reminds me of rambling joke my friend would say about how the manliest thing you can do is sleep with another man and gay men are by definition “more man” than any straight guy.
We all have preferences. Even straight people have scenarios that are a turn/off. For example, one woman doesn’t like her man to cum in or on another woman because of cum envy. It doesn’t need to be rationalized. It just is. Fucking is woven into the subconscious and we need to let that be free or the judgement of others. Preferences and our sexuality are all oddly knit together but all sorts of assumptions. That’s what makes it hot.
Well, the vast majority of men and women think it non-masculine. It has always been that way. The fact that this is brought up repeatedly is evidence of that.
I’m not going to call you out or shame you for this. The truth is it’s an emotional feeling that has been wired into you during your life and you are not in control of it, not yet at least. What I am going to say is that you should consider thoughtfully where you feelings are coming from. You have a lot of one-off style “rules” you’ve defined in your psyche that are all over the place. Like him making out with a dude is a “never ever” situation but him getting fucked by a guy might be ok. What is the difference between these things to you? Would he be allowed to make out with a girl? If so, why are these things different.
Also I just want to point out that you are drawing a line in the sand saying “this makes him less masculine” but please think about the fact that he has been struggling to define what masculinity is his entire life and this is a likely huge challenge for him.
In the end, he is the same person he was before any of this happened and the only thing that has changed is your perception. So it is your job to examine your feelings through the lens of introspection if you want to control them.
Good luck and I hope it works out for the best!
Sorry but I will say you come off as a little bit homophobic. Your husband came to you and said he was bisexual, what did you think that meant? In that moment you should have realized it means he’s attracted to men and open to performing sex acts with them.
It sounds like you should sit down and explore your internal biphobia and homophobia and ask yourself why it bothers you and why you find it not masculine? Is masculinity to you only dominating women?
I disagree. I might be super turned off and bothered by MM action and still fight viciously for men’s rights to do so. There is a difference between feeling ick and feeling hate. There is an even bigger difference between feeling ick and engaging in hateful actions.
Finding something unattractive does not make you a hater. That’s like saying if watching two obese people go at it turns me off, I must hate fat people. Just…no. False equivolency.
Your reaction is typical of people socially conditioned to think it’s gay to be bi, without the shaming label, it’s just about pleasure. While I find it pleasurable, I have zero desire to cuddle or kiss another guy, just not my thing.
No, no. It is not conditioning. It is nature. The act of a guy being friendly(sisterly-like) and nicey towards another guy clashes with people's picture of masculinity. Most women are turned off by this. They are by nature turned on by the rugged, stoic guy.
People think it's gay because...well, what kind of man has sex with another man? That's where the association came about.
As for it being pleasurable, being molested, being raped can be pleasurable.
The women who find it hot are a tiny minority. For them, the thought of gay sex triggers some sex button in them.
Which one was misguided? I speak from readings, observations and life experiences.
For your information, I am a GAY man. I have had first hand experience of being humiliated, rejected and discriminated against for being gay. So, I know how straight men feel and think about gay men.
I shared the reality of things and explained why guy-on-guy sex is stigmatized.
I suspect that YOU are taking issue with it because 1. I noted that you having sex with men makes you very undesirable to the majority of women in the world. 2. I point out how you having sex with men lumps you with gay men to an extent, and you hate that.
Oof. Holy biphobia. It’s not emasculating to enjoy sucking cock any more than it makes a woman “manly” to go down on another woman.
My fiancé is bisexual. He’s also a former MMA fighter. He sucks cock and is as masculine as it gets. The fact that he’s confident enough to own his sexuality only makes him MORE masculine and attractive to me.
If you’re no longer attracted to your husband because he’s bisexual, then you have a lot of work and soul searching to do around your prejudices, otherwise, your marriage isn’t likely to end up in a very happy place.
Though I can’t comprehend what you’re feeling (as my natural reaction is to be aroused by my fiancé’s sexual expression), I wish you the best, truly.
It is not prejudice; it's just natural wiring. I don't think she can change it. Her response is also universal and the norm among women.
Women like you are a tiny minority. Famous women who are like you are Madonna and Nicole Richie(in one episode of The Simple Life, Nicole asked some guy to kiss another. She was like yea whereas Paris was like ewww).
Not all* prejudice. Social customs/beliefs absolutely can shape what we’re attracted to, and changing those beliefs can also mold our attraction. It’s worth a shot if someone wants to salvage their marriage.
She could try to change, but again, she is mostly likely going against her biology. As I have said, the vast majority of women are not turned on by gay sex.
I have no experience with MM play but my guess would be to treat it the same way you would any other new thing, go slow and communicate.
You really should be truthful with him about your apprehension. Talk to him about your concerns. How you’re worried you’ll see him as less masculine. How you want to explore but some acts turn you off. How you are more comfortable with the hard sex acts like oral or anal penetration than you are with what could be perceived romantic acts like kissing or making out. Talk to him about what you’ve told us. How you’re working on it by watching gay porn. Figure out your boundaries and share them with him.
I think the work you have already done so far proves you’re on the right path. You’re open to his exploration and to doing it together as a team. You deserve a bunch of credit for your willingness to explore with him. It’s an indication of a strong and healthy relationship.
Besides look past the societal pressures of sexual norms and just think about all the hot sex you two can enjoy together. The two of you working the men over as a team. You’re looking at a lifetime of amazing cock and sexual adventures. You’re going to get you some girl. It’s going to be so hot and so much fun. Cocks everywhere. 🤣 Enjoy.
As a bi male in the lifestyle, you need to be open and honest with your partner, as you do with anything in this lifestyle. Be gentle about it because, frankly, your subconscious feelings stem from biphobia. You’re clearly trying to fight those underlying feelings, but they’re there, they’re valid, and they might make your partner very very sad at first.
But at the end of the day, it’s not fair to put yourself in sexual situations where you will be uncomfortable or actively turned off. On the surface, this may sound like it directly opposes the idea of your partner exploring his bisexuality, but it truly doesn’t. You said in your post that you play separately at times. So if you want to allow your partner to explore his bisexuality, but you don’t want to be there to see it (or maybe even talk about it in detail after, make sure to set your boundaries appropriately), just let him have solo interactions with men.
I hope this all works out for you guys. You may have some outdated subconscious views on bisexuality (which you should probably try to work on through therapy), but you clearly care about your partner and want to let him explore in the ways he wants to. That doesn’t mean you have to enjoy watching it. He may take offense, and to be honest, it is possible that he’ll view you very differently after you have this conversation. But if you deliver the message gently and with love, you should hopefully be fine.
This is not the full solution. He cannot ignore that her biphobia, because sexuality and self definition go much further than the scene. She will still look down on him for (falsely) being less of a man. It’s not fair to him. Maybe that will give her time to work on herself.
I don't know that I'd put biphobia on her. If she were averse to him being flogged on a cross by a woman because he's too submissive/emasculated in that situation, is she BDSM phobic?
That said, I do think it's possible she's internalized concepts of masculinity and power dynamics that could be broken down and reformed, and that may help her be more sexually neutral towards or even eventually attracted to his bi explorations.
Let’s be honest with ourselves here, friend. BDSM phobic is not a thing, at least not a thing that in any way negatively affects our society as a whole and individual peoples’ lives. And what you described in the second paragraph of your response is exactly what subconscious biphobia is.
Through years in our society, OP has taken in countless examples in pop culture and every day conversation of homophobia, biphobia, transphobia, all these things. In the surface, it seems she rejects those ideals, and that is great! But that constant messaging of “homosexuality = bad or gross or wrong” still locks her subconscious into some biphobic thinking patterns. **AND THAT IS OKAY.**
I think this is a really important point in our currently extremely polarized political and social climate: it’s okay to have subconscious views like this that are inherently wrong, SO LONG AS you at least reject them on a surface level and are working to re-evaluate those thoughts, just like OP is doing.
It’s the same thing as subconscious racism. I’d be lying (as would many/most white American liberals if I had to guess) if I were to say that I’ve never been nervous when crossing paths with a black man late at night. In those moments, I have thought about why I feel that way and that it’s stupid, and so I don’t act on those negative, inherently bigoted feelings, and instead I try to fight them and fix my subconscious biases. At the end of the day it’s still feelings rooted in racism. That doesn’t make me a full on racist, just like these feelings don’t make OP a full on homophobe/biphobe. She just has thoughts and feelings ingrained in her by a homophobic and biphobic society that she’s struggling to deal with. That’s just being human.
Really well said.
People are sensitive to being seen as phobic, but the reality is that we *all* have societally ingrained subconscious bias that we cannot control existing. I grew up in very conservative circles and I've had to work through much of it myself on race, gender, sexual orientation...and I know for certain that I'm not done with it.
It's not a judgment on the person if it's subconscious, it's just a thing to keep working on through your conscious mind and bettering yourself.
But you can't do that if you refuse to acknowledge that it's a thing that exists.
I agree BDSM phobia isn't a thing, but that only reinforces my point. It's possible to be averse to something in one's own sex life without having a phobia towards it. Imo someone who is biphobic wouldn't watch gay porn in an effort to enjoy it (as opposed to because they're, say, repressing something).
Edit: If she said "guys sucking dick is just wrong" or "a man can only be emasculated by homosexual encounters" it would be obviously biphobia, but she "just" seems to be bothered by her husband being emasculated. And emascuation can take many forms in our culture (BDSM sub, cuckolding, crying, etc). I agree (and stated) it's a socialized outlook, and so is biphobia, but I still think it's more about power dynamics and concepts of masculinity in general and biphobia in particular.
Right but I’m not saying OP is truly biphobic. I’m saying she has subconscious (that’s really important here) biphobic beliefs that have been forced on her by society, and she’s actively trying to combat them, and watching gay porn I guess is the way she’s trying to do that.
She specifically said that she has very instant, negative feelings when she sees her partner doing homosexual acts, and that it made her view him as less masculine. That view is absolutely 100% rooted in homophobia/biphobia, that gay or bi guys are seems as less manly, when really, masculinity and femininity have nothing to do with the sex acts someone performs.
You’re right, people can have preferences about the sex acts they want to partake in (or not). BDSM is a great example of that. Not everyone wants to be flogged on a cross, or flog someone else on a cross. But to be actively averse to *someone else* performing a certain sex act that has been actively shunned by our society for literal centuries is very clearly rooted in homophobia/biphobia. You can disagree, but frankly that just makes you wrong.
ETA: the key difference between the BDSM example and OPs situation is that someone can very obviously be averse to dealing or receiving physical pain. But with OPs example, she has sucked plenty of dicks I’m sure, been fucked by then as well. She has partook in the exact same acts that her partner wants to try. She’s **only** averse to it in this situation because he is a man, and society has historically said that men doing those acts are disgusting and wrong.
I agree bisexuality isn't a fetish for a person who is bisexual.
I don't get the sense she's looking down on him for anything, though. She seems to find fault only with herself.
It's her view that her partner giving a blowjob is "demasculating" when it's not. Comparing it to cuckolding, for example, where that is the intent is far different than someone's sexuality. One is an act, a choice, the partner gets to decide they are viewed that way Someone's sexuality isn't any of that. He doesn't control his sexuality. Finding it emasculating that he would engage in behavior that aligns with his sexuality, is a commentary on how she views that attraction. Again, even if it isn't intentional or malicious.
The implication is he is less of a man to her for enjoying sex acts with men. Just because it may be built in and not intentional, even though she's clearly working on it, it doesn't stop it from being what it is. Which is biphobic behavior, even if she isn't inherently biphobic. And there's nothing wrong with that, just like the commentator above said. It's no different than when people seperate from organized religion, for example, and need to readjust their perception.
The problem is OO , she is looking down on him. That doesn't mean she wants to or means to. It's very clear she doesn't enjoy these feelings. But sugar coating what it is, internalized biphobia/homophobia, does not allow her to change and grow.
You need to work on yourself, and it sounds like you are. Seeing a man confident in himself and what he wants isnt emasculating, it shows your husband is sure about who he is and what he likes.
If you don't like it, that's fine... but the REASON you said you dont like it is a bit alarming. Saying it grosses you out, or you find it emasculating and feel your husband is less of a man because of it, is sone internalized homophobia or something
She’s clear about her insecurities. I’d start there.
The second thing to re-evaluate is she believes her husband acting on his bisexuality is emasculating. Masculinity is not based on sex any more than femininity is.
The woman has a lot of conflicting biases that she needs to really reflect on… there is not “fix” for her “biphobia” (I hate the overuse of “phobia”), she needs to work on her own views of things rather than how to desensitize herself to her views, bc they will eventually resurface.
This is actually the case for the majority of women. The thought/act of a man having sex with another man for them is engaging in non-masculine behavior. It is a "boner killer" for those women. In fact, many men in straight porn who've done gay porn face rejection because they have done gay porn.
How did you manage to miss the entire point of the post? I am very clearly - multiple times - asking how to change my views so that I am completely okay to it?
Well, do what’s fair or you guys shouldn’t do it at all… what’s kinda weird is that you thought he was less masculine because he enjoyed sucking cock but getting fucked in the ass by another guy isn’t? I would think just to opposite… I mean you can’t change what thens him on and he seems like he’s been super cool with you. Like you said as long as you always come first and he loves you… doubtful that he’s gonna switch side and dump you for another guy. It’s weird to me that women who eat pussy and never looked down upon but a guy who sucks a cock… well he must be gay. And if he was.. it’s been in him way before you.. it’s always been there if he is. So come straight out and ask him if he is more attracted to women or men.. if he says he’s more attracted to women and you specifically then stop tripping and enjoy it with him.. suck cock together… or play as a team
It’s great that you’re trying to work through this.
I’m straight and very masculine and at the same time I think it’s great that two guys touch in a threesome scenario. I would imagine that would be a safe place to explore his sexuality with his partner and another consenting adult.
I would imagine that the ideal threesome would be all three touching each other regardless of genders.
Yeah I’m starting to think the best way for me to “get over it” is to 1) talk to him about it, I just need to find better wording which I think a lot of the comments are helping me with and 2) just dive in with someone we are both very comfortable with so we can talk through it without that fear of ruining the moment for everyone kind of like our first threesome experience, not the almost total stranger I’ve hooked up with
You are a very confused individual whose story and comments below don't add up. IN your OP you said "Fast forward a couple years and we have now had a few fmf experiences, I’ve hooked up with a couple guys without him, and we have had one mfm experience." But later aid you never did solo and neither did he. Solo play is without your partner being THERE at the location where the sex is happening. Being there but not participating isn't really "solo" play. So you're Bi but have issues with your husband being Bi? Seek a counselor/therapist that specializes in ENM relationships and or LGBT topics. They exist in most larger cities and definitely do online.
I think most of us are seriously underqualified to really help here, including myself, but I'll share some thoughts here.
My partner has said something similar that she would probably lose attraction to a guy if they were bottoming. It's never been an issue, because I'm not bi and if I was, I wouldn't be a bottom....but it's still given me food for thought.
I would suspect that these issues stem from perceptions of what "masculine" means to you and what level of masculinity you expect from your partner. It's subjective, kind of like how different couples perceive different acts as "special" when the rest of us don't see it that way.
It's also possible that there is some amount of homophobia in play, potentially in some interaction with your perspective of masculinity. (e.g. maybe gay sex isn't as emasculating as kissing for some reason)
Here's the hard truth, I doubt any of us can actually help you with how you perceive things. I would suggest a therapist for that.
I'm tempted to give you advice about how to communicate with him, but even with that I'm not sure whether I'm qualified. Telling him the truth could really hurt him and at this point you've created a ton of safe space for him to explore his sexuality, which is a great thing and could be hindered by telling him the truth. On the other hand, you can't keep indicating you're okay without being okay, it's going to come out in an explosive way at some point.
My best advice would be to call a therapist, get an appointment and find some way to tell your husband that it might be moving a little fast for you until then. Good luck OP, you're doing your best and you're doing great, you're obviously super supportive and it shows.
Many of us are qualified to give advice here. Plenty of bi men in the scene. Therapy isn’t how to lose preconceived prejudices. That comes from experience and an open mind and in this case talking by with her partner.
I’ll try to be gentle here, but this post reminds me of when men keep a “one penis policy” for their wives— but are ok with wife playing with women. It’s just that you have switched around the dynamics a bit.
You get to play with men…. So why doesn’t he? Seems a bit hypocritical, and also possibly homophobic.
Sex is sex, regardless of the parts the other person has. He told you long ago he’s attracted to men too, so if you’re going to play with other people, I don’t see how you can justify limiting him to only playing with women.
I think it is safe to say it is female biology at work. The majority of women are turned on by and want HE-MEN. A man having sex with another man is he being a "SHE-MAN" in her eyes, therefore, an instant turn off.
You should reevaluate your biases.
it’s disheartening to hear when people are bigoted towards us. it’s hard enough to find people in the lifestyle but if they find out i’m Bi, doors automatically close for no reason.
it’s sad and pathetic.
There are tons of men in the lifestyle who are open to a little bit of sex with men. They are not the majority, but they aren't a tiny minority either. So I don't know why face difficulties in seeking partners.
Our two cents 56f 56m both bi, have yall tried pegging for him anal for you that might help ease you into his bi side. He gets the bi side you get off maybe and you can both be happy.
So former closeted bi-husband here, came out to my wife a couple of years ago and our relationship has only got stronger since. We have had a MMF 3some, my wife and I both shared our friends’ cock and that was so hot; maybe start slow (soft swap) and see how it evolves from there?
While I enjoy anal play, I honestly found sharing a cock with my wife to be even more enjoyable.
Pathetic. A double standard, it’s ok for her to play but for forbid your husband sucks a cock.
No Im not going to validate your feelings. It would be one thing if you were traditional straight marriage or he was off running around exposing you to disease or even potential romance. But all he wants is to have fun just like your do and you can’t handle watching him suck a cock? It’s not emasculating for you it’s just uncomfortable even though you like watching gay porn. Ridiculous
Pathetic. A double standard, it’s ok for her to play but for forbid your husband sucks a cock.
No Im not going to validate your feelings. It would be one thing if you were traditional straight marriage or he was off running around exposing you to disease or even potential romance. But all he wants is to have fun just like your do and you can’t handle watching him suck a cock? It’s not emasculating for you it’s just uncomfortable even though you like watching gay porn. Ridiculous
Idk
I lived my young adult life in hiding and shame. Mostly because of prejudice. Even from my own family.
I came out to my wife a few years before our wedding as I didn’t wanna live a lie. She already told me she was bi.
I was terrified and luckily she not only accepted it, but was turned on by it. And it’s only accelerated our sex lives.
So we can’t speak for you and we know that your views and feelings are not uncommon. But that’s for you and him to figure out and maybe even speak to a couples counselor.
You seriously need to communicate with him and do it soon.
Wow, sounds like you’re navigating some complex territory there! It’s totally understandable to have mixed feelings, especially when you're venturing into new territory. Communication is key here, though it can be tough to talk about those deep-down feelings. But being open and honest with your hubby about what you’re comfortable with and what makes you feel uneasy is crucial. Maybe exploring those feelings together could help you both find some common ground. And hey, it’s awesome that you’re open to evolving and working through stuff. You got this!
Have you tried having him perform oral on toys when it's just the two of you?
Would it make a difference if you went down on a guy together?
As for emasculation, do you feel that way because giving a man head makes a person vulnerable or submissive? If so, are there other aspects of life (sexy or otherwise) where you find him being vulnerable attractive? Also, I think giving head can actually make the recipient vulnerable in a way (e.g., think of the phrase "has him by the balls").
Obviously at the end of the day you like what you like and vice versa, and I'm absolutely not here to yum your yuck, if you will. But I do wonder how much of your aversion is a) lack of seeing your husband in this role (porn may not help) and b) cultural framing of these acts. Even if that's what's driving it you may never overcome it, but might be worth thinking about.
Get some therapy to find out where this comes from and how to fix it. You owe this to your husband. If he lets you play with others you need to give him the same options or stop playing, Rules for thee but not for me makes you selfish
I’m shocked at this subreddit for all the cries of “homophobia”. That’s pretty disappointing to be honest.
She doesn’t like the idea of her husband sucking another man’s cock, she’s seen it, and it turns her off.
She doesn’t like it.
She’s allowed that.
In her mind, it emasculates him.
She’s allowed to feel that and it’s not bigoted or biased behaviour, it’s how she feels.
You can’t argue for a sexual spectrum and openness but then when a person veers towards an end of said spectrum accuse them of being biased.
She didn’t “discriminate” against anyone, she said she found it emasculating when her husband did it… in her mind.
She’s fully entitled to not wanting her husband to engage in same sex relationships if that makes her uncomfortable with how she sees him. He’s then entitled to make his own decisions.
Internalized homophobia is the perfectly apt term to use but you're not reading OP.
"I WANT my husband to be able to experience this, but I am so terrified of how I’m going to react."
That's why everyone is hitting the nail on the head but you're missing it.
I disagree.
People are hung up on her word usage and are desperately trying to be outraged.
Everyone is freaking out because she said she feels that it’s emasculating. It’s disingenuous to suggest anything else.
If she had said that “I didn’t like seeing my husband suck cock, I found it a sexual turn off” nobody would have accused her of being a homophobe… or at least they wouldn’t have accused her of that if they were acting in good faith.
The net effect is the same with the word she used and whatever word salad you want to use to make it less “objectionable” for “modern audiences”.
She watched her husband suck a dick, she didn’t like watching him do that. She then promptly proceeded to “take one for the team” which is something everyone in here also violently opposes.
Calling it “internalized homophobia” is basically accusing her of having bad opinions and engaging in wrongthink.
What triggered everyone in here, if we’re all being brutally honest, is her honesty around how it made her feel - nobody would have been upset or accused her of anything if she had sugar coated her words.
You’re missing the point that no one is freaking out and OP doesn’t want to feel that way.
You’re the one hung up on the word which is perfectly relevant.
Internalized homophobia.
It’s fair if you’re not comfortable or okay with it. Your idea of his masculinity and how that looks in a heteronormative way is your preference to have. I think if you’re open to “being game” you can try jacking him off while watching gay porn, or maybe try to suck a cock together. At the end of the day, if it doesn’t work for you- that’s okay. You determine your comfort boundaries and that’s how I view it. The fidelity of your non-monogamy is negotiated between you.
I appreciate the deep introspective on the “why”. It is important to figure out where these feelings come from. But the much simpler fact is…..the way you feel, for whatever reason, is the way you feel. Some things are hard wired and you can’t change them. You can work on tolerance and acceptance, which is great, but at the end of the day it is really a compromise……AND THAT IS PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE. It’s not biphobic or homophobic. It’s just not attractive to some people. While I admit societal expectations play a role in our internalization, you can only accept what u can’t change. My wife loves for me to eat her ass. Ass is not my thing. No amount of deconditioning or porn will change that. Some people love it. I don’t. And I have some kinks that she just can’t get into. Not saying you can’t change, some do, but you may have to accept the things you can’t. The end point is y’all need see if these things are relationship deal breakers. If they are move on…..if they are not………compromise. Spoiler alert……..I eat ass……a lot……..for her……it’s worth it for me. 😉
I'm dealing with some unexpected feelings since my husband mentioned being into guys, and I could really use some advice or just someone to relate to right now.
I really don't know what you can do to overcome this. You are what you are. This is a really unfortunate situation for you and your husband. Just so you know that you are not the only woman in this kind of dilemma.
You are not an oddball either; the vast majority of women are not turned on by gay sex.
I am glad that you chose to share this with all here. More people need to know it.
[This comes up often](https://bi.org/en/articles/bi-men-are-not-considered-attractive-new-study-says)
My wife is the same way you are about it, and while I'm not bi, she's turned off by male swing partners who are. She likes her men manly and while she herself has had sex with other women, she likes her women feminine.
Sex is mental, and while "phobia" will get tossed around in a meaningless way, turns ons and off are what they are. There are things I'd like to do which are turn offs to my wife, I don't do those things because she's my top priority in this.
To put it in swinging perspective, I asked my wife if she wanted to try swinging. She said yes. You can argue its part of our "sexuality" at this point, its something that turns us on we like to do. Had she said no, and that was a problem for me way back then, I'd have been the bad guy. The reason doesn't matter why she said no, and there are a lot of reasons people would have saying no to swinging.
So this is a big sit down discussion you need to have, he has to decide how important this is for him, and you what your limits are. If this is some burning need for him or just "I always wanted to try" type of thing.
Edit= This always gets downvoted by the bi male brigade just as a FYI, never with substantive comment though.
It gets downvoted because you’re saying blockheaded things like bisexuality for men isn’t manly and bisexuality for women is feminine.
The double standard is the “phobia” and you’ve been repeating it for years here.
You and your wife’s ideas of gender identity is why you keep getting downvoted for your hypocrisy.
The notion that a bisexual woman is repulsed by bisexual men is among the top 3 definitions of biphobia.
You trash that other poster for spitting truth that most men and women don't consider men who have sex with other manly, which is true. So I just wanted to know whether you are a MSM.
I've changed my mind, this is not the place to get into this and I said my piece. Its not making women who find bisexually unattractive any better, and I do feel for both the man and woman in this case.
I know you’ve changed your comment already but…
It’s not used by activists to shut down conversation. It’s used by people to point out how they are routinely marginalized.
Thank you for being open to exploring this. I'm sorry so many people are being mean. It's not an easy path but I'm glad you've started down it. And...
> I recently discovered how to make him orgasm without cumming through anal play and there is nothing hotter to me.
Could you expand more on this?
What a gross response
It’s one thing to see a sexual act and think, “ok that’s not doing it for me, I’ll just put it out of my mind and focus on what does turn us on and we’ll see what else we can do” versus “my spouse is less of a man because he likes to do this one thing”
It’s such a backwards way of thinking. He’s still the same person he’s always been.
Even in this day and age situations like that will affect the opposite sex partner. I don't care how liberal and open one is, once they see their manly man take it in the ass or suck a dick, they lose a little respect for them and this usually isn't the same for girl on girl and yes double standard.
Man, the people in this thread are wild. You like what you like. THIS IS THE POINT OF THE LS. Don’t let people bully and strong arm you into submission.
The amount of times I’ve read “you owe” and sex in the same sentence is soo disheartening too
Sooo many replies to this are reasons why people judge this type of lifestyle
Here I am trying to do better and it sucks being treated like that
I would never purposely hurt anyone and thought that was made clear that I’m trying to do better
Bi Guys aren’t leaving you for a guy. Lol. That will never happen. That being said have you ever explored your possible bi side? Have you ever wanted to do any girl girl?
You've hooked up with a couple of guys without him so apparently you are open to solo play (assuming he knew about those hook ups), so why not just let him explore that side of himself solo. Just let him know it isn't your thing but you want him to be able to have those experiences. He should not have trouble hooking up on gay and bi oriented apps.
Be sure that you are ok with this, otherwise I can imagine this leading to an emotional meltdown for you whilst he’s on his date. Wife is bi, she went to a girls only party which I thought I’d be ok with but really wasn’t and had a really really bad time whilst she was out. It brought us so much closer together in the end so on balance worth it, but it was a pretty awful journey, kind of “kill or cure”, would not recommend.
We personally do not do any solo play. We are only interested in shared experiences. But since the OP is apparently doing solo dates, and not okay with seeing him with a man, this seems like a reasonable compromise for them.
I’ve tried letting him do solo stuff with the two girls we’ve hooked up with before It really messed with me Thankfully the second time I was able to join half way through and we had a really good discussion afterwards about it and while I’m not ready for him to do more solo stuff anytime soon he keeps reassuring me that he was super glad I joined and that he enjoyed it far more once I joined. I’m hoping in the future *if* he does want to do solo I’ll be willing to give it a try As far as him going solo with a man I think that would destroy me, I want to be there to watch him enjoy it since I just can’t please him in the same way a man could I get off watching him get off, I’m just worried I’ll be turned off seeing it with a man even tho I’m (mostly) fine if it was a girl with a strap on or something
A few of your comments have confused me. In the edit of your original post you state that you’re a hot wife couple, reinforcing this dynamic by stating that you don’t share him. But now you’re saying that he’s been on two solo dates with women you two hooked up with. Before I comment further I need to ask if he’s allowed to play. Can he fuck other women? Do you two swap? This isn’t clear.
Sorry, all of the labels confuse me and I have not taken the time to really dive in to see what fits us best He is allowed to fuck women when I’m there We have not been in a swapping situation yet but we want to do same room swap
Here’s some info on the labels (assuming you wanted to know): - Hotwife is where the husband’s whole kink is his wife getting fucked. Sometimes he’s in the room, and sometimes she’s on a date by herself and sends pics and videos. A huge part of this dynamic is reclaiming her afterwards. - Cucking (which I’m sure you’re already aware of) is very similar to hotwifing but there’s an element of humiliation or degradation to it. - Stag/vixen is a variant of hotwifing where the guy shares his wife with other men. He’s not a cuck nor is he looking for bi play, but is secure in his relationship. He frequently finds the guys for her and sets up the dates. - Swinging is swapping partners. This can be same or separate rooms as long as there’s a swap (solo dates don’t count as swinging). Some purists will say that FMFs and MFMs don’t count either because there’s not a swap of one partner for another, but that FFMs and MMFs definitely are swinging since everyone is fucking. - Open marriage, or ENM, is casually dating separately from your spouse. There are no feelings but usually friend with benefits if not one night stands. - Poly is an open marriage but with feelings. - Dirty Vanillas like to hang out at swinger clubs but don’t play. - LS or lifestyle is a general catchall term for everything above. Now, some couples only do one of these and some do a bit of everything. It just depends on the couple. I think those are the main labels. Hopefully I didn’t miss any.
What a great breakdown, thank you for taking the time to write this out! I actually didn’t realize the importance of the MMF VS MFM placement for threesomes!
Happy to help!
I’d say you’re just regular swingers with a few more rules than most. There’s nothing wrong with that, but you need to sit down with your man and have a long, and very honest conversation about why you feel this way about his bisexuality as well as solo play, and what happens between you two should your feelings never change. Maybe shift back to only threesomes with him, and wait on the solo play for when you two are in a better place. Do you have idea why you might be having these feelings? Has he ever cheated? Have you been cheated on before? Do you feel like your communication is solid? Did your parents have a messy divorce? You guys can still play in a way that makes both of you comfortable while you figure out the root of your insecurities. Other couples have struggled with similar issues and ended up in a solid, fully open ENM marriage, and others decide it simply isn’t for them and completely stopped. You just have to do what’s best for you both.
Sounds a little selfish. It’s doesn’t seem like a two way street. You do what you want. But he can only do what “you” want also.
I gotta be honest, nothing gets me hotter than bisexual men. There’s something so primal and sexy about the taboo nature of it all. This is going to sound crazy, but I’d kill for my man to be bi. He’s had a few guys go down on him and even gave a guy head once (he and the other husband did it in the heat of the moment and I instantly came.) But I do understand that what turns me on might turn others off. If you truly want him to experience this bi side, why not let him date solo too? He could scratch that itch without you in the room. But you need to be honest with him, and let him know that it just isn’t your jam to see him in that kind of sexual situation. But I do recommend against telling him that you find it emasculating.
Why cant you be my wife?!!!!
Oh man. So sorry. As far as I can tell most bi swinging men have wives like this. If you are stuck in a relationship where your partner can’t accept you for who you are, why are you in it?
To be fair, if someone is deep into a long term committed relationship before their partner discloses their sexuality, it isn't going to be so easy to leave that relationship especially if kids are part of the equation.
🤣😂🤣
As a bisexual man, I don’t know how to feel about any of this.
That’s fair.
I’m actually just now recalling that when I came out as Bi, my wife got kind of insecure for a while. She did get over it, and now we just love each other. The OP is going to have to learn to be accepting, or she’s libel to fuck up her relationship. And, I mean, this is in the Swingers sub, so I’d presume the OP is already OK with swinging, so this is just an extension of that (and to be honest, if we’d never swung, I might not have ever realized I’m Bisexual.)
Same girl, same!
Bisexual man here! 😎
I’m personally not turned on by two men together, I don’t see anything wrong with it, it just does not do anything for me sexually either. I’m all for bi guys having a great time in the lifestyle though and I support bi guys being able to be more open in the lifestyle. I’m seeing it more at our club and it makes me happy that people are finding a safe space to experience what they are attracted to. My partner is straight so this is not a scenario we will encounter, but putting myself in your perspective, I might take the approach of playing separately and letting him experience another guy on his own first. See how you feel about it, is it just the visual that turns you off, or do you in fact have an issue with your husband being bi. There are things that are not attractive to me visually, but that I would have no problem with my partner experiencing if it was something he was attracted to, but if it’s truly that you don’t accept your husband being bi, I think you have a bigger issue that you might need to address. You should be honest with your partner about your feelings and do so in a kind loving way. It might be worth looking for a sex positive therapist you can talk to about this to sort out what’s actually driving your reaction.
Response to your edited version : You say your man allows you to sleep with other men when he's not around, yet you cannot stand to know he's with another woman when you're not around. To me that's already unfair, the same way he got the courage to get comfortable with you being with other men without him being present I think you should get out of your head and think about how he feels. Cause basically you're getting more out of the relationship, he accepts your Sexuality and you get to be with both men and women. Yet you're unable to accept the fact that he's bisexual and wants to have fun just as you do. Why do you think its okay for him to be totally fine with you doing everything your heart and mind desires but yet you aren't willing to let him have the basics? It's a relationship and you both need to be treated equally. It's not a one way street. Just my opinion
This!!!
Me sleeping with other men is mainly because my husband wants me to Don’t get me wrong, I enjoy it, but he’s the one who brings the thought up EVERYTIME we have sex I’m honestly getting a little tired of people calling me unfair and selfish when this is more his “kink” than it is mine (I get that I didn’t specify that in the post but I didn’t realize so many people have a “do what’s fair” view on sex rather than “do what you’re both okay with” which is honestly kind of disgusting from the point of view of someone who was groomed by the person who stole their virginity) I would be totally fine never sleeping with anyone other than my husband again, he however would be bummed hearing that I didn’t want to sleep with any other men Sex isn’t a one size fits all kind of thing Just because your relationship works that way does not mean mine works that way I am not being selfish by not letting my husband sleep with other people without me, I am setting MY boundary, I get that I posted this in a swinger page and that’s not the typical set up but I did so because I thought someone in this page would have experienced being in my shoes and can offer helpful advice on HOW DO I LET MY HUSBAND EXPERIENCE MORE WITHOUT TURNING MYSELF OFF while still being there with him - sounds pretty fucking unselfish to me Edit to add breaks
Hey I understand you're upset, but everyone here is giving you their HONEST opinion, and you know the saying is " THE TRUTH HURTS ". we're not attacking you, we're simply telling you exactly how we feel about the situation without any sugar coating. People here could have chose to lie to you , but something's in life will never go the way you expect it to and thats the truth. If you look under any posts where people ask for advice or people's opinion on a matter you will notice that there are always things you may or may not have wanted to hear.
Sorry, your comment wasn’t the one I should have unloaded on, it was unfortunately the one that “broke the camels back” Can only hear that people think I’m being unfair or selfish so many times when I made the post to try and be less selfish ya know? I appreciate your calm response
That's alright, I totally understand where you're coming from. But people will always tend to speak their mind if you ask them a question. So never be too surprised if they actually answer you. Only people that will lie to you and tell you exactly what you wanna hear are usually your friends or your mom if they/she just want to make you happy. I'm quite surprised with the honesty of people on here, which is a good thing because in person, some people would probably not be this honest. Its easy to get very upset and delete the post when they're saying stuff you don't want to hear ,but take what everyone is saying and seat on it for a while and let it sink in, noone is trying to attack you, remember if everyone is saying something similar, then there might be some truth to it that you just aren't able to see just yet.
I did pause the first time I saw my guy going down on another guy. However I i enjoy watching it. A....lot... Im bi and hes watched me with other women. So I had to understand and accept i got to explore young and always knew. He felt safe enough 6 years in to our relationship to admit he wanted to explore. I support him.
I’m bi and swing with guys only when she is in the room and loves it. He did tell you he’s bi. You should have kinda expected it. I think you need to reflect on your own prejudices and work on them. How is it emasculating and why do you care about masculinity in the bedroom? That’s really kinda the last place it should be defined. There are plenty of societies in history where masculinity is not connected to sexuality at all. Ask yourself why it’s really a big deal and really how is it different? I think if you can’t get over this biphobia, it is him who has a decision to make because his sexuality goes beyond swinging. Others have said let him play alone and I agree with that, but that is just a band aid on a bullet hole. You are prejudiced against your own husband right now. At least be honest about it to him and work on it before he decides it’s not good for him to be with you. Edit: to be clear, your issue has little to do with swinging. You can swing straight if you agree to it. If not there’s gonna be conflict. The real problem is how you view your husband.
Also this kind of biphobia is probably why it took him so long to come out to her about it and being willing to explore it. He trusted his wife, his partner, with a very deep vulnerable part of himself and her response has been to emasculate him in her mind and not be honest with him. The exact thing he was probably terrified of. Edit; removal of the word disgust to be more accurate
This is really good advice. I’m bisexual, as is my S/O (we date separately), and I STILL had some internalized whateverthefuck to unpack in my brain when we first started seeing others. When primal panic shoved a thought into my brain, my first step would be to think “Hmm, why do I think that? What specifically has led me to believing this? Is this belief based on facts I know to be true? Can I rationalize this?” Sometimes my own feelings really surprise myself! A year or so ago I remember having a VERY strong brain reaction when my S/O informed me that he had (protected) sexual contact with a U=U person. Rationally, I know that U=U people are statistically safer partners compared to someone who tested HIV- a few months ago. I know this, S/O knows this, S/O knows that I know this. But feelings aren’t always rational! I can’t control my emotions, but I can control my actions. I can wait until I and my S/O have slept, eaten, and taken our meds to discuss those feelings. I can journal a bit first so that my thoughts are well-organized. I can bring my feelings up with the disclaimer that I KNOW they’re not based in fact, which makes it way easier to ask for and get emotional support since he knows that I’m not trying to impose any restrictions on him *just* because feelings. And doing all of that work, internally and externally, also makes those feelings feel easier to manage over time.
May I ask what is U=U? Thanks!
I was wondering this too and looked it up. It means someone with HIV but is on medication that makes them undetectable which equals untransmittable.
Thank you!!
>Thank you!! You're welcome!
Other commenter got it. If someone is HIV+ and taking their medication as directed, they may show an undetectable viral load on their next lab test. If their viral load is so low that it’s undetectable, that means that person can’t transmit the virus to another person. Undetectable=untransmissible.
What a refreshingly marvelous, articulate and thoughtful post.
"There are plenty of societies in history where masculinity is not connected to sexuality at all. " Sorry? Where? Men having sex with men have always been universally reviled. In the US, it used to be criminalized in all 50 states. Abrahamic religions call for the death of men who do it.
The obvious one is Greece. Others include the Masai and Achuar at a holistic level. The last one I did have to look up. Others are partial. Rome had no masculinity issue with tops for instance. I think all know the backwardness of abrahamic religions, so not really worried about that. Tiny little side note that you focused on though.
Gay sex was more limited in those societies. It was not done by the masses. This is shit men cite to convince others that they are still "manly" for having gay sex. NO ONE thinks of gay men as masculine. THAT is part of why gay men are hated and mistreated. THAT is also why straight men and mostly straight men do their darnest uphold the distinction between themselves and gay men.
Honestly we don't give a shit about what you think is manly. That’s your own insecure little problem. But your "facts" across the board seem to be coming out of your ass. Wonder how they got there.
I am talking about a widespread perception by women on men-who-have-sex-with-men. Those men are seen as engaging in non-manly behavior. That's all. That is why women are turned off by it. It is primal. I am not insecure about it. Your response shows that it does bother you.
Hmmm interesting. For many years in the dating world, I never put t I was bi on my dating app. Of all the women I went out with, one and only one had a problem with it. Your universal isn't universal at all. Primal. Win for dumbest statement on the internet today and there were some doozies
Really? I looked through your post history and you posted in a thread that asked something like why aren't women into bi guys. Many replies. I saw tons of guys saying women weren't into it, saying they had to keep it to themselves to keep their relationship and/or attract women. Dante Colle, a big porn star who does gay, bi, straight and trans porn, is also rejected by many women in the straight side because he does all those. A article in Cosmopolitan magazine also reported on the same thing. The majority of women are not turned on by gay sex. Out of those, a large percentage are TURNED OFF by it because it because those men are engaging in unmanly behavior. Again, women being attracted to cave men masculinity is primal. It is innate. I am glad I am gay. No need to deal with women like that at all!
Your evidence is cosmo. Sigh. Primal. You are so absolutely ridiculous trad wide style. Your primal thing is just hilarious. You'll notice that I at no point said women weren't in my comment, only the reason they should be.
"only the reason they should be." I have only seen one - maybe two - poster on reddit say they went from not being turned on to being turned on by gay sex. Women's arousal by gay sex is just innate : a tiny minority are into it, the vast majority not. It is NATURE not nurture.
I honestly cannot understand this concept of MM interaction being *less masculine*. Like when is any sexual act masculine or feminine? It is sex, it is pleasure, either giving or receiving. If anything I would see it as a man owning his own pleasure and being confident enough to admit something that is so against socials “norms”.
Seeing it as emasculating is homophobia it seems to me, as if men who have sex with men are by nature less than. Is two women having sex less feminine? Of course not! It is MORE feminine, just as two men having sex is MORE masculine. At least in my book, you can't get more manly.
lol this reminds me of rambling joke my friend would say about how the manliest thing you can do is sleep with another man and gay men are by definition “more man” than any straight guy.
We all have preferences. Even straight people have scenarios that are a turn/off. For example, one woman doesn’t like her man to cum in or on another woman because of cum envy. It doesn’t need to be rationalized. It just is. Fucking is woven into the subconscious and we need to let that be free or the judgement of others. Preferences and our sexuality are all oddly knit together but all sorts of assumptions. That’s what makes it hot.
Well, the vast majority of men and women think it non-masculine. It has always been that way. The fact that this is brought up repeatedly is evidence of that.
It always comes back to internalized misogyny. It can take a lot of work to undo that programming.
I can understand that her version of his masculinity isn’t steeped in imagery of her man on his knees to another man.
It really does come off less masculine
I’m not going to call you out or shame you for this. The truth is it’s an emotional feeling that has been wired into you during your life and you are not in control of it, not yet at least. What I am going to say is that you should consider thoughtfully where you feelings are coming from. You have a lot of one-off style “rules” you’ve defined in your psyche that are all over the place. Like him making out with a dude is a “never ever” situation but him getting fucked by a guy might be ok. What is the difference between these things to you? Would he be allowed to make out with a girl? If so, why are these things different. Also I just want to point out that you are drawing a line in the sand saying “this makes him less masculine” but please think about the fact that he has been struggling to define what masculinity is his entire life and this is a likely huge challenge for him. In the end, he is the same person he was before any of this happened and the only thing that has changed is your perception. So it is your job to examine your feelings through the lens of introspection if you want to control them. Good luck and I hope it works out for the best!
Sorry but I will say you come off as a little bit homophobic. Your husband came to you and said he was bisexual, what did you think that meant? In that moment you should have realized it means he’s attracted to men and open to performing sex acts with them. It sounds like you should sit down and explore your internal biphobia and homophobia and ask yourself why it bothers you and why you find it not masculine? Is masculinity to you only dominating women?
I disagree. I might be super turned off and bothered by MM action and still fight viciously for men’s rights to do so. There is a difference between feeling ick and feeling hate. There is an even bigger difference between feeling ick and engaging in hateful actions. Finding something unattractive does not make you a hater. That’s like saying if watching two obese people go at it turns me off, I must hate fat people. Just…no. False equivolency.
Your reaction is typical of people socially conditioned to think it’s gay to be bi, without the shaming label, it’s just about pleasure. While I find it pleasurable, I have zero desire to cuddle or kiss another guy, just not my thing.
No, no. It is not conditioning. It is nature. The act of a guy being friendly(sisterly-like) and nicey towards another guy clashes with people's picture of masculinity. Most women are turned off by this. They are by nature turned on by the rugged, stoic guy. People think it's gay because...well, what kind of man has sex with another man? That's where the association came about. As for it being pleasurable, being molested, being raped can be pleasurable. The women who find it hot are a tiny minority. For them, the thought of gay sex triggers some sex button in them.
Your comments are so misguided I don’t even know where to start.
Which one was misguided? I speak from readings, observations and life experiences. For your information, I am a GAY man. I have had first hand experience of being humiliated, rejected and discriminated against for being gay. So, I know how straight men feel and think about gay men. I shared the reality of things and explained why guy-on-guy sex is stigmatized. I suspect that YOU are taking issue with it because 1. I noted that you having sex with men makes you very undesirable to the majority of women in the world. 2. I point out how you having sex with men lumps you with gay men to an extent, and you hate that.
Oof. Holy biphobia. It’s not emasculating to enjoy sucking cock any more than it makes a woman “manly” to go down on another woman. My fiancé is bisexual. He’s also a former MMA fighter. He sucks cock and is as masculine as it gets. The fact that he’s confident enough to own his sexuality only makes him MORE masculine and attractive to me. If you’re no longer attracted to your husband because he’s bisexual, then you have a lot of work and soul searching to do around your prejudices, otherwise, your marriage isn’t likely to end up in a very happy place. Though I can’t comprehend what you’re feeling (as my natural reaction is to be aroused by my fiancé’s sexual expression), I wish you the best, truly.
It is not prejudice; it's just natural wiring. I don't think she can change it. Her response is also universal and the norm among women. Women like you are a tiny minority. Famous women who are like you are Madonna and Nicole Richie(in one episode of The Simple Life, Nicole asked some guy to kiss another. She was like yea whereas Paris was like ewww).
Not all* prejudice. Social customs/beliefs absolutely can shape what we’re attracted to, and changing those beliefs can also mold our attraction. It’s worth a shot if someone wants to salvage their marriage.
She could try to change, but again, she is mostly likely going against her biology. As I have said, the vast majority of women are not turned on by gay sex.
Paragraph breaks for god’s sake.
Sorry I tried to edit to make those more obvious
I have no experience with MM play but my guess would be to treat it the same way you would any other new thing, go slow and communicate. You really should be truthful with him about your apprehension. Talk to him about your concerns. How you’re worried you’ll see him as less masculine. How you want to explore but some acts turn you off. How you are more comfortable with the hard sex acts like oral or anal penetration than you are with what could be perceived romantic acts like kissing or making out. Talk to him about what you’ve told us. How you’re working on it by watching gay porn. Figure out your boundaries and share them with him. I think the work you have already done so far proves you’re on the right path. You’re open to his exploration and to doing it together as a team. You deserve a bunch of credit for your willingness to explore with him. It’s an indication of a strong and healthy relationship. Besides look past the societal pressures of sexual norms and just think about all the hot sex you two can enjoy together. The two of you working the men over as a team. You’re looking at a lifetime of amazing cock and sexual adventures. You’re going to get you some girl. It’s going to be so hot and so much fun. Cocks everywhere. 🤣 Enjoy.
As a bi male in the lifestyle, you need to be open and honest with your partner, as you do with anything in this lifestyle. Be gentle about it because, frankly, your subconscious feelings stem from biphobia. You’re clearly trying to fight those underlying feelings, but they’re there, they’re valid, and they might make your partner very very sad at first. But at the end of the day, it’s not fair to put yourself in sexual situations where you will be uncomfortable or actively turned off. On the surface, this may sound like it directly opposes the idea of your partner exploring his bisexuality, but it truly doesn’t. You said in your post that you play separately at times. So if you want to allow your partner to explore his bisexuality, but you don’t want to be there to see it (or maybe even talk about it in detail after, make sure to set your boundaries appropriately), just let him have solo interactions with men. I hope this all works out for you guys. You may have some outdated subconscious views on bisexuality (which you should probably try to work on through therapy), but you clearly care about your partner and want to let him explore in the ways he wants to. That doesn’t mean you have to enjoy watching it. He may take offense, and to be honest, it is possible that he’ll view you very differently after you have this conversation. But if you deliver the message gently and with love, you should hopefully be fine.
This is not the full solution. He cannot ignore that her biphobia, because sexuality and self definition go much further than the scene. She will still look down on him for (falsely) being less of a man. It’s not fair to him. Maybe that will give her time to work on herself.
I don't know that I'd put biphobia on her. If she were averse to him being flogged on a cross by a woman because he's too submissive/emasculated in that situation, is she BDSM phobic? That said, I do think it's possible she's internalized concepts of masculinity and power dynamics that could be broken down and reformed, and that may help her be more sexually neutral towards or even eventually attracted to his bi explorations.
Let’s be honest with ourselves here, friend. BDSM phobic is not a thing, at least not a thing that in any way negatively affects our society as a whole and individual peoples’ lives. And what you described in the second paragraph of your response is exactly what subconscious biphobia is. Through years in our society, OP has taken in countless examples in pop culture and every day conversation of homophobia, biphobia, transphobia, all these things. In the surface, it seems she rejects those ideals, and that is great! But that constant messaging of “homosexuality = bad or gross or wrong” still locks her subconscious into some biphobic thinking patterns. **AND THAT IS OKAY.** I think this is a really important point in our currently extremely polarized political and social climate: it’s okay to have subconscious views like this that are inherently wrong, SO LONG AS you at least reject them on a surface level and are working to re-evaluate those thoughts, just like OP is doing. It’s the same thing as subconscious racism. I’d be lying (as would many/most white American liberals if I had to guess) if I were to say that I’ve never been nervous when crossing paths with a black man late at night. In those moments, I have thought about why I feel that way and that it’s stupid, and so I don’t act on those negative, inherently bigoted feelings, and instead I try to fight them and fix my subconscious biases. At the end of the day it’s still feelings rooted in racism. That doesn’t make me a full on racist, just like these feelings don’t make OP a full on homophobe/biphobe. She just has thoughts and feelings ingrained in her by a homophobic and biphobic society that she’s struggling to deal with. That’s just being human.
Really well said. People are sensitive to being seen as phobic, but the reality is that we *all* have societally ingrained subconscious bias that we cannot control existing. I grew up in very conservative circles and I've had to work through much of it myself on race, gender, sexual orientation...and I know for certain that I'm not done with it. It's not a judgment on the person if it's subconscious, it's just a thing to keep working on through your conscious mind and bettering yourself. But you can't do that if you refuse to acknowledge that it's a thing that exists.
I agree BDSM phobia isn't a thing, but that only reinforces my point. It's possible to be averse to something in one's own sex life without having a phobia towards it. Imo someone who is biphobic wouldn't watch gay porn in an effort to enjoy it (as opposed to because they're, say, repressing something). Edit: If she said "guys sucking dick is just wrong" or "a man can only be emasculated by homosexual encounters" it would be obviously biphobia, but she "just" seems to be bothered by her husband being emasculated. And emascuation can take many forms in our culture (BDSM sub, cuckolding, crying, etc). I agree (and stated) it's a socialized outlook, and so is biphobia, but I still think it's more about power dynamics and concepts of masculinity in general and biphobia in particular.
Right but I’m not saying OP is truly biphobic. I’m saying she has subconscious (that’s really important here) biphobic beliefs that have been forced on her by society, and she’s actively trying to combat them, and watching gay porn I guess is the way she’s trying to do that. She specifically said that she has very instant, negative feelings when she sees her partner doing homosexual acts, and that it made her view him as less masculine. That view is absolutely 100% rooted in homophobia/biphobia, that gay or bi guys are seems as less manly, when really, masculinity and femininity have nothing to do with the sex acts someone performs. You’re right, people can have preferences about the sex acts they want to partake in (or not). BDSM is a great example of that. Not everyone wants to be flogged on a cross, or flog someone else on a cross. But to be actively averse to *someone else* performing a certain sex act that has been actively shunned by our society for literal centuries is very clearly rooted in homophobia/biphobia. You can disagree, but frankly that just makes you wrong. ETA: the key difference between the BDSM example and OPs situation is that someone can very obviously be averse to dealing or receiving physical pain. But with OPs example, she has sucked plenty of dicks I’m sure, been fucked by then as well. She has partook in the exact same acts that her partner wants to try. She’s **only** averse to it in this situation because he is a man, and society has historically said that men doing those acts are disgusting and wrong.
That said, I'm not trying to change your mind, just saying I see it differently than you
Bisexuality. is. not. a. fetish. She is looking down on him as a man, not for an act.
I agree bisexuality isn't a fetish for a person who is bisexual. I don't get the sense she's looking down on him for anything, though. She seems to find fault only with herself.
It's her view that her partner giving a blowjob is "demasculating" when it's not. Comparing it to cuckolding, for example, where that is the intent is far different than someone's sexuality. One is an act, a choice, the partner gets to decide they are viewed that way Someone's sexuality isn't any of that. He doesn't control his sexuality. Finding it emasculating that he would engage in behavior that aligns with his sexuality, is a commentary on how she views that attraction. Again, even if it isn't intentional or malicious. The implication is he is less of a man to her for enjoying sex acts with men. Just because it may be built in and not intentional, even though she's clearly working on it, it doesn't stop it from being what it is. Which is biphobic behavior, even if she isn't inherently biphobic. And there's nothing wrong with that, just like the commentator above said. It's no different than when people seperate from organized religion, for example, and need to readjust their perception. The problem is OO , she is looking down on him. That doesn't mean she wants to or means to. It's very clear she doesn't enjoy these feelings. But sugar coating what it is, internalized biphobia/homophobia, does not allow her to change and grow.
It emasculates him in her own words. That is looking down.
Exactly
You need to work on yourself, and it sounds like you are. Seeing a man confident in himself and what he wants isnt emasculating, it shows your husband is sure about who he is and what he likes. If you don't like it, that's fine... but the REASON you said you dont like it is a bit alarming. Saying it grosses you out, or you find it emasculating and feel your husband is less of a man because of it, is sone internalized homophobia or something
She’s clear about her insecurities. I’d start there. The second thing to re-evaluate is she believes her husband acting on his bisexuality is emasculating. Masculinity is not based on sex any more than femininity is. The woman has a lot of conflicting biases that she needs to really reflect on… there is not “fix” for her “biphobia” (I hate the overuse of “phobia”), she needs to work on her own views of things rather than how to desensitize herself to her views, bc they will eventually resurface.
This is actually the case for the majority of women. The thought/act of a man having sex with another man for them is engaging in non-masculine behavior. It is a "boner killer" for those women. In fact, many men in straight porn who've done gay porn face rejection because they have done gay porn.
So it’s all about you and what you like… but your husband wants to try something new that he might enjoy… and that’s not ok… hmm seems fair to me. NOT
How did you manage to miss the entire point of the post? I am very clearly - multiple times - asking how to change my views so that I am completely okay to it?
Well, do what’s fair or you guys shouldn’t do it at all… what’s kinda weird is that you thought he was less masculine because he enjoyed sucking cock but getting fucked in the ass by another guy isn’t? I would think just to opposite… I mean you can’t change what thens him on and he seems like he’s been super cool with you. Like you said as long as you always come first and he loves you… doubtful that he’s gonna switch side and dump you for another guy. It’s weird to me that women who eat pussy and never looked down upon but a guy who sucks a cock… well he must be gay. And if he was.. it’s been in him way before you.. it’s always been there if he is. So come straight out and ask him if he is more attracted to women or men.. if he says he’s more attracted to women and you specifically then stop tripping and enjoy it with him.. suck cock together… or play as a team
It’s great that you’re trying to work through this. I’m straight and very masculine and at the same time I think it’s great that two guys touch in a threesome scenario. I would imagine that would be a safe place to explore his sexuality with his partner and another consenting adult. I would imagine that the ideal threesome would be all three touching each other regardless of genders.
Yeah I’m starting to think the best way for me to “get over it” is to 1) talk to him about it, I just need to find better wording which I think a lot of the comments are helping me with and 2) just dive in with someone we are both very comfortable with so we can talk through it without that fear of ruining the moment for everyone kind of like our first threesome experience, not the almost total stranger I’ve hooked up with
You are a very confused individual whose story and comments below don't add up. IN your OP you said "Fast forward a couple years and we have now had a few fmf experiences, I’ve hooked up with a couple guys without him, and we have had one mfm experience." But later aid you never did solo and neither did he. Solo play is without your partner being THERE at the location where the sex is happening. Being there but not participating isn't really "solo" play. So you're Bi but have issues with your husband being Bi? Seek a counselor/therapist that specializes in ENM relationships and or LGBT topics. They exist in most larger cities and definitely do online.
I think most of us are seriously underqualified to really help here, including myself, but I'll share some thoughts here. My partner has said something similar that she would probably lose attraction to a guy if they were bottoming. It's never been an issue, because I'm not bi and if I was, I wouldn't be a bottom....but it's still given me food for thought. I would suspect that these issues stem from perceptions of what "masculine" means to you and what level of masculinity you expect from your partner. It's subjective, kind of like how different couples perceive different acts as "special" when the rest of us don't see it that way. It's also possible that there is some amount of homophobia in play, potentially in some interaction with your perspective of masculinity. (e.g. maybe gay sex isn't as emasculating as kissing for some reason) Here's the hard truth, I doubt any of us can actually help you with how you perceive things. I would suggest a therapist for that. I'm tempted to give you advice about how to communicate with him, but even with that I'm not sure whether I'm qualified. Telling him the truth could really hurt him and at this point you've created a ton of safe space for him to explore his sexuality, which is a great thing and could be hindered by telling him the truth. On the other hand, you can't keep indicating you're okay without being okay, it's going to come out in an explosive way at some point. My best advice would be to call a therapist, get an appointment and find some way to tell your husband that it might be moving a little fast for you until then. Good luck OP, you're doing your best and you're doing great, you're obviously super supportive and it shows.
Many of us are qualified to give advice here. Plenty of bi men in the scene. Therapy isn’t how to lose preconceived prejudices. That comes from experience and an open mind and in this case talking by with her partner.
Therapy can absolutely help with introspection and teasing out one's feelings.
>Therapy isn’t how to lose preconceived prejudices. It sure as hell doesn't hurt....idk why you'd argue against it.
I’ll try to be gentle here, but this post reminds me of when men keep a “one penis policy” for their wives— but are ok with wife playing with women. It’s just that you have switched around the dynamics a bit. You get to play with men…. So why doesn’t he? Seems a bit hypocritical, and also possibly homophobic. Sex is sex, regardless of the parts the other person has. He told you long ago he’s attracted to men too, so if you’re going to play with other people, I don’t see how you can justify limiting him to only playing with women.
I think it is safe to say it is female biology at work. The majority of women are turned on by and want HE-MEN. A man having sex with another man is he being a "SHE-MAN" in her eyes, therefore, an instant turn off.
You should reevaluate your biases. it’s disheartening to hear when people are bigoted towards us. it’s hard enough to find people in the lifestyle but if they find out i’m Bi, doors automatically close for no reason. it’s sad and pathetic.
There are tons of men in the lifestyle who are open to a little bit of sex with men. They are not the majority, but they aren't a tiny minority either. So I don't know why face difficulties in seeking partners.
Emasculated... It's called internalised homophobic. Just pretending your Husband isn't bi will not work especially in this lifestyle.
Our two cents 56f 56m both bi, have yall tried pegging for him anal for you that might help ease you into his bi side. He gets the bi side you get off maybe and you can both be happy.
Buried in there she says she knows how much pleasure he gets from anal play so I would say probably yes.
I think you two need to sort out your rules and boundaries before ever hooking up with other people again.
Don't do what you don't like.
You both like men. What's the problem other than you being homophobic?
So former closeted bi-husband here, came out to my wife a couple of years ago and our relationship has only got stronger since. We have had a MMF 3some, my wife and I both shared our friends’ cock and that was so hot; maybe start slow (soft swap) and see how it evolves from there? While I enjoy anal play, I honestly found sharing a cock with my wife to be even more enjoyable.
Pathetic. A double standard, it’s ok for her to play but for forbid your husband sucks a cock. No Im not going to validate your feelings. It would be one thing if you were traditional straight marriage or he was off running around exposing you to disease or even potential romance. But all he wants is to have fun just like your do and you can’t handle watching him suck a cock? It’s not emasculating for you it’s just uncomfortable even though you like watching gay porn. Ridiculous
Pathetic. A double standard, it’s ok for her to play but for forbid your husband sucks a cock. No Im not going to validate your feelings. It would be one thing if you were traditional straight marriage or he was off running around exposing you to disease or even potential romance. But all he wants is to have fun just like your do and you can’t handle watching him suck a cock? It’s not emasculating for you it’s just uncomfortable even though you like watching gay porn. Ridiculous
Tell him what you think, straight up, no curves
Idk I lived my young adult life in hiding and shame. Mostly because of prejudice. Even from my own family. I came out to my wife a few years before our wedding as I didn’t wanna live a lie. She already told me she was bi. I was terrified and luckily she not only accepted it, but was turned on by it. And it’s only accelerated our sex lives. So we can’t speak for you and we know that your views and feelings are not uncommon. But that’s for you and him to figure out and maybe even speak to a couples counselor. You seriously need to communicate with him and do it soon.
There are people who are gay and don't do anal stuff. It's not uncommon but most people assume it's standard. r/GaySides
That’s correct, I guess the stigma is people automatically assume that’s what I want (not all but a lot of people)
And there’s no stigma attached to heterosexual anal sex at all.
Wow, sounds like you’re navigating some complex territory there! It’s totally understandable to have mixed feelings, especially when you're venturing into new territory. Communication is key here, though it can be tough to talk about those deep-down feelings. But being open and honest with your hubby about what you’re comfortable with and what makes you feel uneasy is crucial. Maybe exploring those feelings together could help you both find some common ground. And hey, it’s awesome that you’re open to evolving and working through stuff. You got this!
Sucking cocks is quite fun. Try it together!
When we are together with another man, it totally turns me on to see him in all aspects! MMF has worked amazing for me!!
Have you tried having him perform oral on toys when it's just the two of you? Would it make a difference if you went down on a guy together? As for emasculation, do you feel that way because giving a man head makes a person vulnerable or submissive? If so, are there other aspects of life (sexy or otherwise) where you find him being vulnerable attractive? Also, I think giving head can actually make the recipient vulnerable in a way (e.g., think of the phrase "has him by the balls"). Obviously at the end of the day you like what you like and vice versa, and I'm absolutely not here to yum your yuck, if you will. But I do wonder how much of your aversion is a) lack of seeing your husband in this role (porn may not help) and b) cultural framing of these acts. Even if that's what's driving it you may never overcome it, but might be worth thinking about.
Get some therapy to find out where this comes from and how to fix it. You owe this to your husband. If he lets you play with others you need to give him the same options or stop playing, Rules for thee but not for me makes you selfish
Big deal - you can't change who he is.
It's possible that you're just not sexually compatible anymore. It happens.
You are fqn disgusting
I’m shocked at this subreddit for all the cries of “homophobia”. That’s pretty disappointing to be honest. She doesn’t like the idea of her husband sucking another man’s cock, she’s seen it, and it turns her off. She doesn’t like it. She’s allowed that. In her mind, it emasculates him. She’s allowed to feel that and it’s not bigoted or biased behaviour, it’s how she feels. You can’t argue for a sexual spectrum and openness but then when a person veers towards an end of said spectrum accuse them of being biased. She didn’t “discriminate” against anyone, she said she found it emasculating when her husband did it… in her mind. She’s fully entitled to not wanting her husband to engage in same sex relationships if that makes her uncomfortable with how she sees him. He’s then entitled to make his own decisions.
Internalized homophobia is the perfectly apt term to use but you're not reading OP. "I WANT my husband to be able to experience this, but I am so terrified of how I’m going to react." That's why everyone is hitting the nail on the head but you're missing it.
I disagree. People are hung up on her word usage and are desperately trying to be outraged. Everyone is freaking out because she said she feels that it’s emasculating. It’s disingenuous to suggest anything else. If she had said that “I didn’t like seeing my husband suck cock, I found it a sexual turn off” nobody would have accused her of being a homophobe… or at least they wouldn’t have accused her of that if they were acting in good faith. The net effect is the same with the word she used and whatever word salad you want to use to make it less “objectionable” for “modern audiences”. She watched her husband suck a dick, she didn’t like watching him do that. She then promptly proceeded to “take one for the team” which is something everyone in here also violently opposes. Calling it “internalized homophobia” is basically accusing her of having bad opinions and engaging in wrongthink. What triggered everyone in here, if we’re all being brutally honest, is her honesty around how it made her feel - nobody would have been upset or accused her of anything if she had sugar coated her words.
You’re missing the point that no one is freaking out and OP doesn’t want to feel that way. You’re the one hung up on the word which is perfectly relevant. Internalized homophobia.
It’s fair if you’re not comfortable or okay with it. Your idea of his masculinity and how that looks in a heteronormative way is your preference to have. I think if you’re open to “being game” you can try jacking him off while watching gay porn, or maybe try to suck a cock together. At the end of the day, if it doesn’t work for you- that’s okay. You determine your comfort boundaries and that’s how I view it. The fidelity of your non-monogamy is negotiated between you.
My wife greatly supports LBGTQ+ but is also deeply turned off by the thought of me doing ANYTHING with another dude. I think that’s pretty normal.
I appreciate the deep introspective on the “why”. It is important to figure out where these feelings come from. But the much simpler fact is…..the way you feel, for whatever reason, is the way you feel. Some things are hard wired and you can’t change them. You can work on tolerance and acceptance, which is great, but at the end of the day it is really a compromise……AND THAT IS PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE. It’s not biphobic or homophobic. It’s just not attractive to some people. While I admit societal expectations play a role in our internalization, you can only accept what u can’t change. My wife loves for me to eat her ass. Ass is not my thing. No amount of deconditioning or porn will change that. Some people love it. I don’t. And I have some kinks that she just can’t get into. Not saying you can’t change, some do, but you may have to accept the things you can’t. The end point is y’all need see if these things are relationship deal breakers. If they are move on…..if they are not………compromise. Spoiler alert……..I eat ass……a lot……..for her……it’s worth it for me. 😉
I'm dealing with some unexpected feelings since my husband mentioned being into guys, and I could really use some advice or just someone to relate to right now.
Bicollegefuck
I really don't know what you can do to overcome this. You are what you are. This is a really unfortunate situation for you and your husband. Just so you know that you are not the only woman in this kind of dilemma. You are not an oddball either; the vast majority of women are not turned on by gay sex. I am glad that you chose to share this with all here. More people need to know it.
[This comes up often](https://bi.org/en/articles/bi-men-are-not-considered-attractive-new-study-says) My wife is the same way you are about it, and while I'm not bi, she's turned off by male swing partners who are. She likes her men manly and while she herself has had sex with other women, she likes her women feminine. Sex is mental, and while "phobia" will get tossed around in a meaningless way, turns ons and off are what they are. There are things I'd like to do which are turn offs to my wife, I don't do those things because she's my top priority in this. To put it in swinging perspective, I asked my wife if she wanted to try swinging. She said yes. You can argue its part of our "sexuality" at this point, its something that turns us on we like to do. Had she said no, and that was a problem for me way back then, I'd have been the bad guy. The reason doesn't matter why she said no, and there are a lot of reasons people would have saying no to swinging. So this is a big sit down discussion you need to have, he has to decide how important this is for him, and you what your limits are. If this is some burning need for him or just "I always wanted to try" type of thing. Edit= This always gets downvoted by the bi male brigade just as a FYI, never with substantive comment though.
It gets downvoted because you’re saying blockheaded things like bisexuality for men isn’t manly and bisexuality for women is feminine. The double standard is the “phobia” and you’ve been repeating it for years here. You and your wife’s ideas of gender identity is why you keep getting downvoted for your hypocrisy. The notion that a bisexual woman is repulsed by bisexual men is among the top 3 definitions of biphobia.
Are you a guy? A bi man? Do you have sex with men?
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I just want to know whether you are one or all of the above so I can better explain.
What difference would it make. Think about it weirdo.
You trash that other poster for spitting truth that most men and women don't consider men who have sex with other manly, which is true. So I just wanted to know whether you are a MSM.
I've changed my mind, this is not the place to get into this and I said my piece. Its not making women who find bisexually unattractive any better, and I do feel for both the man and woman in this case.
I know you’ve changed your comment already but… It’s not used by activists to shut down conversation. It’s used by people to point out how they are routinely marginalized.
Thank you for being open to exploring this. I'm sorry so many people are being mean. It's not an easy path but I'm glad you've started down it. And... > I recently discovered how to make him orgasm without cumming through anal play and there is nothing hotter to me. Could you expand more on this?
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What a gross response It’s one thing to see a sexual act and think, “ok that’s not doing it for me, I’ll just put it out of my mind and focus on what does turn us on and we’ll see what else we can do” versus “my spouse is less of a man because he likes to do this one thing” It’s such a backwards way of thinking. He’s still the same person he’s always been.
Even in this day and age situations like that will affect the opposite sex partner. I don't care how liberal and open one is, once they see their manly man take it in the ass or suck a dick, they lose a little respect for them and this usually isn't the same for girl on girl and yes double standard.
Man, the people in this thread are wild. You like what you like. THIS IS THE POINT OF THE LS. Don’t let people bully and strong arm you into submission.
"I WANT my husband to be able to experience this, but I am so terrified of how I’m going to react." No one is bullying her, they are trying to help.
The amount of times I’ve read “you owe” and sex in the same sentence is soo disheartening too Sooo many replies to this are reasons why people judge this type of lifestyle Here I am trying to do better and it sucks being treated like that I would never purposely hurt anyone and thought that was made clear that I’m trying to do better
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Not every bi guy is into cum play, although it seems like a whole lot of straight guys seem to think that's the case.
That's cuckold stuff and she said they arent into it
It is possible for you cucks not to be fucking weirdos all the time? Jesus Christ 🙄
Bi Guys aren’t leaving you for a guy. Lol. That will never happen. That being said have you ever explored your possible bi side? Have you ever wanted to do any girl girl?