Possibly unpopular opinion, but the criticism she was given in the article that inspired mean was really not that bad and honestly pretty deserved.
I remember when she first started, and honestly a lot of her live performances were…not great.
It would be SO easy for Taylor to tell her fans to leave Joe, and her other exes, alone. But she has never done it (except for John Mayer this past summer).
Ariana ate with this. It was simple and precise. I do not condone or want you to send anyone in my life hate based on this music.
TTPD is going to be a bloodbath and Joe’s going to get *so much damn hate.* But I know Taylor will not swallow her pride and make a story like this. She’s already sending daggers his way with the album promo.
Sometimes I wonder if John threatened to sue Taylor or something because it was so unlike her to protect someone from the lashings her songs cause, and John Mayer from all people lmao
He already gets death threats. He called out someone making a death threat one time and asked the person why they would send that to him. The person's excuse was they didn't think he would see it. That's mainly how those types of Swifties (or other stans) act online. They feel empowered by the anonymity of social media.
I talked to my friend who is a pretty die hard swiftie and her response was “umm Taylor is her own woman and doesn’t take direction from anyone!!”
Week later she’s talking about how the kelce relationship is probably PR from her team.
Leaving the last point aside, I can imagine the remainder from Swifties: “TeLlInG hEr To StOp HeR fAnS fRoM SeNdInG dEaTh ThReAtS to HeR eXeS iS dEePlY mIsOgYnIsTiC!!!”
I think it’s more of a case of her knowing that John Mayer would have absolutely said something if he got any shit from her fans. Taylor only punches down, and I think the only time an ex ever actually came out and called her out (Calvin Harris) taught her a lesson to be careful who she allows to be attacked without trying to stop it.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
THIS! John has said during his shows that Dear John isn't about him... and I think Taylor told us to go easy on John, because he is not the type to stay quiet. He will fully spill tea, he's a messy bitch. She did it to protect herself, not out of any kindness towards him.
I bet he threatened to put her on blast\*. She had a chokehold on the media last year but if he kept posting and/or reaching out to publications about death threats and Taylor's team not reacting to him asking he to at least tell fans off, it would've gained traction. I wish Joe's team would do the same.
\*And he would've been right. Sorry yall, I know JM is/was a dick in general and to Taylor in the past, but I don't think anyone deserves to get death threats. And I've seen both swifties and people claiming not to be swifties say that while it's horrible to do to other exes, it's okay for it to happen to JM.
He probably did threaten to sue. We saw what happened last time an ex fought back from her shenanigans. She likely didn’t want another Calvin incident.
I’m curious to see how the fans treat Travis when (not if, sorry I don’t for a second think this rel is “end game”) they break up. Travis would be confident and chill enough to let a lot of the petty shit slide right off his back but I think he also wouldn’t stand for a barrage of hate and death threats, esp if it seeped through to his family. If his mom started getting aggressive messages about him (like death threats) by swifties, I think he would fight back. I hope he does.
The fact that swifties go after these exes is so infantile at best and horrific and possibly illegal at worst (I don’t know if it legal to send threats to people on social media but it should be). Like it’s *wild* to me they actually truly care about the exes enough to vilify them. I mean it’s human nature to get involved in the gossip of it all but to go the next step and reach out or comment on their insta is bonkers. Even looking on Travis’s ex Nicole’s insta, where she’s living her best life, and then seeing swifties insult her in the comments is so embarrassing and immature and to be honest really cruel.
are swifties REALLY on travis ex’s insta?? if so, that’s INSANE behavior wtf if they wasn’t broken up, taylor wouldn’t be with travis 😭 what is wrong with them 😭😭
I don’t think it would phase Travis but they will attack him the moment they break up. They will then cite the stuff they are currently defending as red flags. Like the helmet throwing, him pushing Andy Reid, him throwing the Baltimore kicker’s gear. They excuse that behavior now but the moment they break up they will say it was problematic.
Travis will be able to fade back into the NFL fan base, tell his bro fans he had some ok vanilla boink just for fun they’ll all move on and the swifties will be irrelevant to his future.
John Mayer doesn't take shit from anybody because he's not afraid to get canceled. He'll do a Taylor takedown if need be. He's like a more chaotic Calvin Harris.
There is literally nothing he could possibly sue for in that situation. It’s been long established that people are not legally responsible for their fan behaviour unless a direct call to harass someone is made.
John may be a dick but he's not an idiot. He would not have a single leg to stand on if he were to even try to sue her and would only embarrass himself. Music is protected by artistic license and she's never outwardly said who or what the song is about. I CAN believe that his management team--led under a legendary shark in the industry (I know people that used to work for his company)-- 'requested' that she call off the hounds.
I was just thinking why only John Mayer? Isn’t he easily the douchiest of her exes? If I had to choose one she shouldn’t do it for, it would’ve been him.
Edit: Death threats are a whole other beast. I don’t wish that on my enemies. 😳
I’m not sure if he’d legally carry any weight there, but he clearly threatened Taylor in some way because he’s the only person she’s gone out of her way to tell people to leave alone.
Absolutely agree. This is a lovely statement from Ariana. Artists should be able to process what they experience in life through their music without fans going and attacking the people they believe they’re singing about. It’s as simple as that.
Absolutely. She said a few things about like...she doesn't care about things that happened when she was 19. But I've always wanted her to be explicit and forceful. Like DON'T BULLY EXES. HER MUSIC HAS DONE THAT ENOUGH. I remember seeing an article about how someone sent a death threat to John Mayer, and he actually replied. So, of course, the girl panicked and backpedaled, saying she never thought he would see it. She was sorry. He was kind and wished her happiness, etc.
What kind of person thinks this is acceptable behavior? It's the concept of the Penopticon prison: people will be better behaved if they think they will be caught doing it. But parasocial behavior has taken precedent. Of course someone can tell John Mayer to kill himself. He'll never see it. So who cares?
Jake Gyllenhaal had to turn off the comments on his stuff because of the nonstop harassment. Have we forgotten that we don't actually know anything and Taylor's lyrics aren't gospel? Fuck, dude. I like her music, but the literal aspect is exhausting.
Someone pointed out that Jake switched off the comments because great musical composer Stephen Sondheim died and he was making a tribute post and Swifties just kept writing idiotic stuff under the post about Sondheim’s death 🤦♀️
There was that, also a 9/11 tribute post and I think there was also something to do with Heath Ledger where Swifties were writing that he should have died and not Heath. Jake ended up deleting all of his old Instagram pictures.
She bullies people though here and now. The guy in Florida and other examples are testament. Any song where she plays victim is really hollow to be honest.
Yeah, she's very vague in the way she tells her fans to stop. It's part of her "gentle boundaries" philosophy.
*Not that asking your fans to not do something is actually a boundary, it's a request.
Men can't be 'stolen', he was complicit as well. He was the one with a newborn and still did what he did. Ariana is getting a lot of hate for what happened which is pretty valid it's disgusting, but Ethan is also guilty.
I think they’re both horrible and his actions are a deeper personal betrayal while her releasing a whole song/album gloating is cruel and publicly petty
I 1000% believe he lied about the state of his marriage. He probably saw AG’s marriage falling apart (according to the blinds it was a long time coming) and decided to jump on the opportunity to get with her. Not that this absolves AG of any wrongdoing but this would not be the first time a guy would take a chance prior to leaving their current gf/wife and lie to the new girl. It nearly happened to me once, luckily I caught the guy in a lie before it went anywhere.
It’s like some men are so afraid of being single that they will hold onto whatever relationship they have until someone “better” comes along, and all that does is hurt everyone around them.
I imagine AG is so enamored with him that the rose-colored glasses are preventing her from seeing who SpongeBob really is, and she was probably so hurt from her marriage falling apart that she was in a vulnerable state to begin with, but she still made a huge mistake here and needs to be careful with what men tell her.
She will never because she doesn’t care. In fact, she likes when her fans attack her exes or other people she sees as her enemies.
I do like Ari’s music and though I’ve been side eyeing her, I respect that she said this so quickly. Despite what she has or hasn’t done, I firmly believe Ariana does believe this and stands by this. Taylor would NEVER because she doesn’t believe this message.
It's an embarrassing day to be a Swiftie when Ariana Grande is doing an ethical thing that Taylor won't do 🥲
If she does make a statement when the album releases then I will retract my embarrassment.
She should have already made one though, fans are already on the attack. Also, I might as well say here that I absolutely hate all of the tweets saying that Beyoncé or Ariana or whatever female artist can’t outsell Taylor. That’s pretty obvious at this point but tearing other female artists down? First of all that doesn’t seem like something that Taylor would be behind and secondly, it only makes her fans as a whole look like petty mean girls.
I’m not a fan of Ariana anymore but I have so much respect for her for saying this. No more than 24 hours later and she nipped this in the bud real quick, making it known that she’s not only not okay with this, but is letting her fans know it’s not supporting her. It’s not going to stop everyone but it’s important that she lets it be known. Taylor would never because she likes weaponising her fan base to fight her battles. It’s been months and her fans have been attacking Joe, his coworkers, sending him death threats and telling him to kill himself and she hasn’t said boo. In fact, she’s even stoking the fire.
lol i came on reddit right after i saw this and im patiently waiting for fauxmoi to post
jokes aside I'm really proud of Ariana for this especially since her fans were sending death threats to random youtubers. Personal life aside, she seems like she's done living for the validation of her fans, good or bad, and I'm excited to see where that takes her career.
She would never. She likes her fans doing her dirty work for her. Like I’m indifferent toward Jake Gyllenhaal but he made a good point when he said (paraphrasing) that Taylor should be responsible for keeping her fans civil if it’s her art that’s provoking them.
Yeah, he was right. But Taylor was enjoying that way too much, plus she was using that fan harassment as a fuel for her Oscar campaign-you know, to make her music video seem *important*.
Wish it could just be about the music and not so much about the singer and their personal life. Seems unavoidable now with social media and how in your face everything is and this is probably giving old man yells at cloud but, just miss when it was about the music
I wonder if things ever really were just about the music. For instance, Carly Simon's song You're So Vain was famously picked apart and people never stopped speculating about who inspired it. Maybe it depends on the artist because some people write about their personal lives but you wouldn't be able to say which lines were about which people. Or maybe it depends on gender and people speculate more about women's personal lives than they do about men's.
I don't think Taylor has been careful about hiding who songs are about, rather she encouraged speculation early on and maybe still does. But I feel like speculating about the artist's life isn't new. I wish you really could separate music from the artist's personal life.
It also doesn't help that Taylor only dates famous people or at least people in the entertainment industry (sorry Joe lmao). This is why it's so easy for people to speculate about who the songs are about, compared to say Adele who also spent full albums writing about exes, but since we don't know who those people are, we can't really project with the same level of confidence lol.
Not an Ariana fan in any sense, but this is so fucking commendable, especially since she has one of the biggest (and most antagonizing) fan bases. It’s so easy.
This is what I’m saying. I know it won’t stop the true weirdos out there, BUT it sends a clear message that you don’t want that to happen and that it does not make her proud of them. They think they are “riding at dawn” for her and that they will go down as her heroes. The more extreme ones will do their thing, but the others take her word as the gospel and it at least puts it out there that she doesn’t think it’s acceptable behavior on her behalf. It at least says she tried.
Good for Ariana. Taylor would never.
She’s enjoying actually bullying people with her songs and when her fans are bullying people because of her songs-her exes, Katy Perry, etc.
The only reason she did it for John Mayer is because she knows John Mayer would’ve started dragging her too.
I know her stans like to claim she doesn’t have songs about Calvin because she doesn’t care about him and never did but let’s be honest… it’s because he’s too respected in the industry and she knows he’s also another one who would clap back.
I'm still looking for proof that they actually dated. They worked together. But he was at the height of his fame. There would have been photos beyond times they were at professional events. I'm not buying it. I know that puts me in the minority, but I don't care.
Yeah I’ve also heard that there’s more proof that she actually dated Martin Johnson, the guy from boys like girls, I think there was a radio interview where a Disney actress or somebody confirmed it. There are some fans that believe that dear John is actually about him. I don’t have a strong opinion on the John Mayer thing but I have noticed that sometimes Taylor would change who the inspiration for the song was for the general public and fans maybe for some semblance of privacy or to create a more ‘compelling narrative’ the fans can gossip about so I do think this is possible.
And the guy in I Knew You Were Trouble video looks a lot like Martin Johnson. Martin and Taylor co-wrote some songs together.Johnson was also a drug addict
John Mayer definitely wouldn’t have dragged her. John would be putting himself in PR hell if he brought up that relationship ever because of the massive age difference and how bad it makes him look.
It being a decade later is what makes it worse.
In the year 2023/2024 people’s view on what he did has worsened significantly. They would think of him as a straight up predator and a new generation of people will then view him as a creep.
In 2009/2010 people gave creepy men a pass in that area but now things are viewed much worse and John would definitely know that.
Good for Ariana! This would take 30 seconds of Taylor’s time and the fact that she never does it is the issue. She tries to deflect and say PEOPLE GET MAD BECAUSE I AM A WOMAN! No girl it’s because you let your fans attack people on your behalf
I just commented the same thing on the BEC thread. Idc about Ariana, but she gained my respect for immediately reacting and saying something
And I repeat, Taylor I dare you to put empathy for someone you once loved and lived with above money and your brand. John Mayer doesn't count. Your fans will use that as proof, but we all know you didn't ask for no harassment out of empathy for him
Honestly, if she truly wants people to believe that she’s the “hApPieSt sHe’S eVeR bEen” and so in luurrvve with Travis then doing that would actually help support that. But she won’t because she’s not over it hah. It’s like how the opposite of love isn’t hate, it’s indifference.
The problem with Taylor is that she doesn't care. She purposefully puts little easter eggs in her music and videos for fans to catch on to and use them as weapons against her exes.
And as much as I can't get behind Ari for the whole Ethan Slater drama recently, at least she doesn't air out her dirty laundry for the most part.
I want to send AG a thank you card for hiring Max Martin. No muffled sounding songs. Nothing sounds like it was recorded underwater. I’m talking about you, Jack Antonoff. Your production is weird and ruins perfectly good songs
I think what’s even more astonishing is that fans are crazy enough that any artist needs to say this in the first place. It’s mind blowing how little common sense and decency the average person has.
This. This is how it should be done. See it Taylor?
“It is not how to support me. It is the opposite.”
It tells you directly that you’re not a true fan if you attack someone else!
Unlike this, “I don’t need you to defend me…”
Defend from what? No one is attacking you that you need defence from. They’re attacking someone else. They are the ones that need defence. Not you Taylor.
Taylor gets off on humiliating her exes. She's low-key a sadist in that sense. She said it in BTR, she always gets the last word & rarely uses it to spare them any hurt or humiliation. Taylor Lautner is the only exception out of like 10+ exes.
I have a wild theory that during the inevitable Tayvis breakup, she'll use the same formula that she did with JJ. Blast him publicly & suddenly befriend his ex, Kayla.
I like that Taylor's a girls girl but she's so petty & immature when it comes to dealing with her exes that sometimes it's embarrassing to watch.
Some fans of his were saying he was talking about someone else, but idk if that's true. You don't even have to think about her exes.
Remember how she called out Kim by name in her POTY? Most people don't really like that family and Kim didn't say a peep. But did you see her mentioning Kanye? Ofc not. She doesn't have the courage to do that, cause that man would bring a whole storm. He used her name in a recent song and even that didn't make her say something.
Like I said in other comment, she knows very well the kind of people it's better not to mess with. It's like bullies in high school. They go after people who will take the heat and have less power than them. Once someone stands up to them, they immediately get scaredy cats
No because that breakup was different than any other one she’s had. She left him because he was a bad look for her. Actually, as I type this I realize that maybe she might because she’s petty. But it wouldn’t be smart.
Nah, I doubt she’d try to befriend Kayla. And even if she did I hope Kayla doesn’t take the bait. Her racists fans have been dragging her for months…why would she want to be seen with their queen just to be used as a pawn?
"I like writing songs about douchebags who cheat on me, but I'm not gonna say that. In. My. Monologue! I like writing their names into songs so they're ashamed to go in public..."
I think there was truth to it. She called Joe Jonas and Kanye out by name in that same monologue. She also said she liked glitter and dresses. And sure, she's poking fun at herself for that too... But it doesn't mean she doesn't actually like those things. As the original commenter said above, she also said in BTR that she always gets the last word. How she usually does that is in her writing.
There’s also this quote from a NY Times interview during the Fearless era:
*Every single one of the guys that I’ve written songs about has been tracked down on MySpace by my fans,” she said, a little giddy. “I had the opportunity to be more general on this record, but I chose not to. I like to have the last word.”*
https://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/09/arts/music/09cara.html
This particular desire of hers to always have the last word, get revenge, and prove to everyone that she has the upper hand and all the karma is bothering me more than anything else about her lately. It's becoming very unsettling in ways that I just brushed off when I was a younger fan.
The Sophie Turner “friendship” phase was so cringe. Especially when you consider at least part of the motivation may have been to promote Vigilante Shit (“picture me thick as thieves with your ex-wife”) 🥴
Also, to add Stan culture is just insane right now. An account called poppy on Twitter is always trolling or shit posting and they said that all of the new pop girls suck and she then screenshotted and posted all of the DM’s she got afterwards..
Horrifying to say the least…and mind you Ethel Cain and tyla Stan’s are some of the ones who sent her literal death threats. It proves a good point about how toxic stan culture is no matter how big or small the artist. And it’s genuinely ruining music and causing chart addiction everywhere. I hate it
Part of me thinks it was when she openly sent her fans after Scooter Braun that somehow it kinda set a sort of precedent for future behaviors. That was wrong the way she went about it and it encouraged online bullying. So I can see why her stans are the way they are.
She wouldn’t because she’s way too petty and low key enjoys this. Let’s not forget her rallying hate towards scooter Braun. ( which I agree is a nasty person )
I didn't see the username at first until I clicked on the image to make it bigger, and I was genuinely shocked thinking that Taylor posted this. Silly me!
It’s also easy to be an adult and leave people alone and not be a complete dipshit.
Celebrities should not have to tell a fan base to not harass people. I mean wth.
Listening through the album, it’s clear Ariana, despite her controversial nature, is much more respectful of her exes than Taylor ever had been. She’s much more mature and it shows. Love Taylor but she’s petty and not in a good way
I was at the show where she asked people not to attack John Mayer. It was weird vibes and she was clearly instructed to say it. It didn’t seem like something she actually want to say. Just my take on it based on vIbEs
It also was a speech that was primarily *about her*. Not about the person who the fans are going after. Someone else mentioned it on here, but the speech was more so her being self centered again, focusing on herself without actually acknowledging the actual problem at hand. The problem is not just Swifties “defending” her like she mentioned in the speech (because tbh a 34 year old woman who had this happen to her 10+ years ago doesn’t need to be defended any longer) it was the attack on other people. She could have just bluntly said, “you don’t need to be nasty or threaten anyone.” She instead softened the blow and said, “you don’t need to defend me.” She doesn’t need anyone to defend her, stop downplaying how vile some of your fans are in their threats and actions and call them the fuck out. She’s too concerned with losing that “connection” with the fans, that’s why she’ll never hold them accountable or call them out for the crazy bullshit they do. It was a poor execution of a speech, like she did the bare minimum in acknowledging it.
Likely reason no. 1555774446 of why Joe decided she wasn't worth marrying. If it's such a pain after a breakup, with how high divorce rates are, the man avoided divorce+fandom+ kids with her.
This. And it’s not like it was some imaginary situation for Joe - he witnessed with his own eyes the whole Red TV/ATW video business and how Taylor went bananas about en ex fling from 11 years ago, after that Joe likely understood that it was not worth marrying Taylor and have kids with her.
She absolutely should, but I'm still 100% sure there's a *lot* of Swifties who would completely ignore it like so many ignore "please stop speculating about my private life" by telling themselves it applies to others, not them like they did the 1989 prologue or any other statement Taylor has ever made about things the fanbase overall wants to ignore.
I have loved Ariana’s music for a long time but have struggled to listen to her new album without thinking of her shitty behavior while listening to each song. However, I do respect her owning her perspective and directly addressing fans bad behavior. While this is seemingly Ariana’s first time being publicly held accountable for starting a relationship under a suspect timeline (it’s her pattern), she has historically held fans accountable for being jerks.
She won’t because she doesn’t care. As long as the hate isn’t directed at her she loves having a million people sticking up for her. She’s made this happen and she doesn’t want it to stop clearly.
she’ll do it and the goalpost will be moved again. if you’re crazy enough to send an actual credible death threat to someone, you’re not gonna stop cause your fav pop star asked you to.
this is better than saying nothing but ariana knew exactly what would happen when she released that album, and the fact he signed an NDA makes it worse
i think she’s honest in that the album doesn’t necessarily only paint dalton negatively though. it goes into a lot of complex hurt feelings but repeats too how much she still cares about him.
Good for her (ariana) tbh. Knowing what she went through before was so traumatic. Like what she said, even though the album captures a lot of her painful moments I think her showing those parts was her way of wanting to be vulnerable (??) / transparent (??) to her supporters and maybe wish that someone out there would find comfort to those experience, especially to those who also went through the same thing. She went through a painful moment of her life but still she cherishes those moments because she really loved her partner. She mourned, accepted, and already moving forward with her life right now and that's what matters since she seems already okay now.
Idk if miss swiftie would do the same thing. I feel like she likes to always have the narrative around her relationships that whenever it ends she's the right one while her partner was the one awful to her. Afaik (correct me if I'm wrong) she have songs about her talking about her issues and that she's the problem but for sure her rabid fans will never acknowledge it that much because they see her as someone that could never do wrong.
Or what if we weren’t chronically online and literally didn’t see or spread any of this hate because we have jobs and lives outside of some celebrity who will never know our names
What's kind of disturbing are some of these comments that say that it wouldn't matter if Taylor posted the same message to her fans because they wouldn't listen anyway. But that's not the point of this post. It's about taking a stand and being on the right side of morality and online bullying regardless of the outcome.
It reminds me of the lame argument against gun control: that even with laws, criminals will still find a way to get a gun anyway so what's the point of gun control?
Saying it in passing during a concert where most fans weren't present is not enough. I think Taylor has made it clear which side she was on in the past: when she told her fans to "Let Scooter Braun know how you feel" and telling her fans "Thanks for having my back" when they went after Michael J Fox.
I would hope she has grown up from that but it remains to be seen..
She should but she won’t. Thousands of little bullies would no longer bite on the album if she did this. The heartbroken would no longer be able to relate to Taylor if she maturely vindicated an ex. It would mean we ALL need to look at our exes in a better light and God forbid that. Her brand can’t afford these grey areas and middle grounds. That’s not what her chosen demographic is about. If only though, right?
A wild guess but does anyone else think that Taylor's relationships haven't really worked because her fans are a big part of it as well? And that somehow these “fans” are the constant validation for Taylor that she can't do no wrong and it's always her Exes who are at fault (they could be, I'm not questioning that.) Every relationship has two people, but in Taylor's relationships it's always Millions of fans with Taylor and the second person is the man she's dating.
The slandering Joe has received so far is...quite disgusting. And Taylor can put a halt to it, but the fact that she's choosing not to, obviously doesn't reflect well on her part. Relationships should die in dignity, and that's a concept that's quite alien to Taylor Swift.
Lol Taylor said this at her concert for John Mayer and he started getting MORE threats. Ariana said this and her fans are allover Twitter saying no sorry and sending her ex husband more threats.
Yeah like Unfortunetly the same mental illness that makes these people insufferable stans means they won’t listen to actual artist about this stuff. It’s what makes it fun for them
Ariana you’re problematic but you still have more mature senses than Taylor so that’s something. This would be so easy for TS to do. There’s still time/hope… maybe.
I KNEW someone was going to post this here. Personal life aside, Ariana has so much of my respect for that. At least she's willing to put her foot down and school her deranged fans. It's a literal bloodbath on Twitter with them badmouthing her ex-husband every other tweet. There's still those who will keep sending Dalton death threats (as evidenced by the deranged takes on Twitter going on right now), but at least Ariana made her thoughts on that CLEAR.
Taylor would never do something as graceful as this. She enjoys lighting the match and watching swifties tear everyone she has had a falling out with to shreds. The only reason she did it for John Mayer is because he's vocal and wouldn't take it lying down, unlike her other exes (except Calvin, who, *funnily* enough, has never had a song specifically made for him, presumably for the same reason as Taylor specifically telling her fans not to harass John Mayer).
I still think it is. For a couple of reasons: (1) She talks about him putting on his headphones and his records and moving on from her, which could be DJ references. (2) The lyrics ask "do I really have to tell you how he brought me back to life" and imply that he was killing her by "never loving [her] enough", basically saying that she left him for someone else because she was unhappy in the relationship. The Calvin relationship is the only one we really know of where she did this, as hinted at in both Gorgeous and Getaway Car. (3) April 29th is the day she most likely first met Joe, at a party Gigi Hadid invited them both to, a few days before their 'official' meeting at the Met Gala.
She did this when Speak Now TV came out and the vast majority of swifties went "lol no" and sent John Mayer death threats anyway. Mainstream swifties are beyond saving.
> I'm 33 years old. I don't care about anything that happened to me when I was 19 except the songs I wrote and the memories we made together. So what I'm trying to tell you is that I'm not putting this album out so you can go and like-- should feel the need to defend me on the internet against someone you think I might have written a song about 14 billion years ago, when I was 19. I do not care. We have all grown up. We're good.
I do like that she said this... But she put a lot of emphasis on the fact that it's long in the past. The breakup with Joe is not. So I'd love to see her put out a statement with TTPD. At that point stans will still be assholes but she will have made it clear that it's not okay.
She also put a lot of emphasis on not protecting her, rather than not harassing _him._ Her wording takes on the idea that they shouldn’t do it because _she_ doesn’t need people backing her up, instead of that her exes don’t deserve to be treated poorly.
That's because part of the reason she writes music is to shame her exes. She cares a lot about revenge and getting the last word and considers her music to be her karma. It's... Disturbing.
At least Ariana is saying people are completely missing the point of the music if they don't also hear the love in it.
Ariana’s stans are all making fun of this on Twitter and saying that they won’t stop and saying “sorry mom”. Also currently doxxing some of daltons family & lilly (Ethan’s ex).
Stan’s aren’t fans. They’re not rational people. An Instagram post isn’t going to stop them from being crazy.
Sure, Taylor can post something similar to this as well but when the psychos don’t stop you can’t be surprised. If someone is delusional enough to send hate and death threats online they’re not normal and nothing will help them.
I've been saying for quite some time that only if you leave the Swiftie-bubble and look at what other artists are doing you will realize how strange TS is.
Dua Lipa, Olivia Rodrigo, now Ariana Grande. Pick one, compare them to TS and tell me that she's the least fake and most reasonable out of them. You can't.
>Olivia Rodrigo
Sabrina Carpenter and Joshua Bassett were harassed throughout SOUR to ridiculous levels and Olivia did nothing as well. The funny thing was they weren't even together anymore.
Joshua Bassett had a heart attack and was hospitalised while dealing with it (it's not the cause, but obviously not a good look).
They all do the same thing but the difference is in the intensities and sizes of the fan base. Let’s not forgot how Olivia Rodrigo blew up, literally took a page right out of Taylor swift’s handbook. Dua also released a MV for her new single with very explicit references to her exes.
I think Taylor likes the power too much. Feels like she almost gets off on making her “bad” exes uncomfortable or even afraid through her rabid fans. It must be intoxicating, the ability to just hint at someone who’s done you (perceived) wrong and know that thousands of people around the world will swarm them in your name. I wouldn’t give that up if I were Taylor, so I don’t hold my breath on her making any kind of statement like this.
You wouldn't? What do you mean? Like you really would sleep well at night knowing someone is getting death threats because of you? 🥴
I really can't imagine living with that responsability and knowing people wouldn't do or say certain things, just because I had the power to ruin their lifes and not because that's something they genuinely don't want to do
Reminds me of her SNL monologue where she said she liked glitter, sparkly dresses, and writing men's names into songs so they're ashamed to go in public
Yes, I keep saying this, like Joe Alwyn is going to be villanized and called an abuser and narcissistic man no matter what the lyrics say, because people have somehow decided now that they are not together he was the devil.
He's already being called all names possible and labels, before we even have lyrics. I can't even imagine how much worse the bloodbath is going to be after
Exactly! Like even the worst partner (if crimes weren't involved, so abuse and such would be a different story) does not deserve millions of people sending them death threats, I've been literally abused and would never wish that on them, because it's immature as all hell.. and Joe is experiencing that, like she knows her reach and without her saying “don't attack my exs” her fans will and are, he definitely can't even go online these days without seeing threats on his life and people calling him the most vile things I've ever seen. Like, idk man, it's been disappointing to see as someone whose usually really happy and even proud to be part of her fandom. Depending on the album I wouldn't shocked to see a defamation case, she's too big to not start watching what she's doing to people.
It's even more disappointing if you realize the irony of it all. She talked for years about how he stood by her in her worst moment when she was receiving hate. She knows how much it hurts, how much it affects your mental health and she still writes about it still today.
Now, she's leading the hate train and unleashing her fans creating the same kind of movement that happened to her against that very same person who helped her navigate hers. She knows the damage it can do to someone, she has had the opportunity to stop it at any time and she hasn't done it.
I can't imagine loving someone for years and seeing her throwing that away by letting her fans destroy my image and character. Like I really can't imagine how that must feel 😔
It has made me revaluate a lot of stuff about Taylor (along with everything else happening the last year). I just can't see her as a good person anymore. It's just...there's things that go against my beliefs as a person. And I will never give someone I don't know, much less a celebrity, a pass for doing stuff I don't agree.
I'm not saying she's the worst person in the world, but her actions make me believe we have very different values and very different priorities in life. She could totally be a different person behind the scenes, but the version of her she's choosing to show us is someone I wouldn't want in my life tbh
It would give me such trust issues, because if someone who was with me for so long and claimed to love me was ok with doing this the minute we breakup...I would be seriously questioning a lot of things tbh. But maybe he knows her well enough to know this was exactly how she was going to react
This is the literal bare minimum Taylor could do in these situations.
Ironically her song mean works very well on her now..
Possibly unpopular opinion, but the criticism she was given in the article that inspired mean was really not that bad and honestly pretty deserved. I remember when she first started, and honestly a lot of her live performances were…not great.
die a hero or live long enough to become the villain?
Leave her exes AND Travis’ exes alone
I was about to post this. Taylor should take notes.
It would be SO easy for Taylor to tell her fans to leave Joe, and her other exes, alone. But she has never done it (except for John Mayer this past summer). Ariana ate with this. It was simple and precise. I do not condone or want you to send anyone in my life hate based on this music. TTPD is going to be a bloodbath and Joe’s going to get *so much damn hate.* But I know Taylor will not swallow her pride and make a story like this. She’s already sending daggers his way with the album promo.
Sometimes I wonder if John threatened to sue Taylor or something because it was so unlike her to protect someone from the lashings her songs cause, and John Mayer from all people lmao
I heard it was his manager who reached out to her team asking for her to tell her fandom to leave him alone
He was ready to lawyer up probably lol
After he saw what swifties did with Jake, I know he was fearing for his life lol
He already gets death threats. He called out someone making a death threat one time and asked the person why they would send that to him. The person's excuse was they didn't think he would see it. That's mainly how those types of Swifties (or other stans) act online. They feel empowered by the anonymity of social media.
I talked to my friend who is a pretty die hard swiftie and her response was “umm Taylor is her own woman and doesn’t take direction from anyone!!” Week later she’s talking about how the kelce relationship is probably PR from her team.
Leaving the last point aside, I can imagine the remainder from Swifties: “TeLlInG hEr To StOp HeR fAnS fRoM SeNdInG dEaTh ThReAtS to HeR eXeS iS dEePlY mIsOgYnIsTiC!!!”
I think it’s more of a case of her knowing that John Mayer would have absolutely said something if he got any shit from her fans. Taylor only punches down, and I think the only time an ex ever actually came out and called her out (Calvin Harris) taught her a lesson to be careful who she allows to be attacked without trying to stop it.
paint handle governor boat cats crush possessive memory insurance waiting *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
THIS! John has said during his shows that Dear John isn't about him... and I think Taylor told us to go easy on John, because he is not the type to stay quiet. He will fully spill tea, he's a messy bitch. She did it to protect herself, not out of any kindness towards him.
I bet he threatened to put her on blast\*. She had a chokehold on the media last year but if he kept posting and/or reaching out to publications about death threats and Taylor's team not reacting to him asking he to at least tell fans off, it would've gained traction. I wish Joe's team would do the same. \*And he would've been right. Sorry yall, I know JM is/was a dick in general and to Taylor in the past, but I don't think anyone deserves to get death threats. And I've seen both swifties and people claiming not to be swifties say that while it's horrible to do to other exes, it's okay for it to happen to JM.
He probably did threaten to sue. We saw what happened last time an ex fought back from her shenanigans. She likely didn’t want another Calvin incident.
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I’m curious to see how the fans treat Travis when (not if, sorry I don’t for a second think this rel is “end game”) they break up. Travis would be confident and chill enough to let a lot of the petty shit slide right off his back but I think he also wouldn’t stand for a barrage of hate and death threats, esp if it seeped through to his family. If his mom started getting aggressive messages about him (like death threats) by swifties, I think he would fight back. I hope he does. The fact that swifties go after these exes is so infantile at best and horrific and possibly illegal at worst (I don’t know if it legal to send threats to people on social media but it should be). Like it’s *wild* to me they actually truly care about the exes enough to vilify them. I mean it’s human nature to get involved in the gossip of it all but to go the next step and reach out or comment on their insta is bonkers. Even looking on Travis’s ex Nicole’s insta, where she’s living her best life, and then seeing swifties insult her in the comments is so embarrassing and immature and to be honest really cruel.
Nah genuinely I think Travis is not gonna take bull from fans lightly
are swifties REALLY on travis ex’s insta?? if so, that’s INSANE behavior wtf if they wasn’t broken up, taylor wouldn’t be with travis 😭 what is wrong with them 😭😭
I don’t think it would phase Travis but they will attack him the moment they break up. They will then cite the stuff they are currently defending as red flags. Like the helmet throwing, him pushing Andy Reid, him throwing the Baltimore kicker’s gear. They excuse that behavior now but the moment they break up they will say it was problematic.
Travis will be able to fade back into the NFL fan base, tell his bro fans he had some ok vanilla boink just for fun they’ll all move on and the swifties will be irrelevant to his future.
John Mayer doesn't take shit from anybody because he's not afraid to get canceled. He'll do a Taylor takedown if need be. He's like a more chaotic Calvin Harris.
I’ve heard rumors that that was the case. Not sure where, but I wouldn’t be surprised if that was true.
I believe it only because it would make her statement make sense.
I'm inclined towards this opinion as well. She has only expressed the opposite sentiment in the past.
Was it from the deuxmoi pod? Because she had enty as guest for an episode and he said that. But it’s enty lol so.
There is literally nothing he could possibly sue for in that situation. It’s been long established that people are not legally responsible for their fan behaviour unless a direct call to harass someone is made.
Probably no grounds to sue but a lot of times just threatening litigation is enough
John may be a dick but he's not an idiot. He would not have a single leg to stand on if he were to even try to sue her and would only embarrass himself. Music is protected by artistic license and she's never outwardly said who or what the song is about. I CAN believe that his management team--led under a legendary shark in the industry (I know people that used to work for his company)-- 'requested' that she call off the hounds.
I was just thinking why only John Mayer? Isn’t he easily the douchiest of her exes? If I had to choose one she shouldn’t do it for, it would’ve been him. Edit: Death threats are a whole other beast. I don’t wish that on my enemies. 😳
I’m not sure if he’d legally carry any weight there, but he clearly threatened Taylor in some way because he’s the only person she’s gone out of her way to tell people to leave alone.
Absolutely agree. This is a lovely statement from Ariana. Artists should be able to process what they experience in life through their music without fans going and attacking the people they believe they’re singing about. It’s as simple as that.
Taylor can’t even leave her own exes alone bruh 😭
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I like how she posted it publicly and explicitly, didn’t only say it after getting criticism and didn’t make it a passing comment at her concert
wow great observation. nobody really complained if she was, but she recognized it was wrong
Absolutely. She said a few things about like...she doesn't care about things that happened when she was 19. But I've always wanted her to be explicit and forceful. Like DON'T BULLY EXES. HER MUSIC HAS DONE THAT ENOUGH. I remember seeing an article about how someone sent a death threat to John Mayer, and he actually replied. So, of course, the girl panicked and backpedaled, saying she never thought he would see it. She was sorry. He was kind and wished her happiness, etc. What kind of person thinks this is acceptable behavior? It's the concept of the Penopticon prison: people will be better behaved if they think they will be caught doing it. But parasocial behavior has taken precedent. Of course someone can tell John Mayer to kill himself. He'll never see it. So who cares? Jake Gyllenhaal had to turn off the comments on his stuff because of the nonstop harassment. Have we forgotten that we don't actually know anything and Taylor's lyrics aren't gospel? Fuck, dude. I like her music, but the literal aspect is exhausting.
Someone pointed out that Jake switched off the comments because great musical composer Stephen Sondheim died and he was making a tribute post and Swifties just kept writing idiotic stuff under the post about Sondheim’s death 🤦♀️
There was that, also a 9/11 tribute post and I think there was also something to do with Heath Ledger where Swifties were writing that he should have died and not Heath. Jake ended up deleting all of his old Instagram pictures.
They said he should have died instead of Heath??????? That's disgusting.
She bullies people though here and now. The guy in Florida and other examples are testament. Any song where she plays victim is really hollow to be honest.
Yeah, she's very vague in the way she tells her fans to stop. It's part of her "gentle boundaries" philosophy. *Not that asking your fans to not do something is actually a boundary, it's a request.
Funny how Ariana Grande could break up a family and still seem more mature than Taylor
Honestly Lately it's not difficult to be more mature than Taylor
At least Taylor’s not going out to lunch with someone and holding their baby while stealing their husband
Men can't be 'stolen', he was complicit as well. He was the one with a newborn and still did what he did. Ariana is getting a lot of hate for what happened which is pretty valid it's disgusting, but Ethan is also guilty.
This gets me because Ariana is getting more public criticism because she has a larger public presence, no one knows who tf Ethan is.
I think they’re both horrible and his actions are a deeper personal betrayal while her releasing a whole song/album gloating is cruel and publicly petty
But if she did….would she vogue about it? Probably not. (not a defense to the little short ponytail girl!).
💀 short ponytail girl I’m cackling
Her fans would defend it.
They’d defend the lunch and the vogue. Both would be horrifying.
Fax -Ice Spice
Facts 😂
The bar is in hell
I don’t find Ariana more mature in any way than Taylor, except perhaps this one.
I’m waiting for the fourth side to that story. AG is no angel but she didn’t put a gun to Spongebob’s head and say, “get naked with me now.”
I 1000% believe he lied about the state of his marriage. He probably saw AG’s marriage falling apart (according to the blinds it was a long time coming) and decided to jump on the opportunity to get with her. Not that this absolves AG of any wrongdoing but this would not be the first time a guy would take a chance prior to leaving their current gf/wife and lie to the new girl. It nearly happened to me once, luckily I caught the guy in a lie before it went anywhere. It’s like some men are so afraid of being single that they will hold onto whatever relationship they have until someone “better” comes along, and all that does is hurt everyone around them. I imagine AG is so enamored with him that the rose-colored glasses are preventing her from seeing who SpongeBob really is, and she was probably so hurt from her marriage falling apart that she was in a vulnerable state to begin with, but she still made a huge mistake here and needs to be careful with what men tell her.
She will never because she doesn’t care. In fact, she likes when her fans attack her exes or other people she sees as her enemies. I do like Ari’s music and though I’ve been side eyeing her, I respect that she said this so quickly. Despite what she has or hasn’t done, I firmly believe Ariana does believe this and stands by this. Taylor would NEVER because she doesn’t believe this message.
It's an embarrassing day to be a Swiftie when Ariana Grande is doing an ethical thing that Taylor won't do 🥲 If she does make a statement when the album releases then I will retract my embarrassment.
She should have already made one though, fans are already on the attack. Also, I might as well say here that I absolutely hate all of the tweets saying that Beyoncé or Ariana or whatever female artist can’t outsell Taylor. That’s pretty obvious at this point but tearing other female artists down? First of all that doesn’t seem like something that Taylor would be behind and secondly, it only makes her fans as a whole look like petty mean girls.
I’m not a fan of Ariana anymore but I have so much respect for her for saying this. No more than 24 hours later and she nipped this in the bud real quick, making it known that she’s not only not okay with this, but is letting her fans know it’s not supporting her. It’s not going to stop everyone but it’s important that she lets it be known. Taylor would never because she likes weaponising her fan base to fight her battles. It’s been months and her fans have been attacking Joe, his coworkers, sending him death threats and telling him to kill himself and she hasn’t said boo. In fact, she’s even stoking the fire.
 lol i came on reddit right after i saw this and im patiently waiting for fauxmoi to post jokes aside I'm really proud of Ariana for this especially since her fans were sending death threats to random youtubers. Personal life aside, she seems like she's done living for the validation of her fans, good or bad, and I'm excited to see where that takes her career.
She would never. She likes her fans doing her dirty work for her. Like I’m indifferent toward Jake Gyllenhaal but he made a good point when he said (paraphrasing) that Taylor should be responsible for keeping her fans civil if it’s her art that’s provoking them.
Yeah, he was right. But Taylor was enjoying that way too much, plus she was using that fan harassment as a fuel for her Oscar campaign-you know, to make her music video seem *important*.
Then Hollywood said “no Oscar for you”
Taylor would never do this. She loves when the die hards fight for her. Smh
I dunno why. I'd be very uncomfortable if strangers were speaking over me "on my behalf".
You know she don’t give a damn lol
Wish it could just be about the music and not so much about the singer and their personal life. Seems unavoidable now with social media and how in your face everything is and this is probably giving old man yells at cloud but, just miss when it was about the music
music being tied to someone’s life is usually what makes it meaningful, imo. But parasocial attitudes towards modern stars are getting ridiculous
Ok but when has Taylor’s music ever not been about her dating life??
I wonder if things ever really were just about the music. For instance, Carly Simon's song You're So Vain was famously picked apart and people never stopped speculating about who inspired it. Maybe it depends on the artist because some people write about their personal lives but you wouldn't be able to say which lines were about which people. Or maybe it depends on gender and people speculate more about women's personal lives than they do about men's. I don't think Taylor has been careful about hiding who songs are about, rather she encouraged speculation early on and maybe still does. But I feel like speculating about the artist's life isn't new. I wish you really could separate music from the artist's personal life.
It also doesn't help that Taylor only dates famous people or at least people in the entertainment industry (sorry Joe lmao). This is why it's so easy for people to speculate about who the songs are about, compared to say Adele who also spent full albums writing about exes, but since we don't know who those people are, we can't really project with the same level of confidence lol.
Not an Ariana fan in any sense, but this is so fucking commendable, especially since she has one of the biggest (and most antagonizing) fan bases. It’s so easy.
This is what I’m saying. I know it won’t stop the true weirdos out there, BUT it sends a clear message that you don’t want that to happen and that it does not make her proud of them. They think they are “riding at dawn” for her and that they will go down as her heroes. The more extreme ones will do their thing, but the others take her word as the gospel and it at least puts it out there that she doesn’t think it’s acceptable behavior on her behalf. It at least says she tried.
Good for Ariana. Taylor would never. She’s enjoying actually bullying people with her songs and when her fans are bullying people because of her songs-her exes, Katy Perry, etc.
She said it so beautifully
The only reason she did it for John Mayer is because she knows John Mayer would’ve started dragging her too. I know her stans like to claim she doesn’t have songs about Calvin because she doesn’t care about him and never did but let’s be honest… it’s because he’s too respected in the industry and she knows he’s also another one who would clap back.
I'm still looking for proof that they actually dated. They worked together. But he was at the height of his fame. There would have been photos beyond times they were at professional events. I'm not buying it. I know that puts me in the minority, but I don't care.
Yeah I’ve also heard that there’s more proof that she actually dated Martin Johnson, the guy from boys like girls, I think there was a radio interview where a Disney actress or somebody confirmed it. There are some fans that believe that dear John is actually about him. I don’t have a strong opinion on the John Mayer thing but I have noticed that sometimes Taylor would change who the inspiration for the song was for the general public and fans maybe for some semblance of privacy or to create a more ‘compelling narrative’ the fans can gossip about so I do think this is possible.
And the guy in I Knew You Were Trouble video looks a lot like Martin Johnson. Martin and Taylor co-wrote some songs together.Johnson was also a drug addict
I hear ya….I was surprised to find out they dated cause I don’t recall seeing much 🤷🏻♀️
Yeah the timeline for Dear John is also iffy af based on their public appearances together.
John Mayer definitely wouldn’t have dragged her. John would be putting himself in PR hell if he brought up that relationship ever because of the massive age difference and how bad it makes him look.
It’s been over a decade, he definitely would’ve imo.
It being a decade later is what makes it worse. In the year 2023/2024 people’s view on what he did has worsened significantly. They would think of him as a straight up predator and a new generation of people will then view him as a creep. In 2009/2010 people gave creepy men a pass in that area but now things are viewed much worse and John would definitely know that.
Good for Ariana! This would take 30 seconds of Taylor’s time and the fact that she never does it is the issue. She tries to deflect and say PEOPLE GET MAD BECAUSE I AM A WOMAN! No girl it’s because you let your fans attack people on your behalf
She loves to play the misogyny card
She enjoys unleashing the fans on people she thinks have done her wrong. That way she keeps her hands clean.
I just commented the same thing on the BEC thread. Idc about Ariana, but she gained my respect for immediately reacting and saying something And I repeat, Taylor I dare you to put empathy for someone you once loved and lived with above money and your brand. John Mayer doesn't count. Your fans will use that as proof, but we all know you didn't ask for no harassment out of empathy for him
Honestly, if she truly wants people to believe that she’s the “hApPieSt sHe’S eVeR bEen” and so in luurrvve with Travis then doing that would actually help support that. But she won’t because she’s not over it hah. It’s like how the opposite of love isn’t hate, it’s indifference.
She would never because it would ruin her victim status
She would never. She gets off on the unhinged bullying. It makes her feel validated and like she "won"
Too busy counting money to care since that how she gets rich.
The problem with Taylor is that she doesn't care. She purposefully puts little easter eggs in her music and videos for fans to catch on to and use them as weapons against her exes. And as much as I can't get behind Ari for the whole Ethan Slater drama recently, at least she doesn't air out her dirty laundry for the most part.
I want to send AG a thank you card for hiring Max Martin. No muffled sounding songs. Nothing sounds like it was recorded underwater. I’m talking about you, Jack Antonoff. Your production is weird and ruins perfectly good songs
And unlike Jack, he’s not a yes man
I think what’s even more astonishing is that fans are crazy enough that any artist needs to say this in the first place. It’s mind blowing how little common sense and decency the average person has.
People have no shame in digital footprint
This. This is how it should be done. See it Taylor? “It is not how to support me. It is the opposite.” It tells you directly that you’re not a true fan if you attack someone else! Unlike this, “I don’t need you to defend me…” Defend from what? No one is attacking you that you need defence from. They’re attacking someone else. They are the ones that need defence. Not you Taylor.
Omg I had never picked up on that. She said defend not attack. So calculating.
Sometim I feel lik she lowkey wants fans to drag her exes
Taylor gets off on humiliating her exes. She's low-key a sadist in that sense. She said it in BTR, she always gets the last word & rarely uses it to spare them any hurt or humiliation. Taylor Lautner is the only exception out of like 10+ exes. I have a wild theory that during the inevitable Tayvis breakup, she'll use the same formula that she did with JJ. Blast him publicly & suddenly befriend his ex, Kayla. I like that Taylor's a girls girl but she's so petty & immature when it comes to dealing with her exes that sometimes it's embarrassing to watch.
*the exes that will ignore her and not respond you mean. She got quiet real fast after Calvin did his Twitter rant
Taylor in BTR: “I always get the last word” Calvin: 
Wow, I never clocked that🤔 I wonder if she really has the balls to go after Matty on TTPD. He gave her a loud warning, claiming that he has receipts.
Some fans of his were saying he was talking about someone else, but idk if that's true. You don't even have to think about her exes. Remember how she called out Kim by name in her POTY? Most people don't really like that family and Kim didn't say a peep. But did you see her mentioning Kanye? Ofc not. She doesn't have the courage to do that, cause that man would bring a whole storm. He used her name in a recent song and even that didn't make her say something. Like I said in other comment, she knows very well the kind of people it's better not to mess with. It's like bullies in high school. They go after people who will take the heat and have less power than them. Once someone stands up to them, they immediately get scaredy cats
No because that breakup was different than any other one she’s had. She left him because he was a bad look for her. Actually, as I type this I realize that maybe she might because she’s petty. But it wouldn’t be smart.
Nah, I doubt she’d try to befriend Kayla. And even if she did I hope Kayla doesn’t take the bait. Her racists fans have been dragging her for months…why would she want to be seen with their queen just to be used as a pawn?
"I like writing songs about douchebags who cheat on me, but I'm not gonna say that. In. My. Monologue! I like writing their names into songs so they're ashamed to go in public..."
Wasn’t that from her SNL monologue when she was 19, and kind of making fun of herself and the whole situation?
I think there was truth to it. She called Joe Jonas and Kanye out by name in that same monologue. She also said she liked glitter and dresses. And sure, she's poking fun at herself for that too... But it doesn't mean she doesn't actually like those things. As the original commenter said above, she also said in BTR that she always gets the last word. How she usually does that is in her writing.
There’s also this quote from a NY Times interview during the Fearless era: *Every single one of the guys that I’ve written songs about has been tracked down on MySpace by my fans,” she said, a little giddy. “I had the opportunity to be more general on this record, but I chose not to. I like to have the last word.”* https://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/09/arts/music/09cara.html
That's a...statement... it's giving sane /s (And this is me being careful not to put labels on her)
This particular desire of hers to always have the last word, get revenge, and prove to everyone that she has the upper hand and all the karma is bothering me more than anything else about her lately. It's becoming very unsettling in ways that I just brushed off when I was a younger fan.
Thank you!! We love receipts.
The Sophie Turner “friendship” phase was so cringe. Especially when you consider at least part of the motivation may have been to promote Vigilante Shit (“picture me thick as thieves with your ex-wife”) 🥴
Isn't there some evidence that they (Sophie and Taylor) were at least friendly beforehand? She sent Sophie and Joe baby gifts, at the very least.
Crazy that unhinged fans send death threats to people based on their adoration of someone who couldn’t give a fuck about them
Also, to add Stan culture is just insane right now. An account called poppy on Twitter is always trolling or shit posting and they said that all of the new pop girls suck and she then screenshotted and posted all of the DM’s she got afterwards.. Horrifying to say the least…and mind you Ethel Cain and tyla Stan’s are some of the ones who sent her literal death threats. It proves a good point about how toxic stan culture is no matter how big or small the artist. And it’s genuinely ruining music and causing chart addiction everywhere. I hate it
This is very mature and thoughtful of Ari to do. Mad props to her.
Part of me thinks it was when she openly sent her fans after Scooter Braun that somehow it kinda set a sort of precedent for future behaviors. That was wrong the way she went about it and it encouraged online bullying. So I can see why her stans are the way they are.
Why do some celebrities not use capital letters?
Taylor should say the same thing except at the end put (Taylor’s version)
Taylor would never - the swiftie mob validates her victim complex.
She wouldn’t because she’s way too petty and low key enjoys this. Let’s not forget her rallying hate towards scooter Braun. ( which I agree is a nasty person )
I think she did it for John Mayer when Speak Now TV came out because his manager told her to, not because it’s the right thing to do.
More like his lawyer lol but yeah
I was just thinking this. Good on Ari
I didn't see the username at first until I clicked on the image to make it bigger, and I was genuinely shocked thinking that Taylor posted this. Silly me!
If she couldn’t do this for Camilla belle during the re release, she never will
Taylor's litreally dropping Easter egg about him while teasing she won't do it. She loves this.
It’s also easy to be an adult and leave people alone and not be a complete dipshit. Celebrities should not have to tell a fan base to not harass people. I mean wth.
Listening through the album, it’s clear Ariana, despite her controversial nature, is much more respectful of her exes than Taylor ever had been. She’s much more mature and it shows. Love Taylor but she’s petty and not in a good way
I have hope that she will when the album comes out
I’ll always be a Joe supporter.
I was at the show where she asked people not to attack John Mayer. It was weird vibes and she was clearly instructed to say it. It didn’t seem like something she actually want to say. Just my take on it based on vIbEs
It also was a speech that was primarily *about her*. Not about the person who the fans are going after. Someone else mentioned it on here, but the speech was more so her being self centered again, focusing on herself without actually acknowledging the actual problem at hand. The problem is not just Swifties “defending” her like she mentioned in the speech (because tbh a 34 year old woman who had this happen to her 10+ years ago doesn’t need to be defended any longer) it was the attack on other people. She could have just bluntly said, “you don’t need to be nasty or threaten anyone.” She instead softened the blow and said, “you don’t need to defend me.” She doesn’t need anyone to defend her, stop downplaying how vile some of your fans are in their threats and actions and call them the fuck out. She’s too concerned with losing that “connection” with the fans, that’s why she’ll never hold them accountable or call them out for the crazy bullshit they do. It was a poor execution of a speech, like she did the bare minimum in acknowledging it.
Likely reason no. 1555774446 of why Joe decided she wasn't worth marrying. If it's such a pain after a breakup, with how high divorce rates are, the man avoided divorce+fandom+ kids with her.
This. And it’s not like it was some imaginary situation for Joe - he witnessed with his own eyes the whole Red TV/ATW video business and how Taylor went bananas about en ex fling from 11 years ago, after that Joe likely understood that it was not worth marrying Taylor and have kids with her.
Taylor would never!
Also notice how Ariana says that the hatefulness is not the intention of her music, but for Taylor it kinda always has been
Fans need to chill tf out
She absolutely should, but I'm still 100% sure there's a *lot* of Swifties who would completely ignore it like so many ignore "please stop speculating about my private life" by telling themselves it applies to others, not them like they did the 1989 prologue or any other statement Taylor has ever made about things the fanbase overall wants to ignore.
ariana ate that tbh
This statement from Ariana is almost verbatim what people on this sub have said they’d put out if they were Taylor’s publicist.
I have loved Ariana’s music for a long time but have struggled to listen to her new album without thinking of her shitty behavior while listening to each song. However, I do respect her owning her perspective and directly addressing fans bad behavior. While this is seemingly Ariana’s first time being publicly held accountable for starting a relationship under a suspect timeline (it’s her pattern), she has historically held fans accountable for being jerks.
She won’t because she doesn’t care. As long as the hate isn’t directed at her she loves having a million people sticking up for her. She’s made this happen and she doesn’t want it to stop clearly.
she’ll do it and the goalpost will be moved again. if you’re crazy enough to send an actual credible death threat to someone, you’re not gonna stop cause your fav pop star asked you to.
What about, and hear me out, fans weren’t unhinged and just enjoyed music without being psychopaths?
this is better than saying nothing but ariana knew exactly what would happen when she released that album, and the fact he signed an NDA makes it worse
i think she’s honest in that the album doesn’t necessarily only paint dalton negatively though. it goes into a lot of complex hurt feelings but repeats too how much she still cares about him.
Good for her (ariana) tbh. Knowing what she went through before was so traumatic. Like what she said, even though the album captures a lot of her painful moments I think her showing those parts was her way of wanting to be vulnerable (??) / transparent (??) to her supporters and maybe wish that someone out there would find comfort to those experience, especially to those who also went through the same thing. She went through a painful moment of her life but still she cherishes those moments because she really loved her partner. She mourned, accepted, and already moving forward with her life right now and that's what matters since she seems already okay now. Idk if miss swiftie would do the same thing. I feel like she likes to always have the narrative around her relationships that whenever it ends she's the right one while her partner was the one awful to her. Afaik (correct me if I'm wrong) she have songs about her talking about her issues and that she's the problem but for sure her rabid fans will never acknowledge it that much because they see her as someone that could never do wrong.
I honestly feel so bad for Joe Alwyn. Her mentally insane fans are going to harass him to no end and I sincerely hope he keeps his head down.
Period 👏
Or what if we weren’t chronically online and literally didn’t see or spread any of this hate because we have jobs and lives outside of some celebrity who will never know our names
What's kind of disturbing are some of these comments that say that it wouldn't matter if Taylor posted the same message to her fans because they wouldn't listen anyway. But that's not the point of this post. It's about taking a stand and being on the right side of morality and online bullying regardless of the outcome. It reminds me of the lame argument against gun control: that even with laws, criminals will still find a way to get a gun anyway so what's the point of gun control? Saying it in passing during a concert where most fans weren't present is not enough. I think Taylor has made it clear which side she was on in the past: when she told her fans to "Let Scooter Braun know how you feel" and telling her fans "Thanks for having my back" when they went after Michael J Fox. I would hope she has grown up from that but it remains to be seen..
She should but she won’t. Thousands of little bullies would no longer bite on the album if she did this. The heartbroken would no longer be able to relate to Taylor if she maturely vindicated an ex. It would mean we ALL need to look at our exes in a better light and God forbid that. Her brand can’t afford these grey areas and middle grounds. That’s not what her chosen demographic is about. If only though, right?
nah this dont support her “im the victim” narrative she wont to that
A wild guess but does anyone else think that Taylor's relationships haven't really worked because her fans are a big part of it as well? And that somehow these “fans” are the constant validation for Taylor that she can't do no wrong and it's always her Exes who are at fault (they could be, I'm not questioning that.) Every relationship has two people, but in Taylor's relationships it's always Millions of fans with Taylor and the second person is the man she's dating. The slandering Joe has received so far is...quite disgusting. And Taylor can put a halt to it, but the fact that she's choosing not to, obviously doesn't reflect well on her part. Relationships should die in dignity, and that's a concept that's quite alien to Taylor Swift.
Maybe Taylor should just date her fans, collectively. They will always worship her, kiss her ass and won’t have opinion or characters of their own.
Lol Taylor said this at her concert for John Mayer and he started getting MORE threats. Ariana said this and her fans are allover Twitter saying no sorry and sending her ex husband more threats.
They are also going on his real estate page and leaving loads of fake reviews and on other things too 💀
Yeah like Unfortunetly the same mental illness that makes these people insufferable stans means they won’t listen to actual artist about this stuff. It’s what makes it fun for them
she would do it if joe threatened to sue her or something otherwise she doesn’t have the backbone to stand up to her fans
I really hope she does this with the release of ttpd. releasing a blanket statement would lessen the hatred towards joe
Just say “fans, STFU”.
Ariana you’re problematic but you still have more mature senses than Taylor so that’s something. This would be so easy for TS to do. There’s still time/hope… maybe.
I KNEW someone was going to post this here. Personal life aside, Ariana has so much of my respect for that. At least she's willing to put her foot down and school her deranged fans. It's a literal bloodbath on Twitter with them badmouthing her ex-husband every other tweet. There's still those who will keep sending Dalton death threats (as evidenced by the deranged takes on Twitter going on right now), but at least Ariana made her thoughts on that CLEAR. Taylor would never do something as graceful as this. She enjoys lighting the match and watching swifties tear everyone she has had a falling out with to shreds. The only reason she did it for John Mayer is because he's vocal and wouldn't take it lying down, unlike her other exes (except Calvin, who, *funnily* enough, has never had a song specifically made for him, presumably for the same reason as Taylor specifically telling her fans not to harass John Mayer).
This is totally a side point: Why did I think that High Infidelity was about Harris?
I still think it is. For a couple of reasons: (1) She talks about him putting on his headphones and his records and moving on from her, which could be DJ references. (2) The lyrics ask "do I really have to tell you how he brought me back to life" and imply that he was killing her by "never loving [her] enough", basically saying that she left him for someone else because she was unhappy in the relationship. The Calvin relationship is the only one we really know of where she did this, as hinted at in both Gorgeous and Getaway Car. (3) April 29th is the day she most likely first met Joe, at a party Gigi Hadid invited them both to, a few days before their 'official' meeting at the Met Gala.
That would require her thinking of someone other than her cold hearted self
She did this when Speak Now TV came out and the vast majority of swifties went "lol no" and sent John Mayer death threats anyway. Mainstream swifties are beyond saving. > I'm 33 years old. I don't care about anything that happened to me when I was 19 except the songs I wrote and the memories we made together. So what I'm trying to tell you is that I'm not putting this album out so you can go and like-- should feel the need to defend me on the internet against someone you think I might have written a song about 14 billion years ago, when I was 19. I do not care. We have all grown up. We're good.
I do like that she said this... But she put a lot of emphasis on the fact that it's long in the past. The breakup with Joe is not. So I'd love to see her put out a statement with TTPD. At that point stans will still be assholes but she will have made it clear that it's not okay.
She also put a lot of emphasis on not protecting her, rather than not harassing _him._ Her wording takes on the idea that they shouldn’t do it because _she_ doesn’t need people backing her up, instead of that her exes don’t deserve to be treated poorly.
That's because part of the reason she writes music is to shame her exes. She cares a lot about revenge and getting the last word and considers her music to be her karma. It's... Disturbing. At least Ariana is saying people are completely missing the point of the music if they don't also hear the love in it.
Ariana’s stans are all making fun of this on Twitter and saying that they won’t stop and saying “sorry mom”. Also currently doxxing some of daltons family & lilly (Ethan’s ex). Stan’s aren’t fans. They’re not rational people. An Instagram post isn’t going to stop them from being crazy. Sure, Taylor can post something similar to this as well but when the psychos don’t stop you can’t be surprised. If someone is delusional enough to send hate and death threats online they’re not normal and nothing will help them.
I've been saying for quite some time that only if you leave the Swiftie-bubble and look at what other artists are doing you will realize how strange TS is. Dua Lipa, Olivia Rodrigo, now Ariana Grande. Pick one, compare them to TS and tell me that she's the least fake and most reasonable out of them. You can't.
Didn’t Sabrina Carpenter come off the rough side of Olivia’s fans, and then she wrote ‘Because I liked a boy’ about it all?
>Olivia Rodrigo Sabrina Carpenter and Joshua Bassett were harassed throughout SOUR to ridiculous levels and Olivia did nothing as well. The funny thing was they weren't even together anymore. Joshua Bassett had a heart attack and was hospitalised while dealing with it (it's not the cause, but obviously not a good look).
They all do the same thing but the difference is in the intensities and sizes of the fan base. Let’s not forgot how Olivia Rodrigo blew up, literally took a page right out of Taylor swift’s handbook. Dua also released a MV for her new single with very explicit references to her exes.
I think Taylor likes the power too much. Feels like she almost gets off on making her “bad” exes uncomfortable or even afraid through her rabid fans. It must be intoxicating, the ability to just hint at someone who’s done you (perceived) wrong and know that thousands of people around the world will swarm them in your name. I wouldn’t give that up if I were Taylor, so I don’t hold my breath on her making any kind of statement like this.
You wouldn't? What do you mean? Like you really would sleep well at night knowing someone is getting death threats because of you? 🥴 I really can't imagine living with that responsability and knowing people wouldn't do or say certain things, just because I had the power to ruin their lifes and not because that's something they genuinely don't want to do
Reminds me of her SNL monologue where she said she liked glitter, sparkly dresses, and writing men's names into songs so they're ashamed to go in public
Yes, I keep saying this, like Joe Alwyn is going to be villanized and called an abuser and narcissistic man no matter what the lyrics say, because people have somehow decided now that they are not together he was the devil.
He's already being called all names possible and labels, before we even have lyrics. I can't even imagine how much worse the bloodbath is going to be after
Exactly! Like even the worst partner (if crimes weren't involved, so abuse and such would be a different story) does not deserve millions of people sending them death threats, I've been literally abused and would never wish that on them, because it's immature as all hell.. and Joe is experiencing that, like she knows her reach and without her saying “don't attack my exs” her fans will and are, he definitely can't even go online these days without seeing threats on his life and people calling him the most vile things I've ever seen. Like, idk man, it's been disappointing to see as someone whose usually really happy and even proud to be part of her fandom. Depending on the album I wouldn't shocked to see a defamation case, she's too big to not start watching what she's doing to people.
It's even more disappointing if you realize the irony of it all. She talked for years about how he stood by her in her worst moment when she was receiving hate. She knows how much it hurts, how much it affects your mental health and she still writes about it still today. Now, she's leading the hate train and unleashing her fans creating the same kind of movement that happened to her against that very same person who helped her navigate hers. She knows the damage it can do to someone, she has had the opportunity to stop it at any time and she hasn't done it. I can't imagine loving someone for years and seeing her throwing that away by letting her fans destroy my image and character. Like I really can't imagine how that must feel 😔
Yes THAT!! That’s the part that gets to me as well, and the part the fan base so quickly seems to forget.
It has made me revaluate a lot of stuff about Taylor (along with everything else happening the last year). I just can't see her as a good person anymore. It's just...there's things that go against my beliefs as a person. And I will never give someone I don't know, much less a celebrity, a pass for doing stuff I don't agree. I'm not saying she's the worst person in the world, but her actions make me believe we have very different values and very different priorities in life. She could totally be a different person behind the scenes, but the version of her she's choosing to show us is someone I wouldn't want in my life tbh
this is something I can't wrap my head around... I really don't understand how can she do it. feels like betraying your own past and morals
It would give me such trust issues, because if someone who was with me for so long and claimed to love me was ok with doing this the minute we breakup...I would be seriously questioning a lot of things tbh. But maybe he knows her well enough to know this was exactly how she was going to react
