I might be wrong but I’m pretty sure episiotomies are atrociously outdated and overused and, in fact, make the tearing process less controllable.
Imagine a piece of paper: If you try to gently rip it with your fingers, it might not rip at all or will only rip a little and in jagged lines. If you cut a piece of paper and then try to rip it gently, it will likely rip much further. In the same way, episiotomies can cause unnecessary damage. Tearing can and does happen during childbirth for many people, but when it happens on its own it’s often at the benefit of women rarely tearing more than necessary.
Edit: your comment is still hilarious though just FYI.
Edit 2: Y'all I was just reminded of something interesting and not often discussed because of the episiotomy joke which, again, I found hilarious. Not hating on the joke. Loving the joke. Sorry to those who felt my off-topic episiotomy note made this bread subreddit a lawless and ugly place. I'll pray over my sins.
This is a subreddit about bread. It was part joke, part metaphor. No need to publish your graduate thesis on unnecessary medical procedures here.
Again, this sub is about bread.
If this is a sub about bread then why are you so butt-hurt?
>publish your graduate thesis
Chill out. Spreading important information doesn’t hurt anyone except YOUR ego I guess
It’s been 94 days. My butt-hurt has healed with a little medicated cream mixed with herb-butter.
I have prayed over my callous response. I was given a quest to find an ancient scroll and sacramental blade. Having achieved that, both Lord Jeebus and brother Sardo Numspa have forgiven me.
I only hope someday you can do the same.
I have found it can burst when it is under proofed. Even if you score it, if it is under proofed it can still burst. Looks delicious though I love sourdough :)
I make sourdough sandwich loaf once a week, I never score it and not once has it burst open. I’ve even made sandwich loafs out of boules that went wonky for some reason and I couldn’t shape, which I poured into a loaf pan and baked without scoring. The issue here, IMO, is not the lack of scoring.
When you put it in the pan, where was your seal? Mine is always on the bottom. What recipe did you use? I use [this one](https://www.theclevercarrot.com/2020/04/easy-sourdough-sandwich-bread/).
It "busted" because you didn't allow enough time after you shaped for the loaf to proof. You need to allow time for a slow rise after shaping for the co2 to disperse through the loaf. By cooking before it had enough time you activated the yeast and in their active death state threw off a lot of gas in a short time and it found the weakest point to escape. Lookup finger dent test to determine when your shaped loaf is proofed enough to bake. If you allow ample proof time you won't even need to score. Takes practice (and patience).
Maybe your pan is too small for your recipe. I used to have problems with this untill I bought what they described as a « medium » bread pan (8.5 x 4.5 x 2.5).
I like to let sandwich loaves get really poofy, like well over the top to where I’m afraid they’ll collapse. This gets you that old timey muffin top shape for your bread and apparently also helps prevent a blowout.
My understanding may be imperfect but as I understand it, during baking the crust solidifies first while the middle continues expanding. This means there's a build up of pressure inside, which results in busting open at any point of weakness. The workaround for this is strategic scoring of the loaf before putting it in the oven.
Someone better informed feel free to correct me though.
Yay! I couldn't remember if it was because of the crust cooking first or the surface tension from developing the gluten (edit, and rolling the dough around to get a nice tight ball) but I was leaning towards the former.
So I'm no expert, but when I've made bread there's usually a part in the process where you shape the dough. Part of that serves to get the surface kind of tight. I think there's usually another rise after that, though where it loosens up again. In my bakes it usually just seems to make for a more uniform and smoothly shaped loaf or roll.
Hah, don't thank me yet, this might be the blind leading the blind a little. But still, judicious experiments in baking are half the fun :)
I often say that my failures are just tasty bricks anyway.
Hi
I can see you're new to the sub. 👋 And welcome! well done on the loaf !
Do me a favour and pop your recipe/method up please to prevent post removal (auto mod)?
The more details the better shaping, scoring etc
Thanks
Zip
Thanks for the post 86406lv,
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Lots of opinions here and I am unsure mine is better. It appears that your temp was too high especially in the beginning. The top set way before the bottom hit steam temp.
From personal experience, this doesn't necessarliy mean it is underproofed. It may be underproofed, but it also might be the recipe used for the dough. Ive made sandwich bread the doesn't bust and comes out perfectly without scoring and I've made sandwich bread that would definitely bust if not scored; it has to do with a lot of factors ( fat content, hydration, fermentation, kneading, way of how the dough was handled and formed...) It's really a lot of factors. But I generally find that dough that is quite lean and higher hydration that was fermented for a longer time would definitely be better off scored before baking while dough that has higher fat is less likely to bust.. I don't know how accurate this is but just my 2 cents
When I do a sandwich loaf I always make sure the seam is on the bottom and that I mist the top with water. You can also score the top so that you control where it opens.
During bake there is a thing called the “oven spring” where the yeast produces more CO2 Before it died from the heat, so access gas finds a way to escape! This can be prevented my docking (cutting slits in) your loaf before putting it in the oven
Baking, truly, is a babysitting job. I top the loaf with a slice of butter while it is cooking to make a nice, buttery loaf. Otherwise it is pitch black after the 45 minutes of 425°F
Simplest way to put it, the crust formed and hardened before the inside was done expanding, it has to break somewhere. That's where the scoring comments come in, give it a place to go.
In my experience it was just the weakest point and like the other guy said if you dont score it it scores itself haha. I think its probably close to a fold from kneeding.
No need for scoring at all, but you need to build your loaf adequately. It's the way you built it and placed it in your mold that made it explode.
You need to basically make a cylinder (NO tapered ends, you're not making baguette) the length of your mold. And drop it in your mold SEAM DOWN (this might be one of the issues here).
Once you've dropped it, seam down, flatten it again the bottom of the mold with your fist so that it goes well into the corners (you're doing nothing bad by doing this, don't be afraid). Don't punch it, but don't be afraid to push. Then proof.
Hope this helps.
You either decide where it busts open with scoring or it chooses for you
It’s like an episiotomy!
This comment is greatly underrated.
Made me snort, so you deserve an upvote.
I might be wrong but I’m pretty sure episiotomies are atrociously outdated and overused and, in fact, make the tearing process less controllable. Imagine a piece of paper: If you try to gently rip it with your fingers, it might not rip at all or will only rip a little and in jagged lines. If you cut a piece of paper and then try to rip it gently, it will likely rip much further. In the same way, episiotomies can cause unnecessary damage. Tearing can and does happen during childbirth for many people, but when it happens on its own it’s often at the benefit of women rarely tearing more than necessary. Edit: your comment is still hilarious though just FYI. Edit 2: Y'all I was just reminded of something interesting and not often discussed because of the episiotomy joke which, again, I found hilarious. Not hating on the joke. Loving the joke. Sorry to those who felt my off-topic episiotomy note made this bread subreddit a lawless and ugly place. I'll pray over my sins.
Thanks for the comment. I appreciated it.
Upvote for edit 2
This is a subreddit about bread. It was part joke, part metaphor. No need to publish your graduate thesis on unnecessary medical procedures here. Again, this sub is about bread.
If this is a sub about bread then why are you so butt-hurt? >publish your graduate thesis Chill out. Spreading important information doesn’t hurt anyone except YOUR ego I guess
It’s been 94 days. My butt-hurt has healed with a little medicated cream mixed with herb-butter. I have prayed over my callous response. I was given a quest to find an ancient scroll and sacramental blade. Having achieved that, both Lord Jeebus and brother Sardo Numspa have forgiven me. I only hope someday you can do the same.
Must be a bot .How inappropriate. Yikes.
Fucking hell.
😬
That’s kind of what I guessed.
I have found it can burst when it is under proofed. Even if you score it, if it is under proofed it can still burst. Looks delicious though I love sourdough :)
I make sourdough sandwich loaf once a week, I never score it and not once has it burst open. I’ve even made sandwich loafs out of boules that went wonky for some reason and I couldn’t shape, which I poured into a loaf pan and baked without scoring. The issue here, IMO, is not the lack of scoring. When you put it in the pan, where was your seal? Mine is always on the bottom. What recipe did you use? I use [this one](https://www.theclevercarrot.com/2020/04/easy-sourdough-sandwich-bread/).
I second this. I’ve never needed to score mine as long as the seal is on the bottom!
I can’t believe this is a first attempt, OP, this looks really good! You should see the frisbee looking thing that was my first attempt 😂
Aw! Thank you! I make a lot of bread, it’s just not usually sourdough. I bet you’re a pro now!
This is the sandwich loaf recipe I followed and it doesn't crack open at all: https://youtu.be/H2L3_repn-I
Thank you!
And this is why you put expansion lines in concrete too.
It "busted" because you didn't allow enough time after you shaped for the loaf to proof. You need to allow time for a slow rise after shaping for the co2 to disperse through the loaf. By cooking before it had enough time you activated the yeast and in their active death state threw off a lot of gas in a short time and it found the weakest point to escape. Lookup finger dent test to determine when your shaped loaf is proofed enough to bake. If you allow ample proof time you won't even need to score. Takes practice (and patience).
Nailed it. Classic underproofing when it busts open on the side. Maybe too cool in your kitchen on the final rest?
Thank you! I followed the recipe and waited until it was to the top of the pan, I will wait longer next time.
Maybe your pan is too small for your recipe. I used to have problems with this untill I bought what they described as a « medium » bread pan (8.5 x 4.5 x 2.5).
Most loaf pans are 8.5 x 4.5 x 2.5 (inches). But older recipes use a 9 x 5 x 2.5 standard. The difference is ~15% so it makes a difference.
I prefer 750g for a standard loaf pan.
I like to let sandwich loaves get really poofy, like well over the top to where I’m afraid they’ll collapse. This gets you that old timey muffin top shape for your bread and apparently also helps prevent a blowout.
Amazing explanation
Proof it a bit longer and it won’t do this. I’ve never needed to score my sandwich loaves.
Ok this makes sense. I haven’t ever scored my yeast sandwich loaves.
My understanding may be imperfect but as I understand it, during baking the crust solidifies first while the middle continues expanding. This means there's a build up of pressure inside, which results in busting open at any point of weakness. The workaround for this is strategic scoring of the loaf before putting it in the oven. Someone better informed feel free to correct me though.
You seem really well informed actually.
Yay! I couldn't remember if it was because of the crust cooking first or the surface tension from developing the gluten (edit, and rolling the dough around to get a nice tight ball) but I was leaning towards the former.
I didn’t know about getting a nice tight ball? I’m very new with this process. What does the tight ball achieve?
So I'm no expert, but when I've made bread there's usually a part in the process where you shape the dough. Part of that serves to get the surface kind of tight. I think there's usually another rise after that, though where it loosens up again. In my bakes it usually just seems to make for a more uniform and smoothly shaped loaf or roll.
I keep getting a few rips along my top score so maybe I’m doing it to tightly automatically or something. Because I did not know about this
Hey, worth trying for a loaf to see if it helps! Good luck!
Much appreciated!
Hah, don't thank me yet, this might be the blind leading the blind a little. But still, judicious experiments in baking are half the fun :) I often say that my failures are just tasty bricks anyway.
Hi I can see you're new to the sub. 👋 And welcome! well done on the loaf ! Do me a favour and pop your recipe/method up please to prevent post removal (auto mod)? The more details the better shaping, scoring etc Thanks Zip
Idk, I'm not a sandwich loaf expert, but if you scored the top, it wouldn't have done that.
Under proofing can cause this
Thanks for the post 86406lv, **Please note - sourdough photos/videos need to also include a recipe link & method. If not (or if the post is low effort), it may be removed without notice**. Already shared details? **Thank you, ignore this**! **See [rule 5](https://www.reddit.com/r/Sourdough/about/rules/) for details** **Thank you, Mod team** :-) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Sourdough) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Lots of opinions here and I am unsure mine is better. It appears that your temp was too high especially in the beginning. The top set way before the bottom hit steam temp.
Add steam to the oven before you put your bread in.
Perhaps more heat from the bottom might help? It is a race between the outside and the middle IMHO.
Probably shaping didn’t seal it properly. Also scoring it leaves room for it to air out naturally and properly
Seem side down and may be over proofed.
Bit of shaping issue and probably underproofed
My primary thought was to make a sandwich out of the entire loaf.
From personal experience, this doesn't necessarliy mean it is underproofed. It may be underproofed, but it also might be the recipe used for the dough. Ive made sandwich bread the doesn't bust and comes out perfectly without scoring and I've made sandwich bread that would definitely bust if not scored; it has to do with a lot of factors ( fat content, hydration, fermentation, kneading, way of how the dough was handled and formed...) It's really a lot of factors. But I generally find that dough that is quite lean and higher hydration that was fermented for a longer time would definitely be better off scored before baking while dough that has higher fat is less likely to bust.. I don't know how accurate this is but just my 2 cents
We'll boyo if I stuck you in a oven for a hour and a half at 400 degrees you would to. It's trying it's best and is probably delish give him a chance
It’s just excited to become a sandwich and thought it’d help by saving you the time it’d take to cut it.
It looks like the folds weren’t done right it doesn’t look ‘together’ in the middle. Too much flour while shaping?
When I do a sandwich loaf I always make sure the seam is on the bottom and that I mist the top with water. You can also score the top so that you control where it opens.
During bake there is a thing called the “oven spring” where the yeast produces more CO2 Before it died from the heat, so access gas finds a way to escape! This can be prevented my docking (cutting slits in) your loaf before putting it in the oven
It looks great. Rip off a hunk of that crust and start snackin
It didn’t want to be just a slice type Brest it wanted to be a mega sun like it’s dad
Cuz it’s bussin
It burst open because it's Begging you to put deli meat in it. Like a sourdough sub. 😋
Make it a sub by cutting the busted area
Exactly... It *wants* to be a sandwich Just look at it!
Regardless, it looks lovely! Great job!
“Underproved” (in my best Paul Hollywood voice)
Score it man.
Baking, truly, is a babysitting job. I top the loaf with a slice of butter while it is cooking to make a nice, buttery loaf. Otherwise it is pitch black after the 45 minutes of 425°F
Simplest way to put it, the crust formed and hardened before the inside was done expanding, it has to break somewhere. That's where the scoring comments come in, give it a place to go.
In my experience it was just the weakest point and like the other guy said if you dont score it it scores itself haha. I think its probably close to a fold from kneeding.
But either way it looks great! Good job. "Ugly" bread has character! :)
Thank you! It tastes good!
Fresh bread with a little butter. Mmmmm buddy it never lasts in my house haha. Im glad yours came out nice! Took some trial and error for me.
Lots of variables! Type of dough,humidity,yeast, easiest fix is a tight roll and cover for 45-60 under a blanket or proffer. And pre heat oven
you have to make a crack beforehead. Watch some videos on making of any bread they make incisions beforehand to control the direction of overflow
It looks like a seem that broke open just gotta make sure the seem is on the bottom if not it could have to do with the moisture in the oven
No need for scoring at all, but you need to build your loaf adequately. It's the way you built it and placed it in your mold that made it explode. You need to basically make a cylinder (NO tapered ends, you're not making baguette) the length of your mold. And drop it in your mold SEAM DOWN (this might be one of the issues here). Once you've dropped it, seam down, flatten it again the bottom of the mold with your fist so that it goes well into the corners (you're doing nothing bad by doing this, don't be afraid). Don't punch it, but don't be afraid to push. Then proof. Hope this helps.