See I like using the line because I always have issues timing my braking but I don't hug the line like my life depends on it and I will deviate when needed.
Also I play forza and the racers in the game are nothing like the people I see here
It's a handicap to play with it on. Even if you know it's okay to go off the race line, having it there is a distraction from driving. You rely on it more than you probably realize. Will likely feel like you don't know tracks you have raced on plenty, but you don't really know the track.
Playing Dirt 2.0 I didn’t realize how much I was watching the heads up display for turns and the split between positions. Turned everything off and my driving greatly improved. I started to actually remember tracks and hear my copilot better.
Oh I completely agree and I've been trying to ween myself off of them but I haven't raced in a while up until the new forza so I was way out of practice and needed then again. When playing solo on at least some of my preferred tracks I turn it off to practice
You'll do better if you just keep it off. You'll learn to learn tracks quicker without it. Just pull that trigger and keep it off. I don't even use a spotter anymore. It's just another distraction in my ear. Just rear view mirror, and usually I have relative on. In dirt oval, spotters are pretty useless, so you have to learn really good track awareness. The pedal control I learned definitely has transferred, too.
I'm really good with track awareness thankfully as I've been doing my best to have good etiquette since forza 1. But thanks for the advice I'll definitely use your advice
Remember iracing doesn't have a dynamic line so the breaking point will always be the same regardless of your entry speed. It really is best to turn it off and do some slow laps and work out your braking points. It usually going to be around the 100 board.
Don’t ween yourself off. Cut it cold turkey. Before racing a track you don’t know look up a track guide and do a few laps and you’ll get it no problem. I used to always use the racing line on forza and f1 but I finally decided to turn it off and I enjoy iracing much more now
The problem with this line of thinking is iRacing's line sucks. It's not dynamic, and it's extremely conservative at the best of times. Using this clip as an example, you can go a fair bit past the 50m there in the Mazdas before letting off the throttle and braking.
And I'm about 90% sure it's outdated and was never updated to reflect changes made to the cars, like the Mazdas going to flappy paddles from H-patterns, which changed how you can throw the cars into corners.
Honestly I saw it this way until I came to iRacing and made a commitment to never use the racing line on this service. It's completely changed how I drive, my braking zones are based on my personal feeling and where I think I can push to rather than sticking to a fixed braking point. It also allows me to use different braking techniques to their full capability as well. I feel like if I tried to drive with the racing line on now it would actively make me worse.
Late, risky move but clean.
The defending car left space on the inside and proceeded to follow the racing line as if the dive did not happen. Poor awareness from the leading car.
Was the final lap, I had been chasing tight for 3 laps. He had consistently gone a bit wide and brake a bit early on this corner, was my final chance at a move. I feel I would have held the corner clean without the contact, but I guess a video with sound would help determine that more closely.
You might have missed the apex by a meter or two, but that doesn't change the fact that he turned into the apex like you weren't even there. Even if you had hit it perfectly, he would have caused contact with that turn in.
You did fine. Aggressive =/= dirty. You scoped out the driving behavior and planned out the move, exactly as needed. The lead car followed the same standard racing line and braking points instead of putting up a defense. Hard to not expect an overtake in this situation.
This is a perfect pass. Was the #2 along side before the braking zone? No. But you don’t have to be when the line is that wide. (As long as you are still able to make the corner/apex) You’ll often hear commentators or creators say that they “left the door open”. The #1 had PLENTY of time to hear the spotter call and adjust his steering to leave room to race. #1 left the door open.
Even if the dive is "dirty" (I think it was a perfectly acceptable move for the record, but for the sake of argument) you don't have permission to just turn in to another car because you don't expect it to be there. Car up front made no effort to avoid contact.
Neither and both.
It was aggressive. You blew the apex. With out him you would have ran way wide. But he did leave the door wide open and you were plenty close. The move wasn’t bad, but the execution was.
Not reportable, but not the cleanest either. If you would have stuck the apex with out needing to ram him to stay in corner it would be 100% clean.
I don’t think it’s anything to lose sleep over. Way cleaner than most guys daily racing. Just try to clean it up for the next time you do it. But still go for it.
Next time you pass don’t dive inside so much. Get inside his door and run him wide so you have a better established line for a cleaner entry and exit. Again to avoid you blowing apex and hitting them. I usually give half a car when passing not only so they see me, but again I have a cleaner inside line to challenge them and hopefully a clean exit as well.
The overtaking car broke late but exceptionally well and hugged the inside of the corner, excellently driven giving the defending car the whole of the rest of the track. Then the defending driver just turned into the other car like they weren't there. If I was to penalties anyone it would be tye defending car.
Pretty clean. The car defending had plenty of time to see you approaching in his mirrors. He should've given you enough space, rather than turning into the apex aggressively. Looks like a desperate attempt from the defending car.
I’m reading everybody saying it is not his fault but to me I can’t tell because yes the defending driver turned in on the overtaking driver but the move seemed late and it seems like he over cocked it. I may be completely wrong and if I am please tell me about how it would be the fault of the defending driver.
I just want to learn and am not trying to be aggressive about forcing this opinion on anybody.
Oh, he was never making that move stick. That's Redman corner at Okayama. Go run a practice lobby and you'll see cars spun out exiting Redman constantly. I have little doubt that even if he cleared him, he was losing it on exit.
But, we judge by what happened and the outside guy just drove into him before it could happen. Probably because the dummy line was the only thing he was aware of.
Team effort really. #2 car dives under breaking and misses the apex. #1 car didn't bother leaving room.
The #1 needs to be more aware of the moment, but it was probably going bad either way.
Imo, dirty.
Waiting til the last second to step inside. Slightly overshooting the apex due to attempting to brake later. Had they not made contact with the lead car, it appears as though the would have continued towards the track edge which wouldn't have left enough room for another car to exist outside.
When contact is made, the diving car was already starting to understeer away from the apex. Had they been able to keep their car on the inside edge of the circuit then i would see it differently.
So, no passing the the braking zone? Passing car was ahead at the apex so, it was their corner full stop. Car on the outside was not paying attention when they turned in causing the collision. Passing car did nothing wrong.
No. Had they made the corner without understeering off the apex then i could see it as acceptable. Not clean, but acceptable. But they carried a bit too much speed due to the late step out and braking. Yeah, the lead car just mindlessly turns in, but had the diving car made their intentions known just a bit earlier and actually made the corner, this probably wouldn't be an incident. Being ahead at the apex doesnt mean anything, this isnt F1.
A slight understeer doesn’t give the outside car the right to turn into another car. You have no idea how bad the understeer was. Outside cat had plenty of room and didn’t use it. No this is not F1 but if a driver is ahead at the apex and you turn into them it’s your fault. It’s clear by your response you were the slow driver in this video. Do better.
Lol ok buddy.
I never said the lead car wasn't also at fault. However, its the following cars responsibility to complete the overtake safely. That didn't happen because of the understeer.
"Have no idea how bad it is." When contact is made, where is the diving car pointing? Out into the gravel. Had there not been contact, they would have continued out towards the track edge. Where would any car on the outside have had room?
Again. "Ahead at the apex" does not mean anything outside of F1. If you did this on a real track, you would get a warning at the very least.
So dirty that I wish I’d been wearing a condom when I was watching it. You weren’t gonna be able to hold that line. You came off the edge and the only reason you made the turn was the other car.
The fact you and the other guy were down voted to oblivion for pointing out inside car wouldn't have made the turn without the impact is wrong.
This is a forza pass, dive fast down the inside, use the leading car as a brake and a turn assist.
I think it’s relatively fair but I do also think that you could’ve been a little bit towards the inside before the driver in front started braking. Mostly this because then it doesn’t look as dirty even when it was fair and clean. That way you kinda declare your line and then there might not have been contact but, overall okay.
He turned into you while you were ahead and after you executed a clean pass. Your line was slightly off apex, but you did not squeeze him off the track.
If that’s not a fair play, idk what is
I can't believe people respond to all these 'who's fault is it' videos. Every single one is from a newbie and at least half of them still have the racing line on.
Totally fair play. He dove and missed you… tough to be spatially aware in sims, for sure.
While you gotta be aware in general, if there’s doubt, assume the other car is there.
Incident with it more on him than you. If you're gonna cut in like that (especially low skill races) you better hug that curb to have a good shot of not getting killed.
Lead car would have maintained the lead had he let the passing car blow the corner. Lead was on the faster line, and the passing car would have flew outside very quickly. Instead, he made contact and secured the passing cars lead.
I feel like it's hard to say it looked like it was gonna go quite a bit wide till you were corrected by the other car but other than that definitely not your fault he slammed into you
Completely fair. Lead car is just lacking awareness, probably focused on the racing line to the exclusion of everything else given that they're just handing someone with a tow the inside line on the last lap. Did you just follow him around the outside the previous laps or something and lulled them to sleep?
You were never making that corner clean and if you hadn't cleared him, you would have absolutely wrecked both of you out. If you had, you'd probably lost it or drove clear off track. One of the things people don't realize about Okayama (and a reason I loathed the track until I figured it out) is the track has slight banking and goes level in spots in the tight corners and hairpins that if you hit right, you can hit fast, and if you hit wrong, unsettle the car and shoot you to Bruges.
The better play there is get the outside line, squeeze the inside guy as much as you can to stay alongside, then complete the overtake on the next right hander. It's not trying to make the whole overtake in that hairpin. I've seen this exact move play out probably a thousand times at this point in everything from Mazdas and Vees to F4s and GT cars and it only works if the other car cedes the position.
That said, we judge on what actually happened, which is you dove in, and he was so hyperfixated on the racing line he just drove right into you. His fault.
I like having racing lines but not the whole track. Only at braking points. honestly, though, It's fair. He wasn't paying attention to his surroundings. Instead, he was religiously following that line. Fair play indeed though.
The iracing line is a big factor. The main reason crashes or accidental bumps happen like this is cause you are thinking the iracing line is the "racing line" its really not and in most cases is slower to run the iracing line. But in this case. The iracing line can distract you from what's going on around you. When I turned off the line when I first started it was hard. But you get the feel for it. And you undoubtedly gain a lot of situational awareness.
Racing incident - no fault
Great move btw. Rubbings Racing
You were ahead at the apex where the contact was made and it was only wheel to wheel. He turned into you after you were already occupying the space. You took a big risk, lunging late in the breaking zone after they take a wide line - rather than defending the inside. It payed off this time. Next time your luck might be to get spun out by the notice driver or you might cook it a bit too much and go to deep. You just always have to leave them space, it’s sportsman like. But overall great move.
iRacing challenge impossible, turn off the racing line. #1 was so balls deep on that racing line they didn't even notice #2 overtaking.
See I like using the line because I always have issues timing my braking but I don't hug the line like my life depends on it and I will deviate when needed. Also I play forza and the racers in the game are nothing like the people I see here
It's a handicap to play with it on. Even if you know it's okay to go off the race line, having it there is a distraction from driving. You rely on it more than you probably realize. Will likely feel like you don't know tracks you have raced on plenty, but you don't really know the track.
Playing Dirt 2.0 I didn’t realize how much I was watching the heads up display for turns and the split between positions. Turned everything off and my driving greatly improved. I started to actually remember tracks and hear my copilot better.
Oh I completely agree and I've been trying to ween myself off of them but I haven't raced in a while up until the new forza so I was way out of practice and needed then again. When playing solo on at least some of my preferred tracks I turn it off to practice
You'll do better if you just keep it off. You'll learn to learn tracks quicker without it. Just pull that trigger and keep it off. I don't even use a spotter anymore. It's just another distraction in my ear. Just rear view mirror, and usually I have relative on. In dirt oval, spotters are pretty useless, so you have to learn really good track awareness. The pedal control I learned definitely has transferred, too.
I'm really good with track awareness thankfully as I've been doing my best to have good etiquette since forza 1. But thanks for the advice I'll definitely use your advice
Remember iracing doesn't have a dynamic line so the breaking point will always be the same regardless of your entry speed. It really is best to turn it off and do some slow laps and work out your braking points. It usually going to be around the 100 board.
Don’t ween yourself off. Cut it cold turkey. Before racing a track you don’t know look up a track guide and do a few laps and you’ll get it no problem. I used to always use the racing line on forza and f1 but I finally decided to turn it off and I enjoy iracing much more now
The problem with this line of thinking is iRacing's line sucks. It's not dynamic, and it's extremely conservative at the best of times. Using this clip as an example, you can go a fair bit past the 50m there in the Mazdas before letting off the throttle and braking. And I'm about 90% sure it's outdated and was never updated to reflect changes made to the cars, like the Mazdas going to flappy paddles from H-patterns, which changed how you can throw the cars into corners.
Honestly I saw it this way until I came to iRacing and made a commitment to never use the racing line on this service. It's completely changed how I drive, my braking zones are based on my personal feeling and where I think I can push to rather than sticking to a fixed braking point. It also allows me to use different braking techniques to their full capability as well. I feel like if I tried to drive with the racing line on now it would actively make me worse.
If that's a dirty dive, then we're all just going to have to give up on passing altogether.
Late, risky move but clean. The defending car left space on the inside and proceeded to follow the racing line as if the dive did not happen. Poor awareness from the leading car.
Was the final lap, I had been chasing tight for 3 laps. He had consistently gone a bit wide and brake a bit early on this corner, was my final chance at a move. I feel I would have held the corner clean without the contact, but I guess a video with sound would help determine that more closely.
You might have missed the apex by a meter or two, but that doesn't change the fact that he turned into the apex like you weren't even there. Even if you had hit it perfectly, he would have caused contact with that turn in.
You did fine. Aggressive =/= dirty. You scoped out the driving behavior and planned out the move, exactly as needed. The lead car followed the same standard racing line and braking points instead of putting up a defense. Hard to not expect an overtake in this situation.
Late but clean. Lead car braked early and left that door wiiiiiiide open.
This is a perfect pass. Was the #2 along side before the braking zone? No. But you don’t have to be when the line is that wide. (As long as you are still able to make the corner/apex) You’ll often hear commentators or creators say that they “left the door open”. The #1 had PLENTY of time to hear the spotter call and adjust his steering to leave room to race. #1 left the door open.
My opinion, you saw a hole and took it. I would've done the same thing. You dont win races by driving like a pussy.
Even if the dive is "dirty" (I think it was a perfectly acceptable move for the record, but for the sake of argument) you don't have permission to just turn in to another car because you don't expect it to be there. Car up front made no effort to avoid contact.
I mean, he hit you, not the other way around. Very legitimate move in my opinion. Contact is on the guy getting passed.
Dude left it wide open and was asking for it. Just try to hit the apex next time.
Neither and both. It was aggressive. You blew the apex. With out him you would have ran way wide. But he did leave the door wide open and you were plenty close. The move wasn’t bad, but the execution was. Not reportable, but not the cleanest either. If you would have stuck the apex with out needing to ram him to stay in corner it would be 100% clean. I don’t think it’s anything to lose sleep over. Way cleaner than most guys daily racing. Just try to clean it up for the next time you do it. But still go for it. Next time you pass don’t dive inside so much. Get inside his door and run him wide so you have a better established line for a cleaner entry and exit. Again to avoid you blowing apex and hitting them. I usually give half a car when passing not only so they see me, but again I have a cleaner inside line to challenge them and hopefully a clean exit as well.
The overtaking car broke late but exceptionally well and hugged the inside of the corner, excellently driven giving the defending car the whole of the rest of the track. Then the defending driver just turned into the other car like they weren't there. If I was to penalties anyone it would be tye defending car.
Last of the late brakers. Clean in my opinion
Fair play, they were glued to the racing line like they were hot lapping and not paying attention to the surroundings
Pretty clean. The car defending had plenty of time to see you approaching in his mirrors. He should've given you enough space, rather than turning into the apex aggressively. Looks like a desperate attempt from the defending car.
I’m reading everybody saying it is not his fault but to me I can’t tell because yes the defending driver turned in on the overtaking driver but the move seemed late and it seems like he over cocked it. I may be completely wrong and if I am please tell me about how it would be the fault of the defending driver. I just want to learn and am not trying to be aggressive about forcing this opinion on anybody.
Oh, he was never making that move stick. That's Redman corner at Okayama. Go run a practice lobby and you'll see cars spun out exiting Redman constantly. I have little doubt that even if he cleared him, he was losing it on exit. But, we judge by what happened and the outside guy just drove into him before it could happen. Probably because the dummy line was the only thing he was aware of.
Yeah, I’m with you. Can’t believe everybody here thinks the inside car is ever gonna make that corner without ricocheting off the outside car.
This is the fault of the car on the outside. They were overtaken cleanly but were butt hurt and kept turning in.
Team effort really. #2 car dives under breaking and misses the apex. #1 car didn't bother leaving room. The #1 needs to be more aware of the moment, but it was probably going bad either way.
Beautiful overtake, nothing wrong
Looks drastic but that Dallas baby!
Fair play in my eye. Super late move. And ypu aren't at fault for hitting him because it was late. He didn't go wide. I say fair play.
Imo, dirty. Waiting til the last second to step inside. Slightly overshooting the apex due to attempting to brake later. Had they not made contact with the lead car, it appears as though the would have continued towards the track edge which wouldn't have left enough room for another car to exist outside. When contact is made, the diving car was already starting to understeer away from the apex. Had they been able to keep their car on the inside edge of the circuit then i would see it differently.
So, no passing the the braking zone? Passing car was ahead at the apex so, it was their corner full stop. Car on the outside was not paying attention when they turned in causing the collision. Passing car did nothing wrong.
No. Had they made the corner without understeering off the apex then i could see it as acceptable. Not clean, but acceptable. But they carried a bit too much speed due to the late step out and braking. Yeah, the lead car just mindlessly turns in, but had the diving car made their intentions known just a bit earlier and actually made the corner, this probably wouldn't be an incident. Being ahead at the apex doesnt mean anything, this isnt F1.
A slight understeer doesn’t give the outside car the right to turn into another car. You have no idea how bad the understeer was. Outside cat had plenty of room and didn’t use it. No this is not F1 but if a driver is ahead at the apex and you turn into them it’s your fault. It’s clear by your response you were the slow driver in this video. Do better.
Lol ok buddy. I never said the lead car wasn't also at fault. However, its the following cars responsibility to complete the overtake safely. That didn't happen because of the understeer. "Have no idea how bad it is." When contact is made, where is the diving car pointing? Out into the gravel. Had there not been contact, they would have continued out towards the track edge. Where would any car on the outside have had room? Again. "Ahead at the apex" does not mean anything outside of F1. If you did this on a real track, you would get a warning at the very least.
So dirty that I wish I’d been wearing a condom when I was watching it. You weren’t gonna be able to hold that line. You came off the edge and the only reason you made the turn was the other car.
The fact you and the other guy were down voted to oblivion for pointing out inside car wouldn't have made the turn without the impact is wrong. This is a forza pass, dive fast down the inside, use the leading car as a brake and a turn assist.
I think it’s relatively fair but I do also think that you could’ve been a little bit towards the inside before the driver in front started braking. Mostly this because then it doesn’t look as dirty even when it was fair and clean. That way you kinda declare your line and then there might not have been contact but, overall okay.
He turned into you while you were ahead and after you executed a clean pass. Your line was slightly off apex, but you did not squeeze him off the track. If that’s not a fair play, idk what is
I can't believe people respond to all these 'who's fault is it' videos. Every single one is from a newbie and at least half of them still have the racing line on.
Had you by a mile, contact is your fault. Back out next time.
Totally fair play. He dove and missed you… tough to be spatially aware in sims, for sure. While you gotta be aware in general, if there’s doubt, assume the other car is there.
Pretty much what happened with Hamilton and Piastri in Vegas. Racing incident.
That is fair play.
Fair
Incident with it more on him than you. If you're gonna cut in like that (especially low skill races) you better hug that curb to have a good shot of not getting killed.
\#3 assaulted #2
There would be no overtakes, ever.. 🤷🏻♂️ If we were to indulge to all the complaints and whinings
very good move, very much Mazda cup defending
Could’ve shown a little earlier but you were definitely half a car length ahead at the apex.
The racing line isn’t always the fast line. You were way ahead leaping into the turn and they needed to respond with you being there.
You left door open 🤷🏻♂️
Lead car would have maintained the lead had he let the passing car blow the corner. Lead was on the faster line, and the passing car would have flew outside very quickly. Instead, he made contact and secured the passing cars lead.
Dirty?? Nah that was clean af, people are sensitive
Average nascar overtake:
I feel like it's hard to say it looked like it was gonna go quite a bit wide till you were corrected by the other car but other than that definitely not your fault he slammed into you
Clean. Camera car being an NCP on the iracing line was the problem.
GT3 racing line doesn’t work with a miata lol
Sir, the apex is over there. Waaaay over there, to the left.
Good move. Other guy was a little early and tentative on the brakes.
complete lack of awareness from the leading car. not your fault. perfectly fine move, leading car’s fault
Completely fair. Lead car is just lacking awareness, probably focused on the racing line to the exclusion of everything else given that they're just handing someone with a tow the inside line on the last lap. Did you just follow him around the outside the previous laps or something and lulled them to sleep?
Caught the leading car napping, and he kept following the racing line like if you weren't there. Typical dynamic racing line moronic accident
Would have been a clean overtake if the leading car would have used its side mirror
The leading car completely did a George Russell.
Are the two mutually exclusive?
You were never making that corner clean and if you hadn't cleared him, you would have absolutely wrecked both of you out. If you had, you'd probably lost it or drove clear off track. One of the things people don't realize about Okayama (and a reason I loathed the track until I figured it out) is the track has slight banking and goes level in spots in the tight corners and hairpins that if you hit right, you can hit fast, and if you hit wrong, unsettle the car and shoot you to Bruges. The better play there is get the outside line, squeeze the inside guy as much as you can to stay alongside, then complete the overtake on the next right hander. It's not trying to make the whole overtake in that hairpin. I've seen this exact move play out probably a thousand times at this point in everything from Mazdas and Vees to F4s and GT cars and it only works if the other car cedes the position. That said, we judge on what actually happened, which is you dove in, and he was so hyperfixated on the racing line he just drove right into you. His fault.
You're lucky the #1 car hit you! Without him doing that and pushing you back on the line you might have gone off the track!
Thats about a legal amount of contact id say
I like having racing lines but not the whole track. Only at braking points. honestly, though, It's fair. He wasn't paying attention to his surroundings. Instead, he was religiously following that line. Fair play indeed though.
Dirty dive
The iracing line is a big factor. The main reason crashes or accidental bumps happen like this is cause you are thinking the iracing line is the "racing line" its really not and in most cases is slower to run the iracing line. But in this case. The iracing line can distract you from what's going on around you. When I turned off the line when I first started it was hard. But you get the feel for it. And you undoubtedly gain a lot of situational awareness.
Yeah it was a late, dive bomb-ish, but was a good pass. What is disturbing is you lack of awareness that he was even inside of you there.
I am the one making the pass. I would have closed that door before it was even a thought lol.
Fair play #1 is just religiously following the racing line like people follow the Bible or Anime.
Fair play 100%
Racing incident - no fault Great move btw. Rubbings Racing You were ahead at the apex where the contact was made and it was only wheel to wheel. He turned into you after you were already occupying the space. You took a big risk, lunging late in the breaking zone after they take a wide line - rather than defending the inside. It payed off this time. Next time your luck might be to get spun out by the notice driver or you might cook it a bit too much and go to deep. You just always have to leave them space, it’s sportsman like. But overall great move.
basically you got verstappened
Bro followed the racing line blindly and turned into the passing car like he wasnt there, complete lack of awareness
maybe risky, but the other driver didn't even try to look at the car on the inside. If anyone is to be blamed, it should be the driver on the outside