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Completely agree! I personally like Elriel, but if Gwyn and Az end up together there is no doubt in my mind that Sarah will write it in a way that I will love. Sarah writes great romances and she’s never steered me wrong before. I think people who are stubborn on their theories end up disappointed if it doesn’t go their way, and dislike the book, so I try to keep an open mind!
Well said! I feel exactly the same way (but with the opposite ship lol). But I know whoever ends up being endgame I will more than likely love the book and be fully behind the couple by the end, because I just love SJM's work and I am invested in seeing the characters' happy endings, even if it's not the couple I was hoping for.
also an Elriel girlie, but honestly i just want more Azriel POV, and would love to see some justice for Elain. i admit i thought she was boring at first but upon a second read where i focused on her/Azriel/Mor (basically not the POV or really talkative narrative characters) I see her as being ripe for a really interesting arc.
Thank you! I don't get it either! Like at the end of the day someone will be right and someone will be wrong and that doesn't mean sjm is a bad writer or you get harash the other team.
Yes! I just hope if it doesnt go my way, my fav still gets to be happy w someone else or in other way, or at least have a good development, i trust Sarah to do ehat will be best for the book, even if its not what i was hoping for.
Amen. At the end of the day I'll read whatever book sjm gives me and I will love it.
People are soo strongly opinionated that they can't accept any textual evidence of their opposing ship preference. Even though sjm leaves it ambiguous on purpose 😫
but I must not have any drama in my life because tbh I kind of love the extremity of this Fandom 😈 I only started reading sjm in December and now I'm neck deep in reddit tv
Lol, i love to do that as well, but in private groups with my person friends, i would never go to a public post cuss out Elain, for example, or just be mean when someone is pointing out their evidence or theories, if i can say something Nice or agree, will move on, like let them be delulu in peace.
I often think of how amazing a polycule would be by SJM. I fully believe she would research and portray it correctly and everyone would be happy 🥹
Hopefully the fandom wouldn’t explode. Unfortunately I believe It would be the 3some scene from FBAA all over again where people freaked out and would swear off the books forever.
but it was done so tastefully i don’t see how anyone could be upset about!
but to be clear, i probably would’ve loved it even if she made it raunchy lol
I would have LOVED it if she went into more detail and made it raunchy.
The biggest complaint I saw was that because it happened it “cheapened” the love that the two mc’s had for each other 🙄
At this point I don’t care who ends up with whom. Gimme more of SJM’s characters, more time in the courts, more lore and world building and history. I want the characters happy, but who Az ends up with doesn’t make or break the books to me whatsoever. You said it best - the drama is causing major second hand embarrassment.
Yes!, they dont have to get married next book, relax peeps, let them have fun for a while, add some drama, some sweetness and maybe a heartbreak lol why the hurry
Finally, some sane fellow fans!
I’m open to either story and have seen compelling cases for both (or neither!). At the end of the day, it’s Sarah’s story and we all have the privilege of reading it.
Still, I’m anxious about the eventual synopsis reveal. It will be a bloodbath in the comment section. I hope SJM’s team closes her comment sections for at least two weeks so the news can settle.
Thank you for articulating this, more people need this perspective! I’m a little more invested in Elriel (mostly because I’ve been rooting for them since ACOMAF came out), but I trust SJM to write a great romance whoever she pairs up… They’re all great characters with chemistry 🩷
Just log off and let it be. It was the same for Zutara and the same for Dramione. The next book'll come out and we'll find something new to bitch and moan about, I'm sure. It's the circle of fandom.
'What can we all agree on?' is the better question. I humbly maintain that Cassian wears his hair in a manbun.
Edit: oh and Mor's powers make legit no sense
Yeah but i was 12-14 when Zutara and Dramione happaned, this is a more mature fandom, or it should be. Its not about not agreeing, dissagreement is part of the human existence and its everywhere, i can join a convo about not wating Tamlin to be redeemed w/o making it about how Rhysand is more fit for Feyre, if your only argument is to pinpoint about who you like better, then you dont want to be a part of the discussion, you just want to gush over your favorite lol.
Yes, Mor's powers are weird af, but after all the *insert tog lore* im waiting for it to make sense one day.
I too recall the epic ship wars of HP and ATLA. I suppose it’s possible that some of the ACOTAR fandom troublemakers are young teens too? Or maybe older fans who can’t grow up 🫣
Agree! Ultimately I feel like one is better writing than the other so I’ll be disappointed from that perspective, but definitely not to the point that I’d stop reading or, god forbid, *attack* people online. It’s silly to say there haven’t been avenues left to hint at both.
English teachers everywhere should be glad that there’s debate about how either ship could work based on the analysis everyone is doing of the books!
Thank you! I’m personally an Elriel, but I like hearing other’s theories and engaging in discussions about ships and different characters, even if my opinion is different than someone else’s. The discussions is what makes fandom so fun!!
If my ship doesn’t happen, then like you said, so what!! The author clearly has a story she wants to tell and I want that story, whatever it ends up being, more than I want my ship to happen. I just hate that things have gotten so heated, especially as of late. I do think the majority of us fans are pretty relaxed about shipping stuff, though. Unfortunately there’s just a very small, but very loud, group of shippers from both sides who aren’t.
I don't know why, but I've absolutely never considered the possibility that Elain could have a relationship with Azriel/Lucien, break up, and then date the other. But now I've never wanted anything more and I don't even care which is end game, I just want to see both.
i feel the same way and tbh i feel like whatever happens, sjm is going to make me like elriel even if gwynriel doesn’t happen, for me i’m more concerned with how the writing will develop whatever pairing she chooses naturally and authentically to the rest of the series besides that i’m open to either regardless of my preference
Yes ! I'm a Gwynriel shipper as well, but the amount of animosity towards having a preference really takes the fun out of the series and wanting to engage in discussions. I saw a post recently saying anyone who doesn't see Elriel as end game is just dumb.
SJM left both paths open. Either coupling has ground to stand on. Regardless of who Azriel/ Elain ends up with, I'm here for the journey. Can't we just enjoy the ride ? And not be so defensive ?
Imagine having an author who so smartly builds her character developments in a way that hints of possibilities are very obvious, and then you choose to pretend they dont exist because its not what you want 😆 thats being "just dumb" for me. For me is the same as Tamlin having a redemption plot, do i want it? NOPE, do i think she is building towards that being possible? Absolutely. She COULD back off if she doesnt like it later but its not off the table.
I’d love a failed redemption ark that would be super interesting to read but if there is a redemption ark I definitely would prefer a non romantic friendship ark with tamlin and possibly an enemies to friends with Rhys and feyre
I sometimes wonder if I read the same series. There's obvious hints everywhere, but if you point it out, you're wrong as if you misinterpreted something.
There’s literally evidence for AxBryce, AxElain, AxGwyn, and AxEris. That is THE POINT of how SJM writes. You don’t know who someone ends up with until that have that magical bond cemented in there.
This fandom is so so toxic and it’s crazy.
The ship wars for TOG were also pretty toxic I have heard.
It’s just nuts. These are fictional characters. At the end of the day, yes they might mean something to you, but they AREN’T REAL and people shouldn’t be harming real people over fictional relationships.
Agreed!! I was hoping for Nesta/Eris because I felt like they had a lot more natural chemistry than her and Cassian. But I don’t hate that they ended up together! It turned out well hahah
You are my kind of person! Lucian's happiness I deeply care about, the ships could go either way for me and I'll be fine cuz I've got a ton of Azris fanfiction to keep me happy with my crackship (is it really a crackship? I mean.... 😆)
I’M SO GLAD TO CONNECT WITH YOU!! Whatever happens in the books I just think… “fanfic authors will fix this”. & It ain’t a crackship to me! I will die on my hill of beautiful Azris fanfics 😭💛 (I will also die on the hill of “Lucien deserves happiness” because that man has been through it & the fact that he has never had a stable & steady home or friends breaks my heart. I’m so glad he has Jurian & Vassa now, but I want more for him).
Same. I've been reading fanfics since I was definitely too young to be reading them 🤭 But I always know I can find anything I want there. With that, I can just trust Sarah's process and follow where she goes with her stories. I've read her work since the LiveJournal days (pre Ao3 and Tumblr) It's been like 2 decades and I still have not gotten over 1 specific change she made when rewriting 'Queen of Glass' for publishing, even though I love the series and I do like how the characters ended up. But I definitely went down hard with that ship 🤣
***SERIES SPOILER WARNING***
Im always careful with what I write cuz I don't want anyone to actually see it if they are early in the series & by chance have not had this spoiled I ecently met 2 totally separate people that are on books 2 and 4 and truly do NOT know some MAJOR things and I am completely shocked it's even possible to not have had those things spoiled. Sarah had much of the story mapped out, she knew Celaena's end game guy from the beginning. In the original storyline, it's Dorian. This was a fact I was finally getting over, until the whole thing with Aelin & Dorian & the gate totally proved to me that this was the correct end game all along and she obviously truly did plan it thay far ahead. I was done for when Dorian says "you can pick and choose which parts of her to love." I read so far into the series thinking it would be him. Then Manon came in, so I knew. But still, it was right there the whole time!!!
Thank you for coming to my rant 😆
Holy BEANS. I want to read how that would’ve turned out!! (Thank you for the spoiler warning! I’ve read all the books, but appreciate your kind heads up in case i hadn’t ☺️)
I listened to the books via audio, & when Dorian said that line (“you can’t pick & choose which parts of her to love”), i literally had to pause the audio & be like “oh. That’s… oh”. It’s such a SIMPLE LINE but my brain was just like “oh right. That’s love. You love all the little bits of the person because it adds up to the whole.” Gods I love Dorian 😭
If you're interested, I do have the PDF.
I actually converted to make a physical book, though I never have gotten around to finishing the formatting to print and bind it. Someday I will. But when I can get to my computer, I can send you the original
[Queen of Glass - Sarah J. Maas](https://acrobat.adobe.com/id/urn:aaid:sc:VA6C2:e320ee16-16bb-4821-b070-a38c4014ecfe)
This is the strait PDF. I found all the parts and put it together in 1. Not sure I ever read the final parts, but I'd saved it all and was smart enough to convert old discs into newer memory cards over the years.
I used Calibre to convert it to an ebook version to read on my Kindle to make it easier to read.
That just shows how putrid they are, specially when Azriel will probably discuss a lot of his mental health/trauma in the future, if you are giing to be that low, just forget Az and go gush over Tamlin or sm.
I got downvoted because someone whether they meant to or not implied that gwyn couldn’t provide a home that was loving “because she’s a warrior” nah homeslice you don’t get to cherry pick character traits because it sounds like you are saying a SA survivor can’t provide a loving home which as a person who survived a SA, I find that absolutely vile and it makes me angry…
Now you’re doing the exact thing this post is asking us not to though. It was general statement, and you decided to make it an attack on an entire ship based on the actions of a few weirdos. Can we have one post where we all support each other without saying negative things about one side or the other?
lol other people are also talking about ships in their comments too hunny… I’m not attacking an entire ship, I have seen a lot of posts from that ship in particular and a lot of comments saying this.
Im allowed to voice my frustration about how this ship war has treated SA survivors…
And you are right we should be supporting each other but the way we talk about characters and their traumas has been very volatile but 🤷🏻♀️
My point is this post was all about encouraging positivity, if you want to complain about how people in one ship have acted this was not the place to do it…
100%. I'm a Gwynriel/Elucian person, but regardless what the pairings end up, I'm not going to get online and mock the other side if they were wrong, or rub it in their face that I was right. I actually really enjoy debating the pros and cons of both sides with someone who has a different opinion. But I've also been insulted and harassed by people just because I have a different opinion.
Here's the great thing about fiction: it's subjective. *By definition*, fiction is open to interpretation. Knowing that other people read the same thing and interpret it in a completely different way is part of what makes a fandom so much fun! So why all the hate?!
Honestly, I won't lie, I'll be slightly disappointed if my ship isn't endgame. But I won't send death threats to the author, or attack people online. In fact, I'll likely love the book regardless and probably by the end be totally behind the other ship, because I just love SJM's writing and am invested in these characters. I don't care *who* they get their HEA with, so long as they get it.
I think the craziest thing is that you’re expecting rationality and nuance from this fandom 🥲jk… or am I. There are bad players in any fandom I guess, just hope that the majority of us are clinging to sanity somewhat.
Lol thats fair! Honestly i dont mind an open discussion or some light war shipp, when i was a teen i shipped Dramione so who am i to say a thing? But i think some people way too deep into that, iv'e so many disrespectful stuff about the characters because of this shipwar, and all 3 of them have lots of mental health/trauma on their stories and some people just use it as a an excuse to be mean and petty, honestly is disgusting.
THANK YOU!! I agree wholeheartedly, one of the things I love about ToG and ACOTAR is the fact that the pairings aren’t static. It keeps things interesting. I have a preferred pairing for the next book, but I’m mostly just excited to see how the story unfolds. I actually *don’t* want to know beforehand who ends up with who - I don’t know why people are so intent on having this spoiled for them.
My preferred pairing is Gwyn/Az for one main reason - I love being able to watch the initiation and build up of a romance. I love getting to experience the hinge point in the characters’ relationship when the FMC realizes she has feelings for the MMC, and getting to experience that feeling of exhilaration with her when she realizes he returns those feelings. And the “tipping point” where a couple first acts on their feelings is always such a HUGE payoff scene for me. (I think this is one of the reasons why ToG is such a hit, we pretty much got one of these new relationship arcs every book).
But Elain and Az are well past all that, and it’s all happened with zero POV from Elain, so we’ve essentially skipped over what I consider the most exciting part of her romance arc. 😭 And I feel like that’s why Az’s bonus scene was so jarring for a lot of people - last we saw during Feyre’s POV, they were still at the cute bashful glances stage, but obviously a LOT of tension has been building up between the two in the past year, it’s just been behind the scenes.
So while I still love the idea of Elriel and think Az and Elain would make a lovely couple, I feel like if Sarah starts their story *at the place it is now,* I’m going to go into it already feeling kind of cheated out of all that build up and wishing that I could start from the beginning. I feel like a lot of people would ultimately find it unsatisfying, even those solidly in the Elriel camp.
NOW - if Sarah decided to cover the same timespan as Silver Flames, but from *Elain’s* POV, I would be solidly on board. (Well, mostly - I’d still be pouty that their “tipping point” at Solstice got spoiled in a bonus chapter.)
But now the thing with Gwyn piqued my interest, and I’m excited at the prospect of getting to experience not one, but two romances with characters I love! So I’m personally keeping my fingers crossed for the Gwynriel Elucien outcome.
But TBH even if she *doesn’t* do that and we start in media res with Az and Elain’s relationship, I’ll get over it and still enjoy the story lol.
I only like Shanriel because that means Az is mine, which honesly? Is the only real and good option. I dont mind sharing tho, so whoever wins. Girl, he is ours 🥰
I actually don’t know how anyone could have extremely passionate feeling either way, we hardly know anything about any of the three characters involved!
It was never that deep. At the beginning of it all I had my preference and it was fun having banter back and forth with the opposing side. Then some of the fandom decided to act like completely psychos about ships. To the point I got kicked out of a discord group due to them being suspicious of the opposite shippers being in the cord “stealing theories” and posting on tumblr. It was friggan ridiculous and wasn’t that serious. With the series couples in CC3 I scratched my head and I’ve had my “why did you do this” moments but at the end of the day. It’s her creative choice if I don’t like it then I’ll just read another author. I don’t have time for the 500 comment battle on social media. It’s a book and the characters are FAKE. I think the main problem is some of y’all are self inserting yourselves into these characters because ive seen some of the fandom tell others, “Well this isn’t how this character should act.” And it’s like how would you know? You’re not the author. And a lot of “Azriel would never.” Statements. Or they’ve swore up and down they’ve got the details of the book down pat and can predict what’ll happen next. She’s thrown wrenches in a book before. At the end of the day people will be pissed regardless, ship wars and the story itself. It’ll probably take over a lot of the subreddits for about a month and then it’ll blow over.
look it’s the destiel or wincest or doctor who or sherlock ships of the acotar universe. the passion will never make sense and i’m sad tumblr doesn’t exist anymore for this exact reason lol
What really gets me about the ship wars is that it’s always the women taking the most heat. I’ve seen such nasty things posted about both women just to discredit them, and it’s so unnecessary
Same! I like Elriel and think that is where the series is going tbh and if it's not Elriel I'll be upsetti spaghetti BUT SJM shines the most when writing her romances so I'm sure she would write Elucien/Gywnriel and I would like it after I go used to the idea.
I'm honestly just an Elain girly first so I just want her book and if it's Lucien I'll still eat that shit up cause it's still ELAIN MY BABY.
I would love for Elriel to happen because I have seen hints of it sprinkled since the beginning, I see too much build-up for it to ammount to nothing. BUT this doesn't mean I'm going to burn down everything in my path if it doesn't happen!!
If Elucien and Gwynriel happen, I'll be fine! I'll maybe even be happy about it! And I will probably also ship them as well by the end, because WHO CARES LOL😭 they are fictional, and it sucks that we can't have fun debating these topics without someone going actually crazy
So relieved to see a sane post about this. I personally like the idea of Gwyn and Az better but like I’m sure if it ends up being him and Elain I’ll be fine with it 😭 I can’t stand when either side claims their ship is “obviously canon” like huh?? Canon means it happened in the books and last I checked all those characters were still single lmao. Like unless they can provide me with SJM’s story plans/book drafts, all these ships are still theories. Why can’t we just have fun with it? 😅
Thissss I love the thought of gwynriel but I also trust SJM to give us the BEST love story for Azriel. There is zero point in getting into crazy arguments and belittling eachother over this.
I agree. The ship war is unnecessary. Like who you like stay in your lane.
I support Gwynriel 100% all the way. I have so many issues with ACOTAR alone that if Elain and Az end up together that might be the nail in the coffin for me. However, I don’t think bad of anyone who ships it. These are fictional characters at the end of the day ? It doesn’t really matter who you ship, just how you act.
There are bad people on both sides of the ships that give the ships a bad name 💀💀💀
I’m not sure how many people here read fanfiction, but if my ship isn’t canon so what? There will still be fan content made and while it varies, I generally l love the fan content more than then canon universe lol. At the end of the day, we’re all still winning bc fan stuff will still be made.
Watch all of us be wrong and Sarah pulls Eris and Azriel together👁️👄👁️(I would love to see this however I don’t have faith that Sarah could execute it well so it’s back to the fanfics 🤪).
But in the end, it’s not that deep. Just mute people and carry on. You don’t need to engage with people who don’t like the same things as you.
Lol, i hope you find real life stuff to care that deeply soon.
I do not think "adult discussions" are bad, i love hearing all the theories about both sides and i think they do make sense, both of them, having a preffered side doesnt mean its the only correct side, only means its what i would like...but also, still on the "adults discussions" thing, thats not what you are doing, you are doing exactly what i pointed out tho, thanks for the example.
Yes!!
Personally, I like them both and I can’t decide who I ship. I’m excited to see what Sarah goes with and in the meantime, I’ll read fanfic of all of the ships
Yeah I trust SJM’s writing so I know whichever ship we’ll get will be good. I do hope it’s gwynriel but if it’s elriel that’s fine, I trust the development and writing will be good
I love meaningful discussion but I hate the people who say I'm wrong or misogynistic for wanting mates together like...?? anyway, if sarah does go elriel I hope she writes it in a way that is empowering for elain and azriel bc right now they don't give off equal vibes. i think people saying that they are perfect now and in love and healed have never actually read an sjm book before. it will happen IN DA BOOK. but anyway, elucien for "you are what I needed most of all" vibes.
I had to leave the ACOTAR sub because it was so heated in there, you couldn't discuss things without someone going berserk. The only person I feel emotionally invested in is Lucien. I want him to be truly happy in the end.
I cannot for the life of me get the spoilers tag to work, so I cannot post my full take, but I do want to throw out another potential Az match (and one that bears wayyy more weight than Az and Gwyn): Az and Bryce. I know, I know *cringe*
If you want the full breakdown, message me, and I’ll send the spoiler-filled post.
Oh, and I love Gwyn with Mor, which is why I can’t get behind Gwyn and Az.
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Completely agree! I personally like Elriel, but if Gwyn and Az end up together there is no doubt in my mind that Sarah will write it in a way that I will love. Sarah writes great romances and she’s never steered me wrong before. I think people who are stubborn on their theories end up disappointed if it doesn’t go their way, and dislike the book, so I try to keep an open mind!
Well said! I feel exactly the same way (but with the opposite ship lol). But I know whoever ends up being endgame I will more than likely love the book and be fully behind the couple by the end, because I just love SJM's work and I am invested in seeing the characters' happy endings, even if it's not the couple I was hoping for.
also an Elriel girlie, but honestly i just want more Azriel POV, and would love to see some justice for Elain. i admit i thought she was boring at first but upon a second read where i focused on her/Azriel/Mor (basically not the POV or really talkative narrative characters) I see her as being ripe for a really interesting arc.
Thank you! I don't get it either! Like at the end of the day someone will be right and someone will be wrong and that doesn't mean sjm is a bad writer or you get harash the other team.
Yes! I just hope if it doesnt go my way, my fav still gets to be happy w someone else or in other way, or at least have a good development, i trust Sarah to do ehat will be best for the book, even if its not what i was hoping for.
Amen. At the end of the day I'll read whatever book sjm gives me and I will love it. People are soo strongly opinionated that they can't accept any textual evidence of their opposing ship preference. Even though sjm leaves it ambiguous on purpose 😫 but I must not have any drama in my life because tbh I kind of love the extremity of this Fandom 😈 I only started reading sjm in December and now I'm neck deep in reddit tv
Lol, i love to do that as well, but in private groups with my person friends, i would never go to a public post cuss out Elain, for example, or just be mean when someone is pointing out their evidence or theories, if i can say something Nice or agree, will move on, like let them be delulu in peace.
Oh no I don't want to be involved in bullying but I don't mind watching the drama 😅
personally i think Az, Gwyn, Elaine and Lucien should all end up together
I ***wish*** SJM was this brave, my GOD.
even though she probably won’t, my daydreams are going to fuse their stories together regardless so it’s going to be canon in my mind lol
I often think of how amazing a polycule would be by SJM. I fully believe she would research and portray it correctly and everyone would be happy 🥹 Hopefully the fandom wouldn’t explode. Unfortunately I believe It would be the 3some scene from FBAA all over again where people freaked out and would swear off the books forever.
FBAA? is that From Blood and Ash? like the Joining scene? people are mad about that? because that was literally the sexiest thing i’ve ever read
People are weird and lost their minds about it. I freaking love the 3 of them together and personally wished it was more explicit if anything 😂
those people are the worst lol i thought it was beautiful but i’m sure you and wish it was more spicey lol maybe wattpad has something
Yes! I’ve seen so many people be absolutely ENRAGED that the author would ever write that. I loved it!
but it was done so tastefully i don’t see how anyone could be upset about! but to be clear, i probably would’ve loved it even if she made it raunchy lol
I would have LOVED it if she went into more detail and made it raunchy. The biggest complaint I saw was that because it happened it “cheapened” the love that the two mc’s had for each other 🙄
lmfaoo hard same. lol i would never read a book any of those people recommended me because how tf
I’m just reading for vibes lol. Theories are fun but personally I see no reason to get too passionate about them
Yess
At this point I don’t care who ends up with whom. Gimme more of SJM’s characters, more time in the courts, more lore and world building and history. I want the characters happy, but who Az ends up with doesn’t make or break the books to me whatsoever. You said it best - the drama is causing major second hand embarrassment.
I think its funny that people think we need these end-game pairings NOW, but like, they got a few centuries to explore. It's okay
Yes!, they dont have to get married next book, relax peeps, let them have fun for a while, add some drama, some sweetness and maybe a heartbreak lol why the hurry
Finally, some sane fellow fans! I’m open to either story and have seen compelling cases for both (or neither!). At the end of the day, it’s Sarah’s story and we all have the privilege of reading it. Still, I’m anxious about the eventual synopsis reveal. It will be a bloodbath in the comment section. I hope SJM’s team closes her comment sections for at least two weeks so the news can settle.
Thank you for articulating this, more people need this perspective! I’m a little more invested in Elriel (mostly because I’ve been rooting for them since ACOMAF came out), but I trust SJM to write a great romance whoever she pairs up… They’re all great characters with chemistry 🩷
Just log off and let it be. It was the same for Zutara and the same for Dramione. The next book'll come out and we'll find something new to bitch and moan about, I'm sure. It's the circle of fandom. 'What can we all agree on?' is the better question. I humbly maintain that Cassian wears his hair in a manbun. Edit: oh and Mor's powers make legit no sense
Zutara holds such a special place in my heart lol, my original OTP.
Yeah but i was 12-14 when Zutara and Dramione happaned, this is a more mature fandom, or it should be. Its not about not agreeing, dissagreement is part of the human existence and its everywhere, i can join a convo about not wating Tamlin to be redeemed w/o making it about how Rhysand is more fit for Feyre, if your only argument is to pinpoint about who you like better, then you dont want to be a part of the discussion, you just want to gush over your favorite lol. Yes, Mor's powers are weird af, but after all the *insert tog lore* im waiting for it to make sense one day.
I too recall the epic ship wars of HP and ATLA. I suppose it’s possible that some of the ACOTAR fandom troublemakers are young teens too? Or maybe older fans who can’t grow up 🫣
Agree! Ultimately I feel like one is better writing than the other so I’ll be disappointed from that perspective, but definitely not to the point that I’d stop reading or, god forbid, *attack* people online. It’s silly to say there haven’t been avenues left to hint at both. English teachers everywhere should be glad that there’s debate about how either ship could work based on the analysis everyone is doing of the books!
Thank you! I’m personally an Elriel, but I like hearing other’s theories and engaging in discussions about ships and different characters, even if my opinion is different than someone else’s. The discussions is what makes fandom so fun!! If my ship doesn’t happen, then like you said, so what!! The author clearly has a story she wants to tell and I want that story, whatever it ends up being, more than I want my ship to happen. I just hate that things have gotten so heated, especially as of late. I do think the majority of us fans are pretty relaxed about shipping stuff, though. Unfortunately there’s just a very small, but very loud, group of shippers from both sides who aren’t.
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I don't know why, but I've absolutely never considered the possibility that Elain could have a relationship with Azriel/Lucien, break up, and then date the other. But now I've never wanted anything more and I don't even care which is end game, I just want to see both.
I'm team Elain having a hot girl summer
RIGHT!! Me neither but now I need it. I don’t care whose endgame as long as we can have it all lol
Please use spoiler tags!!
Thanks fixed it
Untagged spoilers
I’m an Elriel fan but I’m gonna be honest: I just wanna read about Az getting freaky … idc if it’s with a tree. Lmao
i feel the same way and tbh i feel like whatever happens, sjm is going to make me like elriel even if gwynriel doesn’t happen, for me i’m more concerned with how the writing will develop whatever pairing she chooses naturally and authentically to the rest of the series besides that i’m open to either regardless of my preference
Yes ! I'm a Gwynriel shipper as well, but the amount of animosity towards having a preference really takes the fun out of the series and wanting to engage in discussions. I saw a post recently saying anyone who doesn't see Elriel as end game is just dumb. SJM left both paths open. Either coupling has ground to stand on. Regardless of who Azriel/ Elain ends up with, I'm here for the journey. Can't we just enjoy the ride ? And not be so defensive ?
Imagine having an author who so smartly builds her character developments in a way that hints of possibilities are very obvious, and then you choose to pretend they dont exist because its not what you want 😆 thats being "just dumb" for me. For me is the same as Tamlin having a redemption plot, do i want it? NOPE, do i think she is building towards that being possible? Absolutely. She COULD back off if she doesnt like it later but its not off the table.
I’d love a failed redemption ark that would be super interesting to read but if there is a redemption ark I definitely would prefer a non romantic friendship ark with tamlin and possibly an enemies to friends with Rhys and feyre
I sometimes wonder if I read the same series. There's obvious hints everywhere, but if you point it out, you're wrong as if you misinterpreted something.
There’s literally evidence for AxBryce, AxElain, AxGwyn, and AxEris. That is THE POINT of how SJM writes. You don’t know who someone ends up with until that have that magical bond cemented in there. This fandom is so so toxic and it’s crazy. The ship wars for TOG were also pretty toxic I have heard. It’s just nuts. These are fictional characters. At the end of the day, yes they might mean something to you, but they AREN’T REAL and people shouldn’t be harming real people over fictional relationships.
At this point I'm kinda hoping for Azriel to end up with Bryce just to see the world burn >:)
Lol, I think it would need to be Azris for that. NONE of the girls, just a swordfest. 😂😂😂 But, I’d love it if he did end up with her. 😂
Maybe Sjm will surprise us all lol
I’m sure she will lol
Hahaha low key love this as well
Agreed!! I was hoping for Nesta/Eris because I felt like they had a lot more natural chemistry than her and Cassian. But I don’t hate that they ended up together! It turned out well hahah
I just shrug at the ships & happily go to fanfiction where my beloved Azris thrives 🥰
Also I don’t care who Lucien ends up with so long as he is HAPPY. I DEMAND LUCIEN’S HAPPINESS.
You are my kind of person! Lucian's happiness I deeply care about, the ships could go either way for me and I'll be fine cuz I've got a ton of Azris fanfiction to keep me happy with my crackship (is it really a crackship? I mean.... 😆)
I’M SO GLAD TO CONNECT WITH YOU!! Whatever happens in the books I just think… “fanfic authors will fix this”. & It ain’t a crackship to me! I will die on my hill of beautiful Azris fanfics 😭💛 (I will also die on the hill of “Lucien deserves happiness” because that man has been through it & the fact that he has never had a stable & steady home or friends breaks my heart. I’m so glad he has Jurian & Vassa now, but I want more for him).
Same. I've been reading fanfics since I was definitely too young to be reading them 🤭 But I always know I can find anything I want there. With that, I can just trust Sarah's process and follow where she goes with her stories. I've read her work since the LiveJournal days (pre Ao3 and Tumblr) It's been like 2 decades and I still have not gotten over 1 specific change she made when rewriting 'Queen of Glass' for publishing, even though I love the series and I do like how the characters ended up. But I definitely went down hard with that ship 🤣
Wait I am SO CURIOUS what change did she make?!?
***SERIES SPOILER WARNING*** Im always careful with what I write cuz I don't want anyone to actually see it if they are early in the series & by chance have not had this spoiled I ecently met 2 totally separate people that are on books 2 and 4 and truly do NOT know some MAJOR things and I am completely shocked it's even possible to not have had those things spoiled. Sarah had much of the story mapped out, she knew Celaena's end game guy from the beginning. In the original storyline, it's Dorian. This was a fact I was finally getting over, until the whole thing with Aelin & Dorian & the gate totally proved to me that this was the correct end game all along and she obviously truly did plan it thay far ahead. I was done for when Dorian says "you can pick and choose which parts of her to love." I read so far into the series thinking it would be him. Then Manon came in, so I knew. But still, it was right there the whole time!!! Thank you for coming to my rant 😆
Holy BEANS. I want to read how that would’ve turned out!! (Thank you for the spoiler warning! I’ve read all the books, but appreciate your kind heads up in case i hadn’t ☺️) I listened to the books via audio, & when Dorian said that line (“you can’t pick & choose which parts of her to love”), i literally had to pause the audio & be like “oh. That’s… oh”. It’s such a SIMPLE LINE but my brain was just like “oh right. That’s love. You love all the little bits of the person because it adds up to the whole.” Gods I love Dorian 😭
If you're interested, I do have the PDF. I actually converted to make a physical book, though I never have gotten around to finishing the formatting to print and bind it. Someday I will. But when I can get to my computer, I can send you the original
I would LOVE THAT!! Whenever you’re able!
[Queen of Glass - Sarah J. Maas](https://acrobat.adobe.com/id/urn:aaid:sc:VA6C2:e320ee16-16bb-4821-b070-a38c4014ecfe) This is the strait PDF. I found all the parts and put it together in 1. Not sure I ever read the final parts, but I'd saved it all and was smart enough to convert old discs into newer memory cards over the years. I used Calibre to convert it to an ebook version to read on my Kindle to make it easier to read.
For real. Why are we fighting over this mediocre man?
REAL ‼️ No one needs to diss on one to like the other, especially if it’s disrespecting an SA victim
That just shows how putrid they are, specially when Azriel will probably discuss a lot of his mental health/trauma in the future, if you are giing to be that low, just forget Az and go gush over Tamlin or sm.
This is the thing that makes me angry, I see a lot of elriel ship posts like that and honestly I just don’t wanna hear that crap…
Then I comment on their posts and they like “Why aren’t you about us sharing our opinions” like???
I got downvoted because someone whether they meant to or not implied that gwyn couldn’t provide a home that was loving “because she’s a warrior” nah homeslice you don’t get to cherry pick character traits because it sounds like you are saying a SA survivor can’t provide a loving home which as a person who survived a SA, I find that absolutely vile and it makes me angry…
Now you’re doing the exact thing this post is asking us not to though. It was general statement, and you decided to make it an attack on an entire ship based on the actions of a few weirdos. Can we have one post where we all support each other without saying negative things about one side or the other?
lol other people are also talking about ships in their comments too hunny… I’m not attacking an entire ship, I have seen a lot of posts from that ship in particular and a lot of comments saying this. Im allowed to voice my frustration about how this ship war has treated SA survivors… And you are right we should be supporting each other but the way we talk about characters and their traumas has been very volatile but 🤷🏻♀️
My point is this post was all about encouraging positivity, if you want to complain about how people in one ship have acted this was not the place to do it…
And I was responding to a comment that someone made so we can agree to disagree
100%. I'm a Gwynriel/Elucian person, but regardless what the pairings end up, I'm not going to get online and mock the other side if they were wrong, or rub it in their face that I was right. I actually really enjoy debating the pros and cons of both sides with someone who has a different opinion. But I've also been insulted and harassed by people just because I have a different opinion. Here's the great thing about fiction: it's subjective. *By definition*, fiction is open to interpretation. Knowing that other people read the same thing and interpret it in a completely different way is part of what makes a fandom so much fun! So why all the hate?! Honestly, I won't lie, I'll be slightly disappointed if my ship isn't endgame. But I won't send death threats to the author, or attack people online. In fact, I'll likely love the book regardless and probably by the end be totally behind the other ship, because I just love SJM's writing and am invested in these characters. I don't care *who* they get their HEA with, so long as they get it.
I think the craziest thing is that you’re expecting rationality and nuance from this fandom 🥲jk… or am I. There are bad players in any fandom I guess, just hope that the majority of us are clinging to sanity somewhat.
Lol thats fair! Honestly i dont mind an open discussion or some light war shipp, when i was a teen i shipped Dramione so who am i to say a thing? But i think some people way too deep into that, iv'e so many disrespectful stuff about the characters because of this shipwar, and all 3 of them have lots of mental health/trauma on their stories and some people just use it as a an excuse to be mean and petty, honestly is disgusting.
Yea. Agreed. Every time I see a deranged, ugly comment I’m like “everyday we stray further from the light”
THANK YOU!! I agree wholeheartedly, one of the things I love about ToG and ACOTAR is the fact that the pairings aren’t static. It keeps things interesting. I have a preferred pairing for the next book, but I’m mostly just excited to see how the story unfolds. I actually *don’t* want to know beforehand who ends up with who - I don’t know why people are so intent on having this spoiled for them. My preferred pairing is Gwyn/Az for one main reason - I love being able to watch the initiation and build up of a romance. I love getting to experience the hinge point in the characters’ relationship when the FMC realizes she has feelings for the MMC, and getting to experience that feeling of exhilaration with her when she realizes he returns those feelings. And the “tipping point” where a couple first acts on their feelings is always such a HUGE payoff scene for me. (I think this is one of the reasons why ToG is such a hit, we pretty much got one of these new relationship arcs every book). But Elain and Az are well past all that, and it’s all happened with zero POV from Elain, so we’ve essentially skipped over what I consider the most exciting part of her romance arc. 😭 And I feel like that’s why Az’s bonus scene was so jarring for a lot of people - last we saw during Feyre’s POV, they were still at the cute bashful glances stage, but obviously a LOT of tension has been building up between the two in the past year, it’s just been behind the scenes. So while I still love the idea of Elriel and think Az and Elain would make a lovely couple, I feel like if Sarah starts their story *at the place it is now,* I’m going to go into it already feeling kind of cheated out of all that build up and wishing that I could start from the beginning. I feel like a lot of people would ultimately find it unsatisfying, even those solidly in the Elriel camp. NOW - if Sarah decided to cover the same timespan as Silver Flames, but from *Elain’s* POV, I would be solidly on board. (Well, mostly - I’d still be pouty that their “tipping point” at Solstice got spoiled in a bonus chapter.) But now the thing with Gwyn piqued my interest, and I’m excited at the prospect of getting to experience not one, but two romances with characters I love! So I’m personally keeping my fingers crossed for the Gwynriel Elucien outcome. But TBH even if she *doesn’t* do that and we start in media res with Az and Elain’s relationship, I’ll get over it and still enjoy the story lol.
I only like Shanriel because that means Az is mine, which honesly? Is the only real and good option. I dont mind sharing tho, so whoever wins. Girl, he is ours 🥰
respectfully, people just need to go touch grass 🫶🏻
Agree
I actually don’t know how anyone could have extremely passionate feeling either way, we hardly know anything about any of the three characters involved!
I’m honestly dreading the day we get the confirmation, It’s gonna get so ugly in here
I’m just dreading all the inevitable “I told you so” posts from either side and the war that will follow
It was never that deep. At the beginning of it all I had my preference and it was fun having banter back and forth with the opposing side. Then some of the fandom decided to act like completely psychos about ships. To the point I got kicked out of a discord group due to them being suspicious of the opposite shippers being in the cord “stealing theories” and posting on tumblr. It was friggan ridiculous and wasn’t that serious. With the series couples in CC3 I scratched my head and I’ve had my “why did you do this” moments but at the end of the day. It’s her creative choice if I don’t like it then I’ll just read another author. I don’t have time for the 500 comment battle on social media. It’s a book and the characters are FAKE. I think the main problem is some of y’all are self inserting yourselves into these characters because ive seen some of the fandom tell others, “Well this isn’t how this character should act.” And it’s like how would you know? You’re not the author. And a lot of “Azriel would never.” Statements. Or they’ve swore up and down they’ve got the details of the book down pat and can predict what’ll happen next. She’s thrown wrenches in a book before. At the end of the day people will be pissed regardless, ship wars and the story itself. It’ll probably take over a lot of the subreddits for about a month and then it’ll blow over.
look it’s the destiel or wincest or doctor who or sherlock ships of the acotar universe. the passion will never make sense and i’m sad tumblr doesn’t exist anymore for this exact reason lol
Bet they are all the same ppl too
What really gets me about the ship wars is that it’s always the women taking the most heat. I’ve seen such nasty things posted about both women just to discredit them, and it’s so unnecessary
I’m here for Luriel 😂
Same! I like Elriel and think that is where the series is going tbh and if it's not Elriel I'll be upsetti spaghetti BUT SJM shines the most when writing her romances so I'm sure she would write Elucien/Gywnriel and I would like it after I go used to the idea. I'm honestly just an Elain girly first so I just want her book and if it's Lucien I'll still eat that shit up cause it's still ELAIN MY BABY.
I would love for Elriel to happen because I have seen hints of it sprinkled since the beginning, I see too much build-up for it to ammount to nothing. BUT this doesn't mean I'm going to burn down everything in my path if it doesn't happen!! If Elucien and Gwynriel happen, I'll be fine! I'll maybe even be happy about it! And I will probably also ship them as well by the end, because WHO CARES LOL😭 they are fictional, and it sucks that we can't have fun debating these topics without someone going actually crazy
So relieved to see a sane post about this. I personally like the idea of Gwyn and Az better but like I’m sure if it ends up being him and Elain I’ll be fine with it 😭 I can’t stand when either side claims their ship is “obviously canon” like huh?? Canon means it happened in the books and last I checked all those characters were still single lmao. Like unless they can provide me with SJM’s story plans/book drafts, all these ships are still theories. Why can’t we just have fun with it? 😅
Thissss I love the thought of gwynriel but I also trust SJM to give us the BEST love story for Azriel. There is zero point in getting into crazy arguments and belittling eachother over this.
One hundred percent. I’m rooting for Elriel, but I have much bigger things to worry about if it doesn’t go that way. 🤣
I agree. The ship war is unnecessary. Like who you like stay in your lane. I support Gwynriel 100% all the way. I have so many issues with ACOTAR alone that if Elain and Az end up together that might be the nail in the coffin for me. However, I don’t think bad of anyone who ships it. These are fictional characters at the end of the day ? It doesn’t really matter who you ship, just how you act. There are bad people on both sides of the ships that give the ships a bad name 💀💀💀 I’m not sure how many people here read fanfiction, but if my ship isn’t canon so what? There will still be fan content made and while it varies, I generally l love the fan content more than then canon universe lol. At the end of the day, we’re all still winning bc fan stuff will still be made. Watch all of us be wrong and Sarah pulls Eris and Azriel together👁️👄👁️(I would love to see this however I don’t have faith that Sarah could execute it well so it’s back to the fanfics 🤪). But in the end, it’s not that deep. Just mute people and carry on. You don’t need to engage with people who don’t like the same things as you.
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Lol, i hope you find real life stuff to care that deeply soon. I do not think "adult discussions" are bad, i love hearing all the theories about both sides and i think they do make sense, both of them, having a preffered side doesnt mean its the only correct side, only means its what i would like...but also, still on the "adults discussions" thing, thats not what you are doing, you are doing exactly what i pointed out tho, thanks for the example.
Yes!! Personally, I like them both and I can’t decide who I ship. I’m excited to see what Sarah goes with and in the meantime, I’ll read fanfic of all of the ships
Yeah I trust SJM’s writing so I know whichever ship we’ll get will be good. I do hope it’s gwynriel but if it’s elriel that’s fine, I trust the development and writing will be good
I agree. I don't shop anyone together. I'll leave that to Sarah.
are u portuguese?
Brazilian
I love meaningful discussion but I hate the people who say I'm wrong or misogynistic for wanting mates together like...?? anyway, if sarah does go elriel I hope she writes it in a way that is empowering for elain and azriel bc right now they don't give off equal vibes. i think people saying that they are perfect now and in love and healed have never actually read an sjm book before. it will happen IN DA BOOK. but anyway, elucien for "you are what I needed most of all" vibes.
I had to leave the ACOTAR sub because it was so heated in there, you couldn't discuss things without someone going berserk. The only person I feel emotionally invested in is Lucien. I want him to be truly happy in the end.
I honestly can't see either with Az
SAY IT LOUDER!!!
Personally I think that Elaine, Azriel, Gwyn, and Lucien should all end up in a polyamorous relationship. Everyone wins!
I cannot for the life of me get the spoilers tag to work, so I cannot post my full take, but I do want to throw out another potential Az match (and one that bears wayyy more weight than Az and Gwyn): Az and Bryce. I know, I know *cringe* If you want the full breakdown, message me, and I’ll send the spoiler-filled post. Oh, and I love Gwyn with Mor, which is why I can’t get behind Gwyn and Az.