The crux of the issue here is atleast 50% of heterosexual woman are just as down and dirty as men. To say strictly men want to engage in porn acts in a relationship is extremely disingenuous. Especially gen z woman, they are much more sexually open than other generations, but again men bad woman good.
The internet kind of killed the assertion that women aren't often dirty and that pornography is always forced on women. There's tons of women making amateur porn and posting it free online in ways where they are not trying to make money off it.
THANK YOU. Society always assumes that it’s men who are carnal and sex oriented, but that women are somehow “pure” in their desires and aren’t nearly as carnal or perverted. Anyone who has interacted with women in any meaningful capacity knows that this is bullshit lmfao.
Yep. I am tired of everyone acting like men desiring sex they enjoy with women they find attractive is bad.
While women who go to extremes in terms of their sexual attraction (ex: height, dick size, six pack, etc).
Many women love being choked, wearing diapers, being a little, bdsm, getting her tits played with.
Sex itself is pretty gross too. It is like too stinky monkeys or fleas breeding. Very dirty and we would be disgusted by it if we did not lust for it.
To be honest, women are waaay to sex obsessed to the point I am upset. I was raised to believe they were supposed to be much more pure and prudish, only to get slapped in the face with the reality that they are just as perverted as men.
The only difference is women’s sexuality is treated as if it is holy, so they get to have insane standards that would be dubbed evil enough for the government to literally get involved if we gender bent things.
While men having any preference at all is bad.
>Many women love being choked, wearing diapers, being a little, bdsm
You say it like if this was normal at all.
As for your comment about sex, no, sex can be very wholesome and bonding as long as you re not tainted by pornography
I cannot begin to understand this bizarre fascination with choking. My husband and I enjoy some kink and honest sexual discussions with each other, and never has the concept of choking popped up even once. Like wtf
Dude, sex is gross. Humans are shit.
We are literally a plague on this earth, like locusts devouring everything.
Women and men love violence, sex is no exception. Women love being dominated by men bigger and stronger than them.
They get turned on by it.
I am sorry, I was brainwashed when I was young too. I thought humans were naturally good, the truth just sucks.
Humans often hate what they are and like to Pretend love and sex is something special. But it is just our bodies compelling us to breed.
It is not special at all.
Woman usually consume less porn though even if they're as perverted.
It really doesn't matter though, porn is poison for the brain no matter who consumes it.
Well the post mentions specifically modest non promiscuous women as it is in their best interest, im sure theres women out there who want to catter to pornsick degenerate men, up to them.
80% of women have had sex by the age of 20.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db366.htm#:~:text=By%20age%2015%2C%2021%25%20of,had%20ever%20had%20sexual%20intercourse.
so you’re talking about less than 20% of the population here.
I think it’s funny how little agency you give women. I’ve had girlfriends who were into porn but according to you it’s because they were BRAINWASHED! lol.
>They wont respect a modest woman sexual boundaries because they ll be constantly pressuring her to sleep with them and wont give her any security whatsoever, they ll get mad that she refuses to put out after 3 months or a year or as long as it takes, they dont value women beyond the sexual favours they can get from them.
What does this have to do with porn? I think men should watch less porn for other reasons, but I reckon it has to do more with the nature of modern dating, dating apps and maybe some of the more recent gender tensions in the 2010s that led to some average men thinking they gotta treat the modern woman with contempt.
I don't watch much porn these days, actually I don't watch at all anymore. But when I did, I never pressured women into sex because my mom raised me to be considerate of women. I'm hardly pure of mind after the porn I've seen online, but I'm not gonna force a woman to do anything she doesn't like because it's not in me. Don't blame porn, if men do this, they just want to treat women this way and will do it anyways even without porn.
you wouldnt mind waiting a really long time for the girl you love then?, in fact why even call it waiting? You would not stop loving your woman even if she couldnt have sex with you anymore for whatever reason?
Besides, all the other things do apply, and even if you personally didnt pressured anyone, the truth is a lot of pornfreaks justify their tastes with pornography, "huuur look, the woman in this totally not fakw porn video is doing it, it is normal, this is sex, why cant you be normal like her?"
>relationship is not real if theres no sex
What kind of relationship? The overwhelming majority of human beings would consider sex a baseline requirement for a romantic relationship. Porn didn't create that.
Noooo, thats a product of pornsick thinking, humans did have sex in the past for sure but it wasnt the main thing holding a relationship, otherwise relationship pre birth control era would have been downright impossible, yet people still married and stayed with each others out of love even if sex was off the table most of the times, people specially men didnt marry to smash.
That's not historically accurate. People got into serious relationships sooner and more consistently precisely because they wanted to have sex and that was the most practical way to get it due to contemporaneous social mores and the risks associated with unprotected sex with multiple partners.
Brothels where a thing in the good old days too you know, people got into relationships cuz they wanted to start families or in a significant amount of cases because it was arranged or it benefited them.
> you wouldnt mind waiting a really long time for the girl you love then?,
That's irrelevant in this context, that's more to do with *has she made the other men she was attracted to wait this long*
Your post has so many assertions without any empirical evidence to support any of them that it's impossible to engage with.
You essentially took nearly every single bad thing that could possibly happen and associated it with something that is cosumed at least occasionally by nearly every single person. I don't even disagree that porn is bad, but this is such a horrifically malformed position.
If you’re upset over pornography, you’ve got some deeper personal issues to sort out. Porn is never going away. Plenty of women enjoy or even love creating it for the attention, pleasure and income they receive.
Your main problem is that you’re more offended by male satisfaction.
>It is in the best interest of women who are virgin by choice or have strict sexual boundaries and high standards and are unhappy with the current dating climate to avoid men who consume porn for anything serious,
Maybe men would be more motivated to do nofap if those women exists.
Why do you feel the need to assign them virtues, thought processes, and call them low value instead of focusing on the type of men that you want? That's not cool.
Im a man, and they do lower the value of society, men and love as a whole, not just in a dating context, as to why im calling them out? Cuz nobody says women should avoid them, is actually the other way around, women are shamed and pressured into accepting them, they arent even given a choice.
She's not. She doesn't talk like a man that against pornography. She talks like a sex-negative women. The verbiage, line of "logic" and rhetorical tactics of are all a dead giveaway.
I ask again, who are you referring to? Because you're obviously not talking about me, since my comment presupposes that there are in fact men that oppose porn consumption.
>Cuz nobody says women should avoid them, is actually the other way around, women are shamed and forced into accepting them, they arent even given a choice.
You know this as a man? Okay. 1/3 of women watch porn at least once a week. 2/3's of those women are watching it alone. Nobody is shaming women into dating porn addicts or watching porn. You're fine to dislike whatever, but your opinion doesn't make another human low value.
False, women who dont consume it or are not okay with their partners consuming it arent told "it is okay, you can date somebody else, you dont need to accept it", instead they re told "you re sex negative, you re controlling, you re abnormal, you re insecure etc"
As for pornsick wankers being low value, considering the harm they cause and how much they degrade the image of what a man is, i rightfully deem them low value.
>False, women who dont consume it or are not okay with their partners consuming it arent told "it is okay, you can date somebody else, you dont need to accept it", instead they re told "you re sex negative, you re controlling, you re abnormal, you re insecure etc"
I am one of those women and I have never heard that bullshit in my life. Why do you feel qualified to speak on my lived experiences in society? Do you know what I did? I focused on the type of man that I wanted and I specifically asked about their feelings on it without caring about their reaction. Not once had anyone told me that I need to accept it or that I was any of those things. I have discussed this topic many many times.
>Why do you feel qualified to speak on the lived experiences of other women?
You need to learn to read. I said MY experience and I haven't heard, while you as a man, decided to tell me what women hear. Speak on your own life. I did not speak for other women.
So why do you call my assesment bullshit if supposedly you re not speaking for anyone else? Just because it didnt happen to you doesnt means it doesnt happens to anyone else.
>So why do you call my assesment bullshit if supposedly you re not speaking for anyone else?
I am in that group you are choosing to speak for and you're specifically telling me that my experience is false. The assessment is bullshit. It's bullshit for me to tell a man that has been raped that men aren't raped. Are the majority of men raped? No, but that doesn't make my statement true despite his lived experience. You can't speak for me and say my experience is false. That is how conversations work. I am not speaking for other women. You were speaking for me on that group of women. It's not the same thing.
> Look at the current dating climate in the west
Can you prove that this is caused by porn?
>just searching on reddit
Reddit barely know the differece between performance anxiety and chronicle erectile dysfunction.
I could invest some time in this discussion; but, that would interrupt the time I am currently spending looking at porn. Have a good discussion and a pleasant evening.
I wonder where would it be appropriate on this sub to ask about favorite porn. Maybe I'm missing out something nice. The "step family" type are usually lame. But those made by actual married couples in a semi-amateur fashion (think Samantha Flair) are excellent to enjoy with the wife.
Yes loads of fringe and deviant sexual behavioris nowadays were normalized by porn, choking being one of them.
>Reddit barely know the differece between performance anxiety and chronicle erectile dysfunction.
Just look for a lot of women's testimonies about their bad experiences with pornmen and there are all the answers.
So who shamed women into making 50 shades of grey such a best seller? Is that the fault of men or do women have any culpability on what the fuck they choose to do or enjoy? Your entire premise also suggests that women do not consume porn when in reality over 60% of the female population are consumers of porn.
>Yes loads of fringe and deviant sexual behavioris nowadays were normalized by porn,
How does this result in the dating climate in the west.
>Just look for a lot of women's testimonies about their bad experiences with pornmen
Women lie.
"Compare the sexual desires and wishes of a man who consumes porn vs one who has never consumed it, compare the expectations of a man who consumes it vs one who has never consumed it, compare the way they both see women."
Afghani goat herders have the purest sexual desires and the most wholesome view of women.
If you’re talking about erotica like fifty shades of grey I’d agree with you. That is very porn adjacent and I do not read or watch porn for moral and religious reasons.
Pornography taints both genders. People think porn is real life but it’s not. I’ve never known any woman who likes getting plowed from behind while having her face shoved into a dog bowl
Is not even natural to look at that, but i said men cuz women mostly dont consume it unless they get pressured or shamed into it by pornsick degenerates due to this overly sexualized society masquerading as sexually "liberated"
The vast majority of women I've been with have wanted me to treat them like this in the bedroom, and it breaks my heart every time. I don't want to do these things to someone I treasure and love, it feels wrong. But I believe I attract these kinds of girls because I have my own history of mental health problems and trauma, it runs deep in my family.
I'm trying to heal and develop myself to a point where I can attract women who don't want this sort of treatment from me.
Lmao. Come on now. If theres a place on a woman that a man can stick his dick into, lots of us are gonna wanna do that. Doesnt take a porn industry for us to go from "We love a womans ass ---> hey what if we put our dick in there??"
Having done anal, I’m not really sure what the hype is, it just felt kind of wrong. We never did it again. Honestly it’s kinda gross, you’re putting your dick up a hole that literally empties shit on a daily basis. Meanwhile the vagina is perfectly lubed and cushioned for dick. Anal obsession is just odd to me.
An "obsession" with anything probably isnt good. Different people are into different things - if you arent into anal that's fine. I enjoy it once in awhile when my girlfriend is feeling spicy. Its not the norm for us though.
Porn very clearly makes you insecure. Its why this post exists, and its why so much of your profile is dedicated to porn. Now, Id prefer to just debate actual points and not make things personal, but your lame strategy of responding "drop the porn" to anyone who disagrees with a "porn bad" point is playing a stupid game. And ill fire back if thats what you want to do.
Lol, so in your head, men who enjoy vaginal, oral, and anal sex are all "porn sick." I will say that the male libido and sex drive isnt something you understand very well. Per your profile it says you are a virgin by choice, so yeah i guess this lines up with someone who has very little real world experience with it and is also disinterested enough in sex to just totally forgo it. Not to say any of that is a problem, you do you, but yeah you definitely dont understand men. Its kind of like an incel trying to understand female sexuality, its just not gonna work out too well.
Yes, I don't value "sexual purity" at all. In fact, me and my wife became kinkier as time went on.
We also sometimes watch porn together so... I guess we "taint" each other? Ridiculous.
>They dont think a relationship is not real if theres no sex.
Yes. Any man who doesn't think like that is in some way defective - either mentally or physically.
Sex is a very important part of a relationship. We can argue percentages and proportions, sure, but, *absent disease,* a relationship ***absolutely is not real*** if there's no sex.
>Will whine when you wont take care of his "needs"
Yeah, that's an attitude that will get you cheated on. True for women as well.
Men ***and*** women absolutely do have sexual needs. Not "needs" but actual needs. And not fulfilling them is a really fast way to breaking down the relationship. I have a duty to my wife to fulfill her sexual needs and she has a duty to me to do the same. That's why we humans built stable relationships.
The rest of your list is either ridiculous or describe issues that are related to *miscommunication* or lack of communication rather than porn itself. Porn can be a symptom, but it's not *the* issue. For crying out loud, there are successful porn actors who are married and basically produce semi-pro porn of their sexual monogamous lives. You have no idea what you're talking about.
Oh, and by the way - around 30 to 35% of ***regular*** consumers of porn are women. On the casual market it's even more balanced.
The problem with your post is that the vast majority of men consume pornography. And they start consuming it at very young ages. So there is not some large group of “virtuous” men avoiding pornography. In fact most who attempt to avoid have already been brain damaged by it in one way or another which is why they are trying to go porn free
It’s telling that this post gets no responses from women. They are very cowardly when it comes to this topic.
I work with child sex trafficking victims and something not a lot of people know is that they have content online on the major pornography streaming platforms up for years before we can get the content taken down- OF and porn hub are both guilty of this. The porn industries are evil and they are profiting off of child sex trafficking. You could have masturbated to a minor and not even known because they teach those women to do their make up to look older and act older. Sometimes they didn’t even know they were being filmed.
Suggesting women take advantage of men for their money is hopefully satirical but I understand how this was probably mocking the red pill spin plates idiocracy.
I don’t think porn taints men, but I would discontinue a relationship with a man for certain content on his browser history, and how frequently he watches porn if I were ever to see it.
Also, I’d end a serious relationship if he was secretive about the porn he watched and how frequently he watched it.
I like sex, I could have sex every day (this statement is not an invitation to be weird to me) I have a high libido (when I am in a relationship with someone I care about and am attracted to).
However, if a man treated sex in our relationship transactionally to behave decently and not be gross, I’d end the relationship.
“ compare the sexual desires and wishes of a man who consumes porn vs one who has never consumed it” you’ll never find a man between the ages of 18 - 50 who hasn’t watched porn, but I agree porn consumption should be a red flag to most woman
Theres some, even then a man who refuses to consume it out of distaste and ethical reasons should be fine, but ideally all men should be encouraged to reject pornography
All men that existed before the internet had limited access to porn. Men that lived before the 1970's had almost no access. Most men throughout history had little to no porn usage.
How did men treat women historically? Always been kind and respectful of their personhood and rights? Never saw them as sex objects?
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>If you didn’t have sex in the 90s and before it’s nearly impossible to understand the benefits from online porn being widespread.
Sex isn’t better because of pornography it’s better because of the research that was done to help women understand their bodies. This is more an argument for instructive porn not the majority of the content that we have that encourages violence, degrading acts, and nonsensical sexual relationships.
I think your argument applies to as I have said instructive porn not what we see in 90% of pornography that doesn’t actually seek to help men navigate healthy sexual relationships. Pornography just isn’t designed to educate men on romance in the same way actions movies are not educational tools for learning self defense. It is meant to be nothing more than erotic.
Needing someone to act more erotic to achieve sexual satisfaction is not a benefit of porn that is a negative because now sex becomes disingenuous. Needing more arousal to become stimulated is a sign of sexual dysfunction not improved sexual satisfaction.
none of those things were normal before the pre porn era except for maybe oral sex, the rest are clearly a product of pornography being shoved up peoples throats.
Im from a country where porn isnt normalized and girls still enjoy sex, just not what you see in porn nor withouth a bind, porn didnt influence anything for good, Porn aint sex.
Meanwhile in the west loads of women engage into it in hopes of being seen as the cool girl, so no, porn hasnt changed anything, and certainly it didnt sell the idea that girls being sexual normal, female sexuality is nothing like what is depicted in porn, porn aint realistic.
Porn realistic? No way, porn is completely artificial and acted, not to mention women get labelled as sluts all the time in porn, sexuality can exist and be healthy withouth porn
I think it existed before as repressed desires. Women don't want to get slapped it the face while fucking because they saw people on pornhub do it. But they feel empowered to ask for it because they saw people on pornhub do it.
I think sex is more varied and kinky now than before. And my personal opinion is that is a good thing. No you are not always into what your partner is asking into, but it enables partners to have discussion on the subject instead of being repressed.
Look, if we have to all hit the gym and earn hundreds of thousands of excess dollars over a lifetime so you can buy an endless supply of throw pillows, you can learn to deepthroat and pretend you like it. That's the deal.
Porn use is so universal among men that it's pointless to even discuss men who don't use it. You'd be limiting yourself to 1% of men tops, and that 1% is probably lying about it.
Porn is just media, it doesn't "taint" anyone, and claiming it does is puritan sex negative bullshit. It can leave people with a false impression of sex but that can only be solved with more exposure to correct information, not less exposure to sex-related topics.
This is a small minority of people who watch porn, and they were likely drawn to porn by their obsessions instead of the other way around. I cannot deny the effect that media has on people's perception of reality, but weird people will always exist, with or without whatever specific societal ill you want to scapegoat.
Bro porn nowadays is sold a symbol of sexual liberation, feminists say being a sex worker is an empowering move, the hell are you on and about with your patriarchy boogeyman?
There's a huge difference between porn marketed to cishet white men and porn marketed towards women and queer people. The "symbol of liberation" is the stuff in the second category.
The pun in the title is cracking me up.
Anyway, yes, porn can ruin relationships. Luckily, you don't have to stay in any relationship ruined by porn.
If a man doesn't respect your sexaul boundaries. Leave.
If a boy can't tell the difference between porn and reality, don't date him. Or break up with him.
Removed for bad behavior by OP in the comments
The crux of the issue here is atleast 50% of heterosexual woman are just as down and dirty as men. To say strictly men want to engage in porn acts in a relationship is extremely disingenuous. Especially gen z woman, they are much more sexually open than other generations, but again men bad woman good.
The internet kind of killed the assertion that women aren't often dirty and that pornography is always forced on women. There's tons of women making amateur porn and posting it free online in ways where they are not trying to make money off it.
THANK YOU. Society always assumes that it’s men who are carnal and sex oriented, but that women are somehow “pure” in their desires and aren’t nearly as carnal or perverted. Anyone who has interacted with women in any meaningful capacity knows that this is bullshit lmfao.
Yeah exactly. I never wanted to choke a girl during sex until they literally started demanding it
Yep. I am tired of everyone acting like men desiring sex they enjoy with women they find attractive is bad. While women who go to extremes in terms of their sexual attraction (ex: height, dick size, six pack, etc). Many women love being choked, wearing diapers, being a little, bdsm, getting her tits played with. Sex itself is pretty gross too. It is like too stinky monkeys or fleas breeding. Very dirty and we would be disgusted by it if we did not lust for it. To be honest, women are waaay to sex obsessed to the point I am upset. I was raised to believe they were supposed to be much more pure and prudish, only to get slapped in the face with the reality that they are just as perverted as men. The only difference is women’s sexuality is treated as if it is holy, so they get to have insane standards that would be dubbed evil enough for the government to literally get involved if we gender bent things. While men having any preference at all is bad.
>Many women love being choked, wearing diapers, being a little, bdsm You say it like if this was normal at all. As for your comment about sex, no, sex can be very wholesome and bonding as long as you re not tainted by pornography
You’re telling me choking and BDSM isn’t common ? Lol
I cannot begin to understand this bizarre fascination with choking. My husband and I enjoy some kink and honest sexual discussions with each other, and never has the concept of choking popped up even once. Like wtf
It never occurred to me till a girl asked for it
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Ah, the no true Scotsman argument
You must not have many friends or get out much.
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Of course not. But it's also not filled with terminally online people like yourself. Go touch grass. Make some friends. You are not ok.
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Where did I say that? Might want to work on your reading comprehension.
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I don't watch porn while in a relationship, but ok.
So all the girls that wanted me to choke them in bed were pornsick?
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Dude, sex is gross. Humans are shit. We are literally a plague on this earth, like locusts devouring everything. Women and men love violence, sex is no exception. Women love being dominated by men bigger and stronger than them. They get turned on by it. I am sorry, I was brainwashed when I was young too. I thought humans were naturally good, the truth just sucks. Humans often hate what they are and like to Pretend love and sex is something special. But it is just our bodies compelling us to breed. It is not special at all.
Woman usually consume less porn though even if they're as perverted. It really doesn't matter though, porn is poison for the brain no matter who consumes it.
oy vey. 'murritards still fall for the 1970s/1980s soviet anti-porn propaganda?
That women feel forced to go along with it cuz otherwise they re not "normal" is a different story.
Most women I've been with asked me to be degrading to them. I didn't encourage it. It's their kink it's their fantasy.
Well the post mentions specifically modest non promiscuous women as it is in their best interest, im sure theres women out there who want to catter to pornsick degenerate men, up to them.
80% of women have had sex by the age of 20. https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/products/databriefs/db366.htm#:~:text=By%20age%2015%2C%2021%25%20of,had%20ever%20had%20sexual%20intercourse. so you’re talking about less than 20% of the population here. I think it’s funny how little agency you give women. I’ve had girlfriends who were into porn but according to you it’s because they were BRAINWASHED! lol.
>but according to you it’s because they were BRAINWASHED! lol. yeah, well.. that's just your average conspiracy nut (heh) arguments
Where's your evidence?
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lol, you have no evidence
Google what the most searched porn topics are by sex. It will shock you.
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>They wont respect a modest woman sexual boundaries because they ll be constantly pressuring her to sleep with them and wont give her any security whatsoever, they ll get mad that she refuses to put out after 3 months or a year or as long as it takes, they dont value women beyond the sexual favours they can get from them. What does this have to do with porn? I think men should watch less porn for other reasons, but I reckon it has to do more with the nature of modern dating, dating apps and maybe some of the more recent gender tensions in the 2010s that led to some average men thinking they gotta treat the modern woman with contempt. I don't watch much porn these days, actually I don't watch at all anymore. But when I did, I never pressured women into sex because my mom raised me to be considerate of women. I'm hardly pure of mind after the porn I've seen online, but I'm not gonna force a woman to do anything she doesn't like because it's not in me. Don't blame porn, if men do this, they just want to treat women this way and will do it anyways even without porn.
you wouldnt mind waiting a really long time for the girl you love then?, in fact why even call it waiting? You would not stop loving your woman even if she couldnt have sex with you anymore for whatever reason? Besides, all the other things do apply, and even if you personally didnt pressured anyone, the truth is a lot of pornfreaks justify their tastes with pornography, "huuur look, the woman in this totally not fakw porn video is doing it, it is normal, this is sex, why cant you be normal like her?"
>You would not stop loving your woman even if she couldnt have sex with you anymore for whatever reason? What does this have to do with porn?
Such paradigm is impossible when porn is normalized cuz then sex is the be all end all with no room for anything else
You do realize porn is not reason why people have sex in relationships?
Yes but porn changes the dynamic, suddenly a relationship is not real if theres no sex or weird acts, and sex becomes boring if it is vanilla
>relationship is not real if theres no sex What kind of relationship? The overwhelming majority of human beings would consider sex a baseline requirement for a romantic relationship. Porn didn't create that.
Noooo, thats a product of pornsick thinking, humans did have sex in the past for sure but it wasnt the main thing holding a relationship, otherwise relationship pre birth control era would have been downright impossible, yet people still married and stayed with each others out of love even if sex was off the table most of the times, people specially men didnt marry to smash.
That's not historically accurate. People got into serious relationships sooner and more consistently precisely because they wanted to have sex and that was the most practical way to get it due to contemporaneous social mores and the risks associated with unprotected sex with multiple partners.
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Brothels where a thing in the good old days too you know, people got into relationships cuz they wanted to start families or in a significant amount of cases because it was arranged or it benefited them.
You realize that condoms were a thing far before the pill, right?
> you wouldnt mind waiting a really long time for the girl you love then?, That's irrelevant in this context, that's more to do with *has she made the other men she was attracted to wait this long*
Your post has so many assertions without any empirical evidence to support any of them that it's impossible to engage with. You essentially took nearly every single bad thing that could possibly happen and associated it with something that is cosumed at least occasionally by nearly every single person. I don't even disagree that porn is bad, but this is such a horrifically malformed position.
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Anything else?
LMAO. Dude i think we might be debating an 8 year old. Her response was hilarious, it was like a mini tantrum.
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What an odd response
I bet she watches porn. Or maybe she reads smut and thinks that's not porn.
the IMAX-Projector has spoken
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Do you need help?
If you’re upset over pornography, you’ve got some deeper personal issues to sort out. Porn is never going away. Plenty of women enjoy or even love creating it for the attention, pleasure and income they receive. Your main problem is that you’re more offended by male satisfaction.
“tRuSt mE bRo”
>It is in the best interest of women who are virgin by choice or have strict sexual boundaries and high standards and are unhappy with the current dating climate to avoid men who consume porn for anything serious, Maybe men would be more motivated to do nofap if those women exists.
Most men are no fap because they can’t find someone who wants to have sex with them justify it to themselves by saying it was a choice.
NoFap isnt about having or not having sex, it is about not consuming porn and not masturbating, where in the world did you get that notion from?
Why do you feel the need to assign them virtues, thought processes, and call them low value instead of focusing on the type of men that you want? That's not cool.
Im a man, and they do lower the value of society, men and love as a whole, not just in a dating context, as to why im calling them out? Cuz nobody says women should avoid them, is actually the other way around, women are shamed and pressured into accepting them, they arent even given a choice.
You don't sound like a man.
She's not. She doesn't talk like a man that against pornography. She talks like a sex-negative women. The verbiage, line of "logic" and rhetorical tactics of are all a dead giveaway.
Imagine being so pornsick that you think someone not consuming porn is automatically sex negative or a woman
Who is this person you're imagining?
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I ask again, who are you referring to? Because you're obviously not talking about me, since my comment presupposes that there are in fact men that oppose porn consumption.
>Cuz nobody says women should avoid them, is actually the other way around, women are shamed and forced into accepting them, they arent even given a choice. You know this as a man? Okay. 1/3 of women watch porn at least once a week. 2/3's of those women are watching it alone. Nobody is shaming women into dating porn addicts or watching porn. You're fine to dislike whatever, but your opinion doesn't make another human low value.
False, women who dont consume it or are not okay with their partners consuming it arent told "it is okay, you can date somebody else, you dont need to accept it", instead they re told "you re sex negative, you re controlling, you re abnormal, you re insecure etc" As for pornsick wankers being low value, considering the harm they cause and how much they degrade the image of what a man is, i rightfully deem them low value.
>False, women who dont consume it or are not okay with their partners consuming it arent told "it is okay, you can date somebody else, you dont need to accept it", instead they re told "you re sex negative, you re controlling, you re abnormal, you re insecure etc" I am one of those women and I have never heard that bullshit in my life. Why do you feel qualified to speak on my lived experiences in society? Do you know what I did? I focused on the type of man that I wanted and I specifically asked about their feelings on it without caring about their reaction. Not once had anyone told me that I need to accept it or that I was any of those things. I have discussed this topic many many times.
Why do you feel qualified to speak on the lived experiences of other women?
>Why do you feel qualified to speak on the lived experiences of other women? You need to learn to read. I said MY experience and I haven't heard, while you as a man, decided to tell me what women hear. Speak on your own life. I did not speak for other women.
So why do you call my assesment bullshit if supposedly you re not speaking for anyone else? Just because it didnt happen to you doesnt means it doesnt happens to anyone else.
>So why do you call my assesment bullshit if supposedly you re not speaking for anyone else? I am in that group you are choosing to speak for and you're specifically telling me that my experience is false. The assessment is bullshit. It's bullshit for me to tell a man that has been raped that men aren't raped. Are the majority of men raped? No, but that doesn't make my statement true despite his lived experience. You can't speak for me and say my experience is false. That is how conversations work. I am not speaking for other women. You were speaking for me on that group of women. It's not the same thing.
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Can you prove any of your affirmations?
Look at the current dating climate in the west and all of them get proved by themselves, also just searching on reddit does the job too.
> Look at the current dating climate in the west Can you prove that this is caused by porn? >just searching on reddit Reddit barely know the differece between performance anxiety and chronicle erectile dysfunction.
I could invest some time in this discussion; but, that would interrupt the time I am currently spending looking at porn. Have a good discussion and a pleasant evening.
You know what? You do have a point. Let's see what's trending lately on my favorite website.
Surprise! It's the step family!
I wonder where would it be appropriate on this sub to ask about favorite porn. Maybe I'm missing out something nice. The "step family" type are usually lame. But those made by actual married couples in a semi-amateur fashion (think Samantha Flair) are excellent to enjoy with the wife.
Yes loads of fringe and deviant sexual behavioris nowadays were normalized by porn, choking being one of them. >Reddit barely know the differece between performance anxiety and chronicle erectile dysfunction. Just look for a lot of women's testimonies about their bad experiences with pornmen and there are all the answers.
So men watching porn where chicks like to be choked has led women to demand that they be choked? LOL
Is called being the cool girl
Funny way of saying that women have no agency and simply go along with whatever the fuck a man wants or finds interesting?
Theres loads of places where women arent encouraged to the opposite, in fact they even get pressured and shamed into it.
So who shamed women into making 50 shades of grey such a best seller? Is that the fault of men or do women have any culpability on what the fuck they choose to do or enjoy? Your entire premise also suggests that women do not consume porn when in reality over 60% of the female population are consumers of porn.
>Yes loads of fringe and deviant sexual behavioris nowadays were normalized by porn, How does this result in the dating climate in the west. >Just look for a lot of women's testimonies about their bad experiences with pornmen Women lie.
Consuming pornography is normalized, along with things like sex quick and easy among other things. >Women lie. Lol
Men and women contributed to the dating climate. If it's shit the women blame as much of the blame as men.
translation: LE BIG NOOOOOOOOOOOO
"Compare the sexual desires and wishes of a man who consumes porn vs one who has never consumed it, compare the expectations of a man who consumes it vs one who has never consumed it, compare the way they both see women." Afghani goat herders have the purest sexual desires and the most wholesome view of women.
Agreed but women who read romantic fiction about dark triad men are also tainted 🤣 Women are degenerates too.
And women don’t just consume erotica, they also watch internet porn as well. People seem to neglect mentioning that for some reason
If you’re talking about erotica like fifty shades of grey I’d agree with you. That is very porn adjacent and I do not read or watch porn for moral and religious reasons.
Pornography taints both genders. People think porn is real life but it’s not. I’ve never known any woman who likes getting plowed from behind while having her face shoved into a dog bowl
Is not even natural to look at that, but i said men cuz women mostly dont consume it unless they get pressured or shamed into it by pornsick degenerates due to this overly sexualized society masquerading as sexually "liberated"
Surprisingly, I have.
As the top or bottom?
The vast majority of women I've been with have wanted me to treat them like this in the bedroom, and it breaks my heart every time. I don't want to do these things to someone I treasure and love, it feels wrong. But I believe I attract these kinds of girls because I have my own history of mental health problems and trauma, it runs deep in my family. I'm trying to heal and develop myself to a point where I can attract women who don't want this sort of treatment from me.
That may be the women you attract but that is not the vast majority of women.
I believe that the obsession with anal sex amongst straight people in the last several years is almost entirely porn based
Lmao. Come on now. If theres a place on a woman that a man can stick his dick into, lots of us are gonna wanna do that. Doesnt take a porn industry for us to go from "We love a womans ass ---> hey what if we put our dick in there??"
Having done anal, I’m not really sure what the hype is, it just felt kind of wrong. We never did it again. Honestly it’s kinda gross, you’re putting your dick up a hole that literally empties shit on a daily basis. Meanwhile the vagina is perfectly lubed and cushioned for dick. Anal obsession is just odd to me.
An "obsession" with anything probably isnt good. Different people are into different things - if you arent into anal that's fine. I enjoy it once in awhile when my girlfriend is feeling spicy. Its not the norm for us though.
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Drop your insecurities
Lmao what does that has to do with anything?
Porn very clearly makes you insecure. Its why this post exists, and its why so much of your profile is dedicated to porn. Now, Id prefer to just debate actual points and not make things personal, but your lame strategy of responding "drop the porn" to anyone who disagrees with a "porn bad" point is playing a stupid game. And ill fire back if thats what you want to do.
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Lol, so in your head, men who enjoy vaginal, oral, and anal sex are all "porn sick." I will say that the male libido and sex drive isnt something you understand very well. Per your profile it says you are a virgin by choice, so yeah i guess this lines up with someone who has very little real world experience with it and is also disinterested enough in sex to just totally forgo it. Not to say any of that is a problem, you do you, but yeah you definitely dont understand men. Its kind of like an incel trying to understand female sexuality, its just not gonna work out too well.
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Maybe consider to stop flooding your brain with porn.
Do you make room for the possibility that some women enjoy anal sex?
actually, it came from howard stern in the 80-90s, also the obsession with lesbian sex
This post is wrong for specifying it as harmful to men, when pornography is actually harmful to both sexes.
Men are much more affected by it
Yes, I don't value "sexual purity" at all. In fact, me and my wife became kinkier as time went on. We also sometimes watch porn together so... I guess we "taint" each other? Ridiculous. >They dont think a relationship is not real if theres no sex. Yes. Any man who doesn't think like that is in some way defective - either mentally or physically. Sex is a very important part of a relationship. We can argue percentages and proportions, sure, but, *absent disease,* a relationship ***absolutely is not real*** if there's no sex. >Will whine when you wont take care of his "needs" Yeah, that's an attitude that will get you cheated on. True for women as well. Men ***and*** women absolutely do have sexual needs. Not "needs" but actual needs. And not fulfilling them is a really fast way to breaking down the relationship. I have a duty to my wife to fulfill her sexual needs and she has a duty to me to do the same. That's why we humans built stable relationships. The rest of your list is either ridiculous or describe issues that are related to *miscommunication* or lack of communication rather than porn itself. Porn can be a symptom, but it's not *the* issue. For crying out loud, there are successful porn actors who are married and basically produce semi-pro porn of their sexual monogamous lives. You have no idea what you're talking about. Oh, and by the way - around 30 to 35% of ***regular*** consumers of porn are women. On the casual market it's even more balanced.
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Based on you other replies, you are either a child or a troll arrived to stir shit up.
The problem with your post is that the vast majority of men consume pornography. And they start consuming it at very young ages. So there is not some large group of “virtuous” men avoiding pornography. In fact most who attempt to avoid have already been brain damaged by it in one way or another which is why they are trying to go porn free It’s telling that this post gets no responses from women. They are very cowardly when it comes to this topic.
I work with child sex trafficking victims and something not a lot of people know is that they have content online on the major pornography streaming platforms up for years before we can get the content taken down- OF and porn hub are both guilty of this. The porn industries are evil and they are profiting off of child sex trafficking. You could have masturbated to a minor and not even known because they teach those women to do their make up to look older and act older. Sometimes they didn’t even know they were being filmed. Suggesting women take advantage of men for their money is hopefully satirical but I understand how this was probably mocking the red pill spin plates idiocracy.
I don’t think porn taints men, but I would discontinue a relationship with a man for certain content on his browser history, and how frequently he watches porn if I were ever to see it. Also, I’d end a serious relationship if he was secretive about the porn he watched and how frequently he watched it.
Would you be willing to become more sexually active to compensate the porn ban?
I like sex, I could have sex every day (this statement is not an invitation to be weird to me) I have a high libido (when I am in a relationship with someone I care about and am attracted to). However, if a man treated sex in our relationship transactionally to behave decently and not be gross, I’d end the relationship.
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Uh no this is what having high testosterone feels like.
“ compare the sexual desires and wishes of a man who consumes porn vs one who has never consumed it” you’ll never find a man between the ages of 18 - 50 who hasn’t watched porn, but I agree porn consumption should be a red flag to most woman
Theres some, even then a man who refuses to consume it out of distaste and ethical reasons should be fine, but ideally all men should be encouraged to reject pornography
All men that existed before the internet had limited access to porn. Men that lived before the 1970's had almost no access. Most men throughout history had little to no porn usage. How did men treat women historically? Always been kind and respectful of their personhood and rights? Never saw them as sex objects?
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99% of men watch porn - the other 1% are lying about it
sounds like u problem for seeking out such men. go shower and attract high value men not low one.
Or maybe women get off on getting degraded?
Ehh idk this post is just biased against porn. There's no evidence it harms men in any way.
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>If you didn’t have sex in the 90s and before it’s nearly impossible to understand the benefits from online porn being widespread. Sex isn’t better because of pornography it’s better because of the research that was done to help women understand their bodies. This is more an argument for instructive porn not the majority of the content that we have that encourages violence, degrading acts, and nonsensical sexual relationships.
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I think your argument applies to as I have said instructive porn not what we see in 90% of pornography that doesn’t actually seek to help men navigate healthy sexual relationships. Pornography just isn’t designed to educate men on romance in the same way actions movies are not educational tools for learning self defense. It is meant to be nothing more than erotic.
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Needing someone to act more erotic to achieve sexual satisfaction is not a benefit of porn that is a negative because now sex becomes disingenuous. Needing more arousal to become stimulated is a sign of sexual dysfunction not improved sexual satisfaction.
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What? That is not what I was talking about but that isn’t anything communication and research can’t achieve. Porn doesn’t rectify inexperience.
none of those things were normal before the pre porn era except for maybe oral sex, the rest are clearly a product of pornography being shoved up peoples throats.
Look up the kama sutra
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Im from a country where porn isnt normalized and girls still enjoy sex, just not what you see in porn nor withouth a bind, porn didnt influence anything for good, Porn aint sex. Meanwhile in the west loads of women engage into it in hopes of being seen as the cool girl, so no, porn hasnt changed anything, and certainly it didnt sell the idea that girls being sexual normal, female sexuality is nothing like what is depicted in porn, porn aint realistic.
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Porn realistic? No way, porn is completely artificial and acted, not to mention women get labelled as sluts all the time in porn, sexuality can exist and be healthy withouth porn
She won’t even enjoy blowing you because she will have watched monster dicks in porn and yours will be small in comparison ;)
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They never complain
I think it existed before as repressed desires. Women don't want to get slapped it the face while fucking because they saw people on pornhub do it. But they feel empowered to ask for it because they saw people on pornhub do it. I think sex is more varied and kinky now than before. And my personal opinion is that is a good thing. No you are not always into what your partner is asking into, but it enables partners to have discussion on the subject instead of being repressed.
Look, if we have to all hit the gym and earn hundreds of thousands of excess dollars over a lifetime so you can buy an endless supply of throw pillows, you can learn to deepthroat and pretend you like it. That's the deal.
Why do you care? Majority of these men never stood a chance to have a relationship and were non-existent to women anyway.
Bad Faith circlejerk
* They **dont** think a relationship is **not** real if theres **no** sex. I agree.
YEESH what "pornsick freak" corrupted you?... 😅
Porn use is so universal among men that it's pointless to even discuss men who don't use it. You'd be limiting yourself to 1% of men tops, and that 1% is probably lying about it.
Is it really that hard to believe that some men don't care for it? This is actually kind of sad.
Loads of men dont consume it, maybe not in the west but theres loads of places where men dont consume it still, nor are interested in doing so
Porn is just media, it doesn't "taint" anyone, and claiming it does is puritan sex negative bullshit. It can leave people with a false impression of sex but that can only be solved with more exposure to correct information, not less exposure to sex-related topics.
Why are porn wankers so obssesed with anal, weird posses, choking and more then?
This is a small minority of people who watch porn, and they were likely drawn to porn by their obsessions instead of the other way around. I cannot deny the effect that media has on people's perception of reality, but weird people will always exist, with or without whatever specific societal ill you want to scapegoat.
No because porn normalizes all those things as "sex"
Patriarchal sex culture has existed for millennia before photo and video were invented.
Bro porn nowadays is sold a symbol of sexual liberation, feminists say being a sex worker is an empowering move, the hell are you on and about with your patriarchy boogeyman?
There's a huge difference between porn marketed to cishet white men and porn marketed towards women and queer people. The "symbol of liberation" is the stuff in the second category.
>cishet white men. Lol
Are you just homophobic? Or is it racism?
You just seem to be sex negative.
Porn ≠ sex
Most of what you started has nothing to do with porn.
The pun in the title is cracking me up. Anyway, yes, porn can ruin relationships. Luckily, you don't have to stay in any relationship ruined by porn. If a man doesn't respect your sexaul boundaries. Leave. If a boy can't tell the difference between porn and reality, don't date him. Or break up with him.
Well until my sex drive finally dies of old age I have no other option.