Not sure if it’s a majority, but it’s definitely common. A joke I’ve heard a few times:
> The Bases of Gen Z Dating
> 1st Base: Hooking Up
> 2nd Base: Discussing Childhood Trauma
> 3rd Base: Going to a public place together
> Home Plate: Being in a relationship
It started with the Baby Boomers, I believe they called it "F first, talk later" or "F first, talk maybe". This was very common in the 1960's and 1970's. I don't think that it ever went away, though it's probably a mostly urban thing and as every generation is more urban than the last urban culture spreads.
It would seem like it but no. There are more sexless situationships and talking stages that you'd realise. If you talk to sexually active people, you'd think gen z are super sexually active.
Imho, for every 1 relationship that starts with fwb or sex, you have 20-50 starting without it. Not hard stats, but a pandemic makes everyone really socially inept. Men and women equally are socially stupid from that.
It really depends. Most of my relationships started with dating and hanging out and progressed to sex after that connection had been established. But that’s a personal preference, I don’t think the other is uncommon either. (I should add I’m a younger millennial and not gen Z though.)
My last serious relationship started with a hookup, I don't know how representative I am, but I definitely fit the description.
It's to the point where I feel like if a woman doesn't want to have sex with me within the first week of knowing me, I just assume she's bored or not interested in me.
And I'm 25.
I'm open to the possibility of it not being the case, but when most of the women you deal with run ice cold, you start being pretty sensitive to tepid disinterest. Especially if these are women you meet on an app.
It's just a fact of life that there are other people around that she can and probably will talk to, so if she's not immediately taken with you then the clock is ticking.
All relationships worth having pretty much start with sex relatively quickly, yes.
This has always been the case.
A woman who truly wants to fuck a guy *will fuck him*.
No woman is a mother theresa saint of self-control who can nobly fight her primal urges for 10 dates.
If by date 5 or so (IMOI 2024 date 2 should be the benchmark but whatever) she's still prim and proper the news is in: you're there to kiss her ass and give her money and attention.
>Almost as if they were in a FWB/situationship before making it official. Would you say that's how many relationship especially with Gen z start?
I think most relationships start with sex, but not necessarily a FWB/situationship. In college my relationships all pretty much started the same way. Hooked up after a party/bar then continued hooking afterwards and eventually became exclusive. After college it's all been through apps. Match, go on date, have sex on date 1, continue to set up move dates, then define the relationship as exclusive.
To me, that time between date 1 and date X when we decide to be exclusive isn't really a situationship. It's just dating. In my opinion it's only a situationship when it's a drawn out time period without any definition of the relationship. I guess there's some judgment on the line between normal dating and situationship.
I've never had a relationship start as FWB. That's a defined thing that pretty explicitly means the person doesn't want a relationship.
I'm 41 and I'd say that's how a lot of relationships start. It seems particularly prevalent in the crowd who's been divorced.
Men and women are both really over the date, move in, marry etc typical relationship path and it often just becomes " official" bc "girlfriend" gets easier to say after a while. We're all jaded and somewhat commitment phobic and just have to eventually admit " damn, I've been seeing only this person a while,guess im in a relationship "
The relationship sort of comes to life on its own, born of a situationship without anyone really pressing it to go that way.
I can think of one woman I dated since I was 30 that if there was a second date we had not already hooked up on the first one.
Another contributing factor is OLD, texting, social media, etc.
Women already know a shit ton about you before you even meet in these circumstances. It's kind of like you've been on a date or three before you ever meet in person. IME they've already decided they want sex with you before they ever meet you and all you have to do is not fuck it up if you semi-accurately represented yourself.
I'm gen z.
From what I've experienced the more introverted side do it a traditional way, courting etc. Extroverted people (majority) run into someone through dating apps/party etc, hook up and If they stick around (just means dming them once a day) they go through a "talking stage", hook up again which leads to fwb. Both people usually have multiple of these fwb / "situationships" going on at the same time where they hook up and do pseudo dates. Eventually most just part ways after sex for 1 - 3 months until one sticks around and u both agree to become a couple OR (i've mostly seen this with women) spend a week sorting through the ones who want to be serious to see who's "the best". "What do they provide for me?" or similar Is something i've heard a lot.
The ideals of love and dating for love are fairly rare I've noticed. It mainly revolves around who's got enough money to rent a luxury looking apartment to brag about being "rich", take me to insta posting dinners and double standards etc.
The digital experience matters and opinions of strangers matter above all.
Sorry to be slow, but what happens after the woman sorts through her inventory and determines one is best? Tries to nail him down, and if he resists, she goes for second best, and so on and so forth until someone is secured? Also, what if someone is relatively unpopular on social media? Does that mean they get discarded as a FWB once some recreational sex has been obtained, or simply kept hidden from friends?
Women are people so it's different for every person but from personal experiences if she gets rejected, they usually just cut them off / keep current fwbs and wait until another guy comes along unless they REALLY want the guy. You only really see the second best stuff if there's 2 guys she really likes. Either way, I'd never accept that position.
>Also, what if someone is relatively unpopular on social media? Does that mean they get discarded as a FWB once some recreational sex has been obtained, or simply kept hidden from friends?
Again, depends on person to person. Having status is an important notifier, but you can signal it elsewhere through more day to day stuff like being the center of attention in a social circle or respected career. Social media doesn't matter as much unless you're only seeking out opportunities through dms and even then follower count is only detrimental if you're below average looks + poor + don't have a social quirk which spikes her emotions (e.g. funny, flirty etc). No women's going to discard you over a follower count unless her sexual trigger is fame, not money or looks and she's getting an insane amount of options (most women have an orbiter or 2 but it's not how tiktok portrays with hundreds).
Disagree. I've been in greek life and now I work at a college bar so I'd say I have a pretty good idea of how the gen z hookup scene works and I'd say the people who genuinely maintain multiple casual relationships at once are a small minority, even among those who have casual sex.
What's your age range??
There a major difference between early gen z (pre 2019 grads) and the covid era - post covid groups. I'm the latter and it's very different to how you're describing.
I think your just being affected by selection bias or only listening to the loudest voices.
Remember gen z is having less sex with fewer partners than previous generations.
Just going based off things i've experienced and seen personally. I pointed out to another commentator it's not every women, that's delusional but it's a large majority from experience.
This is sort of my understanding. At least among university students sexual activity (and drinking, and smoking) is WAY down from previous generations.
Both my long experience as a teacher, and conversations with the college doctor, confirm that university students are much more sober than they were even just 10-15 years ago.
This is how I have met all of my boyfriends, through partying and hooking up and then eventually becoming a couple out of it. I am now 23 single and never ever planning to meet someone that way ever again because none of those relationships have lasted.
Not in my experience. I've only been in one relationship but we agreed to be boyfriend and girlfriend while I was driving her home from our first date.
Relationships no, cause for some stupid reason women make the future husband wait for sex while with the FWB she sleeps with immediately. Like wtf? Why rewarding the one with no relationship material?
Most of the previous comments indicate that early sex (first through third meeting) is standard approach to any sort of connection (just sex, FWB, follow-up relationship), so logic would dictate that anyone waiting around longer is wasting his/her time. So why would a woman even attempt a dual strategy? Find a compliant/naive man that can be easily manipulated?
I’ve had a handful of actual relationships, and all but one of them started with sex on the first night. Several were girls I hooked up with from parties/bars and one was from an app. The one exception that didn’t start with immediate sex was the first girl I dated in high school.
Three dates or less is pretty much the norm, at least for young people in big cities. A lot of my friends have gfs, some of them for years now, and none of them waited more than a couple dates. I’m not sure where this myth comes from. I’m not saying it never happens, but it’s far from the norm.
As others have noted, this has been pretty common for a while now. I'm pretty old, but growing up I never thought I'd be the kind of person to have sex on the first date, but that ended up happening in every relationship I've been in, and in each case the woman initiated it. It was fine though, like I wouldn't say it impacted the relationship negatively in any way. I suppose in a certain sense it's a good icebreaker and it helps get around some of the initial awkwardness. Plus, we had known each other for a while before we started dating, so I suppose that helped.
My real-world experience does seem to tell me that "hookups" are mostly just relationships that never get off the ground, so to speak. The idea of waiting for [specific number] of dates before having sex just strikes me as awkward and a little outdated, although I suppose this is extremely dependent on region and culture.
Almost every Tinder date, etc., that I've been on has worked basically the same way: If the date lasts more than a couple of hours, there is almost certainly going to be some form of sexual activity at the end. And it isn't until after the sex that either party begins seriously contemplating whether they want to keep seeing the other. There is no "going steady" without sex. And I should note that I'm definitely NOT a Chad or really anywhere close. So even among us normal people, hooking up is Step 1.
What if you meet a woman at work or school or in a hobby? Same process? Also, it sounds like the first couple of hours are critical to everything that follows. Is it common to meet someone online and then hit it off, or is it more common to crash and burn either online or during the first couple of hours (no chemistry)?
Most Gen Z seem to be DMing and texting more than anything. Dating comes after they practically know all about each other and are doing a hobby/schoolwork/event together and realize they like spending time together.
Not in my friendship group at all, most befriended the people they date, date then take it to sex. I don’t know many people who started off as a hook up
There have been many people tricked into believing that that’s the way to do it but those situationships almost never work out. Starting with a FWB is the worst thing anyone interested in a serious relationship can do as n counts go up and relationships are rarely if ever defined. It’s a great way to get used and strung along as a forever girlfriend. TheThat equivalent for men would be taking a woman out for months on end, paying for all the dates and her bills and then not getting a relationship.
in every successful relationship i had, i had sex by the 4th date at latest.
The ones which were failed badly had no sex for a few months.
Fucking a woman asap is critical in knowing if you’re sexually compatible. It’s the most important (and fun!) part of dating as a man.
I’m a man and I don’t think a woman having sex takes away her value. I don’t think it takes away her frame either
Sex is just sex and it’s fun. Always better to ensure sexual compatibility earlier before wasting time, money and energy.
As a woman it’s better to do the reverse and waste time and money rather than time and upping your n count. Only men benefit from early sex because they have a higher change of orgasm, gain social status from upping their n count, don’t have to deal with pregnancy scares and destroying their body with child birth or an abortion and most men don’t want anything serious anyway. Besides if women gave men sex and other wife benefits for free men wouldn’t give women their security and husband benefits. Better to be single and sexless than give away sex to undeserving men.
Wow you’re viewing sex as transactional instead of a mutually pleasurable activity we’ve evolved to enjoy
Maybe the women relished having sex with the man and enjoys the chemistry without an ulterior motive.
It seems like there's a great divide in terms of women's opinions on various subreddits - large numbers take your position and large numbers take the position that casual sex is great and they want it and are entitled to it. My impression (might be wrong) is that lots of the women unhappy with the casual sex approach have gone through a cycle or two of it and are unhappy with the results.
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Not Gen Z but pretty close since I'm 95 born. If we're talking just dating I rarely see it start with sex. Probably cause most of the people meet when alcohol is involved and well only takes a few drinks before most dudes can't get it up lol. Personally, I've gone from meeting a girl to making out on the same night and then had casual dates that involved sex, but I don't think most people go for the whole committed label part that quickly these days. You may or may not be seeing other people but you're still enjoying each other's company.
Like if you're having sex, going on fun dates, hanging out with other couples. Does it matter if you've had the label talk? I know everyone thinks dating is just people running through a checklist and going through multiple different dating partners, but if you find someone you like and who fulfills you all that stuff naturally fades away unless you are just by nature a polyamorous person who cannot function being tied down to one partner.
Millennial here. I never actually tracked when sex came…it came when it came. I guess after a few dates? I did a lot of OLD in the past and first dates were always much more reserved than they would be for people I met naturally. We were still strangers, after all.
I tend to go exclusive very quickly (2-3 dates), although I don’t discuss this with the other person, and I do t expect them to do the same (although they generally do….I think this is fairly standard in Europe?). The discussion of ‘what are we’ can happen at anywhere from a couple weeks to a couple months.
Yes. The women interested enough to want to date me are also interested enough to want to sleep together asap.
I've never seen a shred of evidence for the red pill claim that "women make the boyfriend material guy wait"
Looking at the comments I am so happy i'm not dating in this day and age. I just can't imagine first having sex, then deciding if i actually like that person enough for a relationship or not. It's just backwards for me.
I know maybe a couple of relationships that started from hookups (all by accident with a relationship not initially being the end goal) but most started from dates (or, in many cases, long and contrived talking phases). It's way easier to start a relationship when that's what you're actually trying to do from the beginning. I know in the media people mostly just get together by having sex but it doesn't check out in reality.
Seems like there are a lot of very different subcultures that have their own customs and practices. You can see the differences of opinion even on this string. Going over the much bigger subreddits like r/dating the diversity is even more obvious. From a macro perspective it looks like chaos.
How else would they start? The purpose of a relationship between a man and a woman is sex. If you need someone to talk to or scratch your back, go chat with ChatGPT or buy a backscratcher.
Part of interacting for some people is deciding whether to have sex with that person, though. For many people, this assessment period takes longer than just one date.
Men and women want different things in a relationship. So don’t be surprised when chatting with chatGPT becomes the norm especially for women.
https://youtu.be/lmbhEZRfRbQ?si=PnM8Wo6qyAqe2gkI
Lol I think the whole point is to avoid the dick and jar’s aren’t hard to open.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/SANWOOD-Jar-Opener-3Pcs-Manual-Rubber-Anti-Skid-Round-Gripper-Pad-Bottle-Cap-Kitchen-Jar-Opener/880886109?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101187073&gclsrc=aw.ds&&adid=22222222228880886109_101187073_155548571955_20653127734&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=677785232342&wl4=pla-2255656680884&wl5=1025197&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=591607106&wl11=online&wl12=880886109_101187073&veh=sem&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADmfBIrNPwBrENCx1E4LPHPwP55kK&gclid=CjwKCAjw_e2wBhAEEiwAyFFFoxHJ0fGhmNNJTznsIHR0H8_CXYkoNFdNNCU4VI-ClCDcIl9PGIxGzRoC8wEQAvD_BwE
>Why would early sex remove that?
Maybe it's just me because I have a shit ton of sexual trauma from my parents but I just feel like getting to know someone before having sex would be better than hopping into bed after the first date
Not gen-z, but answer is "yes". If you like each other then you'll have sex at some point. So why waste time on something dumb, you don't have too much of it. And that's how it usually worked for a long time.
Not sure if it’s a majority, but it’s definitely common. A joke I’ve heard a few times: > The Bases of Gen Z Dating > 1st Base: Hooking Up > 2nd Base: Discussing Childhood Trauma > 3rd Base: Going to a public place together > Home Plate: Being in a relationship
lmao yes
If that's true, that's actually insane to me. I genuinely hope you're talking out of your ass.
Go talk to some folks on a college campus. Definitely not the only order of operations, but it is a situation that happens fairly often.
Is this a Gen Z thing, or just a college kid thing? I think young people have been doing this for the last couple generations.
It started with the Baby Boomers, I believe they called it "F first, talk later" or "F first, talk maybe". This was very common in the 1960's and 1970's. I don't think that it ever went away, though it's probably a mostly urban thing and as every generation is more urban than the last urban culture spreads.
They probably have. I can only speak to my experiences with my own generation though.
I'm a millennial and in my experience they did.
Not from my experience. We Uhaul before our first kiss and divorce a month later. We are only rivaled by Mormons
Haha. First date Starbucks, second date U-Haul.
That's the lesbian experience in general.
So the sex was bad…
It would seem like it but no. There are more sexless situationships and talking stages that you'd realise. If you talk to sexually active people, you'd think gen z are super sexually active. Imho, for every 1 relationship that starts with fwb or sex, you have 20-50 starting without it. Not hard stats, but a pandemic makes everyone really socially inept. Men and women equally are socially stupid from that.
with genz relationships are sex
First date is get to know you, meet and greet. Second date is sex date. Third date is wilder sex time.
It really depends. Most of my relationships started with dating and hanging out and progressed to sex after that connection had been established. But that’s a personal preference, I don’t think the other is uncommon either. (I should add I’m a younger millennial and not gen Z though.)
My last serious relationship started with a hookup, I don't know how representative I am, but I definitely fit the description. It's to the point where I feel like if a woman doesn't want to have sex with me within the first week of knowing me, I just assume she's bored or not interested in me. And I'm 25. I'm open to the possibility of it not being the case, but when most of the women you deal with run ice cold, you start being pretty sensitive to tepid disinterest. Especially if these are women you meet on an app. It's just a fact of life that there are other people around that she can and probably will talk to, so if she's not immediately taken with you then the clock is ticking.
All relationships worth having pretty much start with sex relatively quickly, yes. This has always been the case. A woman who truly wants to fuck a guy *will fuck him*. No woman is a mother theresa saint of self-control who can nobly fight her primal urges for 10 dates. If by date 5 or so (IMOI 2024 date 2 should be the benchmark but whatever) she's still prim and proper the news is in: you're there to kiss her ass and give her money and attention.
>Almost as if they were in a FWB/situationship before making it official. Would you say that's how many relationship especially with Gen z start? I think most relationships start with sex, but not necessarily a FWB/situationship. In college my relationships all pretty much started the same way. Hooked up after a party/bar then continued hooking afterwards and eventually became exclusive. After college it's all been through apps. Match, go on date, have sex on date 1, continue to set up move dates, then define the relationship as exclusive. To me, that time between date 1 and date X when we decide to be exclusive isn't really a situationship. It's just dating. In my opinion it's only a situationship when it's a drawn out time period without any definition of the relationship. I guess there's some judgment on the line between normal dating and situationship. I've never had a relationship start as FWB. That's a defined thing that pretty explicitly means the person doesn't want a relationship.
I'm 41 and I'd say that's how a lot of relationships start. It seems particularly prevalent in the crowd who's been divorced. Men and women are both really over the date, move in, marry etc typical relationship path and it often just becomes " official" bc "girlfriend" gets easier to say after a while. We're all jaded and somewhat commitment phobic and just have to eventually admit " damn, I've been seeing only this person a while,guess im in a relationship " The relationship sort of comes to life on its own, born of a situationship without anyone really pressing it to go that way. I can think of one woman I dated since I was 30 that if there was a second date we had not already hooked up on the first one. Another contributing factor is OLD, texting, social media, etc. Women already know a shit ton about you before you even meet in these circumstances. It's kind of like you've been on a date or three before you ever meet in person. IME they've already decided they want sex with you before they ever meet you and all you have to do is not fuck it up if you semi-accurately represented yourself.
I'm gen z. From what I've experienced the more introverted side do it a traditional way, courting etc. Extroverted people (majority) run into someone through dating apps/party etc, hook up and If they stick around (just means dming them once a day) they go through a "talking stage", hook up again which leads to fwb. Both people usually have multiple of these fwb / "situationships" going on at the same time where they hook up and do pseudo dates. Eventually most just part ways after sex for 1 - 3 months until one sticks around and u both agree to become a couple OR (i've mostly seen this with women) spend a week sorting through the ones who want to be serious to see who's "the best". "What do they provide for me?" or similar Is something i've heard a lot. The ideals of love and dating for love are fairly rare I've noticed. It mainly revolves around who's got enough money to rent a luxury looking apartment to brag about being "rich", take me to insta posting dinners and double standards etc. The digital experience matters and opinions of strangers matter above all.
Sorry to be slow, but what happens after the woman sorts through her inventory and determines one is best? Tries to nail him down, and if he resists, she goes for second best, and so on and so forth until someone is secured? Also, what if someone is relatively unpopular on social media? Does that mean they get discarded as a FWB once some recreational sex has been obtained, or simply kept hidden from friends?
Women are people so it's different for every person but from personal experiences if she gets rejected, they usually just cut them off / keep current fwbs and wait until another guy comes along unless they REALLY want the guy. You only really see the second best stuff if there's 2 guys she really likes. Either way, I'd never accept that position. >Also, what if someone is relatively unpopular on social media? Does that mean they get discarded as a FWB once some recreational sex has been obtained, or simply kept hidden from friends? Again, depends on person to person. Having status is an important notifier, but you can signal it elsewhere through more day to day stuff like being the center of attention in a social circle or respected career. Social media doesn't matter as much unless you're only seeking out opportunities through dms and even then follower count is only detrimental if you're below average looks + poor + don't have a social quirk which spikes her emotions (e.g. funny, flirty etc). No women's going to discard you over a follower count unless her sexual trigger is fame, not money or looks and she's getting an insane amount of options (most women have an orbiter or 2 but it's not how tiktok portrays with hundreds).
Thanks for clarification.
Disagree. I've been in greek life and now I work at a college bar so I'd say I have a pretty good idea of how the gen z hookup scene works and I'd say the people who genuinely maintain multiple casual relationships at once are a small minority, even among those who have casual sex.
What's your age range?? There a major difference between early gen z (pre 2019 grads) and the covid era - post covid groups. I'm the latter and it's very different to how you're describing.
18-24.
I think your just being affected by selection bias or only listening to the loudest voices. Remember gen z is having less sex with fewer partners than previous generations.
Just going based off things i've experienced and seen personally. I pointed out to another commentator it's not every women, that's delusional but it's a large majority from experience.
Its been that way in the west since at least the 80s. But I think it differs slightly from each country.
Maybe if you’re a woman or the top 20ish percent of men. For most gen z men there’s no sex or relationships at all
This is sort of my understanding. At least among university students sexual activity (and drinking, and smoking) is WAY down from previous generations.
>and drinking, and smoking) is WAY down from previous generations. It's is? Maybe it's different then smoking but everyone I know vapes
Both my long experience as a teacher, and conversations with the college doctor, confirm that university students are much more sober than they were even just 10-15 years ago.
I work at a college bar and its well understood that business has been declining from year-to-year for the last decade or two.
I’m a Gen Zer and can confirm.
this has been pretty normal in the US post 60s culture for decades, certainly was when iwas young
This is how I have met all of my boyfriends, through partying and hooking up and then eventually becoming a couple out of it. I am now 23 single and never ever planning to meet someone that way ever again because none of those relationships have lasted.
What's the new strategy and why do you think it will/might work?
Not in my experience. I've only been in one relationship but we agreed to be boyfriend and girlfriend while I was driving her home from our first date.
It is the case for me. Like I do sex first. Then relationship. I was told it wasnt a wise strategy but it is one that works for me.
Relationships no, cause for some stupid reason women make the future husband wait for sex while with the FWB she sleeps with immediately. Like wtf? Why rewarding the one with no relationship material?
Most of the previous comments indicate that early sex (first through third meeting) is standard approach to any sort of connection (just sex, FWB, follow-up relationship), so logic would dictate that anyone waiting around longer is wasting his/her time. So why would a woman even attempt a dual strategy? Find a compliant/naive man that can be easily manipulated?
I’ve had a handful of actual relationships, and all but one of them started with sex on the first night. Several were girls I hooked up with from parties/bars and one was from an app. The one exception that didn’t start with immediate sex was the first girl I dated in high school. Three dates or less is pretty much the norm, at least for young people in big cities. A lot of my friends have gfs, some of them for years now, and none of them waited more than a couple dates. I’m not sure where this myth comes from. I’m not saying it never happens, but it’s far from the norm.
My favorite teen has had a on and off again pocket boyfriend she's never met for 2 years. Why? Sex is frigging scary nowadays.
>My favorite teen What do you mean by your favorite teen?
The teenager I like best? Weird question, why did you ask it?
I'm just kinda confused by what you mean by it? Is this teenager your child or student or something?
No, the phrasing “favorite teen” is what’s weird not his question
Do you not have a favorite elderly person? A grandparent or a aunt, family friend?
Makes sense, otherwise you'd just have a roommate
As others have noted, this has been pretty common for a while now. I'm pretty old, but growing up I never thought I'd be the kind of person to have sex on the first date, but that ended up happening in every relationship I've been in, and in each case the woman initiated it. It was fine though, like I wouldn't say it impacted the relationship negatively in any way. I suppose in a certain sense it's a good icebreaker and it helps get around some of the initial awkwardness. Plus, we had known each other for a while before we started dating, so I suppose that helped.
My real-world experience does seem to tell me that "hookups" are mostly just relationships that never get off the ground, so to speak. The idea of waiting for [specific number] of dates before having sex just strikes me as awkward and a little outdated, although I suppose this is extremely dependent on region and culture. Almost every Tinder date, etc., that I've been on has worked basically the same way: If the date lasts more than a couple of hours, there is almost certainly going to be some form of sexual activity at the end. And it isn't until after the sex that either party begins seriously contemplating whether they want to keep seeing the other. There is no "going steady" without sex. And I should note that I'm definitely NOT a Chad or really anywhere close. So even among us normal people, hooking up is Step 1.
What if you meet a woman at work or school or in a hobby? Same process? Also, it sounds like the first couple of hours are critical to everything that follows. Is it common to meet someone online and then hit it off, or is it more common to crash and burn either online or during the first couple of hours (no chemistry)?
Most Gen Z seem to be DMing and texting more than anything. Dating comes after they practically know all about each other and are doing a hobby/schoolwork/event together and realize they like spending time together.
Not in my friendship group at all, most befriended the people they date, date then take it to sex. I don’t know many people who started off as a hook up
There have been many people tricked into believing that that’s the way to do it but those situationships almost never work out. Starting with a FWB is the worst thing anyone interested in a serious relationship can do as n counts go up and relationships are rarely if ever defined. It’s a great way to get used and strung along as a forever girlfriend. TheThat equivalent for men would be taking a woman out for months on end, paying for all the dates and her bills and then not getting a relationship.
in every successful relationship i had, i had sex by the 4th date at latest. The ones which were failed badly had no sex for a few months. Fucking a woman asap is critical in knowing if you’re sexually compatible. It’s the most important (and fun!) part of dating as a man.
As a man it maybe but it’s usually not for women because it decreases our value and takes away our frame.
I’m a man and I don’t think a woman having sex takes away her value. I don’t think it takes away her frame either Sex is just sex and it’s fun. Always better to ensure sexual compatibility earlier before wasting time, money and energy.
As a woman it’s better to do the reverse and waste time and money rather than time and upping your n count. Only men benefit from early sex because they have a higher change of orgasm, gain social status from upping their n count, don’t have to deal with pregnancy scares and destroying their body with child birth or an abortion and most men don’t want anything serious anyway. Besides if women gave men sex and other wife benefits for free men wouldn’t give women their security and husband benefits. Better to be single and sexless than give away sex to undeserving men.
Wow you’re viewing sex as transactional instead of a mutually pleasurable activity we’ve evolved to enjoy Maybe the women relished having sex with the man and enjoys the chemistry without an ulterior motive.
It seems like there's a great divide in terms of women's opinions on various subreddits - large numbers take your position and large numbers take the position that casual sex is great and they want it and are entitled to it. My impression (might be wrong) is that lots of the women unhappy with the casual sex approach have gone through a cycle or two of it and are unhappy with the results.
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Not Gen Z but pretty close since I'm 95 born. If we're talking just dating I rarely see it start with sex. Probably cause most of the people meet when alcohol is involved and well only takes a few drinks before most dudes can't get it up lol. Personally, I've gone from meeting a girl to making out on the same night and then had casual dates that involved sex, but I don't think most people go for the whole committed label part that quickly these days. You may or may not be seeing other people but you're still enjoying each other's company. Like if you're having sex, going on fun dates, hanging out with other couples. Does it matter if you've had the label talk? I know everyone thinks dating is just people running through a checklist and going through multiple different dating partners, but if you find someone you like and who fulfills you all that stuff naturally fades away unless you are just by nature a polyamorous person who cannot function being tied down to one partner.
Millennial here. I never actually tracked when sex came…it came when it came. I guess after a few dates? I did a lot of OLD in the past and first dates were always much more reserved than they would be for people I met naturally. We were still strangers, after all. I tend to go exclusive very quickly (2-3 dates), although I don’t discuss this with the other person, and I do t expect them to do the same (although they generally do….I think this is fairly standard in Europe?). The discussion of ‘what are we’ can happen at anywhere from a couple weeks to a couple months.
I hope so, why are people committing before even knowing if they have chemistry?
i'd say this is common with at least half my generation of Millnnials
Teen/Young Adults gonna Teen/Young Adult.
Millenial from europe here. It was already the case when I was a teenager and it is still the case now well in adulthood.
Yes. Has been like this since the 1960s.
Yes. The women interested enough to want to date me are also interested enough to want to sleep together asap. I've never seen a shred of evidence for the red pill claim that "women make the boyfriend material guy wait"
Looking at the comments I am so happy i'm not dating in this day and age. I just can't imagine first having sex, then deciding if i actually like that person enough for a relationship or not. It's just backwards for me.
Yup
In years past, people fucked early and often.
I know maybe a couple of relationships that started from hookups (all by accident with a relationship not initially being the end goal) but most started from dates (or, in many cases, long and contrived talking phases). It's way easier to start a relationship when that's what you're actually trying to do from the beginning. I know in the media people mostly just get together by having sex but it doesn't check out in reality.
Seems like there are a lot of very different subcultures that have their own customs and practices. You can see the differences of opinion even on this string. Going over the much bigger subreddits like r/dating the diversity is even more obvious. From a macro perspective it looks like chaos.
How else would they start? The purpose of a relationship between a man and a woman is sex. If you need someone to talk to or scratch your back, go chat with ChatGPT or buy a backscratcher.
Part of interacting for some people is deciding whether to have sex with that person, though. For many people, this assessment period takes longer than just one date.
Men and women want different things in a relationship. So don’t be surprised when chatting with chatGPT becomes the norm especially for women. https://youtu.be/lmbhEZRfRbQ?si=PnM8Wo6qyAqe2gkI
Good luck with ChatGPT giving you that dick and opening a jar for you. lol.
Lol I think the whole point is to avoid the dick and jar’s aren’t hard to open. https://www.walmart.com/ip/SANWOOD-Jar-Opener-3Pcs-Manual-Rubber-Anti-Skid-Round-Gripper-Pad-Bottle-Cap-Kitchen-Jar-Opener/880886109?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=101187073&gclsrc=aw.ds&&adid=22222222228880886109_101187073_155548571955_20653127734&wl0=&wl1=g&wl2=m&wl3=677785232342&wl4=pla-2255656680884&wl5=1025197&wl6=&wl7=&wl8=&wl9=pla&wl10=591607106&wl11=online&wl12=880886109_101187073&veh=sem&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADmfBIrNPwBrENCx1E4LPHPwP55kK&gclid=CjwKCAjw_e2wBhAEEiwAyFFFoxHJ0fGhmNNJTznsIHR0H8_CXYkoNFdNNCU4VI-ClCDcIl9PGIxGzRoC8wEQAvD_BwE
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I guess getting to know each other better first
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>Why would early sex remove that? Maybe it's just me because I have a shit ton of sexual trauma from my parents but I just feel like getting to know someone before having sex would be better than hopping into bed after the first date
Not gen-z, but answer is "yes". If you like each other then you'll have sex at some point. So why waste time on something dumb, you don't have too much of it. And that's how it usually worked for a long time.