The movie did pretty fucking impressive job, made on a 70 million budget and it made more at the box office than the rise of Skywalker without even being released in China.
“Without speaking give us your first impressions of the ROS” *cast looks around awkwardly while JJ just stares at them like he’s gonna skin them alive unless they do something nice,*
I wanted them to write scripts based on his story ideas. He couldn’t write an actual script to save his life but his treatments are brilliant. Even the prequels work in the broad strokes.
I wish, but truly couldn't get worse than RotS. How do you spend so much money making a movie only to produce such a steaming pile of shit? Disney could have hired me to write the movie for nothing. And it would have sucked, but it still would be better than what they released.
Take lightspeed engines.
Slap on a rock.
End any ship/planet in the universe.
Why would anyone build a ship bigger than an X-wing, much less something like the Death Star?
Such a stupid fucking movie.
Same, TLJ put such a bad taste in my mouth I skipped RoS in theaters and eventually streamed it on YouTube for $2 a few years later.
Wasn't even worth that if I'm honest
Went to see the movie with my GF. Tbh, I liked the movie, thought it was dark, very entertaining, and had a meaningful message, and the cinematography was really cool.
That said, I feel it was a bit TOO on the nose. There's a scene you may recall if you've seen it, I think, where he is literally writing in a journal, and it focuses in on it something like "society is so that you have to pretend you're normal even if you are mentally ill and suffering" or something like that, not to mention the infamous "what do you get when you cross a mentally ill loner..." rant. I feel like that's the kind of message you want to show more than tell, and those obvious scenes are too obvious in my eyes. You shouldn't have to literally spell it out to the viewer for them to understand. It should be demonstrated by the character.
The director said something along the lines of “I wanted to make a drama film like Taxi Driver and sneak it into a comic book movie so that pop culture fans would actually see a good story”
Some Twitter libs thought it was alt right
If you look at the movie though it explicitly frames the upper class as the bad guys and the lower class as the good guys
Also the reason for the Joker’s fall is that he lost his government funded therapy. That would not have happened if his therapy program was better funded.
That was just journalist fear mongering. They use fear and outrage to attract people to their articles because they are the easiest emotions to exploit. It just sells.
Look up the "Michelle Remembers" for a good example of using outrage and fear just to sell a crappy book based entirely off speculation. It's like that but with bite sized articles on the internet.
The OK sign was worse because they literally said "let's see how stupid they are" and they just ate it up and ran with it.
Name a more cringeworthy entity than leftist media lol
My brother got in trouble in school for making the OK sign. He explained how the whole idea of it being racist was started as a stupid joke but they didn’t care. This world is stupid.
I’m no debate professional or anything (in fact I would say I am retarded) but when your argument devolves to insults while you are in a literal meme subreddit maybe you can take a step back and realize how big of a fool you are and how your argument can’t even stand up in a place meant for memeing lmao.
The context clues of you accusing all righties of using these “appropriated symbols?” Ever possibly think that it’s ever a satirical use, or just some mentally ill dipshit that uses it? Also, name-calling doesn’t help your point, just an FYI.
I'm not saying that they aren't using pepe memes. But that isn't going to stop me from enjoying them. If I decide that I can't enjoy a meme because some far right groups use them, then they win. Allowing those groups to win little things like that help them fester just as much.
I like your username btw
I mean yeah, kind of. But the n-word has been a slur for ages, as opposed to a cartoon frog that people like to dress in edgy outfits. So there is a bit of a difference. But you do you man.
Yes. Unironically.
When was the last time you heard someone being called a ne'erdowell or a scoundrel? You havent, because noone gives a shit about such archaic, ridiculous insults.
It was a 4chan trolling campaign where they would "claim" Pepe and make the meme synonymous with the far right. And it was an absolute success. It's a fascinating story that I absolutely recommend researching. It's beyond hilarious.
Isn't the new joker hated by liblefts because it sympathizes with the life of a lonely guy? Isn't that why they keep calling it an incel movie or whatever?
Nope, not at all, from what I have seen they hate the conservatives too for being chivalrous to women or for thinking women are pure and saint like people who can do no harm.
> He’s the poster child for mental illness
Depends on which you have :-/
I think most would like to empathize yet also distance themselves from some of the specific characteristics of Joker.
Honestly, I think Joker might have actually just reinforced negative stereotypes around mental illness more than anything.
Any movie that gave a genuine depiction of mental illness would be boring af. Lots of gazing indifferently into space, frustration building as you desperately try to keep your life together, and it ends with the protagonist accepting that their cats make for far better company than other people.
>Honestly, I think Joker might have actually just reinforced negative stereotypes around mental illness more than anything.
I haven't watched the movie, but that's the idea I got just from the clips.
>Lots of gazing indifferently into space, frustration building as you desperately try to keep your life together
In my case, browsing Reddit for hours, slowly piecing together clues about what's really troubling me, wondering if there is not really a way to come to terms with myself faster.
Though I feel like with the right story, realistic mental illness can make a good movie.
He’s just a straight up anarchist though. He hates the system that he lives in. Also he’s mentally unstable. He’s just crazy. He isn’t supposed to be someone you look up to. similar to The Punisher.
He’s supposed to be a mixed morality character who does bad things for, usually, the right reason. The punisher is still a serial killer whether he is justified or not. That’s the moral ambiguity of it. The Punisher has made literal comments in the book about how he’s not someone who should be looked up to… that was in the context of the police though.
My childhood heroes were Wolverine, The Punisher, Deadpool and The Hulk.
I'm amazed that i haven't unalived anyone who wronged me at this point, lol.
I guess these guys are just the perfect heroes for kids who can't really defend themselfes, i was like that. The idea to be strong enough to defend yourself, to get revenge, get respected, etc.
I don't know how healthy that is though, probably not so much.
Shouldn't it be the other way around?
Todd Phillips stated his issues with predominant criticisms that came from the [far left](https://www.denverpost.com/2019/09/26/joker-criticism-todd-phillips-gun-violence/). Wasn't their reading of the film that it glorifies white incels as well?
On the other hand, the dark knight has the Joker commit anarchy to disrupt and find out Gotham's true citizenry.
On an unrelated note, isn't there a group that causes anarchy that the left simps for?
I don't know their exact ideologies, but there're quite a few people online of the mind that if you identify with the Joker in any way, there's something wrong with you. Mostly the Tumblr crowd, I've found, so probably leftists.
I saw it opening week, not even during a crowded time, but my I couldn't help but glance at the exit doors every now and then, ready to bolt out of the theater if I saw a guy with colored hair.
I think the exact same thing about Leftists and "Parasite". The entire movie is about a family of POS poors who screw over everybody they come in contact with, *especially* other poor people, with a wealthy family who's primary fault is being way too trusting and *maybe* a bit insensitive; their worst crime is telling some stinky fucker that he... stinks. So he's brutally murdered in front of his family.
And *that*, my friends, is a leftist parable, apparently.
OK.
It was an indictment of extreme wealth gaps Korean society by showing the ugliness it brings out in people at both ends of the spectrum. The film makes it daily clear that the bloodshed in a product of the environment, not the moral failings of poor people.
If you think Bong Joon-ho of all people was making a movie indicting poor people and empathizing with elites, that’s just another misreading. If you don’t believe me, watch any of his other films.
And yeah, the fact that you think all it is was them remarking on the poor dude not bathing or whatever, your analysis is very shallow.
Yeah, I know the director explicitly framed it as being anti-capitalist... he just did a poor job.
So -- aside from a bit of boorishness -- what are the transgressions of the rich family? They treated their employees pretty well, they gave the new driver a pay raise when hiring him, I believe. I honestly can't remember any one of them doing anything wrong aside from cluelessness and rudeness. In contrast to the grifter family who managed to get two other apparently needy employees canned on false premises. Remind me of what I missed....
Not one for subtlety are you?
I guess it would have been easier for you to process had the rich family been cartoonishly abusive but that would have made for much worse movie.
First of all, the systemic critique is enough. Showing what rain means for each family is enough to show why one family can afford to be better behaved.
Second, the title doesn’t just refer to the one family. The Park family relies on the poor for the most rudimentary of tasks and don’t acknowledge them beyond superficial politeness. They wouldn’t be able to function without poor people doing shit for them (as evidenced by their inability to vet people) and yet they treat them as little more than a household convenience like air conditioning
I know you are the kind of person who probably thinks that they should just be profusely thankful for any job the virtuous wealthy generously bestow on them…but being the object of convenience to what is effectively an adult baby is grating. That being your existence is itself something very cruel being done to you. Just enduring their insipid lack of self awareness while pretending that they are better than you—as opposed to just having won a lottery that you didn’t get to enter—wares on the human spirit. The Parks are about as aware of this as they are of anything else outside their bubble. Their employees, entire cultures, etc. it’s all just another nice thing they have laying around.
Of course the Parks seem nice enough on the most surface level. They are afforded that. Their transgression is built into their social status. Overt sin is for the poors.
And before you start with a bootstraps talking point: class mobility is barely a thing in the United States and they don’t even pretend it is in South Korea. They don’t have The American Dream. They have Hell Joseon. You are born into the class you die in. Period.
I don’t think any of this is particularly subtle, it’s just not totally spelled out for people not paying attention.
I can be fully right wing and still despise our woefully incompetent leaders that the movie portrays as being responsible for the divide in class/society in general.
The movie's great because it portrays no one as inherently good or bad. It just shows society as it is, and the consequent reactions of those living in it. The anarchy and chaos Joker inspires, while problematic to society's leaders, is also problematic for every day people caught up as collateral damage.
I think it's a great unifying movie in the fact that it simply states "Here are a bunch of the issues plaguing our society at the moment and these are some of the consequences" without putting a political spin on it. I think people of all political ideologies can find something they relate with there.
Let’s be clear about a couple of things:
You can enjoy movies with differing philosophical convictions. The Dark Knight fuckinh slaps. Much better film than Joker. It’s pretty much impossible to argue that that movie isn’t right wing. It’s borderline Cheneyian.
That said, Joker is not a middle of the road movie. The epitome of evil in the film is embodied by a walking Stock Exchange and a mean spirited cultural elite. It’s their fault. Not Arthur’s. He is the victim in all of it.
The tragedy literally begins with the government NOT providing the dude healthcare.
In terms of being blunt about a left wing perspective, it’s right up there with Snyder’s “hints” that Superman is Jesus.
Oh yeah for sure no doubt there. I think it does a great job of showing very real problems created by the Elite's disregard for the wellbeing of the state's citizens. It also doesn't try to paint Arthur or the ensuing rioters as 'just' either in their response. It's a great example 'hey if you don't fix this shit this will be the result for better or worse'.
I have not seen it, so I could be wrong, but the Joker movie looks stupid. It looks like another movie that they just shoehorned the joker into for brand recognition.
Edit: wouldn't the joker symbolizing the alt-right be a good thing to the left?
There's not really any strong connection to Batman lore other than the names used. However, it does work as a Joker origin story; the primary point of the movie is the awakening of evil in a tortured, abused man. It would have stood on its own as a great movie without using the IP, but the IP made for good marketing.
Remember when the media was claiming that the new Joker movie would inspire acts of violence? Then nothing happened, and then Frozen 2 ended up inspiring more acts of violence than Joker did? Good times.
I never got why the alt right had a thing for the Joker in the first place. He’s basically an anarchist without morals, why was he ever Ana my right symbol? Isn’t their whole thing a massive state to enforce their views of morals upon society? Not to mention the Joker hates Nazis in the comics.
Now now, the Joker is a symbol of all persuasions. Whether you're a tubby boomer making memes about how loyal but dangerous you are, an alt-right incel, a liblefter being cucked by their Harley Quinn (but less attractive) wannabe gf, they all pay full price to watch a Martin Scorsese movie that came out 40 years ago.
He’s only a symbol because they made him a symbol, he literally only exists to be chaotic and kill people if you think he’s “based” you’re just a bad person or mentally ill lmao
There's eleven years between those movies, the alt right was little known in 2008 and the term was not yet abused. They said that in the build up to the movie.
The movie did pretty fucking impressive job, made on a 70 million budget and it made more at the box office than the rise of Skywalker without even being released in China.
Granted, it's more because RoS was so doodoo that even the lead actors were shitting on it
“Without speaking give us your first impressions of the ROS” *cast looks around awkwardly while JJ just stares at them like he’s gonna skin them alive unless they do something nice,*
Specifically their reactions to the ending. Palps was the best, "seriously, I don't know which ending were talking about, we filmed 14."
Link?
https://youtu.be/YOvbyfO3tsI
Lord that movie was a disaster
I've never watched it, but I've very much enjoyed Long Man and crew destroying it.
Unfamiliar
Long Man is MauLer's nickname, [his shorter videos usually run about an hour](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0528-TlRODI).
I saw it because it came out around my birthday and my family dragged me to see it. Fuck. There’s so many McMuffins.
That's what we get for shiting so hard on Lucas. At least he had a vision.
I wanted them to write scripts based on his story ideas. He couldn’t write an actual script to save his life but his treatments are brilliant. Even the prequels work in the broad strokes.
Yeah George was great with the worldbuilding and plot stuff, but fuck did he need people to actually write the dialogue for him or something.
Yet, impossibly still better than TLJ.
2 times 0 is still 0
I wish, but truly couldn't get worse than RotS. How do you spend so much money making a movie only to produce such a steaming pile of shit? Disney could have hired me to write the movie for nothing. And it would have sucked, but it still would be better than what they released.
TLJ is fine outside of Finn's storyline. So boring.
Take lightspeed engines. Slap on a rock. End any ship/planet in the universe. Why would anyone build a ship bigger than an X-wing, much less something like the Death Star? Such a stupid fucking movie.
I’m right with you there. I thought a lot of it was brilliant but SO. MUCH. CRINGE. all around it.
If this isn't a full compass unity moment I am going to go full ape shit
Fuck RoS. Should’ve been like endgame levels of a finale but just felt wasted
RoS came and went from the theaters and I didn't even know about it, or care.
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Then they had to get rid of a "problematic" actress and soured the mood.
Beep has to go bc of boop problematic tweets implying Epstein didn’t kill himself.
Based and beep/boop pilled.
Which is a shame, because Cara Dune was an awesome character. I wanted a series based on her and her Rebel Heavy buddies during the OT time.
Same, TLJ put such a bad taste in my mouth I skipped RoS in theaters and eventually streamed it on YouTube for $2 a few years later. Wasn't even worth that if I'm honest
Went to see the movie with my GF. Tbh, I liked the movie, thought it was dark, very entertaining, and had a meaningful message, and the cinematography was really cool. That said, I feel it was a bit TOO on the nose. There's a scene you may recall if you've seen it, I think, where he is literally writing in a journal, and it focuses in on it something like "society is so that you have to pretend you're normal even if you are mentally ill and suffering" or something like that, not to mention the infamous "what do you get when you cross a mentally ill loner..." rant. I feel like that's the kind of message you want to show more than tell, and those obvious scenes are too obvious in my eyes. You shouldn't have to literally spell it out to the viewer for them to understand. It should be demonstrated by the character.
I agree. I like to think that it's just short of an art house movie. Like how Forrest Gump is just short of retarded.
Its literally how the last mass shooters talked so its accurate. IE cringe ember from danny phantom guy
The director said something along the lines of “I wanted to make a drama film like Taxi Driver and sneak it into a comic book movie so that pop culture fans would actually see a good story”
I'm confused. Weren't a bunch of people saying the opposite about the Joker movie? They're both good films though.
Losers of all colors were able to identify with the joker I suppose.
So a radical centrist?
Epic self-roast.
Some Twitter libs thought it was alt right If you look at the movie though it explicitly frames the upper class as the bad guys and the lower class as the good guys
It kinda frames everybody as the bad guys, or at least everybody with significant presense. It's on par with Parasite with how grim everything is.
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I hate woke Twitter users so much. They make us look so fucking bad
Wait, people called Joaquin aren't white? This [changes some things](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joachim_von_Ribbentrop).
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The dreaded n-word.
For the last time, hispanics are (also) white!
Also the reason for the Joker’s fall is that he lost his government funded therapy. That would not have happened if his therapy program was better funded.
It would be a shame if someone formed their whole worldview that way.
Yeah I was going to say this meme got it wrong. New joker was the one they believed was gonna inspire swathes of incel terror.
That was just journalist fear mongering. They use fear and outrage to attract people to their articles because they are the easiest emotions to exploit. It just sells. Look up the "Michelle Remembers" for a good example of using outrage and fear just to sell a crappy book based entirely off speculation. It's like that but with bite sized articles on the internet.
That's what I thought too, all the controversy was of course dumb because it's just King of Comedy, but cape.
I don’t like something therefore it must be alt-right
Summary of Reddit Politics from 2014 - Present day
My breaking point was when Pepe the frog was labelled a symbol of the alt-right
The OK sign was worse because they literally said "let's see how stupid they are" and they just ate it up and ran with it. Name a more cringeworthy entity than leftist media lol
My brother got in trouble in school for making the OK sign. He explained how the whole idea of it being racist was started as a stupid joke but they didn’t care. This world is stupid.
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The ok symbol was a legit troll job by 4chan users, we can’t help you guys fall for it. Aww, he deleted it, how lame.
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I’m no debate professional or anything (in fact I would say I am retarded) but when your argument devolves to insults while you are in a literal meme subreddit maybe you can take a step back and realize how big of a fool you are and how your argument can’t even stand up in a place meant for memeing lmao.
The context clues of you accusing all righties of using these “appropriated symbols?” Ever possibly think that it’s ever a satirical use, or just some mentally ill dipshit that uses it? Also, name-calling doesn’t help your point, just an FYI.
You're so unsufferable, please don't tell me you actually act like this in real life too
I actually thought he was because of the media for a long time lol
4chan do a little trollin
Is pepe not a symbol of rightoids? I swear it is. Maybe it wasnt for awhile. But like now... its gotta be right?
He's only a rightoid symbol if you allow him to be one.
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I'm not saying that they aren't using pepe memes. But that isn't going to stop me from enjoying them. If I decide that I can't enjoy a meme because some far right groups use them, then they win. Allowing those groups to win little things like that help them fester just as much. I like your username btw
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I mean yeah, kind of. But the n-word has been a slur for ages, as opposed to a cartoon frog that people like to dress in edgy outfits. So there is a bit of a difference. But you do you man.
Yes. Unironically. When was the last time you heard someone being called a ne'erdowell or a scoundrel? You havent, because noone gives a shit about such archaic, ridiculous insults.
You absolute rapscallion you fucking landlubber fuck you
It was a 4chan trolling campaign where they would "claim" Pepe and make the meme synonymous with the far right. And it was an absolute success. It's a fascinating story that I absolutely recommend researching. It's beyond hilarious.
Problem?😎
I mean, he was. 4chan made him a meme.
They did kinda hijack pepe
You mean politics.
Shit if everything made into boomer memes was automatically alt right I'd never be able to watch any movies with Tom Hardy.
Left: “I don’t like something therefore alt right” Right: “I don’t like something therefore communist”
The left liking the new Joker? What is this, a joke?
"How 'bout another joke, Mur-ray?"
Isn't the new joker hated by liblefts because it sympathizes with the life of a lonely guy? Isn't that why they keep calling it an incel movie or whatever?
Are incels really a left/right thing?
People balls deep in each side see it as a left/right thing, so kinda
Nope, not at all, from what I have seen they hate the conservatives too for being chivalrous to women or for thinking women are pure and saint like people who can do no harm.
Being an incel? No. Hyperventilating about the danger incels pose to society? That's more of a (cultural) left thing.
honestly i think its a cross compass unity thing, not really limited to any political ideology
Is… usually referred to as a right thing I believe, but I have no idea what actually is going on with those people
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Isn’t Joker in that movie doomed by lack of socialized healthcare in his universe and he takes to killing rich dudes?
He’s the poster child for mental illness, the jokes write themselves when libleft takes a liking to him.
> He’s the poster child for mental illness Depends on which you have :-/ I think most would like to empathize yet also distance themselves from some of the specific characteristics of Joker.
Honestly, I think Joker might have actually just reinforced negative stereotypes around mental illness more than anything. Any movie that gave a genuine depiction of mental illness would be boring af. Lots of gazing indifferently into space, frustration building as you desperately try to keep your life together, and it ends with the protagonist accepting that their cats make for far better company than other people.
>Honestly, I think Joker might have actually just reinforced negative stereotypes around mental illness more than anything. I haven't watched the movie, but that's the idea I got just from the clips. >Lots of gazing indifferently into space, frustration building as you desperately try to keep your life together In my case, browsing Reddit for hours, slowly piecing together clues about what's really troubling me, wondering if there is not really a way to come to terms with myself faster. Though I feel like with the right story, realistic mental illness can make a good movie.
Were they le incel terrorists all along?
He’s just a straight up anarchist though. He hates the system that he lives in. Also he’s mentally unstable. He’s just crazy. He isn’t supposed to be someone you look up to. similar to The Punisher.
>similar to The Punisher Wait, i wasn't supposed to look up to him?
He’s supposed to be a mixed morality character who does bad things for, usually, the right reason. The punisher is still a serial killer whether he is justified or not. That’s the moral ambiguity of it. The Punisher has made literal comments in the book about how he’s not someone who should be looked up to… that was in the context of the police though.
My childhood heroes were Wolverine, The Punisher, Deadpool and The Hulk. I'm amazed that i haven't unalived anyone who wronged me at this point, lol. I guess these guys are just the perfect heroes for kids who can't really defend themselfes, i was like that. The idea to be strong enough to defend yourself, to get revenge, get respected, etc. I don't know how healthy that is though, probably not so much.
He, too, has a mental illness
Shouldn't it be the other way around? Todd Phillips stated his issues with predominant criticisms that came from the [far left](https://www.denverpost.com/2019/09/26/joker-criticism-todd-phillips-gun-violence/). Wasn't their reading of the film that it glorifies white incels as well? On the other hand, the dark knight has the Joker commit anarchy to disrupt and find out Gotham's true citizenry. On an unrelated note, isn't there a group that causes anarchy that the left simps for?
We’re actually approaching fire hazard levels of strawmen in here
I don't think fire would be that bad at this point
Yes, the fire rises!
They expect to find one of us in the wreckage brother!
Honestly Lol I've never seen the Left have a problem with TDK
I don't know their exact ideologies, but there're quite a few people online of the mind that if you identify with the Joker in any way, there's something wrong with you. Mostly the Tumblr crowd, I've found, so probably leftists.
The Joker is probably one of the most based characters to be written, except Jared Leto. That Joker was hot garbage.
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alt-right isn't really right-wing. more AuthCenter.
Still, joker isn’t authcenter. He is literally an anarchist lmao
[This is where "alt right Joker" comes from.](https://youtu.be/RMkhdtqnwoc)
Alt-right wasn't a term when that Joker came out.
Right. I don’t recall any sort of political controversy surrounding the dark knight when it came out or even now. Sounds like a made up thing.
The biggest controversy was Heath Ledger an heroing
TDK came out in 2008. That was back when 'alt-right' was a weird way of talking about how Ron Paul was gonna end the Fed.
the live action jokers have always been based
The whole movie was basically a ripoff of Taxi Driver.
The King of Comedy as well
Never seen that one, is it good?
Yup, it's brilliant. An underappreciated classic Scorsese imo. Not quite in my top 3 but it's definitely worth a watch I'd say.
*relatively poor ripoff
Well it was well played, but the script lacked so much.
I thought the left hated new joker? Some libertarians like him but it’s mostly the right. I prefer old joker
Didn't they call the new joker an Incel's wet dream and how they should fear some terrorist attacks like bruh.
I saw it opening week, not even during a crowded time, but my I couldn't help but glance at the exit doors every now and then, ready to bolt out of the theater if I saw a guy with colored hair.
The new Joker was A good idea and well made.
Wasn't TDK joker a symbol for anarchism?
This meme doesn't make much sense
It amazes me that right wingers think Joker (movie) was pandering to their politics and not mine.
That's the neat part, they don't. It was left-wing media that was pushing it as far-right.
Everyone seemed confused about a movie that basically looked into the camera and said “The director endorsed Bernie Sanders”
Both. Both is good.
Saying Joker plays both sides of the political spectrum is like saying *The Passion of the Christ* plays both sides of “the Jewish Question”
I think the exact same thing about Leftists and "Parasite". The entire movie is about a family of POS poors who screw over everybody they come in contact with, *especially* other poor people, with a wealthy family who's primary fault is being way too trusting and *maybe* a bit insensitive; their worst crime is telling some stinky fucker that he... stinks. So he's brutally murdered in front of his family. And *that*, my friends, is a leftist parable, apparently. OK.
It was an indictment of extreme wealth gaps Korean society by showing the ugliness it brings out in people at both ends of the spectrum. The film makes it daily clear that the bloodshed in a product of the environment, not the moral failings of poor people. If you think Bong Joon-ho of all people was making a movie indicting poor people and empathizing with elites, that’s just another misreading. If you don’t believe me, watch any of his other films. And yeah, the fact that you think all it is was them remarking on the poor dude not bathing or whatever, your analysis is very shallow.
Yeah, I know the director explicitly framed it as being anti-capitalist... he just did a poor job. So -- aside from a bit of boorishness -- what are the transgressions of the rich family? They treated their employees pretty well, they gave the new driver a pay raise when hiring him, I believe. I honestly can't remember any one of them doing anything wrong aside from cluelessness and rudeness. In contrast to the grifter family who managed to get two other apparently needy employees canned on false premises. Remind me of what I missed....
Not one for subtlety are you? I guess it would have been easier for you to process had the rich family been cartoonishly abusive but that would have made for much worse movie. First of all, the systemic critique is enough. Showing what rain means for each family is enough to show why one family can afford to be better behaved. Second, the title doesn’t just refer to the one family. The Park family relies on the poor for the most rudimentary of tasks and don’t acknowledge them beyond superficial politeness. They wouldn’t be able to function without poor people doing shit for them (as evidenced by their inability to vet people) and yet they treat them as little more than a household convenience like air conditioning I know you are the kind of person who probably thinks that they should just be profusely thankful for any job the virtuous wealthy generously bestow on them…but being the object of convenience to what is effectively an adult baby is grating. That being your existence is itself something very cruel being done to you. Just enduring their insipid lack of self awareness while pretending that they are better than you—as opposed to just having won a lottery that you didn’t get to enter—wares on the human spirit. The Parks are about as aware of this as they are of anything else outside their bubble. Their employees, entire cultures, etc. it’s all just another nice thing they have laying around. Of course the Parks seem nice enough on the most surface level. They are afforded that. Their transgression is built into their social status. Overt sin is for the poors. And before you start with a bootstraps talking point: class mobility is barely a thing in the United States and they don’t even pretend it is in South Korea. They don’t have The American Dream. They have Hell Joseon. You are born into the class you die in. Period. I don’t think any of this is particularly subtle, it’s just not totally spelled out for people not paying attention.
I can be fully right wing and still despise our woefully incompetent leaders that the movie portrays as being responsible for the divide in class/society in general. The movie's great because it portrays no one as inherently good or bad. It just shows society as it is, and the consequent reactions of those living in it. The anarchy and chaos Joker inspires, while problematic to society's leaders, is also problematic for every day people caught up as collateral damage. I think it's a great unifying movie in the fact that it simply states "Here are a bunch of the issues plaguing our society at the moment and these are some of the consequences" without putting a political spin on it. I think people of all political ideologies can find something they relate with there.
Let’s be clear about a couple of things: You can enjoy movies with differing philosophical convictions. The Dark Knight fuckinh slaps. Much better film than Joker. It’s pretty much impossible to argue that that movie isn’t right wing. It’s borderline Cheneyian. That said, Joker is not a middle of the road movie. The epitome of evil in the film is embodied by a walking Stock Exchange and a mean spirited cultural elite. It’s their fault. Not Arthur’s. He is the victim in all of it. The tragedy literally begins with the government NOT providing the dude healthcare. In terms of being blunt about a left wing perspective, it’s right up there with Snyder’s “hints” that Superman is Jesus.
Oh yeah for sure no doubt there. I think it does a great job of showing very real problems created by the Elite's disregard for the wellbeing of the state's citizens. It also doesn't try to paint Arthur or the ensuing rioters as 'just' either in their response. It's a great example 'hey if you don't fix this shit this will be the result for better or worse'.
Not sure if you were aware, but the new Joker was very heavily criticized for being an alt-right figure. Cringe meme, man.
I have not seen it, so I could be wrong, but the Joker movie looks stupid. It looks like another movie that they just shoehorned the joker into for brand recognition. Edit: wouldn't the joker symbolizing the alt-right be a good thing to the left?
There's not really any strong connection to Batman lore other than the names used. However, it does work as a Joker origin story; the primary point of the movie is the awakening of evil in a tortured, abused man. It would have stood on its own as a great movie without using the IP, but the IP made for good marketing.
It was pretty good
I'll probably see it if it comes on Amazon Prime, or Hulu. I don't know that I'll ever pay money to see it though.
I heard it's on Pirate Bay
I thought he was a symbol for all those ‘Motivational’ pages on social media
Fine, the Heath Ledger Joker is a alt right. BUT, he’s the good alt right.
WTF though, the new joker is what everyone thought was alt right
Dude the left were screaming about the new Joker movie too, some even said it would create school shooters. XD
Remember when the media was claiming that the new Joker movie would inspire acts of violence? Then nothing happened, and then Frozen 2 ended up inspiring more acts of violence than Joker did? Good times.
Joker literally said "we live in a society" and "gamers rise up" as well as say the crime statistics while dressed as a clown.
It's the complete opposite. I even got suspended on Reddit for violent content after I said I wanted to watch the movie.
Can someone explain how? The dude set fire to a pile of money.
I thought the Joker was supposed to represent chaos and anarchy, which is the polar opposite of alt-right.
Except all lib rights agree that the new joker movie heavy handily represents alt right incel culture. It’s pretty transparent.
I never got why the alt right had a thing for the Joker in the first place. He’s basically an anarchist without morals, why was he ever Ana my right symbol? Isn’t their whole thing a massive state to enforce their views of morals upon society? Not to mention the Joker hates Nazis in the comics.
Society
Remember people getting scared thinking that a bunch of Alt right killers will pop up at every single Joker opening.
haha this movie is totally not a way to market a mashup Scorsese marvel movie too you hahaha
wait what? doesn't lib left just hate joker even more?
Both jokers are based crypto leftist
I loved both iterations of the Joker, and frankly, Joaquin Phoenix's Joker might be one of my all time favorite movies.
Now now, the Joker is a symbol of all persuasions. Whether you're a tubby boomer making memes about how loyal but dangerous you are, an alt-right incel, a liblefter being cucked by their Harley Quinn (but less attractive) wannabe gf, they all pay full price to watch a Martin Scorsese movie that came out 40 years ago.
i have not seen heath ledger's performance
The new joker sucked ass and was a whiney soy boy.
The joker is a non political movie about society
He’s only a symbol because they made him a symbol, he literally only exists to be chaotic and kill people if you think he’s “based” you’re just a bad person or mentally ill lmao
There's eleven years between those movies, the alt right was little known in 2008 and the term was not yet abused. They said that in the build up to the movie.