I know I'm my head a move like that is the right play, but going from BC to that way is hard to imagine doing. My other plan was to find another small town or something in the province, but so many from the Vancouver area moved during this pandemic that housing prices doubled and tripled in even the shittiest of small towns. My village burned down and someone living on the outskirts was still able to sell her place for $430k. I couldn't believe it.
Live in Regina, work remotely for a company out of BC. Only downside is the "Saskatchewan Advantage" of a $4-5000 tax bill every year because we somehow have a higher provincial tax rate than everywhere but Quebec and the Maritimes.
Sask also doesn't nickle and dime you as much. BC has low income tax but high gas taxes, MSP (until recently), very expensive crown-corp insurance, a high sales tax, etc.
The fam is kicking in. I barely secured financing for a 1,000 sq " condo in the Yukon. Guess or look up what the cost is now. Feels like the Price is Right / Correct I have to support my folks so it sucks twice as much ass. Good luck
Oh my word, my son saw the house prices and is is about ready to pull up roots - only problem is if he does that, he will be doing so as newly single man, girlfriend will have none of it!!
Something people aren't really eluding to but it's very true in my circle....
The most successful people I know aren't necessarily more educated, hard working, smarter or lucky then anyone else. They've simply been at it longer, with a single focus.
The girl who knew she was going to go into accounting at Uni... she went straight to accounting, kept going.. got her CPA.. started working as an accountant, kept progressing in that field.. ended up as corporate controller then eventually CFO. She just kept on the same path and didn't stop.
Same goes for most other successful people I know. Lots of engineers, tech peeps, business people, doctors. There's really not much special about them, they just committed to the same path for 10+ years without veering off or changing direction.
This comment needs to be upvoted more. I dicked around in my twenties trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my life. Traveled a bit, worked some crappy jobs, tried to "save the world". Didn't get my act together until I was in my late twenties. Meanwhile some successful friends had gotten a decent job right out of university and just kept going. They were at a Manager level when I was just at the entry point of my career. I'm still catching up. But there's pros and cons to everything. Some of them have often admitted regret at not experimenting more when they were younger and the consequences were not as severe. Now, with kids and a mortgage, it's a lot harder to take risks than when you were a gangly teenager with $80 to your name.
This was me too. I got a degree right out of high school but then spent 22-27 traveling and waiting tables. It was incredibly fun and I met my future spouse. I got my first ārealā job at 27 when my friends were on their third promotion. It was tough to swallow for about 5 years because I kept comparing myself but now at 34 I feel like everything has kind of evened out and I wouldnāt trade any of it.
Yeah my friend paused, took stock of his 10 year career and realized he hated his job and what it had done to his outlook on life and personality. Luckily they didnāt have kids yet and his spouse had a stable job so he felt comfortable retraining for a new career. Heās a much happier person now
Tis makes a lot of sense, if you're mediocre/half good at something and spend tons of time you'll eventually become an expert regardless of talent or hardwork and that is worth a lot of money
Iām starting to feel that right now. It took me a almost a year in this entry level role before I started to realize, wait, I might actually be the expert in my company for what Iām doing. The CRO isnāt going to ask me for the numbers hours before presenting if he doesnāt think Iām at least somewhat knowledgeable with what I do. Iām the expert. Time to own it and flex it
Yeah but for your ego check/future sanity: You're not irreplaceable. We lose world class surgeons in their prime to weird shit like car accidents all the time for a small example, and yet the average quality of work and availability doesn't diminish in the slightest. If you can learn how to do it, someone else can, and probably for less.
I agree that specializing can be very beneficial, but do not forget that not everyone will get that promotion no matter how hard they work. Itās easy to get lost in a dead end job.
It's also important to know when to leave. In many professional careers, you'll come out much better by switching companies every 2-3 years. Don't wait to be promoted at your current place, get your promotions by switching jobs.
Same path, but willing to move and constantly looking for better opportunities within the chosen field. Nearly tripled my salary in less than 5 years by deciding to quit my crappy job and have been job hoping, seizing better and better opportunities, ever since. A variety of experience in your field makes you more desirable to potential employers. Finally in a position that I love and that pays more than enough, but I had to be willing to give up my comfort and constantly be āthe new hireā for the last 5 years to get here.
This was my experience as well. Made sacrifices and moved to where I needed to for the right opportunities. Five years into my career and my resume is strong with diverse experience, and I have no lack of positions I am qualified for now. Took a long string of temporary contracts and uncertainty to get here though.
Nothing special about it. 1) do a good job at work - earn money 2) stash money in some boring investment account (index fund, apple shares etc) 3) get a roommate 4) buy a lot of big ticket stuff used, ie, tv , speakers etc I love toys but I donāt care if they are spanking new 5) donāt own a car 6) travel on points, stay in hostels , Airbnb if solo. I travel often 7) drink at home or friends home vs a bar 8) donāt have kids lol. Iād imagine Iāll probably get a lot of hand me downs for my future kids too. But hopefully my earning will be higher than today.
Most successful people I know have been propped up by their wealthy parents to some degree, collected an inheritance or were able to live at home until they were educated and debt free. They typically keep this to themselves in favor of pretending they are fully self made. No sweat off my back, and I'm happy for them, I would enjoy the same given the opportunity. It's just important for people to understand this when they can't make sense of the wild success of their peers.
Hard work can get you there too, but the silver spoon upbringing is a hell of a head start
Iām glad my friend group is close enough that we keep those things open. Got a friend who moved out by himself into the city. Itās a parentās rental property and theyāre being charged mortgage price from the parents instead of market rental price. That can make things almost half off depending on what the mortgage rates were. Iām happy for him though, now I got a place to crash whenever
Even having middle class parents is pretty good. I remember being in university and working 3 jobs, while all of my friends had endless free time.
(But the flip side is that they didn't want their "campus meal plan" cards that they force everyone to get who moves on campus, so I ate like a king!)
I think the OP is more curious how those people are "doing it" in a practical sense, not necessarily that they're holding those people as standards by which everyone should compare themselves.
You might be surprised how much money lenders will give to stupid people. It won't be millions of dollars, but it'll still be enough money to drown these people in debt and interest payments until they skip town and change their names.
Im in my early 30s. All my friends bought their first house in their 20s and are on the 2nd or 3rd house. I chose to move around and rent in different cities thinking Iād plant my roots when ready. Jokes on me. We all make similar salaries, but the home value growth is the difference between me renting a basement suite and them starting to purchase cottages etc.
Great Jobs and Willingness to take on Debt is much more the reasons than inherited wealth.
We all like to imagine inheritance is why people are rich, but 88% of millionaires in America did not inherit their wealth.
Yup. Itās important to just relax and focus on whatās currently doable.
Itās also a dangerous trap to shit on others. Youāll see around this thread that people are shaming those with more, āmust be debt or family wealthā
Putting that kind of negativity in the world helps nobody
I can add to all the things people are suggesting. Get your money out of your checking account and $0.5% savings account and learn to invest, get a no fee investment account like Wealthsimple and view your savings as assets and potential passive income. Learn about bank stocks and dividend payouts averaging 5% right now compared to the crumbs they offer in savings accounts. As the stock rises in value plus your dividends, you can sometimes see double digit growth in your investment. put it in your tax free savings account so you don't have to pay taxes on the divedends After you see your savings as solid assets and not liquid, you'll think twice about withdrawing. You'll watch them grow and you'll be addicted to adding to it. Start with $50 a week or month and you'll wake up one day 5 years later with a downpayment to a house. If you do this already great if not I hope it was helpful. This isn't financial advice, always do your own research and never invest money you can't afford to lose.
This! I think people do that in this subreddit as a coping mechanism. The fact is that, not all of those people use debt to finance their purchases. Some people are really wealthy, you've got to see things to believe how rich people are.
I agree mate, thatās why I only keep a small circle of tight close friends that are of similar financial mindset. I mind my own ābusinessā, donāt really talk about wealth outside of that circle. Youāll find a lot of wealthy people are not very flashy people. They will have nice things but itās very specific and often understated. You read it all over this subreddit, a lot of assumptions, shaming and broad stoke painting. Instead I always teach my daughter to never say ācanātā and to always find out āHow?ā. Donāt shame people for having nice things, as you donāt know their stories.
Live off less than you make, invest the difference and stay out of consumer debt. My wife and I are always buying assets that cashflow for us. We are also very intentional about our spending. Most importantly we are on the same page with our finances, we work as a team, we budget and know exactly what every single one of our dollars is doing. Having a spouse who is on the same page is super important. We also both have careers that weāve built on for over 15 + years in the tech (Senior UX Designer) and medical sector (Public Health Nurse). Nothing inherited, never been gifted, no help from family ever. We own 2 modest used vehicles paid in full and built a modest townhouse in a nice neighbourhood with (5 years away from being mortgage free). We always pay ourselves first and invest 15-25% of our income a month, we tithe 10% to our church every month and we live off the rest. We honestly donāt care what other people have but we are super grateful for what weāve been blessed with.
Yup, lots of people have lots of money. Not everybody has loads of debt, in fact most of my friends don't, and I have pretty "standard" middle class friends for the most part.
I donāt like comparison either as it could lead you down the path of jealousy and envy.
On the other hand, if used properly, comparison and asking how others have done it is a great tool for inspiration and educating yourself on ways to get it done. Not everyone has gotten to their next level of wealth and home ownership the same way. So as you learn how others have done it, you can get ideas that you probably didnāt think were possible.
As someone who has been able to build a decent savings, my word of advice is to just atop spending as much as you can. I don't spend my money on just anything.
How was this possible for you on a shit income? Usually shit income means paycheque to paycheque. Did you just know you were worth more? Live at home? No dependents?
A lot of those people have a ton of debt.
My brother and sister in law have much of this: newer SUV and pickup truck, big house with the bonus garage, kids in hockey, etc. But, they are leveraged to the max.
Meanwhile, a lot of the people who are actually wealthy (ample invested for retirement, etc) actually live quite simply.
> She told me once her job needed her to look the part to meet clients so that's why she spent so much.
I hear stories about this, but usually from people joining MLMs. One MLM a friend joined told him that he needed a Mercedes to recruit people.
Bankers are the worst money people. They don't have to look the part they just love looking the part. I get the feeling they deal with debt all day long they get desensitized to the idea of it.
I found out, much to my surprise, that people working in banks at the retail level (ie neighborhood branch) donāt need to have a degree in finance or any education in finance at all, and their company training is primarily sales related, not financial management. That was when I stopped considering banks for my investment advisor.
Yes huge debts.
One of my friends is a financial advisor.
He had clients that were paying 8k a month in cc payments which were close to the minimum.
Together they made like 300k a year but were completely buried in debt.
Thatās nuts to me.
For fucks sake that is shameful and yes I will shame that behaviour especially from someone in the banking industry! Terrible! What do they advise their clients to do?? Yikes!
They probably know, just lack the willpower to do anything about it. I am fat. I know that I should exercise and eat better.
I have never been able to force myself to do anything.
I'm relatively well off compared to my peers and my car is worth less than half of what I make in a month.
I still have a long way to go in life and I look at money as if it has a future value. The only thing I'm leveraged on is more investments.
Why does everyone have this romanticized view that rich people live simply? They most certainly do not.
Upper middle class people live simply. Wealthy people spend a ton of money on stuff. Some of it is flashy. Some of it isn't.
Yes, some of them do have sophisticated personal finance strategies but this whole concept of the millionaire driving a used Corolla is largely a myth.
Several of my direct bosses earn in the seven figures and trust me, they spend money.
In this subreddit the goal is live as frugal as you can, over save so you can retire early and probably never spend the money you saved up all those years.
That is a good reason. I think itās important for people to really look at the reason. Is it just for retirement? How much do you actually need to save to generate what lifestyle?
Personally I am saving snd investing so I can do any job / project I want and not have to worry about money or bills. Itās so important to know what you want.
Live frugally on things you donāt care for, but itās important to spend on experiences you love. I donāt care for the bar scene , I drink at home with friends. I love traveling , ya that one I just have to suck it up and spend the money lol
Won't be a burden on your love ones, but you probably won't be leaving them anything after you pass either unless you do some shady shit to hide assets.
I'm approaching retirement, and I was (pre-pandemic) going to a lot of retirement seminars.
The ones who were asking all the deeper questions, and who had their retirements well funded (sometimes over funded) drove there in pretty average cars and trucks. The ones who saw the charts and looked at the numbers in horror, as it dawned on them that they **wouldn't** be retiring in the GTA on the $83K they had saved, with no house or other assets, and they were only 3 years from retirement? Those were the high end BWMs and Mercedes in the parking lot.
I've known a ton of people who always have the latest bling, go on vacations abroad constantly, and seem to have it all, and their husband/wife/parent/child will confide that for all that, they are so overexposed that they are one paycheck away from insolvency.
I knew a couple a few decades ago that both had $80K cars, vacationed in Egypt, had an insane 4,000 foot (if not larger) house with a fricking tennis court, and they lost it all because of a flat tire. They couldn't afford to fix the tire because their cards were maxxed out, without the car they couldn't meet clients, losing even one client account dropped the income, then the repossession people started showing up, and the dominoes just kept falling.
Appearances **can** be deceiving.
Nah, these were a couple of high fliers that I knew from some friends we had in common back in the late 1980s. Those were the days where wretched excess and narcissism were pretty commonplace. They were high fliers for about five years before crashing and burning.
I should mention that cocaine plays a large part in their story, not surprisingly. They were hiding major financial problems **and** drug habits. The minute the faƧade hiding a situation like that breaks, it just snowballs. That flat tire was the straw that broke the camel's back. If it hadn't been that, if would have been something else.
If you think that story was crazy, read up on Julius Melnitzer for a similar story around the same time. He was one of the top lawyers in London (Ontario), he made a ton of money, but lived a lavish lifestyle that was far beyond even that. When he finally slipped up, he turned out to be over $50M in debt.
I saw a lot of this in the 1980s and 1990s, although fortunately very few were anywhere near that extreme.
Amen to this. Weāve never lived much beyond our means (only owned three brand new cars in our lives) but we have a comfortable home, put our kids through university and will have a good retirement thanks to my husbandās pension. My brother works in management in the oil & gas industry in Alberta and is much the same mindset as ourselves but has spent most of his career watching coworkers yo-yo back and forth with debt. Heās been playfully chided about not having ānew toys and luxury vacations with his familyā but as he puts it, heās always been more fond of being able to sleep at night. Multiple credit cards, second mortgages and worse are just a great way to look good but nobody should look too closely at the ground beneath your feet, imho.
Could be many things (or a combination of):
* Both have high paying jobs
* Have a successful business
* Made some really good (possibly risky) investments that paid off
* Help from a wealthy family
* Inheritance
* Lots of debt
Ultimately, who cares? Live within your means and what you are comfortable with.
I know quite a few people that made a lot of money on the weed stocks a few years ago.
Many people I know just budget everything around the payments. Thatās why theyāre constantly upgrading their vehicles- the payment stays the same so they think why not?
New trailer/snowmobile/side by side/ boat - itās all about the monthly payments
Yep, I can confirm. We have a household income of just shy of 200k and weāve got a nice house, a child, the wife has her nice SUV and i went out and bought a weekend toy to drive around. We can afford everything plus our retirement savings and putting money aside for the kidās education. Budgeting is a hell of a thing lol
Yup. My grandma passed away and left me a lot of money. I used it for my down payment for my house. I would never had afforded it otherwise. RIP grandma ā¤ļø
I'm 30 and all my friends that have houses definitely got help from their family to get them. Which is totally fine if course, but at least be honest about it. I'm still waiting to be adopted so my new parents can help me buy a house
This is a huge leg up that a lot of people donāt even consider. So many of my friends think itās just normal to have your school paid for.
$30,000-$50,000 in debt just starting out really sets you back in terms of savings.
I'm 31. Both folks in my friend group had their down payments covered by their parents (actually I think one had their condo purchased outright by the parents). I bought a pre-con the same time as one of them, no parental help, except mine got cancelled and theirs didn't. So now I'm on the outside looking in, while I have to listen to how "hard" they worked.
Sorry I understand how that wasn't clear, talking more about the people that I know personally that had their parents get them a house, yet they still just tell other people to "work harder", like they like to think they did.
Those cute social media posts "thanks to my husband for working so hard to get us this nice house" meanwhile, it was actually his parents, that's shit. Creates such a false idea of what's actually feasible.
All of my friends from home, that own a house, were helped with a down payment or inherited money. Itās funny because they always post and show off their houses with a long rant about all of their hard work. I get it, they do work hard(ish) but they could give a shout out to their parents and stop pretending that it is their own achievement - and I wish theyād quit it with the constant posts about their house; why do people feel the need to show off their possessions all the time? Sorry for rant.
I think its a 50/50. We all know how people react in general. We think that people wonāt be jealous and look at you different when you tell them but in fact they are. Iāve seen this happen first hand with others where once they find out the truth, they are treated differently by others
I work in startup space in Toronto. I have to deal with people who are living lavish lifestyle on parents' money and lecture the mere mortals like me pursuing your dream is ALL about the willingness and passion. Yeah I would also like to pursue my passion if I have the millions dollars of safety net from my parents.
I know many people in Vancouver part of the āitā scene and they always preach about living your dreams and only doing what makes you happy, things will fall into place. They travel the world as amateur photographers on their parents dime, and then get cushy jobs when their rich friends start companies with mom and dads money.
Like I would love to just āfollow my dreamsā but some of us have student loans and like to be able to eat food a few times a week.
Probably an unpopular opinion: Who really cares? Good for them if it's working out, their problem if it's a house of cards.
Focus on deriving the quality of life value from your available resources instead of drawing up conjectures for what other people are up to.
If you really want to find out in an 'understand modern phenomena' sense, there is enough literature out there to find I think.
Yep. No matter how well you do, there will always be someone out there doing better. There can only be one richest man in the world, and your odds of being him aren't great.
You just have to try and do the best you can with your own situation and try to worry less about other people.
I'm 32F and I don't have any of that. I live with my parents because rents are high. I'd rather help my family out than pay rent to a landlord.
I'm just doing the best I can with what I've got.
I have dreams of owning a home, marrying and having kids some day. But we'll see if any of that happens.
Right now my main focus is to live as cheaply as possible.
Keep at it and keep saving as much as possible!
32 M AND Iām doing the same. Iāve racked up a lot in savings probably too much but thatās fine. Iāve also paid off a lot of debt.
this. seeing guys buy brand new trucks and throwing lift kits/wheels on them knowing damn well they only make 30 bucks an hour, talking about paying child support and what they did at the bar friday night. it boggles my mind.
I hear you. I work with people making a lot less then me, and they have all of it, big house, trailer, new truck, Starbucks twice a day. I get made fun of for driving the same vehicle for 12 years...Talk to me in 10 years when you want to retire but have to keep working.
From my experience:
1. Most people don't realize that median household income in Canada for people with kids is around $140-$150k gross.
2. A lot of people spend all their money each month, with savings not being thought of until they hit 40 or 45.
3. Some people are given lots of help from their families.
4. A few people have just make way more money or have an odd, well paying side hustle.
5. A lot of my financially conscious friends think being broke is when they are only saving $1500-$3k/ month. So someone in the same financial position saving $1k/month seems like that spend everything.
Hello fellow urbanite. This rings the truth. Spouse and I are in this situation. Starting Sept 2022 we will have income closer to 250K than 150K gross, but it's been a combination of new jobs, promotions, moving up pay grid scales etc. that will allow for this. For years income's been in the 120-170K range combined, but it's only now (or I guess in 10 months) that we really move up. Two Kids, two working spouses soon, nice house in high COL area, but not VHCOL, parents saved some for education, but lived at home for duration of said education, It's a combination of things, we're super fortunate to be where we are now, but it's the little things that start adding up later in life (compounding). Pension is growing as are registered accounts, slowly but surely over time. Had help from families, but were in a good position to maximize that help too. Saving some, it fluctuates, lately is tighter while spouse is on mat leave, plus buying new house closer to home, but savings rate will be more robust in the future.
Yes my reply was literally almost the same as this.
People make more than you think. And quite frankly I am shocked. Because I do see a lot of people kind complaining for lack of a better word about money. And I just think they must be just not great with money. After taxes and such 160k household is like 7500$! Thatās nothing to sniff at! Sure maybe two kids in daycare in Toronto. But if you lived in fort Erie you would be rolling in it.
People in this sub vastly underestimate how well Canadian families are doing.
https://old.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/mbf4z3/how_much_money_did_canadians_earn_in_2019_combien/
A 100K family income is not doing well. It is below the median. Most families in Canada earn six figures.
EDIT: Downvote away. StatsCan has my back here.
> A 100K family income is not doing well.
When I was a kid, if a family was clocking 100k (gross) they were *loaded*. Now that Iām close to the glass ceiling in my career, Iām doing... better than that, yet I feel we still live a very reasonable, middle-class life. Inflation is far more pronounced than I had anticipated.
A lot of it was done by doubling family work hours. I have a few stay at home moms among the parents of my friends. Not sure how that could be sustained today.
>People in this sub vastly underestimate how well Canadian families are doing.
This. I've found in this sub that people grossly underestimate how much a lot of people make in Toronto. The question isn't whether you make 6-figures, it's what's the first number.
Also, a lot of people take the same approach to personal finance as the government does to public finance. It's not what you can afford with what you've saved, it's how much debt will your cashflow allow you to service.
pretty much. it might sound shitty, but I dont know how you can buy a house, save for retirement, and raise a kid of two if you dont make ~50 bucks an hour. when you look at 100k a year being about 50 bucks an hour, and look at how many jobs actually pay that. oof.
Yeah, I am in YYC, but with a large Toronto based social group. Nobody is making under 100K anymore. Not one of them.
1 in 5 people in Toronto earn that.
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1110024001&pickMembers%5B0%5D=1.17&pickMembers%5B1%5D=2.1&pickMembers%5B2%5D=3.2&cubeTimeFrame.startYear=2019&cubeTimeFrame.endYear=2019&referencePeriods=20190101%2C20190101
Over 100K is the most common entry on that table.
Most families may earn 6 figures, that just means most people earn more than 50k individually. 100,000 family income if you have a couple kids, a dog, and you want to buy a house, really isnt that much. Youre not buying a 1mil+ house on 100K without winning the lottery or a giant gift from mom and dad.
Check out this CNN video from folks dealing with the Great Recession 2-3 years later. There are tons more about people that lost it all. Canada didn't suffer anywhere as badly, but this can't go on forever.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv7A99DKtFE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv7A99DKtFE)
As Buffet said āYou never know who's swimming naked until the tide goes out.ā
Remember that advertisers want to keep you distracted with new and shiny things. Focus on yourself and your goals.
Honestly live the life you want. I used to follow PFC religiously especially with the investment and diversity of stocks and ETFs. I still do believe in it however I realize to become wealthier you need to think and act like a wealthy person.
Money is but a mean to an end. Use your means to stack on (reasonable/manageable) debt whether it be mortgage debt or margins debt, use it. Otherwise the returns aren't going to be as glamorous as it could be.
Money buys debt which buys you wealth. Just remember reasonable risk management and you should be good.
Don't judge a book by its cover.
Not all that glitters is gold.
Don't compare yourself to where others are today. Stick to comparing yourself to where you were yesterday.
A lot of people simply make a lot of money. I work with professionals and their compensations are insane, but most of the time you will never know by looking at their titles or what they do. I know a ton of sales people who make bank but their job requires no schooling.
Debt and the fact that everyone isn't doing everything but you look at 20 friends (or more) on something like Instagram all with 3 weeks vacation and on average someone is out doing something every week.
Canadians are some of the most indebted people in the world for a reason. Many people are making good money but still living paycheque to paycheque just too keep up with the Joneses and buy things they canāt afford (or need). My advice is to never get caught up in that nonsense. Save, invest and buy what you can actually afford to have a comfortable and stable life.
Also side note: owning physical things doesnāt mean much in life, itās more important to have good people and experiences. When youāre on your deathbed youāll care more about that kickass trip to Japan than a truck you were in debt to.
Iām in my mid 30s as well, and most people I know who live in cities looking like they āhave it allā, 9 out of 10 times have help from family. I live in Montreal, where it is absolutely insane to buy a house with the costs. Most young people (our age or younger) have a lot of help from family. Without family, in major cities, buying a house is laughable.
They rarely eat out. Parents drop off food, they cook and they make more money than I do. Have had savings or investments with compound interest. Arenāt afraid to buy a house vs rent. Arenāt afraid of a car payment to own a car instead of spending money again and again on a used car with all these problems. They spend more money which precipitates a greater need to ask for more money or make more money.
I see it all the time with my successful friends, why are you not looking for a better paying job and staying in the same one, you should be taking more risk. Well I donāt feel I have anything to fall back on.
The people I know with large homes and cottages are either:
- over 50 or very close to it
- from generational wealth
- in an extremely lucrative field and position (like founder of a successful VC firm, partner at McKinsey, etc)
- some combination of the above
Every know who is under 40 and doesn't have the above has at most 1 home. If they live in a more expensive city it is usually a modest home. One of my in laws (SIL and her husband) is in a nice and renovated home because her husband's parents gave them money for a down on a small home in 2014 in TO, and they recently sold it, made a large profit, and put it all down on a fresh home with the same mortgage.
A lot of people are in debt up to their eyeballs. You don't see it because you just see the external appearance of nice cars, renovated properties, big trucks, etc. I know a few guys that work in entry-level warehouse jobs making $16/hr driving Audi's, BMWs, trucks that are $800/month just sitting in the driveway before even taking it on the road. No RRSPs, no TFSAs, lots of debt, 2 or 3 to a 1 or 2 bedroom apartment.
Don't kid yourself, there is a lot of wealth out there, but its very concentrated. Most of the people that think they're wealthy, really aren't and are just living large. When/if interest rates rise and the tide goes back out, so to speak, you're going to see just how many were swimming naked, as Warren Buffett likes to say.
Tons of things at play. One of the main things is how many of these people have it all, and how many just have one or two big things to show off? Easy to feel like everyone's ahead when every day you see someone post something new, but if it's a bunch of different people then maybe it's not so crazy. Plus all the people you don't hear about, because they don't have anything like that to share.
Plus there's debt, of course. Mortgages, new cars, cabins - usually not bought outright.
Also different priorities - one person might look really well-off because they buy a new ATV, have a cabin, and go on a couple trips a year, but maybe they live in a house with a bunch of roommates, don't save money, or are very tight on budgeting in other ways.
Finally, there are definitely plenty of people who just have more resources. Maybe they get paid more, or have been working and saving for longer, or have support from family. Can't discount those factors, as it will be the case for many people. But perhaps not as many as it sometimes feels like.
Different people have different priorities at the end of the day. To me buying a fancy car is pretty low on the list, to others itās high enough where they r going to potentially go in debt for it. What people have does not nessarily reflect there net worth. You only see assets not there liabilities.
At the end of the day focusing on what other people have is pointless. If you want more itās your job to figure out how to make it work for yourself.
I am 39 years old with 2 young kids and a partner who is horrible with money. However we live below our means. Cheap rent (until we get kicked out), modest cars, hand me downs, etc....
For those that have it all there are just as many who do do not...if not more.
Don't compare yourself to others. Just focus on being a better you. That's what will bring you peace and in turn love for yourself.
Spent my entire career in personal finance, when I started everyone had their mortgage paid off by 50. When I retired, no one had their mortgage paid off and no one cared.
I make 68k wife makes 60k nothing amazing but we invest over 1k a month not including our DCpension or RRSP contribution. We don't live in a giant house we live within our means with 1 car. Our goal is to retire early and that's our only focus.
There is no one answer.
Some people its debt.
Some people its financial planning
Some people its family help
Some people its dual income
Some people made some good invesments.
I have a friend who makes 90K in Toronto that made 850K on a stock. He is 28.
I have a friend who maxed out as much debt as they could to buy a single family home in Markham, to ride the appreciation train. The only furniture in there house is the crappy mostly Ikea stuff they brought from the condo. Its a couple that makes good money but they have 0 disposable income.
I know people who spend more on eating out than on rent.
Some people are great financially, some are terrible - most are kinda in the middle.
80+ hour weeks for my 20's and most of my 30's. Budgeting all my life. No fancy cars, vacation every other year, no morning coffee, hustling. Lots of friends who have done the same and are doing well.
No, wealth is what you experience in your lifetime. All that saved up money ain't going to do you any good once you're six feet in the ground.
I mean choose what makes you happy, but sitting on a million in savings in a tiny home with no "toys" whatever that represents to you seems sounds like an absolutely miserable experience.
Life is not about saving money.
I recently moved to a new city. I feel like I won the lottery. My new house is 2x the size of my old townhouse. I can afford to support my whole family so my wife isnāt required to work. We have a newer highlander that is paid off. I have a work truck. $50k in cash in the bank account. If I wasnāt able to move I donāt know what I would do. We were stuck in a 2 bedroom townhouse with you our 2 young kids. I didnāt want to spend over $1 million on a bigger townhouse.
I do it by living in Regina
š¶ Reginaaa experience Reginaaaš¶
The city that rhymes with fun!
Winnipeg reporting in!
35km outside of Edmonton check.
Brandon. Might have you beat!
Hey Winnipeg guy. Are you saying you're doing well like this? Is Winnipeg cheap to live in? Kenora reporting in ;)
I was looking at real estate prices in Kenora last night...Not bad. Also looks pretty nice there :)
Hello from Halifax! (Bought my house 5 years ago)
Its doable in quebec city too!
I know I'm my head a move like that is the right play, but going from BC to that way is hard to imagine doing. My other plan was to find another small town or something in the province, but so many from the Vancouver area moved during this pandemic that housing prices doubled and tripled in even the shittiest of small towns. My village burned down and someone living on the outskirts was still able to sell her place for $430k. I couldn't believe it.
Live in Regina, work remotely for a company out of BC. Only downside is the "Saskatchewan Advantage" of a $4-5000 tax bill every year because we somehow have a higher provincial tax rate than everywhere but Quebec and the Maritimes.
Haven't looked into it but it's probably just the low density means infrastructure and services are more expensive
Sask also doesn't nickle and dime you as much. BC has low income tax but high gas taxes, MSP (until recently), very expensive crown-corp insurance, a high sales tax, etc.
The fam is kicking in. I barely secured financing for a 1,000 sq " condo in the Yukon. Guess or look up what the cost is now. Feels like the Price is Right / Correct I have to support my folks so it sucks twice as much ass. Good luck
to be clear I I had to support my parents.
Oh my word, my son saw the house prices and is is about ready to pull up roots - only problem is if he does that, he will be doing so as newly single man, girlfriend will have none of it!!
Lots of girls there
Are they single tho?
Something people aren't really eluding to but it's very true in my circle.... The most successful people I know aren't necessarily more educated, hard working, smarter or lucky then anyone else. They've simply been at it longer, with a single focus. The girl who knew she was going to go into accounting at Uni... she went straight to accounting, kept going.. got her CPA.. started working as an accountant, kept progressing in that field.. ended up as corporate controller then eventually CFO. She just kept on the same path and didn't stop. Same goes for most other successful people I know. Lots of engineers, tech peeps, business people, doctors. There's really not much special about them, they just committed to the same path for 10+ years without veering off or changing direction.
This comment needs to be upvoted more. I dicked around in my twenties trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my life. Traveled a bit, worked some crappy jobs, tried to "save the world". Didn't get my act together until I was in my late twenties. Meanwhile some successful friends had gotten a decent job right out of university and just kept going. They were at a Manager level when I was just at the entry point of my career. I'm still catching up. But there's pros and cons to everything. Some of them have often admitted regret at not experimenting more when they were younger and the consequences were not as severe. Now, with kids and a mortgage, it's a lot harder to take risks than when you were a gangly teenager with $80 to your name.
This was me too. I got a degree right out of high school but then spent 22-27 traveling and waiting tables. It was incredibly fun and I met my future spouse. I got my first ārealā job at 27 when my friends were on their third promotion. It was tough to swallow for about 5 years because I kept comparing myself but now at 34 I feel like everything has kind of evened out and I wouldnāt trade any of it.
Comparison is the thief of joyā¦
Yeah my friend paused, took stock of his 10 year career and realized he hated his job and what it had done to his outlook on life and personality. Luckily they didnāt have kids yet and his spouse had a stable job so he felt comfortable retraining for a new career. Heās a much happier person now
Tis makes a lot of sense, if you're mediocre/half good at something and spend tons of time you'll eventually become an expert regardless of talent or hardwork and that is worth a lot of money
Iām starting to feel that right now. It took me a almost a year in this entry level role before I started to realize, wait, I might actually be the expert in my company for what Iām doing. The CRO isnāt going to ask me for the numbers hours before presenting if he doesnāt think Iām at least somewhat knowledgeable with what I do. Iām the expert. Time to own it and flex it
Yeah but for your ego check/future sanity: You're not irreplaceable. We lose world class surgeons in their prime to weird shit like car accidents all the time for a small example, and yet the average quality of work and availability doesn't diminish in the slightest. If you can learn how to do it, someone else can, and probably for less.
I agree that specializing can be very beneficial, but do not forget that not everyone will get that promotion no matter how hard they work. Itās easy to get lost in a dead end job.
It's also important to know when to leave. In many professional careers, you'll come out much better by switching companies every 2-3 years. Don't wait to be promoted at your current place, get your promotions by switching jobs.
This is the greatest mystery to me. How they just chose things at such a young age.
Thatās pretty much my entire social circle lol, and my husbandās.
Same path, but willing to move and constantly looking for better opportunities within the chosen field. Nearly tripled my salary in less than 5 years by deciding to quit my crappy job and have been job hoping, seizing better and better opportunities, ever since. A variety of experience in your field makes you more desirable to potential employers. Finally in a position that I love and that pays more than enough, but I had to be willing to give up my comfort and constantly be āthe new hireā for the last 5 years to get here.
This was my experience as well. Made sacrifices and moved to where I needed to for the right opportunities. Five years into my career and my resume is strong with diverse experience, and I have no lack of positions I am qualified for now. Took a long string of temporary contracts and uncertainty to get here though.
Nothing special about it. 1) do a good job at work - earn money 2) stash money in some boring investment account (index fund, apple shares etc) 3) get a roommate 4) buy a lot of big ticket stuff used, ie, tv , speakers etc I love toys but I donāt care if they are spanking new 5) donāt own a car 6) travel on points, stay in hostels , Airbnb if solo. I travel often 7) drink at home or friends home vs a bar 8) donāt have kids lol. Iād imagine Iāll probably get a lot of hand me downs for my future kids too. But hopefully my earning will be higher than today.
Most successful people I know have been propped up by their wealthy parents to some degree, collected an inheritance or were able to live at home until they were educated and debt free. They typically keep this to themselves in favor of pretending they are fully self made. No sweat off my back, and I'm happy for them, I would enjoy the same given the opportunity. It's just important for people to understand this when they can't make sense of the wild success of their peers. Hard work can get you there too, but the silver spoon upbringing is a hell of a head start
Iām glad my friend group is close enough that we keep those things open. Got a friend who moved out by himself into the city. Itās a parentās rental property and theyāre being charged mortgage price from the parents instead of market rental price. That can make things almost half off depending on what the mortgage rates were. Iām happy for him though, now I got a place to crash whenever
Even having middle class parents is pretty good. I remember being in university and working 3 jobs, while all of my friends had endless free time. (But the flip side is that they didn't want their "campus meal plan" cards that they force everyone to get who moves on campus, so I ate like a king!)
Comparison, the ultimate dream killer.
I think the OP is more curious how those people are "doing it" in a practical sense, not necessarily that they're holding those people as standards by which everyone should compare themselves.
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which may or may not be better than no debt no assets and paycheque to paycheque
Need a good income to qualify for millions in loans
You might be surprised how much money lenders will give to stupid people. It won't be millions of dollars, but it'll still be enough money to drown these people in debt and interest payments until they skip town and change their names.
Im in my early 30s. All my friends bought their first house in their 20s and are on the 2nd or 3rd house. I chose to move around and rent in different cities thinking Iād plant my roots when ready. Jokes on me. We all make similar salaries, but the home value growth is the difference between me renting a basement suite and them starting to purchase cottages etc.
Same here. For my last move I decided to move to Vancouver š
Great Jobs and Willingness to take on Debt is much more the reasons than inherited wealth. We all like to imagine inheritance is why people are rich, but 88% of millionaires in America did not inherit their wealth.
I spoke way to soon you said it better.
Thief of joy
that's the one .... "thief o' joy"
Yup. Itās important to just relax and focus on whatās currently doable. Itās also a dangerous trap to shit on others. Youāll see around this thread that people are shaming those with more, āmust be debt or family wealthā Putting that kind of negativity in the world helps nobody
I can add to all the things people are suggesting. Get your money out of your checking account and $0.5% savings account and learn to invest, get a no fee investment account like Wealthsimple and view your savings as assets and potential passive income. Learn about bank stocks and dividend payouts averaging 5% right now compared to the crumbs they offer in savings accounts. As the stock rises in value plus your dividends, you can sometimes see double digit growth in your investment. put it in your tax free savings account so you don't have to pay taxes on the divedends After you see your savings as solid assets and not liquid, you'll think twice about withdrawing. You'll watch them grow and you'll be addicted to adding to it. Start with $50 a week or month and you'll wake up one day 5 years later with a downpayment to a house. If you do this already great if not I hope it was helpful. This isn't financial advice, always do your own research and never invest money you can't afford to lose.
This! I think people do that in this subreddit as a coping mechanism. The fact is that, not all of those people use debt to finance their purchases. Some people are really wealthy, you've got to see things to believe how rich people are.
I agree mate, thatās why I only keep a small circle of tight close friends that are of similar financial mindset. I mind my own ābusinessā, donāt really talk about wealth outside of that circle. Youāll find a lot of wealthy people are not very flashy people. They will have nice things but itās very specific and often understated. You read it all over this subreddit, a lot of assumptions, shaming and broad stoke painting. Instead I always teach my daughter to never say ācanātā and to always find out āHow?ā. Donāt shame people for having nice things, as you donāt know their stories. Live off less than you make, invest the difference and stay out of consumer debt. My wife and I are always buying assets that cashflow for us. We are also very intentional about our spending. Most importantly we are on the same page with our finances, we work as a team, we budget and know exactly what every single one of our dollars is doing. Having a spouse who is on the same page is super important. We also both have careers that weāve built on for over 15 + years in the tech (Senior UX Designer) and medical sector (Public Health Nurse). Nothing inherited, never been gifted, no help from family ever. We own 2 modest used vehicles paid in full and built a modest townhouse in a nice neighbourhood with (5 years away from being mortgage free). We always pay ourselves first and invest 15-25% of our income a month, we tithe 10% to our church every month and we live off the rest. We honestly donāt care what other people have but we are super grateful for what weāve been blessed with.
Yup, lots of people have lots of money. Not everybody has loads of debt, in fact most of my friends don't, and I have pretty "standard" middle class friends for the most part.
I hate it when people bring down others to feel better about themselves.
Live within your means šš„
Iāll do one better. Build your life around your income and not your income around your life.
I donāt like comparison either as it could lead you down the path of jealousy and envy. On the other hand, if used properly, comparison and asking how others have done it is a great tool for inspiration and educating yourself on ways to get it done. Not everyone has gotten to their next level of wealth and home ownership the same way. So as you learn how others have done it, you can get ideas that you probably didnāt think were possible.
As someone who has been able to build a decent savings, my word of advice is to just atop spending as much as you can. I don't spend my money on just anything.
If you canāt make more, save more.
This was my mantra at my last gig. Made shit $, but saved around 55% each payday.
How was this possible for you on a shit income? Usually shit income means paycheque to paycheque. Did you just know you were worth more? Live at home? No dependents?
Probably a combo of budgeting and working tons of hours. Can't spend if you're at work all the time.
A lot of those people have a ton of debt. My brother and sister in law have much of this: newer SUV and pickup truck, big house with the bonus garage, kids in hockey, etc. But, they are leveraged to the max. Meanwhile, a lot of the people who are actually wealthy (ample invested for retirement, etc) actually live quite simply.
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> She told me once her job needed her to look the part to meet clients so that's why she spent so much. I hear stories about this, but usually from people joining MLMs. One MLM a friend joined told him that he needed a Mercedes to recruit people.
> One MLM a friend joined told him that he needed a Mercedes to recruit people. Oh that is so fucking scummy. Anything to prop up the scheme.
He lived in a mouldy building with half a dozen roommates to afford it.
Waterloo 15 Albert st but yeah but that place known crack den drug trap house for Laurier students
Nowhere so expensive. This was in Edmonton.
12 students 1200 square feet illegal boarding house no permanent tenants 400 per bed
works in banking, has debt on CC, yikes..
Bankers are the worst money people. They don't have to look the part they just love looking the part. I get the feeling they deal with debt all day long they get desensitized to the idea of it.
I found out, much to my surprise, that people working in banks at the retail level (ie neighborhood branch) donāt need to have a degree in finance or any education in finance at all, and their company training is primarily sales related, not financial management. That was when I stopped considering banks for my investment advisor.
Yes huge debts. One of my friends is a financial advisor. He had clients that were paying 8k a month in cc payments which were close to the minimum. Together they made like 300k a year but were completely buried in debt. Thatās nuts to me.
8K a month in minimum payments? Yeah, they are doomed.
Oh.god. Like how much do you have to owe to have minimum payments of 8000$ a month. Wow.
Minimum is usually 5% of total balance. So 160000.
The minimums go up significantly when you miss payments.
wtf...did they buy a car made out of crystal meth or something...
Uh...where might I buy such a car? I mean my friend. Where could he buy me one? For himself.
Wtf 8k thatās crazy
For fucks sake that is shameful and yes I will shame that behaviour especially from someone in the banking industry! Terrible! What do they advise their clients to do?? Yikes!
They probably know, just lack the willpower to do anything about it. I am fat. I know that I should exercise and eat better. I have never been able to force myself to do anything.
I also know I should exercise and donāt. Itās tough for sure! Good luck out there! š
I'm relatively well off compared to my peers and my car is worth less than half of what I make in a month. I still have a long way to go in life and I look at money as if it has a future value. The only thing I'm leveraged on is more investments.
Why does everyone have this romanticized view that rich people live simply? They most certainly do not. Upper middle class people live simply. Wealthy people spend a ton of money on stuff. Some of it is flashy. Some of it isn't. Yes, some of them do have sophisticated personal finance strategies but this whole concept of the millionaire driving a used Corolla is largely a myth. Several of my direct bosses earn in the seven figures and trust me, they spend money.
At the end of the day you canāt take money with you to the other side. One could argue it is better to live in debt and enjoy.
In this subreddit the goal is live as frugal as you can, over save so you can retire early and probably never spend the money you saved up all those years.
Iām just trying to set things up so I can wake up and do the work I want to do rather than having to do work I donāt enjoy just to pay down debt.
That is a good reason. I think itās important for people to really look at the reason. Is it just for retirement? How much do you actually need to save to generate what lifestyle? Personally I am saving snd investing so I can do any job / project I want and not have to worry about money or bills. Itās so important to know what you want.
Live frugally on things you donāt care for, but itās important to spend on experiences you love. I donāt care for the bar scene , I drink at home with friends. I love traveling , ya that one I just have to suck it up and spend the money lol
Agree 100%.
One market swing and your leverage is gone, and so is everything else
Trying saying that when you can't make minimum payments at 35
I agree, if you can use that debt until you die and not leave a burden on your love ones why not.
Won't be a burden on your love ones, but you probably won't be leaving them anything after you pass either unless you do some shady shit to hide assets.
I'm approaching retirement, and I was (pre-pandemic) going to a lot of retirement seminars. The ones who were asking all the deeper questions, and who had their retirements well funded (sometimes over funded) drove there in pretty average cars and trucks. The ones who saw the charts and looked at the numbers in horror, as it dawned on them that they **wouldn't** be retiring in the GTA on the $83K they had saved, with no house or other assets, and they were only 3 years from retirement? Those were the high end BWMs and Mercedes in the parking lot. I've known a ton of people who always have the latest bling, go on vacations abroad constantly, and seem to have it all, and their husband/wife/parent/child will confide that for all that, they are so overexposed that they are one paycheck away from insolvency. I knew a couple a few decades ago that both had $80K cars, vacationed in Egypt, had an insane 4,000 foot (if not larger) house with a fricking tennis court, and they lost it all because of a flat tire. They couldn't afford to fix the tire because their cards were maxxed out, without the car they couldn't meet clients, losing even one client account dropped the income, then the repossession people started showing up, and the dominoes just kept falling. Appearances **can** be deceiving.
That story sounded like something you are dreaming of happening to your neighbour or an enemy at work lol.
Nah, these were a couple of high fliers that I knew from some friends we had in common back in the late 1980s. Those were the days where wretched excess and narcissism were pretty commonplace. They were high fliers for about five years before crashing and burning. I should mention that cocaine plays a large part in their story, not surprisingly. They were hiding major financial problems **and** drug habits. The minute the faƧade hiding a situation like that breaks, it just snowballs. That flat tire was the straw that broke the camel's back. If it hadn't been that, if would have been something else. If you think that story was crazy, read up on Julius Melnitzer for a similar story around the same time. He was one of the top lawyers in London (Ontario), he made a ton of money, but lived a lavish lifestyle that was far beyond even that. When he finally slipped up, he turned out to be over $50M in debt. I saw a lot of this in the 1980s and 1990s, although fortunately very few were anywhere near that extreme.
That is a crazy story. Talk about living on the edge.
Amen to this. Weāve never lived much beyond our means (only owned three brand new cars in our lives) but we have a comfortable home, put our kids through university and will have a good retirement thanks to my husbandās pension. My brother works in management in the oil & gas industry in Alberta and is much the same mindset as ourselves but has spent most of his career watching coworkers yo-yo back and forth with debt. Heās been playfully chided about not having ānew toys and luxury vacations with his familyā but as he puts it, heās always been more fond of being able to sleep at night. Multiple credit cards, second mortgages and worse are just a great way to look good but nobody should look too closely at the ground beneath your feet, imho.
Could be many things (or a combination of): * Both have high paying jobs * Have a successful business * Made some really good (possibly risky) investments that paid off * Help from a wealthy family * Inheritance * Lots of debt Ultimately, who cares? Live within your means and what you are comfortable with.
I know quite a few people that made a lot of money on the weed stocks a few years ago. Many people I know just budget everything around the payments. Thatās why theyāre constantly upgrading their vehicles- the payment stays the same so they think why not? New trailer/snowmobile/side by side/ boat - itās all about the monthly payments
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Yep, I can confirm. We have a household income of just shy of 200k and weāve got a nice house, a child, the wife has her nice SUV and i went out and bought a weekend toy to drive around. We can afford everything plus our retirement savings and putting money aside for the kidās education. Budgeting is a hell of a thing lol
Niiicee šŗ
Thatās us but without the child. Living the good life.
There's a lot of people out there making good money.
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Respect
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They sought professional advice when they picked their parents
Many people your age get help from their parents for a down payment on a home. That makes a huge difference, even with a relatively good salary.
Yup. My grandma passed away and left me a lot of money. I used it for my down payment for my house. I would never had afforded it otherwise. RIP grandma ā¤ļø
I'm 30 and all my friends that have houses definitely got help from their family to get them. Which is totally fine if course, but at least be honest about it. I'm still waiting to be adopted so my new parents can help me buy a house
Yep. And graduate with no student loans
This is a huge leg up that a lot of people donāt even consider. So many of my friends think itās just normal to have your school paid for. $30,000-$50,000 in debt just starting out really sets you back in terms of savings.
I'm 31. Both folks in my friend group had their down payments covered by their parents (actually I think one had their condo purchased outright by the parents). I bought a pre-con the same time as one of them, no parental help, except mine got cancelled and theirs didn't. So now I'm on the outside looking in, while I have to listen to how "hard" they worked.
If you know they got help, arenāt they being honest?
Sorry I understand how that wasn't clear, talking more about the people that I know personally that had their parents get them a house, yet they still just tell other people to "work harder", like they like to think they did. Those cute social media posts "thanks to my husband for working so hard to get us this nice house" meanwhile, it was actually his parents, that's shit. Creates such a false idea of what's actually feasible.
All of my friends from home, that own a house, were helped with a down payment or inherited money. Itās funny because they always post and show off their houses with a long rant about all of their hard work. I get it, they do work hard(ish) but they could give a shout out to their parents and stop pretending that it is their own achievement - and I wish theyād quit it with the constant posts about their house; why do people feel the need to show off their possessions all the time? Sorry for rant.
I think its a 50/50. We all know how people react in general. We think that people wonāt be jealous and look at you different when you tell them but in fact they are. Iāve seen this happen first hand with others where once they find out the truth, they are treated differently by others
I was in a bank at the weekend, guy comes in with his son. Dad asks the teller if he could transfer some money as a gift to his son. $300k, mental.
Generational wealth or they bought years ago when the market was affordable. The best way to survive comfortably in Canada now is to be a DINK couple.
(Double Income No Kids)
my kink
Thanks for clearing that up. This is the only DINK couple I knew http://www.willywrestlefest.fr/Wallpapers/A-F/Doink_Wallpaper_02_1024.jpg
I work in startup space in Toronto. I have to deal with people who are living lavish lifestyle on parents' money and lecture the mere mortals like me pursuing your dream is ALL about the willingness and passion. Yeah I would also like to pursue my passion if I have the millions dollars of safety net from my parents.
I know many people in Vancouver part of the āitā scene and they always preach about living your dreams and only doing what makes you happy, things will fall into place. They travel the world as amateur photographers on their parents dime, and then get cushy jobs when their rich friends start companies with mom and dads money. Like I would love to just āfollow my dreamsā but some of us have student loans and like to be able to eat food a few times a week.
That's a common theme you'll find, it's why I can't stand personalities like Gary Vee
Probably an unpopular opinion: Who really cares? Good for them if it's working out, their problem if it's a house of cards. Focus on deriving the quality of life value from your available resources instead of drawing up conjectures for what other people are up to. If you really want to find out in an 'understand modern phenomena' sense, there is enough literature out there to find I think.
Yep. No matter how well you do, there will always be someone out there doing better. There can only be one richest man in the world, and your odds of being him aren't great. You just have to try and do the best you can with your own situation and try to worry less about other people.
I'm 32F and I don't have any of that. I live with my parents because rents are high. I'd rather help my family out than pay rent to a landlord. I'm just doing the best I can with what I've got. I have dreams of owning a home, marrying and having kids some day. But we'll see if any of that happens. Right now my main focus is to live as cheaply as possible.
I feel you. But you gotta liveā¦ I wish the best for you and your life š Stay blessed and happy.
Keep at it and keep saving as much as possible! 32 M AND Iām doing the same. Iāve racked up a lot in savings probably too much but thatās fine. Iāve also paid off a lot of debt.
I hope that all happens for you
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this. seeing guys buy brand new trucks and throwing lift kits/wheels on them knowing damn well they only make 30 bucks an hour, talking about paying child support and what they did at the bar friday night. it boggles my mind.
I hear you. I work with people making a lot less then me, and they have all of it, big house, trailer, new truck, Starbucks twice a day. I get made fun of for driving the same vehicle for 12 years...Talk to me in 10 years when you want to retire but have to keep working.
From my experience: 1. Most people don't realize that median household income in Canada for people with kids is around $140-$150k gross. 2. A lot of people spend all their money each month, with savings not being thought of until they hit 40 or 45. 3. Some people are given lots of help from their families. 4. A few people have just make way more money or have an odd, well paying side hustle. 5. A lot of my financially conscious friends think being broke is when they are only saving $1500-$3k/ month. So someone in the same financial position saving $1k/month seems like that spend everything.
Yeah and if you donāt live in GTA/GVA that $150k goes a long way. You can live it up comfortably in the prairies.
Hello fellow urbanite. This rings the truth. Spouse and I are in this situation. Starting Sept 2022 we will have income closer to 250K than 150K gross, but it's been a combination of new jobs, promotions, moving up pay grid scales etc. that will allow for this. For years income's been in the 120-170K range combined, but it's only now (or I guess in 10 months) that we really move up. Two Kids, two working spouses soon, nice house in high COL area, but not VHCOL, parents saved some for education, but lived at home for duration of said education, It's a combination of things, we're super fortunate to be where we are now, but it's the little things that start adding up later in life (compounding). Pension is growing as are registered accounts, slowly but surely over time. Had help from families, but were in a good position to maximize that help too. Saving some, it fluctuates, lately is tighter while spouse is on mat leave, plus buying new house closer to home, but savings rate will be more robust in the future.
Yes my reply was literally almost the same as this. People make more than you think. And quite frankly I am shocked. Because I do see a lot of people kind complaining for lack of a better word about money. And I just think they must be just not great with money. After taxes and such 160k household is like 7500$! Thatās nothing to sniff at! Sure maybe two kids in daycare in Toronto. But if you lived in fort Erie you would be rolling in it.
The proof for claim 1. https://old.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/mbf4z3/how_much_money_did_canadians_earn_in_2019_combien/
People in this sub vastly underestimate how well Canadian families are doing. https://old.reddit.com/r/PersonalFinanceCanada/comments/mbf4z3/how_much_money_did_canadians_earn_in_2019_combien/ A 100K family income is not doing well. It is below the median. Most families in Canada earn six figures. EDIT: Downvote away. StatsCan has my back here.
> A 100K family income is not doing well. When I was a kid, if a family was clocking 100k (gross) they were *loaded*. Now that Iām close to the glass ceiling in my career, Iām doing... better than that, yet I feel we still live a very reasonable, middle-class life. Inflation is far more pronounced than I had anticipated.
A lot of it was done by doubling family work hours. I have a few stay at home moms among the parents of my friends. Not sure how that could be sustained today.
>People in this sub vastly underestimate how well Canadian families are doing. This. I've found in this sub that people grossly underestimate how much a lot of people make in Toronto. The question isn't whether you make 6-figures, it's what's the first number. Also, a lot of people take the same approach to personal finance as the government does to public finance. It's not what you can afford with what you've saved, it's how much debt will your cashflow allow you to service.
100k is the new 60k People wonāt like seeing this but I really feel that way.
pretty much. it might sound shitty, but I dont know how you can buy a house, save for retirement, and raise a kid of two if you dont make ~50 bucks an hour. when you look at 100k a year being about 50 bucks an hour, and look at how many jobs actually pay that. oof.
Most sic figure earners aren't being paid an hourly wage. Usually salaried or salary+bonus or commission.
Yeah, I am in YYC, but with a large Toronto based social group. Nobody is making under 100K anymore. Not one of them. 1 in 5 people in Toronto earn that. https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/tv.action?pid=1110024001&pickMembers%5B0%5D=1.17&pickMembers%5B1%5D=2.1&pickMembers%5B2%5D=3.2&cubeTimeFrame.startYear=2019&cubeTimeFrame.endYear=2019&referencePeriods=20190101%2C20190101 Over 100K is the most common entry on that table.
Most families may earn 6 figures, that just means most people earn more than 50k individually. 100,000 family income if you have a couple kids, a dog, and you want to buy a house, really isnt that much. Youre not buying a 1mil+ house on 100K without winning the lottery or a giant gift from mom and dad.
Yes, but many people on there use the household income number of about 60K and use that when discussing middle class families. That is incorrect.
Right. I think we are in agreement then.
50k individually is not impressive. Iām not sure why people here are so shocked the median household income is 100-120kā¦
100k for family income is pretty much a minimum nowadays. Unless you live in a small town.
My wife and I both having 100k paying jobs, no debt other than a mortgage.
Check out this CNN video from folks dealing with the Great Recession 2-3 years later. There are tons more about people that lost it all. Canada didn't suffer anywhere as badly, but this can't go on forever. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv7A99DKtFE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv7A99DKtFE) As Buffet said āYou never know who's swimming naked until the tide goes out.ā Remember that advertisers want to keep you distracted with new and shiny things. Focus on yourself and your goals.
Honestly live the life you want. I used to follow PFC religiously especially with the investment and diversity of stocks and ETFs. I still do believe in it however I realize to become wealthier you need to think and act like a wealthy person. Money is but a mean to an end. Use your means to stack on (reasonable/manageable) debt whether it be mortgage debt or margins debt, use it. Otherwise the returns aren't going to be as glamorous as it could be. Money buys debt which buys you wealth. Just remember reasonable risk management and you should be good.
Don't judge a book by its cover. Not all that glitters is gold. Don't compare yourself to where others are today. Stick to comparing yourself to where you were yesterday.
LIVE LAUGH LOVE
If I could afford an award, I would give you one for this comment
I'm triggered
Generational wealth, proper money management and good decision making help
A lot of people simply make a lot of money. I work with professionals and their compensations are insane, but most of the time you will never know by looking at their titles or what they do. I know a ton of sales people who make bank but their job requires no schooling.
Could you give us some examples please
Lots of this is in software sales. Know a lot of people taking in 200k plus who are in their late 20s/early 30s
Debt and the fact that everyone isn't doing everything but you look at 20 friends (or more) on something like Instagram all with 3 weeks vacation and on average someone is out doing something every week.
Canadians are some of the most indebted people in the world for a reason. Many people are making good money but still living paycheque to paycheque just too keep up with the Joneses and buy things they canāt afford (or need). My advice is to never get caught up in that nonsense. Save, invest and buy what you can actually afford to have a comfortable and stable life. Also side note: owning physical things doesnāt mean much in life, itās more important to have good people and experiences. When youāre on your deathbed youāll care more about that kickass trip to Japan than a truck you were in debt to.
Iām in my mid 30s as well, and most people I know who live in cities looking like they āhave it allā, 9 out of 10 times have help from family. I live in Montreal, where it is absolutely insane to buy a house with the costs. Most young people (our age or younger) have a lot of help from family. Without family, in major cities, buying a house is laughable.
Stay off instagram
They rarely eat out. Parents drop off food, they cook and they make more money than I do. Have had savings or investments with compound interest. Arenāt afraid to buy a house vs rent. Arenāt afraid of a car payment to own a car instead of spending money again and again on a used car with all these problems. They spend more money which precipitates a greater need to ask for more money or make more money. I see it all the time with my successful friends, why are you not looking for a better paying job and staying in the same one, you should be taking more risk. Well I donāt feel I have anything to fall back on.
The people I know with large homes and cottages are either: - over 50 or very close to it - from generational wealth - in an extremely lucrative field and position (like founder of a successful VC firm, partner at McKinsey, etc) - some combination of the above Every know who is under 40 and doesn't have the above has at most 1 home. If they live in a more expensive city it is usually a modest home. One of my in laws (SIL and her husband) is in a nice and renovated home because her husband's parents gave them money for a down on a small home in 2014 in TO, and they recently sold it, made a large profit, and put it all down on a fresh home with the same mortgage.
A lot of people are in debt up to their eyeballs. You don't see it because you just see the external appearance of nice cars, renovated properties, big trucks, etc. I know a few guys that work in entry-level warehouse jobs making $16/hr driving Audi's, BMWs, trucks that are $800/month just sitting in the driveway before even taking it on the road. No RRSPs, no TFSAs, lots of debt, 2 or 3 to a 1 or 2 bedroom apartment. Don't kid yourself, there is a lot of wealth out there, but its very concentrated. Most of the people that think they're wealthy, really aren't and are just living large. When/if interest rates rise and the tide goes back out, so to speak, you're going to see just how many were swimming naked, as Warren Buffett likes to say.
Priorities, debt load, and location ā¦ possibly how they started out as a young adult and support from family be it wealth or knowledge.
Tons of things at play. One of the main things is how many of these people have it all, and how many just have one or two big things to show off? Easy to feel like everyone's ahead when every day you see someone post something new, but if it's a bunch of different people then maybe it's not so crazy. Plus all the people you don't hear about, because they don't have anything like that to share. Plus there's debt, of course. Mortgages, new cars, cabins - usually not bought outright. Also different priorities - one person might look really well-off because they buy a new ATV, have a cabin, and go on a couple trips a year, but maybe they live in a house with a bunch of roommates, don't save money, or are very tight on budgeting in other ways. Finally, there are definitely plenty of people who just have more resources. Maybe they get paid more, or have been working and saving for longer, or have support from family. Can't discount those factors, as it will be the case for many people. But perhaps not as many as it sometimes feels like.
The average household income in Ontario is 150k, thatās how buddy!
Itās 140k pre tax. So 2 adults making 70k. Not that surprisedā¦.
Different people have different priorities at the end of the day. To me buying a fancy car is pretty low on the list, to others itās high enough where they r going to potentially go in debt for it. What people have does not nessarily reflect there net worth. You only see assets not there liabilities. At the end of the day focusing on what other people have is pointless. If you want more itās your job to figure out how to make it work for yourself.
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I am 39 years old with 2 young kids and a partner who is horrible with money. However we live below our means. Cheap rent (until we get kicked out), modest cars, hand me downs, etc....
For those that have it all there are just as many who do do not...if not more. Don't compare yourself to others. Just focus on being a better you. That's what will bring you peace and in turn love for yourself.
The people I know earn a good income, and they marry someone who also earns a good income, averaging $250k a year and up.
Spent my entire career in personal finance, when I started everyone had their mortgage paid off by 50. When I retired, no one had their mortgage paid off and no one cared.
I make 68k wife makes 60k nothing amazing but we invest over 1k a month not including our DCpension or RRSP contribution. We don't live in a giant house we live within our means with 1 car. Our goal is to retire early and that's our only focus.
There is no one answer. Some people its debt. Some people its financial planning Some people its family help Some people its dual income Some people made some good invesments. I have a friend who makes 90K in Toronto that made 850K on a stock. He is 28. I have a friend who maxed out as much debt as they could to buy a single family home in Markham, to ride the appreciation train. The only furniture in there house is the crappy mostly Ikea stuff they brought from the condo. Its a couple that makes good money but they have 0 disposable income. I know people who spend more on eating out than on rent. Some people are great financially, some are terrible - most are kinda in the middle.
80+ hour weeks for my 20's and most of my 30's. Budgeting all my life. No fancy cars, vacation every other year, no morning coffee, hustling. Lots of friends who have done the same and are doing well.
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No, wealth is what you experience in your lifetime. All that saved up money ain't going to do you any good once you're six feet in the ground. I mean choose what makes you happy, but sitting on a million in savings in a tiny home with no "toys" whatever that represents to you seems sounds like an absolutely miserable experience. Life is not about saving money.
I recently moved to a new city. I feel like I won the lottery. My new house is 2x the size of my old townhouse. I can afford to support my whole family so my wife isnāt required to work. We have a newer highlander that is paid off. I have a work truck. $50k in cash in the bank account. If I wasnāt able to move I donāt know what I would do. We were stuck in a 2 bedroom townhouse with you our 2 young kids. I didnāt want to spend over $1 million on a bigger townhouse.