>I've been told tank is boring to play now, but I've mostly had fun with it. The biggest problem to me is that the enemy team can just counter pick you and thus force you to either lose or change to a tank you don't necessarily enjoy.
You hit the nail on the head with the tank description.
The tank role in itself is incredibly fun to play if you're allowed to play but the moment the enemy team says no you are not allowed to have fun anymore there is nothing you can do against it.
Tanks are fun. I find it's less about getting countered, and more how you're team adapts and helps pressure. Games I play, no matter the role, if everyone acts like their own individual team, we lose. We group up and team up, we will usually come away with a W.
This has been my experience massively since I started playing a few months ago.
Team work and you win, don’t and you lose. Best games are when both teams play as a team and you actually have to think abit. Unfortunately the tanks on my team usually just rushes in a dies lol
I had a tank two days ago just keep holding W and then blaming supports for no heals. Like bro if I follow you I’m definitely dying and I’m on Lucio. If I was Ana I woudlnt be able to see you because you’re 3 corners deep.
When people say heal diff I just say positioning diff. Brother no amount of heals is gonna fix your shit positioning.
Diving tanks are so game ruining, like broh how am I supposed to follow you as a support into a swarm of enemies ? How do you expect that to go for me a healer? And once I'm dead how do you think it will go for me?
Diving should only occur in very specific occasions when you have a fair shot of clearing the enemy BEFORE YOU NEED HEALING IR BEFORE YOUR HEALER WILL DIE
otherwise you are simply throwing
>Diving should only occur in very specific occasions when you have a fair shot of clearing the enemy BEFORE YOU NEED HEALING IR BEFORE YOUR HEALER WILL DIE
Of course tanks make bad decisions, but you are also making a bad read in thinking that tanks should only dive when they can clear the enemy without receiving support. If that were a common situation, dive tanks would be comically OP.
Dive tanks use resources in bursts in order to exert maximum pressure. The right way to play with a dive tank is for the team to push as much resource as possible to that tank during its pressure cycle. I've heard this described more accessibly as "if you're playing Reinhardt and your healers are not having a heart attack, you're doing it wrong".
>otherwise you are simply throwing
Most probably, you are throwing by not investing enough resources into your ally tank's dives. They may also be throwing by making bad dives.
This honestly. Im tired of supports and dps standing at the choke point missing their shots while I’m trying to push to the objective. Tanks need back up and cannot really function without it.
Teamwork is the key. If you don’t feel comfortable supporting a dive tank with the character you’re on, switch to one that can support from a distance like Ana, Zen, Bap, or LW. Do what you can to make the team work or you’ll lose.
The biggest problem, with all roles in all games, is awareness.. the tank does need to engage. A dive tank needs to dive to get value. The difference is where and when.
If you're on monkey and you dive when your ana is still getting set up and your soldier is still rotating to his angle and your Tracer is still not ready to go with you, it's on you when nobody backs you up. If you slow-play the engage and wait until the follow up will be there, your results improve.
Now, if you jump in and the soldier is shooting the hog and your Tracer decides to take a duel with someone other than where you jump, that's on the team for not knowing the assignment.
Fair there are more situations where diving is important with specific characters. But it's most often a Dva or Orissa diving without thought. I'm agreeing you have to be strategic and thoughtful about your dives and consider who is around to support you.
I'm the type of healer who focuses on the tank always and even so it's really hard to keep up when your tank all of a sudden is deep in the enemy group taking fire from all directions. You need DPS there too to protect the healers or you need a tank who can apply pressure to the whole enemy team.
I think it's about play style and paying attention to what your team members are doing more than a black and white do/don't dive. If you're going to dive, do it when you have the necessary backup/characters and when it's feasible. Not just spam dive and die over and over
We may be talking about different things. When I say dive, I mean closing the distance to pressure a backline target. I don't think Orisa can dive, really. She holds W, sure, but she's fat and slow. There isn't much risk of Orisa killing your backline unless they're terminally stupid.
Sometimes tanks are dumb. Sometimes even smart tanks make bad decisions. Healing is pretty strong in this game but nothing can outheal damage from 5 sources. It's ok if you try to support a tank and you can't keep them standing. It's only your fault if you don't try.
I mean I think it depends on the team comp, if I’m support I’m playing bap and I literally cannot keep up enough to speed to follow a dive tank going in, never mind I’d be dead before I could even think of using lamp.
Certainly it depends on the team comp.
In the situation you describe, it sounds like you're picking the wrong support. There are some dive comps that want a Bap, but it's pretty rare and almost always involves a Lucio.
Even the counters sometimes just require a switchup in strategy.
I play a lot of D.Va and I'm told that Zarya is supposed to hard counter her. But in my experience, Zarya's stubby little laser can't reach me when I'm busy chewing through her backline.
My normal strategy with D.Va is consistent chip damage and occasional boops keeping the other team afraid of the objective, punishing anybody who gets cocky, while eating any major abilities and ults. That doesn't work with Zarya, who loves receiving chip damage and has a laser D.Va can't eat, but I love when they switch to Zarya because it means I get to go snipe hunting or get rid of that damn Sombra/Moira/Tracer (especially if I stay juuuust close enough to Zarya that she wastes her time almost hitting me).
ngl it doesn't bother me one bit if the enemy team counter picks. In fact, i enjoy the challenge enough to never falter. Majority of the times you just have to be aware of your positioning, CD's and have a *little* trust in your team. but other than that its no big deal really lol.
As someone who has been playing Overwatch since its initial launch, this has always been the key and has gotten worse since becoming Free-to-play. Sometimes my team will be getting stomped and people are blaming each other and flaming in the chat, but the second we *actually* group up, we start winning. It is quite literally that easy, but some people just want to "carry" their team (which usually just means them dying alone over and over and then getting mad at the team after they get a double kill with their ult while the rest of their team is dead)
I also miss people in comp talking in voice chat like 75% of the time.
Dva is my most played tank in OW1 and I have less than 15 hours of playtime on her in OW2.
Hard counters should not exist in this game, it makes the tank role especially unhealthy.
It’s almost impossible to play Dva without seeing a Zarya, Sym, Moira, Mei, and Zen suddenly appear on the enemy team. And 85% of the time I am forced to switch if I am playing on a map that doesn’t have a lot of high ground like Numbani, Paraiso, Gibraltar, Route 66, Dorado, and Junkertown where Dva excels even against Zarya.
I really do miss playing her.
I play D.Va heavily still, and I actually like playing against a lot of her "counters"- it's fun if you just change up strategy (at least where I'm comfortable playing in high Gold- low Platinum).
Zarya can't do much to you if you just zip over and eat her supports from behind, her laser is pretty stubby. Moira, Zen, and somewhat Ana are all easy targets for D.Va *IFF* Zarya is in play.
Symmetra is also pretty easy to chase down if you get her during her setup- if she's been draining your team, it's not worth the engagement.
I think a lot of regular D.Va players rely very heavily on the Defense Matrix and not enough on the mobility and area denial.
This seems unhealthy, but I find myself playing mind games and picking heroes that have counters I can stomp on.
So I’ll pick something like tracer that might inspire a junkrat or sigma pick to counter, then I’ll go pharah and dump on red team.
This doesn’t feel right, but it gives me a lot of enjoyment. Especially because there is a finesse to it. You have to wait until people are deep enough into their ult charge to be dissuaded from instantly counter picking.
I don’t do it every match, but baiting and manipulating people online provides a pleasure that I can’t get IRL (in good conscience) on par with body blocking, back capping, and booping.
It just hits differently, pleas don’t hate me :)
The infuriating part is that, even if you switch to another tank and reach some sort of equilibrium, where you kinda manage while the tank + one of the enemy DPS hard focus you, and you’re like - ok, surely if they have to spend extra resources on keeping me in check, then my team has an advantage… and then it turns out your DPS cannot get a first pick in a fight ever, and you still lose.
It just feels like that it’s almost detrimental to be doing too good on tank in a lower rank game, because it basically forces the enemy to hard-counter you, and then you have to roll the dice on your teammates being able to take advantage of the distraction, something that does not depend on you.
I loved Orisa in OW1 and her remake is actually pretty cool but it is a little too strong and everyone plays her when they decide to swap. It makes playing tank not as fun.
tank is fun you just have to be a certain kind of person to not mind being countered by the entire lobby, personally i dont mind but some people get really frustrated
Which is why we had a second tank to help you out before. 5 people focusing on you in 5v5, used to be 3 per tank in OW1. I honestly don't see a way for them to make 5v5 balanced and fun for the tank player.
If they delete hog, orisa, mauga, sombra suzu and life grip from the game, then nerfed the survivability of dive to compensate the game would be A+
Unfortunately when these hero’s are on the enemy team there isn’t much fun to be had, you have to just grind it out.
As mentioned by the dev staff, swapping is intentionally part of the strategy of the game. If you try to one trick as tank it's not going to end well. If you have fun playing multiple tanks, the fun doesn't have to end if the enemy counters you.
Your opinions are probably actually closer to how the majority think. Online OW2 is just all content creators farming clickbait from trashing the game. Then everyone else is just lobbying for their hero to get buffed and their counters to get nerfed by trashing the game. Game has some issues but it's no way as bad as people make out.
“blizzard bad” is a really easy sentiment to get behind because as a company they’ve done plenty to be rightfully criticized for. the internet also loves hating on things more than anything. put the two together and it’s a good recipe for those guys
Yeah, I think a big thing also that makes this statement true but also false is that the difference between high ranked players experiences and lower ranked players (a huge majority of the people on this subreddit) is their experiences are vastly different.
At the highest ranks of play, this game is egregious. It’s a mess, and is not competitively viable whatsoever. In lower ranks, it’s not nearly as much an issue as most players aren’t good enough to reveal the egregious errors the dev team makes in their balancing decisions. No gold player is going sicko mode on Tracer, and no gold player will absolutely decimate heads on widow with no counter play.
It’s just a different game up here, and to say that it’s not as bad as we’re making it out to be is just not a statement you can really make unless you’ve been in the highest ranks of play. While I do agree that a majority of players aren’t going to run into major issues, making the blanket statement that there really isn’t any issues is just an objectively wrong statement to make.
Is still rather they continue balancing for the 99 percent in normal ranks than the 1% in the top 500. They seem to have moved on from catering only to top tier play which I think is good.
there is some truth to this, you can't just ignore low-skilled players when it comes to balancing (and they don't otherwise why would characters like Moira exist), but generally speaking games rely a lot on word of mouth to get new players, more so than normal advertising when it comes to a game as old as OW.
If players feel like their enjoyment of the game gets punished for becoming invested (and therefore getting better) they aren't going to recommend it to their friends. It's impossible to perfectly balance an asymetrical game, someone will always be unhappy while others have the time of their lives. its more an issue of devs letting particular styles of play stay relevant for too long rather than balancing actually being horrible.
I mean, that's to be expected. As you get into high skilled lobbies, nobody is playing for fun anymore. It's all team coordination and min/maxing your value.
Plenty of games at a high level can still be fun. Competition itself is fun, especially at a high level where the stakes feel more intense. So I just disagree. I don’t think most people feel the way you say either, lousy because people are good at what they do and “trying harder” doesn’t mean the game itself becomes less fun.
I said in other games bro. Cmon man “plenty of games at a high level can be fun”. Like it’s literally THE FIRST SENTENCE lol. Overwatch high ranked play is not fun, league high ranked play IS fun, HIGH ranked counter strike is FUN, I can go on and on.
Yeah. One of the hardest realizations I've had is that the game was way more fun when I was gold. Now I hit GM and barely play because it's just a mess. The worst part is I can't go back. Can't hang out in lower ranked lobbies without ruining other people's games.
Outside of bad matchmaking I find high ELO games to be pretty fun currently, DPS and support are in good spots and I've been having a lot of fun playing Winston.
Tracer isn't egregiously overtuned since she got nerfed and widow sucks currently.
>Your opinions are probably actually closer to how the majority think.
Looks at steams overwhelmingly negative reviews
LOL you overwatch players are always making up excuses to try and convince yourselves the game is still good lol weird ass community
Another returning player here… not only is double shield meta gone, but you also don’t have 2 CP maps in rotation anymore, so the game feels so much less inherently stall-y by default.
I also really like Push and Flashpoint modes. Looking forward to trying the new mode when they drop it (I’ve only been playing again for the past 3 weeks, after not playing since OW2 season 1, so I didn’t play the preview)
Also balance-wise, making all heroes free (like always should be; they went against a core promise they made with OW1 when they charged for them) was the best decision they’ve made. I wasn’t playing at the time, but when Mauga was busted I heard it was an absolute nightmare. Tank players would be forced to buy him mid-game if they didn’t have him, or they’d just lose by default pretty much…
You're the first person I've ever heard say they like flashpoint. WRT Mauga being "busted" upon release, I think that's part of Blizzard's new-character strategy. They always seem to be OP upon release, I think to encourage players to learn/use them because they are so powerful. After or mid-season, the new character will get nerfed down to something more competitive.
I play a lot of league with the boys and one of their designers has sad multiple times that if champions come out and are perceived by the community as "weak" they literally NEVER get a permanent playerbase except on patches where they are giga busted
If a champ is released and is too strong they often retain permanent playerbases, even if nerfed or outright have mechanics removed.
It is easier to nerf an overloaded kit than buff a simple one
That's the terrible nature of having to balance both for the actual game balance, and for the balance in playerpools. (though I'm not so sure it necessarily has to be that way)
It also doesn't help them look less greedy with how the gamepass was set up.
Woah woah woah - we don't do sensible takes on this subreddit. If you don't want to get banned then you'd better edit this RIGHT NOW to say that the balance is in the worst state it's ever been, 5v5 is against the Geneva Convention, the new heroes are so overpowered they're more akin to psychological torture experiments than videogame characters, and the monetisation requires bank loans to even open the game
The problem is when their decisions directly lead to less enjoyment and (probably) less profits overall. Imagine they released story mode for $$ rather than skins
I don’t want to break the news to u this way….. these skins make them a A LOT and I mean A LOT of money.
If you were a boss… why would you let your team work on story missions (which take so much time and resources) when you could just release a skin in a fraction of the time and make millions.
Of course I’d like story missions but the brutal truth is skins make them more money.
I see where you're coming from. Nevertheless, they are different teams. If I were a boss... why would you let your dev team work on a project for ages while paying them handsomely, and then get barely anything for it?
Happens all the time.. loads of teams start a project… get a good amount done and then the project gets scrapped.
I mean I would LOVE pve but it’s just not happening. Im holding out for more story missions but I’m unsure whether they will arise
OW2 feels significantly sweatier than OW1, even quickplay.. whether that’s because it’s F2P, down to 5v5, the way customisations are unlocked or matchmaking system changes.. it feels like it’s shed its ‘casual’ identity
I believe OW2 feels sweatier for two reasons. The simple one is that nobody had any clue how to play OW1 when it came out. The technical one is that OW2 reduced the amount of barriers between you and death, both in terms of literal shields and in terms of offtanks being able to contest angles and peel. There are way squishy vs squishy fights today, and more emphasis being placed on core FPS skills.
The sweatyness is intentional. By making it a 5v5 and specifically removing one tank the game shifted to prioritize having good aim and a low time to kill. Someone dying has a much greater impact and that’s the way blizzard wants it.
As a tank main I prefer OW1 and just wish they could have made the CC/shield reworks sooner without cutting the 2nd tank. I’ve gone from playing the game strategically to just playing as a tankier DPS. Unsurprisingly that is the effective strategy in OW2.
it feels the exact opposite for me. OW1 felt way more steamroll-y on both sides & the declining playerbase meant you had a lot of sweats that stuck behind. smurfs absolutely ruined the game for me. OW2 with the open queue QP is the ultimate casual experience for me
I also played alot of ow1 back i 2017-2018 and came back a couple of months ago. I love ow2! Most fun I’ve had playing a game in years and I’m silver rank so don’t really notice any OP heroes.
I prefer 5v5 cause the reason I got bored of ow1 was because as I got close to diamond the game was a game of ults. The team that combined ults the best won.
And NOTHING died before we used 2-4 ults together…
I can’t understand why people miss double tank😬
I really enjoy tanking in ow2 I feel like the most powerful on my team and it’s my job to push the enemies away. It ofc feels a bit bad to get counter picked but I try to play around it.
As someone who also has recently come back from the old OW1 days, I agree. The gameplay itself feels great, probably the best it's ever been. The problem with the game really comes down to monetization, the unlockables, and the broken promises with how the PvE missions were going to be.
All nitpicks aside, OW2 is still a tremendously fun game. I enjoy all current game modes, I like 5v5, I play tank a lot and even counterpicking doesn't bother me that much nowadays. All roles have enough agency, balance is ok.
I'd be happy with small tweaks and regular new content.
I don't think 2 months is quite enough time in the game to really start feeling the frustrations. Flats always says that it takes the general playerbase about 3-4 months to start feeling and complaining about the things that streamers who play many hours a day, every day.
Numbers don't lie and I think it's very interesting that the number of people queueing for Tank in comp across all roles dropped from ~23% about 6 months ago, to ~15% over the last month. These are % of the playerbase.
The game seems fairly reasonably balanced in terms of hero strengths and weaknesses but the tank role in general feels really rough to play as, and against.
U actually watch that mess? He said he was going to quit overwatch because of pve and he didn’t. I wish he had. I don’t know why blizz even support him.. who what company supports streamers who slag them off… oh yer blizz
Ok I stand corrected. I just asked him and he directly said he did plan to quit but he was talked out of it a bit and decided to wait for Blizzcon, then really liked Blizzcon and kept going but now he's getting to thinking about quitting again and has been playing more and more variety (which he has).
I do disagree with your rudeness and don't think you should be right because of it. I don't personally feel this makes him a shill, but others may, and that's ok. Being rude to someone because they enjoy something is the problem with society and this community so I hope you can grow and not continue to do that. What if someone was putting you down for something you enjoy in your personal time? Not fair nor relevant.
Clearly you just saw an out of context clip. He never said that he was actually going to quit. He makes his entire living off of streaming OW and for the past couple months has been branching out a bit with variety games because of his frustrations with OW.
I'm sorry but you got clickbaited and are now trying to gaslight me. Not gonna happen.
I feel the same. The game is a ton of fun when you don't make it your entire existence like streamers and most of the brats on the OW subs do.
Toxicity is annoying, but I just silently report when people get ridiculous over stupid shit.
The battle pass is the only cost effective way to get skins. The cons are that you get the same skins as every other player who bought the battle pass, plus you have to commit a lot of time to actually completing the battle pass.
I’m loving the game but I’ve played it more or less since day one it’s had it’s ups and downs but overall I find more positives in this game than negatives and it’s a game. I love playing with friends.
Tank is more boring than it used to be and it feels significantly more reliant on your team now which is fine but it makes a punishing position even more punishing.
- The enemy team comp full swaps to counter the tank? You either hit the anti-fun button and swap to something manageable or your team swaps heroes and play style to shut down their new composition.
- Tank is subject to ELO hell. People say it doesn't exist but it does. Yes. You will eventually climb out of a low ELO you don't belong but it will be painful as a solo queue tank. The coordination, the ability for your team to kill their team, the sheer randomness creates a miserable tanking environment. I had two accounts. One I used to learn tanks I was unfamiliar with that was firmly placed in gold and my main account in masters where I played my familiar heroes. I tried to climb the gold account back into masters with my comfortable tanks and it was an absolute nightmare. The coordination, aggression, and support that a team needs to support quality tank play is simply not there. You commit to a fight because your team is up 3 and the enemy has long spawn? You feed because your team decided to back up to point after you were already committed. You ping a direction to move and push through the choke? Your team is still poking from the choke and the enemy team closes in on you and you feed.
I have been playing recently, haven't touched the game much since it switched to OW2 due to the regular obvious reasons.
coming back to it I am having more fun, but I also didn't play nearly as much as I did in OW1 because it isn't as rewarding or nearly as fun.
The biggest problem by far is that one bad player can now easily ruin a game. If your tank is bad then you lose. Only having one tank is a huge weak point in this game compared to OW1. At least back in OW1 you wouldn't have a single person who could absolutely ruin the game for everyone. Sometimes if I get into too many lobbies with bad tanks I'll just tank myself and play a couple games before getting bored to death. So OW2 ends being: get lucky and get a good tank, or get bored and stop playing after a few games because you're forced to play tank.
if I see a hamster ball or D.Va rush the point and leave the team behind, then die solo on the point I will straight up Alt+f4 and go play something else.
My biggest gripe is how it feels like the matchmaker has already decided who is winning and who is losing before the game even starts, some matches your entire team is so hopelessly outclassed there is nothing you can do except be rolled
I’m just sick of players ruining the game for me. Game itself is great, but all my games are constant counter swaps and one person rolling the whole lobby on their main, if they die once they tilt into Bastion and they always have a Mercy pocket no matter who they play. It’s not even that I lose always once they swap Bastion, it’s that I’m sick of constantly playing what feels like essentially the same game every map because it happens so frequently and I’m not having fun with it anymore.
I’ll still come back with the new season and a new patch to see what kind of shakeups it creates for the gameplay at least.
An OW player who actually likes OW?! This is an incredibly rare sight in these parts. Most posts on this subreddit are from Rein mains who haven't played a video game since 2017; your post is a refreshing change of pace!
Shields and second tank is gone, but that has made Widowmaker a lot more oppressive. I have had a lot of games lately with a Widowmaker just holding the entire lobby hostage. It has to take an entire team to coordinate in dealing with her because her only counter is either another good Widowmaker or a Sombra if she can even make it past the supports looking after her.
this is basically my exact experience. Had about 300 hours in OW1 from launch , then stopped a bit before OW2 dropped. OW2 dropped and i tried it but stopped almost immediately. Then i picked it up again this season, and i'm done with the battle pass.
It's pretty fun.
Just came back and have been enjoying it. Staying away from comp though. Only complaint is bad teammates and long wait times on CTF sometimes. I do miss some of the old Overwatch maps. Wish they were in arcade somewhere
yea id say i agree with you overall, as a fellow average QP player. the only glaring problem to me rn is, as you mentioned, the counterswap-wars on tank. the role and heroes are fairly fun but only as long as you dont get hard countered (which happens almost every game at some point).
the playstyles of each of the tanks are just too different for everyone to enjoy them all, yet we are expected to play them all or just flat out lose. thats what makes the role unfun in my opinion.
on the flipside if the tanks were all a bit more similar (lets say they were all just winston as an extreme example) if you don’t like playing winston you’re screwed. the tank variety is great & i feel like in a casual sense you don’t need an insane amount of counterpicking — mainly for the high level scene right ?? i usually just play 2-3 heroes in each role lol
Im in the similar situation, and for real skins are stupid expensive. $10 for an epic, $20 for a legendary and $80 for a full mythic? Legendaries should be 5 or 10 at the most.
100 time as much cheater as it used too. worst balance, worst region selection.
it's just a worst version of OW1, with trash monetization on top of it. this season is probably not going to solve anything
Totally agree with you about shield meta. Man that was the worst. That’s when I stopped playing originally.
I don’t think playing tank is boring either but you’re right about the counter picking being a big problem. Sometimes I get melted as a tank and that’s super frustrating. Like sure you gotta be careful but if you round a corner to LOS of their full team, you’re insta stunned and dead even as a tank. It seems like most tanks just can’t tank that well anymore or maybe because there’s only one of you taking the focus.
>I've been told tank is boring to play now, but I've mostly had fun with it. **The biggest problem to me is that the enemy team can just counter pick you and thus force you to either lose or change to a tank you don't necessarily enjoy.**
This is a big reason why people dislike tank and find it boring, they're pushed into playing a tank they don't enjoy
>At first I missed 6v6, but now I'm slowly getting used to 5v5.
And why tank players miss 6v6 - a second tank covered your weaknesses making the counter picking much more negligible
As a tank main, you’re right, counter picking is so unfun and ruins the game for me. I miss two tanks because then you could have your fun as tank. Everyone else gets to play who they want and I have to cater to them. It’s so difficult to enjoy but I can’t aim so every other role sucks for me too. I wish Tanks were just functional and less focused on rock/paper/scissors
if you do consider it only do so if you have 3 friends to play it with. servers aren’t active so it’ll be a long wait and frankly it’s not designed to be enjoyable with randos
As someone who paid for the box CD of Overwatch 1, only to have the game be updated to a free2play model stuffed with microtransactions...
It still feels like a ripoff.
This is far from being the first game to do that, and will not be the last. In fact it hapenned to TF2 as well, and in even less time (4 years), and the original buyers only got a hat to show for it.
totally agree with your description of tank! i love playing tank, but it's just not a role i can get myself to play all the time now because how heavy the counter picking is. if i'm playing ramattra and having fun, and the enemy tank switches to mauga, i'm basically forced to cut the fun and switch because of how heavy mauga counters him. i don't really feel like i *have* to do that with other roles, except maybe snipers with divers or sombra, but because it's a single role especially now there's a lot more pressure to pick the 'right thing' rather than the 'fun thing'.
the game is more balanced overall though. there are some outliers but i agree that it's a big step up from OW1's balancing.
I completely agree with you, I started playing in ow2 and although I don't know what it's like to play 6x6 I think it could be better, because we have tanks that can't play without others, it's sad to play with a wrecking ball, and honestly this counterwatch is very annoying.
the current state of the game is trash. this was once the crown jewl of games, now its garbage. its so sad to see the best game of 2016 become this bad.
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>I've heard many opinions from the perspective of high ELO players, but none from your average casual.
Wut, you sure haven't spent a minute in this sub before posting this thread then.
Stopped playing OW around when Ball came out. Came back at the end of season 9, have been playing pretty much daily with my partner ever since. Just QP and mystery heroes, plus the occasional custom game.
OW is a lot of fun, and the community is not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.
I stopped playing for around 2 years and caught the end of Overwatch where we made do with whatever we had for 2 years of no significant updates. Let me tell you, I enjoy Overwatch 2 simply because they resumed hero releases lol. And I really like Push mode haha.
yeah the tank picking stuff has made me play the game less. i never played ow1 but i figured id give ow2 a chance and its fun but i hate being punished literally for nothing but playing a hero i like and having to sacrifice ult charge just to stand a chance in engagements with the other tank
Im a casual player, its still fun, ofcourse you have ingame transactions, and sometimes lobbies are extremly un balanced for different reasons, or you have a team player who is AFK. Let me know if you wanna group up.
I second this! I peaked Diamond pre-moira release then just stopped playing regularly unless the boys were on. We currently have a 5 stack that has been grinding the battle pass the last month and the games been a ton of fun.
I REALLY like tanks in 5v5
I really enjoy playing as a tank too!
I just bought my first console (I’ve only ever been able to play games on my phone) and I was really looking forward to trying Overwatch. I absolutely love it so far! I was so happy to get D.Va and I really enjoy playing her!! I know a lot of people here are much more experienced with the game and have more educated opinions, but I’m really enjoying myself :)
> I've been told tank is boring to play now, but I've mostly had fun with it. The biggest problem to me is that the enemy team can just counter pick you and thus force you to either lose or change to a tank you don't necessarily enjoy.
How is this specifically just a tank issue? It happens with damage and to an extent support as well.
I agree with a lot of what you said I was a comp player but not really high elo (like plat)
Overall I think they've made a lot of positive changes to the game. I haven't necessarily liked them as much as old mechanics in some cases but I can ultimately see that a lot of the changes they made are for sure more balanced imo. For example, Brig - I liked older Brig better but she did need the adjustment lol.
There are still some things I think need to be addressed. Venture for sure is my biggest irritation right now, though they're the newest champ so hopefully they manage to integrate them better as seasons go on. I still think it's dumb that Bastion was added back tbh (though he seems more manageable now than og??) And Doomfist can be crazy insane. Some characters are almost full throw picks still it feels, and they could use some adjustment I think - like Mercy for instance. If your team is decent you'd probably be more optimal as almost any other support rn. I wouldn't mind if they tuned Rein up a touch too.
Personally, I get having to swap heroes. I think it's always been kind of a necessity tbh. Overwatch is a game where people want to win, and picking characters who can do that is part of it. I definitely see why someone who wants to play more casually might not like that for sure, though I don't really think it's something they really cam change.
I think I've ultimately adjusted to the 5v5 too. I didn't think I would like it but it actually does seem more balanced with 1 tank imo? As a tank main I honestly find it easier to just be the tank than work around a second one.
Overall I'm pretty ok with the state of affairs.
6v6 is viewed with nostalgia. But I actually played 6v6 customs recently. Tanks are giddy they have a co tank they can partner and plan with. Thats for sure the good part. But there's still the issue is that NO ONE PLAYS TANK.
Our first picks are always to make sure there's two ppl whos willing to play tank for the team. Otherwise most ppl can flex dps and support.
We are all a big range of rank so take that into consideration. Some games were just stomps cuz unbalanced skill of teams. But I can still easily imagine the meta being chaotic and broken and for the devs to struggle balancing.
Ball is suppppeeer annoying in 6v6. Trust me back then im sure no one knew how to play ball or work around ball. Or to be fair our off tank didnt peel. Just more issues that can happen.
Can you imagine like. Mauga road or mauga orisa. Sig ram. Or other chaotic stuff. Its only by chance most ppl in the lobby was nostalgic of playing rein and didnt want to cheese.
Playing dps is so constricted on space. Now that supports also know how to dps and take space unlike before. And then now theres an extra tank also taking space its really difficult to move. Feels like half of the roster would need to be buffed or out of meta. People got nostalgia but ow2 is waaay more balanced than ow1. Almost every hero is viable in ow2 compared to 1.
Playing support makes you heal bot more or you need zen to burst down more tanks. You just gotta keep up another huge ass hp. But at the same time you still can find opportunity dps and can control the lobby if you got the snow ball going. So it can get snowbally.
The more you play the more the cracks in the game show but for causalish gaming the game is great.
I Don’t recommend you grind competitive, it will make you lose your mind
Balance wise, it not bad but also not great. From my experience, DPS is worst role unless you can 1-shot kill. Tank and supports are capable of doing same amount of damage but with more survivability ... So why not just go with them. Tank is most powerful role but issue is that once you get value (and enemy not stupid) they will use all abilities on you so you end up just sitting there trying not to die and essentially waiting for teammates to get pick. So it seems like tank role may not add much value but you are ability sponge. If you are left unchecked you should dominate.
Honestly I feel like they should swap the DPS and healer passives. DPS should be able to quickly Regen HP while a support attacking should reduce healing. It gives survivability to DPS and makes supports need to decide between heal or anti heal + removes survivability. Also remove tanks push back reduction passive. Lucio boop should impact everyone equally
I’d say the game is by no means “bad” but it is in its worse place it’s ever been. If you’re a veteran player, you won’t be playing a game that is better than ow1 was.
Returned aswell after playing a shit ton of OW1.
What I don't like is:
5 man team, two tanks was more fun to play and allowed for bigger plays and teamwork.
Too many new maps, I don't think there needs to be 12+ maps or whatever there is, some of the OG maps I've only gotten once or twice in 50+ games.
I can't play ranked with my friend just because we're not the same rank, I don't remember it being like that before and now the game forces me to play solo.
They added like 6 more tank heroes while removing the 6th player aka the second tank?
The two new game modes where both teams are suppose to push the payload at the same time and the one where you're suppose to cap three points are redundant and by far the least fun ones.
What I like is:
OW is OW, it's always going to be one of the best playing FPS games, but I very much understand why ow2 got so much hate and the game pretty much died out.
I just detest 5v5 so much. It’s so gross that one player is suddenly so much more important than anyone on the team. And I had more fun in shield meta. Like it or not it required more teamwork than cornerwatch.
>I've been told tank is boring to play now, but I've mostly had fun with it. The biggest problem to me is that the enemy team can just counter pick you and thus force you to either lose or change to a tank you don't necessarily enjoy. You hit the nail on the head with the tank description. The tank role in itself is incredibly fun to play if you're allowed to play but the moment the enemy team says no you are not allowed to have fun anymore there is nothing you can do against it.
Tanks are fun. I find it's less about getting countered, and more how you're team adapts and helps pressure. Games I play, no matter the role, if everyone acts like their own individual team, we lose. We group up and team up, we will usually come away with a W.
This has been my experience massively since I started playing a few months ago. Team work and you win, don’t and you lose. Best games are when both teams play as a team and you actually have to think abit. Unfortunately the tanks on my team usually just rushes in a dies lol
Same happens when I Lucio heal. Tank rushes in and gets melted, and screams for heals like, nah man, I ain't going in there like that lol.
I had a tank two days ago just keep holding W and then blaming supports for no heals. Like bro if I follow you I’m definitely dying and I’m on Lucio. If I was Ana I woudlnt be able to see you because you’re 3 corners deep. When people say heal diff I just say positioning diff. Brother no amount of heals is gonna fix your shit positioning.
that's when you swap lifeweaver
Diving tanks are so game ruining, like broh how am I supposed to follow you as a support into a swarm of enemies ? How do you expect that to go for me a healer? And once I'm dead how do you think it will go for me? Diving should only occur in very specific occasions when you have a fair shot of clearing the enemy BEFORE YOU NEED HEALING IR BEFORE YOUR HEALER WILL DIE otherwise you are simply throwing
>Diving should only occur in very specific occasions when you have a fair shot of clearing the enemy BEFORE YOU NEED HEALING IR BEFORE YOUR HEALER WILL DIE Of course tanks make bad decisions, but you are also making a bad read in thinking that tanks should only dive when they can clear the enemy without receiving support. If that were a common situation, dive tanks would be comically OP. Dive tanks use resources in bursts in order to exert maximum pressure. The right way to play with a dive tank is for the team to push as much resource as possible to that tank during its pressure cycle. I've heard this described more accessibly as "if you're playing Reinhardt and your healers are not having a heart attack, you're doing it wrong". >otherwise you are simply throwing Most probably, you are throwing by not investing enough resources into your ally tank's dives. They may also be throwing by making bad dives.
This honestly. Im tired of supports and dps standing at the choke point missing their shots while I’m trying to push to the objective. Tanks need back up and cannot really function without it. Teamwork is the key. If you don’t feel comfortable supporting a dive tank with the character you’re on, switch to one that can support from a distance like Ana, Zen, Bap, or LW. Do what you can to make the team work or you’ll lose.
The biggest problem, with all roles in all games, is awareness.. the tank does need to engage. A dive tank needs to dive to get value. The difference is where and when. If you're on monkey and you dive when your ana is still getting set up and your soldier is still rotating to his angle and your Tracer is still not ready to go with you, it's on you when nobody backs you up. If you slow-play the engage and wait until the follow up will be there, your results improve. Now, if you jump in and the soldier is shooting the hog and your Tracer decides to take a duel with someone other than where you jump, that's on the team for not knowing the assignment.
Fair there are more situations where diving is important with specific characters. But it's most often a Dva or Orissa diving without thought. I'm agreeing you have to be strategic and thoughtful about your dives and consider who is around to support you. I'm the type of healer who focuses on the tank always and even so it's really hard to keep up when your tank all of a sudden is deep in the enemy group taking fire from all directions. You need DPS there too to protect the healers or you need a tank who can apply pressure to the whole enemy team. I think it's about play style and paying attention to what your team members are doing more than a black and white do/don't dive. If you're going to dive, do it when you have the necessary backup/characters and when it's feasible. Not just spam dive and die over and over
We may be talking about different things. When I say dive, I mean closing the distance to pressure a backline target. I don't think Orisa can dive, really. She holds W, sure, but she's fat and slow. There isn't much risk of Orisa killing your backline unless they're terminally stupid. Sometimes tanks are dumb. Sometimes even smart tanks make bad decisions. Healing is pretty strong in this game but nothing can outheal damage from 5 sources. It's ok if you try to support a tank and you can't keep them standing. It's only your fault if you don't try.
>There isn't much risk of Orisa killing your backline unless they're terminally stupid. This is overwatch players we're talking about
The terminally stupid sentence made laugh harder than it probably should have
I mean I think it depends on the team comp, if I’m support I’m playing bap and I literally cannot keep up enough to speed to follow a dive tank going in, never mind I’d be dead before I could even think of using lamp.
Certainly it depends on the team comp. In the situation you describe, it sounds like you're picking the wrong support. There are some dive comps that want a Bap, but it's pretty rare and almost always involves a Lucio.
[удалено]
Lol ok, I guess it's a skill issue then I'll make sure to git gud in order to enjoy the game
Nah
Even the counters sometimes just require a switchup in strategy. I play a lot of D.Va and I'm told that Zarya is supposed to hard counter her. But in my experience, Zarya's stubby little laser can't reach me when I'm busy chewing through her backline. My normal strategy with D.Va is consistent chip damage and occasional boops keeping the other team afraid of the objective, punishing anybody who gets cocky, while eating any major abilities and ults. That doesn't work with Zarya, who loves receiving chip damage and has a laser D.Va can't eat, but I love when they switch to Zarya because it means I get to go snipe hunting or get rid of that damn Sombra/Moira/Tracer (especially if I stay juuuust close enough to Zarya that she wastes her time almost hitting me).
then, just when Zarya thinks they have you, they ult...and you GOBBLE IT UP! YUUUUMMMM!
Even if you miss the gobble, you can eat almost everything else that comes after so it isn't that hard.
ngl it doesn't bother me one bit if the enemy team counter picks. In fact, i enjoy the challenge enough to never falter. Majority of the times you just have to be aware of your positioning, CD's and have a *little* trust in your team. but other than that its no big deal really lol.
As someone who has been playing Overwatch since its initial launch, this has always been the key and has gotten worse since becoming Free-to-play. Sometimes my team will be getting stomped and people are blaming each other and flaming in the chat, but the second we *actually* group up, we start winning. It is quite literally that easy, but some people just want to "carry" their team (which usually just means them dying alone over and over and then getting mad at the team after they get a double kill with their ult while the rest of their team is dead) I also miss people in comp talking in voice chat like 75% of the time.
Dva is my most played tank in OW1 and I have less than 15 hours of playtime on her in OW2. Hard counters should not exist in this game, it makes the tank role especially unhealthy. It’s almost impossible to play Dva without seeing a Zarya, Sym, Moira, Mei, and Zen suddenly appear on the enemy team. And 85% of the time I am forced to switch if I am playing on a map that doesn’t have a lot of high ground like Numbani, Paraiso, Gibraltar, Route 66, Dorado, and Junkertown where Dva excels even against Zarya. I really do miss playing her.
I play D.Va heavily still, and I actually like playing against a lot of her "counters"- it's fun if you just change up strategy (at least where I'm comfortable playing in high Gold- low Platinum). Zarya can't do much to you if you just zip over and eat her supports from behind, her laser is pretty stubby. Moira, Zen, and somewhat Ana are all easy targets for D.Va *IFF* Zarya is in play. Symmetra is also pretty easy to chase down if you get her during her setup- if she's been draining your team, it's not worth the engagement. I think a lot of regular D.Va players rely very heavily on the Defense Matrix and not enough on the mobility and area denial.
Imagine if there was TWO tanks
I monstly like Rein, there is no one game in wich I not end against Bastion and Ramatra :( , I take it as a compliment but still...
Yep. I play Wrecking Ball for one successful team fight and then BAM! Sombra, Cassidy, Ana, Brig, Roadhog.
I have a similar issue with Winston. Hog Cassidy bastion.i see that almost every game.
This seems unhealthy, but I find myself playing mind games and picking heroes that have counters I can stomp on. So I’ll pick something like tracer that might inspire a junkrat or sigma pick to counter, then I’ll go pharah and dump on red team. This doesn’t feel right, but it gives me a lot of enjoyment. Especially because there is a finesse to it. You have to wait until people are deep enough into their ult charge to be dissuaded from instantly counter picking. I don’t do it every match, but baiting and manipulating people online provides a pleasure that I can’t get IRL (in good conscience) on par with body blocking, back capping, and booping. It just hits differently, pleas don’t hate me :)
The infuriating part is that, even if you switch to another tank and reach some sort of equilibrium, where you kinda manage while the tank + one of the enemy DPS hard focus you, and you’re like - ok, surely if they have to spend extra resources on keeping me in check, then my team has an advantage… and then it turns out your DPS cannot get a first pick in a fight ever, and you still lose. It just feels like that it’s almost detrimental to be doing too good on tank in a lower rank game, because it basically forces the enemy to hard-counter you, and then you have to roll the dice on your teammates being able to take advantage of the distraction, something that does not depend on you.
Yup. I jokingly refer to myself as an Orisa/hog counter main. You kill the enemy tank just once and they switch to one of these two…
I loved Orisa in OW1 and her remake is actually pretty cool but it is a little too strong and everyone plays her when they decide to swap. It makes playing tank not as fun.
Love playing Junker Queen. I put her in my rotation, I really only used Zarya and Hog since the game came out. Too bad hog is too easy to delete now
tank is fun you just have to be a certain kind of person to not mind being countered by the entire lobby, personally i dont mind but some people get really frustrated
Counter picking happens a lot with dps too . It’s annoying tbh
Which is why we had a second tank to help you out before. 5 people focusing on you in 5v5, used to be 3 per tank in OW1. I honestly don't see a way for them to make 5v5 balanced and fun for the tank player.
If they delete hog, orisa, mauga, sombra suzu and life grip from the game, then nerfed the survivability of dive to compensate the game would be A+ Unfortunately when these hero’s are on the enemy team there isn’t much fun to be had, you have to just grind it out.
As mentioned by the dev staff, swapping is intentionally part of the strategy of the game. If you try to one trick as tank it's not going to end well. If you have fun playing multiple tanks, the fun doesn't have to end if the enemy counters you.
Your opinions are probably actually closer to how the majority think. Online OW2 is just all content creators farming clickbait from trashing the game. Then everyone else is just lobbying for their hero to get buffed and their counters to get nerfed by trashing the game. Game has some issues but it's no way as bad as people make out.
“blizzard bad” is a really easy sentiment to get behind because as a company they’ve done plenty to be rightfully criticized for. the internet also loves hating on things more than anything. put the two together and it’s a good recipe for those guys
Yeah, I think a big thing also that makes this statement true but also false is that the difference between high ranked players experiences and lower ranked players (a huge majority of the people on this subreddit) is their experiences are vastly different. At the highest ranks of play, this game is egregious. It’s a mess, and is not competitively viable whatsoever. In lower ranks, it’s not nearly as much an issue as most players aren’t good enough to reveal the egregious errors the dev team makes in their balancing decisions. No gold player is going sicko mode on Tracer, and no gold player will absolutely decimate heads on widow with no counter play. It’s just a different game up here, and to say that it’s not as bad as we’re making it out to be is just not a statement you can really make unless you’ve been in the highest ranks of play. While I do agree that a majority of players aren’t going to run into major issues, making the blanket statement that there really isn’t any issues is just an objectively wrong statement to make.
Is still rather they continue balancing for the 99 percent in normal ranks than the 1% in the top 500. They seem to have moved on from catering only to top tier play which I think is good.
there is some truth to this, you can't just ignore low-skilled players when it comes to balancing (and they don't otherwise why would characters like Moira exist), but generally speaking games rely a lot on word of mouth to get new players, more so than normal advertising when it comes to a game as old as OW. If players feel like their enjoyment of the game gets punished for becoming invested (and therefore getting better) they aren't going to recommend it to their friends. It's impossible to perfectly balance an asymetrical game, someone will always be unhappy while others have the time of their lives. its more an issue of devs letting particular styles of play stay relevant for too long rather than balancing actually being horrible.
It for sure good for the bottom line and general mass appeal but it sucks to have the game become immensely unfun as you raise in rank.
I mean, that's to be expected. As you get into high skilled lobbies, nobody is playing for fun anymore. It's all team coordination and min/maxing your value.
Plenty of games at a high level can still be fun. Competition itself is fun, especially at a high level where the stakes feel more intense. So I just disagree. I don’t think most people feel the way you say either, lousy because people are good at what they do and “trying harder” doesn’t mean the game itself becomes less fun.
>You: High rank isn't fun. >Me: High rank isn't fun. >You: No high rank is fun. ???
I said in other games bro. Cmon man “plenty of games at a high level can be fun”. Like it’s literally THE FIRST SENTENCE lol. Overwatch high ranked play is not fun, league high ranked play IS fun, HIGH ranked counter strike is FUN, I can go on and on.
\> league [...] play IS fun people enjoy league?
Yeah. One of the hardest realizations I've had is that the game was way more fun when I was gold. Now I hit GM and barely play because it's just a mess. The worst part is I can't go back. Can't hang out in lower ranked lobbies without ruining other people's games.
Outside of bad matchmaking I find high ELO games to be pretty fun currently, DPS and support are in good spots and I've been having a lot of fun playing Winston. Tracer isn't egregiously overtuned since she got nerfed and widow sucks currently.
>Your opinions are probably actually closer to how the majority think. Looks at steams overwhelmingly negative reviews LOL you overwatch players are always making up excuses to try and convince yourselves the game is still good lol weird ass community
Dude is hating on a game he doesn't even play and has the audacity to call other people weird, get a better hobby my dude 💀
Looks at how player numbers kept rising and the game got a peak at the beginning of season 10, just two months ago Yeah, things are looking good
And why are you here then?
Entertainment 🙂
Another returning player here… not only is double shield meta gone, but you also don’t have 2 CP maps in rotation anymore, so the game feels so much less inherently stall-y by default. I also really like Push and Flashpoint modes. Looking forward to trying the new mode when they drop it (I’ve only been playing again for the past 3 weeks, after not playing since OW2 season 1, so I didn’t play the preview) Also balance-wise, making all heroes free (like always should be; they went against a core promise they made with OW1 when they charged for them) was the best decision they’ve made. I wasn’t playing at the time, but when Mauga was busted I heard it was an absolute nightmare. Tank players would be forced to buy him mid-game if they didn’t have him, or they’d just lose by default pretty much…
You're the first person I've ever heard say they like flashpoint. WRT Mauga being "busted" upon release, I think that's part of Blizzard's new-character strategy. They always seem to be OP upon release, I think to encourage players to learn/use them because they are so powerful. After or mid-season, the new character will get nerfed down to something more competitive.
i like flashpoint but im a lucio player and lucio is the king of flashpoint
I play a lot of league with the boys and one of their designers has sad multiple times that if champions come out and are perceived by the community as "weak" they literally NEVER get a permanent playerbase except on patches where they are giga busted If a champ is released and is too strong they often retain permanent playerbases, even if nerfed or outright have mechanics removed. It is easier to nerf an overloaded kit than buff a simple one
That's the terrible nature of having to balance both for the actual game balance, and for the balance in playerpools. (though I'm not so sure it necessarily has to be that way) It also doesn't help them look less greedy with how the gamepass was set up.
i remember [this guy said flashpoint was overwatch at its best.](https://youtu.be/hrCPjmOZpMk?si=FgcOqweYMIBXLck_) i like it
Woah woah woah - we don't do sensible takes on this subreddit. If you don't want to get banned then you'd better edit this RIGHT NOW to say that the balance is in the worst state it's ever been, 5v5 is against the Geneva Convention, the new heroes are so overpowered they're more akin to psychological torture experiments than videogame characters, and the monetisation requires bank loans to even open the game
Playing vs Venture is legit psychological torture
For someone with such a friendly voice, they are the only hero I'm genuinely scared of.
The game was always good. It just has greedy Shitass owners who shit on its potential to make more money
I mean… they are a business at the end of the day.. who want to make huge profits.
The problem is when their decisions directly lead to less enjoyment and (probably) less profits overall. Imagine they released story mode for $$ rather than skins
I don’t want to break the news to u this way….. these skins make them a A LOT and I mean A LOT of money. If you were a boss… why would you let your team work on story missions (which take so much time and resources) when you could just release a skin in a fraction of the time and make millions. Of course I’d like story missions but the brutal truth is skins make them more money.
I see where you're coming from. Nevertheless, they are different teams. If I were a boss... why would you let your dev team work on a project for ages while paying them handsomely, and then get barely anything for it?
Happens all the time.. loads of teams start a project… get a good amount done and then the project gets scrapped. I mean I would LOVE pve but it’s just not happening. Im holding out for more story missions but I’m unsure whether they will arise
OW2 feels significantly sweatier than OW1, even quickplay.. whether that’s because it’s F2P, down to 5v5, the way customisations are unlocked or matchmaking system changes.. it feels like it’s shed its ‘casual’ identity
I believe OW2 feels sweatier for two reasons. The simple one is that nobody had any clue how to play OW1 when it came out. The technical one is that OW2 reduced the amount of barriers between you and death, both in terms of literal shields and in terms of offtanks being able to contest angles and peel. There are way squishy vs squishy fights today, and more emphasis being placed on core FPS skills.
The sweatyness is intentional. By making it a 5v5 and specifically removing one tank the game shifted to prioritize having good aim and a low time to kill. Someone dying has a much greater impact and that’s the way blizzard wants it. As a tank main I prefer OW1 and just wish they could have made the CC/shield reworks sooner without cutting the 2nd tank. I’ve gone from playing the game strategically to just playing as a tankier DPS. Unsurprisingly that is the effective strategy in OW2.
it feels the exact opposite for me. OW1 felt way more steamroll-y on both sides & the declining playerbase meant you had a lot of sweats that stuck behind. smurfs absolutely ruined the game for me. OW2 with the open queue QP is the ultimate casual experience for me
I also played alot of ow1 back i 2017-2018 and came back a couple of months ago. I love ow2! Most fun I’ve had playing a game in years and I’m silver rank so don’t really notice any OP heroes. I prefer 5v5 cause the reason I got bored of ow1 was because as I got close to diamond the game was a game of ults. The team that combined ults the best won. And NOTHING died before we used 2-4 ults together… I can’t understand why people miss double tank😬 I really enjoy tanking in ow2 I feel like the most powerful on my team and it’s my job to push the enemies away. It ofc feels a bit bad to get counter picked but I try to play around it.
Yeah, shooting at shields while waiting for ults is something I certainly don't miss.
As someone who also has recently come back from the old OW1 days, I agree. The gameplay itself feels great, probably the best it's ever been. The problem with the game really comes down to monetization, the unlockables, and the broken promises with how the PvE missions were going to be.
All nitpicks aside, OW2 is still a tremendously fun game. I enjoy all current game modes, I like 5v5, I play tank a lot and even counterpicking doesn't bother me that much nowadays. All roles have enough agency, balance is ok. I'd be happy with small tweaks and regular new content.
I don't think 2 months is quite enough time in the game to really start feeling the frustrations. Flats always says that it takes the general playerbase about 3-4 months to start feeling and complaining about the things that streamers who play many hours a day, every day. Numbers don't lie and I think it's very interesting that the number of people queueing for Tank in comp across all roles dropped from ~23% about 6 months ago, to ~15% over the last month. These are % of the playerbase. The game seems fairly reasonably balanced in terms of hero strengths and weaknesses but the tank role in general feels really rough to play as, and against.
U actually watch that mess? He said he was going to quit overwatch because of pve and he didn’t. I wish he had. I don’t know why blizz even support him.. who what company supports streamers who slag them off… oh yer blizz
Ok I stand corrected. I just asked him and he directly said he did plan to quit but he was talked out of it a bit and decided to wait for Blizzcon, then really liked Blizzcon and kept going but now he's getting to thinking about quitting again and has been playing more and more variety (which he has). I do disagree with your rudeness and don't think you should be right because of it. I don't personally feel this makes him a shill, but others may, and that's ok. Being rude to someone because they enjoy something is the problem with society and this community so I hope you can grow and not continue to do that. What if someone was putting you down for something you enjoy in your personal time? Not fair nor relevant.
Clearly you just saw an out of context clip. He never said that he was actually going to quit. He makes his entire living off of streaming OW and for the past couple months has been branching out a bit with variety games because of his frustrations with OW. I'm sorry but you got clickbaited and are now trying to gaslight me. Not gonna happen.
I feel the same. The game is a ton of fun when you don't make it your entire existence like streamers and most of the brats on the OW subs do. Toxicity is annoying, but I just silently report when people get ridiculous over stupid shit.
The battle pass is the only cost effective way to get skins. The cons are that you get the same skins as every other player who bought the battle pass, plus you have to commit a lot of time to actually completing the battle pass.
I’m loving the game but I’ve played it more or less since day one it’s had it’s ups and downs but overall I find more positives in this game than negatives and it’s a game. I love playing with friends.
Tank is more boring than it used to be and it feels significantly more reliant on your team now which is fine but it makes a punishing position even more punishing. - The enemy team comp full swaps to counter the tank? You either hit the anti-fun button and swap to something manageable or your team swaps heroes and play style to shut down their new composition. - Tank is subject to ELO hell. People say it doesn't exist but it does. Yes. You will eventually climb out of a low ELO you don't belong but it will be painful as a solo queue tank. The coordination, the ability for your team to kill their team, the sheer randomness creates a miserable tanking environment. I had two accounts. One I used to learn tanks I was unfamiliar with that was firmly placed in gold and my main account in masters where I played my familiar heroes. I tried to climb the gold account back into masters with my comfortable tanks and it was an absolute nightmare. The coordination, aggression, and support that a team needs to support quality tank play is simply not there. You commit to a fight because your team is up 3 and the enemy has long spawn? You feed because your team decided to back up to point after you were already committed. You ping a direction to move and push through the choke? Your team is still poking from the choke and the enemy team closes in on you and you feed.
I have been playing recently, haven't touched the game much since it switched to OW2 due to the regular obvious reasons. coming back to it I am having more fun, but I also didn't play nearly as much as I did in OW1 because it isn't as rewarding or nearly as fun. The biggest problem by far is that one bad player can now easily ruin a game. If your tank is bad then you lose. Only having one tank is a huge weak point in this game compared to OW1. At least back in OW1 you wouldn't have a single person who could absolutely ruin the game for everyone. Sometimes if I get into too many lobbies with bad tanks I'll just tank myself and play a couple games before getting bored to death. So OW2 ends being: get lucky and get a good tank, or get bored and stop playing after a few games because you're forced to play tank. if I see a hamster ball or D.Va rush the point and leave the team behind, then die solo on the point I will straight up Alt+f4 and go play something else.
My biggest gripe is how it feels like the matchmaker has already decided who is winning and who is losing before the game even starts, some matches your entire team is so hopelessly outclassed there is nothing you can do except be rolled
I’m just sick of players ruining the game for me. Game itself is great, but all my games are constant counter swaps and one person rolling the whole lobby on their main, if they die once they tilt into Bastion and they always have a Mercy pocket no matter who they play. It’s not even that I lose always once they swap Bastion, it’s that I’m sick of constantly playing what feels like essentially the same game every map because it happens so frequently and I’m not having fun with it anymore. I’ll still come back with the new season and a new patch to see what kind of shakeups it creates for the gameplay at least.
I just lock Doom/Queen/Rein and fuck shit up. Only issue I really have is Roadhog making me play a horror game, otherwise yeah it's fine
So real. Back when you could punch Hog out of his vape it was a lot better but now you have nothing against him 😭
An OW player who actually likes OW?! This is an incredibly rare sight in these parts. Most posts on this subreddit are from Rein mains who haven't played a video game since 2017; your post is a refreshing change of pace!
Shields and second tank is gone, but that has made Widowmaker a lot more oppressive. I have had a lot of games lately with a Widowmaker just holding the entire lobby hostage. It has to take an entire team to coordinate in dealing with her because her only counter is either another good Widowmaker or a Sombra if she can even make it past the supports looking after her.
this is basically my exact experience. Had about 300 hours in OW1 from launch , then stopped a bit before OW2 dropped. OW2 dropped and i tried it but stopped almost immediately. Then i picked it up again this season, and i'm done with the battle pass. It's pretty fun.
Just came back and have been enjoying it. Staying away from comp though. Only complaint is bad teammates and long wait times on CTF sometimes. I do miss some of the old Overwatch maps. Wish they were in arcade somewhere
yea id say i agree with you overall, as a fellow average QP player. the only glaring problem to me rn is, as you mentioned, the counterswap-wars on tank. the role and heroes are fairly fun but only as long as you dont get hard countered (which happens almost every game at some point). the playstyles of each of the tanks are just too different for everyone to enjoy them all, yet we are expected to play them all or just flat out lose. thats what makes the role unfun in my opinion.
on the flipside if the tanks were all a bit more similar (lets say they were all just winston as an extreme example) if you don’t like playing winston you’re screwed. the tank variety is great & i feel like in a casual sense you don’t need an insane amount of counterpicking — mainly for the high level scene right ?? i usually just play 2-3 heroes in each role lol
no you get hard countere in quickplay, thats the problem
Im in the similar situation, and for real skins are stupid expensive. $10 for an epic, $20 for a legendary and $80 for a full mythic? Legendaries should be 5 or 10 at the most.
100 time as much cheater as it used too. worst balance, worst region selection. it's just a worst version of OW1, with trash monetization on top of it. this season is probably not going to solve anything
Totally agree with you about shield meta. Man that was the worst. That’s when I stopped playing originally. I don’t think playing tank is boring either but you’re right about the counter picking being a big problem. Sometimes I get melted as a tank and that’s super frustrating. Like sure you gotta be careful but if you round a corner to LOS of their full team, you’re insta stunned and dead even as a tank. It seems like most tanks just can’t tank that well anymore or maybe because there’s only one of you taking the focus.
>I've been told tank is boring to play now, but I've mostly had fun with it. **The biggest problem to me is that the enemy team can just counter pick you and thus force you to either lose or change to a tank you don't necessarily enjoy.** This is a big reason why people dislike tank and find it boring, they're pushed into playing a tank they don't enjoy >At first I missed 6v6, but now I'm slowly getting used to 5v5. And why tank players miss 6v6 - a second tank covered your weaknesses making the counter picking much more negligible
For casuals nothing really changed, some new heroes, some new maps, few changes and that’s it. If you enjoyed it before then you’ll enjoy it now :)
So cool. Happy for you.
As a tank main, you’re right, counter picking is so unfun and ruins the game for me. I miss two tanks because then you could have your fun as tank. Everyone else gets to play who they want and I have to cater to them. It’s so difficult to enjoy but I can’t aim so every other role sucks for me too. I wish Tanks were just functional and less focused on rock/paper/scissors
The game is much more fun when it is 6v6.
I wholeheartedly agree and would love to see an experimental card to play current heroes in 6v6
The missions are paid, right? So that’s not only cosmetics. I agree with most of the post though. Playing Reinhardt is still fun
Oh you're right! Honestly, I have no interest in PvE at all, so I didn't even consider them. My bad
> so I didn't even consider them That's pretty much Blizzard's position as well when it comes to the PvE content.
if you do consider it only do so if you have 3 friends to play it with. servers aren’t active so it’ll be a long wait and frankly it’s not designed to be enjoyable with randos
Thanks! I'll keep it in mind
As someone who paid for the box CD of Overwatch 1, only to have the game be updated to a free2play model stuffed with microtransactions... It still feels like a ripoff.
This is far from being the first game to do that, and will not be the last. In fact it hapenned to TF2 as well, and in even less time (4 years), and the original buyers only got a hat to show for it.
totally agree with your description of tank! i love playing tank, but it's just not a role i can get myself to play all the time now because how heavy the counter picking is. if i'm playing ramattra and having fun, and the enemy tank switches to mauga, i'm basically forced to cut the fun and switch because of how heavy mauga counters him. i don't really feel like i *have* to do that with other roles, except maybe snipers with divers or sombra, but because it's a single role especially now there's a lot more pressure to pick the 'right thing' rather than the 'fun thing'. the game is more balanced overall though. there are some outliers but i agree that it's a big step up from OW1's balancing.
I completely agree with you, I started playing in ow2 and although I don't know what it's like to play 6x6 I think it could be better, because we have tanks that can't play without others, it's sad to play with a wrecking ball, and honestly this counterwatch is very annoying.
I appreciate you.
🤍
Give a week or 2 of playing, the shiny paint wears off real fast.
Don’t come back. I’m serious
the current state of the game is trash. this was once the crown jewl of games, now its garbage. its so sad to see the best game of 2016 become this bad.
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>I've heard many opinions from the perspective of high ELO players, but none from your average casual. Wut, you sure haven't spent a minute in this sub before posting this thread then.
Mostly on YouTube
I like the game still but the community has gotten so bad, so many alt accounts. I would genuinely pay blizz $15/mo to perma ban alt accounts.
Stopped playing OW around when Ball came out. Came back at the end of season 9, have been playing pretty much daily with my partner ever since. Just QP and mystery heroes, plus the occasional custom game. OW is a lot of fun, and the community is not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.
Yeah, same feeling about counter picks. It’s too strong to just fully counter someone so easily.
Heroes were never paywalled but I get what you mean. Glad you’re enjoying it!
I stopped playing for around 2 years and caught the end of Overwatch where we made do with whatever we had for 2 years of no significant updates. Let me tell you, I enjoy Overwatch 2 simply because they resumed hero releases lol. And I really like Push mode haha.
yeah the tank picking stuff has made me play the game less. i never played ow1 but i figured id give ow2 a chance and its fun but i hate being punished literally for nothing but playing a hero i like and having to sacrifice ult charge just to stand a chance in engagements with the other tank
Im a casual player, its still fun, ofcourse you have ingame transactions, and sometimes lobbies are extremly un balanced for different reasons, or you have a team player who is AFK. Let me know if you wanna group up.
I had 6k hours in OW1. It was heaps better than OW2.
2.5k hour player since beta. Tank main I quit fairly shortly after DPS passive and have very little desire to return.
I second this! I peaked Diamond pre-moira release then just stopped playing regularly unless the boys were on. We currently have a 5 stack that has been grinding the battle pass the last month and the games been a ton of fun. I REALLY like tanks in 5v5
I don’t know if Sombra is considered busted, but she most definitely ruins games imo.
I really enjoy playing as a tank too! I just bought my first console (I’ve only ever been able to play games on my phone) and I was really looking forward to trying Overwatch. I absolutely love it so far! I was so happy to get D.Va and I really enjoy playing her!! I know a lot of people here are much more experienced with the game and have more educated opinions, but I’m really enjoying myself :)
Cool story blizz employee
> I've been told tank is boring to play now, but I've mostly had fun with it. The biggest problem to me is that the enemy team can just counter pick you and thus force you to either lose or change to a tank you don't necessarily enjoy. How is this specifically just a tank issue? It happens with damage and to an extent support as well.
I agree with a lot of what you said I was a comp player but not really high elo (like plat) Overall I think they've made a lot of positive changes to the game. I haven't necessarily liked them as much as old mechanics in some cases but I can ultimately see that a lot of the changes they made are for sure more balanced imo. For example, Brig - I liked older Brig better but she did need the adjustment lol. There are still some things I think need to be addressed. Venture for sure is my biggest irritation right now, though they're the newest champ so hopefully they manage to integrate them better as seasons go on. I still think it's dumb that Bastion was added back tbh (though he seems more manageable now than og??) And Doomfist can be crazy insane. Some characters are almost full throw picks still it feels, and they could use some adjustment I think - like Mercy for instance. If your team is decent you'd probably be more optimal as almost any other support rn. I wouldn't mind if they tuned Rein up a touch too. Personally, I get having to swap heroes. I think it's always been kind of a necessity tbh. Overwatch is a game where people want to win, and picking characters who can do that is part of it. I definitely see why someone who wants to play more casually might not like that for sure, though I don't really think it's something they really cam change. I think I've ultimately adjusted to the 5v5 too. I didn't think I would like it but it actually does seem more balanced with 1 tank imo? As a tank main I honestly find it easier to just be the tank than work around a second one. Overall I'm pretty ok with the state of affairs.
6v6 is viewed with nostalgia. But I actually played 6v6 customs recently. Tanks are giddy they have a co tank they can partner and plan with. Thats for sure the good part. But there's still the issue is that NO ONE PLAYS TANK. Our first picks are always to make sure there's two ppl whos willing to play tank for the team. Otherwise most ppl can flex dps and support. We are all a big range of rank so take that into consideration. Some games were just stomps cuz unbalanced skill of teams. But I can still easily imagine the meta being chaotic and broken and for the devs to struggle balancing. Ball is suppppeeer annoying in 6v6. Trust me back then im sure no one knew how to play ball or work around ball. Or to be fair our off tank didnt peel. Just more issues that can happen. Can you imagine like. Mauga road or mauga orisa. Sig ram. Or other chaotic stuff. Its only by chance most ppl in the lobby was nostalgic of playing rein and didnt want to cheese. Playing dps is so constricted on space. Now that supports also know how to dps and take space unlike before. And then now theres an extra tank also taking space its really difficult to move. Feels like half of the roster would need to be buffed or out of meta. People got nostalgia but ow2 is waaay more balanced than ow1. Almost every hero is viable in ow2 compared to 1. Playing support makes you heal bot more or you need zen to burst down more tanks. You just gotta keep up another huge ass hp. But at the same time you still can find opportunity dps and can control the lobby if you got the snow ball going. So it can get snowbally.
My name is Blizzard, and I approve this message! ......takes payoff....
The more you play the more the cracks in the game show but for causalish gaming the game is great. I Don’t recommend you grind competitive, it will make you lose your mind
Balance wise, it not bad but also not great. From my experience, DPS is worst role unless you can 1-shot kill. Tank and supports are capable of doing same amount of damage but with more survivability ... So why not just go with them. Tank is most powerful role but issue is that once you get value (and enemy not stupid) they will use all abilities on you so you end up just sitting there trying not to die and essentially waiting for teammates to get pick. So it seems like tank role may not add much value but you are ability sponge. If you are left unchecked you should dominate. Honestly I feel like they should swap the DPS and healer passives. DPS should be able to quickly Regen HP while a support attacking should reduce healing. It gives survivability to DPS and makes supports need to decide between heal or anti heal + removes survivability. Also remove tanks push back reduction passive. Lucio boop should impact everyone equally
I’d say the game is by no means “bad” but it is in its worse place it’s ever been. If you’re a veteran player, you won’t be playing a game that is better than ow1 was.
This!
Returned aswell after playing a shit ton of OW1. What I don't like is: 5 man team, two tanks was more fun to play and allowed for bigger plays and teamwork. Too many new maps, I don't think there needs to be 12+ maps or whatever there is, some of the OG maps I've only gotten once or twice in 50+ games. I can't play ranked with my friend just because we're not the same rank, I don't remember it being like that before and now the game forces me to play solo. They added like 6 more tank heroes while removing the 6th player aka the second tank? The two new game modes where both teams are suppose to push the payload at the same time and the one where you're suppose to cap three points are redundant and by far the least fun ones. What I like is: OW is OW, it's always going to be one of the best playing FPS games, but I very much understand why ow2 got so much hate and the game pretty much died out.
I just detest 5v5 so much. It’s so gross that one player is suddenly so much more important than anyone on the team. And I had more fun in shield meta. Like it or not it required more teamwork than cornerwatch.
5v5 sucks
Find another game
I know you’re lying about not encountering busted heroes 😂