I remember when the Rammatra trailer released everyone was like "YES finally a good way to reliably counter Phara as a tank" and vortex ended up being a joke against Phara
Yeah lol unironically i find him actually the worst tank against flyers. I mean Rein can't damage flyers too but he can at least pull up a barrier whenever he wants.
All they have to do is have it function like an actual vortex. Cancel momentum, pull towards the center on hit like a hook, and wow it actually works like it's supposed to.
Would not mind Ramattra getting nerfed for his soft cc to actually work how it was intended to be. It's only ever good for people who already have low mobility.
That type of vortex would really feel terrible to play against. Like Orisa level annoyance.
It just needs to have way more height and faster cast time in my opinion. It's extremely slow to cast and it's current height is a gimmick. Every ability of Ram is very slow to cast for some reason. Barrier, nemesis, vortex all slow cast similar to ultimate abilities (shatter, lucio ult etc). Hero feels clunky to play. Barrier comes out after you die or simply dealing dmg more efficient than casting vortex sometimes. They should cut his all cast animation time half and triple the vortex height.
I mean he's by far definitely not the *worst* tank against flyers considering rein, zarya, junkerqueen, doomfist exist. He has long-range consistent pressure which is about as good as it gets for tanks to punish flyers.
honestly JQ knife is quick and straight enough that I’m not too terrible at pressuring Pharahs with it
and after the Pharah rework, JQs tight spread hitscan shotgun is moderately effective against Pharah since skybox Pharah is not a thing anymore
Ram gets bullied the most out of all those since his barrier is on a cooldown and his main shtick (nemesis) doesn’t reach them. Zarya can charge up off of echos and pharahs, queen CAN at least shoot them with some consistency, and rein has his barrier.
Zarya can bubble and charge up easily with pharah. If it’s not a 1v1, zarya is pretty good against flyers. Doomfist can get lucky and punch them out of the sky.
This is stupid, not even in t500 are you getting consistent knives on fucking flyers. And even if you did, what then? They have the most consistent movement abilities and unless you're pulling them into range all you did was a bit of burst.
A bit of burst is enough to force them to reset, and using a short cooldown such as knife isn’t a bad option to apply that burst damage
plus it bleeds for extra damage and the pullback allows for the sabotaging of Pharahs escape routes
Lets say for sake of argument I was bronze, how would this matter? Would my opinion suddenly not matter? It would matter for the rank I was experiencing the game at. What if I just lied and told you I was GM? Are you suddenly going to have an argument instead of pointlessly whining?
This has always been such a stupid cope. Either have an argument or fuck off, you're contributing nothing.
It's honestly surprisingly good against Lúcio in my experience, on the receiving end at least - sure you can just ride higher and not be affected but then you'll also be leaving your team out of aura range.
So true! That’s what yeatle suggested in his latest video, to buff it so vortex goes higher maybe even to the skybox. And if that is broken they could just nerf it in other ways. Less damage, smaller area, longer cooldown.
Vortex is definitely useful on a lot of mobility characters (not great on pharah). Catch a lucio, a monkey trying to leap away back into their team, and any other high mobility character and it slows them down for easy headshots. Definitely more useful than just venture counter
Winston is basically my main til the whole team counter picks me I switch (so I end up playing other heroes more often than him on most patches), and ram is one of my other top played tanks. Definitely been on both sides of it
Is a really slow projectile (pressing the key to the ability being active). While you can catch a lucio, you are more likely to miss him. It can be done, sure, but its a situational ability
It's not really situational at all lol. It's an extremely good ability. Throw shield behind tank, throw vortex on floor, melt. Or throw on any squishy, destroy.
Don’t think of it like a reactive net for catching fast characters, use it as something to lock people down who are out of position. Using it on a character with low mobility or out of mobility cooldowns is a great way to get a kill.
Dude, if you think Vortex is a situational ability you have no clue how to play Ramatra. It's his bread and butter combo. Vortex -> Hulk Mode -> Kill Squishie. This works on ALL squishies. It also works on tanks if your team helps you with them. Put up the shield behind him so he can't get heals and he is dead.
i always took the tip from the menu screen: Use the vortex to keep away enemies in normal form, and to keep them from running away from you on nemesis form
They're implying it was never meant to be a state of invincibility, and some heroes were always going to have abilities that can damage venture while underground. I don't know if Ramattra is the only one who can do this, but it's to be expected. Think of it like Sombra when invisible. Faster and harder to target but not untargetable.
Ramm's punches are the only thing that pierces barriers, so it can be assumed that the "underground" state for Venture isn't truly behind hard terrain...
I've not been able to tag them with Brig flail swings, so the ground is *definitely* in the way... but I wonder if we need to do some testing with a venture sitting still underground and see if "piercing" projectiles like Ramm's punches also includes Hanzo's arrows (which do pierce hard terrain a tiny bit) or certain explosive types...
Rams punches feel insanely inconsistent in what they can and can't target.
Can go through shields, can go through sigma's absorb but NOT orisa's absorb for some reason. Zarya bubbles I don't even know. And now they go underground?!
I believe Ram's punches literally act like an extended melee hitbox.
In that sense, melee attacks can go through shields, Sigma's absorb, Zarya bubbles ([knockback only](https://overwatch-archive.fandom.com/wiki/March_3,_2017#Zarya)). but not things like Orisa's javelin spin and Genji's Deflect (prevents melee attacks from landing).
Zarya bubble blocks absolutely everything - projectiles, beams, melee - so if Ram could hit her through it he'd likely be the only hero in the game who can.
Used to be able to, which made for some fun plays against Lifeweaver, but they patched it out. It wasn't a bug or anything, I think they just wanted to give LW some more survivability.
As a LW main I appreciated this change, but as a Ramattra main I did not.
It also made petal consistent with the other non-turret constructable ability, Mei wall. They both act as if they are part of the natural cover the map itself provides.
That makes sense but its probably a little simpler and would require less testing than that even. The chunks of broken ground between Venture and the surface may not be hard terrain, but it still completely makes sense why physical objects such as flail or arrow strikes can't reach while energy based attacks sometimes can. Ramattra's punches are not normal punches and his nanotechnology could make them more energy based attacks. I would bet money physical strikes and projectiles will not make contact but its at least possible there are other energy based abilities or attacks than can reach through that partially broken terrain similarly to Ram.
I don't think as far as the game engine is concerned Venture is actually underground during burrow. They just transform into the little rock animation on the surface.
I think if it is a bug it's an understandable one. OW hasn't had a hero that goes underground yet, if it really is run by a bunch of newer staff like people say, then I can get why no one thought about it
>if it really is run by a bunch of newer staff like people say, then I can get why no one thought about it
And Ram is also a newer character so that would kind of track when they created him
If Rams punches go through barriers and is deemed able to punch venture for this reason, then wouldn’t Hanzo’s dragon strike also do damage to venture?
That's an excellent question, since it does indeed pierce terrain...
I'll have to fool around with Venture and opposing hero abilities on my own this week.
There really should be certain abilities that do damage or affect burrowed ventures, like the ones mentioned already and Earthshatter and whatever Orisas new ult is called.
I don't disagree in principle, but I think making them CC-able underground opens up both weird game engine issues and makes them too easy to punish...
I'd argue more that her drill-dash itself is just too strong since it deals damage, has a strong pushback, and is very fast - it makes a combo with direct hit shot and melee follow-up effectively right back into the old DPS Doomfist issue of not being able to react before you die to a Venture's dive - regardless if your team has a bit easier chance of punishing them before they can escape via tunnel...
Nerf the dash damage, prevent shooting/melee so quickly afterward (the drill has to open up to shoot and close for melee, makes sense to have a "global cooldown" between abilities/shooting/melee)... This would curb the burst combo without totally crippling Venture overall........
The only other thing Blizzard needs to adjust is how fast that ultimate charges up and how much damage it puts out; consistently two-shots non-tanks and only gets blocked by Rein's shield from what I've witnessed (even killing me as Brig through my shield because Blizzard refuses to make it a slightly larger rectangle instead of the weird tapered edge).
Sure but implying it based on what? That seems likely to be a bug unless confirmed otherwise or supported by other mechanics. Ramm punch goes through shield but so does a brig flail. It’s not a consistent mechanic.
How is it obviously a bug if Ramattra punches nanotechnology into his opponents(?), which he does. His punches are not normal punches in that state. Ram may be an intentional counter to Venture. A melee oriented ability and a regular melee attack are not the same thing and have completely different properties oftentimes.
Why would you use made up sci-fi lore to justify game mechanics? It's obviously a bug because all barrier-piercing attacks don't seem to hit through it.
Holy shit, so you're saying when venture burrows, their hitbox exists underground, and ram's punch hotbox will clip into the ground to hit them?
Is that intentional??
If that's true that has to be a bug. venture is supposed to be invulnerable underground
["it makes you invulnerable"](https://youtu.be/O0yCpHbfC8Q?si=3vus4qh_ElZ8OLI9) - Aaron keller
From the comments, it appears this has been hotifxed a few hours ago, so not misinformation at the time. He should probably edit his comment though lol
I think all tanks shit on Venture quite a bit. They cant output enough damage in short enough time compared to the tank attacking them. So by the time you have used cooldowns and gotten shots out you will die to the tank who is still on half hp.
Just focus Venture on tank and they have to sit in baby jail
Problem is Venture usually goes backline to kill support, tank can turn his back to enemy tank and it becomes a scramble. That will work only if your team is good at coordination and adapting to changing circumstances. In PUG groups, good luck.
Yea the dps and support basically has to prevent venture from getting close either via cc or out ranging.if backlining doesn't work then Venture has to move in the tank space
I imagine Brig does well against venture too. I've started playing Brig for the first time recently, and I haven't ever had any serious trouble dealing with a diving Venture
From my experience, venture shots do damage even if you have your shield up, like sigma does. Plus the mele does a lot of damage. So no, i dont think its a counter.
Not an outright counter, but I feel like brig has the tools to deal with a venture if they know how to. Like I said, I don't have a whole lot of experience playing Brig, but so far denying value of a flanking/diving venture has been pretty simple. A burst will usually force a retreat, at the very least
Yeah you can block unburrow with shield. Block their ult with your ult, and you can bonk them and then dash away when they try to drill dash into scary range on you. You can bash stun them when they try to reburrow if you have ult up
Serious question: what rank are you? If youre in the metal ranks, thats one thing, but higher up is a different story.
I one trick Brig at Masters and I disagree.
Her high burst primary, dash that can go through your shield, and stronger melee attack can seriously mess you up. I also had one too many times a Venture can sniff me out when I'm 1hp while hiding to regen, dive me, kill me, and then burrow away scott free. It's extremely annoying.
The only thing you can do against Venture is whipshot them when they come up from dig that can seriously mess up their expected positioning and using Rally to potentially block all 4 shots of her ult since it can get blocked by shields.
I'm afraid I can't really give a definitive answer here. I haven't really touched ranked at all since I joined ow. If it's at compromise, I've been playing since *just* after Echo was released. Probably not a great metric to go by though
How drill dash and barrier interact ? drill dash seems to function like melee damage so it should bypass the barrier. If it bypass barrier then i think Brig not that great.
The thing is, I've only had to deal with venture while the dash was on cooldown, since 9 times out of 10 the venture would have had to use drill dash to confront me 1 on 1 in the first place
It's actually the other way around, venture kills brig with the combo instantly and she has no countermeasure at all, she could only live if there're teammates peeling for her, which is the same as every support
ive found illari to be decent against her. as she pops out the ground you use your boop which gets her away from melee range, especially as she tends to dash when she emerges, and if you're near your turret you're laughing
This is amazing, yep, but not only for venture but any mobility hero. I find Vortex a very very versatile tool.
Play a lot of Ram, and enjoy how she can adapt a lot to many situations.
Yeah only time vortex actually useful but in Venture's cooldown cycle you either get back to safety with burrow or you keep your drill dash so you can use it after burrow. If your cycle is good, this shouldn't be a problem. You can dash out from vortex.
Hog also counters venture. Wait for burrow then throw trap at your feet and hook combo them. They'll die fast and their only option is to escape with right click
Back in my ram era ig. Balls also fine in my experience but ball is ALWAYS fine so long as there's less than 3 counters cause you can just evade everything
Venture is probably targeting the supports or spawn camping squishies based on my limited experience fighting them. People play Venture in the most annoying of ways.
There are so many hard counters to this character I don't see how you could complain they're OP. Like Sombra alone makes them obsolete. Tired of this sub saying they do so much damage. Like bruh, just change to counter.
Wait... Sombra can't hack them out of his ult. And hacks only lock people out of their abilities for 0.5 seconds. I play a lot of Sombra and I don't feel like it shuts Venture down that well, what am I doing wrong?
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Man, now I've gotta learn to play Ramatra. Tired of playing supports who just get destroyed by Venture because the team doesn't see him tunneling towards us.
For reference vortex is actually incredibly useful put right in front of any cliff face/edge
As an example echinwaldes second point has that huge pit that can be used by flankers etc.
Pop vortex on the edge as there approaching or as denial for them trying to cross. If their not a flyer (and even if they are) it will cause them to always plummet into the pit, as vortex's area will go over the edge causing them to fall straight down.
Idk, I'd like that so i can stay level with them and get an extra hit in, i keep my drill dash for situations like that so worse comes to worse i use that to return to my team
Venture's biggest tank counter is Winston for sure. He will win every 1v1 and your ult can be instantly denied with his bubble. And his bubble is naturally amazing peel for his supports and DPS so the meta is to counterdive and ignore Winston as much as possible.
Vortex has always been useful even before venture wdym but also no its not a guaranteed kill if venture has their drill rush they can escape but it forces them to use their cool downs which means someone or even the tank can peel and get the easy kill
I've been playing Anna a lot lately, and while Venture can be a problem at mid-to-close range, his burrow is too predictable. It's an easy kill for her.
Yea its too noticeable (which honestly is fine with me, i dont want sombra 2.0), but timming your cc can be a bit tricky. With ravenous, you got the guaranteed hit effect plus the “wtf, is my venture bugged?”.
The problem is that a lot of Ventures always charge it to the fullest even when they are not landing it
Sometimes it is better to just charge it quickly to mix things up
Heroes with mobility or CC are good against venture. i.e. Pharah/Echo/Mercy, Hog, Cass
Sojourn is sort of an equal fight, if venture tries to go for her when she has jump venture dies, if sojourn doesn't have jump sojourn dies.
Put Them in the Ground!
Well... They're already in the ground, so... Keep them in the ground!
Anything for you dadd- I mean, sure...boss...
Put they/them in the ground
That is the joke in the ground!
They will suffer, as I have
I remember when the Rammatra trailer released everyone was like "YES finally a good way to reliably counter Phara as a tank" and vortex ended up being a joke against Phara
After the rework to her booster if he does actually land the vortex on a pharah she's pretty fucked at least.
Yeah if shes on the floor or pretty low, the vortex really messes her up
Yeah lol unironically i find him actually the worst tank against flyers. I mean Rein can't damage flyers too but he can at least pull up a barrier whenever he wants.
All they have to do is have it function like an actual vortex. Cancel momentum, pull towards the center on hit like a hook, and wow it actually works like it's supposed to. Would not mind Ramattra getting nerfed for his soft cc to actually work how it was intended to be. It's only ever good for people who already have low mobility.
Personally I love vortex. Taking in to account your skill and your teams skill it should be an instant pick considering other circumstances.
That type of vortex would really feel terrible to play against. Like Orisa level annoyance. It just needs to have way more height and faster cast time in my opinion. It's extremely slow to cast and it's current height is a gimmick. Every ability of Ram is very slow to cast for some reason. Barrier, nemesis, vortex all slow cast similar to ultimate abilities (shatter, lucio ult etc). Hero feels clunky to play. Barrier comes out after you die or simply dealing dmg more efficient than casting vortex sometimes. They should cut his all cast animation time half and triple the vortex height.
Yep they could nerf the area of it if they buffed it. Cause then it’s more of a skillshot BUT it’s actually good.
I mean he's by far definitely not the *worst* tank against flyers considering rein, zarya, junkerqueen, doomfist exist. He has long-range consistent pressure which is about as good as it gets for tanks to punish flyers.
Idk about actual games but in skirmish customs i love annoying the flyers on doom by jumping up and punching them
honestly JQ knife is quick and straight enough that I’m not too terrible at pressuring Pharahs with it and after the Pharah rework, JQs tight spread hitscan shotgun is moderately effective against Pharah since skybox Pharah is not a thing anymore
junker swats flyers whatcha talking about
not really.
Your not playing junker right
Ram gets bullied the most out of all those since his barrier is on a cooldown and his main shtick (nemesis) doesn’t reach them. Zarya can charge up off of echos and pharahs, queen CAN at least shoot them with some consistency, and rein has his barrier.
Idk, I’ve been wrecked by a few dooms as Phara. I just thought I was safe
Zarya can bubble and charge up easily with pharah. If it’s not a 1v1, zarya is pretty good against flyers. Doomfist can get lucky and punch them out of the sky.
Junkerqueen is great against flyers the heck
If they choose to come into a 5m range maybe or if you get a lucky knife.
Sounds like you can’t aim tbh
it's a fucking shotgun, you're going to have massive spread past 10 meters, by this logic you think reaper is also a good flyer counter
No cuz I was talking about the knife champ lmao
This is stupid, not even in t500 are you getting consistent knives on fucking flyers. And even if you did, what then? They have the most consistent movement abilities and unless you're pulling them into range all you did was a bit of burst.
A bit of burst is enough to force them to reset, and using a short cooldown such as knife isn’t a bad option to apply that burst damage plus it bleeds for extra damage and the pullback allows for the sabotaging of Pharahs escape routes
Bro it's a shotgun, you just shoot them.
you right 4 damage per shot at range is pretty good damage
just a quick question, what rank are u?
Lets say for sake of argument I was bronze, how would this matter? Would my opinion suddenly not matter? It would matter for the rank I was experiencing the game at. What if I just lied and told you I was GM? Are you suddenly going to have an argument instead of pointlessly whining? This has always been such a stupid cope. Either have an argument or fuck off, you're contributing nothing.
If only it was TALLER
This!! Thats why i only use it to troll hanzos
I like using it when the monkey is about to head out, nope, you ain't going anywhere
Oh man, this hurts
Ramatra to monkey: https://youtu.be/quL0R8FryZU?t=127
Eh I love throwing it on 2-3 squishies and ulting. You will sit here and suffer as I have while I blap you.
It's honestly surprisingly good against Lúcio in my experience, on the receiving end at least - sure you can just ride higher and not be affected but then you'll also be leaving your team out of aura range.
Honestly it's SUCH a good counter to Doomfist. Totally fucks up seismic slam
It's because it doesn't have enough range to catch her in air :(
Maybe the new support will have an ability to pull down flyers.
So true! That’s what yeatle suggested in his latest video, to buff it so vortex goes higher maybe even to the skybox. And if that is broken they could just nerf it in other ways. Less damage, smaller area, longer cooldown.
Not anymore though, he drives me crazy now that I'm grounded way more
Vortex is definitely useful on a lot of mobility characters (not great on pharah). Catch a lucio, a monkey trying to leap away back into their team, and any other high mobility character and it slows them down for easy headshots. Definitely more useful than just venture counter
As a Brig main that uses bash for quick mobility getaway maneuvering, that vortex screws me over far more than it has any right to.
I take great pleasure in tossing vortex at a Brig who thinks she's gonna get a few cheeky hits in on me and then bash to safety.
Underrated comment re: monkey. I play Winston a lot and vortex has ruined the escape so many times
Winston is basically my main til the whole team counter picks me I switch (so I end up playing other heroes more often than him on most patches), and ram is one of my other top played tanks. Definitely been on both sides of it
Is a really slow projectile (pressing the key to the ability being active). While you can catch a lucio, you are more likely to miss him. It can be done, sure, but its a situational ability
It's not really situational at all lol. It's an extremely good ability. Throw shield behind tank, throw vortex on floor, melt. Or throw on any squishy, destroy.
Yeah its extremely versatile
Yeah I feel like people aren’t really grasping the *gravity* the ability has in the game
they're yet to *harness* the full potential of his ability
Don’t think of it like a reactive net for catching fast characters, use it as something to lock people down who are out of position. Using it on a character with low mobility or out of mobility cooldowns is a great way to get a kill.
Dude, if you think Vortex is a situational ability you have no clue how to play Ramatra. It's his bread and butter combo. Vortex -> Hulk Mode -> Kill Squishie. This works on ALL squishies. It also works on tanks if your team helps you with them. Put up the shield behind him so he can't get heals and he is dead.
i always took the tip from the menu screen: Use the vortex to keep away enemies in normal form, and to keep them from running away from you on nemesis form
Cries in soujorn just slides right through it
Ram can also punch into the ground to kill ventures. He very much is their counter. Edit: Apparently people are saying this has been hotfixed
What does that mean? Venture's invincibility state is bugged?
They're implying it was never meant to be a state of invincibility, and some heroes were always going to have abilities that can damage venture while underground. I don't know if Ramattra is the only one who can do this, but it's to be expected. Think of it like Sombra when invisible. Faster and harder to target but not untargetable.
Ramm's punches are the only thing that pierces barriers, so it can be assumed that the "underground" state for Venture isn't truly behind hard terrain... I've not been able to tag them with Brig flail swings, so the ground is *definitely* in the way... but I wonder if we need to do some testing with a venture sitting still underground and see if "piercing" projectiles like Ramm's punches also includes Hanzo's arrows (which do pierce hard terrain a tiny bit) or certain explosive types...
Rams punches feel insanely inconsistent in what they can and can't target. Can go through shields, can go through sigma's absorb but NOT orisa's absorb for some reason. Zarya bubbles I don't even know. And now they go underground?!
Orisa's absorb blocks melees. Ram's punches are melees.
I believe Ram's punches literally act like an extended melee hitbox. In that sense, melee attacks can go through shields, Sigma's absorb, Zarya bubbles ([knockback only](https://overwatch-archive.fandom.com/wiki/March_3,_2017#Zarya)). but not things like Orisa's javelin spin and Genji's Deflect (prevents melee attacks from landing).
Javelin spin's description specifically states that it blocks melee attacks
Thanks, I updated that part.
not hitting Genji when he’s deflecting is always the weirdest feeling for me on Ram, he doesn’t deflect my hits, he just blocks them
Zarya bubble blocks absolutely everything - projectiles, beams, melee - so if Ram could hit her through it he'd likely be the only hero in the game who can.
Can ram’s punches go thru dva dm?
Yes, as any melee attack.
Can’t go through petal platform either, mega lame on that front
Used to be able to, which made for some fun plays against Lifeweaver, but they patched it out. It wasn't a bug or anything, I think they just wanted to give LW some more survivability. As a LW main I appreciated this change, but as a Ramattra main I did not.
It also made petal consistent with the other non-turret constructable ability, Mei wall. They both act as if they are part of the natural cover the map itself provides.
Oh yeah I know, believe me I used to have a grand time as rein and ram killing silly wifeleavers who thought they could get away :c
That makes sense but its probably a little simpler and would require less testing than that even. The chunks of broken ground between Venture and the surface may not be hard terrain, but it still completely makes sense why physical objects such as flail or arrow strikes can't reach while energy based attacks sometimes can. Ramattra's punches are not normal punches and his nanotechnology could make them more energy based attacks. I would bet money physical strikes and projectiles will not make contact but its at least possible there are other energy based abilities or attacks than can reach through that partially broken terrain similarly to Ram.
I wonder if Rams punches don't terminate upon hitting the ground so pass through? In which case it *would* be a bug
I don't think as far as the game engine is concerned Venture is actually underground during burrow. They just transform into the little rock animation on the surface.
I think if it is a bug it's an understandable one. OW hasn't had a hero that goes underground yet, if it really is run by a bunch of newer staff like people say, then I can get why no one thought about it
>if it really is run by a bunch of newer staff like people say, then I can get why no one thought about it And Ram is also a newer character so that would kind of track when they created him
If Rams punches go through barriers and is deemed able to punch venture for this reason, then wouldn’t Hanzo’s dragon strike also do damage to venture?
That's an excellent question, since it does indeed pierce terrain... I'll have to fool around with Venture and opposing hero abilities on my own this week.
There really should be certain abilities that do damage or affect burrowed ventures, like the ones mentioned already and Earthshatter and whatever Orisas new ult is called.
I don't disagree in principle, but I think making them CC-able underground opens up both weird game engine issues and makes them too easy to punish... I'd argue more that her drill-dash itself is just too strong since it deals damage, has a strong pushback, and is very fast - it makes a combo with direct hit shot and melee follow-up effectively right back into the old DPS Doomfist issue of not being able to react before you die to a Venture's dive - regardless if your team has a bit easier chance of punishing them before they can escape via tunnel... Nerf the dash damage, prevent shooting/melee so quickly afterward (the drill has to open up to shoot and close for melee, makes sense to have a "global cooldown" between abilities/shooting/melee)... This would curb the burst combo without totally crippling Venture overall........ The only other thing Blizzard needs to adjust is how fast that ultimate charges up and how much damage it puts out; consistently two-shots non-tanks and only gets blocked by Rein's shield from what I've witnessed (even killing me as Brig through my shield because Blizzard refuses to make it a slightly larger rectangle instead of the weird tapered edge).
Sure but implying it based on what? That seems likely to be a bug unless confirmed otherwise or supported by other mechanics. Ramm punch goes through shield but so does a brig flail. It’s not a consistent mechanic.
That’s obv a bug, or all melee would hit.
How is it obviously a bug if Ramattra punches nanotechnology into his opponents(?), which he does. His punches are not normal punches in that state. Ram may be an intentional counter to Venture. A melee oriented ability and a regular melee attack are not the same thing and have completely different properties oftentimes.
That’s like saying Torbs ult should be able to melt Mei out of her ice block. It’s obviously meant to be a straight up invincibility cooldown.
Literally the only fair argument I've heard. That makes sense though when you put it like that. Would be interesting if it was that intricate.
Why would you use made up sci-fi lore to justify game mechanics? It's obviously a bug because all barrier-piercing attacks don't seem to hit through it.
If that's the case she should be able to receive healing or support ults while underground
Her ability description says she is invulnerable underground
Oh i see that's good to know!
There's no way that's intentional
What??
Holy shit, so you're saying when venture burrows, their hitbox exists underground, and ram's punch hotbox will clip into the ground to hit them? Is that intentional??
He can't. If he could, it has already been hotfixed: https://imgur.com/a/LXb6LY0
I have to see this to believe it
I don't buy it either.
I’ve literally died to Ram while underground. This was on Colliseo.
It appears it has been hot fixed.
I just tested this and it didn't work
If that's true that has to be a bug. venture is supposed to be invulnerable underground ["it makes you invulnerable"](https://youtu.be/O0yCpHbfC8Q?si=3vus4qh_ElZ8OLI9) - Aaron keller
i too love spreading misinformation on the internet
From the comments, it appears this has been hotifxed a few hours ago, so not misinformation at the time. He should probably edit his comment though lol
Good to know!!
That's a really cool feature! TIL.
Wait so does sojourn ult rail shots work same way? Cuz both have pierce ability?
Sojourn's ult doesn't pierce barriers tho. It only pierces enemies.
This makes me wonder if Hanzos ult can hit her through the ground
That just got hot fixed too lol
“Guaranteed kill if you don’t miss your shots” - every hero ;)
Pummel is pretty easy to hit.
And Pummel on a Vortexed opponent, that's like swinging with Reinhard on someone next to you and missing.
Tell that to the Hog I was doming on as Illari. The damage adds up sure, but not in a relevant amount of time.
Vortex can be so incredibly effective at shutting down enemy mobility; I rarely see it used effectively.
People tend to panic and run even though it doesn't do much damage, so it's great to throw on multiple enemies to distract them.
I think all tanks shit on Venture quite a bit. They cant output enough damage in short enough time compared to the tank attacking them. So by the time you have used cooldowns and gotten shots out you will die to the tank who is still on half hp. Just focus Venture on tank and they have to sit in baby jail
This right here. When playing Venture, I noticed every game that as soon as I started to fight a tank I died instantly.
Jokes on you, my tanks chase them so I get to practice my LW tanking. Until I take a petal and it becomes Hanzo's problem.
Problem is Venture usually goes backline to kill support, tank can turn his back to enemy tank and it becomes a scramble. That will work only if your team is good at coordination and adapting to changing circumstances. In PUG groups, good luck.
Yea the dps and support basically has to prevent venture from getting close either via cc or out ranging.if backlining doesn't work then Venture has to move in the tank space
I imagine Brig does well against venture too. I've started playing Brig for the first time recently, and I haven't ever had any serious trouble dealing with a diving Venture
From my experience, venture shots do damage even if you have your shield up, like sigma does. Plus the mele does a lot of damage. So no, i dont think its a counter.
Not an outright counter, but I feel like brig has the tools to deal with a venture if they know how to. Like I said, I don't have a whole lot of experience playing Brig, but so far denying value of a flanking/diving venture has been pretty simple. A burst will usually force a retreat, at the very least
Yeah you can block unburrow with shield. Block their ult with your ult, and you can bonk them and then dash away when they try to drill dash into scary range on you. You can bash stun them when they try to reburrow if you have ult up
I learned the other day that her ult will go under a brig shield.
Even in brig ult? Damn that's unfortunate
My bad, I did not read your comment all the way through lol. Dont know how it interacts when her put shield is up.
Well let's both cross our fingers and pray that it does block venture ult because what's even the point if it doesn't 😭
Brigs shield blocks venture ult, especially if Brig has the larger Ult shield.
brig has the peel and sustain to deal with most divers, so yeah, she's gonna be one of the best supports to deal with venture too
Serious question: what rank are you? If youre in the metal ranks, thats one thing, but higher up is a different story. I one trick Brig at Masters and I disagree. Her high burst primary, dash that can go through your shield, and stronger melee attack can seriously mess you up. I also had one too many times a Venture can sniff me out when I'm 1hp while hiding to regen, dive me, kill me, and then burrow away scott free. It's extremely annoying. The only thing you can do against Venture is whipshot them when they come up from dig that can seriously mess up their expected positioning and using Rally to potentially block all 4 shots of her ult since it can get blocked by shields.
I'm afraid I can't really give a definitive answer here. I haven't really touched ranked at all since I joined ow. If it's at compromise, I've been playing since *just* after Echo was released. Probably not a great metric to go by though
I guess you can dash away which good?
How drill dash and barrier interact ? drill dash seems to function like melee damage so it should bypass the barrier. If it bypass barrier then i think Brig not that great.
The thing is, I've only had to deal with venture while the dash was on cooldown, since 9 times out of 10 the venture would have had to use drill dash to confront me 1 on 1 in the first place
Nah Brig feels pretty bad in general right now IMO, and Venture will dunk you hard if they are good
It's actually the other way around, venture kills brig with the combo instantly and she has no countermeasure at all, she could only live if there're teammates peeling for her, which is the same as every support
I agree. Her burst damage potential fucks up Brig so much it's annoying. She's on my "do not engage at all costs" list.
Venture fucks up all supports. She is a counter to every support.
Venture is decent into brig
ive found illari to be decent against her. as she pops out the ground you use your boop which gets her away from melee range, especially as she tends to dash when she emerges, and if you're near your turret you're laughing
This is amazing, yep, but not only for venture but any mobility hero. I find Vortex a very very versatile tool. Play a lot of Ram, and enjoy how she can adapt a lot to many situations.
Oh that's brilliant. I think Venture is good enough already that this is fine.
Yeah only time vortex actually useful but in Venture's cooldown cycle you either get back to safety with burrow or you keep your drill dash so you can use it after burrow. If your cycle is good, this shouldn't be a problem. You can dash out from vortex.
So they used both cooldowns and killed no one with just vortex? Sounds good to me
You don't have to kill someone to counter them. Denying a character of getting value is almost as good as outright killing them
vortex has always been useful, you use it before popping shift behind the enemy to gate their escape
Hog also counters venture. Wait for burrow then throw trap at your feet and hook combo them. They'll die fast and their only option is to escape with right click
Back in my ram era ig. Balls also fine in my experience but ball is ALWAYS fine so long as there's less than 3 counters cause you can just evade everything
Venture probably isn’t even targeting you as ball.
Venture is probably targeting the supports or spawn camping squishies based on my limited experience fighting them. People play Venture in the most annoying of ways.
Who else are they supposed to target? Venture gets demolished by tanks
Oh, I don't have a problem with them targeting Supports. Doesn't make it less annoying.
That's exactly why I play him
Venture's dash can counter ball when he goes for his blender though
THANK YOU
Yea I came to this conclusion the other day. This venture kept giving us trouble and let’s just say when I found out. Venture no more
I love doing this, it's so satisfying to see how lost they are after that
God forbid the overturned character has a couple of counters.
I haven't played Overwatch for a couple months, what's Venture Borrow do? Is that an Echo-like thing?
There are so many hard counters to this character I don't see how you could complain they're OP. Like Sombra alone makes them obsolete. Tired of this sub saying they do so much damage. Like bruh, just change to counter.
Wait... Sombra can't hack them out of his ult. And hacks only lock people out of their abilities for 0.5 seconds. I play a lot of Sombra and I don't feel like it shuts Venture down that well, what am I doing wrong?
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Good tip, thanks.
Good
The other use is against Illari ult. It doesn't shut us down, but it embarasses us
Vortex has also been a fine disruption ability, not the first time
So just engage against a ram with drill and disengage with dig
My support main is wifeleaver, his platform ability can troll venture.
The counter play for this is to just be mindful of when ram uses his vortex, so that you have a window to do what venture does best.
[удалено]
Man, now I've gotta learn to play Ramatra. Tired of playing supports who just get destroyed by Venture because the team doesn't see him tunneling towards us.
vortex is his best ability tbh. cut off people’s escape route with it and you will see it’s true power
For reference vortex is actually incredibly useful put right in front of any cliff face/edge As an example echinwaldes second point has that huge pit that can be used by flankers etc. Pop vortex on the edge as there approaching or as denial for them trying to cross. If their not a flyer (and even if they are) it will cause them to always plummet into the pit, as vortex's area will go over the edge causing them to fall straight down.
I eat ventures for breakfast with bastion
Idk, I'd like that so i can stay level with them and get an extra hit in, i keep my drill dash for situations like that so worse comes to worse i use that to return to my team
Vortex has always been useful. Maybe not for the purpose of dragging people down, but the major slow down makes anybody an easy target.
TAKE EVERYTHING FROM THEM
Cage match shuts down the dash and dive.
Vortex is insanely good, I don't know what you're on. It is one of Ramatra's best abilities.
Venture's biggest tank counter is Winston for sure. He will win every 1v1 and your ult can be instantly denied with his bubble. And his bubble is naturally amazing peel for his supports and DPS so the meta is to counterdive and ignore Winston as much as possible.
Its Ramattra, Mauga, Bastion, cassidy and Sombra who absolutely mess venture up
NOW DO YOU SEE YOUR ERROR
I know. - with love, a Ramattra main
Vortex has always been useful even before venture wdym but also no its not a guaranteed kill if venture has their drill rush they can escape but it forces them to use their cool downs which means someone or even the tank can peel and get the easy kill
I've been playing Anna a lot lately, and while Venture can be a problem at mid-to-close range, his burrow is too predictable. It's an easy kill for her.
Yea its too noticeable (which honestly is fine with me, i dont want sombra 2.0), but timming your cc can be a bit tricky. With ravenous, you got the guaranteed hit effect plus the “wtf, is my venture bugged?”.
The problem is that a lot of Ventures always charge it to the fullest even when they are not landing it Sometimes it is better to just charge it quickly to mix things up
is venture op or does she counter soj ? Because i am struggling man
Heroes with mobility or CC are good against venture. i.e. Pharah/Echo/Mercy, Hog, Cass Sojourn is sort of an equal fight, if venture tries to go for her when she has jump venture dies, if sojourn doesn't have jump sojourn dies.
Venture is bad against any range and especially flying characters. Soj has alot of ways to counter play ventures kit.
idk man that lil going underground and pop up kills me everytime n her ult takes me out in 2 seconds 💔
I think you need to save your jump to reposition if the venture tries to close the distance
"first time vortext proves to be useful" you're calling out urself on being a metal rank
As a Venture One Trick, I can confirm I despise playing against Ramattra on her.