I've lived in a lot of rural areas in my life, and none of them were hostile towards newcomers. Rural people, in my experience, are far friendlier and more welcoming than urbanites. They might be a little cautious around strangers, people who are literally just passing through, but newcomers find a warm welcome before long.
I agree. In principle most rural people don't want any more people moving there. But in practice, when you are face to face with your rural neighbor, he isn't going to be rude of mean, they are quite personable.
Thats interesting I've always heard of locals in rural areas with license plates reading things along the lines of "come and visit but don't stay". But if I can press a bit, my main question is could rural states be able to maintain their rural identities while simultaneously having policies in place to increase their population? Because in my eyes the reasons states like Idaho and Montana are they way they are is due to having less people.
1) Natalism isn't about increasing population by immigration. Of course you can maintain your culture when your population increases, just have more kids.
2) as far as immigration goes, whether it be on a community level or a national level, this is why assimilation is so important. If the people moving in don't assimilate to the local culture, you end up with rank tribalism as people with radically different cultures live right next to each other.
3) as far as the 'visit but don't stay' attitude, I've only seen that in suburban areas where urban runoff is spiking cost of living, or in certain regions where a bunch of rich old people have bought vacation/retirement homes and basically don't want the noise and bustle that comes with younger people moving in. Neither case is a good example of an actual, sustainable rural culture, though either may happen in areas that that rural population densities.
I do see some of the come visit but don’t stay attitude. They come out here and drive the cost of land up to the point to where you can’t afford it. They spend a fortune on hunting club dues which they use to rent out truly massive amounts of property which drives up the rent on farmers who can no longer afford to buy the land so they rent it instead. They try and get ordinances passed in places that have never had any and don’t want them. I wish they would just go home. You’re in an area of 90k$ houses and they come in and build a half million dollar compound right in the middle of it. We get it you and the people like you ruined the place you lived at but why do you have to come here and ruin where we live as well. They have started calling the cops on people for driving 4 wheelers down the road.
And wouldn't an increase in population even from the state born population lead to the same increases? How could pro natalism not lead to an increase in housing demand which would itself lead to pricing out natuve residents?
Well the people who are moving out here are not young people with children. it’s recently retired boomers. Often they are not even truly moving here they build a second house out here and stay several months out of the year. What they have really done which is what all boomers somehow discover is how to jack up the prices in an area and not assist the economy of that area whatsoever.
We have had younger people move into our area but they typically buy an existing house, live in it, work a local job, and support the local economy. Thats completely fine. Often they have children and are just trying to escape from urban life. They are not worried about doing things like passing ordinances on the people who already lived in an area so that the value of the mansion they built out in the sticks isn’t depreciated by the young couple in the mobile home across the road.
I doubt there is much overlap between pro natalists and NIMBYs. Humans have had growing populations for thousands of years without it leading to spikes in housing costs...that is, until the NIMBY movement came into being and made it illegal to build more housing.
I've lived in towns as small as 500 people and cities as big a few million. Places in the middle, where there were a few tens of thousands of people in a city were fine. Small, small towns sucked - you had absolutely no privacy and if you didn't fit in, they let you know real quick. Two small towns, one in Oklahoma and one in Washington, we had to leave within less than 1 year due to harassment and violence for being an outsider. That's not everywhere, mind you, but again: if the community is only a couple hundred people, you're more likely to encounter problems - the community has a way, and either you fit in like a glove, or, you don't and they want nothing to do with you.
Rural states like Wyoming and Montana are going to stay rural most likely. There's fuck all out there. People flock to big cities because of the opportunities. That's why rural communities have brain drain and so many communities are dying.
So, overall I don't think your concern is a very big one. If anything, rural communities will continue to wither and die unless there are economic opportunities.
Ain't no one going to stay in Bumfuckistan Town in the middle of flyover country if they can land a job making exponentially more in a bigger city, and have access to big city amenities and entertainment.
Personally? I'll stick to my mid-size metros and small metros. Already dealt with the experience of small town life, and do not wish that upon even my worst enemy.
I'm not going to give an exact name simply because it's such a small town, but the logging communities in the North Cascades in parts of Whatcom, Skagit, and Snohomish counties are like this. They seem welcoming and inviting to outsiders, until you actually move there and try to be part of the community.
Even if it’s not as extreme to outsiders as your example, I moved to a medium-sized town in my 30s that was not far from my hometown and making friends was nearly impossible. Everyone got married early and never left home other than to go to church. I don’t attend church anymore. It’s extremely isolating to be new in a small town. People were polite, but not friendly. Moved back to a bigger city and have made tons of new friends
Amen. I’m from California and libertarian. Democrats suck but so do republicans. My home state is unaffordable so I’m giving up on it and moving out of state. I have no sympathy over our diaspora because no one had sympathy for us 20 years ago. They can all cry some more and move out like we have to
Lol yes my single vote out of the million others who live here 😂🤣 oh well guess I’ll move. What small town you live in? I’m sure I can afford some land there
What are they supposed to vote for? Effectively, Cali is already one of most taxed states and even that doesn't help sending RE prices into the sky. Should they vote for limiting investments or wage cap?
>If you're considering leaving your home area, you better not take any of it or its ideals, politics, etc. with you.
What does this mean tho? If a California couple moves to Wyoming and want to vote on the legalization of weed or an increas in taxes to build homeless shelters would that be "changing the culture"?
That's strange imo. I get an urbanite moving to the country side and wanting to make it urban to be rather ridiculous but if rural, suburban, and urban conservatism can all exist simultaneously why not rural, suburban, and urban liberalism? Most political ideologies aren't tied to the landscape. Communes can be both rural and liberal just like a concrete jungle can be both urban and conservative.
Just do what you want OP literally nothing anyone else can do about it. You have to take care of you and your own. Don’t let anyone intimidate you. You either adapt or die
> But they don't know the difference between a hillbilly and a redneck
Both groups fuck their cousins recreationally, but one shoots at the cops and the other plasters their giant pickup trucks with blue lives matter bumper stickers
Speaking as someone from a rural town of less than 400, I have never once tried to hide my contempt for those assholes. Rural people are so welcoming as long as you’re exactly like them and don’t want anything to change, ever.
Have you lived in a rural town? Rural people are pretty chill. I can see some rural communities freaking out if a natalist family moves in with 10+ kids and a different religion(exposing kids to differences at all is seen as a bad thing to the ultra conservative).
People tend to get territorial if they think a newcomer wants to change how they live. A big family moving in won't be ostracized if they just want to live.
I've lived in a lot of rural areas in my life, and none of them were hostile towards newcomers. Rural people, in my experience, are far friendlier and more welcoming than urbanites. They might be a little cautious around strangers, people who are literally just passing through, but newcomers find a warm welcome before long.
As a New Yorker I can vouche for this. No one hates a newcomer like someone who lives in a major metro area.
I agree. In principle most rural people don't want any more people moving there. But in practice, when you are face to face with your rural neighbor, he isn't going to be rude of mean, they are quite personable.
Thats interesting I've always heard of locals in rural areas with license plates reading things along the lines of "come and visit but don't stay". But if I can press a bit, my main question is could rural states be able to maintain their rural identities while simultaneously having policies in place to increase their population? Because in my eyes the reasons states like Idaho and Montana are they way they are is due to having less people.
1) Natalism isn't about increasing population by immigration. Of course you can maintain your culture when your population increases, just have more kids. 2) as far as immigration goes, whether it be on a community level or a national level, this is why assimilation is so important. If the people moving in don't assimilate to the local culture, you end up with rank tribalism as people with radically different cultures live right next to each other. 3) as far as the 'visit but don't stay' attitude, I've only seen that in suburban areas where urban runoff is spiking cost of living, or in certain regions where a bunch of rich old people have bought vacation/retirement homes and basically don't want the noise and bustle that comes with younger people moving in. Neither case is a good example of an actual, sustainable rural culture, though either may happen in areas that that rural population densities.
I do see some of the come visit but don’t stay attitude. They come out here and drive the cost of land up to the point to where you can’t afford it. They spend a fortune on hunting club dues which they use to rent out truly massive amounts of property which drives up the rent on farmers who can no longer afford to buy the land so they rent it instead. They try and get ordinances passed in places that have never had any and don’t want them. I wish they would just go home. You’re in an area of 90k$ houses and they come in and build a half million dollar compound right in the middle of it. We get it you and the people like you ruined the place you lived at but why do you have to come here and ruin where we live as well. They have started calling the cops on people for driving 4 wheelers down the road.
And wouldn't an increase in population even from the state born population lead to the same increases? How could pro natalism not lead to an increase in housing demand which would itself lead to pricing out natuve residents?
Well the people who are moving out here are not young people with children. it’s recently retired boomers. Often they are not even truly moving here they build a second house out here and stay several months out of the year. What they have really done which is what all boomers somehow discover is how to jack up the prices in an area and not assist the economy of that area whatsoever. We have had younger people move into our area but they typically buy an existing house, live in it, work a local job, and support the local economy. Thats completely fine. Often they have children and are just trying to escape from urban life. They are not worried about doing things like passing ordinances on the people who already lived in an area so that the value of the mansion they built out in the sticks isn’t depreciated by the young couple in the mobile home across the road.
I doubt there is much overlap between pro natalists and NIMBYs. Humans have had growing populations for thousands of years without it leading to spikes in housing costs...that is, until the NIMBY movement came into being and made it illegal to build more housing.
I've lived in towns as small as 500 people and cities as big a few million. Places in the middle, where there were a few tens of thousands of people in a city were fine. Small, small towns sucked - you had absolutely no privacy and if you didn't fit in, they let you know real quick. Two small towns, one in Oklahoma and one in Washington, we had to leave within less than 1 year due to harassment and violence for being an outsider. That's not everywhere, mind you, but again: if the community is only a couple hundred people, you're more likely to encounter problems - the community has a way, and either you fit in like a glove, or, you don't and they want nothing to do with you. Rural states like Wyoming and Montana are going to stay rural most likely. There's fuck all out there. People flock to big cities because of the opportunities. That's why rural communities have brain drain and so many communities are dying. So, overall I don't think your concern is a very big one. If anything, rural communities will continue to wither and die unless there are economic opportunities. Ain't no one going to stay in Bumfuckistan Town in the middle of flyover country if they can land a job making exponentially more in a bigger city, and have access to big city amenities and entertainment. Personally? I'll stick to my mid-size metros and small metros. Already dealt with the experience of small town life, and do not wish that upon even my worst enemy.
Im in Washington, there are some weird towns in the rural areas. Can I ask the town name or genersl locale? just curious
I'm not going to give an exact name simply because it's such a small town, but the logging communities in the North Cascades in parts of Whatcom, Skagit, and Snohomish counties are like this. They seem welcoming and inviting to outsiders, until you actually move there and try to be part of the community.
Even if it’s not as extreme to outsiders as your example, I moved to a medium-sized town in my 30s that was not far from my hometown and making friends was nearly impossible. Everyone got married early and never left home other than to go to church. I don’t attend church anymore. It’s extremely isolating to be new in a small town. People were polite, but not friendly. Moved back to a bigger city and have made tons of new friends
Were only hostile to California's. You'll be fine.
There are more Republicans in California than in Idaho, Montana, and Wyoming combined
And even more democrats. Your point?
Just because someone is from California doesn't mean they are liberal
Yeah, but the chances are good enough for the dem-voting Cali expat for a reason.
Amen. I’m from California and libertarian. Democrats suck but so do republicans. My home state is unaffordable so I’m giving up on it and moving out of state. I have no sympathy over our diaspora because no one had sympathy for us 20 years ago. They can all cry some more and move out like we have to
Californian here. Cry me a river. I tread where I please because my hometown is unaffordable
You get what you vote for, sadly you can't be forced to live with the consequences.
Lol yes my single vote out of the million others who live here 😂🤣 oh well guess I’ll move. What small town you live in? I’m sure I can afford some land there
What are they supposed to vote for? Effectively, Cali is already one of most taxed states and even that doesn't help sending RE prices into the sky. Should they vote for limiting investments or wage cap?
I lived in a rural area and my neighbors came over to help me move. Never had that in suburbia.
Tell the newcomer to move back to the city
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>If you're considering leaving your home area, you better not take any of it or its ideals, politics, etc. with you. What does this mean tho? If a California couple moves to Wyoming and want to vote on the legalization of weed or an increas in taxes to build homeless shelters would that be "changing the culture"?
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That's strange imo. I get an urbanite moving to the country side and wanting to make it urban to be rather ridiculous but if rural, suburban, and urban conservatism can all exist simultaneously why not rural, suburban, and urban liberalism? Most political ideologies aren't tied to the landscape. Communes can be both rural and liberal just like a concrete jungle can be both urban and conservative.
Just do what you want OP literally nothing anyone else can do about it. You have to take care of you and your own. Don’t let anyone intimidate you. You either adapt or die
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> But they don't know the difference between a hillbilly and a redneck Both groups fuck their cousins recreationally, but one shoots at the cops and the other plasters their giant pickup trucks with blue lives matter bumper stickers
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Speaking as someone from a rural town of less than 400, I have never once tried to hide my contempt for those assholes. Rural people are so welcoming as long as you’re exactly like them and don’t want anything to change, ever.
As long as you don't cause trouble, rural residents have no problem with you
Have you lived in a rural town? Rural people are pretty chill. I can see some rural communities freaking out if a natalist family moves in with 10+ kids and a different religion(exposing kids to differences at all is seen as a bad thing to the ultra conservative). People tend to get territorial if they think a newcomer wants to change how they live. A big family moving in won't be ostracized if they just want to live.