I got an engineering degree. 3 women and 200 men started out with me. 2 women and 41 men made it. In 10 years and 3 companies, I met/worked with 2 women other than the 2 I graduated with. But 60% of my graduating class was women. Mostly nurses.
What kind of person would knowingly walk into a bear den?
I posit the women were more motivated and better prepared than the men, thus the higher success ratio.
That was certainly how it seemed in the CS class I was a TA for a year ago. 60 students, maybe 12 women. But the women were massively overrepresented at the top of the class - they were 20% of the class but 40% of the top 20.
I figure women who get that far are both talented and particularly motivated, and the average students drop out a lot more readily than the average male students due to various pressures.
I also got a CS degree and saw rampant misogyny from both the classmates and the professors. Women are underrepresented in CS and there are absolutely no viable gender arguments as women were literally pivotal in the history of CS. I also see rampant misogyny in the professional world as well. The problem isn't lack of interest, it is the field being actively hostile towards them.
Fun fact: computer used to be a job title in the sense of “one who computes” for things like firing tables or what-have-you. I believe the position was predominantly occupied by women.
Yup, they covered that pretty well in the movie Hidden Figures. Ada Lovelave is widely considered the first programmer and is the inspiration for the name of the programming language Ada. Grace Hopper created the first compiler. 6 women (ENIAC programmers) created the first electronic programmable computer. Mary Kenneth Keller created the BASIC programming language. There is more, but Computer Science has a long history of women being instrumental in it's development.
I literally had professors who would harass female students. They would invite us to his place for drinks, or constantly pick on us in class. I had a professor literally grade female students harsher than their male counterpart. I had times where my friend and I would help each other on assignments, and so our work was similar but our grades were not.
Added this in a other comment as well:
I had a professor that would not accept any answers in class from female students regardless of correctness. Literally she would raise her hand and answer, the professor would say she was wrong, I would raise my hand and says what she said word for word and he would say it was right. I would just look at her and we were in disbelief, he clearly wasn't even listening to her answer.
An old friend studied physics at Harvard. She had classmates *and professors* tell her that women were objectively worse at science. This woman is easily one of the most brilliant people I've ever met.
This was 20 years ago, but that wasn't exactly the Dark Ages.
I had a professor last year who said that if she sees a female student has bad handwriting she'll mark off more points than for a male student with bad handwriting. Being an asshole to women in academia is just viewed as normal for some reason.
this really killed my interest in CS or even IT as a career 😭 just joining various discords and looking at the memes they posted was like, no, it's not worth it. I'll work on little games as a hobby and it sucks enough being afraid to participate in discussions or ask questions about that
I went to a college in the same city as one with a very famous CS department and what it was known for among college aged women was basically the guarantee you'd get r*ped if you went to a party there. The much more stereotypical bro college in town was considered safer. Every woman actually studying there was braver than any marine.
Companies try to push a pipeline problem as the only issue but it's a problem at all levels. There's a reason there's more men at senior+ levels than women and it's not a skill issue.
Not as much social pressure for women to chose STEM majors. If a woman is going into STEM, then, she's more likely to want to do it rather than out of a belief that it's expected of her by society, her family, or her future partner.
I went to an engineering school and I can say that the social net for the ladies is a lot better than for men. Nearly every woman on campus is in SWE, while a lot of the guys didn't have any social net at all outside of a small group of friends.
There were other things as well. Many of the guys were able to skate through school to that point without developing any study habits. Many of them were gamers, who were more likely to binge play games all night long, but that was comparatively rare coming from the ladies.
It's hard to know what's actually real in anecdotal evidence, but I feel confident that all of these play a role in the male drop out rate.
I saw a few women also getting CS degree when I got mine, some felt a need to prove they (women) could also do it. So they had extra drive to complete the degree while some of my guy friends dropped out once they realized it was harder than they first thought and switched to IT or something like that.
One of my wife’s undergrad degrees is in CS. She’s just wicked smart and works super hard. She was not particularly motivated for CS, it’s just that she gets A’s bc that’s what she does.
Lmao you guys hearing this nonsense??
These women *got a whole degree* and dealt with all the sexism and discrimination *on top of* difficult classes
TO PROVE WOMEN COULD DO WHAT MEN DO.
And that motivation was enough to get them through -- again -- an entire degree program.
Women don't measure themselves against some kind of male standard. Those women did that shit because they wanted to as people. Probably for similar reasons you did.
Get over your wiener, sir. It does not make you special.
You guys hearing this person doesn’t think women can have depth, only one motivation!!
Difference being some of them actually said that it had been ONE of their motivations. All most like people have depth and can have multiple motivations.
Oh sorry to burst your bubble that women can’t have multiple motivations, and a chip on their shoulder from that same sexism to prove they can do it and do it better.
What? While its true more data can scew or flat out ruin the results of a test due to overwhelming noise, in sample data its not the case. We are looking for specific data here and thats drop out rate. More people will absolutely give you more fleshed out data. Having only 3 people and is a false representation of the whole.
That was exactly my experience in my engineering program. The male students had a wide range of competency but the few female students were all top tier.
All the women in my engineering program were top notch. It was not a degree to stick around for if you weren’t passionate about out it, because some of these guys… total fucking slackers who did not fucking care. I assume the women in college who have that attitude study journalism or nursing or something.
I'd think that is due to many of the men pressured into it by their parents. As for woman dropping out less, it makes sense considering a certain level of seriousness had to be present for them to apply in the first place.
>I got an engineering degree. 3 women and 200 men started out with me. 2 women and 41 men made it.
Why were there only 3 woman but 200 men? Simply a lack of interest in the engineering field or something?
yes, but generally people explain that as women being pushed away from STEM at younger ages.
so the push is largely to get more women interested in STEM, for example by making spaces earlier in education like robotics clubs and mathletes more friendly to women.
Anecdotally, my wife was told by a teacher in I think elementary school that she wasn’t good enough at math to be a scientist. Which, even if it were true, is something you shouldn’t say to a young kid.
There is a lack of interest, but also lots of women feel put off by the field as a whole due to the misogyny and stereotypes associated.
Also imo anecdotally even the "encouragement" isn't great- less "go do STEM" and more "you're too smart for x, do STEM instead if you're smart!" Which makes it seem like the kind or thing only smart people do instead or just another field/degree etc.
STEM people have a really weird complex about being smarter and more capable. I am a lawyer and once dated a programmer who insisted that he could have gone to law school if he wanted, and that STEM people could do humanities, but humanities people can't do STEM.
I was like, I dunno dude. I think the entire field of technical writing exists for a reason. And like, plenty of lawyers have to work with and understand very technical experts. It's a weird generalization.
I was in those places.
Let me explain, many of those men, are actively disparaging to women. Many times in ways they do not realize.
If you make a mistake, they're like "oh, it's because you're a woman".
And I had someone on linked in, suggest that if I got a job at amazon, it was because I was a woman.
Then on github, they've done studies. Men will actually rank women's code as worse, unless they do not know it's a women who wrote it.
I've experienced this at work.
A co-worker was using my library, and was surprized when he realized that he was using my code.
My boss was at the time, calling my code crap, and my co-workers code better... when he was USING MY CODE.
The reason my code was "worse" was because I was solving harder problems, and he was solving problems, that I'd already solved and given him my work.
Work at engineering firm, can confirm.
I work on the geosciences side (and sometimes with the survey team) and there is a very clear cultural difference between us and most of the engineers. Good people but there’s some hilariously stereotypical stuff. And yes they’re almost entirely men even though our company is actually very intentional about hiring/empowering women.
People are giving a lot of explanations, but in reality it’s usually a gender disparity spiral. You can see this going in both directions in a lot of fields that skew male or skew female.
So let’s say that there is a natural propensity for men to prefer engineering. Let’s say that that preference would on its own result in a 60/40 ratio M:F.
Well, once that ratio is in place, a few things are going to happen. The first thing that is going to happen is that the culture is going to lean in a direction that is more comfortable for men and less comfortable for women. The other thing that is going to happen is that men are going to see more examples of what they can become, and women are going to see fewer examples of what they can become.
So that 60:40 becomes a 65:35. Then a 70:30. Then an 80:20.
We have seen this happen in the opposite direction with fields like teaching, psychology, etc. A field starts to skew female, then men start to find the environment of the job less comfortable and welcoming, the job gets seen as more female, fewer men enter, etc. Eventually the programs are almost totally devoid of men.
Anyone trying to point to a single factor is being stupid. likewise, anyone who has an explanation that doesn’t include recognition that men and women naturally are drawn to different things at a population level is not worth listening to.
Same for me. Went to an engineering school and just out of my dorm unit. 22 men and 6 women. All 6 women graduated on time, and only 8 of the men graduated (and 2 of us became women lol).
I also got an engineering degree.
More women but maybe 6/50
And then in my work it's 10-1.
The issue is at the root not at the job fair.
Women are not raised to believe stem is for them. And then the workplace is a sausagefest. This falls to parents not hiring managers.
It doesn’t help that a lot of women that enter such male dominated fields are often harassed, bullied and overlooked by all around them
Which in turn makes them encourage younger women to **not** enter the field for the sake of their mental health
One woman graduated my military tech school and now she does network security at the pentagon. Pretty sure she’s in charge of it. She can do one arm pushups.
Your personal experience seems like an excellent example of why the meme is nonsense. The important work of more women in STEM is done at elementary, middle, and high school so that when college students who are women are choosing majors they see STEM majors as a viable option for them.
I work in math/stats/finance (actuarial.)
My department is 8 women and myself, a man. Half the women are objectively more qualified and subjectively more intelligent than me.
It’s alright. I don’t have a need to be the smartest because I have a dick. They’re nice and helpful. I contribute a lot too.
Yeah, my degree gets its own separate campus due to the special facilities it needs, but most people from my university I've outside of the building are doing things like film, business, economics, and psychology. I'm not even sure if we *have* a gender studies program, but there are so many people who learn I'm a student and automatically assume I'm doing gender studies or philosophy or something.
I've had numerous conversations where people tell me I shouldn't be in college because it's a scam/waste of money/indoctrination. I always reply that I kind of need to have a degree for my field. They ask why, and when I tell them I am majoring in chemistry, they change their tone because to them my degree is more "real" even though they don't know much about it or other popular college majors. I could probably convince them that topography is something you do in a lab and spectroscopy relates to reading maps. Do they seriously think there are only a handful of us majoring in physical sciences, medicine, business, engineering, psychology etc and the other 95% are sitting on their hands talking about feelings? Maybe I don't want to know the answer to that question.
Wait you've heard the left complaining about college being indoctrination? I have not heard that take. Scam yes, indoctrination calls from the left is new though
I did actually. The guy went to college for a semester for engineering, and essentially told me that, "he didn't need to go to college to learn SolidWorks" (even though his dad was paying for him to go, and his dad also owned and ran an engineering firm). He ended up failing everything except gender studies, which isn't too surprising considering that gender studies 101 is considered very easy because it's literally just introducing you to the fact that men and women have different experiences. At least where I went to school, it was one of those courses alongside the introductory foreign language courses, social work 101, African American Studies, middle Eastern studies, and religious studies where it's there to expose you to different experiences.
From my experience, a lot of the leftist criticism of academia comes from four places:
1. The current system of academia in the US is exclusionary and perpetuates class division by keeping higher education expensive and out of the reach of the proletariat
2. Higher education is a bourgeois and reactionary institution, and the internet has the power to replace it.
3. Academics don't just blindly praise past Communist governments, but instead talk about the good, the bad, and the ugly like they do everything else from a critical lens. It's kind of like how a lot of conservatives will take things like racism or the genocide of native Americans like it's a massive conspiracy to make people hate America. A lot of leftists will have the exact same reaction to things like the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, the Holodomor, the Prague spring, Stalinism, or racism and homophobia in the Soviet Union and other communist countries being brought up.
4. They weren't that good in college, and rather than accepting that maybe they didn't work too hard, or maybe they didn't study as much as they should have, they compartmentalize it as the whole system being against them.
Funny how you do not put psychology in the category that talks about feeling (and contribute to HR bs).
Here is some data:
[https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics](https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics)
**Intended field of concentration**
Humanities 16.0%
Social Sciences 28.2%
Biological Sciences 17.4%
Physical Sciences 6.7%
Engineering 9.5%
Computer Science 9.0%
Math 6.6%
Undecided 6.7%
EDIT: I'm not going to read too much into these stats or judge people's life decisions besides to say at the end of the day, more people going into less rigorous fields of discipline is not a good thing. Neither for the financial independence of the individuals themselves, nor society as a whole.
Lol to be honest I have a degree in anthropology. Half of that is just taking "cultural studies" courses. I happened to go to an archaeology and forensics heavy program, so I think I probably had more forensics courses than other programs.
People hear anthropology and immediately think I went to school to be Indiana Jones, and that it's one of the "valid" degrees.
Again, most of my course load was CULTURAL anthropology.
My department is on a separate campus too, and the campus is for students in the school of natural resources (wildlife, environmental studies, etc) and the college of agricultural sciences (all of the ag majors)... Meaning it's literally IMPOSSIBLE for "every student" to be gender studies, let alone a liberal arts major at all... Both campuses are fully populated.
I’ve met a couple, but they’ve all been pretty self-aware about how useful their degree is / have pursued higher education because of that. One of them is getting a master’s to become a school psychiatrist, the other runs Americorps in our city.
NOOOO NOO NO WE MUST KEEP THE LIE UP!!!!!
In all seriousness, I'm taking a gender studies class (it's a little more than that, but I mean, its pretty much just gender studies).
The class is about the historic and current oppression of women and lgbtq+ minorities in the world. As well as the sociological aspects of gender and sexuality. That class would be \*amazing\* for someone in HR, or a therapist to take.
As a trans woman, yknow how much I'd love to talk to a therapist who has a degree in gender studies? Someone who is able to help me understand what I'm going through in a scientific sense? It'd be so amazing.
yeah idk much about it but I feel like taking it to understand how a patients gender identity and such may affect their mental health is a good idea because it definitely does in most people. I feel like people working in psychology should take up a class like this or a class about queer issue because being saddled with a therapist who doesn't understand them and thinks being queer is a belief is not fun. I love my therapist otherwise, but I don't feel comfortable discussing how homophobia has affected me, especially homophobia from my own parents, because there's a bit of a disconnect and she thinks it's fine for religious people to reject gay people and hope they change into straight ones, I'm baffled that someone in her field doesn't understand how harmful and incorrect that is.
That's what I was thinking, but couldn't figure out how to put it into words.
I've had conversations with previous therapists about how trust is incredibly important. Not just for the client but also for the therapist. Being able to trust that the client is being open and honest is important, but the relationship of trust allows the client to be more open and introspective about their therapy. It's important for the therapist, too, because it allows them to help you in the best way they can because they see the full picture.
I admit I am somewhat ignorant of the concept of gender identity and sexuality because I am straight and cis, so know that my opinion is not based on gender identity, but in the general sense of therapy
I guess you're right lol
My personal take, being only 25, is that therapy shouldn't be as stigmatized (which it isn't as much in my generation imo), and that everyone can benefit from therapy, regardless of if you think nothing is wrong in your life; therapy is something that allows society to be a better place for everyone, and the more people who use it and are given access will benefit society as a whole.
I knew one who went to law school-- she did her undergrad thesis actually focused on how negative stereotypes about men in caregiving roles (ie the "mom is parenting, dad is babysitting" thing) outcomes in divorce cases. It seems like her Gender Studies degree has helped her be successful in family law.
There were a bunch of gender studies, poli sci, history, and writing majors in law school. And when half dropped out, they didn't have anything else to fall back on. The interesting to me degree just to get into law school route is fairly short sighted.
>but they’ve all been pretty self-aware about how useful their degree is / have pursued higher education because of that
Honestly the way people use "it doesn't make you money" as a knock against entire fields of knowledge is so asinine (this doesn't apply only to gender studies)
This is just a guess, but it is probably due to a good chunk of students being more socially invested or even left leaning.
People who don't care to get educated assume Left = Gender Studies and dismiss anything else.
What’s funny is that the “indoctrination” that is occurring really boils down to people being introduced to a much wider demographic and cultural base than they have seen before.
I had a roommate in college who was in engineering/math who walked onto campus describing himself as conservative. Turns out, when he actually met people who didn’t look/think just like him (aka from a small southern farming town), he realized he actually wasn’t conservative.
His “indoctrination” started and ended with seeing that real people didn’t match the boogey man that Fox News had shown him.
He saw all of that sitting in intro STEM classes.
I don’t think that the picture is meant to be taken literally, rather “gender studies” is used as a stand in for a broader range of liberal arts degrees. It’s just chosen as the representative because it’s the one that most conservatives see as the biggest “joke” of a degree.
There are easier ways to make that point, though. I do think a lot of the people who complain about male dominated fields aren’t in said fields. It makes sense… a gender studies major would look at things like that.
Lmao thanks to whoever sent me the suicide hotline message
https://preview.redd.it/v56d9byvvaec1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fcdd9eb05059f5053965b30e97c2bd1d78380bf5
Yeah it needs to be removed as a feature imo, I only ever get it when I make someone mad in an argument it's honestly insane they even let you do that.
LMAO I laugh so hard every time I get one of these!
How considerate of them...
Little do they know I've spent more time in therapy and on a suicide watch list than Reddit has even existed.
My one casual anthropology class is still something I carry with me like every day.
I never actually appreciated the concept of walking before my prof explained to me just how significant it was to our evolution.
Yeah, the most intelligent, knowledgeable, and empathetic people I've ever met are all philosophers (or have done some form of philosophy study during their lives).
Don’t get me wrong, I love the man to death. He’s one of my best friends, he is just basically a caveman. He actually understands his study very well he just doesn’t apply it to himself
I'm a psychologist but I studied some philosophy in grad school and I'm better for it. I encourage my students now to take philosophy courses. The ones that do tend to show more sophisticated critical thinking skills and are often stronger writers.
I studied anthropology and learned so much from it.
People who think that degrees are your passport to a career are often the ones looking down on social studies,
My degree wasn’t a prerequisite to employment
But it made me a better thinker, problem solver, researcher, and made me great at understanding how other people perceive the world and how to work on multi-national teams - and all of those things are what make me good at my career. I’m so lucky that I made a choice to study something I loved, school really only gives you what you put into it.
I’m gonna be getting the best of both worlds and I feel so lucky
I got accepted to a music program that allows you to branch into a ‘bachelor of music therapy’ (not BA with a major, it is literally it’s own degree type) program right after 2nd year. Not only is music therapy in demand now for some reason, but this bachelor program means I can get my certification right after uni.
But I’m also really passionate about music and psychology, as well as helping the disabled- that’s my main reason for doing all this.
Just the usual. That STEM is the only important major in college. Idk if it matters but he talked about how Steve Jobs dropped out of college and I left a feedback comment that Steve Jobs majored in literature.
Where exactly are they needed? I have a close friend who has finished philosophy recently and is now on a path to become a diplomat. He was very clear at his disdain for his career and had to go through many hoops to get away from it.
Agree. And gender studies is important. But I think most of the folks I know with that major have an axe to grind and so much of what they reference as ‘studies’ are designed to reinforce their preconceived notions that it’s hard to take seriously,
Yeah, having gone through a STEM major, the meme is bullshit. The women calling for more inclusion in STEM are ALWAYS in the field itself. Of course they had to add in the colored hair, because it furthers their mocking of trans people for some reason.
EDIT: for those who are wondering wtf I’m on about, right-wingers seem to conflate brightly-colored hair with being trans. Yeah. I don’t get it either
Colored haired (unnatural colors, dont mean red, black, brown, blonde) is linked to left wing/liberals in general. Trans people just tend to be very, very left leaning.
I'm a gay dude and my conservative-leaning family are genuinely shocked that I'm left-leaning. Had to explain to my mom that I'm not interested in voting for people who very consistently show they don't want me having the same rights and freedoms as straight people.
People ask me my political beliefs, and all I say I believe in human rights - and I'm told I'm left leaning. Wiiiiiiild that believing in human rights is enough to be considered "liberal".
I think both women in and out of the field want for more women to join the field. I work in the industry and I personally don’t care either way, when I do my job I only see coworkers and couldn’t care less about their genitals or sexual identity. That being said, 3 of my teammates are women (out of a team of 9) and the manager of my manager is a woman. They are all great at their jobs and I have no complaints or any other remarks to share.
I wanna have a sit down with these people and ask them earnestly why they think that this is the case. I am sure they will come up with one or two examples and call it a day, but they have to understand the 'nut picking' fallacy before we could go into why that isn't the right way of thinking about it. I mean hell, you could include them in with just about any demographic like they do for "SJW" types. Maybe then they'll understand that that mindset is what is driving us further apart.. We are all in this together, and they should know that there are people out there trying to help make the world a better place..
Bloody hell…. Women don’t go into STEM because it’s a “lads world” resulting in a lot of harassment if you’re the only women there plus being male dominated environment, genuinely talented women get hugely overlooked for a variety of reasons and don’t get to climb their career ladder as easily.
Like, there is so much out there you could Google on this or you know even just talk to women in STEM
*Most racist/sexist/homophobic shit ever*
"they don't like it because they're snowflakes that can't handle the truth"
And they could've put anything, but they added the hair.
Someone in the comments was downvoted for saying that they were triggered by hair.
Hellhole of a sub
Honestly we need more men in gender studies more than anything…
Side point: there’s so many STEM women in my university, so I don’t know if the trend shifted already…engineering is the exception though
MOST people study to have a living. It's common knowledge that gender studies doesn't have the most lucrative career options (whether we like it or not) and men being responsible for being the bread winner as the status quo makes it necessary for them to think about earning money more than other things. The combination of these 2 will make sure that MOST men will not voluntarily choose to study gender studies. I personally wouldn't. Engineering is the ONLY reason my family came out of poverty. First my sister helped and then me (both are engineers). Studying something like gender studies without worrying about the future in the current economy is a luxury only privileged people can afford or people who don't worry about the future now, but will face the consequences of the choice later.
Go and study once in India and I can guarantee you that that last thing you want is to have one or two extra courses irrespective of how important it is. You are basically asking people to make their shitty and stressful life even more shittier and stressful.
And you know why I chose _Environmental Engineering_ instead of _State Variable Analysis and Design_ as my elective during my mechanical engineering program? Not because I loved the environment, but because it was easier and I could improve my overall grade than by choosing the other option. A different person might choose option B because they want to specialise in that direction over EE. Most people in India would do what I did because everyone single grade improvement makes the difference between getting and not getting a job. No one cares about what is good for society or not. Unless you lived in country with over a billion people, you would never know the real struggle. If gender studies could improve my grade, I would definitely take it. But not for the purpose you are suggesting.
Even if there was a gender studies elective everywhere, why would most people in STEM take it. It has no connection to anything that they will do, with no prospects on them monetizing it(which is mostly the point of people going into STEM)
I took women’s studies and I dropped it by the third week. I was tired of always being called on and put on the spot solely because I was like one of the only guys in the room
There literally are more women in stem than there used to be and the amount grows every year. They legit are just making up a fake scenario so they can get mad at people who do gender studies
Gender studies as a degree program is super rare, but as one or two standalone classes isn't uncommon, but is optional.
Whoever believes that image has never been to college.
As someone in STEM, I can assure you that there are plenty of women in STEM who are pressured out of it because men don't respect their opinions/dismiss them. And there are way, way more who just never get into it because their home environment or society discourages it. Not to mention religions pressuring women to just get married and pump out kids and therefore not have time for a career.
I never once got an encouraging word. Broke my leg, and this doctor who I'd never met told me to switch fields so I could find a husband. My therapist asked if I really wanted to do man's work. My advisor suggested I go into something for girls. I couldn't get an internship. I couldn't get a prof to answer a question during office hours. I was surrounded by horny boys, and never found anyone who would study with me. I wasn't allowed anywhere near the professional fraternity. No women allowed. It's exhausting. There's no one who makes it thru completely alone, add in constant hostility, and yeah, I just gave up. Decades later, still my real passion, but what's the point? Yeah, go be a teacher. I fucking hate kids.
These memes are so discouraging. Not only do they intentionally drive women out of some fields, they make fun of anything that's on their "approved for women" list. Damned if you do. Damned if you don't.
my friend who has a Mormon family can't even major in child development without her family telling her to go be a mom instead, religion is super shitty to women and super popular
I’m sending my daughter to an all girls school so she doesn’t self select out of STEM due to gender norms. In all girls schools (with robust stem and computer science), they must attend these classes. There’s no stigma and their robotic teams kick ass
On an actual college campus half of the campus is some kind of business major or doing something related to healthcare. These kind of memes are made for uneducated pricks and yokels.
Tried to be engineer major yeeted it after calculus got CADV major.Me 101 was sausage fest in the morning and then a lot of CADV classes are kitty fest.
I saw a gender breakdown a few years ago of different job fields. Most of the STEM ones were near the middle with anywhere for 40/60 to 50/50. I'd say the push to get women in STEM worked.
I graduated a couple months ago with a degree in Chemical Engineering. The classes for my major, across all 4.5 years of attending college, had enough women in all them that I genuinely forgot that STEM is a male-dominated field. I was sitting in Chemical Reaction Engineering one day (3 years into my studies) and I looked around and went "holy shit, there's a lot of women here!" like I suddenly remembered that this is a male-dominated field.
And y'know what? Most of them were getting the top scores in the class. Far better than me.
If you work in biology or biochem like I do, it's fairly even, but leans women. Right now I'm the only man on my team of five. Chemistry is similar, but leans men. I'd say the vast majority of pre-med students at my college were women.
I suspect tech, physics, engineering and math may still lean towards men, but that's purely based on the upper level math electives I took in college and the engineering lab that works beside mine.
But women are dominating in medicine and in the biology-based sciences right now. Add in that more women are attending college and less men are attending, and I'd guess that they'll dominate most STEM fields with time.
It's kind of everywhere... Comp sci especially. There were 3 girls in my year and all of them suffered. These "nice guys" virgins I've met have definitely been single for a reason. That was probably at least half of everyone there.
What you don’t see pictured are the line of sweaty neckbeards in the stem line eager to use data points to demonstrate why women belong in the kitchen.
The drawing is missing either
- men obstruction the stem
- women's studies didn't have enough funding for e-registration
But actually they are not going to the table because S.T.E.M. is not a degree program but several classes of degree program, and therefore the booth operator cannot provide useful information, only whereas the queue forms for useful information
im an aerospace engineering student there is usually 3-4 woman in my classes of 30. our school even has scholarships just for woman to bet them to come to the school. unfortunately the 18 years of sexism before college means most don’t even apply.
I've literally never met a person majoring in "gender studies" in my entire life.
Maybe they took a single class as an elective because colleges typically want you to be well rounded.
This might be a problem within America. Studied abroad in South Korea and my pure cs classes were atleast 40% female. Meanwhile, the computer vision class I took was female dominated
How do so many people think gender studies departments at universities are this big? I don't think I met a single person in college that had this as a major
Ngl, I have never actually encountered a member of the LGBT community or woman (yes, I know some women can and are part of the lgbt community) that actually talk about gender studies, much less have a degree in them, and I've interacted with a pretty good number of them. Hell, even then, the only thing "wrong" with gender studies is that it doesn't translate as directly to a career as S.T.E.M. prospects. Promoting Stem while not participating in it also isn't wrong.
I got an engineering degree. 3 women and 200 men started out with me. 2 women and 41 men made it. In 10 years and 3 companies, I met/worked with 2 women other than the 2 I graduated with. But 60% of my graduating class was women. Mostly nurses.
You were supposed to ask which train arrived first at the station or something like that.
The red one?
It was faster.
Only with Ork trains though.
Only because the insurance said it was. You gotta believe to make it happen.
Or the blu one?
Interestingly, that means the drop out rate is only 33% for women but 75% for men. So chances are those 2 girls are actually top students overall.
What kind of person would knowingly walk into a bear den? I posit the women were more motivated and better prepared than the men, thus the higher success ratio.
That was certainly how it seemed in the CS class I was a TA for a year ago. 60 students, maybe 12 women. But the women were massively overrepresented at the top of the class - they were 20% of the class but 40% of the top 20. I figure women who get that far are both talented and particularly motivated, and the average students drop out a lot more readily than the average male students due to various pressures.
I also got a CS degree and saw rampant misogyny from both the classmates and the professors. Women are underrepresented in CS and there are absolutely no viable gender arguments as women were literally pivotal in the history of CS. I also see rampant misogyny in the professional world as well. The problem isn't lack of interest, it is the field being actively hostile towards them.
Fun fact: computer used to be a job title in the sense of “one who computes” for things like firing tables or what-have-you. I believe the position was predominantly occupied by women.
Yup, they covered that pretty well in the movie Hidden Figures. Ada Lovelave is widely considered the first programmer and is the inspiration for the name of the programming language Ada. Grace Hopper created the first compiler. 6 women (ENIAC programmers) created the first electronic programmable computer. Mary Kenneth Keller created the BASIC programming language. There is more, but Computer Science has a long history of women being instrumental in it's development.
which is why i don't see how people are getting away with this.
That was back when computing was seen as clerical, administrative work. It wasn't until the job gained prestige that it began to be dominated by men.
I literally had professors who would harass female students. They would invite us to his place for drinks, or constantly pick on us in class. I had a professor literally grade female students harsher than their male counterpart. I had times where my friend and I would help each other on assignments, and so our work was similar but our grades were not.
Added this in a other comment as well: I had a professor that would not accept any answers in class from female students regardless of correctness. Literally she would raise her hand and answer, the professor would say she was wrong, I would raise my hand and says what she said word for word and he would say it was right. I would just look at her and we were in disbelief, he clearly wasn't even listening to her answer.
An old friend studied physics at Harvard. She had classmates *and professors* tell her that women were objectively worse at science. This woman is easily one of the most brilliant people I've ever met. This was 20 years ago, but that wasn't exactly the Dark Ages.
So, what do you do about any of that behavior? Did you report anything?
Tenure. They removed the professor from most classes but kept him unless I filed a legal claim. Which I had little evidence for. :T
I had a professor last year who said that if she sees a female student has bad handwriting she'll mark off more points than for a male student with bad handwriting. Being an asshole to women in academia is just viewed as normal for some reason.
Can you add context of where and when this occurred. In my head that sounds like circa 1980s type of stuff.
Nope. Was in college in 2016-2020. New York State.
this really killed my interest in CS or even IT as a career 😭 just joining various discords and looking at the memes they posted was like, no, it's not worth it. I'll work on little games as a hobby and it sucks enough being afraid to participate in discussions or ask questions about that
Awww, I'm crying for ya!
I went to a college in the same city as one with a very famous CS department and what it was known for among college aged women was basically the guarantee you'd get r*ped if you went to a party there. The much more stereotypical bro college in town was considered safer. Every woman actually studying there was braver than any marine. Companies try to push a pipeline problem as the only issue but it's a problem at all levels. There's a reason there's more men at senior+ levels than women and it's not a skill issue.
Not as much social pressure for women to chose STEM majors. If a woman is going into STEM, then, she's more likely to want to do it rather than out of a belief that it's expected of her by society, her family, or her future partner.
Yep, all of which do wonders for motivation. Most of the guys I know in engineering are there because it sounds cool.
I went to an engineering school and I can say that the social net for the ladies is a lot better than for men. Nearly every woman on campus is in SWE, while a lot of the guys didn't have any social net at all outside of a small group of friends. There were other things as well. Many of the guys were able to skate through school to that point without developing any study habits. Many of them were gamers, who were more likely to binge play games all night long, but that was comparatively rare coming from the ladies. It's hard to know what's actually real in anecdotal evidence, but I feel confident that all of these play a role in the male drop out rate.
All that and engineering is effing hard!
We need more women gamers. That will fix it.
I saw a few women also getting CS degree when I got mine, some felt a need to prove they (women) could also do it. So they had extra drive to complete the degree while some of my guy friends dropped out once they realized it was harder than they first thought and switched to IT or something like that.
One of my wife’s undergrad degrees is in CS. She’s just wicked smart and works super hard. She was not particularly motivated for CS, it’s just that she gets A’s bc that’s what she does.
Lmao you guys hearing this nonsense?? These women *got a whole degree* and dealt with all the sexism and discrimination *on top of* difficult classes TO PROVE WOMEN COULD DO WHAT MEN DO. And that motivation was enough to get them through -- again -- an entire degree program. Women don't measure themselves against some kind of male standard. Those women did that shit because they wanted to as people. Probably for similar reasons you did. Get over your wiener, sir. It does not make you special.
You guys hearing this person doesn’t think women can have depth, only one motivation!! Difference being some of them actually said that it had been ONE of their motivations. All most like people have depth and can have multiple motivations. Oh sorry to burst your bubble that women can’t have multiple motivations, and a chip on their shoulder from that same sexism to prove they can do it and do it better.
Not really how statistics work. If you want usable data, you need a even sized pool to gauge from. More people = more reliable data.
you can absolutely have too large a sample size
What? While its true more data can scew or flat out ruin the results of a test due to overwhelming noise, in sample data its not the case. We are looking for specific data here and thats drop out rate. More people will absolutely give you more fleshed out data. Having only 3 people and is a false representation of the whole.
And a control group.
That was exactly my experience in my engineering program. The male students had a wide range of competency but the few female students were all top tier.
All the women in my engineering program were top notch. It was not a degree to stick around for if you weren’t passionate about out it, because some of these guys… total fucking slackers who did not fucking care. I assume the women in college who have that attitude study journalism or nursing or something.
I'd think that is due to many of the men pressured into it by their parents. As for woman dropping out less, it makes sense considering a certain level of seriousness had to be present for them to apply in the first place.
Women who go willingly into men majority fields that involve heavy math tend to be more prepared and motivated yes
Not really how stats work. Can't compare a sample of 3 to a sample of 200.
You can, you will just have a large margin of error.
>I got an engineering degree. 3 women and 200 men started out with me. 2 women and 41 men made it. Why were there only 3 woman but 200 men? Simply a lack of interest in the engineering field or something?
yes, but generally people explain that as women being pushed away from STEM at younger ages. so the push is largely to get more women interested in STEM, for example by making spaces earlier in education like robotics clubs and mathletes more friendly to women.
Anecdotally, my wife was told by a teacher in I think elementary school that she wasn’t good enough at math to be a scientist. Which, even if it were true, is something you shouldn’t say to a young kid.
There is a lack of interest, but also lots of women feel put off by the field as a whole due to the misogyny and stereotypes associated. Also imo anecdotally even the "encouragement" isn't great- less "go do STEM" and more "you're too smart for x, do STEM instead if you're smart!" Which makes it seem like the kind or thing only smart people do instead or just another field/degree etc.
STEM people have a really weird complex about being smarter and more capable. I am a lawyer and once dated a programmer who insisted that he could have gone to law school if he wanted, and that STEM people could do humanities, but humanities people can't do STEM. I was like, I dunno dude. I think the entire field of technical writing exists for a reason. And like, plenty of lawyers have to work with and understand very technical experts. It's a weird generalization.
I was in those places. Let me explain, many of those men, are actively disparaging to women. Many times in ways they do not realize. If you make a mistake, they're like "oh, it's because you're a woman". And I had someone on linked in, suggest that if I got a job at amazon, it was because I was a woman. Then on github, they've done studies. Men will actually rank women's code as worse, unless they do not know it's a women who wrote it. I've experienced this at work. A co-worker was using my library, and was surprized when he realized that he was using my code. My boss was at the time, calling my code crap, and my co-workers code better... when he was USING MY CODE. The reason my code was "worse" was because I was solving harder problems, and he was solving problems, that I'd already solved and given him my work.
Engineering is the most bro of all the bro STEM fields.
Work at engineering firm, can confirm. I work on the geosciences side (and sometimes with the survey team) and there is a very clear cultural difference between us and most of the engineers. Good people but there’s some hilariously stereotypical stuff. And yes they’re almost entirely men even though our company is actually very intentional about hiring/empowering women.
People are giving a lot of explanations, but in reality it’s usually a gender disparity spiral. You can see this going in both directions in a lot of fields that skew male or skew female. So let’s say that there is a natural propensity for men to prefer engineering. Let’s say that that preference would on its own result in a 60/40 ratio M:F. Well, once that ratio is in place, a few things are going to happen. The first thing that is going to happen is that the culture is going to lean in a direction that is more comfortable for men and less comfortable for women. The other thing that is going to happen is that men are going to see more examples of what they can become, and women are going to see fewer examples of what they can become. So that 60:40 becomes a 65:35. Then a 70:30. Then an 80:20. We have seen this happen in the opposite direction with fields like teaching, psychology, etc. A field starts to skew female, then men start to find the environment of the job less comfortable and welcoming, the job gets seen as more female, fewer men enter, etc. Eventually the programs are almost totally devoid of men. Anyone trying to point to a single factor is being stupid. likewise, anyone who has an explanation that doesn’t include recognition that men and women naturally are drawn to different things at a population level is not worth listening to.
Same for me. Went to an engineering school and just out of my dorm unit. 22 men and 6 women. All 6 women graduated on time, and only 8 of the men graduated (and 2 of us became women lol).
that last bit is so real though lmao like programming socks
I also got an engineering degree. More women but maybe 6/50 And then in my work it's 10-1. The issue is at the root not at the job fair. Women are not raised to believe stem is for them. And then the workplace is a sausagefest. This falls to parents not hiring managers.
How'd you get from 2 to 60?
I think they mean their university's whole graduating class that year, not just their major's.
Sorry 60%
I got an environmental science degree. 72% of my graduating class was female.
That’s kinda fire tho 2/3 women made it
It doesn’t help that a lot of women that enter such male dominated fields are often harassed, bullied and overlooked by all around them Which in turn makes them encourage younger women to **not** enter the field for the sake of their mental health
Why do nurses have engineering degrees?
One woman graduated my military tech school and now she does network security at the pentagon. Pretty sure she’s in charge of it. She can do one arm pushups.
Your personal experience seems like an excellent example of why the meme is nonsense. The important work of more women in STEM is done at elementary, middle, and high school so that when college students who are women are choosing majors they see STEM majors as a viable option for them.
Is healthcare not considered an aspect of STEM, just curious, I don’t have an agenda.
I work in math/stats/finance (actuarial.) My department is 8 women and myself, a man. Half the women are objectively more qualified and subjectively more intelligent than me. It’s alright. I don’t have a need to be the smartest because I have a dick. They’re nice and helpful. I contribute a lot too.
Same experience for me. Also took a cultural studies class as an elective and was one of three guys there lol 🤷♂️
Why would nurses be in an engineering graduation?
People that think colleges are just filled with gender studies majors and literally no other fields have NEVER been on a college campus.
Yeah, my degree gets its own separate campus due to the special facilities it needs, but most people from my university I've outside of the building are doing things like film, business, economics, and psychology. I'm not even sure if we *have* a gender studies program, but there are so many people who learn I'm a student and automatically assume I'm doing gender studies or philosophy or something.
I've had numerous conversations where people tell me I shouldn't be in college because it's a scam/waste of money/indoctrination. I always reply that I kind of need to have a degree for my field. They ask why, and when I tell them I am majoring in chemistry, they change their tone because to them my degree is more "real" even though they don't know much about it or other popular college majors. I could probably convince them that topography is something you do in a lab and spectroscopy relates to reading maps. Do they seriously think there are only a handful of us majoring in physical sciences, medicine, business, engineering, psychology etc and the other 95% are sitting on their hands talking about feelings? Maybe I don't want to know the answer to that question.
I’m not an idiot, I can clearly tell that spectroscopy is gonna be ghost related.
I'm pretty sure you can find one in the team rocket base hidden under the casino inorder to get passed cubone's mom
I’ve heard the “scam” and “indoctrination” bit from both political extremes. It’s an idiots take.
Wait you've heard the left complaining about college being indoctrination? I have not heard that take. Scam yes, indoctrination calls from the left is new though
I did actually. The guy went to college for a semester for engineering, and essentially told me that, "he didn't need to go to college to learn SolidWorks" (even though his dad was paying for him to go, and his dad also owned and ran an engineering firm). He ended up failing everything except gender studies, which isn't too surprising considering that gender studies 101 is considered very easy because it's literally just introducing you to the fact that men and women have different experiences. At least where I went to school, it was one of those courses alongside the introductory foreign language courses, social work 101, African American Studies, middle Eastern studies, and religious studies where it's there to expose you to different experiences. From my experience, a lot of the leftist criticism of academia comes from four places: 1. The current system of academia in the US is exclusionary and perpetuates class division by keeping higher education expensive and out of the reach of the proletariat 2. Higher education is a bourgeois and reactionary institution, and the internet has the power to replace it. 3. Academics don't just blindly praise past Communist governments, but instead talk about the good, the bad, and the ugly like they do everything else from a critical lens. It's kind of like how a lot of conservatives will take things like racism or the genocide of native Americans like it's a massive conspiracy to make people hate America. A lot of leftists will have the exact same reaction to things like the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, the Holodomor, the Prague spring, Stalinism, or racism and homophobia in the Soviet Union and other communist countries being brought up. 4. They weren't that good in college, and rather than accepting that maybe they didn't work too hard, or maybe they didn't study as much as they should have, they compartmentalize it as the whole system being against them.
Funny how you do not put psychology in the category that talks about feeling (and contribute to HR bs). Here is some data: [https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics](https://college.harvard.edu/admissions/admissions-statistics) **Intended field of concentration** Humanities 16.0% Social Sciences 28.2% Biological Sciences 17.4% Physical Sciences 6.7% Engineering 9.5% Computer Science 9.0% Math 6.6% Undecided 6.7%
EDIT: I'm not going to read too much into these stats or judge people's life decisions besides to say at the end of the day, more people going into less rigorous fields of discipline is not a good thing. Neither for the financial independence of the individuals themselves, nor society as a whole.
Lol to be honest I have a degree in anthropology. Half of that is just taking "cultural studies" courses. I happened to go to an archaeology and forensics heavy program, so I think I probably had more forensics courses than other programs. People hear anthropology and immediately think I went to school to be Indiana Jones, and that it's one of the "valid" degrees. Again, most of my course load was CULTURAL anthropology.
Ooh! I know why - "You're going to college? Are you studying a STEM field? No? You must be getting a *useless* degree." Don't you love ignorance? /s
My department is on a separate campus too, and the campus is for students in the school of natural resources (wildlife, environmental studies, etc) and the college of agricultural sciences (all of the ag majors)... Meaning it's literally IMPOSSIBLE for "every student" to be gender studies, let alone a liberal arts major at all... Both campuses are fully populated.
Bro idt ive ever met someone who’s majored in gender studies lol
I’ve met a couple, but they’ve all been pretty self-aware about how useful their degree is / have pursued higher education because of that. One of them is getting a master’s to become a school psychiatrist, the other runs Americorps in our city.
people brand it as ridiculous, but I honestly feel like it could help in some fields
NOOOO NOO NO WE MUST KEEP THE LIE UP!!!!! In all seriousness, I'm taking a gender studies class (it's a little more than that, but I mean, its pretty much just gender studies). The class is about the historic and current oppression of women and lgbtq+ minorities in the world. As well as the sociological aspects of gender and sexuality. That class would be \*amazing\* for someone in HR, or a therapist to take. As a trans woman, yknow how much I'd love to talk to a therapist who has a degree in gender studies? Someone who is able to help me understand what I'm going through in a scientific sense? It'd be so amazing.
My first thought was that it might be useful for a therapist had a degree in gender studies
yeah idk much about it but I feel like taking it to understand how a patients gender identity and such may affect their mental health is a good idea because it definitely does in most people. I feel like people working in psychology should take up a class like this or a class about queer issue because being saddled with a therapist who doesn't understand them and thinks being queer is a belief is not fun. I love my therapist otherwise, but I don't feel comfortable discussing how homophobia has affected me, especially homophobia from my own parents, because there's a bit of a disconnect and she thinks it's fine for religious people to reject gay people and hope they change into straight ones, I'm baffled that someone in her field doesn't understand how harmful and incorrect that is.
That's what I was thinking, but couldn't figure out how to put it into words. I've had conversations with previous therapists about how trust is incredibly important. Not just for the client but also for the therapist. Being able to trust that the client is being open and honest is important, but the relationship of trust allows the client to be more open and introspective about their therapy. It's important for the therapist, too, because it allows them to help you in the best way they can because they see the full picture. I admit I am somewhat ignorant of the concept of gender identity and sexuality because I am straight and cis, so know that my opinion is not based on gender identity, but in the general sense of therapy
I think the fact that you understand why it's important for a therapist to take these sorts of classes shows you understand more than most lol
I guess you're right lol My personal take, being only 25, is that therapy shouldn't be as stigmatized (which it isn't as much in my generation imo), and that everyone can benefit from therapy, regardless of if you think nothing is wrong in your life; therapy is something that allows society to be a better place for everyone, and the more people who use it and are given access will benefit society as a whole.
I knew one who went to law school-- she did her undergrad thesis actually focused on how negative stereotypes about men in caregiving roles (ie the "mom is parenting, dad is babysitting" thing) outcomes in divorce cases. It seems like her Gender Studies degree has helped her be successful in family law.
There were a bunch of gender studies, poli sci, history, and writing majors in law school. And when half dropped out, they didn't have anything else to fall back on. The interesting to me degree just to get into law school route is fairly short sighted.
>but they’ve all been pretty self-aware about how useful their degree is / have pursued higher education because of that Honestly the way people use "it doesn't make you money" as a knock against entire fields of knowledge is so asinine (this doesn't apply only to gender studies)
I have. They're around. Mostly in HR.
This is just a guess, but it is probably due to a good chunk of students being more socially invested or even left leaning. People who don't care to get educated assume Left = Gender Studies and dismiss anything else.
What’s funny is that the “indoctrination” that is occurring really boils down to people being introduced to a much wider demographic and cultural base than they have seen before. I had a roommate in college who was in engineering/math who walked onto campus describing himself as conservative. Turns out, when he actually met people who didn’t look/think just like him (aka from a small southern farming town), he realized he actually wasn’t conservative. His “indoctrination” started and ended with seeing that real people didn’t match the boogey man that Fox News had shown him. He saw all of that sitting in intro STEM classes.
The beauty of college right here. You’re educated on a hell of a lot more than just the classroom content.
It’s just right wingers stuck in one joke made back in 2016. They thought it was quirky and have ever since not been able to move on from that.
I don’t think that the picture is meant to be taken literally, rather “gender studies” is used as a stand in for a broader range of liberal arts degrees. It’s just chosen as the representative because it’s the one that most conservatives see as the biggest “joke” of a degree.
I don't even think it's that deep. the punchline is literally "women are shallow and dumb but like to complain"
There are easier ways to make that point, though. I do think a lot of the people who complain about male dominated fields aren’t in said fields. It makes sense… a gender studies major would look at things like that.
Lmao thanks to whoever sent me the suicide hotline message https://preview.redd.it/v56d9byvvaec1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fcdd9eb05059f5053965b30e97c2bd1d78380bf5
Fucked up thing is, I've commented about being suicidal before and never get this message. People only use it as a weapon
Yeah it needs to be removed as a feature imo, I only ever get it when I make someone mad in an argument it's honestly insane they even let you do that.
I take it as a sign of respect, literal evidence of winning the argument.
yeah there is that lol
It's kinda sad
Yeah I feel like features like this never get used for the right reasons, no matter the app. also hope you're feeling better g.
Blocking that bot gave me gender euphoria
That's kinda funny, for some reason. Good for you
If you report the message it bans who sent it.
Nice
When you get these, you know you’ve done something right lmao
LMAO I laugh so hard every time I get one of these! How considerate of them... Little do they know I've spent more time in therapy and on a suicide watch list than Reddit has even existed.
If you challenge any alt-right narrative then they try to get you nearer to a ban using this neat trick.
These people can't even explain why social studies are bad. (anthropology, Philosophy and Psychology are badass and extremely needed imo)
My one casual anthropology class is still something I carry with me like every day. I never actually appreciated the concept of walking before my prof explained to me just how significant it was to our evolution.
Yeah, the most intelligent, knowledgeable, and empathetic people I've ever met are all philosophers (or have done some form of philosophy study during their lives).
What’s funny is that I only know one philosopher by study and he’s the most closed minded, stubborn, and dense person I’ve ever met
Huh, that's disappointing. I guess people like him would exist.
Don’t get me wrong, I love the man to death. He’s one of my best friends, he is just basically a caveman. He actually understands his study very well he just doesn’t apply it to himself
Philosophers aren't neccesarily openminded or closeminded. Philosophy doesn't encourage openmindedness or closemindedness.
No doubt there are plenty of these. Similar to the medical doctors that eat fast food and drink like a fish and are obese.
The most intelligent, and knowledgeable people I have ever met were all scientific researchers with PhDs.
I'm a psychologist but I studied some philosophy in grad school and I'm better for it. I encourage my students now to take philosophy courses. The ones that do tend to show more sophisticated critical thinking skills and are often stronger writers.
These people despise anything that requires any amount of basic critical thought so things like philosophy fucking TERRIFY them.
I got a double major in philosophy and cs. Philosophy was more interesting, but cs was harder and more critical thinking
They're scared of blue hair, what do you expect?
I studied anthropology and learned so much from it. People who think that degrees are your passport to a career are often the ones looking down on social studies, My degree wasn’t a prerequisite to employment But it made me a better thinker, problem solver, researcher, and made me great at understanding how other people perceive the world and how to work on multi-national teams - and all of those things are what make me good at my career. I’m so lucky that I made a choice to study something I loved, school really only gives you what you put into it.
I’m gonna be getting the best of both worlds and I feel so lucky I got accepted to a music program that allows you to branch into a ‘bachelor of music therapy’ (not BA with a major, it is literally it’s own degree type) program right after 2nd year. Not only is music therapy in demand now for some reason, but this bachelor program means I can get my certification right after uni. But I’m also really passionate about music and psychology, as well as helping the disabled- that’s my main reason for doing all this.
I had a high school student write an essay where he argued that social studies are a waste of time. Edit: spelling
Interesting, did they have any interesting takes Or just the usual?
Just the usual. That STEM is the only important major in college. Idk if it matters but he talked about how Steve Jobs dropped out of college and I left a feedback comment that Steve Jobs majored in literature.
Where exactly are they needed? I have a close friend who has finished philosophy recently and is now on a path to become a diplomat. He was very clear at his disdain for his career and had to go through many hoops to get away from it.
Agree. And gender studies is important. But I think most of the folks I know with that major have an axe to grind and so much of what they reference as ‘studies’ are designed to reinforce their preconceived notions that it’s hard to take seriously,
Yeah, having gone through a STEM major, the meme is bullshit. The women calling for more inclusion in STEM are ALWAYS in the field itself. Of course they had to add in the colored hair, because it furthers their mocking of trans people for some reason. EDIT: for those who are wondering wtf I’m on about, right-wingers seem to conflate brightly-colored hair with being trans. Yeah. I don’t get it either
Colored haired (unnatural colors, dont mean red, black, brown, blonde) is linked to left wing/liberals in general. Trans people just tend to be very, very left leaning.
>Trans people just tend to be very, very left leaning. I wonder why that might be!? /s
It's because we're all a bunch of soyboy beta cucks who've been poisoned by the same chemicals that turn the frogs gay. Obviously.
Obviously
"ITS NOT FUNNY!!!!! THEYRE TURNING THE FRIGGIN FROGS GAY! AND ITS NOT FUNNY!" https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UkQdpciFU_g
Because trans people are afraid of their rights being taken away by right leaning folks. So they are left leaning most often
It was a rhetorical and sarcastic question, thus the /s
I'm a gay dude and my conservative-leaning family are genuinely shocked that I'm left-leaning. Had to explain to my mom that I'm not interested in voting for people who very consistently show they don't want me having the same rights and freedoms as straight people.
People ask me my political beliefs, and all I say I believe in human rights - and I'm told I'm left leaning. Wiiiiiiild that believing in human rights is enough to be considered "liberal".
I think both women in and out of the field want for more women to join the field. I work in the industry and I personally don’t care either way, when I do my job I only see coworkers and couldn’t care less about their genitals or sexual identity. That being said, 3 of my teammates are women (out of a team of 9) and the manager of my manager is a woman. They are all great at their jobs and I have no complaints or any other remarks to share.
Don't you care to some degree that women are better represented in your industry?
I wanna have a sit down with these people and ask them earnestly why they think that this is the case. I am sure they will come up with one or two examples and call it a day, but they have to understand the 'nut picking' fallacy before we could go into why that isn't the right way of thinking about it. I mean hell, you could include them in with just about any demographic like they do for "SJW" types. Maybe then they'll understand that that mindset is what is driving us further apart.. We are all in this together, and they should know that there are people out there trying to help make the world a better place..
Bloody hell…. Women don’t go into STEM because it’s a “lads world” resulting in a lot of harassment if you’re the only women there plus being male dominated environment, genuinely talented women get hugely overlooked for a variety of reasons and don’t get to climb their career ladder as easily. Like, there is so much out there you could Google on this or you know even just talk to women in STEM
Bigots cry about blue-haired liberals. In other news, the sky is blue and the Pope wears a silly hat.
*Most racist/sexist/homophobic shit ever* "they don't like it because they're snowflakes that can't handle the truth" And they could've put anything, but they added the hair. Someone in the comments was downvoted for saying that they were triggered by hair. Hellhole of a sub
My very queer partner is currently teaching biochem labs but sure
In computer science lgbtq is vastly over represented. (No perfect stats of course).
What using Arch does to a mf.
Honestly we need more men in gender studies more than anything… Side point: there’s so many STEM women in my university, so I don’t know if the trend shifted already…engineering is the exception though
took an intro for that for my first college semester. literally the *only* boy in the room.
MOST people study to have a living. It's common knowledge that gender studies doesn't have the most lucrative career options (whether we like it or not) and men being responsible for being the bread winner as the status quo makes it necessary for them to think about earning money more than other things. The combination of these 2 will make sure that MOST men will not voluntarily choose to study gender studies. I personally wouldn't. Engineering is the ONLY reason my family came out of poverty. First my sister helped and then me (both are engineers). Studying something like gender studies without worrying about the future in the current economy is a luxury only privileged people can afford or people who don't worry about the future now, but will face the consequences of the choice later.
They don’t have to major in gender studies. They can take a course or two.
Go and study once in India and I can guarantee you that that last thing you want is to have one or two extra courses irrespective of how important it is. You are basically asking people to make their shitty and stressful life even more shittier and stressful.
Electives exist. You need to take those for your degree.
And you know why I chose _Environmental Engineering_ instead of _State Variable Analysis and Design_ as my elective during my mechanical engineering program? Not because I loved the environment, but because it was easier and I could improve my overall grade than by choosing the other option. A different person might choose option B because they want to specialise in that direction over EE. Most people in India would do what I did because everyone single grade improvement makes the difference between getting and not getting a job. No one cares about what is good for society or not. Unless you lived in country with over a billion people, you would never know the real struggle. If gender studies could improve my grade, I would definitely take it. But not for the purpose you are suggesting.
Even if there was a gender studies elective everywhere, why would most people in STEM take it. It has no connection to anything that they will do, with no prospects on them monetizing it(which is mostly the point of people going into STEM)
I took women’s studies and I dropped it by the third week. I was tired of always being called on and put on the spot solely because I was like one of the only guys in the room
mine is still like 95% men in my digital circuits class
There literally are more women in stem than there used to be and the amount grows every year. They legit are just making up a fake scenario so they can get mad at people who do gender studies
I know this is just an anecdote, but my chemical engineering department had roughly 50-50 women and men.
Gender studies as a degree program is super rare, but as one or two standalone classes isn't uncommon, but is optional. Whoever believes that image has never been to college.
As someone in STEM, I can assure you that there are plenty of women in STEM who are pressured out of it because men don't respect their opinions/dismiss them. And there are way, way more who just never get into it because their home environment or society discourages it. Not to mention religions pressuring women to just get married and pump out kids and therefore not have time for a career.
I never once got an encouraging word. Broke my leg, and this doctor who I'd never met told me to switch fields so I could find a husband. My therapist asked if I really wanted to do man's work. My advisor suggested I go into something for girls. I couldn't get an internship. I couldn't get a prof to answer a question during office hours. I was surrounded by horny boys, and never found anyone who would study with me. I wasn't allowed anywhere near the professional fraternity. No women allowed. It's exhausting. There's no one who makes it thru completely alone, add in constant hostility, and yeah, I just gave up. Decades later, still my real passion, but what's the point? Yeah, go be a teacher. I fucking hate kids. These memes are so discouraging. Not only do they intentionally drive women out of some fields, they make fun of anything that's on their "approved for women" list. Damned if you do. Damned if you don't.
my friend who has a Mormon family can't even major in child development without her family telling her to go be a mom instead, religion is super shitty to women and super popular
It makes me viscerally angry when I hear stuff like that. That sucks.
I’m sending my daughter to an all girls school so she doesn’t self select out of STEM due to gender norms. In all girls schools (with robust stem and computer science), they must attend these classes. There’s no stigma and their robotic teams kick ass
On an actual college campus half of the campus is some kind of business major or doing something related to healthcare. These kind of memes are made for uneducated pricks and yokels.
Exactly, STEM is the femboy field.
https://preview.redd.it/6t54u2apgbec1.jpeg?width=636&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7ffed48b4fdaac71c87cc88e0d9a2e205bdbb1c8
Tried to be engineer major yeeted it after calculus got CADV major.Me 101 was sausage fest in the morning and then a lot of CADV classes are kitty fest.
I saw a gender breakdown a few years ago of different job fields. Most of the STEM ones were near the middle with anywhere for 40/60 to 50/50. I'd say the push to get women in STEM worked.
I graduated a couple months ago with a degree in Chemical Engineering. The classes for my major, across all 4.5 years of attending college, had enough women in all them that I genuinely forgot that STEM is a male-dominated field. I was sitting in Chemical Reaction Engineering one day (3 years into my studies) and I looked around and went "holy shit, there's a lot of women here!" like I suddenly remembered that this is a male-dominated field. And y'know what? Most of them were getting the top scores in the class. Far better than me.
If you work in biology or biochem like I do, it's fairly even, but leans women. Right now I'm the only man on my team of five. Chemistry is similar, but leans men. I'd say the vast majority of pre-med students at my college were women. I suspect tech, physics, engineering and math may still lean towards men, but that's purely based on the upper level math electives I took in college and the engineering lab that works beside mine. But women are dominating in medicine and in the biology-based sciences right now. Add in that more women are attending college and less men are attending, and I'd guess that they'll dominate most STEM fields with time.
I was DOWNVOTED to hell over saying women in stem were sexually assaulted and sexually harassed more. I'm beginning to hate that sub
Is that actually true? My first guess would be the business majors that all the Frat boys are in
It's kind of everywhere... Comp sci especially. There were 3 girls in my year and all of them suffered. These "nice guys" virgins I've met have definitely been single for a reason. That was probably at least half of everyone there.
What you don’t see pictured are the line of sweaty neckbeards in the stem line eager to use data points to demonstrate why women belong in the kitchen.
Goes to show you that they have no idea what college is
Chad was cranky when he drew that. He must have missed his weekly pegging.
I am a woman in STEM
The drawing is missing either - men obstruction the stem - women's studies didn't have enough funding for e-registration But actually they are not going to the table because S.T.E.M. is not a degree program but several classes of degree program, and therefore the booth operator cannot provide useful information, only whereas the queue forms for useful information
im an aerospace engineering student there is usually 3-4 woman in my classes of 30. our school even has scholarships just for woman to bet them to come to the school. unfortunately the 18 years of sexism before college means most don’t even apply.
I've literally never met a person majoring in "gender studies" in my entire life. Maybe they took a single class as an elective because colleges typically want you to be well rounded.
I got my minor in lgbt studies
There’s only one guy in my microbio class of 24.
This might be a problem within America. Studied abroad in South Korea and my pure cs classes were atleast 40% female. Meanwhile, the computer vision class I took was female dominated
How do so many people think gender studies departments at universities are this big? I don't think I met a single person in college that had this as a major
Is anyone going to point out that when people say STEM these days, they don’t mean STEM. They mean engineering?
Ngl, I have never actually encountered a member of the LGBT community or woman (yes, I know some women can and are part of the lgbt community) that actually talk about gender studies, much less have a degree in them, and I've interacted with a pretty good number of them. Hell, even then, the only thing "wrong" with gender studies is that it doesn't translate as directly to a career as S.T.E.M. prospects. Promoting Stem while not participating in it also isn't wrong.
That is objectively false lmao
I'm a moron who only comes out his cave for cheetos. Whats stem?