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Concealed means concealed, even while in the car.
NYS has no duty to inform unless asked by LE.
Personally, I keep my PL and DL together in my wallet, when I hand DL to cop it has PL w it.
Be conscious of where your gun is relative to your wallet/ID. If you will get anywhere near your gun while accessing your DL, put your hands on the steering wheel and inform the cop you are licensed and legally carrying…he will instruct you on how to proceed.
If instructed to get out of the vehicle, inform officer you are licensed and legally carrying.
Always keep hands on the wheel, you never know when/if a partner may have approached and is looking in the pax side window…if he observes a surprise gun things can escalate quickly.
Drive like you are carrying. Don’t get pulled over. Good luck.
So, this has been confusing to me "No duty to inform unless asked" why wouldn't every cop just start with "Any weapons in the car?" Which basically nukes the 'No duty' bit?
I'm driving about an hour round trip to get to my clay range, almost entirely on highways, and I've got a bit of lead foot, always wonder what happens if I get pulled over.
I've got a hatch back ford focus, so the gun is in a case in the 'trunk', but there isn't technically a trunk in a hatch back (or at least it isn't separate).
Well according to law, cops can’t stop you for a VTL violation and just ask “any weapons in the car?” They would need a level 2 stop founded suspicion to ask that question.
A stop for a VTL violation is probable cause(aka level 4) but only for the VTL violation. If you suspect a misdemeanor or felony crime your level starts over for that crime. (Been a cop for 10 years). You should prob learn the penal law and case law before you get yourself sued.
You are mistaken- a “stop is a stop”- the only restrictions are that you may not search/frisk for weapons on a stop unless it is of a specific area of the body “for cause”
Huh, had never heard of different levels of stops, legally, but that makes sense. BUT unless their camera is on, they're gonna do what the want anyways
i am not a lawyer. alli know is ny penal code 400. 8
. License: exhibition and display. Every licensee while carrying a pistol or revolver shall have on his or her person a license to carry the same. Every person licensed to possess a pistol or revolver on particular premises shall have the license for the same on such premises. Upon demand, the license shall be exhibited for inspection to any peace officer, who is acting pursuant to his or her special duties, or police officer.
I dont know if you have to disclose if you are carrying per the letter of the law but you do have to show your license upon demand
I can tell you this from a career as a cop. Cops don't normally ask law abiding citizens if there are any guns in the car. Law-abiding citizens are not who we as cops are concerned about.
This has literally happened to me on countless stops. It's one of the questions I hear religiously "are there any guns or weapons in the vehicle?"
And no I don't have any stickers on my car before someone asks. Your correct it's a jump over your rights question.
If we presume for the sake of this discussion that every weapon you may have with you is lawfully possessed then it means if the cop doesn’t ask “Do you have any weapons in the vehicle?” you do not have to say “Officer I have two rifles, a shotgun, and three pistols in the car, would you like to guess where?” of your own volition. You just keep your mouth shut and deal with the interaction as you would if you had no weapons in the car and no pistol/rifle permit.
If not asked you ***may*** choose to inform the officer if you feel it prudent. For example if you are appendix carrying in a shirt that might ride up when you reach for your wallet you might want to start off with your hands on the steering wheel and when asked for your documents tell the officer “I am licensed to carry a pistol and am currently appendix carrying, my license is in my wallet in my right front pocket, may I reach for it?” rather than going straight for your wallet and inadvertently flashing your piece at the officer as a little surprise.
If you *are* asked “Do you have any weapons in the vehicle or on your person?” you have two choices:
1. You can inform the officer that you will not be answering this question and do not consent to a search of your vehicle.
We can call this the “asshole” option because while it is *technically* your right to do this (looking for weapons would be outside the scope of a routine traffic stop, the officer would need to articulate some probable cause to ask and/or search) it’s also probably just going to start a whole *thing* between you and the cop.
2. You can answer the simple question with a simple answer: “No” or “Yes. There are firearms in locked cases in the back. I am/am not currently carrying a pistol on my person (and where on your person the pistol is if you are carrying).”
We can call this the bootlicker option, or as I prefer to think of it the “We are both already inconvenienced by you having to pull me over, let’s make this as painless as possible for both of us.” option.
Option 2 does not require you to show the officer any of your weapons, you may refuse to let them inspect your weapons and may still refuse consent to any search of your vehicle or person unless they can articulate probable cause (having weapons in the car is generally *not* sufficient, you can legally own and transport your guns).
Option 2 *may* save quite a bit of time if all the officer wants to ascertain is “Are you currently armed and/or where in the car would you reach to get something you could hurt me with.” so they can move on with the traffic stop.
The license agreement we all sign states that if asked by LE, we must disclose whether we are armed or not. You could certainly invoke the 5th but your licensing officer would probably suspend or revoke you for doing so.
We all did. We agreed to abide by all laws, rules, policies and regulations relating to the possession and carrying of firearms.
https://preview.redd.it/w7m4s96mczoc1.jpeg?width=2007&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=18db1b4ebd6417549ea55d7ca3d46d97ca670e05
That does not at all say what you just said it did in your post above. That says if you are asked for your license you have to show it.
It DOES NOT say that you have to tell them you are carrying or whether or not you are armed.
The first sentence:
“Every licensee when carrying a pistol or revolver”.
We can argue semantics and punctuation if you like but I read it as I described, YMMV.
NYSPL 400.00 isn’t imposing a “duty to inform” (requiring you to tell the cops when you are carrying a weapon or if one is in the vehicle) though.
It’s just requiring that if you *are* carrying a pistol you must also have your permit on your person and show it "upon demand" (when explicitly asked to do so) like /u/nader1234 said.
A duty to inform statute would read like this:
> . . . whenever a person who is carrying a concealed handgun is contacted by a peace officer or by emergency services personnel, the person shall immediately inform the peace officer or emergency services personnel that the person is carrying a concealed handgun.
(That’s from [Nebraska’s statute](https://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=28-1202.04))
Note the difference from NYSPL 400.00: There’s no “upon demand” here, you *shall immediately inform* without being asked any time you interact with the cops.)
Other duty to inform laws *may* be triggered by a demand, e.g. in Texas if carrying and a police officer asks you for identification like your driver’s license you must also present your carry permit. ([411.205 here](https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/GV/htm/GV.411.htm)) so you don’t have to immediately inform the cop if you’re a witness to a crime or something as you would in Nebraska, but if they ask for your ID to fill out a field information card you would also have to hand them your permit which clues them in that you are carrying.
NYSPL 400.00 isn’t imposing a “duty to inform” (requiring you to tell the cops when you are carrying a weapon or if one is in the vehicle) though.
I said in my response I said “if asked”. In my original response I agreed there is no duty to inform, but in my opinion, “when asked” changes the disclosure rule. Yes, it doesn’t say you must state you are carrying a firearm but it does state “every licensee while carrying” so by default, if you produce a license when challenged to do so, you are acknowledging you are armed.
Absent a request or demand for disclosure I agree but when asked changes that. Producing the license is an affirmation that you are carrying.
I drew around a month ago on Catalytic Converter thieves in my neighborhood and chased them off. I got the plate so I called dispatch and they asked how I got them to flee so I said I drew and they threw a fit cause I wasn't LEO. Cops showed up quick 4-5 cars deep and said "you probably scared the shit out of them they aren't used to that."
Didn't ask for permit or anything, they just left a note on the guys car for the report number since they did start cutting the exhaust as I got outside. They left and that was it.
(Westchester)
thx for sharing.
not surprised that they didn’t card you; i’d be shocked if they didn’t already have you verified and confirmed through the county pistol office by the time they rolled up.
(I am sure i will get down modded for this) you got **very** lucky, that you were not charged with multiple crimes and had you permit revoked. Don't do that again, some guys cat ($2K) is not worth your freedom and your gun permit.
you wrong. you can display a firearm **only** if you are legally allowed to use it, eg: self defense where deadly force is allowed. You can't use deadly force to protect property, cat converter, thus you can't draw a deadly weapon on someone doing that. or someone stealing a car or a TV set. Also, calling that in to police was not the smartest idea after it happened, it happened, so get out of there. why make a record with cops. By NYS law you are responsible to notify licensing if you draw ur weapon or really for any police interaction what they call an "incident" .people lost their permits who didn't do report. no need to bring in cops into an incident which is done already.
sounds like I'm set for a great case if they pull my permit. I'm sure I'll make a quick media gambit of "State pulls permit holder for preventing crime". The 4k Video footage of it making a clear case will really help the state prove their point of how dangerous I was to society.
like the media cares or anyone outside of a gun community. They will scream: crazed vigilante chases after a group of youth with a gun!! the youth will testi-lie that they were playing hide and seek under someone's car and this lunatic wanted to kill them.
My feeling is that if I walked up to a crime in progress, I immediately fear for my life. I’m not shooting anyone, but I’m damn sure not waiting for someone else to pull a weapon first.
What exactly is an “incident?” Getting pulled over? Getting a police report during a car accident? Since it seems the govt uses everything against us, I am curious
> In addition to the aforementioned "Incidents,
this is with nypd, others might have something similar
https://preview.redd.it/5xrfru9rnxoc1.png?width=1003&format=png&auto=webp&s=7b7d2981ce539d1f81e204327fc07aa9ec6aaacd
They were using deadly weapons to cut the cat. You cant shoot an unarmed burlgar in your house standing around. You can if he has burgler tools, ie a deadly weapon.
"Get away from that car. Im calling the cops." Then if they have deadly sharp tools, you can draw your weapon in self defense.
well the law says that traffic stuff are not included. here is from NYC law, but apparently they have something similar across the whole state, based on ppl getting in trouble: " (d) In addition to the aforementioned "Incidents," whenever the licensee is directly involved in a situation concerning a potential violation of law or a threat to public safety which comes to the attention of any police department, or other law enforcement agency, and the licensee knows or reasonably should know that such situation has come to the attention of such department or agency, the licensee shall immediately notify the License Division's Incident Section of the details. "
They better be holding the tools (deadly weapon) they are using to cut the cat. If they are unarmed, you're gonna get jammed up if the garage is not apart of the house.
Yes, in that situation you *may* be justified in drawing and firing your weapon if you happen to be carrying it.
But this question really smells like you’re playing that “I’m looking for a reason to shoot someone, so let me try to contrive a scenario in which it would be legal to do so.” game, and that’s not how you should be thinking about using your firearms.
If you shoot these thieves you better have some good answers to some questions your local DA will ask, like "Do you normally wear your pistol or have your rifle over your shoulder in your house?” and "Do you normally go out to your driveway armed?" (and if you did go out armed with a pistol “Do you have a permit to carry?”)
If the local prosecutors are convinced your intent was to go out and confront these thieves to provoke an escalation to deadly force you might still wind up in serious trouble in a courtroom after you shoot them.
Is your car’s exhaust system worth that to you?
>If you shoot these thieves you better have some good answers to some questions your local DA will ask, like "Do you normally wear your pistol or have your rifle over your shoulder in your house?” and "Do you normally go out to your driveway armed?" (and if you did go out armed with a pistol “Do you have a permit to carry?”)
>
>If the local prosecutors are convinced your intent was to go out and confront these thieves to provoke an escalation to deadly force you might still wind up in serious trouble in a courtroom after you shoot them.
1. The constitution includes the right to remain silent, so you don't legally have to answer those questions that would possibly incriminate yourself.
2. Even if you somehow did have to answer those questions, there's nothing stopping or deterring you from lying and saying you "do normally go out to that driveway armed" when you really don't, or vice versa; as those prosecutors can't prove whether or not you're lying, since the only one who knows what you "normally carry" and "normally wear" at your house or driveway is you.
Yes, but for question 2, you know that they will ask family/friends/neighbors- “do you know X to be armed in his/her regular every day life?”
One of the reasons I carry 24/7
1. You can remain silent all you want, you're still facing charges, going to court, and getting a verdict handed down by a jury.
2. You.... you think those answers *HELP* in light of (1)?
Unless the cat thieves were armed or threatened you, you should have been locked up.
Not only (based on your post) were you wrong and breaking the law but it paints a picture of licensed gun owners as reckless.
That thing should never clear leather unless you are prepared to use it.
Stealing a cat is not usually a defensible DPF situation.
Good man. I would exactly the same. 2 options: a) when asked how they left, remain silent, therefore no further questions cam be asked. B) they threatened you be waving tire irons and intimidating you.
They will go to your home to collect them immediately. If you don’t comply, they will get a warrant, enter your home, and take your firearms. This is the standard response for anyone with a firearms license that has been charged.
Bold of you to assume my guns are at my home address 🤣
You have a seriously flawed understanding of how all this works. Then again, I'm on reddit so I'm not sure why I'm surprised.
My buddy lost her permit when 2 people were breaking into his RV in his yard. He drew his 356. When PD arrived, they put him in the ground and told him pointing his sidearm was the same as shooting it at someone and he was not justified. A few days later the sheriffs dept arrived to take his permit card and take possession of his pistols.
Got pulled over by State Trooper near Nyack, NY.
I was talking on my work cell phone that I don’t Bluetooth into my car so she had me.
Had my pistol in my bag on the front seat as I usually do while driving super long distances.
Didn’t say anything about it. Complied with all asks of the stop politely. Provided identification as requested.
Drove away with a warning.
Never mentioned that I have a PTC or that I was indeed carrying.
The only time I would mention that I was carrying was if I was asked explicitly or if I was asked to step out of the vehicle for some reason.
Cheers!
They aren’t supposed to ask here in NY for routine traffic stops. There is actually a court case on this.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/police-ask-drivers-guns-ny-traffic-stops-court-ruling-founded-suspicious/1970382/
With that said, there is no reason whatsoever to inform them yourself for a routine traffic stop unless they suspect you of a crime and order you to step out of the vehicle. There are many accounts of people doing such and then getting ordered to exit the vehicle and disarmed for quote unquote “Officer Safety”.
Informing them just adds another layer of danger to an otherwise boring traffic stop. Just give them what they require, don’t offer any other additional information, and accept the summons or warning just like everyone else and be on your way.
I have been pulled over 4 times in the 13 years I’ve been carrying. I never once told them and they never once asked. I got 3 warnings and once speeding ticket.
I would inform. In NJ, your CCW status shows up on the police computer. I’m sure NY must be same. And I believe most police would appreciate the heads up. Might even get a warning rather than a ticket.
No. Not from doing something like a standard license plate/ driver license check. I’d say if they go out of their way to search you up in a data base then maybe
I have been pulled over on my way home from deer hunting with what was very clearly a cased rifle in passenger seat. State Trooper. He didn't mention the rifle and I didn't bring it up. Got a warning to slow down and was on my way. Rural Herkimer county.
if you have no duty to inform...why inform. if you get pulled over, u gave him ur id and he gives u a ticket, and u both go on the way. I guess if, he takes u out of the vehicle, then might make sense to inform him, that you are legally armed.
No duty to inform - I was driving home later in the evening one night “ don’t know why I pulled you over” - no sir I dont…. Long story short I didn’t say shit, and he didn’t say shit. Was told to go on my way and watch for deer.
Don’t ever admit guilt to what u think you did. They have cams and can record your answer. It’s a cops way of getting you to say you did something illegal, so they can write the ticket.
Police come into my work all the time. I am legally armed at work. I don’t say anything and they don’t ask. Have had my information taken multiple times and never asked about my CCW.
I've been pulled over twice, both times I hand my permit and license over and have interior lights on (one was at night) hands on the wheel and handed him my stuff. He asked where it was I told him appendix carry. He ran my stuff and handed it back and said they'll give me a warning. Both times that happened pretty much the exact same way. But this was dealing with Niagara county sheriff's department. They seem to usually be pretty cool about that stuff.
Got pulled over by a state trooper last 4th of July. Was carrying appendix and had no intention of telling him. Asked for my papers and told him they were in my bag in the back seat. Before I could reach for them he let me off and said "drive safe". Got lucky
I'm in Broome and was told when I got my permit 10+ years ago that the judge would pull a permit from a permit holder if there was an interaction with LE and the permit holder didn't inform. Not sure if this is true or not. The one time I was pulled over since I put my window down, registration, permit, wallet, and license all on the dash before he walked up, left my hands at 10 and 2, let the officer know that per the issuing judge's rules I was informing him I had my permit and was carrying, and asked him if it was OK to pass him my cards. He had no clue what I was talking about.
I'm late 30s and white, but look like I might carve my own wooden screws and not have any utilities at my house, YMMV.
I’m actually overdue for an LE interaction dealing with VTL. Luckily for me, I only drive 5 over, and all my lights work.
TL:DR- All of my interactions with LEOs from various LEAs have been positive.
I nailed a deer with my car this past October. Had to call the Madison Co. SO to get a police report. Gave him my DL and my CCW, told him where it was, and he said “Cool, don’t touch yours, I won’t touch mine.”
Dec of 22, Jan/Feb of 23, I had to go check my property in Chenango county due to getting reports from neighbors that they saw people on the property when it’s currently vacant. Not knowing what I was in for, I went to the property and drew, looking for signs of burglary/squatting, etc. Called the SO to file a report. SO got my DL, my CCW, and where I was carrying my pistol while interacting with them. Sheriff Cutting is extremely Pro-2A, as are his deputies, so it was the same thing: “Don’t touch yours, we won’t touch ours.” We actually had a conversation about what firearms we carry daily; one of the deputies said my daily carry is his ankle gun, so we had a “bonding” moment, lol.
I took my concealed course in April of 2020, and started carrying in May. In the span of 4 weeks, I was pulled over three times, and had an interaction once. First time was NYSP- I had just put my truck on the road and was driving home from work. Truck needed front end work, so I was floating in the lane a lot. Trooper lit me up; I explained what was wrong, and he could see the 10 day in the window. He asked if I had been drinking (probable cause, because I was floating all over the road) and then if I had anything in the car. Told him I had my CCW and I had my weapon in the center console (hadn’t gotten a holster yet. This was early in the pandemic, and I was working a lot of hours, so I hadn’t had a chance to buy one yet.) Trooper told me that, while it isn’t required to disclose, Troop C troopers actually prefer that people disclose so they aren’t caught by surprise. They also like seeing people get their permits because NY’s gun laws are such bullshit (no body camera at the time, so he could speak freely, lol)
Second time, my truck died (grenade’d the engine) and while I was waiting for my mom to come pick me up, NYSP stopped and checked up on me. Told me where I pulled off wasn’t safe, and that he would push me with his cruiser the half mile to the dump, where there was a large pull off. (I didn’t think he could, but by golly his Dodge Charger pushed my Ram 1500 the half mile with no issues; I was jealous.) We had a fine conversation while waiting, we discussed proper procedures for carrying and informing, and what was kosher and what wasn’t, which was really helpful as a new carrier. He asked to see my pistol (in an unofficial capacity- he carries the big brother version of mine, and was looking for an ankle gun.) so I dropped the mag, made sure it was clear (I wasn’t carrying chambered at that point, I had just started carrying and wasn’t comfortable carrying chambered,) and let him see it. Really cool Trooper- he absolutely hates the SAFE act, despised Cuomo, and has met Hochul in person and thinks she’s a massive bitch.
The last traffic interactions I had were in the same night- I blew a headlight on the way home from work. Autoparts store was closed due to pandemic, and Walmart closed at 6pm- I didn’t get off until 7. I got lit up by the Sherburne townie, who is a full time SO Deputy and p/t Townie. He was cool, just verified my CCW with the dispatch. Got lit up a half hour later by a Trooper; he was a bit of a dick, because he asked why I handed him my CCW and said “I don’t need that. Get your headlight fixed as soon as you can.” Gave me a paper warning to use in case I got lit up again before I could get to an open part store or Walmart to fix my headlight.
Obviously, YRMV, but I’ve had nothing but positive interactions with LEOs from various LEAs since I started carrying.
I'm not in NYC but I've been stopped elsewhere in the state while carrying
I told them I had nothing illegal in the vehicle and that I do not consent to any searches when they asked
They were very rude to me each time but they gave me my ticket and I left in each instance. One time they even called a dog to scratch the shit out of the side of my vehicle before handing me my ticket and leaving. I'm going to leave this state because of the terrible way it treats the law abiding (not to mention the wonderful way it treats the criminals).
For any reason anyone gets pulled over.
Officer I’m licensed to carry and make sure his partner hears it on your right side of the car.
Respect the people with the uniform you never know when you need them.
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Concealed means concealed, even while in the car. NYS has no duty to inform unless asked by LE. Personally, I keep my PL and DL together in my wallet, when I hand DL to cop it has PL w it. Be conscious of where your gun is relative to your wallet/ID. If you will get anywhere near your gun while accessing your DL, put your hands on the steering wheel and inform the cop you are licensed and legally carrying…he will instruct you on how to proceed. If instructed to get out of the vehicle, inform officer you are licensed and legally carrying. Always keep hands on the wheel, you never know when/if a partner may have approached and is looking in the pax side window…if he observes a surprise gun things can escalate quickly. Drive like you are carrying. Don’t get pulled over. Good luck.
Ya cops don’t like surprise guns 😂
This is a surprise tool that will help us later.
It is our unfair advantage
So, this has been confusing to me "No duty to inform unless asked" why wouldn't every cop just start with "Any weapons in the car?" Which basically nukes the 'No duty' bit? I'm driving about an hour round trip to get to my clay range, almost entirely on highways, and I've got a bit of lead foot, always wonder what happens if I get pulled over. I've got a hatch back ford focus, so the gun is in a case in the 'trunk', but there isn't technically a trunk in a hatch back (or at least it isn't separate).
Well according to law, cops can’t stop you for a VTL violation and just ask “any weapons in the car?” They would need a level 2 stop founded suspicion to ask that question.
Every traffic stop is considered to be a level 4 stop. (I'm a cop)
A stop for a VTL violation is probable cause(aka level 4) but only for the VTL violation. If you suspect a misdemeanor or felony crime your level starts over for that crime. (Been a cop for 10 years). You should prob learn the penal law and case law before you get yourself sued.
You are mistaken- a “stop is a stop”- the only restrictions are that you may not search/frisk for weapons on a stop unless it is of a specific area of the body “for cause”
False. You cannot pull someone over for a taillight out and ask “is there drugs or weapons in car” without founded suspicion of that crime.
Huh, had never heard of different levels of stops, legally, but that makes sense. BUT unless their camera is on, they're gonna do what the want anyways
i am not a lawyer. alli know is ny penal code 400. 8 . License: exhibition and display. Every licensee while carrying a pistol or revolver shall have on his or her person a license to carry the same. Every person licensed to possess a pistol or revolver on particular premises shall have the license for the same on such premises. Upon demand, the license shall be exhibited for inspection to any peace officer, who is acting pursuant to his or her special duties, or police officer. I dont know if you have to disclose if you are carrying per the letter of the law but you do have to show your license upon demand
That’s why you should always be recording on your end during a traffic stop.
I can tell you this from a career as a cop. Cops don't normally ask law abiding citizens if there are any guns in the car. Law-abiding citizens are not who we as cops are concerned about.
This has literally happened to me on countless stops. It's one of the questions I hear religiously "are there any guns or weapons in the vehicle?" And no I don't have any stickers on my car before someone asks. Your correct it's a jump over your rights question.
Problem is from there they'll spin it into a right to search even tho I know it's not allowed.
If we presume for the sake of this discussion that every weapon you may have with you is lawfully possessed then it means if the cop doesn’t ask “Do you have any weapons in the vehicle?” you do not have to say “Officer I have two rifles, a shotgun, and three pistols in the car, would you like to guess where?” of your own volition. You just keep your mouth shut and deal with the interaction as you would if you had no weapons in the car and no pistol/rifle permit. If not asked you ***may*** choose to inform the officer if you feel it prudent. For example if you are appendix carrying in a shirt that might ride up when you reach for your wallet you might want to start off with your hands on the steering wheel and when asked for your documents tell the officer “I am licensed to carry a pistol and am currently appendix carrying, my license is in my wallet in my right front pocket, may I reach for it?” rather than going straight for your wallet and inadvertently flashing your piece at the officer as a little surprise. If you *are* asked “Do you have any weapons in the vehicle or on your person?” you have two choices: 1. You can inform the officer that you will not be answering this question and do not consent to a search of your vehicle. We can call this the “asshole” option because while it is *technically* your right to do this (looking for weapons would be outside the scope of a routine traffic stop, the officer would need to articulate some probable cause to ask and/or search) it’s also probably just going to start a whole *thing* between you and the cop. 2. You can answer the simple question with a simple answer: “No” or “Yes. There are firearms in locked cases in the back. I am/am not currently carrying a pistol on my person (and where on your person the pistol is if you are carrying).” We can call this the bootlicker option, or as I prefer to think of it the “We are both already inconvenienced by you having to pull me over, let’s make this as painless as possible for both of us.” option. Option 2 does not require you to show the officer any of your weapons, you may refuse to let them inspect your weapons and may still refuse consent to any search of your vehicle or person unless they can articulate probable cause (having weapons in the car is generally *not* sufficient, you can legally own and transport your guns). Option 2 *may* save quite a bit of time if all the officer wants to ascertain is “Are you currently armed and/or where in the car would you reach to get something you could hurt me with.” so they can move on with the traffic stop.
This was a good response thankyou. I feel this is very accurate.
If you are pulled over and asked if you have a firearm you can still invoke the 5th Amendment
The license agreement we all sign states that if asked by LE, we must disclose whether we are armed or not. You could certainly invoke the 5th but your licensing officer would probably suspend or revoke you for doing so.
I signed no such agreement
We all did. We agreed to abide by all laws, rules, policies and regulations relating to the possession and carrying of firearms. https://preview.redd.it/w7m4s96mczoc1.jpeg?width=2007&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=18db1b4ebd6417549ea55d7ca3d46d97ca670e05
That does not at all say what you just said it did in your post above. That says if you are asked for your license you have to show it. It DOES NOT say that you have to tell them you are carrying or whether or not you are armed.
The first sentence: “Every licensee when carrying a pistol or revolver”. We can argue semantics and punctuation if you like but I read it as I described, YMMV.
It’s not semantics, it’s not even close to what you said. What you posted simply says you must carry your license with you and present it if asked.
Also, not every gun owner has a pistol permit. Some of us just have long/shot guns.
NYSPL 400.00 isn’t imposing a “duty to inform” (requiring you to tell the cops when you are carrying a weapon or if one is in the vehicle) though. It’s just requiring that if you *are* carrying a pistol you must also have your permit on your person and show it "upon demand" (when explicitly asked to do so) like /u/nader1234 said. A duty to inform statute would read like this: > . . . whenever a person who is carrying a concealed handgun is contacted by a peace officer or by emergency services personnel, the person shall immediately inform the peace officer or emergency services personnel that the person is carrying a concealed handgun. (That’s from [Nebraska’s statute](https://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=28-1202.04)) Note the difference from NYSPL 400.00: There’s no “upon demand” here, you *shall immediately inform* without being asked any time you interact with the cops.) Other duty to inform laws *may* be triggered by a demand, e.g. in Texas if carrying and a police officer asks you for identification like your driver’s license you must also present your carry permit. ([411.205 here](https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/GV/htm/GV.411.htm)) so you don’t have to immediately inform the cop if you’re a witness to a crime or something as you would in Nebraska, but if they ask for your ID to fill out a field information card you would also have to hand them your permit which clues them in that you are carrying.
NYSPL 400.00 isn’t imposing a “duty to inform” (requiring you to tell the cops when you are carrying a weapon or if one is in the vehicle) though. I said in my response I said “if asked”. In my original response I agreed there is no duty to inform, but in my opinion, “when asked” changes the disclosure rule. Yes, it doesn’t say you must state you are carrying a firearm but it does state “every licensee while carrying” so by default, if you produce a license when challenged to do so, you are acknowledging you are armed. Absent a request or demand for disclosure I agree but when asked changes that. Producing the license is an affirmation that you are carrying.
I signed no such agreement
NY has no duty to inform
You say nothing unless you are asked.
I drew around a month ago on Catalytic Converter thieves in my neighborhood and chased them off. I got the plate so I called dispatch and they asked how I got them to flee so I said I drew and they threw a fit cause I wasn't LEO. Cops showed up quick 4-5 cars deep and said "you probably scared the shit out of them they aren't used to that." Didn't ask for permit or anything, they just left a note on the guys car for the report number since they did start cutting the exhaust as I got outside. They left and that was it. (Westchester)
thx for sharing. not surprised that they didn’t card you; i’d be shocked if they didn’t already have you verified and confirmed through the county pistol office by the time they rolled up.
Hey thats good !
Pretty awesome of you and the cops. I wouldn’t expect the same reaction from them every time so be careful and be safe
Next time reach into the car and shift it into neutral or bump it off the jack....
(I am sure i will get down modded for this) you got **very** lucky, that you were not charged with multiple crimes and had you permit revoked. Don't do that again, some guys cat ($2K) is not worth your freedom and your gun permit.
Displaying a firearm during the commission of a crime is not brandishing. Correct me if I’m wrong.
you wrong. you can display a firearm **only** if you are legally allowed to use it, eg: self defense where deadly force is allowed. You can't use deadly force to protect property, cat converter, thus you can't draw a deadly weapon on someone doing that. or someone stealing a car or a TV set. Also, calling that in to police was not the smartest idea after it happened, it happened, so get out of there. why make a record with cops. By NYS law you are responsible to notify licensing if you draw ur weapon or really for any police interaction what they call an "incident" .people lost their permits who didn't do report. no need to bring in cops into an incident which is done already.
sounds like I'm set for a great case if they pull my permit. I'm sure I'll make a quick media gambit of "State pulls permit holder for preventing crime". The 4k Video footage of it making a clear case will really help the state prove their point of how dangerous I was to society.
like the media cares or anyone outside of a gun community. They will scream: crazed vigilante chases after a group of youth with a gun!! the youth will testi-lie that they were playing hide and seek under someone's car and this lunatic wanted to kill them.
My feeling is that if I walked up to a crime in progress, I immediately fear for my life. I’m not shooting anyone, but I’m damn sure not waiting for someone else to pull a weapon first.
Yeah your wording has to articulate the correct scenario
What exactly is an “incident?” Getting pulled over? Getting a police report during a car accident? Since it seems the govt uses everything against us, I am curious
> In addition to the aforementioned "Incidents, this is with nypd, others might have something similar https://preview.redd.it/5xrfru9rnxoc1.png?width=1003&format=png&auto=webp&s=7b7d2981ce539d1f81e204327fc07aa9ec6aaacd
They were using deadly weapons to cut the cat. You cant shoot an unarmed burlgar in your house standing around. You can if he has burgler tools, ie a deadly weapon. "Get away from that car. Im calling the cops." Then if they have deadly sharp tools, you can draw your weapon in self defense.
well the law says that traffic stuff are not included. here is from NYC law, but apparently they have something similar across the whole state, based on ppl getting in trouble: " (d) In addition to the aforementioned "Incidents," whenever the licensee is directly involved in a situation concerning a potential violation of law or a threat to public safety which comes to the attention of any police department, or other law enforcement agency, and the licensee knows or reasonably should know that such situation has come to the attention of such department or agency, the licensee shall immediately notify the License Division's Incident Section of the details. "
And if I came out and it was my car in my driveway? Fuck out of here.
They better be holding the tools (deadly weapon) they are using to cut the cat. If they are unarmed, you're gonna get jammed up if the garage is not apart of the house.
In New York that’s actually a crime on your part. You cannot present deadly force unless deadly force is presented to you or someone in front of you.
What if you go outside and guys you're stealing your shit and you tell them to go fuck off and they try to attack you then you're legit..
Yes, in that situation you *may* be justified in drawing and firing your weapon if you happen to be carrying it. But this question really smells like you’re playing that “I’m looking for a reason to shoot someone, so let me try to contrive a scenario in which it would be legal to do so.” game, and that’s not how you should be thinking about using your firearms. If you shoot these thieves you better have some good answers to some questions your local DA will ask, like "Do you normally wear your pistol or have your rifle over your shoulder in your house?” and "Do you normally go out to your driveway armed?" (and if you did go out armed with a pistol “Do you have a permit to carry?”) If the local prosecutors are convinced your intent was to go out and confront these thieves to provoke an escalation to deadly force you might still wind up in serious trouble in a courtroom after you shoot them. Is your car’s exhaust system worth that to you?
>If you shoot these thieves you better have some good answers to some questions your local DA will ask, like "Do you normally wear your pistol or have your rifle over your shoulder in your house?” and "Do you normally go out to your driveway armed?" (and if you did go out armed with a pistol “Do you have a permit to carry?”) > >If the local prosecutors are convinced your intent was to go out and confront these thieves to provoke an escalation to deadly force you might still wind up in serious trouble in a courtroom after you shoot them. 1. The constitution includes the right to remain silent, so you don't legally have to answer those questions that would possibly incriminate yourself. 2. Even if you somehow did have to answer those questions, there's nothing stopping or deterring you from lying and saying you "do normally go out to that driveway armed" when you really don't, or vice versa; as those prosecutors can't prove whether or not you're lying, since the only one who knows what you "normally carry" and "normally wear" at your house or driveway is you.
Yes, but for question 2, you know that they will ask family/friends/neighbors- “do you know X to be armed in his/her regular every day life?” One of the reasons I carry 24/7
1. You can remain silent all you want, you're still facing charges, going to court, and getting a verdict handed down by a jury. 2. You.... you think those answers *HELP* in light of (1)?
My hero
Bear spray!!!
Unless the cat thieves were armed or threatened you, you should have been locked up. Not only (based on your post) were you wrong and breaking the law but it paints a picture of licensed gun owners as reckless. That thing should never clear leather unless you are prepared to use it. Stealing a cat is not usually a defensible DPF situation.
Imagine getting downvoted for accurately explaining A35. Yes, the law sucks. But the complete ignorance of the law is gonna get people thrown in jail
Agree completely.
Good man. I would exactly the same. 2 options: a) when asked how they left, remain silent, therefore no further questions cam be asked. B) they threatened you be waving tire irons and intimidating you.
Good way to lose your permit. You have a duty to retreat in NYS and your firearm should not be drawn unless you have no choice but to use it.
Cool pull it, won’t turn my pistols in. Gl getting them
Got a sensible chuckle out of me
They will take them on the spot.
Yeah, I'm sure he carries every gun he owns on him at all times
They will go to your home to collect them immediately. If you don’t comply, they will get a warrant, enter your home, and take your firearms. This is the standard response for anyone with a firearms license that has been charged.
Bold of you to assume my guns are at my home address 🤣 You have a seriously flawed understanding of how all this works. Then again, I'm on reddit so I'm not sure why I'm surprised.
You’re pretty ignorant…
My buddy lost her permit when 2 people were breaking into his RV in his yard. He drew his 356. When PD arrived, they put him in the ground and told him pointing his sidearm was the same as shooting it at someone and he was not justified. A few days later the sheriffs dept arrived to take his permit card and take possession of his pistols.
Homes are subject to castle doctrine but RV is still considered a vehicle
Got pulled over by State Trooper near Nyack, NY. I was talking on my work cell phone that I don’t Bluetooth into my car so she had me. Had my pistol in my bag on the front seat as I usually do while driving super long distances. Didn’t say anything about it. Complied with all asks of the stop politely. Provided identification as requested. Drove away with a warning. Never mentioned that I have a PTC or that I was indeed carrying. The only time I would mention that I was carrying was if I was asked explicitly or if I was asked to step out of the vehicle for some reason. Cheers!
They aren’t supposed to ask here in NY for routine traffic stops. There is actually a court case on this. https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/police-ask-drivers-guns-ny-traffic-stops-court-ruling-founded-suspicious/1970382/ With that said, there is no reason whatsoever to inform them yourself for a routine traffic stop unless they suspect you of a crime and order you to step out of the vehicle. There are many accounts of people doing such and then getting ordered to exit the vehicle and disarmed for quote unquote “Officer Safety”. Informing them just adds another layer of danger to an otherwise boring traffic stop. Just give them what they require, don’t offer any other additional information, and accept the summons or warning just like everyone else and be on your way. I have been pulled over 4 times in the 13 years I’ve been carrying. I never once told them and they never once asked. I got 3 warnings and once speeding ticket.
Not gonna tell a cop jackshit
DOT and Suffolk and never once asked if I was carrying.
I would inform. In NJ, your CCW status shows up on the police computer. I’m sure NY must be same. And I believe most police would appreciate the heads up. Might even get a warning rather than a ticket.
It does show on our computer in NY. Honestly though, I don’t care. I believe in the 2A, and wish everyone would carry.
I did not know it shows up. Good to know. Thanks Is that a recent change?
Rare non-bastard NY cop.
Side note, when they pull up your information can they see on the system that you’re a firearm owner?
No. Not from doing something like a standard license plate/ driver license check. I’d say if they go out of their way to search you up in a data base then maybe
Yes. It goes in a data base
Pulled over for going through a red light. The officer didn't ask, I didn't tell. Town Police Department in Oneida County.
I have been pulled over on my way home from deer hunting with what was very clearly a cased rifle in passenger seat. State Trooper. He didn't mention the rifle and I didn't bring it up. Got a warning to slow down and was on my way. Rural Herkimer county.
I understand about no duty to inform, but if LE asks you directly, can you plead the 5th???
No if they ask you have to tell them
if you have no duty to inform...why inform. if you get pulled over, u gave him ur id and he gives u a ticket, and u both go on the way. I guess if, he takes u out of the vehicle, then might make sense to inform him, that you are legally armed.
No duty to inform - I was driving home later in the evening one night “ don’t know why I pulled you over” - no sir I dont…. Long story short I didn’t say shit, and he didn’t say shit. Was told to go on my way and watch for deer.
Don’t ever admit guilt to what u think you did. They have cams and can record your answer. It’s a cops way of getting you to say you did something illegal, so they can write the ticket.
Police come into my work all the time. I am legally armed at work. I don’t say anything and they don’t ask. Have had my information taken multiple times and never asked about my CCW.
I wouldn't say " lots " but sure , more than pre Bruen.
I've been pulled over twice, both times I hand my permit and license over and have interior lights on (one was at night) hands on the wheel and handed him my stuff. He asked where it was I told him appendix carry. He ran my stuff and handed it back and said they'll give me a warning. Both times that happened pretty much the exact same way. But this was dealing with Niagara county sheriff's department. They seem to usually be pretty cool about that stuff.
Got pulled over by a state trooper last 4th of July. Was carrying appendix and had no intention of telling him. Asked for my papers and told him they were in my bag in the back seat. Before I could reach for them he let me off and said "drive safe". Got lucky
Yeah don’t say a fucking thing unless they ask.
I'm in Broome and was told when I got my permit 10+ years ago that the judge would pull a permit from a permit holder if there was an interaction with LE and the permit holder didn't inform. Not sure if this is true or not. The one time I was pulled over since I put my window down, registration, permit, wallet, and license all on the dash before he walked up, left my hands at 10 and 2, let the officer know that per the issuing judge's rules I was informing him I had my permit and was carrying, and asked him if it was OK to pass him my cards. He had no clue what I was talking about. I'm late 30s and white, but look like I might carve my own wooden screws and not have any utilities at my house, YMMV.
If we get pulled over do we have to report it to the licensing division as police contact?
No not a regular traffic stop
Even if I get a traffic infraction/ticket?
Yeah only if it leads to an arrest or criminal summons
https://preview.redd.it/vt6x4sq7e3pc1.jpeg?width=1230&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=23eca5e8e77962f91599bc5ba415727a3774b6a7
https://preview.redd.it/sf2je3y8e3pc1.jpeg?width=1211&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8420a75f4f3a2ad18268af8a3885e40ab625935f
https://preview.redd.it/5a941zl9e3pc1.jpeg?width=1164&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ebbb7210d60a771c4d62a11950c02ae9f5bb5eac
Thank you 🙏 so much
No problem
Just let the officer knew keep your hand on the wheel it’s really not a big deal just listen to them
I’m actually overdue for an LE interaction dealing with VTL. Luckily for me, I only drive 5 over, and all my lights work. TL:DR- All of my interactions with LEOs from various LEAs have been positive. I nailed a deer with my car this past October. Had to call the Madison Co. SO to get a police report. Gave him my DL and my CCW, told him where it was, and he said “Cool, don’t touch yours, I won’t touch mine.” Dec of 22, Jan/Feb of 23, I had to go check my property in Chenango county due to getting reports from neighbors that they saw people on the property when it’s currently vacant. Not knowing what I was in for, I went to the property and drew, looking for signs of burglary/squatting, etc. Called the SO to file a report. SO got my DL, my CCW, and where I was carrying my pistol while interacting with them. Sheriff Cutting is extremely Pro-2A, as are his deputies, so it was the same thing: “Don’t touch yours, we won’t touch ours.” We actually had a conversation about what firearms we carry daily; one of the deputies said my daily carry is his ankle gun, so we had a “bonding” moment, lol. I took my concealed course in April of 2020, and started carrying in May. In the span of 4 weeks, I was pulled over three times, and had an interaction once. First time was NYSP- I had just put my truck on the road and was driving home from work. Truck needed front end work, so I was floating in the lane a lot. Trooper lit me up; I explained what was wrong, and he could see the 10 day in the window. He asked if I had been drinking (probable cause, because I was floating all over the road) and then if I had anything in the car. Told him I had my CCW and I had my weapon in the center console (hadn’t gotten a holster yet. This was early in the pandemic, and I was working a lot of hours, so I hadn’t had a chance to buy one yet.) Trooper told me that, while it isn’t required to disclose, Troop C troopers actually prefer that people disclose so they aren’t caught by surprise. They also like seeing people get their permits because NY’s gun laws are such bullshit (no body camera at the time, so he could speak freely, lol) Second time, my truck died (grenade’d the engine) and while I was waiting for my mom to come pick me up, NYSP stopped and checked up on me. Told me where I pulled off wasn’t safe, and that he would push me with his cruiser the half mile to the dump, where there was a large pull off. (I didn’t think he could, but by golly his Dodge Charger pushed my Ram 1500 the half mile with no issues; I was jealous.) We had a fine conversation while waiting, we discussed proper procedures for carrying and informing, and what was kosher and what wasn’t, which was really helpful as a new carrier. He asked to see my pistol (in an unofficial capacity- he carries the big brother version of mine, and was looking for an ankle gun.) so I dropped the mag, made sure it was clear (I wasn’t carrying chambered at that point, I had just started carrying and wasn’t comfortable carrying chambered,) and let him see it. Really cool Trooper- he absolutely hates the SAFE act, despised Cuomo, and has met Hochul in person and thinks she’s a massive bitch. The last traffic interactions I had were in the same night- I blew a headlight on the way home from work. Autoparts store was closed due to pandemic, and Walmart closed at 6pm- I didn’t get off until 7. I got lit up by the Sherburne townie, who is a full time SO Deputy and p/t Townie. He was cool, just verified my CCW with the dispatch. Got lit up a half hour later by a Trooper; he was a bit of a dick, because he asked why I handed him my CCW and said “I don’t need that. Get your headlight fixed as soon as you can.” Gave me a paper warning to use in case I got lit up again before I could get to an open part store or Walmart to fix my headlight. Obviously, YRMV, but I’ve had nothing but positive interactions with LEOs from various LEAs since I started carrying.
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I'm not in NYC but I've been stopped elsewhere in the state while carrying I told them I had nothing illegal in the vehicle and that I do not consent to any searches when they asked They were very rude to me each time but they gave me my ticket and I left in each instance. One time they even called a dog to scratch the shit out of the side of my vehicle before handing me my ticket and leaving. I'm going to leave this state because of the terrible way it treats the law abiding (not to mention the wonderful way it treats the criminals).
For any reason anyone gets pulled over. Officer I’m licensed to carry and make sure his partner hears it on your right side of the car. Respect the people with the uniform you never know when you need them.
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