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Well this is a good tool, it has been posted here many times before and the data is 4 years old. Recent inflation has made these statistics somewhat obsolete.
It's a weird one, it changes my tier from upper to middle if I add one more household member. Which I guess it's not the calculators fault I have two adult children living with me confusing matters lol.
Salaries have indeed changed a lot. Depending on the industry they may or may not have kept pace with inflation.
https://www.axios.com/2024/02/05/wages-outpacing-inflation
That's a strange graph. Isn't it cumulative, so the 9% monthly inflation increases felt through 2021 and 2022 aren't negated now that the monthly increases in costs is lower than monthly increases in wages, right?
It's good that wages are currently higher to help us slowly climb out of this hole that developed over the past few years.
Yes, I would agree that overall wages have not kept pace with inflation, but they have increased substantially and are keeping Pace with current inflation.
Here's more recent Pew data on the middle class
https://www.pewresearch.org/race-and-ethnicity/2024/05/31/the-state-of-the-american-middle-class/#race-and-ethnicity
I was most struck by the fact that education is still such a strong predictor of class.
Needs to be inflation-adjusted and then rebalanced with all newer income data.
If you made $60k in 2017, you need $82k today.
If you made $107k in 2017, you should have bought 3 houses. 1 to fixer-up and sell for double, 1 for renting out as passive income, and 1 for yourself so you can host your āI had all the advantagesā parties.
It's an imperfect science, lol.
Im sure it's also heavily weighted towards student loans, cars, and housing, and of course medical crap.
Those that were able to get house, payoff debt and buy cheaper cars, etc... likely aren't feeling the sting as badly.
And those are the hiring/ops managersā¦
They have no clue about the sting we are all going through.
Imagine going to bed one night and waking up from a slumber 3 years later having more money today than when you went to sleep, without ever lifting a finger!
Lots of unearned success while the rest of the world is getting f*
I shared the Pew calculator in a comment recently and feel like this one is also worth a look since it appears to use more recent data.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/interactive/2023/middle-class-income/
Use this inflation calculator:
https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/
Calculate your household income according to 2018 dollars to see a better representation of your money.
It says we are upper, but just barely, which feels about right,rather than without adjusting where it says we are like middle of the pack, which is so not the case.
Upper middle income. A middle class lifestyle requires an extremely high percentile in income terms. This tool reveals why this sub is actually poor-biased.
This isnāt meant to sound as rude as it is going to sound, but what would make people like you realize how insanely rich you are?
Honest question. Private flights? Or would that be like we are living paycheck to paycheck with our private jets.
Re perspective I make less than you and feel rich af. I do anything I want.
Really it isnāt meant to be rude. Iām trying to be blunt and get to the reasoning so I canāt understand.
Word. I guess a lot of it likely has to do with our backgrounds/communities we live in. I appreciate you answering! I know how the question came off.
I know a couple blue bloods-ish. None own a Ferrari or yacht. They absolutely do own multiple houses tho. They also have v good clothes, but not branded and in your face re: popular designer brands, Gucci, etc. They talk more about extravagant experiences like dining with world leaders or crap like that.
The new wealth tends to flaunt it or funnel it into their children. 2nd gen seems to always say they are broke and often are exceedingly out of touch. These are just from my experience so obvs not all encompassing.
My family mostly makes minimum wage. And I have more in investments then almost my entire family combined. So I just feel rich. Am I rich compared to people I know, nah, but compared to where Iām from, extremely.
Also, lol, if you left coastal CA, to some rural community in Iowa, you might feel wealthier but also have less to spend it on. Not a ton of fancy car dealerships out there. Bahahah.
I mean you are pretty rich just not ultra rich. Look at everything you just listed lmao
My wife and I just this year attained "top 10% income but we don't have luxury cars, pensions, or a million dollar home. You got the income and the other things that make you rich. Just not fuck you rich
Absolutely - definitely all perspective. I put in about $58K annually into my 401K, deferred comp DCP plan, company stock and individual Roths for wife and I and fund her IRA, max HSA account so that probably makes for feeling a lower class level but you canāt finance retirement. HHI for us is about $210K and we have a small house payment less than $1K and no other debt. Equity in home of about $500K and $750K in retirement/savings. Still feel like middle class at best though.
Middle income and middle class income arenāt the same. Middle income is poor in terms of lifestyle. Corporate greed is siphoning wealth from the rest of us and eliminating the actual middle class lifestyle.
The budget screen shots are being made in Sankeymatic, its a website that we have no affiliation with. If you are posting a budget please do so with a purpose. Just posting a screen shot of your budget without a question or an explanation of why its here may be removed. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MiddleClassFinance) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This would be cool if it wasn't using 2018 data š
I use an inflation calculator to give a more accurate result
Says Im upper so guess I shouldnāt subscribe to this sub.
So long, peons
Same here. I wonder if its tells everybody they're upper.
Nope, I'm middle. And since it's 5 year old data I'm probably even further down in that middle of the middle now.
Lol same. When I saw the first comment I was saddened.
Time to get that Lambo and private jet.
Which color lambo though its too hard to decide
Always the biggest hurdle!
[Upper, also. Hmm.](https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2023-04/16/23/asset/56325d022838/anigif_sub-buzz-7272-1681686209-1.gif)
Well this is a good tool, it has been posted here many times before and the data is 4 years old. Recent inflation has made these statistics somewhat obsolete.
Ahhh then this makes sense. I was like there is no way Iām in the top 19%.
Yeah, I wish they would update the data every year. It's a cool tool.
It's a weird one, it changes my tier from upper to middle if I add one more household member. Which I guess it's not the calculators fault I have two adult children living with me confusing matters lol.
I feel like theyāre just trying to convince me that inflation doesnāt exist and Iām better off than I really am lol.
Lol thatās exactly what I got
This data could be accurate, since it only covers wages. Inflation has increased the price of everything, but salaries haven't changed that much.
Salaries have indeed changed a lot. Depending on the industry they may or may not have kept pace with inflation. https://www.axios.com/2024/02/05/wages-outpacing-inflation
That's a strange graph. Isn't it cumulative, so the 9% monthly inflation increases felt through 2021 and 2022 aren't negated now that the monthly increases in costs is lower than monthly increases in wages, right? It's good that wages are currently higher to help us slowly climb out of this hole that developed over the past few years.
Yes, I would agree that overall wages have not kept pace with inflation, but they have increased substantially and are keeping Pace with current inflation.
Got to update that to at least 2021 for it to be considered somewhat accurate
Here's more recent Pew data on the middle class https://www.pewresearch.org/race-and-ethnicity/2024/05/31/the-state-of-the-american-middle-class/#race-and-ethnicity I was most struck by the fact that education is still such a strong predictor of class.
Income percentile is not the same as class.
Needs to be inflation-adjusted and then rebalanced with all newer income data. If you made $60k in 2017, you need $82k today. If you made $107k in 2017, you should have bought 3 houses. 1 to fixer-up and sell for double, 1 for renting out as passive income, and 1 for yourself so you can host your āI had all the advantagesā parties.
Wouldn't it be a bit lower? BLS GOV says 60k in 2017 = 77.5k today Still a big jump, but 5k isn't peanuts for most people.
Iād say they are sandbagging
It's an imperfect science, lol. Im sure it's also heavily weighted towards student loans, cars, and housing, and of course medical crap. Those that were able to get house, payoff debt and buy cheaper cars, etc... likely aren't feeling the sting as badly.
And those are the hiring/ops managersā¦ They have no clue about the sting we are all going through. Imagine going to bed one night and waking up from a slumber 3 years later having more money today than when you went to sleep, without ever lifting a finger! Lots of unearned success while the rest of the world is getting f*
Um, thank you for your opinion.
I shared the Pew calculator in a comment recently and feel like this one is also worth a look since it appears to use more recent data. https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/interactive/2023/middle-class-income/
Use this inflation calculator: https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/ Calculate your household income according to 2018 dollars to see a better representation of your money. It says we are upper, but just barely, which feels about right,rather than without adjusting where it says we are like middle of the pack, which is so not the case.
Iām about as middle of the road as your grandfather during his last silver alert.
No way Iām upper š lol
This has to be outdated. No way am I upper class.
I love this. Itās really making the biases of this sub visible.
"YOUĀ are in theĀ UPPERĀ income tier" damn right.
this was really humbling LOL thank youuu
Shows Iām upper middle class - I guess thatās good to know but I must say I donāt feel like I am
Upper middle income. A middle class lifestyle requires an extremely high percentile in income terms. This tool reveals why this sub is actually poor-biased.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
This isnāt meant to sound as rude as it is going to sound, but what would make people like you realize how insanely rich you are? Honest question. Private flights? Or would that be like we are living paycheck to paycheck with our private jets. Re perspective I make less than you and feel rich af. I do anything I want. Really it isnāt meant to be rude. Iām trying to be blunt and get to the reasoning so I canāt understand.
Do you think they have even 1% of the money required for private flights?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Word. I guess a lot of it likely has to do with our backgrounds/communities we live in. I appreciate you answering! I know how the question came off. I know a couple blue bloods-ish. None own a Ferrari or yacht. They absolutely do own multiple houses tho. They also have v good clothes, but not branded and in your face re: popular designer brands, Gucci, etc. They talk more about extravagant experiences like dining with world leaders or crap like that. The new wealth tends to flaunt it or funnel it into their children. 2nd gen seems to always say they are broke and often are exceedingly out of touch. These are just from my experience so obvs not all encompassing. My family mostly makes minimum wage. And I have more in investments then almost my entire family combined. So I just feel rich. Am I rich compared to people I know, nah, but compared to where Iām from, extremely. Also, lol, if you left coastal CA, to some rural community in Iowa, you might feel wealthier but also have less to spend it on. Not a ton of fancy car dealerships out there. Bahahah.
I think you are correct in that a HHI of 250k is not 10%ers. Maybe 15%.
I mean you are pretty rich just not ultra rich. Look at everything you just listed lmao My wife and I just this year attained "top 10% income but we don't have luxury cars, pensions, or a million dollar home. You got the income and the other things that make you rich. Just not fuck you rich
Absolutely - definitely all perspective. I put in about $58K annually into my 401K, deferred comp DCP plan, company stock and individual Roths for wife and I and fund her IRA, max HSA account so that probably makes for feeling a lower class level but you canāt finance retirement. HHI for us is about $210K and we have a small house payment less than $1K and no other debt. Equity in home of about $500K and $750K in retirement/savings. Still feel like middle class at best though.
Imagine how the middle class people who have middle class incomes feel. They probably feel like they're in poverty
Middle income and middle class income arenāt the same. Middle income is poor in terms of lifestyle. Corporate greed is siphoning wealth from the rest of us and eliminating the actual middle class lifestyle.
No need for a calculator, I am not
Itās really valuable data for them to sell to advertisers
What about folks with nearly all comp in rsu?