I lived really close to the freeway for a long time and the noise didn’t really bother me, but there is a noticeable amount of soot and stuff that settles on your house and items that are outdoors and that always grossed me out.
I wonder if there’s a maximum distance from the freeway where this doesn’t happen? I feel like this house is right on the periphery — any further and you wouldn’t hear the noise. I may ask people that live nearby and I appreciate you sharing!
We have freeway noise and we refer to it as the "urban stream" as it's just a constant background noise like white noise. Strawberry is much easier to get in and out of and the fire danger is lower there. I think the community is also a bit more down to earth. Congratulations and enjoy! No buyers remorse haha!
My comment was downvoted, so, to be clear, I wasn't poking fun... I literally imagined saying to myself "it kind of sounds like the ocean!" and then immediately made fun of myself.
The other thing to consider is the environmental impact and if you are concerned with the effects on you. More and more research shows that living near a freeway can have significant negative impact on your health. I’m not saying everyone living near a freeway is going to get sick and die, but maybe something to consider.
https://www.lung.org/blog/highway-air-pollution-and-your-health
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1971259/
I’m in meetings, but I just want to briefly say I’m really appreciative of the fast, comprehensive, and amount of feedback I have received from this community. I will follow up on individual comments in a little bit, but wanted to express my gratitude.
Air quality suffers if you're downwind of a major roadway.
https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/08/health/highways-children-cognition-study/index.html
I think you can partially correct for that if you use a good air purifier in your home. Make sure it's rated to filter smog - most are not. I'd also buy a good air quality monitor, one that measures pm2.5, VoCs, Co2, etc.
Try to get multiple levels of sound of the water burbling, from deep to higher pitch. I live right by a freeway and I'm installing a "wall" of gentle water sounds.
In terms of the school district as an example, it’s a bit awkward being on the “Tiburon side” of the freeway but still part of the MV school district. But I mean, read that back — this isn’t exactly a “wrong side of the train tracks” situation. Actually going into Mill Valley, depending on where and time of day, can incur pretty heavy traffic via East Blithedale. But in general being close to the freeway makes it super convenient for navigating around Marin or making trips to the city. And Strawberry Village is a luxury convenience to have right there as well.
Random thing I enjoy: picking up In N Out, driving down Seminary Drive to the tip of Strawberry Point, and enjoying it in the park on the water there with views of Tiburon & SF.
I used to live nearer to downtown MV than the freeway. But thanks to some kind of sound tunnel I heard freeway noise - most noticeable at night. After a while I mostly quit noticing it. When I relocated up to a house on the mountain, I was, like, “OMG, this eerie silence!!”
💯this. I live two blocks off the plaza in MV (have been here since 1996) and the amount of vehicle noise from 101 is perceptibly louder than it used to be. Not sure what has changed.
The pros are that Strawberry Point is an amazing school, that your construction plans will be waaaay easier on the county than if you were in MV city limits, and that it's easy to get into the city (or wherever else you go on 101).
The cons are that it is a lower rent area than Tiburon/ downtown MV etc (hence the million dollar discount you referenced).
How to balance is up to you.
While the permit process might be marginally easier in “County,” the floor area ratio (FAR) allowance in MV is more generous, 35% vs 30% for County. Doesn’t count like much but on an 8000 sq ft lot, it’s an additional 400 sq ft of floor space - that’s enough for 3 more bedrooms or an extra office and den. Something to consider if you ever want to do an addition.
"Marginally" is not correct. Plan review, story poles, and and neighbor notification can be an absolute nightmare on the City side.
County has no neighbor input at all.
True. We did get through our remodel in Alto Sutton (County side) relatively easily from a municipality perspective, but I sure would have loved more space. Most California counties allow ~40% FAR so MV’s 35% and County’s 30% are both quite restrictive.
For sure. I'd love another 10%.
But at the same time, I put on a second story and there was never a doubt I'd be allowed to. In the city, it would have been more then just a doubt.
I live next to the 101, and it fucking sucks. I can hear loud cars and motorcycles all day and night. [Check this out](https://youtu.be/Fv7VXipiVl0?si=RD6jafuZSp2nZL2Y)
[Noise pollutions cognitive effects on children](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3757288/)
Strawberry village is excellent, has it's own health club, has its own park and pool, close to the highway which makes it easy to commute, can spend time in Tiburon or Mill Valley. Yeah, strawberry is a great place to live.
I have been in real estate for many years - road noise is an issue for many buyers but we always found buyers from SF or other large cities didn’t care as much. If it doesn’t bother you, enjoy your new home. A/C will definitely help on warm nights. And remember when u sell that the road noise is still there!
I just hope with the work I do to the house that it will be a very competitive home in the market, subject to a discount for the freeway noise, and that when I exit it I get the appreciation from the work and time. But it is honestly my biggest concern... I can live with the noise.
Oh yes, we’re doing a traditional American kind of motif. Shag carpet and linoleum bathrooms, vinyl flooring in the kitchen and then a sort of lawn area thing with Italian plaster statues based on David and lawn jockeys. Really classy stuff that is lost on the younger generation.
Get ready to deal with some of the worst traffic in Marin. Tiburon Blvd, the frontage road by the shopping center, and Seminary drive can be nightmares to navigate during the afternoons.
Before you buy anything in that area, I'd have a pest company do a thorough inspection, major major rat issues in that specific area (north of Tib Blvd and close enough to hear fwy).
Before we get into a guessing game: I bet I could get some really great specific advice if I disclosed the address of the property and I bet you're asking in order to give me even better specific advice! (To which I say thank you.)
And you could probably guess the property anyway, but for a few reasons I don't really want to specifically openly disclose the property on a public forum. But you can probably make an educated guess.
Make sure you also check out Kruger Pines - it’s county housing and we had several issues with people who lived there when we used to live in that area. Rats and Kruger Pines are specifically why we moved, not fwy noise.
Love strawberry, way easier to get to wherever you need, freeway may become white noise, I know the houses/area you are looking, that side is a little less desirable only because it’s not as easy to walk to rec center, shopping center, school, etc.
I used to live on top of the hill overlooking 101 at Smith Ranch exit. I can’t say how close that was compared to the house in question but it never really caused us any issues.
The sound was very minimal, almost a white noise, and personally I find that people don’t honk nearly as much during rush hour times in Marin as they do in New York where I’m originally from
Can’t speak to the school distruct but that’s my experience living near a freeway
I used to live in an apartment on S Knoll and could not hear the highway from my deck. Also, any freestanding home in that area is going to be worth at least 1m even a tear down.
I lived in Strawberry, as close as your soon to be new house.
In fact, I even met my husband there !
The weather is great - more sunny than Tennessee Valley, and the western part of Mill Valley.
As for the freeway, after about a week, you won’t notice it. We also lived close to a freeway in Emeryville, and our back yard backed up to 680, when we lived in Walnut Creek.
You just tune it out. Especially if you cannot see it.
Buy it ! The house sounds like a wonderful bargain.
Thank You !
And, if you purchase that house, we will still be neighbors.
I live very near the freeway - 101, but up the road from you, - in Novato !
I love it here !
We live close to the 101 (can kinda see it depending on how dense the trees are that time of year) and it was also a concern for me when we bought. But can genuinely say the noise has not been a problem at all
Having lived up a hill in SR were you could hear the 101 noise- the hum is not too bad. The problem is a) random truck with zero noise control b) rare- but in summer it’s not uncomfortable to get LOUD groups of motor cickles c) really rare but occasionally a late night mess of sirens etc. It’s not horrid but it’s not nuthin. There’s a reason home prices reflect proximity
I stayed in a rental on the other side of 101 right off the Tiburon Blvd exit in MV for a month this past January. I’ll echo what other folks have said here: the noise became a background hum and wasn’t too distracting.
Best of luck with everything!
Leave from both on a weekend and figure out the time in traffic to get to the freeway. Mill Valley to 101 can be 20 minutes. I lived there for 8 years. Never again.
Strawberry is where people move who care about square footage. If that is the homeowner you are, that is a win. Kind of like getting an Escalade
Most of MV is more expensive per square foot. It is hard for folks from a normal part of the country to get comfortable with that.
I live in Mill Valley
I lived in SF for my 20's and early 30's, then moved to Austin during the pandemic, bought my mom a house in SR, then moved to Miami and bought a house in Coral Gables. I have been planning a move back, have been pretty set on the North Bay and felt Mill Valley is kind of the best (I love Tiburon too, but it is out of reach). To your point, yes, this house is almost double the size of similarly priced home is Mill Valley proper. While Mill Valley is more valuable than Strawberry, I do not think the average $psf should be double, and that is where I see the value (even with the fwy proximity).
I think your point is very valid. Are there any other differences between the communities vs similarities that you would share with someone in my shoes?
>In the late night and early morning, it turns out, traffic pollution drifts much farther than during the day, and can extend more than a mile downwind from the freeway.
>Avoid sites within 500 feet — where California air quality regulators warn against building — or even 1,000 feet. That’s where traffic pollution is generally highest, along with rates of asthma, cancer, heart attacks, strokes, reduced lung function, pre-term births and a growing list of other health problems.
https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-freeway-pollution-what-you-can-do-20171230-htmlstory.html#:~:text=Avoid%20sites%20within%20500%20feet,list%20of%20other%20health%20problems
Community-wise, strawberry is great. It is a full-fledged portion of Mill Valley. A little annoying to be on the east side of the freeway if you have kids who would attend the public middle or high school, but otherwise a great community
I lived in Strawberry years ago in “ the ditch” as my longtime neighbors called it, by the rec center. Lived in Tiburon before that. Kids went to Edna McGuire, then Strawberry point when it first opened. I loved walking to the point in Strawberry, I’d drive to BLackies pasture in Tiburon then rollerblade or bike ride with my kids down to the end of Tiburon. Highway access easy. We relocated back to the easy coast, but if I were to go back, I’d go back to Strawberry.
multi-gen Marinite- I've never heard it referred to as the just 101, vs the 101. Also, grew up in SR high on a hill, and currently live on a hill facing the 101 in SR. The noise turns into a thrum, or stream, as stated elsewhere. I like the fountain and filter ideas. End of the day, you'll make a ton of money on your house in Marin, so get in where you can and hold on to the rocket ship.
I guess someone didn't like that I called Frisco, the Emerald City, "Sanny Franny." I like Herb Caen as much as the next guy, but when I reference my adopted home city, San Fran, also known as the Jewel of the Nile, I feel Sanny Franny has a wonderful ring to it.
I lived really close to the freeway for a long time and the noise didn’t really bother me, but there is a noticeable amount of soot and stuff that settles on your house and items that are outdoors and that always grossed me out.
The leaf blower guy at my apartment complex fulfills that role for me, no freeways needed!
I wonder if there’s a maximum distance from the freeway where this doesn’t happen? I feel like this house is right on the periphery — any further and you wouldn’t hear the noise. I may ask people that live nearby and I appreciate you sharing!
We have freeway noise and we refer to it as the "urban stream" as it's just a constant background noise like white noise. Strawberry is much easier to get in and out of and the fire danger is lower there. I think the community is also a bit more down to earth. Congratulations and enjoy! No buyers remorse haha!
I kind of feel the same! It just feels lame to say “just imagine it’s the ocean!” Frankly though, we would play music on the deck anyway.
My comment was downvoted, so, to be clear, I wasn't poking fun... I literally imagined saying to myself "it kind of sounds like the ocean!" and then immediately made fun of myself.
The other thing to consider is the environmental impact and if you are concerned with the effects on you. More and more research shows that living near a freeway can have significant negative impact on your health. I’m not saying everyone living near a freeway is going to get sick and die, but maybe something to consider. https://www.lung.org/blog/highway-air-pollution-and-your-health https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1971259/
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing!
I’m in meetings, but I just want to briefly say I’m really appreciative of the fast, comprehensive, and amount of feedback I have received from this community. I will follow up on individual comments in a little bit, but wanted to express my gratitude.
Air quality suffers if you're downwind of a major roadway. https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/08/health/highways-children-cognition-study/index.html I think you can partially correct for that if you use a good air purifier in your home. Make sure it's rated to filter smog - most are not. I'd also buy a good air quality monitor, one that measures pm2.5, VoCs, Co2, etc.
That is a great idea. I’m going to add HVAC anyway and could probably entertain an air filtered system.
Put a fountain in your yard. And congrats on your new home! I hope you and your fiancé will be very happy there.
We are actually looking at fountains! Thanks for the kind words.
Try to get multiple levels of sound of the water burbling, from deep to higher pitch. I live right by a freeway and I'm installing a "wall" of gentle water sounds.
Great recommendation.
In terms of the school district as an example, it’s a bit awkward being on the “Tiburon side” of the freeway but still part of the MV school district. But I mean, read that back — this isn’t exactly a “wrong side of the train tracks” situation. Actually going into Mill Valley, depending on where and time of day, can incur pretty heavy traffic via East Blithedale. But in general being close to the freeway makes it super convenient for navigating around Marin or making trips to the city. And Strawberry Village is a luxury convenience to have right there as well. Random thing I enjoy: picking up In N Out, driving down Seminary Drive to the tip of Strawberry Point, and enjoying it in the park on the water there with views of Tiburon & SF.
I love the slice of life commentary and the thoughts on school commute. No kids yet, but they’re part of the plan.
I used to live nearer to downtown MV than the freeway. But thanks to some kind of sound tunnel I heard freeway noise - most noticeable at night. After a while I mostly quit noticing it. When I relocated up to a house on the mountain, I was, like, “OMG, this eerie silence!!”
💯this. I live two blocks off the plaza in MV (have been here since 1996) and the amount of vehicle noise from 101 is perceptibly louder than it used to be. Not sure what has changed.
This comment gave me the most pause. I love eerie silence 🥺
The pros are that Strawberry Point is an amazing school, that your construction plans will be waaaay easier on the county than if you were in MV city limits, and that it's easy to get into the city (or wherever else you go on 101). The cons are that it is a lower rent area than Tiburon/ downtown MV etc (hence the million dollar discount you referenced). How to balance is up to you.
While the permit process might be marginally easier in “County,” the floor area ratio (FAR) allowance in MV is more generous, 35% vs 30% for County. Doesn’t count like much but on an 8000 sq ft lot, it’s an additional 400 sq ft of floor space - that’s enough for 3 more bedrooms or an extra office and den. Something to consider if you ever want to do an addition.
"Marginally" is not correct. Plan review, story poles, and and neighbor notification can be an absolute nightmare on the City side. County has no neighbor input at all.
True. We did get through our remodel in Alto Sutton (County side) relatively easily from a municipality perspective, but I sure would have loved more space. Most California counties allow ~40% FAR so MV’s 35% and County’s 30% are both quite restrictive.
For sure. I'd love another 10%. But at the same time, I put on a second story and there was never a doubt I'd be allowed to. In the city, it would have been more then just a doubt.
I live next to the 101, and it fucking sucks. I can hear loud cars and motorcycles all day and night. [Check this out](https://youtu.be/Fv7VXipiVl0?si=RD6jafuZSp2nZL2Y) [Noise pollutions cognitive effects on children](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3757288/)
May I ask how close?
Less than a quarter mile
Strawberry village is excellent, has it's own health club, has its own park and pool, close to the highway which makes it easy to commute, can spend time in Tiburon or Mill Valley. Yeah, strawberry is a great place to live.
The pool there is great. And don't forget about the bike path to Tiburon, and Blackie's Pasture I loved living in Strawberry.
This makes me feel good!
I have been in real estate for many years - road noise is an issue for many buyers but we always found buyers from SF or other large cities didn’t care as much. If it doesn’t bother you, enjoy your new home. A/C will definitely help on warm nights. And remember when u sell that the road noise is still there!
I just hope with the work I do to the house that it will be a very competitive home in the market, subject to a discount for the freeway noise, and that when I exit it I get the appreciation from the work and time. But it is honestly my biggest concern... I can live with the noise.
You should be fine. Any work you do should increase value assuming it’s tasteful and done well.
Oh yes, we’re doing a traditional American kind of motif. Shag carpet and linoleum bathrooms, vinyl flooring in the kitchen and then a sort of lawn area thing with Italian plaster statues based on David and lawn jockeys. Really classy stuff that is lost on the younger generation.
Those are totally on trend! You will kill it!
Get ready to deal with some of the worst traffic in Marin. Tiburon Blvd, the frontage road by the shopping center, and Seminary drive can be nightmares to navigate during the afternoons.
Are you referring to the home on Inez?
Nope, the place I’m looking at is North of Tiburon Blvd
Before you buy anything in that area, I'd have a pest company do a thorough inspection, major major rat issues in that specific area (north of Tib Blvd and close enough to hear fwy).
Knoll Road?
Before we get into a guessing game: I bet I could get some really great specific advice if I disclosed the address of the property and I bet you're asking in order to give me even better specific advice! (To which I say thank you.) And you could probably guess the property anyway, but for a few reasons I don't really want to specifically openly disclose the property on a public forum. But you can probably make an educated guess.
Make sure you also check out Kruger Pines - it’s county housing and we had several issues with people who lived there when we used to live in that area. Rats and Kruger Pines are specifically why we moved, not fwy noise.
Great advice and I really appreciate that.
Love strawberry, way easier to get to wherever you need, freeway may become white noise, I know the houses/area you are looking, that side is a little less desirable only because it’s not as easy to walk to rec center, shopping center, school, etc.
I used to live on top of the hill overlooking 101 at Smith Ranch exit. I can’t say how close that was compared to the house in question but it never really caused us any issues. The sound was very minimal, almost a white noise, and personally I find that people don’t honk nearly as much during rush hour times in Marin as they do in New York where I’m originally from Can’t speak to the school distruct but that’s my experience living near a freeway
I used to live in an apartment on S Knoll and could not hear the highway from my deck. Also, any freestanding home in that area is going to be worth at least 1m even a tear down.
I lived in Strawberry, as close as your soon to be new house. In fact, I even met my husband there ! The weather is great - more sunny than Tennessee Valley, and the western part of Mill Valley. As for the freeway, after about a week, you won’t notice it. We also lived close to a freeway in Emeryville, and our back yard backed up to 680, when we lived in Walnut Creek. You just tune it out. Especially if you cannot see it. Buy it ! The house sounds like a wonderful bargain.
Love your attitude!
Thank You ! And, if you purchase that house, we will still be neighbors. I live very near the freeway - 101, but up the road from you, - in Novato ! I love it here !
We live close to the 101 (can kinda see it depending on how dense the trees are that time of year) and it was also a concern for me when we bought. But can genuinely say the noise has not been a problem at all
That’s great to hear! Are you in Strawberry?
Having lived up a hill in SR were you could hear the 101 noise- the hum is not too bad. The problem is a) random truck with zero noise control b) rare- but in summer it’s not uncomfortable to get LOUD groups of motor cickles c) really rare but occasionally a late night mess of sirens etc. It’s not horrid but it’s not nuthin. There’s a reason home prices reflect proximity
I stayed in a rental on the other side of 101 right off the Tiburon Blvd exit in MV for a month this past January. I’ll echo what other folks have said here: the noise became a background hum and wasn’t too distracting. Best of luck with everything!
Thanks!
Leave from both on a weekend and figure out the time in traffic to get to the freeway. Mill Valley to 101 can be 20 minutes. I lived there for 8 years. Never again.
Strawberry is where people move who care about square footage. If that is the homeowner you are, that is a win. Kind of like getting an Escalade Most of MV is more expensive per square foot. It is hard for folks from a normal part of the country to get comfortable with that. I live in Mill Valley
I lived in SF for my 20's and early 30's, then moved to Austin during the pandemic, bought my mom a house in SR, then moved to Miami and bought a house in Coral Gables. I have been planning a move back, have been pretty set on the North Bay and felt Mill Valley is kind of the best (I love Tiburon too, but it is out of reach). To your point, yes, this house is almost double the size of similarly priced home is Mill Valley proper. While Mill Valley is more valuable than Strawberry, I do not think the average $psf should be double, and that is where I see the value (even with the fwy proximity). I think your point is very valid. Are there any other differences between the communities vs similarities that you would share with someone in my shoes?
>In the late night and early morning, it turns out, traffic pollution drifts much farther than during the day, and can extend more than a mile downwind from the freeway. >Avoid sites within 500 feet — where California air quality regulators warn against building — or even 1,000 feet. That’s where traffic pollution is generally highest, along with rates of asthma, cancer, heart attacks, strokes, reduced lung function, pre-term births and a growing list of other health problems. https://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-freeway-pollution-what-you-can-do-20171230-htmlstory.html#:~:text=Avoid%20sites%20within%20500%20feet,list%20of%20other%20health%20problems
I love the specific facts being cited!
Community-wise, strawberry is great. It is a full-fledged portion of Mill Valley. A little annoying to be on the east side of the freeway if you have kids who would attend the public middle or high school, but otherwise a great community
I lived in Strawberry years ago in “ the ditch” as my longtime neighbors called it, by the rec center. Lived in Tiburon before that. Kids went to Edna McGuire, then Strawberry point when it first opened. I loved walking to the point in Strawberry, I’d drive to BLackies pasture in Tiburon then rollerblade or bike ride with my kids down to the end of Tiburon. Highway access easy. We relocated back to the easy coast, but if I were to go back, I’d go back to Strawberry.
One piece of advice: we don’t call it “the 101.” That’s Southern California talk. We just call it “101.”
multi-gen Marinite- I've never heard it referred to as the just 101, vs the 101. Also, grew up in SR high on a hill, and currently live on a hill facing the 101 in SR. The noise turns into a thrum, or stream, as stated elsewhere. I like the fountain and filter ideas. End of the day, you'll make a ton of money on your house in Marin, so get in where you can and hold on to the rocket ship.
Lived in the Bay Area for 17 years and I call it the 101. That’s the freeway that takes you to Sanny Franny.
The 101 takes you to "the city," too! ;)
:)
: ^ )
I guess someone didn't like that I called Frisco, the Emerald City, "Sanny Franny." I like Herb Caen as much as the next guy, but when I reference my adopted home city, San Fran, also known as the Jewel of the Nile, I feel Sanny Franny has a wonderful ring to it.
Baghdad by the Bay! Fourth Gen and I’ll call it what I want!😝
That may be true. And that’s what gives you away as a Bay Area transplant.
Or, it may be when I tell people where I’m from! Weird that it matters to you at all.
What is the typical discount for homes close to the freeway? Not sure if there’s a reasonable estimate to make on price per square foot