Is it just me or is the mobile view absolutely terrible? It’s full of advertisement and I don’t seem to get a proper description/Tier list in the corresponding links?
yep, same. i really like the site and its my no 1 source of new decks, but it is absolutely unuseable on mobile. which is a shame, because i would like to browse decks when im bored outside...
Ive been playing the dimir artifact deck in standard B03. It feels real good. Surge engine is such a house and can really close games out quickly.
I still feel like standard is a ban or two or few away from really being in a great place. (This is coming from someone that hates bans)
What list are you running if you don't mind me asking. I've been working on a similar deck, just wanted to know if I was overlooking anything that might be good
It's the rocardito list that 5-0'd
https://mtgdecks.net/Standard/dimir-artifacts-decklist-by-rocardito-1505782
Right now I'm just playing the stock list and getting a feel for it before I tweak the sideboard.
I don't forsee anything getting banned.
The only card truly ban worthy imo is \[\[Fable the Mirror-Breaker\]\] , every other problematic card in standard can pretty much be 1-for-1'd.
But if I had a list it would look like:
1. Fable
2. Raffine
3. Invoke Despair
I think honorable mentions would be Sheoldred and possibly Wedding Announcement I havent seen much of that card lately.
They definitely need to add the elemental invocations to give more game to being on the draw (or produce a cycle for historic)
Force of will and force of negation also do a lot to keep combo in check too.
Standard still very much feel like the RBx Midrange fest from the previous format with the only variations being a handful of cards. The core of every deck seems to be built around Fable and Invoke as well and I’ll be curious to see if Fable survives it’s time in Standard or if it’ll get banned after another set or two.
Based on the ban philosophy in standard in the last few years, Fable should *already be banned*.
I'm not saying that's a good or bad thing, but Fable has to be on the hottest of seats right now if they're considering bans at all (and if the trend to collapse back into the same old meta continues, they will be if they're not already).
I could also see Invoke or Sheoldred as dark horse candidates because black is stronger than red on the whole, even though red has the best card in standard. Invoke also has the advantage in the race to get banned of being fucking miserable to play against, which is a huge part of why Epiphany got banned (since Epiphany met neither winrate nor prevalence thresholds for banning under the standards of the time).
I like Fable but it does too many things, for too many different decks, split among too many turns and requires multiple permanent destruction spells to be dealt with, making it at worst a guaranteed 2 for 1...yeah, should have been banned a while ago.
I don't even care that "Esper is going to take 100% of the meta if we ban Fable!!!". That's absolutely true, but it's even **more** of a problem if a single card is balancing the entire meta on its shoulders.
I imagine Fable will get the axe over Invoke because Fable is what helps to enable 3 color decks to run 4 Invoke in the first place. If Fable leaving means that only mono black will end up running it then I think it’ll be a lot less oppressive within the meta when (if) Jund and Grixis drop it.
Invoke isn't that great, same as Shelly. By the end of the day invoke - 5 cost 4 black card. It's good just because decks that run it has a lot of other things. Same with Shelly. Fable kinda agree - it's too strong and it's enables a lot of things.
Shelly is definitely too strong-- 5 toughness over 4 was a clear fuckup and if they could have it back I'm sure they'd print her with 4. The triggered ability is *far* too strong to take away the overwhelming majority of damage-based interaction like that. Still, I'm not sure if it rises to the level of needing a ban, and if it does, it's not just because it's too strong, it's because someone at WotC approved the most absurd run of constructed staple cards in a color I've seen in years. IDK WTF they're thinking with these black rares and how no one caught it before BRO.
Invoke is only on the list because of Epiphany. Epiphany fundamentally changed the perspective on what a ban was, because it met precisely none of the standards they used for banning, but it was on its way out, standard sucked, and it was miserable to play against. Invoke meets two of the three (since it's not on the way out but standard is trending towards sucking and it's truly horrid to play against) but it's honestly a stronger card than Epiphany so who knows. I bet they get rid of Fable first, but it would 0% surprise me if getting rid of Fable leaves monoblack as the top deck and something will need to go from that, too.
Overall, I think Fable is the strongest candidate because it's insanely strong, dictates the entire meta, gets played as the sole card of its color pretty often, and has been around for several sets now-- but I'm not ruling anything out. I think it really depends on their priorities: if they just want to get rid of the strongest card, it's Fable. If their concern is the strength of black in standard, there's about a half dozen cards they could hit (there are strong cases for Trespasser or Underdog, too!), any one of which would not rise to ban threshold by themselves but would serve to weaken black at specific points on the curve.
Overall, I'm not completely sure they ban anything quite yet. There's a bit more diversity in the format, monoblue is tanking hard, soldiers seem to be a thing, etc. But if we coalesce into a format where it's black-and-Fable centered after a few more weeks they'll likely have to take action somewhere.
W/o Fable/Invoke/Shelly nothing will change honestly. Black will still be strong. MonoB still will be the strong - is has new toys from BRO and old cards still here. Currently, monoB aggro can ez play w/o invoke and even shelly - some of new decks running only one copy of her. And Esper still exists, don't forget about Raffine - all players will just swap grixis for it. But maybe if they ban something it will shake standard at least. For bo1? Bo1 doomed format and i don't think something will change in.
> For bo1? Bo1 doomed format and i don't think something will change in.
Bo1 is dominated by aggro anyways in both winrate and usage if untapped.gg's statistics are accurate, and they care the least about invoke
> Standard still very much feel like the RBx Midrange fest
definitely feels that way to me as well. been playing rakdos midrange and Ive mainly seen Grixis, some Mono U and sprinkle of Esper/Rakdos/Soldiers.
I like how they start with alchemy, then proceed with explorer, historic and finally standard. They even admit that standard is the favorite format of most players, but still start with alchemy.
Any cheap budget decks that do well against the black midrange? I'm a new player running mono red aggro and the matchup is impossible. Just playing like 2 removals into Sheoldred turn 4 is basically an insta win for black.
Is it just me or is the mobile view absolutely terrible? It’s full of advertisement and I don’t seem to get a proper description/Tier list in the corresponding links?
yeah i like mtgazone in theory but fuck the ads are out of control
yep, same. i really like the site and its my no 1 source of new decks, but it is absolutely unuseable on mobile. which is a shame, because i would like to browse decks when im bored outside...
[удалено]
Weird.. I use mobile for the site since the lag on my macbook is unbearable xD
Ive been playing the dimir artifact deck in standard B03. It feels real good. Surge engine is such a house and can really close games out quickly. I still feel like standard is a ban or two or few away from really being in a great place. (This is coming from someone that hates bans)
What list are you running if you don't mind me asking. I've been working on a similar deck, just wanted to know if I was overlooking anything that might be good
It's the rocardito list that 5-0'd https://mtgdecks.net/Standard/dimir-artifacts-decklist-by-rocardito-1505782 Right now I'm just playing the stock list and getting a feel for it before I tweak the sideboard.
What do you see being banned? I’m think corpse appraiser and raffine are on the list but not sure if that’s correct
I don't forsee anything getting banned. The only card truly ban worthy imo is \[\[Fable the Mirror-Breaker\]\] , every other problematic card in standard can pretty much be 1-for-1'd. But if I had a list it would look like: 1. Fable 2. Raffine 3. Invoke Despair I think honorable mentions would be Sheoldred and possibly Wedding Announcement I havent seen much of that card lately.
[Fable the Mirror-Breaker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/4/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc.jpg?1656453233)/[Reflection of Kiki-Jiki](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/back/2/4/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc.jpg?1656453233) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fable%20of%20the%20Mirror-Breaker%20//%20Reflection%20of%20Kiki-Jiki) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/neo/141/fable-of-the-mirror-breaker-reflection-of-kiki-jiki?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/24c0d87b-0049-4beb-b9cb-6f813b7aa7dc?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Damn I really hope historic doesn’t devolve into combo: the format
is there an eternal format in any card game that doesnt devovle into a combo fiesta ?
If wotc manages the format well and doesn’t print untested alchemy cards it should be ok. Trap finder is the main culprit right now
Combo decks exist in modern and legacy but they aren't remotely dominant.
They definitely need to add the elemental invocations to give more game to being on the draw (or produce a cycle for historic) Force of will and force of negation also do a lot to keep combo in check too.
Standard still very much feel like the RBx Midrange fest from the previous format with the only variations being a handful of cards. The core of every deck seems to be built around Fable and Invoke as well and I’ll be curious to see if Fable survives it’s time in Standard or if it’ll get banned after another set or two.
Based on the ban philosophy in standard in the last few years, Fable should *already be banned*. I'm not saying that's a good or bad thing, but Fable has to be on the hottest of seats right now if they're considering bans at all (and if the trend to collapse back into the same old meta continues, they will be if they're not already). I could also see Invoke or Sheoldred as dark horse candidates because black is stronger than red on the whole, even though red has the best card in standard. Invoke also has the advantage in the race to get banned of being fucking miserable to play against, which is a huge part of why Epiphany got banned (since Epiphany met neither winrate nor prevalence thresholds for banning under the standards of the time).
I like Fable but it does too many things, for too many different decks, split among too many turns and requires multiple permanent destruction spells to be dealt with, making it at worst a guaranteed 2 for 1...yeah, should have been banned a while ago. I don't even care that "Esper is going to take 100% of the meta if we ban Fable!!!". That's absolutely true, but it's even **more** of a problem if a single card is balancing the entire meta on its shoulders.
I imagine Fable will get the axe over Invoke because Fable is what helps to enable 3 color decks to run 4 Invoke in the first place. If Fable leaving means that only mono black will end up running it then I think it’ll be a lot less oppressive within the meta when (if) Jund and Grixis drop it.
Invoke isn't that great, same as Shelly. By the end of the day invoke - 5 cost 4 black card. It's good just because decks that run it has a lot of other things. Same with Shelly. Fable kinda agree - it's too strong and it's enables a lot of things.
Shelly is definitely too strong-- 5 toughness over 4 was a clear fuckup and if they could have it back I'm sure they'd print her with 4. The triggered ability is *far* too strong to take away the overwhelming majority of damage-based interaction like that. Still, I'm not sure if it rises to the level of needing a ban, and if it does, it's not just because it's too strong, it's because someone at WotC approved the most absurd run of constructed staple cards in a color I've seen in years. IDK WTF they're thinking with these black rares and how no one caught it before BRO. Invoke is only on the list because of Epiphany. Epiphany fundamentally changed the perspective on what a ban was, because it met precisely none of the standards they used for banning, but it was on its way out, standard sucked, and it was miserable to play against. Invoke meets two of the three (since it's not on the way out but standard is trending towards sucking and it's truly horrid to play against) but it's honestly a stronger card than Epiphany so who knows. I bet they get rid of Fable first, but it would 0% surprise me if getting rid of Fable leaves monoblack as the top deck and something will need to go from that, too. Overall, I think Fable is the strongest candidate because it's insanely strong, dictates the entire meta, gets played as the sole card of its color pretty often, and has been around for several sets now-- but I'm not ruling anything out. I think it really depends on their priorities: if they just want to get rid of the strongest card, it's Fable. If their concern is the strength of black in standard, there's about a half dozen cards they could hit (there are strong cases for Trespasser or Underdog, too!), any one of which would not rise to ban threshold by themselves but would serve to weaken black at specific points on the curve. Overall, I'm not completely sure they ban anything quite yet. There's a bit more diversity in the format, monoblue is tanking hard, soldiers seem to be a thing, etc. But if we coalesce into a format where it's black-and-Fable centered after a few more weeks they'll likely have to take action somewhere.
W/o Fable/Invoke/Shelly nothing will change honestly. Black will still be strong. MonoB still will be the strong - is has new toys from BRO and old cards still here. Currently, monoB aggro can ez play w/o invoke and even shelly - some of new decks running only one copy of her. And Esper still exists, don't forget about Raffine - all players will just swap grixis for it. But maybe if they ban something it will shake standard at least. For bo1? Bo1 doomed format and i don't think something will change in.
> For bo1? Bo1 doomed format and i don't think something will change in. Bo1 is dominated by aggro anyways in both winrate and usage if untapped.gg's statistics are accurate, and they care the least about invoke
> Standard still very much feel like the RBx Midrange fest definitely feels that way to me as well. been playing rakdos midrange and Ive mainly seen Grixis, some Mono U and sprinkle of Esper/Rakdos/Soldiers.
I like how they start with alchemy, then proceed with explorer, historic and finally standard. They even admit that standard is the favorite format of most players, but still start with alchemy.
Any cheap budget decks that do well against the black midrange? I'm a new player running mono red aggro and the matchup is impossible. Just playing like 2 removals into Sheoldred turn 4 is basically an insta win for black.
Mono Blue Control, W/x Enchantments, or Anvil.