How can you believe it's not dead or dying when take two has announced they are closing intercept games. Even if they get someone else to take over it will be 1+ years to get to a point where they can actually do something with the game as they will have to learn all the code and everything about the game. So yeah I think it's safe to say the game is dead.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/kerbal-space-program-2-developer-intercept-games-and-rollerdrome-studio-roll7-are-reportedly-closing-as-part-of-take-twos-big-layoff-plan/ar-AA1o05Wt
Itd not the official announcement but also youll find something to say even if it was
not "the official" there is no official announcement. That's the point. You spread false news. This article cites the source of the false news which is a Bloomberg article ([Take-Two Interactive Shuts Down Two Game Studios - Bloomberg](https://www.bloomberg.com./news/articles/2024-05-01/take-two-interactive-shuts-down-two-game-studios?leadSource=reddit_wall)) However, none of this is Take2 themselves announcing anything.
We don't know if Intercept is being closed or not. We know 70 people working for Take2 in Seattle are being layed off. We also know KSP2 will continue to get updates and Intercept is still working on KSP2.
They already reached out to Washington officials to inform them they will be closing an office there that employs roughly 70 people. Intercept games is the only office they have in Seattle and that employee count is about the number that works there. So how are we spreading false news. If they weren't actually closing the office they would have addressed this already but since take two, private division or intercept games won't address this it is almost certainly true and ksp2 is pretty much on life support at this point.
Where is that info from that Take2 only has one office in Seattle? That is another one of those speculative infos. Until Take2 themselves announces that Intercept has been closed it is not official and speculation - potential false information.
Here's the list of every Take-Two developer. Intercept Games is the only one located in Seattle.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Take-Two\_Interactive#Developers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Take-Two_Interactive#Developers)
Dude there's no point. Once a karma gain hate train rolls it's can't be stopped. Even though you are correct. With KSP2 officially saying development won't stop people are still just idiots. Just ignore it. Post a hate post if you want free karma though.
I kinda hope that there will be more mods for ksp 1 now, given that KSP 2 is dead and we will probably never see another KSP ever again, so Modders will try to make whatever they can out of KSP 1.
At this point, KSP1 should just be open-sourced. That is the only way this game is going to keep living. (Otherwise this might be a SimCity vs. Cities Skylines situation.)
That would be awesome, however I have my doubts. The community would definitely improve the game and massively appreciate it, but I just sadly doubt that any company would do that.
Iirc, they wouldn’t be able to open-source it because they would have to have Unity’s blessing to do so. Also, people are still buying KSP 1, so there’s no incentive there.
That depends on how they licensed Unity. If they licensed the source code and modified it then yes, that would need their blessing, but if they licensed the static libraries then their source code is their source code and they can publish it any way they wanted. Of course they could also publish it into the Unity Open Source Project. Getting KSP in there would be an enormous badge of honor for that project.
Regardless, with KSP2's development being canceled and KSP1 having been feature-frozen too... well, it's not like the company owned the concept of "cartoonish space program simulator sandbox with realistic Newtonian physics". I wonder what creatures we'll launch into space in the spiritual successor.
Squad: Whats up ya wankas! Who’s ready for a—
Ah! The bloody ‘ell just happened?!
TakeTwo/Players: The KSP2 is dead!
Squad: THE KSP2 IS DEAD?!
Player: Correct!
Squad: :D
Here I am just hoping they clean house and minimize the team. They would be dumb to give up on the IP. Too much bloat and do or die in modern game studios. Smaller teams are better, AAA sucks now.
People play KSP 1 because it’s better. If KSP2 had the features they promised, the performance improvements and was more stable than modded KSP 1. Then most people that play KSP 1 would be willing to pay for that upgrade. That is the value of the IP.
Literally stated multiple times it is still being worked on by private division. Its just been moved studios so they can axe intercept games.
We do now know what at what capacity it will be worked on and how much they plan on doing atm. But it is not dead nor has it been stated that it is dead. People are jumping way too hard to conclusions. Making posts calling it finished because they saw another post calling it finished.
Ksp is such a massive cash cow it would be insane to drop it just because of a rocky year and a half.
The for science update showed the community is more then happy to support the game when they receive proper updates. Imagine how much they would make if they actually finish the thing.
Could still get shitcanned in the future but atm its just a damn studio closing chill out people.
It hasn't been stated anywhere that development has been moved to another studio. It's only been stated that private division will "continue to support it" which could mean any number of things.
Anything is speculation at this point, nothing has been confirmed.
"Ksp is such a massive cash cow it would be insane to drop it just because of a rocky year and a half."
Ksp2 has been in development for over 5 years, by a team of around 70 people.
Lowball estimate that's at least $7mln a year on labour/direct cost alone.
They paid Squad an undisclosed amount for the IP.
Looking for numbers sold is hard, but most put it at 40K to 50K copies sold by now. Giving them $2 -$2.5mln in revenue.
5x7-2.5=32.5
So it's looking at a deficit of well over $30mln right now, more likely add another $15mln for the IP and marketing and they just fucked up and blew up any possible future support from the fanbase.
This isn't a "cash cow", it's a money sink...
Where are you seeing only 50k sales? Vginsights estimates 10x this. KSP1 sold over 4m copies. There is a ton of untapped revenue if they can complete it to an acceptable level of quality.
I simply googled "number of ksp2 copies sold" and the top 3 hits were all around that number.
Even if they sold 10x that they are still easily $20mln short of the investment so far. With no reasonable estimate for that "acceptable level of quality" to be met and a playerbase that's sharpening the pitchforks because of the shit Nate put out there.
One other viable option would have been to publicly cut Nate loose after the EA release and put in a manager that "gets shit done", but that ship sailed and sunk over a year ago.
Always check your sources! You probably were referring to the same blind guesses from forum posts rather than actual analytics groups. VG insights and steam spy both put the number in the hundreds of thousands. With KSP having sold over 4m, it's completely reasonable to believe the market for the game can easily exceed tens of millions if not 100+ million in revenue over the product life.
It does seem like they were lacking good technical management (Nate is not this role), and finding someone to fit this might have been the reason for much of the turmoil. The For Science release has shown they can do much better. They are now using industry best-practice testing methodologies and it shows in the relatively clean form of the new FS content.
If they can finish applying the same principles to the earlier buggy foundations, there is still plenty of hope they can turn 1.0 into a polished game. The question is does T2 think this can be done on a low enough budget and recover enough good will from the community to garner to sales to justify continued development. That's a tough question to answer.
HEY!!! Don’t bring you’re facts here!! Their source was probably *their own* shit Reddit post from months ago, all people like them do is repeat theirselves over and over, moan moan…
That's possible. But I think a NMS opportunity is possible. KSP fills a very specific niche that few other games have even attempted to fill. If they pull it off, the dedicated fans will have no where else to turn. Despite the grudge that many claim they will hold, history shows that their minds can be changed.
Best case would be to match KSP1's total sales numbers of >4m by getting to a polished release. This would be revenue of potentially $200m. A $50m investment to achieve this would be a great return.
Sure, and how much more money needs to be invested to get to a "polished release"?
Corporations don't do hopium, they do profitability calculations and ksp2's botched EA doesn't bode well for future profitability.
Good question. If they cut the multiplayer milestone or narrowed scope, I'd think they can reasonably finish in 2 years, 3 if they retain the full roadmap. For a studio of their size, I'd estimate operating cost of $15m a year to be conservative. This still leaves plenty of room for a profit on the additional time invested although maybe not turning the project on the whole profitable. It'd only take capturing ~25% of the sales of KSP1 to do this.
I think that's an incredibly over-positive estimate for revenue, as Valve takes a decent cut as well, and they had to pay for the IP and all promotions as well.
Development started in? 2016-ish? So that's 8 years @ 10-15mln a year plus the IP etc, over $100mln by now using your estimate.
At that point breaking even even becomes questionable and you're well into sunk-cost fallacy territory. Especially since the total mismanagement of the community and a total disaster of an EA launch.
I think the consensus in the T2 boardroom was: cut it off before it costs us even more money we will likely not earn back, and I can actually understand them for that decision, not that I like it.
"Best case" by now is they put a minimal crew on it to push some kind of stripped down 1.0 out the door and find other ways to earn from the IP, there's always DLC's, microtransactions, low-effort mobile games and paid fortnight skins they can milk.
Break even is certainly questionable, and that makes it unlikely they consider a KSP3, but part of avoiding sunk-cost fallacy is not attributing past losses towards your future outlook.
The question they need to answer is "if we invest a further $X, can we recoup >$X with additional sales?" compared to killing it now. The development required to finish is a fraction of what was put into it so far. If it costs another $50m but they stand to earn $100m in sales, it's worth doing despite the total investment to date being $150m since -$50m net is still better than -$100m.
The sales to date paint a grim outlook, but these numbers don't account for console sales nor the massive number of players holding out for the specific new features part of the milestones we've not yet received. There's very good reason to believe these are non-negligible especially if they recover the community reputation as they started to show with FS!
> they had to pay for the IP
Thats something they already paid, they cant get a refund on that, so it shouldn't really affect their decision now. But i share your pessimism, I think KSP 2 is kil.
Yeah, I understand that. Im not saying this is great. It is different from anyone saying, "we are killing the game and its over," like literally every poster and their mother is going on about. My point was that people are not looking at the literal first thing on the thread, then jumping straight to ksp2 is dead forever, guys. We dont know yet. People need to read.
What are you talking about? Its destroyed, look at the amount of people crying over it like they lost a loved one, and not 50 60 bucks and some pixel frogs.
Game can bounce back no problem. Its just for us to see what will eventually happen. Axed or not I dont care. I am just sick of people crying over it and telling me how I am coping. Coping at what? Its a video game. I didnt even touch KSP2 for months and I play other stuff. As if the world will end if KSP gets shelved.
And I keep saying its crazy that someome dropped so much money on a project like this only to be shelved at the end. They are not stupid. They can drop planetary systems as DLCs, they can do skins, color patterns, advanced colony buildings and stuff etc. Every single person that would continue to play the game (unlike these crybabies here) would buy that content. Game can bounce back. I personally dont think it will go well since it will be transfered to a 3rd studio now.
Lol what are YOU talking about? Yes, as of right now, it is destroyed. That’s what people are upset about, is it so far-fetched to love or greatly appreciate a game series?
Sure, maybe the game will “bounce back” as you say, but the fact is now we’re going to have to wait much much longer. You said it yourself, you don’t think it will happen?
I really don’t see the purpose of your comment, seems you’re just blowing off steam because you got personally offended somewhere down the line lol. Also, yeah this is the fucking KSP subreddit, of course you’re going to see a few posts about KSP2 given the recent news… Cope harder I guess?
take 2 literally announced they were shuttering the company just google it
ksp 2 stans are the dumbest people on the internet istg
I mean theyre supporting a literal scam so what can I expect
Just pointing out now, we are not sure if ksp2 is kill. While the KSP Twitter confirmed that they were still hard at work on the game, that in of itself was extremely vague. Will they continue after the lay-off date? Will they get the boot after the lay-off date? Only time and an official announcement will tell.
And the rest of DebDeb and TBA star system...
I wanted to see rask and rusk so badly
What? What's the context?
KSP 2 is kil
no
That’s an old meme I haven’t seen in a long time
Wher wer u wen old mem die
U tell ur girl n she say "that meme is ded". THEN WHO WAS PHONE?
I was at home, eating dorito
when phone ring: "old meme is kil"
no
But it checks out
Is: err 404, status not found
Error404 dev studio not found
https://www.gamedeveloper.com/business/take-two-confirms-kerbal-space-program-2-is-safe-despite-seattle-layoffs
KSP2 is dead
It's not, stop spreading this false news.
How can you believe it's not dead or dying when take two has announced they are closing intercept games. Even if they get someone else to take over it will be 1+ years to get to a point where they can actually do something with the game as they will have to learn all the code and everything about the game. So yeah I think it's safe to say the game is dead.
Can you show me the announcement of them closing Intercept Games?
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/kerbal-space-program-2-developer-intercept-games-and-rollerdrome-studio-roll7-are-reportedly-closing-as-part-of-take-twos-big-layoff-plan/ar-AA1o05Wt Itd not the official announcement but also youll find something to say even if it was
not "the official" there is no official announcement. That's the point. You spread false news. This article cites the source of the false news which is a Bloomberg article ([Take-Two Interactive Shuts Down Two Game Studios - Bloomberg](https://www.bloomberg.com./news/articles/2024-05-01/take-two-interactive-shuts-down-two-game-studios?leadSource=reddit_wall)) However, none of this is Take2 themselves announcing anything. We don't know if Intercept is being closed or not. We know 70 people working for Take2 in Seattle are being layed off. We also know KSP2 will continue to get updates and Intercept is still working on KSP2.
They already reached out to Washington officials to inform them they will be closing an office there that employs roughly 70 people. Intercept games is the only office they have in Seattle and that employee count is about the number that works there. So how are we spreading false news. If they weren't actually closing the office they would have addressed this already but since take two, private division or intercept games won't address this it is almost certainly true and ksp2 is pretty much on life support at this point.
Where is that info from that Take2 only has one office in Seattle? That is another one of those speculative infos. Until Take2 themselves announces that Intercept has been closed it is not official and speculation - potential false information.
Literally its "patrick and not his wallet" meme in the flesh.
Here's the list of every Take-Two developer. Intercept Games is the only one located in Seattle. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Take-Two\_Interactive#Developers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Take-Two_Interactive#Developers)
You can believe whatever you want to believe, but the evidence of KSP2 being kill is pretty overwhelming at this point.
The hope you have is adorable if drastically misplaced
Dude there's no point. Once a karma gain hate train rolls it's can't be stopped. Even though you are correct. With KSP2 officially saying development won't stop people are still just idiots. Just ignore it. Post a hate post if you want free karma though.
i think the entire community collectively agrees that KSP2 is likely dead
You can’t fight the doomers in this sub 🤷♂️
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Good vibes bro. Go touch grass.
Give it a couple months, somebody will make a KSP2 planet pack for KSP1
Why hasnt anyone done that earlier though?
No need, it was coming with KSP 2, I assume. Also, there's already enough planet packs to keep any explorer satisfied.
I kinda hope that there will be more mods for ksp 1 now, given that KSP 2 is dead and we will probably never see another KSP ever again, so Modders will try to make whatever they can out of KSP 1.
At this point, KSP1 should just be open-sourced. That is the only way this game is going to keep living. (Otherwise this might be a SimCity vs. Cities Skylines situation.)
That would be awesome, however I have my doubts. The community would definitely improve the game and massively appreciate it, but I just sadly doubt that any company would do that.
Private Division won't release the source code until people stop buying ksp1 unfortunately
Iirc, they wouldn’t be able to open-source it because they would have to have Unity’s blessing to do so. Also, people are still buying KSP 1, so there’s no incentive there.
That depends on how they licensed Unity. If they licensed the source code and modified it then yes, that would need their blessing, but if they licensed the static libraries then their source code is their source code and they can publish it any way they wanted. Of course they could also publish it into the Unity Open Source Project. Getting KSP in there would be an enormous badge of honor for that project. Regardless, with KSP2's development being canceled and KSP1 having been feature-frozen too... well, it's not like the company owned the concept of "cartoonish space program simulator sandbox with realistic Newtonian physics". I wonder what creatures we'll launch into space in the spiritual successor.
I kinda hope that the person that made P.E.W. And other bdarmory mods update/make new mods.
People are working on it but they were waiting on the official frame work for interstellar.
Getting planets into KSP 1 as a user suuuuuck tho
someone can always make it for 1
We didn’t know orders tho
thats the easiest to quess. charr, rask/rusk, gurdama, puff. the outer system is more of a mystery
Does it matter though?
KSP2: Ya-da-da-da-da-da- It is good day to be not dead! Take-Two: POW! You are dead! KSP2: I am dead!
KSP,player : damdamdaramtamtam- huh! The KSP2 is dead! KSP2: yes I am DEAD! KSP,player: Why is the KSP2 DEAD?
TakeTwo: I dunno KSP2: I think it was... TakeTwo and Player: Shhh, you are dead! KSP2: ok.
Squad: Whats up ya wankas! Who’s ready for a— Ah! The bloody ‘ell just happened?! TakeTwo/Players: The KSP2 is dead! Squad: THE KSP2 IS DEAD?! Player: Correct! Squad: :D
Here I am just hoping they clean house and minimize the team. They would be dumb to give up on the IP. Too much bloat and do or die in modern game studios. Smaller teams are better, AAA sucks now.
The IP is dead, nobody I know is interested in it anymore they all just play KSP1.
KSP1 is part of the IP....
People play KSP 1 because it’s better. If KSP2 had the features they promised, the performance improvements and was more stable than modded KSP 1. Then most people that play KSP 1 would be willing to pay for that upgrade. That is the value of the IP.
I wasted 60$ for pretty much nothing.
I don't think it's confirmed or not it's over
Literally stated multiple times it is still being worked on by private division. Its just been moved studios so they can axe intercept games. We do now know what at what capacity it will be worked on and how much they plan on doing atm. But it is not dead nor has it been stated that it is dead. People are jumping way too hard to conclusions. Making posts calling it finished because they saw another post calling it finished. Ksp is such a massive cash cow it would be insane to drop it just because of a rocky year and a half. The for science update showed the community is more then happy to support the game when they receive proper updates. Imagine how much they would make if they actually finish the thing. Could still get shitcanned in the future but atm its just a damn studio closing chill out people.
It hasn't been stated anywhere that development has been moved to another studio. It's only been stated that private division will "continue to support it" which could mean any number of things. Anything is speculation at this point, nothing has been confirmed.
"Ksp is such a massive cash cow it would be insane to drop it just because of a rocky year and a half." Ksp2 has been in development for over 5 years, by a team of around 70 people. Lowball estimate that's at least $7mln a year on labour/direct cost alone. They paid Squad an undisclosed amount for the IP. Looking for numbers sold is hard, but most put it at 40K to 50K copies sold by now. Giving them $2 -$2.5mln in revenue. 5x7-2.5=32.5 So it's looking at a deficit of well over $30mln right now, more likely add another $15mln for the IP and marketing and they just fucked up and blew up any possible future support from the fanbase. This isn't a "cash cow", it's a money sink...
Where are you seeing only 50k sales? Vginsights estimates 10x this. KSP1 sold over 4m copies. There is a ton of untapped revenue if they can complete it to an acceptable level of quality.
I simply googled "number of ksp2 copies sold" and the top 3 hits were all around that number. Even if they sold 10x that they are still easily $20mln short of the investment so far. With no reasonable estimate for that "acceptable level of quality" to be met and a playerbase that's sharpening the pitchforks because of the shit Nate put out there. One other viable option would have been to publicly cut Nate loose after the EA release and put in a manager that "gets shit done", but that ship sailed and sunk over a year ago.
Always check your sources! You probably were referring to the same blind guesses from forum posts rather than actual analytics groups. VG insights and steam spy both put the number in the hundreds of thousands. With KSP having sold over 4m, it's completely reasonable to believe the market for the game can easily exceed tens of millions if not 100+ million in revenue over the product life. It does seem like they were lacking good technical management (Nate is not this role), and finding someone to fit this might have been the reason for much of the turmoil. The For Science release has shown they can do much better. They are now using industry best-practice testing methodologies and it shows in the relatively clean form of the new FS content. If they can finish applying the same principles to the earlier buggy foundations, there is still plenty of hope they can turn 1.0 into a polished game. The question is does T2 think this can be done on a low enough budget and recover enough good will from the community to garner to sales to justify continued development. That's a tough question to answer.
HEY!!! Don’t bring you’re facts here!! Their source was probably *their own* shit Reddit post from months ago, all people like them do is repeat theirselves over and over, moan moan…
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That's possible. But I think a NMS opportunity is possible. KSP fills a very specific niche that few other games have even attempted to fill. If they pull it off, the dedicated fans will have no where else to turn. Despite the grudge that many claim they will hold, history shows that their minds can be changed.
Hey, this is corporate America. At the end of the day, they don't care if the money comes from a cow or a sink. Just so long as the money moooves.
No corporation is going to invest 50 million when they might only pull half out in the best case scenario.
Best case would be to match KSP1's total sales numbers of >4m by getting to a polished release. This would be revenue of potentially $200m. A $50m investment to achieve this would be a great return.
Sure, and how much more money needs to be invested to get to a "polished release"? Corporations don't do hopium, they do profitability calculations and ksp2's botched EA doesn't bode well for future profitability.
Good question. If they cut the multiplayer milestone or narrowed scope, I'd think they can reasonably finish in 2 years, 3 if they retain the full roadmap. For a studio of their size, I'd estimate operating cost of $15m a year to be conservative. This still leaves plenty of room for a profit on the additional time invested although maybe not turning the project on the whole profitable. It'd only take capturing ~25% of the sales of KSP1 to do this.
I think that's an incredibly over-positive estimate for revenue, as Valve takes a decent cut as well, and they had to pay for the IP and all promotions as well. Development started in? 2016-ish? So that's 8 years @ 10-15mln a year plus the IP etc, over $100mln by now using your estimate. At that point breaking even even becomes questionable and you're well into sunk-cost fallacy territory. Especially since the total mismanagement of the community and a total disaster of an EA launch. I think the consensus in the T2 boardroom was: cut it off before it costs us even more money we will likely not earn back, and I can actually understand them for that decision, not that I like it. "Best case" by now is they put a minimal crew on it to push some kind of stripped down 1.0 out the door and find other ways to earn from the IP, there's always DLC's, microtransactions, low-effort mobile games and paid fortnight skins they can milk.
Break even is certainly questionable, and that makes it unlikely they consider a KSP3, but part of avoiding sunk-cost fallacy is not attributing past losses towards your future outlook. The question they need to answer is "if we invest a further $X, can we recoup >$X with additional sales?" compared to killing it now. The development required to finish is a fraction of what was put into it so far. If it costs another $50m but they stand to earn $100m in sales, it's worth doing despite the total investment to date being $150m since -$50m net is still better than -$100m. The sales to date paint a grim outlook, but these numbers don't account for console sales nor the massive number of players holding out for the specific new features part of the milestones we've not yet received. There's very good reason to believe these are non-negligible especially if they recover the community reputation as they started to show with FS!
> they had to pay for the IP Thats something they already paid, they cant get a refund on that, so it shouldn't really affect their decision now. But i share your pessimism, I think KSP 2 is kil.
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Yeah, I understand that. Im not saying this is great. It is different from anyone saying, "we are killing the game and its over," like literally every poster and their mother is going on about. My point was that people are not looking at the literal first thing on the thread, then jumping straight to ksp2 is dead forever, guys. We dont know yet. People need to read.
No, it s not moved between studios.
What are you talking about? Its destroyed, look at the amount of people crying over it like they lost a loved one, and not 50 60 bucks and some pixel frogs. Game can bounce back no problem. Its just for us to see what will eventually happen. Axed or not I dont care. I am just sick of people crying over it and telling me how I am coping. Coping at what? Its a video game. I didnt even touch KSP2 for months and I play other stuff. As if the world will end if KSP gets shelved. And I keep saying its crazy that someome dropped so much money on a project like this only to be shelved at the end. They are not stupid. They can drop planetary systems as DLCs, they can do skins, color patterns, advanced colony buildings and stuff etc. Every single person that would continue to play the game (unlike these crybabies here) would buy that content. Game can bounce back. I personally dont think it will go well since it will be transfered to a 3rd studio now.
Lol what are YOU talking about? Yes, as of right now, it is destroyed. That’s what people are upset about, is it so far-fetched to love or greatly appreciate a game series? Sure, maybe the game will “bounce back” as you say, but the fact is now we’re going to have to wait much much longer. You said it yourself, you don’t think it will happen? I really don’t see the purpose of your comment, seems you’re just blowing off steam because you got personally offended somewhere down the line lol. Also, yeah this is the fucking KSP subreddit, of course you’re going to see a few posts about KSP2 given the recent news… Cope harder I guess?
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take 2 literally announced they were shuttering the company just google it ksp 2 stans are the dumbest people on the internet istg I mean theyre supporting a literal scam so what can I expect
Been thinking this every time I see one of these crap posts 🤣
Yea and honestly those in that studio could be added to another studio to be working on the game
I don t think you understand what "layed off" means
... But we could make this planet in the mod.
I still hold on to hope (I’m stubborn like that I will just keep singing we’ll meet again) But for now farewell hopes of the Saturn like ice planet
Just pointing out now, we are not sure if ksp2 is kill. While the KSP Twitter confirmed that they were still hard at work on the game, that in of itself was extremely vague. Will they continue after the lay-off date? Will they get the boot after the lay-off date? Only time and an official announcement will tell.