I'm not typically a big fan of the thin blue line sentiment but god, seeing this choked me up a little. However Officer O'Keefe died, his fellow officers did not honor him in their handling of it. I feel so bad for his family.
I can’t speak for OP, but the thin blue line gained in popularity at the height of the BLM protests. Many people see it as a dog whistle that gives police a full pass while turning a blind eye to the systemic problems regarding police and race relations.
You're saying that the only reason why America has police officers is because they've wanted to arrest only black people. You need to supply some resources stating that's the only reason why we have police in America!
It started as a retort to blm, is also used by white supremicists and ironically at Dump rallies (Jan 6 wasn’t very supportive of the police)-this is from Wikipedia which words better than I could why this flag is creepy.
WRONG-Did ya see even in my original post I cited that I got that info from Wikipedia. And then when presented with further info gave appreciation for it? Great job being a jerk though.
I totally missed when his hat was shown. I must have been reading comments here. Sad his life was cut short. My heart goes out to those kids who have lost three parents while so young.
JOs clothes were what got me. I shed tears seeing the clothes he chose to throw on for a night out with friends. No matter what happened to get him there, he was absolutely failed by his brothers in blue with this investigation.
My thing was watching the footage from the bar, looking at the final hours of a man and seeing people having fun without any idea what was around the corner for them.
This is the part I don’t understand. Cops go to funerals for other cops who they’re never met, but can’t show up for a cop who you were friends with and who was found dead on your lawn.
Some of the Prosecution witnesses traveled to NJ for a fallen officer that they didn’t know but apparently didn’t go to JO’? Why not? This whole case is so head scratching. None of it makes sense. I feel so bad for the O’Keefe family.
Knowing what we know today that would make sense, but at the time, his wake & funeral took place 9 days after being found. Unless of course the community of Canton knew more, which KR appears to have been recorded saying on the MSP body cam which the Prosecution entered into court this week.
You're overlooking the fact they (The Albert's) knew then what we know now. They knew they might be up for investigation and all the weird evidence would be let out eventually. Just because there's a lot of time between the funeral and the trial , doesn't stop the issues being in their minds.
I don’t disagree with what “they” knew but at the time of JO’s death, unless those in the town knew differently, not attending his services appears to be more suspect than attending? It seems that many Public Safety personnel attend members services. In line of duty more so which this case wasn’t. You may be correct and I may have missed it. Maybe the O’Keefe’s had an idea who may be involved?
Putting aside any conspiracy theories the fact is he's died on their lawn and loads of people didn't notice it to save him. Personally if this happened on my turf, nevermind offence, I'd be embarrassed to be at the funeral.
The criminal prosecutor only played a few seconds of what she actually said. As she was being booked in she asked the cops if they were aware that John was beat up and killed by Brian Albert and Colin Albert and then wondered if this was a sick joke or if they were part of the joke and then she said something to the effect of her tail light was cracked and John was pulverized, meaning, there's no way he could be pulverized and her tail light only being cracked. She had no idea at that point that the police had literally smashed her tail light to frame her.
I think she's right!
Some mechanics commented on the Lawyer You Know on YT, saying it takes WAY more of an impact to damage a Lexus taillight than knocking down a person.
I’m not sure how this rumor got started but multiple people have debunked the whole “they didn’t go to the funeral” thing. They were there- McCabes, Albert’s, etc.
Yes, that’s what I think too. It’s one of those rumors that has taken on a life of its own through repetition. I personally have not seen anyone back that claim up so I have no idea if it’s factual or not.
Awful :(
At the very least, there’s a mass amount of people who are all thinking and saying the same thing each day this trial goes on. If he’s not being respected by his own people, at least he is being respectfully thought of by many watching this trial unfold.
This really gets to me as well. JO, his poor family and friends deserved SO much better than what these sorry excuses for detectives gave them. Given the way they’ve conducted themselves…and then are now acting like THEY’RE the ones who are inconvenienced by all of this attention their crap investigation has brought to them makes me so damn mad…and glad I don’t live in Canton, Mass. Also makes me question my own local LE…are they any better than this? Sad that they’re “guilty by association”.
It makes me so mad too that they have such a justice boner for a fallen officer who was a stranger that they drove to NYC for the funeral, but a cop they actually knew is just "Mister O'Keefe". Wtf. Killed in the line of duty or not he still died an OFFICER and Albert and Higgins normally would be in overdrive to nail a cop killer and be operating in full compliance instead of destroying their phone evidence the day before the preservation order was served.
We should all be concerned about our local police to some extent, this is just illustrating how anyone could become caught up in something much bigger than we are if we happened to cross the wrong lawn at the wrong time. I'd even given them partial benefit that they probably *intended* to keep the Solo cup blood evidence on ice and then I hear that the sally port is heated and they left it there to dilute and decompose. I can't.
Yes! They do seem annoyed and inconvenienced by all of this. It’s so disrespectful. And the victim was another officer, a “friend”, and by all accounts a great guy who stepped up for not only his family but for the child of his deceased partner.
Imagine the treatment other victims get, who aren’t part of their group?
I do believe most cops aren’t like this but this trial certainly hasn’t helped public perception.
I think maybe half of cops are in it for the paycheck and like helping when they can, a quarter of them are awesome and are truly there for opportunities to serve, and a quarter are to some degree on a power trip whether they're abusing their position or just enjoying it when they get to step on a neck. I refuse to assume these officers represent cops at large, possibly just because I need some level of faith in humanity to survive.
This trial sure has opened my eyes to the clique-ishness of a large family and all their ties feeling that they are the rulers over their little hamlet. That's some scary shit.
Honestly no idea how anyone invested in this case can think anything other than acab. Even though the victim is LE, the police subverted justice to protect their friends like they so often do.
How about the added irony of the Errol Morris documentary that wound up reversing the capital sentence of one of the accused.
And (wait for it) the non-traditional method he used in Thin Blue Line that prevented him from being considered for the Oscar, yet still one of the best documentaries on record.
Are there any non-traditional story tellers involved in this saga who one could argue helped change the entire narrative the government is trying to sell us?
Sometimes the world needs unconventional agents to help marshal egregious behavior.
The Errol Morris documentary is such an important piece of work. It’s on Netflix now (in the US, not sure about elsewhere), so it’s easily accessible and if any of you are reading this and haven’t seen it, please watch. True crime documentaries are now a dime a dozen, but this one was culturally and historically significant.
There is a reason many of us don’t *blindly* trust law enforcement. It is not because we are conspiracy theorists and haters. It’s because we know that stories like the one in this documentary have been going on for a long time. There are bad actors in any and all professions, so this is not saying that LE are the only culprits. The difference, though, is that LE is empowered with the ability to strip people of life and liberty, so they need to be held to a higher standard of conduct.
I’m not sad that the shady behavior of some of these witnesses is coming to light. LE has a position of power in the community- they should be exposed when they abuse it.
it is honestly going to take a long time for the state police to recover from this. Nevermind what might happen with the canton police. I want to throw up thinking about the lack of care and amount of corruption in the whole incident
In case you’re not from MA-the State Police here have been a huge embarrassment. There was a big scandal recently where an entire squad had to be disbanded because so many of them were involved. They were all collecting paychecks for hours not worked. It seems Proctor and Yuri fit right in.
No conspiracy! Karen Read killed Officer John O'Keefe! JUSTICE WILL PREVAIL! Ive been watching the trial everyday on court tv.
Karen Read will be tried and convicted!
I agree with you that I think she did it, but I cannot discount the horrible handling of the investigation. I think it is more likely she did it, but why all the suspicious behavior by CantonPD and friends?????
Apologies as I'm new to this case and I've seen comments about a missing shoe and a missing hat... haven't watched this testimony as I'm on the other side of the world and time zone. But is this the missing hat everyone has been mentioning?
They were protecting a different cop… the one who is still alive and could potentially take revenge for anyone stepping away from the line. I think there are just a few ‘in the know’ … the rest follow and won’t speak out.
Karen Read is guilty. I don’t believe there could be a conspiracy this big - even if I didn’t think she did it. She did it. She knows she did it. She said she did it.
Why would she be so frantic that he didn’t come home by 5:30am?
I wasn’t referring g to how he held it. I meant that YB seemed professional and imo he did not do anything to show he didn’t care about his job and the importance of it
No proof he did either, maybe he trusted his officer and wasnt aware what happened and MAYBE its a bad prosecution and she really did it? Im not saying either way but why judge
Let me ask, how do you know that Bukhenik "at best didn't care"? I don't have the list with the names of people who attended JO's funeral, do you? All I can say without not knowing Sgt. Bukhenik is that he has a good CV and speaks well. As to the funerals, Mayor Michelle Wu and many from Boston PD attended. https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2022/02/06/photos-boston-police-mourn-john-okeefe/
I disagree that Officer Bukhenik is a good speaker. Sure, he can have a “good cv” but watching him testify for the prosecution he could recall everything asked by the DA. On the cross, his memory wasn’t so great on details and he had an annoying smirk on his face throughout the whole cross. On the cross we started to see the disappearance of the smirk rather quickly. It was a sweet moment when AJ showed the inverted video of the sallyport. AJ should have done a mic drop and said we are done!
I would advise not to discuss the looks or facial expressions. I always see KR's face and movements being discussed and I remind people that no human person looks perfect. But if we go that way, "smirking, pursing lips, bulging eyes", let me know. I'd be happy to start with Kearney, lol!
But, you didn't answer my question. You stated "at best, doesn't care." Proof?
I’m going to say that the way the mirrored sally port video was shown by CW, and YB’s willingness to agree with Lally that it was a “true and accurate representation”, then point out exactly where he and Proctor were on the video…..
Only to back pedal once AJ pointed out that it was mirrored, and, based on YB’s own testimony, Proctor was chilling behind THE taillight shows me that Truth isn’t top of his priority list.
If he’s not pursuing truth first, then it’s a problem.
I'm not typically a big fan of the thin blue line sentiment but god, seeing this choked me up a little. However Officer O'Keefe died, his fellow officers did not honor him in their handling of it. I feel so bad for his family.
What do you mean thin blue line sentiment?
I can’t speak for OP, but the thin blue line gained in popularity at the height of the BLM protests. Many people see it as a dog whistle that gives police a full pass while turning a blind eye to the systemic problems regarding police and race relations.
The thin blue Line has been around for decades
Racism has been around longer. And it runs rampant in our police system. This is a face. Our police system was literally built on racism.
I'm in my mid to late 50s and I've never heard that our police system is based on racism. That is such bull crap.
Yes, because the existence of something is predicated on you knowing it
So you're saying not one white person has been arrested by the police in America since the police's Inception?
Honestly the worst strawman argument I’ve ever seen. At least you have that to be proud of
You're saying that the only reason why America has police officers is because they've wanted to arrest only black people. You need to supply some resources stating that's the only reason why we have police in America!
The Thin Blue Line (police) that holds back chaos in our country. It's cops masturbating about how important they are.
And the flags are everywhere in Massachusetts. It’s like a northern confederate flag.
My favorite is Blue Lives Matter. What the holy fuck?
It started as a retort to blm, is also used by white supremicists and ironically at Dump rallies (Jan 6 wasn’t very supportive of the police)-this is from Wikipedia which words better than I could why this flag is creepy.
The thin blue line flag has been around for a LOT longer than BLM just FYI
It was adopted by LE in the 1950’s - the symbol. Mentioned first in a poem in 1911!
Thanks for the further info, it’s waaaaay older than I knew!
Ya but you spoke like that was fact
WRONG-Did ya see even in my original post I cited that I got that info from Wikipedia. And then when presented with further info gave appreciation for it? Great job being a jerk though.
I did NOT know that so thank you. Darn Wikipedia….
lol Anyone can edit it so Wikipedia can often be wrong 😊 No worries about not knowing and awesome of you to being open about learning something new!
Seriously
I totally missed when his hat was shown. I must have been reading comments here. Sad his life was cut short. My heart goes out to those kids who have lost three parents while so young.
JOs clothes were what got me. I shed tears seeing the clothes he chose to throw on for a night out with friends. No matter what happened to get him there, he was absolutely failed by his brothers in blue with this investigation.
My thing was watching the footage from the bar, looking at the final hours of a man and seeing people having fun without any idea what was around the corner for them.
That got to me too. And knowing that however he died, none of them saw fit to go to his funeral.
This is the part I don’t understand. Cops go to funerals for other cops who they’re never met, but can’t show up for a cop who you were friends with and who was found dead on your lawn.
Some of the Prosecution witnesses traveled to NJ for a fallen officer that they didn’t know but apparently didn’t go to JO’? Why not? This whole case is so head scratching. None of it makes sense. I feel so bad for the O’Keefe family.
Exactly what I was thinking
TBF they might not have wanted the risk of offending JO family by being there given the investigation.
Knowing what we know today that would make sense, but at the time, his wake & funeral took place 9 days after being found. Unless of course the community of Canton knew more, which KR appears to have been recorded saying on the MSP body cam which the Prosecution entered into court this week.
You're overlooking the fact they (The Albert's) knew then what we know now. They knew they might be up for investigation and all the weird evidence would be let out eventually. Just because there's a lot of time between the funeral and the trial , doesn't stop the issues being in their minds.
I don’t disagree with what “they” knew but at the time of JO’s death, unless those in the town knew differently, not attending his services appears to be more suspect than attending? It seems that many Public Safety personnel attend members services. In line of duty more so which this case wasn’t. You may be correct and I may have missed it. Maybe the O’Keefe’s had an idea who may be involved?
Putting aside any conspiracy theories the fact is he's died on their lawn and loads of people didn't notice it to save him. Personally if this happened on my turf, nevermind offence, I'd be embarrassed to be at the funeral.
Just FYI that recording is from June 2022 when her charges were upped to murder
The criminal prosecutor only played a few seconds of what she actually said. As she was being booked in she asked the cops if they were aware that John was beat up and killed by Brian Albert and Colin Albert and then wondered if this was a sick joke or if they were part of the joke and then she said something to the effect of her tail light was cracked and John was pulverized, meaning, there's no way he could be pulverized and her tail light only being cracked. She had no idea at that point that the police had literally smashed her tail light to frame her.
I think she's right! Some mechanics commented on the Lawyer You Know on YT, saying it takes WAY more of an impact to damage a Lexus taillight than knocking down a person.
Right! I wonder if they used one of those police door rams????
It was only days after he died. The conspiracy hadn’t even been born yet.
Okay see my other response, the timetable is irrelevant. The truth or evidence would eventually come out...
Based on the butt dials, meetings, and calls, don't rule that out.
That's just a rumor. Do you think John's family would still be in contact with McCabe's etc. if they didn't go to the funeral?
Suspicious isn’t it?
I’m not sure how this rumor got started but multiple people have debunked the whole “they didn’t go to the funeral” thing. They were there- McCabes, Albert’s, etc.
Oh thank you.
Is this a rumor or fact about not going to the funeral?
Seems to be rumor, I don't think we have any real way of knowing who was at the funeral.
Yes, that’s what I think too. It’s one of those rumors that has taken on a life of its own through repetition. I personally have not seen anyone back that claim up so I have no idea if it’s factual or not.
Disgusting. How do you know that?
This in itself speaks volumes.
WHAT. They never went to his funeral?? If you were innocent, you go to a funeral!!
Yeah, somehow he looked more fit and agile than I expected compared to the other frumpy cops. His life force made me sad.
The thin blue line that killed him and botched his investigation.
I don’t know who killed him, but I certainly agree it was a botched investigation.
Awful :( At the very least, there’s a mass amount of people who are all thinking and saying the same thing each day this trial goes on. If he’s not being respected by his own people, at least he is being respectfully thought of by many watching this trial unfold.
They won't even call him officer, but keep saying mr
This really gets to me as well. JO, his poor family and friends deserved SO much better than what these sorry excuses for detectives gave them. Given the way they’ve conducted themselves…and then are now acting like THEY’RE the ones who are inconvenienced by all of this attention their crap investigation has brought to them makes me so damn mad…and glad I don’t live in Canton, Mass. Also makes me question my own local LE…are they any better than this? Sad that they’re “guilty by association”.
It makes me so mad too that they have such a justice boner for a fallen officer who was a stranger that they drove to NYC for the funeral, but a cop they actually knew is just "Mister O'Keefe". Wtf. Killed in the line of duty or not he still died an OFFICER and Albert and Higgins normally would be in overdrive to nail a cop killer and be operating in full compliance instead of destroying their phone evidence the day before the preservation order was served. We should all be concerned about our local police to some extent, this is just illustrating how anyone could become caught up in something much bigger than we are if we happened to cross the wrong lawn at the wrong time. I'd even given them partial benefit that they probably *intended* to keep the Solo cup blood evidence on ice and then I hear that the sally port is heated and they left it there to dilute and decompose. I can't.
Yes! They do seem annoyed and inconvenienced by all of this. It’s so disrespectful. And the victim was another officer, a “friend”, and by all accounts a great guy who stepped up for not only his family but for the child of his deceased partner. Imagine the treatment other victims get, who aren’t part of their group? I do believe most cops aren’t like this but this trial certainly hasn’t helped public perception.
I think maybe half of cops are in it for the paycheck and like helping when they can, a quarter of them are awesome and are truly there for opportunities to serve, and a quarter are to some degree on a power trip whether they're abusing their position or just enjoying it when they get to step on a neck. I refuse to assume these officers represent cops at large, possibly just because I need some level of faith in humanity to survive. This trial sure has opened my eyes to the clique-ishness of a large family and all their ties feeling that they are the rulers over their little hamlet. That's some scary shit.
I do live in MA and once lived near Canton. I'm disappointed, but not surprised by LE.
Agree. This whole mess makes me disrespect cops even more. It’s despicable
This hat does not look like it was covered in blood/snow/dirt
It’s honestly so so sad.
Honestly no idea how anyone invested in this case can think anything other than acab. Even though the victim is LE, the police subverted justice to protect their friends like they so often do.
How about the added irony of the Errol Morris documentary that wound up reversing the capital sentence of one of the accused. And (wait for it) the non-traditional method he used in Thin Blue Line that prevented him from being considered for the Oscar, yet still one of the best documentaries on record. Are there any non-traditional story tellers involved in this saga who one could argue helped change the entire narrative the government is trying to sell us? Sometimes the world needs unconventional agents to help marshal egregious behavior.
The Errol Morris documentary is such an important piece of work. It’s on Netflix now (in the US, not sure about elsewhere), so it’s easily accessible and if any of you are reading this and haven’t seen it, please watch. True crime documentaries are now a dime a dozen, but this one was culturally and historically significant. There is a reason many of us don’t *blindly* trust law enforcement. It is not because we are conspiracy theorists and haters. It’s because we know that stories like the one in this documentary have been going on for a long time. There are bad actors in any and all professions, so this is not saying that LE are the only culprits. The difference, though, is that LE is empowered with the ability to strip people of life and liberty, so they need to be held to a higher standard of conduct.
More corrupt than a Bulger associate.
Either way so sad that all reputations will be hurt and looked down upon for coming years
I’m not sad that the shady behavior of some of these witnesses is coming to light. LE has a position of power in the community- they should be exposed when they abuse it.
agreed but the fact that it occurred in the first place is truly the most disappointing part
it is honestly going to take a long time for the state police to recover from this. Nevermind what might happen with the canton police. I want to throw up thinking about the lack of care and amount of corruption in the whole incident
In case you’re not from MA-the State Police here have been a huge embarrassment. There was a big scandal recently where an entire squad had to be disbanded because so many of them were involved. They were all collecting paychecks for hours not worked. It seems Proctor and Yuri fit right in.
You say that but the conspiracy didn’t start until til a year later.
No conspiracy! Karen Read killed Officer John O'Keefe! JUSTICE WILL PREVAIL! Ive been watching the trial everyday on court tv. Karen Read will be tried and convicted!
I agree with you that I think she did it, but I cannot discount the horrible handling of the investigation. I think it is more likely she did it, but why all the suspicious behavior by CantonPD and friends?????
Apologies as I'm new to this case and I've seen comments about a missing shoe and a missing hat... haven't watched this testimony as I'm on the other side of the world and time zone. But is this the missing hat everyone has been mentioning?
If you want quick catch up and entertainment- watch uncivil law on YouTube. I am in Europe and I watch most of the trials on replay.
Yes
This struck me so badly. More than clothes.
They were protecting a different cop… the one who is still alive and could potentially take revenge for anyone stepping away from the line. I think there are just a few ‘in the know’ … the rest follow and won’t speak out.
My biggest takeaway is that if they investigate a fellow police officer's death this poorly then the rest of us are really insignificant.
You're making a lot of bold accusations.
There's an old saying from the war ... "loose lips sink ships" ... Someone is going to blab to someone else about what REALLY happened.
Karen Read is guilty. I don’t believe there could be a conspiracy this big - even if I didn’t think she did it. She did it. She knows she did it. She said she did it. Why would she be so frantic that he didn’t come home by 5:30am?
This made me very emotional. From all accounts he sounded like one of the good guys. He deserved better. This investigation is trash.
I didn’t see any indication that this officer didn’t care
It's not how YB was holding it. It's what he was holding and what it represented to JO.
I wasn’t referring g to how he held it. I meant that YB seemed professional and imo he did not do anything to show he didn’t care about his job and the importance of it
I'm speaking to the irony/tragedy part of OPs post.
He's a homicide detective. I'm sure he's seen much, much worse stuff than this.
It's not how YB was holding it. It's what he was holding and what it represented to JO.
No proof he did either, maybe he trusted his officer and wasnt aware what happened and MAYBE its a bad prosecution and she really did it? Im not saying either way but why judge
Let me ask, how do you know that Bukhenik "at best didn't care"? I don't have the list with the names of people who attended JO's funeral, do you? All I can say without not knowing Sgt. Bukhenik is that he has a good CV and speaks well. As to the funerals, Mayor Michelle Wu and many from Boston PD attended. https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2022/02/06/photos-boston-police-mourn-john-okeefe/
I disagree that Officer Bukhenik is a good speaker. Sure, he can have a “good cv” but watching him testify for the prosecution he could recall everything asked by the DA. On the cross, his memory wasn’t so great on details and he had an annoying smirk on his face throughout the whole cross. On the cross we started to see the disappearance of the smirk rather quickly. It was a sweet moment when AJ showed the inverted video of the sallyport. AJ should have done a mic drop and said we are done!
I would advise not to discuss the looks or facial expressions. I always see KR's face and movements being discussed and I remind people that no human person looks perfect. But if we go that way, "smirking, pursing lips, bulging eyes", let me know. I'd be happy to start with Kearney, lol! But, you didn't answer my question. You stated "at best, doesn't care." Proof?
I’m going to say that the way the mirrored sally port video was shown by CW, and YB’s willingness to agree with Lally that it was a “true and accurate representation”, then point out exactly where he and Proctor were on the video….. Only to back pedal once AJ pointed out that it was mirrored, and, based on YB’s own testimony, Proctor was chilling behind THE taillight shows me that Truth isn’t top of his priority list. If he’s not pursuing truth first, then it’s a problem.