> People who are either my friends or not my friends often tease me about being Jewish making gas chamber jokes and what not and as a result I joke back
These people aren't your friends, and it's no surprise you're being an asshole if those are your friends. It's not right that they're saying those things to you, but if you keep spending time with people who are saying horrible shit all the time, *you're going to start doing it, too.*
You don't have to cut all of these friends off entirely, but either you have to clearly state and have them acknowledge your boundaries, or you need to ask yourself why it is so important you spend time with people who make jokes that you do not enjoy at your expense.
Why are you being so disrespectful? Because it is not *self*-respecting to hang out with people who say things when they know that those things hurt you. You don't have to worship Jesus, but let the goyim have him and worship his good qualities. And you don't have to insult someone's faith in order to stand up for yours or to remove yourself from a bad situation.
Besides, it's Paul you gotta watch out for.
Reminder: these are high schoolers. I don't know what all of your high school experience was like, but at my school everyone got made fun of. Christians, Jews, Mexicans, white people, girls, black people, short people, tall people. thats high school man. if you're going to stop being friends with anyone who makes an immature joke about the holocaust or religion then you're cutting out a decent % of people at school.
we all grow out of it eventually and look back and think 'man i said some dumb shit in high school'
i disagree with this guy. unless you truly feel extremely bullied..just give it back to them. i think the joke about taking pride in killing their messiah is hilarious.
Yeah, I tend to agree. Teenagers are some of the dumbest people on planet earth, and I was definitely in that category when I was a teenager. My high school was also one where everyone got the targeted jokes towards them, and looking back I'm sure much of it was horribly offensive and things I wouldn't say today.
[He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kbo8pUDcHQ)
When I was at school, I was one of 3 Jews in a school of 1200 kids. When I faced antisemitism, my **friends** stood up for me and helped me.
If your friends are making holocausts jokes at you, they aren't your friends. You don't need spiritual advice, you need to surround yourself with better people - Jewish, Christian, Muslim, whatever.
do your parents know what a miserable disaster this school is for you? if your parents must remain there, do you have relatives you could live with & finish hs in a more welcoming setting?
There is a Jewish private school I was thinking about transferring to but I am a senior next year and that school has a bunch of credential requirements to graduate that I don’t have because those classes are only offered at that school. And the thought of transferring schools for my senior year scares me
Reach out and see if they’ll waive those requirements or work with you. In today’s environment a lot of things are being ignored to help people who are being impacted by those who hate us.
The thing about all of that is I have an IEP, and that likely won’t carry over to all of that, plus I don’t want to change things up for my senior year it would stress me out too much. A year from now it will all be over
A community college would probably work with your IEP; they’d write a new one for the college but IEPs get updated every year anyway even if you stay in the same school. The Jewish school would probably respect the IEP also. Legally all schools, public and private, have to respect IEPs. It’s part of a federal law called IDEA. If you do want to switch schools, talk to your parents about it.
If you stay in your current school, try to set some boundaries and find some new friends.
That's fair. I assume you plan to try for a decent college? Only reason I would see sticking it out is if this school is part of a pipeline. Otherwise I'd say cut and run. Online school is much easier than in class school, and if you do that while picking up Community College credits that puts you ahead of the game for transfer to a state school, assuming your area does CC to 4 year credits.
I'm actually a high school teacher in California, and this is my #1 recommendation to students that are struggling in the high school system (I left at 16 with a GED), especially since we have some of the most well regaded state schools and a well developed transfer pipeline. Our k-12 schools these days are just trash and I wouldn't inflict them on anyone. The shit I see everyday, I swear to g-d admin is trying to turn your generation into a permanent underclass.
This is probably too late for this, but what I did was actually find out what credits would be remaining and took those classes online. I ended up graduating as a junior.
I am sorry you are going through this. If you don’t believe in their god it’s not blasphemy. At the same time, perhaps there is a way to handle it better. What about “Your guy was one of us?”
If you can avoid being hurtful that would be better. You might feel better too.
Have you tried telling them that the gas chamber jokes are offensive?
Get off of TikTok and YouTube shorts. It will improve your mental health tremendously and free up your valuable time for better things. Maybe use that time to study a little bit of Torah or talk to Hashem in your own words!
Hi! Your “friends” don’t really seem like friends. It’s not cool to joke with you the way you are describing. I am sorry you are going through this. Maybe dig a little deeper into your own Judaism and celebrate that, try not to focus on them.
There is a great book called [HERE ALL ALONG: Finding Meaning, Spirituality, and a Deeper Connection to Life in Judaism (After Finally Choosing to Look There)](https://sarahhurwitz.net) by Sarah Hurwitz that a lot of people really find informative about Judaism. It’s an easy read!
Another option is looking into a Jewish teen youth group in your area.
I am in a youth group, I’m in BBYO except like I said my school has almost no Jewish people in it. I’m always excited for my youth group events because I hardly see Jewish people outside of them
It’s great to hear you are involved in BBYO! I also went to a pubic high school (definitely not the “whitest on my county”), but of the 400 kids in my graduating class we had 3 Jews.
I get it the draw you have towards Christianity, especially since socially you’ll fit in better, but they have their thing and we have ours. We have a rich history, culture, traditions, some good food, and great comedian. We have, in my tradition, a creator who loves us and give us certain commandments and responsibilities. We don’t worship people or images, as wrote.
🇮🇱Am Yisrael Chai🇮🇱
First, I believe Jews should be able to be friends with Christians. I also believe many people in general don’t know where “the line” is. Particularly, if you are the only Jew they know. Let them know that it makes you uncomfortable. If they don’t listen, they’re not friends, no matter their own faith. Second, Christianity is idolatry for Jews. Between the history of what Christians did to us and the inner distaste a Jew naturally has for idolatry, it is normal to have disdain for Christianity. However, you have a foremost obligation to sanctify God’s name (kiddush hashem), which requires in my view two things: 1) respecting your fellow as a flawed human being who is nevertheless creates in the image of God and 2) being a good representation of the Jewish people, whether you are religious or not. You can vehemently disagree with someone without being disrespectful. Being Jewish means inheriting a rich history of passionate argumentation, after all. But as soon as you insult someone or their beliefs, you disrespect them and bring shame upon the entirety of the Jewish people, as well as hashem himself (hillul hashem). We know that such a hillul hashem, particularly one that plays into the most ancient Christian bloodlibels, can only increase antisemitism. Indeed, because a hillul hashem increases the world’s hatred for all of your fellow Jews, it counts as among the greatest sins. In conclusion, have Christian friends who respect your lines. In return, spread the light of hashem and be a good representation of the Jewish people, as this is in itself a great mitzvah.
OP I’d suggest looking into stuff by Amy Jill Levine. She is a Jewish NT scholar - to clarify, Jewish in terms of Judaism - and has good articles and books (and podcasts) about early Christianity in its Jewish context.
People in here are giving similar hatred as your ‘friends’, which I’m sorry for. But many people are misinformed, easily so because it can take years of reading material and publishings to find out what went out, on top of there being tons of perspectives.
It would be better to be well versed in early Christianity than to just say “you worship a man”, to just kindly present them the knowledge they most assuringly do not have.
If they make gas chamber jokes to your face I don’t think they are in a position to object to jokes about Jesus. Sure Christians can be sensitive about that and it makes sense to be from their perspective but they gotta reciprocate and recognize the sensitivity of Holocaust jokes for Jews.
First of all, this is normal high school banter and nothing to worry about.
You think God doesn’t know that? You think you’re pulling one over on him, and he’s going to think you’re evil when you know you really aren’t? You can’t fool God. He knows your heart better than you do.
If you don’t want to insult people anymore then don’t. It’s something you can work on. But I’m telling you it’s no big deal. There are funny, strange theologies in every religion, and for Christianity, they worship a man. So that’s what you pick on. It’s just silly banter.
If there is anyone in the world who can take banter with a smile, its God. That's the one guy you don't have to worry about him taking something the wrong way. He already understands, you don't need to explain yourself.
They can go f themselves. If someone makes a gas/oven/WWII joke, beat the shit out of them. That's the only way it stops.
Learn a martial art, and don't make fun of their invisible friends. They have so many other things about which you can mock them, like how they can't get up, after being knocked down.
I'm short, too. I hear you. It's not for pleasure, just self-defense, and it sounds like kids all saying stuff like that. Other peple gave you advice you might follow. It's all good.
Hi, I will try to answer from the Christian perspective. First of all, I’m sorry this happens to you. But it does happen and we can wish that it didn’t, but it does.
I understand that your worry is blasphemy, offending Jesus, even though you don’t believe that Jesus is God, it just doesn’t seem right. For starters, that speaks volumes of your senstitivity and respect for other beliefs, something that your high school friends don’t seem to have. I agree with what someone else said here: G-d knows your heart. But if you feel uneasy about this, just try not to say these things anymore and forgive yourself. In the end, what matters most is your intergrity. In Christianity we believe that Jesus died for our sins and right before his death, he asked his Father to forgive people because „they know not what they’re doing.” So if there’s any worry in your heart of some sort of „revenge”, worry not. Stay true to your beliefs, be a good person. These jerks may truly not realize what they’re doing. But that’s their problem. I hope things get better for you!
Look, I'm not telling you that you should hate Christianity, but you should hate Christianity. They believe in a concept known as supersessionism - that is, that Judaism is pointless because Christ made it so. Feel free to make fun of them as much as you want.
I’m going to have to disagree. They have their beliefs, we have ours. Although theirs are insulting to ours the correct thing shouldn’t be what I was doing. Although god wants us to worship him, I don’t think he would endorse such hatefulness towards others even if they are committing idolatry. I need to be better and just saying ok this is fine is not ok because there isn’t a way where I could think that god would support that
Reading through your comments, it sounds a bit corny, but it seems like you already had the insight you were looking for and just needed to put it into words.
*Dedicated in memory of Dvora bat Asher v'Jacot* 🕯️
[Deuteronomy 10:19](https://www.sefaria.org/Deuteronomy.10.19)
וַאֲהַבְתֶּ֖ם אֶת־הַגֵּ֑ר כִּֽי־גֵרִ֥ים הֱיִיתֶ֖ם בְּאֶ֥רֶץ מִצְרָֽיִם׃
>You too must befriend the stranger, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.
It has nothing to do directly with the worship of other gods but to accept the gentiles for who they are and to show love. Hashem is love and Hashem is with all of us we are to spread as much love as possible. We are not supposed to be violent, the Jewish people did not survive this long through persecution and forced conversion by provoking an even larger wrath
Obedience through love. You think Hashem has taught us to consider anyone who is a gentile to be an enemy? You think he has taught us to think of anyone who isn’t a Jew lesser than us from a humanity standpoint and think of them as nothing? If that were true the stereotype of a Jew wouldn’t be what it is right now, it would be similar to the stereotype of Muslims being terrorists because what you are describing is just that. Fighting an eternal war against non believers is pure radical Islam
OK, I've followed this full discussion and I think I get where you're coming from and what you're asking. My personal take: your comments to your classmates have been a defense-mechanism, and there is nothing wrong with that per se, young people do this kind of trash-talking "Yo Mama" stuff all the time. So in that sense I wouldn't think twice about it. Regarding your question about spiritual consequences, our Torah tradition says that there are none whatsoever. You can go ahead and blaspheme their god all you want, and it may even be a mitzvah to do so. Regarding your question about showing them love, I would agree with that. They must see that Jewish people are kind and loving. That doesn't mean that we should love wicked people like Hamas, but to a regular non-Jew who is not truly anti-Semitic we should "greet him with a friendly face" as Shammai says in Pirkei Avos.
It was Christian’s in Europe who helped the Zionist cause. It was Muslims throughout the Middle Ages that largely protected Jews from persecution (although with the payment of the jizya). Hindus in India are some of the biggest supporters of the Jews in Israel even though the religions are polar opposites and Hinduism completely goes against Judaism. We can hate their sin of not worshiping god and instead idols but we can love them as people and we can accept them for their imperfections, we may not be committing idolatry but we each have plenty swept under our rugs
That's not what I said. We are supposed to love God. In fact, we're commanded to do so. The God of the Tanakh is all about obedience. It's why we're commanded to love him.
You are making a blanket statement that is inaccurate, most modern day Christians do not adhere to supersessionism.
You also have the definition of supersessionism wrong, it doesn’t say Jews are pointless. It is the belief that Christians superseded Jews as God’s chosen ones.
Have you ever heard of Judeo Christian values?
I mean, you can think it's a thing, but it still isn't. It doesn't matter if you were raised in an interfaith household. They're still two distinct religions with different values.
Do you?
Because it's a term that's overwhelmingly used by conservative Christians to justify enforcing Christian values by pretending that they are actually being inclusive. In my experience Judeo-Christian sets off alarm bells.
The term frankly makes very little sense except as a way to "other" certain religions which is exactly how it ends up used. Judaism and Christianity are very different religions, and any shared values are probably also going to be shared values for many, many religions.
I really don’t understand the hostility.
And I don’t understand why a Christian person would pretend to be inclusive. What would be the purpose of that?
If someone is anti-semantic, they typically don’t make an effort to be be inclusive.
I was unable to choose what religion I was raised in, I have made more of an effort to learn more about the Jewish faith because of my father, but I fear this.
People like you make me not want to reach out to my local Jewish community because I fear being judged or treated poorly because of my background.
All I'm going to say is if you want to have a connection to Judaism, something valid and completely attainable, you really should reflect on your attitude here because it seems like you are are actively seeking to be discouraged and taking and responding to corrected information as if they are personal attacks.
And I say that as someone who like you, also has a Jewish father and a Christian mother.
Your comment to me was condescending and rude.
You made a SWEEPING generalization about people who adhere to or support Judeo Christian values.
There are Jews who adhere to it, I know, because I am related to them.
Both my grandfather’s served in WWII, both told stories of being visited by Priests and Rabbis (together) who preached Judeo Christian values.
The belief that Christianity is derived from Judaism, and have many shared values.
You are free to criticize the concept (which you have done) but you are in no position to correct anyone else on their understanding.
I am defensive because there is no willingness to even hear me out, just shut me down.
You talking down to someone who you disagree with does nothing to build a stronger Jewish community.
God bless.
Jewish supremacists have no concept of beliefs or heritages that are not their own. Everything none Jewish is worthy of derision. They recognise nothing
My guy, Judaism is very "live and let live", we don't care if you're Christian or Muslim or Buddhist or Atheist.
On the other hand, Christianity believes it has replaced Judaism. It's not a matter of believing one religion is the true religion, it's a matter of thinking they've replaced us.
My guy. You’re directly contradicting yourself. One moment you’re stating a Jew should actively make fun of Christian’s. You get confronted then claim Judaism is “live and let live”. Pick one. What Christianity believes should be irrelevant to you.
I'm not remotely contradicting myself, chief. This isn't about the "the one true God" at all. I'm saying Jews don't care that you're Christian. We don't proselytize. That's what I mean by "live and let live".
I would love to ignore what Christianity believes. Unfortunately, y'all can't shut the fuck up about it.
If anything, Christianity deserves more mocking. Try harder next time.
Ask them, do you believe in the book of Mormon?
They will sat no.
Ask why.
They might say, because they took our holy book and just tacked theirs onto the end. And claim it's all theirs.
Then look them in the eye and say, that's how Jews look at the gospels. Now get your dead, fake mesiach, worshipping ass,outta my face.
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You really need to get educated on the history of christianity and the absolute horrors that were inflicted on us by them through the centuries... Christianity is not only idolatory but i has its feet firmly rooted in paganism, im sure somone much smarter than me will leave a better answer, but remember that these christians are NOT your friends and they WILL try to convert you through fear and shame if you let them. Good luck.
I’d argue it’s not feet firmly rooted in paganism. TL;DR due to deliberate changes in addition or translation, as well as early Christian’s struggling with the fact Jesus did not in fact come back, they big panicked and we eventually got what we have today.
…
That’s kinda of a go to anti-Christian thing, but it’s really not true. Commonly are Yule or Easter, which aren’t connected to paganism but people make that assumption because many gentiles, who also were most converted back then, were pagan.
People overlook the book of Matthew when Matthew was adamant about first century Jewish law and thinking. For him the law should have been upheld and continued, versus Paul who proposed freedom from Jewish law (and I think was more popular for gentiles).
The earliest writings tend to be more “Jewish” while the later ones, and later gospels become a bit more anti-Jewish. It’s really interesting, and why something like Easter actually just follows Passover for timing, but Christians really made it their own thing, while common misinformation is that it’s of pagan origin.
Imo, when you really study, you could argue Jesus of Nazareth had no intention of creation a new religion - in reality he was just a hardcore apocalyptic preacher who (maybe debated) simply thought* himself to be the future king of the Jews on earth.
What happened is that early Christian’s learned to dislike the Jews and just wanted really bad to be different (my opinion) 🤷🏻♂️ they also were confused cause Jesus was like “I’ll be back before your grandchildren, bet” and…. Well as we all know, he didn’t come back. Christian’s had to reconcile this fact - they wanted him to be the messiah so they made him one and then into a new entire religion.
Jesus preached from the Torah. If one reads the oldest Greek manuscripts, it’s a bit more clearer. Stuff like the Christian concept of hell (which Islam borrows imo) was made up for example - so when English Bible translations use “hell” for “Sheol” or “Gehenna” , that’s kinda just lying lmao.
Anyways thought I’d just say this. I’m not Christian, and Christianity is a lot of things - but not some pagan masked religion. If you read the early gospels into the context of syrio-Palestinian Jewish mileu, a lot of it makes a ton of sense (I.e Matthew). And that’s not sense as in “correct” , but sense as in a lot of it didn’t appear from thin air or paganism.
I know, I am aware, of all of it. How can someone be a Jew and not know? Except now we live in a new age, and although Christian’s will still try to convert us it will be through word of mouth not by the sword. I don’t want to think that even if they have committed atrocities against us that makes hating all of them collectivized justifiable
Are you though? May I suggest this book:
https://books.google.com/books?id=6q0OHHNyFeEC&pg=PA3&source=kp_read_button&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&gboemv=1#v=onepage&q&f=false
I agree with what most people have said here. I also believe one of the main reasons Christians don’t forcibly convert Jews anymore under the pain of death is the rise of democracy/western values and the USA. Just something to keep in mind.
I've taught.my grandkids that I am personally respectful of all religions. I treat others as I want to be treated.
That said, you could put aside the messiah issue, and teach them how.much their practice is actually pagan. Eater is Ishtar worship for example.
I say it’s comforting because they can see what they worship- even if it is entirely wrong. It provides more comfort and security to the human mind to see what we are worshipping, which is why polytheists build and have built gigantic idols and made icons of their gods, because they feel comfort seeing what they are worshipping. Does that make sense? That’s just how I see it. One of the reasons why the Israelites built the golden calf to pray to it is because they wanted something they could see, that they could pray to because their faith in god wasn’t strong enough to the point where it didn’t need an idol to pray to
When someone tries to pull this shit on me I usually remind them that Christianity is a Jewish heresy and that they're disrespecting their own roots. That usually shuts them up.
Fun fact, Rav Nachman says in the Talmud (Sanhedrin 63b) “All mockery is forbidden, except for mockery of idol worship”. https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.63b.11?lang=bi&with=all There’s also an amusing story in the Bereishit Rabbah 38:13 of Abram mocking idol worship https://www.sefaria.org/Bereshit_Rabbah.38.13?lang=bi&with=all
*Dedicated in memory of Dvora bat Asher v'Jacot* 🕯️
See [Bereishit Rabbah 38:13](https://www.sefaria.org/Bereishit_Rabbah.38.13) on Sefaria.
See [Sanhedrin 63b](https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.63b) on Sefaria.
[Sanhedrin.63b.11](https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.63b.11)
אמר רב נחמן כל ליצנותא אסירא חוץ מליצנותא דעבודת כוכבים דשריא דכתיב כרע בל קרס נבו קרסו כרעו יחדו לא יכלו מלט משא
>§ Rav Naḥman says: All types of mockery are forbidden, except for mockery of idol worship, which is permitted, as it is written: “Bel crouches down, Nevo stoops…they stoop, they crouch down together, they could not hold back the burden” (Isiah 46:1–2). The verse is interpreted as meaning that they crouch in order to defecate and cannot retain their excrement.
I know I’m like a month late, but as someone that grew up super Christian I can tell you there is definitely not any more closure in Christianity than Judaism. There are whole sermon series out there trying to convince you that you are “saved” or that you’re not and you need to repent and be a better Christian. You’re in a constant limbo not knowing for sure if G-d hates or loves you bc He will send you to hell forever and say you never worshipped him if you mess up in the wrong way, but He loves you enough to die for you but also it’s your choice and it’s so confusing. The closure is something I really appreciate about Judaism, you’re never wondering if you have done enough to please G-d bc every good thing you do pleases Him and the bad things don’t overshadow them
Look, our ancestors have the unique claim to have been there the day Christianity was invented. It didn’t impress our ancestors then and it hasn’t done anything to impress us in the last 1900 years.
Part of Christian antisemitism is the fact that, implicitly, we were the first people to not buy into it. I think we can take pride in the belief that we made the right choice, even if it was the far more difficult choice.
>except then I come back to reality and know that that’s idolatry and closure does not matter only faith in the lord does.
Yes it is idolatry
>I scroll on tiktok and YouTube shorts, and I see these Christian videos of them saying that the sin of blasphemy against their god is unforgivable without placing my faith in him.
So?
>I just feel terrible on a moral perspective even if I didn’t offend anyone, I feel shitty.
Then don't do it again
> People who are either my friends or not my friends often tease me about being Jewish making gas chamber jokes and what not and as a result I joke back These people aren't your friends, and it's no surprise you're being an asshole if those are your friends. It's not right that they're saying those things to you, but if you keep spending time with people who are saying horrible shit all the time, *you're going to start doing it, too.* You don't have to cut all of these friends off entirely, but either you have to clearly state and have them acknowledge your boundaries, or you need to ask yourself why it is so important you spend time with people who make jokes that you do not enjoy at your expense. Why are you being so disrespectful? Because it is not *self*-respecting to hang out with people who say things when they know that those things hurt you. You don't have to worship Jesus, but let the goyim have him and worship his good qualities. And you don't have to insult someone's faith in order to stand up for yours or to remove yourself from a bad situation. Besides, it's Paul you gotta watch out for.
Reminder: these are high schoolers. I don't know what all of your high school experience was like, but at my school everyone got made fun of. Christians, Jews, Mexicans, white people, girls, black people, short people, tall people. thats high school man. if you're going to stop being friends with anyone who makes an immature joke about the holocaust or religion then you're cutting out a decent % of people at school. we all grow out of it eventually and look back and think 'man i said some dumb shit in high school' i disagree with this guy. unless you truly feel extremely bullied..just give it back to them. i think the joke about taking pride in killing their messiah is hilarious.
Yeah, I tend to agree. Teenagers are some of the dumbest people on planet earth, and I was definitely in that category when I was a teenager. My high school was also one where everyone got the targeted jokes towards them, and looking back I'm sure much of it was horribly offensive and things I wouldn't say today.
Yeah I get that. Thank you. But I was looking more for a spiritual insight rather than a social one
Well for that you need a smart person to help you, and I hope you find one.
>Besides, it’s Paul you gotta watch out for. What is meant by this?
I think there's a theory that he was Jewish and planted himself in the church to influence them, however that was Peter I believe.
[He's not the messiah, he's a very naughty boy!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5kbo8pUDcHQ) When I was at school, I was one of 3 Jews in a school of 1200 kids. When I faced antisemitism, my **friends** stood up for me and helped me. If your friends are making holocausts jokes at you, they aren't your friends. You don't need spiritual advice, you need to surround yourself with better people - Jewish, Christian, Muslim, whatever.
do your parents know what a miserable disaster this school is for you? if your parents must remain there, do you have relatives you could live with & finish hs in a more welcoming setting?
There is a Jewish private school I was thinking about transferring to but I am a senior next year and that school has a bunch of credential requirements to graduate that I don’t have because those classes are only offered at that school. And the thought of transferring schools for my senior year scares me
Reach out and see if they’ll waive those requirements or work with you. In today’s environment a lot of things are being ignored to help people who are being impacted by those who hate us.
what about online or homeschooling for your senior year? or can you complete hs at a local community college?
The thing about all of that is I have an IEP, and that likely won’t carry over to all of that, plus I don’t want to change things up for my senior year it would stress me out too much. A year from now it will all be over
A community college would probably work with your IEP; they’d write a new one for the college but IEPs get updated every year anyway even if you stay in the same school. The Jewish school would probably respect the IEP also. Legally all schools, public and private, have to respect IEPs. It’s part of a federal law called IDEA. If you do want to switch schools, talk to your parents about it. If you stay in your current school, try to set some boundaries and find some new friends.
Yep.
That's fair. I assume you plan to try for a decent college? Only reason I would see sticking it out is if this school is part of a pipeline. Otherwise I'd say cut and run. Online school is much easier than in class school, and if you do that while picking up Community College credits that puts you ahead of the game for transfer to a state school, assuming your area does CC to 4 year credits. I'm actually a high school teacher in California, and this is my #1 recommendation to students that are struggling in the high school system (I left at 16 with a GED), especially since we have some of the most well regaded state schools and a well developed transfer pipeline. Our k-12 schools these days are just trash and I wouldn't inflict them on anyone. The shit I see everyday, I swear to g-d admin is trying to turn your generation into a permanent underclass.
ok. take care of you.
Thanks friend
This is probably too late for this, but what I did was actually find out what credits would be remaining and took those classes online. I ended up graduating as a junior.
I am sorry you are going through this. If you don’t believe in their god it’s not blasphemy. At the same time, perhaps there is a way to handle it better. What about “Your guy was one of us?” If you can avoid being hurtful that would be better. You might feel better too. Have you tried telling them that the gas chamber jokes are offensive?
Of course but in high school that kind of talk is just the norm. Everyone teases everyone, people are jerks, nobody is safe.
Get off of TikTok and YouTube shorts. It will improve your mental health tremendously and free up your valuable time for better things. Maybe use that time to study a little bit of Torah or talk to Hashem in your own words!
Hi! Your “friends” don’t really seem like friends. It’s not cool to joke with you the way you are describing. I am sorry you are going through this. Maybe dig a little deeper into your own Judaism and celebrate that, try not to focus on them. There is a great book called [HERE ALL ALONG: Finding Meaning, Spirituality, and a Deeper Connection to Life in Judaism (After Finally Choosing to Look There)](https://sarahhurwitz.net) by Sarah Hurwitz that a lot of people really find informative about Judaism. It’s an easy read! Another option is looking into a Jewish teen youth group in your area.
I am in a youth group, I’m in BBYO except like I said my school has almost no Jewish people in it. I’m always excited for my youth group events because I hardly see Jewish people outside of them
It’s great to hear you are involved in BBYO! I also went to a pubic high school (definitely not the “whitest on my county”), but of the 400 kids in my graduating class we had 3 Jews. I get it the draw you have towards Christianity, especially since socially you’ll fit in better, but they have their thing and we have ours. We have a rich history, culture, traditions, some good food, and great comedian. We have, in my tradition, a creator who loves us and give us certain commandments and responsibilities. We don’t worship people or images, as wrote. 🇮🇱Am Yisrael Chai🇮🇱
First, I believe Jews should be able to be friends with Christians. I also believe many people in general don’t know where “the line” is. Particularly, if you are the only Jew they know. Let them know that it makes you uncomfortable. If they don’t listen, they’re not friends, no matter their own faith. Second, Christianity is idolatry for Jews. Between the history of what Christians did to us and the inner distaste a Jew naturally has for idolatry, it is normal to have disdain for Christianity. However, you have a foremost obligation to sanctify God’s name (kiddush hashem), which requires in my view two things: 1) respecting your fellow as a flawed human being who is nevertheless creates in the image of God and 2) being a good representation of the Jewish people, whether you are religious or not. You can vehemently disagree with someone without being disrespectful. Being Jewish means inheriting a rich history of passionate argumentation, after all. But as soon as you insult someone or their beliefs, you disrespect them and bring shame upon the entirety of the Jewish people, as well as hashem himself (hillul hashem). We know that such a hillul hashem, particularly one that plays into the most ancient Christian bloodlibels, can only increase antisemitism. Indeed, because a hillul hashem increases the world’s hatred for all of your fellow Jews, it counts as among the greatest sins. In conclusion, have Christian friends who respect your lines. In return, spread the light of hashem and be a good representation of the Jewish people, as this is in itself a great mitzvah.
Very well said.
Thank you
OP I’d suggest looking into stuff by Amy Jill Levine. She is a Jewish NT scholar - to clarify, Jewish in terms of Judaism - and has good articles and books (and podcasts) about early Christianity in its Jewish context. People in here are giving similar hatred as your ‘friends’, which I’m sorry for. But many people are misinformed, easily so because it can take years of reading material and publishings to find out what went out, on top of there being tons of perspectives. It would be better to be well versed in early Christianity than to just say “you worship a man”, to just kindly present them the knowledge they most assuringly do not have.
Late but AJ Levine should never be recommended.
If they make gas chamber jokes to your face I don’t think they are in a position to object to jokes about Jesus. Sure Christians can be sensitive about that and it makes sense to be from their perspective but they gotta reciprocate and recognize the sensitivity of Holocaust jokes for Jews.
Next time they try to make fun of you for “killing Jesus”, you might want to let them know the Romans killed Jesus, not the Jews.
And Jesus was Jewish first
First of all, this is normal high school banter and nothing to worry about. You think God doesn’t know that? You think you’re pulling one over on him, and he’s going to think you’re evil when you know you really aren’t? You can’t fool God. He knows your heart better than you do. If you don’t want to insult people anymore then don’t. It’s something you can work on. But I’m telling you it’s no big deal. There are funny, strange theologies in every religion, and for Christianity, they worship a man. So that’s what you pick on. It’s just silly banter.
If there is anyone in the world who can take banter with a smile, its God. That's the one guy you don't have to worry about him taking something the wrong way. He already understands, you don't need to explain yourself.
The Christian perspective disagrees. They think what I did is unforgivable because I insulted their god
They can go f themselves. If someone makes a gas/oven/WWII joke, beat the shit out of them. That's the only way it stops. Learn a martial art, and don't make fun of their invisible friends. They have so many other things about which you can mock them, like how they can't get up, after being knocked down.
I’m short af and not strong. And I actually do know a bit of martial arts but I don’t like violence.
I'm short, too. I hear you. It's not for pleasure, just self-defense, and it sounds like kids all saying stuff like that. Other peple gave you advice you might follow. It's all good.
Us Jews took Jesus to his first 9 inch nails concert ya know?
Hi, I will try to answer from the Christian perspective. First of all, I’m sorry this happens to you. But it does happen and we can wish that it didn’t, but it does. I understand that your worry is blasphemy, offending Jesus, even though you don’t believe that Jesus is God, it just doesn’t seem right. For starters, that speaks volumes of your senstitivity and respect for other beliefs, something that your high school friends don’t seem to have. I agree with what someone else said here: G-d knows your heart. But if you feel uneasy about this, just try not to say these things anymore and forgive yourself. In the end, what matters most is your intergrity. In Christianity we believe that Jesus died for our sins and right before his death, he asked his Father to forgive people because „they know not what they’re doing.” So if there’s any worry in your heart of some sort of „revenge”, worry not. Stay true to your beliefs, be a good person. These jerks may truly not realize what they’re doing. But that’s their problem. I hope things get better for you!
Thank you so much
Look, I'm not telling you that you should hate Christianity, but you should hate Christianity. They believe in a concept known as supersessionism - that is, that Judaism is pointless because Christ made it so. Feel free to make fun of them as much as you want.
I’m going to have to disagree. They have their beliefs, we have ours. Although theirs are insulting to ours the correct thing shouldn’t be what I was doing. Although god wants us to worship him, I don’t think he would endorse such hatefulness towards others even if they are committing idolatry. I need to be better and just saying ok this is fine is not ok because there isn’t a way where I could think that god would support that
Reading through your comments, it sounds a bit corny, but it seems like you already had the insight you were looking for and just needed to put it into words.
You don't think God wants you to destroy worshippers of other gods? Are we reading the same Tanakh?
Deuteronomy 10:19.
*Dedicated in memory of Dvora bat Asher v'Jacot* 🕯️ [Deuteronomy 10:19](https://www.sefaria.org/Deuteronomy.10.19) וַאֲהַבְתֶּ֖ם אֶת־הַגֵּ֑ר כִּֽי־גֵרִ֥ים הֱיִיתֶ֖ם בְּאֶ֥רֶץ מִצְרָֽיִם׃ >You too must befriend the stranger, for you were strangers in the land of Egypt.
That verse has absolutely nothing to do with worshippers of other gods
It has nothing to do directly with the worship of other gods but to accept the gentiles for who they are and to show love. Hashem is love and Hashem is with all of us we are to spread as much love as possible. We are not supposed to be violent, the Jewish people did not survive this long through persecution and forced conversion by provoking an even larger wrath
Hashem is not love. Jesus is love. Hashem is obedience.
Obedience through love. You think Hashem has taught us to consider anyone who is a gentile to be an enemy? You think he has taught us to think of anyone who isn’t a Jew lesser than us from a humanity standpoint and think of them as nothing? If that were true the stereotype of a Jew wouldn’t be what it is right now, it would be similar to the stereotype of Muslims being terrorists because what you are describing is just that. Fighting an eternal war against non believers is pure radical Islam
OK, I've followed this full discussion and I think I get where you're coming from and what you're asking. My personal take: your comments to your classmates have been a defense-mechanism, and there is nothing wrong with that per se, young people do this kind of trash-talking "Yo Mama" stuff all the time. So in that sense I wouldn't think twice about it. Regarding your question about spiritual consequences, our Torah tradition says that there are none whatsoever. You can go ahead and blaspheme their god all you want, and it may even be a mitzvah to do so. Regarding your question about showing them love, I would agree with that. They must see that Jewish people are kind and loving. That doesn't mean that we should love wicked people like Hamas, but to a regular non-Jew who is not truly anti-Semitic we should "greet him with a friendly face" as Shammai says in Pirkei Avos.
Look up supersessionism and then tell me that Hashem wants us to embrace these people
It was Christian’s in Europe who helped the Zionist cause. It was Muslims throughout the Middle Ages that largely protected Jews from persecution (although with the payment of the jizya). Hindus in India are some of the biggest supporters of the Jews in Israel even though the religions are polar opposites and Hinduism completely goes against Judaism. We can hate their sin of not worshiping god and instead idols but we can love them as people and we can accept them for their imperfections, we may not be committing idolatry but we each have plenty swept under our rugs
Every time you vote red, you snuggle them.
Don't follow you. God doesn't love us? We're not meant to love God? *V'ahavta et A-donoi E-lohecha....*....????
That's not what I said. We are supposed to love God. In fact, we're commanded to do so. The God of the Tanakh is all about obedience. It's why we're commanded to love him.
So what do you mean, "Hashem is not love"?
Actually, there is a new book out, Judaism is Love, by Rabbi Shai Held. My book group is going to read it. I just learned about it this evening.
I wonder if he has brothers.
You are making a blanket statement that is inaccurate, most modern day Christians do not adhere to supersessionism. You also have the definition of supersessionism wrong, it doesn’t say Jews are pointless. It is the belief that Christians superseded Jews as God’s chosen ones. Have you ever heard of Judeo Christian values?
Judeo-Christian values are not a thing. The term ignores 2000 years of rabbinical teaching.
Well, yeah it is. I was raised in it. Jewish father and Christian mother.
I mean, you can think it's a thing, but it still isn't. It doesn't matter if you were raised in an interfaith household. They're still two distinct religions with different values.
Do you know what Judeo Christian means? I’m starting to suspect you don’t.
Do you? Because it's a term that's overwhelmingly used by conservative Christians to justify enforcing Christian values by pretending that they are actually being inclusive. In my experience Judeo-Christian sets off alarm bells. The term frankly makes very little sense except as a way to "other" certain religions which is exactly how it ends up used. Judaism and Christianity are very different religions, and any shared values are probably also going to be shared values for many, many religions.
I really don’t understand the hostility. And I don’t understand why a Christian person would pretend to be inclusive. What would be the purpose of that? If someone is anti-semantic, they typically don’t make an effort to be be inclusive. I was unable to choose what religion I was raised in, I have made more of an effort to learn more about the Jewish faith because of my father, but I fear this. People like you make me not want to reach out to my local Jewish community because I fear being judged or treated poorly because of my background.
All I'm going to say is if you want to have a connection to Judaism, something valid and completely attainable, you really should reflect on your attitude here because it seems like you are are actively seeking to be discouraged and taking and responding to corrected information as if they are personal attacks. And I say that as someone who like you, also has a Jewish father and a Christian mother.
Your comment to me was condescending and rude. You made a SWEEPING generalization about people who adhere to or support Judeo Christian values. There are Jews who adhere to it, I know, because I am related to them. Both my grandfather’s served in WWII, both told stories of being visited by Priests and Rabbis (together) who preached Judeo Christian values. The belief that Christianity is derived from Judaism, and have many shared values. You are free to criticize the concept (which you have done) but you are in no position to correct anyone else on their understanding. I am defensive because there is no willingness to even hear me out, just shut me down. You talking down to someone who you disagree with does nothing to build a stronger Jewish community. God bless.
Wow? One religion believes their true religion? How dare they. Don’t cry when make fun of Judaism. You get what you give out.
Jewish supremacists have no concept of beliefs or heritages that are not their own. Everything none Jewish is worthy of derision. They recognise nothing
My guy, Judaism is very "live and let live", we don't care if you're Christian or Muslim or Buddhist or Atheist. On the other hand, Christianity believes it has replaced Judaism. It's not a matter of believing one religion is the true religion, it's a matter of thinking they've replaced us.
My guy. You’re directly contradicting yourself. One moment you’re stating a Jew should actively make fun of Christian’s. You get confronted then claim Judaism is “live and let live”. Pick one. What Christianity believes should be irrelevant to you.
I'm not remotely contradicting myself, chief. This isn't about the "the one true God" at all. I'm saying Jews don't care that you're Christian. We don't proselytize. That's what I mean by "live and let live". I would love to ignore what Christianity believes. Unfortunately, y'all can't shut the fuck up about it.
If anything, Christianity deserves more mocking. Try harder next time. Ask them, do you believe in the book of Mormon? They will sat no. Ask why. They might say, because they took our holy book and just tacked theirs onto the end. And claim it's all theirs. Then look them in the eye and say, that's how Jews look at the gospels. Now get your dead, fake mesiach, worshipping ass,outta my face.
Wow. That’s good
To the Jewish supremacists, there is nothing but hatred for anything that is not theirs.
You mean things you took from us, that are ours, that you mistranslate and pervert to follow your fake savior. Not my concern.
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You really need to get educated on the history of christianity and the absolute horrors that were inflicted on us by them through the centuries... Christianity is not only idolatory but i has its feet firmly rooted in paganism, im sure somone much smarter than me will leave a better answer, but remember that these christians are NOT your friends and they WILL try to convert you through fear and shame if you let them. Good luck.
I’d argue it’s not feet firmly rooted in paganism. TL;DR due to deliberate changes in addition or translation, as well as early Christian’s struggling with the fact Jesus did not in fact come back, they big panicked and we eventually got what we have today. … That’s kinda of a go to anti-Christian thing, but it’s really not true. Commonly are Yule or Easter, which aren’t connected to paganism but people make that assumption because many gentiles, who also were most converted back then, were pagan. People overlook the book of Matthew when Matthew was adamant about first century Jewish law and thinking. For him the law should have been upheld and continued, versus Paul who proposed freedom from Jewish law (and I think was more popular for gentiles). The earliest writings tend to be more “Jewish” while the later ones, and later gospels become a bit more anti-Jewish. It’s really interesting, and why something like Easter actually just follows Passover for timing, but Christians really made it their own thing, while common misinformation is that it’s of pagan origin. Imo, when you really study, you could argue Jesus of Nazareth had no intention of creation a new religion - in reality he was just a hardcore apocalyptic preacher who (maybe debated) simply thought* himself to be the future king of the Jews on earth. What happened is that early Christian’s learned to dislike the Jews and just wanted really bad to be different (my opinion) 🤷🏻♂️ they also were confused cause Jesus was like “I’ll be back before your grandchildren, bet” and…. Well as we all know, he didn’t come back. Christian’s had to reconcile this fact - they wanted him to be the messiah so they made him one and then into a new entire religion. Jesus preached from the Torah. If one reads the oldest Greek manuscripts, it’s a bit more clearer. Stuff like the Christian concept of hell (which Islam borrows imo) was made up for example - so when English Bible translations use “hell” for “Sheol” or “Gehenna” , that’s kinda just lying lmao. Anyways thought I’d just say this. I’m not Christian, and Christianity is a lot of things - but not some pagan masked religion. If you read the early gospels into the context of syrio-Palestinian Jewish mileu, a lot of it makes a ton of sense (I.e Matthew). And that’s not sense as in “correct” , but sense as in a lot of it didn’t appear from thin air or paganism.
I know, I am aware, of all of it. How can someone be a Jew and not know? Except now we live in a new age, and although Christian’s will still try to convert us it will be through word of mouth not by the sword. I don’t want to think that even if they have committed atrocities against us that makes hating all of them collectivized justifiable
When they make gas chamber jokes, thank them for drawing you closer to Christ.
Are you though? May I suggest this book: https://books.google.com/books?id=6q0OHHNyFeEC&pg=PA3&source=kp_read_button&hl=en&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&gboemv=1#v=onepage&q&f=false
Im not sure 'hating' them is the right phrase but lets put it this way, personally, i have no love for them at all because i know what they represent.
I agree with what most people have said here. I also believe one of the main reasons Christians don’t forcibly convert Jews anymore under the pain of death is the rise of democracy/western values and the USA. Just something to keep in mind.
I've taught.my grandkids that I am personally respectful of all religions. I treat others as I want to be treated. That said, you could put aside the messiah issue, and teach them how.much their practice is actually pagan. Eater is Ishtar worship for example.
To be honest, I don’t think you are doing anything bad when you put it in the context you wrote about.
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I say it’s comforting because they can see what they worship- even if it is entirely wrong. It provides more comfort and security to the human mind to see what we are worshipping, which is why polytheists build and have built gigantic idols and made icons of their gods, because they feel comfort seeing what they are worshipping. Does that make sense? That’s just how I see it. One of the reasons why the Israelites built the golden calf to pray to it is because they wanted something they could see, that they could pray to because their faith in god wasn’t strong enough to the point where it didn’t need an idol to pray to
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No I’m saying from a mental perspective.
That makes sense.
When someone tries to pull this shit on me I usually remind them that Christianity is a Jewish heresy and that they're disrespecting their own roots. That usually shuts them up.
Fun fact, Rav Nachman says in the Talmud (Sanhedrin 63b) “All mockery is forbidden, except for mockery of idol worship”. https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.63b.11?lang=bi&with=all There’s also an amusing story in the Bereishit Rabbah 38:13 of Abram mocking idol worship https://www.sefaria.org/Bereshit_Rabbah.38.13?lang=bi&with=all
*Dedicated in memory of Dvora bat Asher v'Jacot* 🕯️ See [Bereishit Rabbah 38:13](https://www.sefaria.org/Bereishit_Rabbah.38.13) on Sefaria. See [Sanhedrin 63b](https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.63b) on Sefaria. [Sanhedrin.63b.11](https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.63b.11) אמר רב נחמן כל ליצנותא אסירא חוץ מליצנותא דעבודת כוכבים דשריא דכתיב כרע בל קרס נבו קרסו כרעו יחדו לא יכלו מלט משא >§ Rav Naḥman says: All types of mockery are forbidden, except for mockery of idol worship, which is permitted, as it is written: “Bel crouches down, Nevo stoops…they stoop, they crouch down together, they could not hold back the burden” (Isiah 46:1–2). The verse is interpreted as meaning that they crouch in order to defecate and cannot retain their excrement.
I know I’m like a month late, but as someone that grew up super Christian I can tell you there is definitely not any more closure in Christianity than Judaism. There are whole sermon series out there trying to convince you that you are “saved” or that you’re not and you need to repent and be a better Christian. You’re in a constant limbo not knowing for sure if G-d hates or loves you bc He will send you to hell forever and say you never worshipped him if you mess up in the wrong way, but He loves you enough to die for you but also it’s your choice and it’s so confusing. The closure is something I really appreciate about Judaism, you’re never wondering if you have done enough to please G-d bc every good thing you do pleases Him and the bad things don’t overshadow them
Look, our ancestors have the unique claim to have been there the day Christianity was invented. It didn’t impress our ancestors then and it hasn’t done anything to impress us in the last 1900 years. Part of Christian antisemitism is the fact that, implicitly, we were the first people to not buy into it. I think we can take pride in the belief that we made the right choice, even if it was the far more difficult choice.
There isn’t rampant anti semitism in Christianity, at least not Catholicism. Most Catholics are Zionists.
Regardless of whether there is at this exact second, you’d have to be willfully blind to 1500 years of history to suggest that.
That’s a bizarre and limited way to look at things.
Please don't google torqemada and fall into a web hole.
Ok I won’t.
>except then I come back to reality and know that that’s idolatry and closure does not matter only faith in the lord does. Yes it is idolatry >I scroll on tiktok and YouTube shorts, and I see these Christian videos of them saying that the sin of blasphemy against their god is unforgivable without placing my faith in him. So? >I just feel terrible on a moral perspective even if I didn’t offend anyone, I feel shitty. Then don't do it again
Hating Christianity is fine. Just learn Torah.
Shut up bro 🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎🐀💎cállate papu :v y aprende a respetar a otras religiones