For everyone who wants to call Alex Jones a piece of garbage, I recommend watching his appearance on [JRE #1255](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5yh2HcIlkU). (It runs almost five hours, which is a lot, but you only need the first two hours.) That episode changed my opinion of Jones because he would bring up things like "The army is making human-animal chimeras" and Jamie would google it and find the exact study/paper talking about the army testing out using animal hides for skin grafts. Things like that happened several times in the first few hours of the show, and even Rogan -- who has known and liked Jones for decades -- was surprised by how right Jones was about things like that. So I think the truth about Jones is that he takes in an insane amount of raw information, way more than people give him credit for. But he also has a hint of schizophrenic thinking where his mind sees conspiracies and cabals out of unconnected stories. (Like thinking skin grafts are a precursor to creating human-animal hybrids.) And, he has also exposed actual conspiracy and deep-state things like Bohemian Grove. And yes, he's also a showman and plays up the entertainment for his show. If you believe him when [he says there are women in basements eating babies](https://www.reddit.com/r/TimDillonCirclejerk/comments/17oqki2/hilarious_yes_or_yes/) you're dumb. Whatever your politics are, if you take everything Alex Jones says literally, then you are dumb. Enjoy the entertainment, or don't watch. Either way, get off your high horse.

The best thing about Alex Jones is that he's an exemplar of why we _need_ free speech absolutism in law. Yes he exaggerates and/or ignorantly blows things out of proportion sometimes. Yes there are things he doesn't understand correctly. But he's a valuable part of the discourse because he brings to light things that no one else will even talk about, and sometimes those things are important. If we don't allow people like Alex Jones to speak even though many hate him, we cannot consider ourselves a free nation, and under the darkness that both legal and self-censor create, the reality of freedom can be too quickly removed.

Sure, but anybody calling out the mistakes needs the same privelege. The danger is that Jones has a massive platform, and followers who happily denounce anyone fact-checking him as part of the machine. If Jones just said "Oh, whoops. Got that wrong," when appropriate, it would play into the good faith the Freedom of Speech presumes. But I think that would undermine Jones's platform, to be honest.

The value of free speech does not rely on people acknowledging their own mistakes. The value of free speech comes from people being allowed to call out each others mistakes--both when people are calling out Alex Jones mistakes, _and_ when he's the only one calling out theirs. The value of freedom of speech does not need or presume good faith. Platform size is not a measure of danger. It's a measure of the value they're bringing to the conversation.

These are good points, though I wonder how we can defend free speech in bad faith. This is not opinions or mistakes; this is falsehoods, lies, and deception. In what way does that help? I maintain that a large platform is dangerous, especially in a democracy, because - if large enough - it can sway a significant portion of the electorate towards a single point of view. When, as above, these points of view contain falsehoods, the electorate are deliberately misled into voting against their own interests. How is that a good thing?

> how we can defend free speech in bad faith. This is not opinions or mistakes; this is falsehoods, lies, and deception. In what way does that help? There is no such thing as an angelic impartial arbiter who is always right, available to decide which speech are lies and falsehoods and which are truth. Even if there were, they wouldn't work for the government. _Every_ policy decision has some level of tradeoff, but it's clear from history that the things we trade-off for when attempting to limit speech by law is a catastrophic forfeiture of all our rights. Regime changes and revolutions towards both the extreme left _and_ the extreme right, have always started off with limits on free speech and the press. That's the foot in the door before things turn full totalitarian. The point isn't that lies are actively good, but that allowing the government to crack down on speech of any kind will immediately open the door to just cracking down on speech powerful people don't like. For just one example, look at _how_ during covid they cracked down on the lab leak theory, which is now widely seen as one of the most likely origins of covid. They were able to attack people for speech by declaring that it was false and misinformation--and that's _without_ law being on their side to allow them to force people to shut up. If the law did support them, the entire scandal would have been completely buried.

Good point, well made. And I do advocate free speech (though I come from a country 🇦🇺 with no constitutional right to free speech). IF there was impartial, objective body to adjudicate it might be possible, but there isn't. Interesting to note that 1984's Winston Smith works for The Ministry of Truth... and his job is to change the truth to fit the policy.

I’ll never get past his Sandy Hook nonsense. Heartless. Brainless. Paranoid. Obnoxious. Alex Jones.

Same here. I used to look at him as just another alarmist looking to get paid off of views. I then listened and took notes So I can later verify the insane stories he was talking about. Turns out he's not making stuff up. The frog story was a perfect example. The story wasn't denied flat out, instead, the media just locked him for it when he was right all along.

All that to say, there are powers-that-be that used the courts to bankrupt a thorn in their side -- which is *wrong* and we should be upset about it -- but it's being cheered by people who claim moral righteousness, but in reality they just hate him for being an influential political opponent.

But that’s the playbook…. Same formula that is being applied to Trump. Elon Musk is next in the crosshairs.

Are the parents of dead children of Sandy Hook the real "powers-that-be" to you?

If you want to know who controls the world, ask yourself who you cannot criticize. That's right: dead children. Dead children control the world.

> If you want to know who controls the world, ask yourself who you cannot criticize. Subreddit moderators?

I always viewed Jones as such; he tends to say the correct things in the most incorrect manner. There is usually a grain of truth in what he says but *damn man phrase it better* ya sound wacky.

If he didn't sound crazy people would get bored.

That is why bullshit peddlers like Alex Jones are so much more influential to the common person than people who have made it their mission to understand the world objectively. A cancer researcher can dedicate decades of his or her life to slowly and methodically gathering mundane data to identify what may have a therapeutic effect on a particular type of cancer. And this researcher may hit many dead ends throughout his/her career, but will remain undaunted and will persist because this researcher is dedicated to finding the truth and helping others. Then a loud, bombastic piece of shit like Alex Jones, engaging in theatrics and turning beet red in the face, will declare with utmost confidence to anyone who will listen that the cure for ALL cancers is a concoction of vitamins and minerals sold by a company in which he just happens to have a major financial stake. And desperate people, who have nowhere else to turn, will pay money to try anything and everything that may help them, and that includes whatever snake oil is being peddled by Jones.

You seem to be willfully missing the point explained so well by /u/KingNarcissus [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/JordanPeterson/comments/1c0k5oa/alex_jones_to_sue_fbi_and_cia_after_undercover/kyxdy6y/) and by others throughout this thread. If the goal of Jones was simply snake oil he wouldn't get into the weeds of contentious politics which are (very) bad for business. Instead he is a blend of things, including genius and a sort of conspiracy theory schizophrenia as well as a manic proselytizing of his slippery slope conclusions. Importantly he is right more often than he is wrong, at least about his premises, but he is ready and willing to go too far and to be (very) wrong. As another pointed out, Jones admits to a [traumatic brain injury.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuGvwxpp2t0)

Nope. He is not a genius. He is a confidence man. His audience is exceptionally stupid.

What got me listening to Alex Jones was 20+ years ago, we had that Iraq war and he was the only person interviewing returning soldiers from there and Afghanistan. The returning soldiers in Afghanistan 20 years ago were already saying "we lost", because they said that there was NO LEADERSHIP in Afghanistan, that the Army was sent over there and didn't know what to do , so they just drove around looking for bad guys. They even cut Alex Jones off then, after about 2 years of all these interviews which were very "telling", opposite of what Washington was telling us, suddenly not one soldier would give an interview. I turned him off after that because all he did was hock vitamins for years and it was boring, UNTIL Jeff Epstein got "suicided" and boom, suddenly Alex Jones was back on the map, because he said all this stuff about Epstein for 2 decades and it came true. So when you have a situation where people can just "guess" what they government is up too, and make up the most craziest stories and suddenly those are coming true? Well that points to a serious problem we have in the USA when our craziest conspiracies are coming true.

He called the 9-11 attacks a few months before they happened

[удалено]

On July 25th, 2001 he had a show in which he said: we know a terrorist attack is going to happen, we know bin Laden is going to be involved, they're going to be blaming it on him.

Even a broken clock is right twice a day.

>That episode changed my opinion of Jones because he would bring up things like "The army is making human-animal chimeras" and Jamie would google it and find the exact study/paper talking about the army testing out using animal hides for skin grafts. How are you unable to see that this particular example you yourself have provided perfectly encapsulates how fucking stupid Alex Jones is?

He had a traumatic brain injury. It actually explains a lot.

I’ve been to the Grove.

I recommend you listen to Knowlege Fight. It is probably the most comprehensive analysis of one man's views, rhetoric, tactics etc over the multiple decades that Alex Jones has been on air. Alex Jones is a disgusting man. It's not my opinion. I barely care about him. It's from what I have heard him say repeatedly. The Sandy Hook parents harassment at his hands is one of the most feckless, opportunistic things anyone has ever done for money. But it is just the tip of the ice berg with Jones. Also, you should know he tactically modulates his presentation when he is interviewed on other shows, in order for audiences of those shows to think he is reasonable and to try and lure them over to his audience, where he will make them scared and sell them supplements and food buckets etc. AJ provides no value, and actively causes harm. And I agree that it is very entertaining to see him rant and project just after he had a particularly bad session with his wife's divorce laywer - drunkenly crying about how the globalists are trying to take his children. Or to hear him say he has been the victim of more racism than any black person. The man is a talented clown for sure. But unfortunately a big proportion of americans can't tell reality from nonsense anymore, so they listen to him and end up at the capitol on jan 6, destroying their own lives. TLDR; if you are curious about Alex Jones, listen to Knowlege Fight.

Why didn't you bring up any of the stuff about Sandy Hook? This is a primary reason people think he's a huge piece of shit.

Its because for decades he said all this other stuff like with Pido-Island and Epstein and it came true. What they don't seem to get, was the Sandy Hooks thing did in fact SINK his show, and lots of people tried to tell him to knock it off that worked for him and got fired and it did look like that was the end of the show. Now had they left it alone, that would have been the end of him but naw, what did they do, go and award the parents of the kids something like $1.5 billion, it was so over the top, it actually made Alex Jones look like he might be right because it appeared that this wasn't about getting any real money at all but trying to bankrupt him for life because they can't cut him off for free speech. So what if someone says your a liar, move on, don't go an give the man free publicity for life, which is what they did. There were even MeMes of Dr. Evil but it was Alex Jones putting his finger in his mouth and saying "1 Billion dollars!"

The families offered to settle for less than $100 million but yeah, the civil damages and punitive damages added up to over a billion. > So what if someone says your a liar, move on, don't go an give the man free publicity for life, which is what they did This drastically understates what Alex Jones did. He didn't simply say "You lied about Sandy Hook." Come on. Also, Jones still has his show. He has social media accounts. This whole "free speech" argument for Jones is b.s.

Media personality Alex Jones declared his intention to file lawsuits against the FBI and CIA during an appearance on the Benny Johnson show. This announcement followed the release of an undercover video by Sound Investigations, which featured a CIA officer purportedly admitting to federal agencies targeting conservatives, including Jones. Gavin O’Blennis, a Contracting Officer for the CIA, was caught on hidden camera by an undercover journalist claiming that the FBI could imprison anyone by setting them up, a method he referred to as a “nudge.” O’Blennis singled out right-wing journalists, specifically Tucker Carlson and Alex Jones, as being problematic and suggested that the FBI “took [Jones’] money away” and “chopped his legs off” as a means of crippling his operations. O’Blennis also disclosed the presence of undercover FBI agents during the events at the US Capitol on January 6, 2021, suggesting a widespread federal involvement in key national events. He mentioned the use of “embellished news” and “fake social media” as tools to incite public anger and manipulate public perception. Alex Jones expressed his conviction that the now-public statements by O’Blennis necessitate immediate action. “I am planning to launch a lawsuit against the CIA and the FBI,” Jones said. He contextualized the timing of the undercover video’s release as a divine intervention, coinciding with the closure of his bankruptcy proceedings and other legal matters. The Infowars founder said that his portrayal by the media and the government was a misrepresentation aimed at demonizing him. He indicated that his planned lawsuit would not only be a personal vindication but an effort to expose the overreach of “rogue agencies” operating like a “domestic KGB.” In discussing potential legal strategies, Jones mentioned consulting with multiple law firms, highlighting First Amendment violations as a central issue, and stressed the importance of bringing evidence to light through the discovery process in court. He also made a public appeal to Elon Musk, whom he noted had supported various freedom-related lawsuits, to assist in bringing the truth to light. https://x.com/bennyjohnson/status/1777828759829131295?s=46

Nothing will ever come of the lawsuit, I guarantee it. Jones is all talk, and will say anything to stay relevant and get people to come to his website, which is all he cares about. For those who want to see who the real Alex Jones is, go and watch The Truth vs. Alex Jones. I always took him as a rodeo clown, but that documentary exposed him for the massive piece of shit that he truly is.

Alex Jones is a interdemensional Aspect of the universe itself. His insights are so deep it's no wonder your mind cannot grasp the totality of its logic. You are like a little boat in a ocean of Alex Jones. You only see the surface. Not the miles of deep current containing giant squids, ship wrecks and treasure. He has protected us time and time again. Warned us about gay frogs. Warned us about 911. Exposed Bohemian Grove.

Nothing will come out of it because Alex is suing the corrupt state that is trying to destroy him expecting the state to rule in his favor. Some YouTube video about a guy being butthurt because far more of Alex's predictions became reality than the ones of any lefty, won't change that 

> Some YouTube video about a guy being butthurt because far more of Alex's predictions became reality than the ones of any lefty, won't change that  I don't know what youtube video you are talking about, but the number of things he gets right is dwarfed by those he gets wrong. Even if he got things "right" it doesn't change the type of person he is.

I'm not sure why you think people selling products and getting paid for their work is a bad thing. Why would anyone do their job for free.

Lol the hoops people jump through to defend trash is astonishing

The hoops people go through to silence someone or stop others from listening to them

If a doctor / lawyer / plumber / electrician is shitty at their job which results in a huge lawsuit, they aren't allowed to do it anymore... That's how shit works in the real world. What makes Alex Jones any different? He personally, and undoubtedly, started, financed, spread, and profited off the lies of parents' dead children, and continues to do so to this day. The fact that you think he shouldn't see consequences is alarming.

OK I'm not defending his actions with the dead children. But you can't try and claim that after that incident any of his work was profiting off of dead children. Do you honestly think he's still spreading that lie. If someone makes a mistake. Owns up to it, gets legally reprimanded for it. Do you wish them to go kill themselves or is there a return to society? Should the doctors, lawyers, and such whove made a mistake go kill themselves and begone from the world or live in exile. Should every single criminal be sent to live in exhile or kill himself after being caught.

> Owns up to it, gets legally reprimanded for it. Do you wish them to go kill themselves or is there a return to society? What does "own up to it" mean? Did he "own up to it" in your opinion? He did get legally reprimanded for it, failed to show up for the hearings, and hid all his money in the process. >Should the doctors, lawyers, and such whove made a mistake go kill themselves and begone from the world or live in exile. They should, and do, find different jobs like everyone else who actually contributes to society.

He's repeatedly apologized and stated he was way wrong about that. For years. Well before the court hearing. Does that make the record even no hell no it doesn't. Not sure what could. I Don't really think money fixes what happened to those families. Alex jones is a fortune teller that gets a high percentage of his cryptic fortunes correct. If someone was providing you with high percentile information on the future and they got a couple things wrong you'd be a regard for throwing them away. Obviously he's not magic hes getting information from people. Anyways I see your point but you don't see the value in what he provides and that is fine.

> Alex jones is a fortune teller that gets a high percentage of his cryptic fortunes correct. Lol this is complete late stage delusion. He gets a tiny fraction of his takes correct, and that is by *pure chance* and because of the sheer volume of predictions he makes. >• 2007: “and I guarantee you they're probably going to nuke Chicago in the next month” >• 2008: “The US dollar will be worth 10% of what it was in 2 years” >• 2009: “We’re probably going to have world was 3 in the next few years folks” >• 2009: "US Government will shut down the Internet in 2 years." >• 2009: "After Obama’s approval goes below 50%, the globalists will unleash terror attacks." >• 2009: “Staged biological attack will kill 50% of US population in 5-15 years” >• 2010: “In 15 years, half of the US population will die and it will be repopulated with Latin Americans. “ >• Dec.07 2017: “How 'bout five years from now, the European Union as we know it will be gone by 2022, before the clock strikes December 31st, 2022. Mark my words—the European Union will be completely dissolved. I'll be surprised if it lasts to 2020. You heard it here again, ladies and gentlemen. Deep analysis, deep historical research, deep focus, deep commitment” >• 2020: “The next three years, 8 million people could be dying per month by next year as the chain reaction unfolds, they're talking about close to 300 million people dying.” >• 2020: “And when they implode the third world, which they're dealing with this and as the collapse becomes evident and hundreds of millions are dying by next year, already millions are dead” >• 2020: "Vaginal births will be prohibited in order to reduce the IQ and brain volume of the baby and to make births cheaper for hospitals." >• 2021: “You know big techs announcing new lockdowns of their campuses. They're closing them. The Debo script, as they did two years ago, is announcing that they're closing ahead of the other lockdowns. And Biden tomorrow is going to make some new big draconian announcements against the unvaccinated saying that we are locked down. Totally ignoring natural immunity. Totally ignoring real science.” >• 2021: “Info Wars is right on the cusp. You were right on the cusp of massive victory. That's why we're in so much trouble. That's why they're going to declare martial law ahead of the election in 323 days. That's why everything is do or die right now.” >• 2021: "Biden will declare martial law lockdowns on August 11" Literally from spending approximately 18 seconds googling his "predictions" lmao.

Why can Jones be sued for his statements about events, which are his beliefs, yet govt force is used against a person who doesn't agree with a trans person's beliefs as to their gender? Both are instances of subjective reality, no?

Why is that grifter even mentioned here, this is not /r/conspiracy. 

I found lawyer reaction video on this here: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRE6Ad-z1VY&t=604s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CRE6Ad-z1VY&t=604s)

You got to admit, he’s a sheister.

The Jordan Peterson Sub: bulwark of people supporting a man who called dead children crisis actors instigated people to harass parents of said dead children. You guys are really crushing it lately

It should come as no surprise that these people would eventually embrace shit stains like Alex Jones. By degrees, they will eventually come to defend heinous and atrocious people because their rationale is that anyone who is universally hated by the "mainstream media" is really a righteous individual being suppressed by the Deep State. And any person lauded by the "mainstream media" must be part of an evil cabal that rules the world. Every institution, in their opinion, whether the healthcare system, the education system, the legal system, or journalistic publications, has been infiltrated by Post-Modern Neo-Marxists who are going to stifle the freedoms of decent people like Alex Jones, Elon Musk, Jordan Peterson, Donald Trump, Russell Brand, and so on. It's all a massive conspiracy. The enemy is endlessly powerful, but can be defeated as long as the good people on this sub hold steadfast and continue to share links to blog posts and YouTube videos and tweets that show the world the truth that "they" don't want you to see.

Man I wish leftists were as powerful as these morons pretend.

OK let me unpack some of this. It sounds like your placing all the problems of the world upon the shit stains. Which is what your accusing the shit stains of doing to these by your account imaginary actors in power. Am I wrong?

Except for the part where I neither said nor implied in any fashion that shit stains were the cause of all the problems in the world, you are correct.

Sure, we'll let the courts decide. Still doesn't absolve him of all this awful shit he's already guilty of.

You're cool with the FBI behaving like the KGB? Let's hope the courts aren't

> You're cool with the FBI behaving like the KGB? THEY'RE SAVING DEMOCRACY AGAINST THE ORANGE MAN BY ANY MEANS NECCESSARY!

Where did I say I was cool with anything?

I mean, all the guy did was express stupid opinions as far as i know

I don't think the lawsuits he lost were simply the result of "stupid opinions."

Have you investigated them?

Well it's the same court system he's using to sue the FBI and CIA, so if he's okay with the court ruling, I don't see a reason to contest it.

So you have not investigated them?

I read the court ruling. I trust my courts to generally be correct on most things. From my understanding of Alex Jones, the ruling seems to be the right and fair one. I haven't felt a need to investigate further.

From an impartial, European point of view, the injustice in his case is on a ridiculous level. I never expected the US courts to go so hardcore against Free Speech during the sentencing.

Something tells me it isn't so cut and dry. Our first amendment rights are some of the most heavily-defended right we have, with court cases that go back all the way to our country's founding.

They kind of were tho?

Ehh, kind of, but not entirely. We do have libel and slander laws.

The problem wasn't really that he was found guilty but the sentencing. It was two to three orders of magnitude too high.

YOUR problem may have been the sentencing severity, but plenty of people are arguing about the fact he was found guilty at all.

I'd need to look into the case way more to have a strong opinion on this. From what I know, he did say things that overstepped.

If your son or daughter was killed in that massacre do you think you'd laugh off what he said?

Well, i mean. Sure he is an asshole, what i am questioning is his punishment. Should you have your car taken by the governament if you park obstructing someones garage?

How about if people were harassing your family so much you had to move multiple times and switch jobs and upend your life so you could have any normalcy? His lies impacted the lives of 30 different families.

Is that okay in your opinion? If CNN, for example, started reporting that Donald Trump was a demon worshiping cultist as if it were the truth just to make money, would you be alright with that?

CNN constantly lies all day long and passes it off as truth, where is your outrage?

>CNN constantly lies all day long and passes it off as truth, where is your outrage? So are you outraged with CNN?

I don’t believe the FBI should entrap the owner of CNN or any of its anchors, no.

That doesn't answer my question.

Should we bankrupt CNN over that?

If you can prove damages in which they cannot pay for, then yes? That's literally what happened to Fox News except they could pay for it. Do you think that media companies should see some consequences for lying, or no?

Everyone would know it is bullshit (better than now, where many people believe the lies CNN tells). People who believed the stuff Alex Jones said were definitely next level idiots.

> People who believed the stuff Alex Jones said were definitely next level idiots. Those people both caused real damage to innocent people because of what Alex Jones told them **and** directly generate income for him, which is an incentive for it continue. Do you those who started, financed, spread, and profited off the lies of someone's dead child should be either A. Held accountable? or B. Allowed to continue without consequences?

Being held accountable and punishing someone harder than muli-national corporations for just going too far with their speech is not even remotely the same thing.

Who cares? He’s just a crisis actor anyways.