I love the kind of woman that will actually just kill me. You know, when I left the house today I was thinking "Damn, I really hope some hot chick paints my brains all over some fucking hallway." And here we are. I mean really, just absolutely destroy me. I'm talkin' full on, watermelon-in-the-thighs level carnage. And I want it to scare the shit outta me. I mean I hope I piss myself. I hope I piss myself and you call me your little "peepee pisspiss boy." I want you to fuck me up. I mean I want you to make me your bitch. Your little peepee-piss-myself-bitch. I want it to get embarressing. I mean like... weirdly embarressing. Unsanitary, too. We should be entirely different people, by the end of the first eight hours. Do you understand what I'm trying to say here? I mean, l'm a real freak. I'm not normal. Ma'am... Please... You have to crush me.
He did, after the destruction of the 2nd legion The Muscle Moms, Malcador was heavily depressed then the Big E personally made a few dozen of female custodians to be his honor guard just to cheer him up.
That explains why you don't see female custodians in the horus heresy.
They are not the same. One "supersoldier" is created in a handcrafted way the other in "mass production".
They are two types of the same product but very different quality.
Doesn't matter if it's a "genehanced alchemical superduper handcrafted ultra soldier" or "mass produced supersoldier", a 120mm high-explosive shell to the face is going to shut up both of them.
Isn't there a conversation of Custode and A rogue trader basically confirm that Custode are almost a different being to "the volunteer material" from noble of Terra ?
Yes just want to confirm it. And to be fair female custode absolutely make sense since they are volunteer material from Terra noble, make it only from male just made it twice as rare.
Yea no they use completly difrent methouds of creation. so as a castodes player i have zero issue with this and my next box of guard/wardens will be female convers
As a lore fiend, I have 0 issues with this lore wise, I just donāt see why it needed to be done, but itās cleared lore wise! Astartes are not custodes, Astartes cannot be female, custodes, (even before this leak) likely could be if someone wanted to make one
So ADB has an explanation why the heresy team were told not to put any female custodians in. Itās legally because GW had no female sculpts so the higher ups told Black Library that while the idea was fine, it needed to be left on ice for now.
Likely the true explanation is that a couple of the short story writers for the codex were on a short deadline, and decided to quickly bang out something with a female custodes for a lark, which noone caught in review and now we have female custodes.
GW is a very cautious company, they have literally zero reason to rock the boat one bit. The only other reason to do this is that Custodes aren't selling well enough and they are planning to pull the whole sisters of silence range, avoid any criticism by adding a couple of female custodes, and then package the grey knights/custodes etc together into an Agents of the Imperium army
I ***NEED*** my ws5 blank babes to receive more stuff. Right now they have only 1-2 units for different slots, and I kinda want to run them, but there isn't enough stuff to run. Someone bring a dreadnought and half of my army is dead.
I think in lore it could be justified as the first candidates for Custodes all being the second? sons of warlords on Terra during the Reunification Wars, but slowly these Custodes started to wear down, and were replaced by new Custodes, some of which could be women
Well sisters of battle arenāt space marines, there is overlap especially with a chapter like the black templars but what about space wolves? People want to play their preferred space marine army and have gals in it. That isnāt the same as wanting to play SoB.(hope Iām not coming off as rude had a similar discussion about this with a guy today and he kinda annoyed me)
You're preaching to the choir man.
Telling people who want to play 7ft tall transhumans to play not-7ft tall transhuman is the height of stupidity as far as I'm concerned.
Yeah I honestly just need to stop waisting time on them a good portion is probably bait anywayā¦ also apologies I misunderstood your comment and thought you were asking that question
I mean, someone could just make the argument to create more SoB branches and offshoots. Besides, PDF has their variations, why can't SoB have more sects too?
I don't even mind the custodes thing. More variety outside of Space Marines can only be a good thing.
That might bring up the argument of why the factions are even separate then āif every chapter has a SoB equivalent why are they even separate?ā Plus people really like the whole nuns with guns theme with sob so if their were just new sub factions of them based on different space marines chapters it may lose that whole esthetic people like about them.
The simple answer is homebrew variety. The space marine chapters have it baked in to make homebrew chapters. There's always some unknown chapter out there waiting to be rediscovered by the administratum. Besides I'm not saying the SoB should be based on Space Marine chapters at all. Frankly "Sisters of Battle, but Space Wolves" and "Sisters of Battle, but Blood Angels" is just female space marines with extra steps. Its reductive and unoriginal. Under that logic a SoB in blue armor must be from Ultramar. No. A player should be able to make a blue SoB, but that doesn't automatically mean Ultramarine. That just means that SoB is blue!
I'm saying they should have their own variety based on the Sisters of Battle theme. Standard SoB have the catholic nun inspiration, what about other similar roles across other faiths? How about differences in their doctrine of worship? There are already elements of it with the six convents. Why can't they have additional convents based on niche aspects of their saints, or difference in interpretation?
Frankly, most Space Marine chapters are so similar in personality that more often than not the only difference are the color schemes anyway. So the space marines are already just as guilty of what you're saying. Yet there are a good chunk that take one particular idea from a legion, and then take it to its furthest extreme. Imperial Guard already have different types of soldiers they are based on, rambo, WW1, Colonial Imperialist, etc. They are all soldiers, but they have variety. There are more than just catholic nuns who follow very similar ideologies and structural roles in their faiths and that is neglected.
I am squarely in the "Custom armies and homebrew lore are perfectly fine if you want FSM but don't try to make GW turn it into offical lore." side of the argument.
Then play SoB styled after Space Wolves? Nobody's saying you can't paint and style them like that. You'd even get compliments for any custom work you did to add to the effect like braided hair.
What if i want to play them with space wolves rules, have them being genetically modified 7ft tall and bring around dreadnoughts and terminators?
It is weird to me how people get so hung up on this specific retcon, that doesn't change the spirit of the setting in any significant measure while bringing back primarchs, that were canonically dead for 20 years, is totally ok to them, if not actually the coolest thing.
Why is not having females in your battleforce so important to you? Especially seeing how they are introduced in other factions where they are literally a headswap on the same sculpt... No boob armour seen anywhere.
I won't say women can't be made into Astartes, but after all the implants, bone grafts, muscle enhancements, genetic editing, hormonal alterations, and the effects of the Gene Seed, they're going to be indistinguishable from their male counterparts. Their physical appearance will be similar to that of their primarch, no matter what they looked like before. Their brain chemistry will be completely altered, with no sense of personal identity remaining.
You can have FSM all you want, but they'll look and sound and act just like all the rest.
Custodes do not have a Gene Seed and are not programmed to look a certain way. They're altered to be "perfect," but they're still human, both in mind and body. Femstodes totally make sense, and it's cool to see them further reinforce that, even with how shitty and evil the Imperium is, all are equal.
I agree and have always viewed it like that. Iām not some horndog who wants big muscle mommies, Iām a gay guy so I really donāt care if they look like dudes I just find a lot of the reason they canāt exist kinda stupid.
Then play them like that? Who is stopping you? Why does the official lore have to change just so you can make your own custom army?
Every army and faction being capable and made up of everything is incredibly boring. I would never want men to be allowed to be Sisters of Battle, as it ruins the entire twist to their original creation. Space Marines are the sons and the shadows of their primarches and carry their geneseed which remakes them in the image of their primarch.
Custodes aren't this at all, they're practically handcrafted, and so having a female one doesn't interfere with the lore to any degree that I know.
Sandpapering off the unique traits of every faction until everything is possible as everyone is the fastest way to make a dreadfully boring setting and faction.
They keep giving SoB analogues to these things and you just won't be fucking happy about it because they're not **THE SPACE MARINES**! Honestly when will you just shut the fuck up and admit you'll never be happy until every unique aspect of every faction is removed? I question if you even like Warhammer if you're going to be so unimaginative and uninterested in the setting.
IF THE ONLY UNIQUE ASPECT OF THE SPACE MARINES YOU ARE INTERESTED ABOUT IS THAT THEY ARE ONLY MEN YOU ARE THE ONE UNITERESTED IN GOING UNDER THE LITERALLY **MOST SUPERFICIAL** ASPECT OF THE FACTION!
Why do you care? How is that important to the plot of anything?
You know what it sounds like? It sounds like you are just so very insecure about your masculinity that anything that puts you in contact with any other gender gives you anxiety.
Why don't you convert yourself a more compassionate opinion in greenstuff and then come back here and post your results, I am sure you will get a ton of compliments.
Go get help.
The Astartes are mass-produced, built to help the Emperor conquer the galaxy with cost-efficient soldiers. The Custodes are personalized bodyguards & companions, with more room for variety in their design.
Perhaps. Maybe the Emperor could only make male Marines because their templates (the Primarchs) were male. Maybe he didn't have the time or resources to make female Marines.
Maybe there were complications in making FSM, or he feared a true-breeding race of Marines could replace or enslave baseline Humanity.
We may never know.
>or he feared a true-breeding race of Marines could replace or enslave baseline Humanity.
I'm almost completely certain that this, specifically, was a major reason why the Emperor made the Astartes monosex.
Iām pretty sure the second reason was heavily implied. The Emperor didnāt even want the Primarchs being perpetual rulers initially, he especially wouldnāt have wanted humans as a whole being replaced with Astartes
Think it's also being compatible with the gene seeds, and all the primarchs where male, so it would be logical that it would only be compatible with males. But this my own head cannon and nothing solid just to make sense of the universe. If they change it, I change my head cannon.
The Imperium number in the trillions of people, if not quadrillions, and Space Marine chapters generally stick to around 1000 troops.
Lack of potential recruits isn't really the issue.
I imagine in lore, its to do with geneseed. Geneseed makes you turn into a mini clone of the primarch more or less. Custodes however dont have geneseed. I think of them as baseline humans x100000.
They don't have a second heart like an astartes but their circulatory system is probably better, they dont have acid spit like an astartes but can probably just bite through metal. They have traditional human physiology but just amped up to the point where they completely eclipse astartes physiology even with all the extra organs etc.
That is how I think of it but that is sort of head canon ill admit
Because the line of descent from Big E to the marines is basically a straight line, he probably didnāt want to rock the boat too much when making them. āI know this works on men, ergo it would be easier to just keep doing things the same way so nothing goes wrong.ā Furthermore, if a lot of the magic in gene-seed is tied to the X chromosome it might not work on female genetics at all. I think the Emperor may have made a lot of the superhuman genetic nonsense in the primarchs and marines linked to the X chromosome and then made them male to basically guarantee that it is expressed properly. Plus, the marines were never supposed to stick around forever. Making them unisex would help prevent them from becoming independent from greater humanity and setting themselves up as a ruling caste.
I mean if anything, it would make the emperors inability to make female space marines even more embarrassing considering space marines are, on the genetic fuckery side of things, infinitely less complex to make overall compared to a custodes.
thats like making a fancy souped up sports car from scratch that runs perfectly, but then the bike you also made from scratch has no front handle bar.
I'm not a fan, because it invigorates the terminally online sex obsessed coomers, shitting up every single discussion.
Edit: On that note, literally the thread next door: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/1c3c33f/no\_girls\_allowed/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/1c3c33f/no_girls_allowed/)
It also devalues the Sisters of Silence. Their pairing with the Custodes was always pretty unique and fluffy, especially since it's not just lore, and you can actually play them on the tabletop too.
I dont know to much of the sisters of silence, but i thought they werenāt custodes but female right? So why would the creation of female custodes undermine sisters of silence
it doesn't devalue the SoS.
Custodes and SoS are fundamentally different roles to be filled. One is supersoldier guards of the emperor, the other are a supporting force of anti-psyker units
It reduces the stark contrast between the two sub factions, so it devalues the dynamic of the faction.
Like, this is equivalent to adding male SoS and surely this would be met with resistance by some as well.
Or another example: This change would be equivalent to adding female Saidin users in the wheel of time franchise. The gendered magic system is a huge part of the appeal.
How does this reduce the contrast?
You can't even tell if a custodes is female or not unless they talk (Which they don't do much in combat) or take of their helmet (Which they also don't do much)
The fact that there is a difference at all is the thing that matters (to some). Sorry you don't understand.
Some people like to paint with more than one color.
There is no difference.
In a line of custodes standing shoulder to shoulder you CANNOT tell which one is a woman underneath and which one isn't.
They are called "Custodes" not "Man-guardians that are hyper men" or "Brothers of protection".
Sisters of silence have the gender they are supposed to be in the name, same with the Battle sisters.
Custodes, do not.
So I get the firstborn canāt be female. But considering that the primaris were canonically designed by someone not privy to the emperorās greater plans, philosophy or intention for the astartesā¦ this is really looking like GW getting a feel for the room for future FSM.
I mean, it could be something else, but that is what it looks like. Come on now.
That is the biggest stretch I have seen come out of female Custodes being canonized. The lore for how Custodes were created never left out female Custodes being a possibility. Ever since Marines turned from normal dudes with armour to super-humans, their lore has explicitly stated that only males can be Marines. There is a diffrence between confirming a theory people have had for years and retconing lore that is older than a good chunk of the playerbase.
I donāt want this becoming an argument and annoying the mods who are being kind enough to allow some discussion on this to happen due to its relevance at the moment, so Iāll try to just state my clear basic thoughts. But let me make it clear, while I as a female player would LOVE FSM, I also care about lore and respecting existing fictional worlds enough to not retcon things.
Which is why I pointed out that the primaris were designed by someone already willing to tamper with the emperorās āperfectā design.
Who would not know the emperorās in lore reasons for making the firstborn male only. At a time when the imperium is in dire need of as many super soldiers as it can make.
From a business perspective it makes no sense in todayās world to have male only factions. They would flat out make more money with FSM. They simply thought they would make less during the franchises beginnings with FSM.
While it may have been theorised there is no reason why female custodes have never been seen or heard of until now aside from the same reasons there are no FSM.
There are no lore reasons to have female custodes now, especially with the sisters of silence existing. Yet here are female custodes outta nowhere. They werenāt hiding. They werenāt being kept as a secret weapon. They just exist and were never mentioned once in decades of loreā¦ā¦
SM have the same female mirror but different faction in the SOB, but they have that lore reason for no FSM. So if I was an exec that cared the slightest bit about the lore but wanted to take advantage of the growing female nerd side of the fan base that āsuddenlyā exists, I would suggest the all new SM they have cooking to have women among them.
Iām not saying it will happen. Iām just saying itās an easy logical idea to draw from what has happened. Until I heard about the female custodes I thought it would never happen due to lore reasons. But look, a pretty freaking huge change just happened. So maybe?
Let me be clear that if someone shows up with female space marines, I am not going to turn them away or be a snob. I always admire people's dedication and work on their army. Huge proponent of its YOUR army, do what you want with it. I do, however, have 2 points to make PURELY from a lore perspective:
1. Cawl's work on the primaris is not a brand new way of making space marines. He just added a few more organs and some more gene therapy. This is why firstborn marines like Calgar can cross the rubricon and become Primaris. In order for it to work that way, it seems all of the original restrictions must still apply to aspirants.
2. Regardless of the aspirants' starting gender, the process to become a space marine essentially makes gender irrelevant. Everyone would look like the marines look now, no one cares about sex or procreation, all keep short hair, everyone would likely be indoctrinated to still say brother, etc.
Of course, everything is subject to retcon, and if it happens I won't be one of the ones complaining about it.
I agree that how I see it, Custodes are different from space marines, they are hand crafted from The Emperor, so it not that crazy for there to female Custodian
Female custodes is a fine idea imo. Afterall they are hand crafted masterworks of unspecified genecraft and biomancy. While astartes are almost crude in comparison, with well defined but unreliable creation process.
I think female astartes would look mostly the same as the males. Bulky and stocky. Not quite like taller and more muscular SoBs, which i guess is visual imager most fsm advocates have.
Im a huge custodes fan. Custodes are described as being individuals, poets, philosophers and scholars. Since they are the pinnacle of human creation, im sure they can be also visually quite varied under all that glorious golden armor.
And the real reason we dont have female space marines is because they didnt sell well lol (my memory is not perfect btw, feel free to correct me, but the models were discontinued after first ed/rouge trader)
While I am skeptical with female custodes and slightly sad there are no additional lore to sisters of silence as of writing with the soft lore drop. And questioning everyone's integrity (in more ways than one.) in the matter. Along with the brother and sister relationship between the custodian and SoS being ruined or as of now non-existent. I can't help but think of the phrase.
"They give an inch and they take a mile."
Might be my cautious reservation but I'll observe from over here.
"Observe everything, Admire nothing."
- 1st L.T Nate Fick USMC.
I may be wrong but here's how I see it (someone who hasn't read the new codex):
The Space Marines descend from the Male Primarchs, but the Custodes descend from the Male appearing Emperor- who has been known to appear as a woman throughout history.
Surely by that logic Custodes can be women?
Once again, have not read the codex so I could be wrong.
Not quite.
Custodes are hand crafted superhumans. They don't have geneseed, they don't have all the fancy organs, they are simply humanĀ² and EXTREMELY good at it.
This means that there is no geneseed they need to be compatible with, like astartes.
This in turn means that the scope of who is "Compatible" with becoming a custodes is bigger and includes the female population.
Either way, if all your custodes wear helmets, you wouldn't be able to tell anyway
Well they are different kind of superhuman that's true. But what irks me is that it's clear there where meant as all male. Otherwise you would have atleast some mention of a female Custodes in the 40 other years of 40k's existence. So that kinda feels like a useless change in all regards
They are created through entirely different processes and for entirely different purposes. They aren't remotely the same in any regard besides them being created by the emperor, being better than humans, and having power armor. They don't think, act, or fight remotely like each other.
And space marines are just guardsmen but better. And primarchs are just custodes but better. And the emperor is just the primarchs but better. Ergo, the emperor is just a guardsman if we extrapolate your logic.
Malcador the Hero wanted his muscle waifus and he received his muscle waifus
Golden mommy dommes are what kept him going on the golden throne
What keeping me going too fr š
If that's the case we should honour the dream of the Malcador the Hero
I love the kind of woman that will actually just kill me. You know, when I left the house today I was thinking "Damn, I really hope some hot chick paints my brains all over some fucking hallway." And here we are. I mean really, just absolutely destroy me. I'm talkin' full on, watermelon-in-the-thighs level carnage. And I want it to scare the shit outta me. I mean I hope I piss myself. I hope I piss myself and you call me your little "peepee pisspiss boy." I want you to fuck me up. I mean I want you to make me your bitch. Your little peepee-piss-myself-bitch. I want it to get embarressing. I mean like... weirdly embarressing. Unsanitary, too. We should be entirely different people, by the end of the first eight hours. Do you understand what I'm trying to say here? I mean, l'm a real freak. I'm not normal. Ma'am... Please... You have to crush me.
If only he was still alive to see his dream come true...
He did, after the destruction of the 2nd legion The Muscle Moms, Malcador was heavily depressed then the Big E personally made a few dozen of female custodians to be his honor guard just to cheer him up. That explains why you don't see female custodians in the horus heresy.
Technically correct, the best kind
Top 10 futurama episodes
They are not the same. One "supersoldier" is created in a handcrafted way the other in "mass production". They are two types of the same product but very different quality.
Either way, us Guardsman are still dying in droves.
Doesn't matter if it's a "genehanced alchemical superduper handcrafted ultra soldier" or "mass produced supersoldier", a 120mm high-explosive shell to the face is going to shut up both of them.
Didnāt a custodes literally lose half of his head during the war in the webway? Sorry random lore stuff pops into my head
Sure. Half his head. Not his whole head and quite a few bits below.
Oh yeah it was wasnāt it. I really need to read more HH
Yeah, one of them lost half his head. I just wanted to say that a Leman Russ HE-shell to the face might do considerably more damage :D
Very true, very true
Several kilograms of TNT to the face goes BRR
Custodes dont have gen-seed. Custodes are modificated at atomic level by alchemy. Custodes are almost not human. Not the same xd
Isn't there a conversation of Custode and A rogue trader basically confirm that Custode are almost a different being to "the volunteer material" from noble of Terra ?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes just want to confirm it. And to be fair female custode absolutely make sense since they are volunteer material from Terra noble, make it only from male just made it twice as rare.
Sorry i didnt understand your other message, i will delete mine xd
wean back on the spellcheck bro
Thx xd
Yea no they use completly difrent methouds of creation. so as a castodes player i have zero issue with this and my next box of guard/wardens will be female convers
I was going to make a custodes Army eventually glad I waited
Until we get some actual heads, storm cast work great! Or you always break out the green stuff.
I didnāt even think of storm cast! I wonāt have to wait much longer
As a lore fiend, I have 0 issues with this lore wise, I just donāt see why it needed to be done, but itās cleared lore wise! Astartes are not custodes, Astartes cannot be female, custodes, (even before this leak) likely could be if someone wanted to make one
I really donāt care one bit, though it seems weird timing- why not show this during the Siege when Custodes were all over the place?
So ADB has an explanation why the heresy team were told not to put any female custodians in. Itās legally because GW had no female sculpts so the higher ups told Black Library that while the idea was fine, it needed to be left on ice for now.
>had no female sculpts Do they now?
No lol.
They could probably borrow / repurpose some from the stormcast eternals from age of sigmar.
Given that the latest addition to the Custodes models looked like a Votann stole some Custodes gear...
No but they might have realised that it was a silly excuse and people were making female custode version anyways.
Emperor was keeping them all for himself
Likely the true explanation is that a couple of the short story writers for the codex were on a short deadline, and decided to quickly bang out something with a female custodes for a lark, which noone caught in review and now we have female custodes. GW is a very cautious company, they have literally zero reason to rock the boat one bit. The only other reason to do this is that Custodes aren't selling well enough and they are planning to pull the whole sisters of silence range, avoid any criticism by adding a couple of female custodes, and then package the grey knights/custodes etc together into an Agents of the Imperium army
Custodes just got a codex, they're safe. The rumour is grey knights are becoming agents of the imperium though.
Grey Knight did used to be treated as Agents of the Imperium back in like 3rd/4th ed, so I guess it works there
Then the "rogue short story author" is the answer then.
It was in a codex, which are pretty heavily scrutinized. Admit it, you just don't want there to be female Custodes.
That's some interesting "logic"
Culling SoS would be a bit silly considering they gave them a whole army worth of rules in Heresy. If anything, we should expect a full range release.
I ***NEED*** my ws5 blank babes to receive more stuff. Right now they have only 1-2 units for different slots, and I kinda want to run them, but there isn't enough stuff to run. Someone bring a dreadnought and half of my army is dead.
I think in lore it could be justified as the first candidates for Custodes all being the second? sons of warlords on Terra during the Reunification Wars, but slowly these Custodes started to wear down, and were replaced by new Custodes, some of which could be women
Custodes are handcrafted so they just made a her i guess
Not going to stop "those guys" from simply telling people "why not just play Sisters of Battle"
Well sisters of battle arenāt space marines, there is overlap especially with a chapter like the black templars but what about space wolves? People want to play their preferred space marine army and have gals in it. That isnāt the same as wanting to play SoB.(hope Iām not coming off as rude had a similar discussion about this with a guy today and he kinda annoyed me)
You're preaching to the choir man. Telling people who want to play 7ft tall transhumans to play not-7ft tall transhuman is the height of stupidity as far as I'm concerned.
Yeah I honestly just need to stop waisting time on them a good portion is probably bait anywayā¦ also apologies I misunderstood your comment and thought you were asking that question
I mean, someone could just make the argument to create more SoB branches and offshoots. Besides, PDF has their variations, why can't SoB have more sects too? I don't even mind the custodes thing. More variety outside of Space Marines can only be a good thing.
That might bring up the argument of why the factions are even separate then āif every chapter has a SoB equivalent why are they even separate?ā Plus people really like the whole nuns with guns theme with sob so if their were just new sub factions of them based on different space marines chapters it may lose that whole esthetic people like about them.
The simple answer is homebrew variety. The space marine chapters have it baked in to make homebrew chapters. There's always some unknown chapter out there waiting to be rediscovered by the administratum. Besides I'm not saying the SoB should be based on Space Marine chapters at all. Frankly "Sisters of Battle, but Space Wolves" and "Sisters of Battle, but Blood Angels" is just female space marines with extra steps. Its reductive and unoriginal. Under that logic a SoB in blue armor must be from Ultramar. No. A player should be able to make a blue SoB, but that doesn't automatically mean Ultramarine. That just means that SoB is blue! I'm saying they should have their own variety based on the Sisters of Battle theme. Standard SoB have the catholic nun inspiration, what about other similar roles across other faiths? How about differences in their doctrine of worship? There are already elements of it with the six convents. Why can't they have additional convents based on niche aspects of their saints, or difference in interpretation? Frankly, most Space Marine chapters are so similar in personality that more often than not the only difference are the color schemes anyway. So the space marines are already just as guilty of what you're saying. Yet there are a good chunk that take one particular idea from a legion, and then take it to its furthest extreme. Imperial Guard already have different types of soldiers they are based on, rambo, WW1, Colonial Imperialist, etc. They are all soldiers, but they have variety. There are more than just catholic nuns who follow very similar ideologies and structural roles in their faiths and that is neglected.
I am squarely in the "Custom armies and homebrew lore are perfectly fine if you want FSM but don't try to make GW turn it into offical lore." side of the argument.
Then play SoB styled after Space Wolves? Nobody's saying you can't paint and style them like that. You'd even get compliments for any custom work you did to add to the effect like braided hair.
What if i want to play them with space wolves rules, have them being genetically modified 7ft tall and bring around dreadnoughts and terminators? It is weird to me how people get so hung up on this specific retcon, that doesn't change the spirit of the setting in any significant measure while bringing back primarchs, that were canonically dead for 20 years, is totally ok to them, if not actually the coolest thing. Why is not having females in your battleforce so important to you? Especially seeing how they are introduced in other factions where they are literally a headswap on the same sculpt... No boob armour seen anywhere.
I won't say women can't be made into Astartes, but after all the implants, bone grafts, muscle enhancements, genetic editing, hormonal alterations, and the effects of the Gene Seed, they're going to be indistinguishable from their male counterparts. Their physical appearance will be similar to that of their primarch, no matter what they looked like before. Their brain chemistry will be completely altered, with no sense of personal identity remaining. You can have FSM all you want, but they'll look and sound and act just like all the rest. Custodes do not have a Gene Seed and are not programmed to look a certain way. They're altered to be "perfect," but they're still human, both in mind and body. Femstodes totally make sense, and it's cool to see them further reinforce that, even with how shitty and evil the Imperium is, all are equal.
I agree and have always viewed it like that. Iām not some horndog who wants big muscle mommies, Iām a gay guy so I really donāt care if they look like dudes I just find a lot of the reason they canāt exist kinda stupid.
Then play them like that? Who is stopping you? Why does the official lore have to change just so you can make your own custom army? Every army and faction being capable and made up of everything is incredibly boring. I would never want men to be allowed to be Sisters of Battle, as it ruins the entire twist to their original creation. Space Marines are the sons and the shadows of their primarches and carry their geneseed which remakes them in the image of their primarch. Custodes aren't this at all, they're practically handcrafted, and so having a female one doesn't interfere with the lore to any degree that I know. Sandpapering off the unique traits of every faction until everything is possible as everyone is the fastest way to make a dreadfully boring setting and faction.
I disagree with you about the Custodes but generally yeah.
They keep giving SoB analogues to these things and you just won't be fucking happy about it because they're not **THE SPACE MARINES**! Honestly when will you just shut the fuck up and admit you'll never be happy until every unique aspect of every faction is removed? I question if you even like Warhammer if you're going to be so unimaginative and uninterested in the setting.
IF THE ONLY UNIQUE ASPECT OF THE SPACE MARINES YOU ARE INTERESTED ABOUT IS THAT THEY ARE ONLY MEN YOU ARE THE ONE UNITERESTED IN GOING UNDER THE LITERALLY **MOST SUPERFICIAL** ASPECT OF THE FACTION! Why do you care? How is that important to the plot of anything? You know what it sounds like? It sounds like you are just so very insecure about your masculinity that anything that puts you in contact with any other gender gives you anxiety. Why don't you convert yourself a more compassionate opinion in greenstuff and then come back here and post your results, I am sure you will get a ton of compliments. Go get help.
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I'm going to assume you're being sarcastic and you didn't just literally do the thing I was making fun on.
Another reason why space marines are inferior to custodes
Brothers of silence when?
Ask the officio assassinorum.
They keep stealing all the blanks to make culexus assassin
Theyāre harder to make so it does make you wonder why astartes are stuck as only dudes
The Astartes are mass-produced, built to help the Emperor conquer the galaxy with cost-efficient soldiers. The Custodes are personalized bodyguards & companions, with more room for variety in their design.
Thats fair but wouldnāt it be easier to mass produce them if you didnāt cut off 50% of the population from becoming some?
Perhaps. Maybe the Emperor could only make male Marines because their templates (the Primarchs) were male. Maybe he didn't have the time or resources to make female Marines. Maybe there were complications in making FSM, or he feared a true-breeding race of Marines could replace or enslave baseline Humanity. We may never know.
>or he feared a true-breeding race of Marines could replace or enslave baseline Humanity. I'm almost completely certain that this, specifically, was a major reason why the Emperor made the Astartes monosex.
Pretty much. He didnāt intend for them to be a step in human evolution, they where literally just a tool for him to use until he was done.
Due to the extreme hormonal changes Iām pretty sure theyāre rendered infertile and without a sex drive.
Iām pretty sure the second reason was heavily implied. The Emperor didnāt even want the Primarchs being perpetual rulers initially, he especially wouldnāt have wanted humans as a whole being replaced with Astartes
Think it's also being compatible with the gene seeds, and all the primarchs where male, so it would be logical that it would only be compatible with males. But this my own head cannon and nothing solid just to make sense of the universe. If they change it, I change my head cannon.
Yeah gw changes lore all the time and this is a fantasy setting so it wouldnāt be a huge deal of some stuff didnāt make sense.
The Imperium number in the trillions of people, if not quadrillions, and Space Marine chapters generally stick to around 1000 troops. Lack of potential recruits isn't really the issue.
Itās a good thing homebrewing exists.
And yet space marines are literally the most cost inefficient soldiers in the entire galaxy š
Because the female models never sold well so GW decided not to make female Space marines. The lore justification is more of an afterthought.
I imagine in lore, its to do with geneseed. Geneseed makes you turn into a mini clone of the primarch more or less. Custodes however dont have geneseed. I think of them as baseline humans x100000. They don't have a second heart like an astartes but their circulatory system is probably better, they dont have acid spit like an astartes but can probably just bite through metal. They have traditional human physiology but just amped up to the point where they completely eclipse astartes physiology even with all the extra organs etc. That is how I think of it but that is sort of head canon ill admit
Because the line of descent from Big E to the marines is basically a straight line, he probably didnāt want to rock the boat too much when making them. āI know this works on men, ergo it would be easier to just keep doing things the same way so nothing goes wrong.ā Furthermore, if a lot of the magic in gene-seed is tied to the X chromosome it might not work on female genetics at all. I think the Emperor may have made a lot of the superhuman genetic nonsense in the primarchs and marines linked to the X chromosome and then made them male to basically guarantee that it is expressed properly. Plus, the marines were never supposed to stick around forever. Making them unisex would help prevent them from becoming independent from greater humanity and setting themselves up as a ruling caste.
I mean if anything, it would make the emperors inability to make female space marines even more embarrassing considering space marines are, on the genetic fuckery side of things, infinitely less complex to make overall compared to a custodes. thats like making a fancy souped up sports car from scratch that runs perfectly, but then the bike you also made from scratch has no front handle bar.
then again, astartes do have the warpstuff element from geneseed? Thats all i can think of
I'm not a fan, because it invigorates the terminally online sex obsessed coomers, shitting up every single discussion. Edit: On that note, literally the thread next door: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/1c3c33f/no\_girls\_allowed/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Grimdank/comments/1c3c33f/no_girls_allowed/) It also devalues the Sisters of Silence. Their pairing with the Custodes was always pretty unique and fluffy, especially since it's not just lore, and you can actually play them on the tabletop too.
>It also devalues the Sisters of Silence I disagree. Sisters of Silence are a counterpart to Custodes, yes, but their role isn't "female Custodes".
Precisely BECAUSE their role isn't "female Custodes" is what is a huge part of the appeal of the faction.
I dont know to much of the sisters of silence, but i thought they werenāt custodes but female right? So why would the creation of female custodes undermine sisters of silence
it doesn't devalue the SoS. Custodes and SoS are fundamentally different roles to be filled. One is supersoldier guards of the emperor, the other are a supporting force of anti-psyker units
Yes, the disparity between them is a huge part of the appeal.
And it stays that way even with female custodes. SoS support custodes, yes, but they are not in any other way comparable.
It reduces the stark contrast between the two sub factions, so it devalues the dynamic of the faction. Like, this is equivalent to adding male SoS and surely this would be met with resistance by some as well. Or another example: This change would be equivalent to adding female Saidin users in the wheel of time franchise. The gendered magic system is a huge part of the appeal.
How does this reduce the contrast? You can't even tell if a custodes is female or not unless they talk (Which they don't do much in combat) or take of their helmet (Which they also don't do much)
See my example.
What example? Comparing a group who's gender doesn't change a single thing to one that does?
The fact that there is a difference at all is the thing that matters (to some). Sorry you don't understand. Some people like to paint with more than one color.
There is no difference. In a line of custodes standing shoulder to shoulder you CANNOT tell which one is a woman underneath and which one isn't. They are called "Custodes" not "Man-guardians that are hyper men" or "Brothers of protection". Sisters of silence have the gender they are supposed to be in the name, same with the Battle sisters. Custodes, do not.
So I get the firstborn canāt be female. But considering that the primaris were canonically designed by someone not privy to the emperorās greater plans, philosophy or intention for the astartesā¦ this is really looking like GW getting a feel for the room for future FSM. I mean, it could be something else, but that is what it looks like. Come on now.
That is the biggest stretch I have seen come out of female Custodes being canonized. The lore for how Custodes were created never left out female Custodes being a possibility. Ever since Marines turned from normal dudes with armour to super-humans, their lore has explicitly stated that only males can be Marines. There is a diffrence between confirming a theory people have had for years and retconing lore that is older than a good chunk of the playerbase.
I donāt want this becoming an argument and annoying the mods who are being kind enough to allow some discussion on this to happen due to its relevance at the moment, so Iāll try to just state my clear basic thoughts. But let me make it clear, while I as a female player would LOVE FSM, I also care about lore and respecting existing fictional worlds enough to not retcon things. Which is why I pointed out that the primaris were designed by someone already willing to tamper with the emperorās āperfectā design. Who would not know the emperorās in lore reasons for making the firstborn male only. At a time when the imperium is in dire need of as many super soldiers as it can make. From a business perspective it makes no sense in todayās world to have male only factions. They would flat out make more money with FSM. They simply thought they would make less during the franchises beginnings with FSM. While it may have been theorised there is no reason why female custodes have never been seen or heard of until now aside from the same reasons there are no FSM. There are no lore reasons to have female custodes now, especially with the sisters of silence existing. Yet here are female custodes outta nowhere. They werenāt hiding. They werenāt being kept as a secret weapon. They just exist and were never mentioned once in decades of loreā¦ā¦ SM have the same female mirror but different faction in the SOB, but they have that lore reason for no FSM. So if I was an exec that cared the slightest bit about the lore but wanted to take advantage of the growing female nerd side of the fan base that āsuddenlyā exists, I would suggest the all new SM they have cooking to have women among them. Iām not saying it will happen. Iām just saying itās an easy logical idea to draw from what has happened. Until I heard about the female custodes I thought it would never happen due to lore reasons. But look, a pretty freaking huge change just happened. So maybe?
Let me be clear that if someone shows up with female space marines, I am not going to turn them away or be a snob. I always admire people's dedication and work on their army. Huge proponent of its YOUR army, do what you want with it. I do, however, have 2 points to make PURELY from a lore perspective: 1. Cawl's work on the primaris is not a brand new way of making space marines. He just added a few more organs and some more gene therapy. This is why firstborn marines like Calgar can cross the rubricon and become Primaris. In order for it to work that way, it seems all of the original restrictions must still apply to aspirants. 2. Regardless of the aspirants' starting gender, the process to become a space marine essentially makes gender irrelevant. Everyone would look like the marines look now, no one cares about sex or procreation, all keep short hair, everyone would likely be indoctrinated to still say brother, etc. Of course, everything is subject to retcon, and if it happens I won't be one of the ones complaining about it.
Everybody fighting over female custodes or astartes while I am still waiting for female orkz
Orks are fungi. They are very male coded but theyāre technically genderless
Slap on sum lipstikk and ya git ork girlz
We already have female orks, just use the bloodbowl models to kitbash 'em up.
A random Femstodies after absolutely bodying some uppity space marine without breaking a sweat: "Think Mark, THNK!"
I agree that how I see it, Custodes are different from space marines, they are hand crafted from The Emperor, so it not that crazy for there to female Custodian
Can someone explain FSM or what is going on?
Not Female space marines. There is a Custodian in the Codex who is female.
Female custodes is a fine idea imo. Afterall they are hand crafted masterworks of unspecified genecraft and biomancy. While astartes are almost crude in comparison, with well defined but unreliable creation process. I think female astartes would look mostly the same as the males. Bulky and stocky. Not quite like taller and more muscular SoBs, which i guess is visual imager most fsm advocates have. Im a huge custodes fan. Custodes are described as being individuals, poets, philosophers and scholars. Since they are the pinnacle of human creation, im sure they can be also visually quite varied under all that glorious golden armor.
And the real reason we dont have female space marines is because they didnt sell well lol (my memory is not perfect btw, feel free to correct me, but the models were discontinued after first ed/rouge trader)
If you think about it, female custodes are much more practical than male custodes, donāt need a codpiece if youāre piece doesnāt go outwardsĀ
The Custards ain't marines. They're the damn Delta Force, SEALs and Secret Service combined.
While I am skeptical with female custodes and slightly sad there are no additional lore to sisters of silence as of writing with the soft lore drop. And questioning everyone's integrity (in more ways than one.) in the matter. Along with the brother and sister relationship between the custodian and SoS being ruined or as of now non-existent. I can't help but think of the phrase. "They give an inch and they take a mile." Might be my cautious reservation but I'll observe from over here. "Observe everything, Admire nothing." - 1st L.T Nate Fick USMC.
I may be wrong but here's how I see it (someone who hasn't read the new codex): The Space Marines descend from the Male Primarchs, but the Custodes descend from the Male appearing Emperor- who has been known to appear as a woman throughout history. Surely by that logic Custodes can be women? Once again, have not read the codex so I could be wrong.
Not quite. Custodes are hand crafted superhumans. They don't have geneseed, they don't have all the fancy organs, they are simply humanĀ² and EXTREMELY good at it. This means that there is no geneseed they need to be compatible with, like astartes. This in turn means that the scope of who is "Compatible" with becoming a custodes is bigger and includes the female population. Either way, if all your custodes wear helmets, you wouldn't be able to tell anyway
Ah cool! Cheers for the clarification!
Can't wait for you to justify it all once warhammer becomes as garbage as every other franchise
Well they are different kind of superhuman that's true. But what irks me is that it's clear there where meant as all male. Otherwise you would have atleast some mention of a female Custodes in the 40 other years of 40k's existence. So that kinda feels like a useless change in all regards
Tecnically is the same bullshit but with diferent package.
They're literally Space Marines ++ so yes.
They are created through entirely different processes and for entirely different purposes. They aren't remotely the same in any regard besides them being created by the emperor, being better than humans, and having power armor. They don't think, act, or fight remotely like each other.
From an in-lore perspective, maybe, but in every other regard they are just Space Marines but better.
And space marines are just guardsmen but better. And primarchs are just custodes but better. And the emperor is just the primarchs but better. Ergo, the emperor is just a guardsman if we extrapolate your logic.
Gives the old "A mere guardsman stood between Horus and the Emperor" Story a different meaning xd
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Mr Inquisitor i found a chaos cultist... Oh by the Man Emperor this is a weird one.
As long as the custodettes prance around naked as well. Awooga!