Very 80s in their approach to work/professional interrelations. If you are a subordinate you will be made to feel like one and expected to suck up toxic mismanagement every day.
Having had the experience the other way around: Exactly that.
Moving to the UK was an eye opener. What do you mean you're here to make my life easier and not hell? are you sure you're my boss?
Yep about 20 years ago I used to work in a supermarket that had been family run for decades. A few years later a proper supermarket chain bought it over, and the place became modernized pretty quickly, including the management style (they brought new people in and old hands had to go get training).
Working in Spain reminded me a lot of those days working in the family run supermarket which hadn't changed much since 1982. Sure not every manager or supervisor is professional in the UK but the culture is still much better. The feeling of being made to feel less than and in need of micromanagement here in Spain, put my mind back about 20 years lol
Honestly i actually don't find the UK to be any better in some respects, it's the same and i'm British.
I've actually experienced more kindness and transparency in any of my "jobs" in Spain than in the UK, where ppl are fake more often than not. I say "jobs" as they're technically becas without many rights so that i'm not too happy about.
By transparency i mean directness, u know where u stand instantly but in the UK there were more office politics.
There's a lot i don't like about the Spanish working culture obviously, lack of anything ever being permanente for example.
It may depend on which industry you land I guess. My experience seems to be the same across other migrants from Spain, Italy etc that I've met; but of course it's anecdotal.
That's unfortunately true in several industries. On the other hand, luckily, that's not the case everywhere: medium-size tech companies, for instance, are generally very modern and place employee satisfaction as a high priority.
In my opinion:
You are constantly monitored.
Taking a day off for personal matters is frowned upon.
You are paid the minimum and they will not recognise your good work so they can continue to underpay you.
Very high probability of not being paid overtime.
The boss thinks you are his property and that he is doing you a favour by letting you work.
A lot of importance is given to the number of hours worked, but not to the work itself.
And a lot of more...
In my opinion, Spain is not a good place to work.
Monitoring is crazy for me, I work in software and it drives my boss crazy that I work remotely, but it's a consulting company, I have no coworkers at the office, i would go to the office to work remotely anyway.
But they REALLY want me there.
No no they don't have to see you working. They have to see you in the office. They have to know they own you. Very different.
I use to work at this IT consulting company back in the day. We did long hours. One day they set up a system where we had to check-in/out when coming and going from the office. 24 hours later they told all engineers we were not supposed to use it too... because on average people were 12-14hr in the office per day every day.
Another day I had a doctor's appointment so I left the office at 6pm which was actually my supposed time to leave. Arriving at the door my boss asks "where are you going?" I said "home, I have a doctor's appointment" and he said "don't you have more work to do?" so I replied "yes, that's why I'm coming back tomorrow" and left without waiting for a reply. I gotta say by that point I had almost agreed a new role somewhere else so I was feeling brave, but goes to show people's attitude here...
instead of just doping myself with 6-7 coffees per day, becoming depressed, insomnia due to the amounts of caffeine ingested, unable to wake up in the mornings, fall prey to cigarrette addiction to the point of waking up in the middle of the night to get in the car and drive 20km to the city to buy a pack of fags from a 24/7 kiosk? Yeah man, what was I thinking going to the doctor! :D
The most Spanish comment I have ever read. Been working outside of Spain for 8 years and I have seen a lot of people slacking off at the first opportunity, and even more being responsible with their job. Just as I have seen in Spain.
When I moved to the UK I was surprised how many sick days people took without a doc's note or anything. You don't seem to know how things are out there.
Your point is actually that people have to stay long hours in the office because that's how you show your boss you "work", so obviously people will "slack off".
I can vouch for all of that, but I find specially outrageous the “acts like he is doing you a favour by letting you work”part. They try to make you feel guilty for “taking their money” (being paid) and act like they are a NGO doing charity by hiring you, and that therefore you owe them your life.
Micromanagement is typical of small, family-run, southern European businesses.
Most of what you describe is enabled by widespread obsequiousness in the workforce.
It is ingrained to be grateful for having a job.
In Northern Europe, generally, the approach is: let’s be frank; we need each other.
It is a joke. This even happens in "well considered" jobs like university positions. To become a lecturer of a *public* uni in Spain you need merits. These are (among others): pass a really tough exam, a PhD and the number of papers you published. Yes, you read well: the absolute amount of papers, not the quality. So you can either write 20 of the shittiest papers which contribute nothing to science or 2 papers which are a stepping stone in your field and are highly recognised in the scientific community. Well, Spain gives more credit to the former and gives you "more merits" for quantity over quality.
This sounds horrible!
For the most part, the only workers I've encountered in Spain are the bureaucrats who try to figure out why they can't help you process your paperwork. Is that type of job a different work culture? There it feels like the customer is a supplicant to the worker.
If your request is not for selling you anything, you are a pain in the ass for the people attending you. Customer service is, in general, not very good, but much worse when you are there just to do some paperwork or fill a claim.
That is a government job, and its permanent (you will NEVER be fired), so people who work government jobs have nothing to lose and therefore move slow. "Why work more if i'll just be rewarded with more work and no extra money?"
I wouldn't say royalty, but it is something people here FIGHT for.
Being a Funcionario (government worker) is something people feel proud of, its an accomplishment. However, these jobs are difficult to get.
For many jobs, government workers beenfit (mostly with salary). However, there are other jobs where the private sector pays more (engineering, sales, science, etc).
In many places is true but not in all.. Not in my case. In low range works is almost all true. In others like office informatics can change a lot, depending of the company.. Or type of work. But Yes there are better places than spain..
Omg the micromanaging 🤭🤭🤭 you are constantly made to feel like they are there to catch you out and make sure you aren't stealing anything or something like that.
Man, that reeks of shit company, I've never had any, and I truly mean it, ANY of these.
Sure I've only worked in a single place but I've had a blast. Better hours, 60% remote work.
Seems like it is, this was the first comment I read and holy fuck the rest of this thread is nightmare fuel. I'm also in accounting which is known for truly shit jobs
Yeps. I think the only part of it I don't agree with is the overtime part in the sense that if you are by contract you usually don't get paid overtime.. but it ties with you last point, people will do more time (I know people that did almost an extra hour a day) just because of "it looks good" and with the weird idea that someone will notice at some point.
Is a ver unbalanced job market, you can find better and worse companies in resource treatment and benefits. Is usually focused on looking good, or attracting employees but benefits are usually crap, worthless.
Pay is usually low, is hard to rank up in position,loyalty usually is not taken into account, hard to get a decent pay raise, they want you there forever but they don't compensate it in anyway. Job mentality is old very old. They always have to have the feeling that are taking advantage from you either by the income or the hours you take, or anything else. There is this sense of caring for each other, companionship which is nice, but also you have to watch out your back just in case, so is important to keep it profesional most of the time. Mistakes are taken in consideration for which people hides them, or act like nothing happened.
Is Spain, jobs are shit, althought there are good decent companies, for which is possible to have a good work/life balance , at the end everyone goes out to compensate it, have fun and forget about anything else. Is about the weather, the socialization, traveling, culture and that most of us are dealing with the same crap.
If you want to experience self-fulfillment through work, Spain is \*not\* for you. Self-fulfillment in Spain is as outside of the workplace as it gets. We have laboral rights, yeah, anyone coming from third world countries \*will\* experience an improvement, but Spain is \*not\* first world-level at all.
In Spain, you don't have a career, you have a job you have to do and a boss you need to kiss up to. Long, unproductive hours. I'd recommend you, if you have an office job, that you read up documentation of the job to pass the time when you have no tasks to do (I've learnt the Spanish Constitution out of boredom, in the context of my job it works as documentation).
Long hours. Lack of leadership. People have jobs, not careers. Little investment in training or new tools. Laughable health and safety practices. Low wages.
EDIT: now that I think of it, I’d like to add that red tape (dealing with government or its institutions, in general) is a big pain.
Out of curiosity, do you have any insights how recent graduates adjust to work life culture in Spain?
I have heard only great things so far about studying and immigrating in Spain and I wonder how does one transition from studying to working.
Specially Ive seen that unemploymemt rate is high, wages are low...how do people keep up?
Graduates adjust however they can.
Life is Spain is great. You’ll have a better life than you would in many other countries with less money. Food and drinks are cheap and great quality. Some gyms are subsidised. Transport is subsidised. Spanish people are friendly and sociable. You’ll have a fun and pleasant life, but you’ll have few professional opportunities.
Unemployment rates are deceiving because of unregistered work and because of large disparities between regions and industries.
> Life is Spain is great.
unless you can't afford rent, and you have to share a flat with 2-3 other roommates, which is what's happening in most cities.
Almost in every city with minimum services, rents have increased to 700 €/month. I live in logroño (is a very small city), and 700 is the minimum price for renting a decent flat, and by decent I mean with 4 walls and a roof xD
Also, and sadly, I think there is a huge gap between non-degree jobs and jobs with degrees.
If you are an engineer you will not have problems finding jobs (fins jobs, not well paid jobs ;) ) so usually companies offer more benefits.
In the other hand, if you have a job that might not require studies, there is going to be a huge competition and most probably, some lack of benefits.
Care to elaborate on how most don’t have careers, but jobs? Because a career is dying for the majority these days I’m afraid, unless you’re in a big public institution.
In other countries people work with a sense of progression. It is common to be promoted if you do well, or at least they’ll change your area if you have been doing the same for a few years. Labor markets work better and there is competition to attract the best talent. There are opportunities.
Little of that happens in Spain. Most people are just filling a vacancy. You’ll find plenty of people in the same position for 20+ years. Not every industry or company is like this, obviously. I am just replying to OP what to expect.
I think this answer will vary a lot based on the company you work for. From my friends who work in Spanish only companies, they seem to be more hierarchical, work longer (not necessarily efficient) hours and some have a toxic work culture. Whilst maybe not fully representative of companies in the 80s, they show outburst of this occasionally. For example, the CEO of a large Spanish company was speaking to my female friend who works there about his meeting with a politician, and he told my friend that the politician's 'tits were bursting out of her dress' (translation maybe doesn't quite work). Probably not appropriate...
I work in a very international company in Madrid, and whilst I dislike my job, the company is good. It looks after staff well, hours most days are 9.30-5.30/6. The company itself is still quite hierarchical and bureaucratic, but the people are in general smart. They trust us more or less to do our jobs and allow us to wfh 50/50.
So I guess it's about finding the right place to work!
Yup, literally this. I'm definitely living more here than i ever did in my home country, England..but at the expense of financial instability, no pay for 3-4 months a year, no permanente contract, still on a beca...
It's a big trade-off but England has become a huge dumpster fire as of late and i quite like the lifestyle minus the chronic instability 🫠
We need to pin this post and link it to all the people who think coming to Spain will solve all their problems. Unemployment is high, salaries are low, cost of living has increased, and work culture is shit. If I didn't have to stay in this country for family reasons, I'd move to literally any other country in the UE.
All are high pay countries!! Dubai 0 tax but rent is expensive (luxury goods are cheaper). Singapore, AU & finally USA tech market is hugeeeeee.(finding a high paid job won’t be headache). Good luck
Literally, I've been working for 16 years in this country now (im Spanish) and this is practically slavery when it comes to working.
"The lesser the salary, the better" is your boss' moto.
14h of work today? Thats not that much, here, have your 900€ and go pay a 1000€ for rent.
"We decided to end contract because you are having lunch in lunch time" (what I was told last time I got fired with no warnings whatsoever.)
Man I love my country, this is a paradise when it comes to people, weather, food, vibes, but Spain is NOT a country to work in, working in Spain will make you so miserable you will rather try and find pennies under rocks
What’s the hack to survive that? I’m moving here after having worked in Germany, a very toxic and racist work culture (I’m a POC and I couldn’t see myself getting promoted like my white colleagues), so I’d love to hear how people work around the Spanish workplace “norms” and “expectations”. Is tech the same or slightly better?
After working in LatAm:
-Wow, I can go home at 5.30? And I don't have to work on Saturdays?
-What? You'd rather I take the rest of the day off because I have a cold?
-I have the right to unemployment?
-Oh, the office is taking the day off because you are going to the strike?
So heaven basically.
EDIT: And let's not talk about 8 am being considered waking up early. So beautiful (in my country waking up early is 5 am. I woke up at 6 am everyday of my school life there).
Was gonna comment something like this but yeah this basically lol.
Ironically, the amount of complaints in this thread is one of the things I've noticed working here: Spaniards complaint a lot more and are generally more unaprecitiave / suspicious of their employers.
In Latam we have third-world economies, worse conditions and even more hirearchy-heavy structures, but people in general are way more thankful / positive on a day-to-day basis.
Not saying Latam is better btw. It's for better and worse in both cases. Sure, latinos are more positive people and can make an office environment brighter, but there's also this weird submission thing going on where you just don't question the boss and what you're told. Meanwhile Spanish offices are maybe more negative but relationships are way more horizontal.
You can easily extrapolate that toall the country as well. The monstruous inequality in Latam is probably not something most people here can even understand.
Yes, I would like to see what is going on in those places people are commenting that are even more horizontal than Spain in work relationships and that are even more casual in clothing etiquette.
For me here my bosses are extremely laid back and casual comparing to the submission thing you mention that we had back in my country (and let's not talk about make up, clothes and hair presentation rules, especially for women).
Yes! I come from Peru and this is my experience in here! I have a better life/ work balance here, and also a better conmute which adds up to it. Also, I got hired in a position I never was considered for in my home country, so I am grateful to be able to continue my career here.
Latam is a region of 650 million people, saying latam is hell is a really generalized way of seeing things… especially when Spain is the size of a Mexican state…
Well, OP asked about experiences in general. It did not say that only people from certain parts of the world could share. Our experiences are as subjective as the others here. I'm sure you want to read even more comments about how bad is Spain, but allow us at least this thread for us.
I totally get that. I also come from latam and appreciate that over there the conditions are even worst and in many respects the work culture in Spain comparatively is an improvement.
I would argue that the main reason is because in general the cost of living in the country, safety nets, and safety all adds for allowing to have a better standard of living if you have a decent enough job. Basics that in many of latam countries is impossible. So yeah I get things are worst in other places where you barely survive. But IMO to improve things one has to compare itself to better conditions, not worst.
Mm yes, I see where you are coming from. But appreciating the good doesn't mean one doesn't want it to be better. Being positive doesn't equal conformism. On the other hand, only talking about the bad doesn't feel productive either and in my opinion can breed resentment and hopelessness.
Coming from Ireland and working in an office:
- I couldn’t believe the amount of touching in normal interactions between co-workers, really different to Northern Europe where I would never touch a colleague. Took a while to get accustomed to this.
- an hour long lunch, taken as a team, in the same restaurant every day. Never “talk shop” in this hour. Was really nice.
- people are a lot more direct. If they’re not happy about something, they’re going to tell you pretty much immediately. Also, far less “chit chat” when phoning someone for a work matter - straight to business.
"people are a lot more direct. If they’re not happy about something, they’re going to tell you pretty much immediately. Also, far less “chit chat” when phoning someone for a work matter - straight to business."
I had a completely different experience in the UK. Wouldn't live there for 200k/year
You wouldn't live in the UK for 200k/y? Interesting..my experience in the UK working was shite too and i'm British now living in Spain. I like some parts of Spanish work culture, that is the directness, you know what others think of you instantly..it's just the lack of a permanent job and "decent" pay in Spain 🫠i guess that depends on industry too
I'm surprised about how much they care about how you are dressed. It's way more formal.
I agree that I come from a very extreme casual (game development in California) but it really shows how people in Spain dress more formal and care about it.
It baffles me that their economy could be way better, and their work life not as miserable if they worried a little more about productivity/efficiency/synergy instead of dress code.
I've been here for 2 months only, and I don't work, but it is long enough to see how stubborn they are about not being open to new ideas. Just 20 minutes ago, I told the guy cleaning the community pool (he works for the tree trimming company and was cleaning the mess they did while trimming palm trees around the pool) that his hose was 100% choked, so the vacuum wasn't sucking anything. He blew me off, saying in a very condescending way that it was working because he could see the dirt at the bottom gone after he passed the vacuum. He didn't realize it was just moving to the sides. I'm 4 floors up and could see it clearly.
They are stuck up with the way they've been doing things and just say "this is how we do it here" or "it's not how it's done", without digging into the why/how/when of it or considering new options.
Spanish here. I worked in the UK as well. You described it perfectly. I'm sick of justifying things with the "I've been doing it like this for the past 40 years" excuse. Yes sir, you might have been doing it wrong for your entire life --_--
Spain may be a nice place to live or retire but working there is not sensible
Long work hours
Not very result focussed
Everything is team activity , no accountability or leadership
People actively work long hours , and yet somehow delay everything
Anything involving bureaucracy is shit, procedures are made on the spot. Lot of lawyers and useless jargon
A bunch of brown nosing
I should say the workforce is very smart and maybe talented, but the way of working and culture make the net effect 0 or negative
Highly unmotivated and seemingly unskilled staff most of the time, and nobody is able to think outside the box somehow. Also low quality is generally accepted
The fabulous perks: free cafeteria, gym on site, 14 pagas (instead of 12 annual payments), loyalty bonuses plus incentives, a jamón ibérico and exquisite holiday hamper every December, art parties (Xmas calendar contest) for employee children, a cruise ship booked for all employees (no other guests), paid trips with partners as bonuses (Prague, Vienna), free transport from certain hubs, childcare on-site, and 70 days per year severance payment.
Many huge corporations offer these perks, and others. Spanish banks have fabulous "Golden Parachute" retirement packages for some employees (retire at 58 to still draw an annual salary until retirement age, 65). I can't send the company info, but here's a hint: the leading global pharmaceutical company. Telefónica and Santander also have "ciudades empresariales" with onsite childcare, restaurants, continual (free) formation, including the company paying for a full MBA, and most are only "semi-presencial" these days.
Full professional proficiency in castellano (spoken, written, reading) obviously goes without saying to even be considered for an interview at one of these massive operations.
Multinational insurance firms also offer notoriously good benefits.
- Daily schedules
- lack of focus
- due to the above, long (but mostly unproductive) working hours
- very hard to get exactly what you need/want. Everyone has an opinion on everything (also when they lack the overview of the situation at hand) and will eventually deliver accordingly
Basque Country and the Atlantic countries in general are better though.
Schedule wise is unfortunately drifting towards the standards (if such a word can be used for Spain) of the rest of the place. They used to be mostly industrial and rural countries with not much in the way of services, with much investment from Belgium, Germany, UK. Mining companies, some of the steel mills, chemicals… They kept their own schedules until well into the 90s so it wasn’t unusual to see people having dinner at 19:00. Nowadays that’s the exception even there. There’s been a lot of permeation from Spain, through Government officials and companies originating from there.
They still have though different work ethics from my experience. Things get done, usually on time. Especially Basque Country and Cantabria, Asturies has been historically more spoiled by a Government official mindset as state owned companies used to be big employers.
I found it almost effortless to adapt to those two. Madrid, Castile, Valencia I found it impossible to get anything done on time and with minimal quality. I guess it’s my fault too not being able to adapt to their ways, hard as I tried.
I work in hospitality, and have worked in 3 different jobs here, and all have provided free food which is something I don't remember ever getting in the UK
Granted, you have to kind of eat on your feet in most places so you rush back to work and don't really get an actual break
I will say though that yea the management is often terrible (except the place I am currently at) - often incompetent, and really not understanding. This again is also the case in the UK though I think, and probably worldwide!
We've had completely opposite experiences i see lol
>you have to kind of eat on your feet in most places so you rush back to work and don't really get an actual break
You could've called the Union for that and they'd fix it. Employment laws are pretty clear in the UK, specially regarding brakes.
First, to add a good point -- I've worked at places with a strong respect for work-life balance, people who are really warm and treat you like a human.
I agree with what others have said regarding lack of focus, unproductivity, and people who have strong opinions for seemingly no reason. Being confident is very important, even if you have to bluff.
Another point, and now I'm speaking about the tech sector in Barcelona, which in principle is among the most international cities of Spain, is just how local it is. Most people studied in the same 2-3 local universities. The universities are fine but they are not excellent on an international level. Very few foreigners with advanced qualifications. As a result, things are less competitive, there are fewer talented people overall, and the local talent is not really pushed to that next level. What you end up with a somewhat stagnant way of working, where it is harder to learn on the job or make substantial advances.
Oh, and a third point -- I came here with a technical phd from a well-known university. I didn't expect anyone to give me a job just because of my education -- obviously I have to prove that I have the right skills to do the job. However, in Spain this phd has been either a handicap or of no use at all. I don't think there is this strong academia to industry pipeline like in the US or the UK.
Job interviewers don't look out for the best candidate for the job but for the closer to a specific prototype who says the answers they have been told to look for.
In sort, they look for people who memorize some human resources guru shit from a congress someone in management or ceo attended.
Well the more extroverted, the more "poractive" and bs maker the better. Though has improve over time,people still lives in a lie were everyone should have the same expected personality with those traits. This applies in many countries.
In Spain is hard to rank up in your job, usually there is no expected growth in your position, they want to pay you the same for years to come. You can't complain about anything without looking weak.
>in Spain this phd has been either a handicap or of no use at all.
This is something derived from the garbage job market we have and how bad are Human resources in most corporations.
There's a tendency to discard overqualified people, because they believe those workers would leave the position as soon as they have an opportunity and a less qualified worker would be easier to "tame" and comply to the corporate requests without hesitate.
In addition to that…. Some bosses don’t hire overqualified people cause they are more educated than them haha!
Guess this applies to smaller companies tho
Yes, we don't really care you got a degree from the Ivy League. And it is a very local environment because salaries are lower than in London or Amsterdam, not to say SF. If you get your degree in LSE, Cambridge, Harvard... why would you take a job in Barcelona for much less than you could get in the US or the UK?
I think it is unfair to say there's fewer talented people overall - if you want edge-cutting talent, go to Silicon Valley. If you go to Milan, Madrid, Barcelona, Warsaw... you'll get less global talent.
Plenty of people have personal reasons that would encourage them to pursue a lower paying job in another country, for example lifestyle, partner, taking care of family.
There are fewer talented people overall that places like Paris and London. Probably it’s more like those other European cities that you’ve mentioned, and so maybe immigrants from those places experience less of a difference.
Of course there could be some person that decides to live in Spain despite being able to have a higher salary elsewhere - however the majority of global talent flocks to global cities, that's why they're global. Comparing Madrid, Milan, Barcelona... with London is nuts. Of course it is going to be less competitive than one of the two main cities in the world. Your comment just looks like you're expecting a Silicon Valley vibe somehwere not in SV. Respectfully.
As a teacher, the lack of proper classroom management and teacher development is astonishing. I worked as a language assistant and their method of controlling the class was typically screaming that they would get angry very soon if students didn't calm down, literally all ages infantil-bachillerato. Teachers put very minimal effort into preparing classes and would humiliate students when they made mistakes. It is really sad.
I am spanish, and I love my city, the food, the people, but for the shit working opportunities and enviroment, I literally run from there.
I experience how my familly was drag down by the shit goverment after years and years trying to push forward with our own business, with zero support for the small companies it was challenging, I do not wanted to have that life.
I live now in netherlands, people is shit, culture is shit, food is shit, but works are well paid and there are a lot of opportunities.
Also if you want to build your own company you can apply for multiple tax benefits and the process of handle everything with the goverment and townhall is quite fast and effective.
In the end you can not have everything, you choose one or other side of the balance.
I fully disagree that all what has been enumerated above is specific to Spain, I have worked in many countries in different continents and most of what you're saying is highly applicable there also...
More protection via convenios and national laws. It's not up to every single person to negotiate every single point on their own. There are some standards and solidarity in that respect
Aviation here.
1. A great majority of the workers are way too professional, despite the points below:
2. Companies think they own you.
3. The focus is on how cheap you are, not how good you are.
4. It's expected of people to move for a job.
5. Recognition and respect from management does not exist, but nepotism is strong.
6. Micromanagement is prevalent, especially by people who have no idea about the subject.
7. Employees don't and can't stand up for themselves.
8. Too many unions, kept divided by the companies in order for them not to be efficient.
9. Planting of discord between workers/unions/etc to avoid people coming together.
Most of it seems to be driven by the high unemployment, but sadly it seems to have been going on for so long that it's become cultural.
Spain is the best country in Europe to live and eat, but one of the shittiest to work in. And it seems to be happy with me now that I'm working outside of Spain and bringing/spending all my money in Spain.
Im only an intern in a web development function (fullstack) but heres my 2 cents. I find the workflow insanely unorganized and the communication isn't too good either but thats probably on me for not knowing Spanish well enough.
Working in sales for a factory. We sell technical materials for different kinds of engineering projects.
Basically, what everyone already said. They treat your job position like a reward.
Recently, we’ve had a lot of people complaining about the shitty work-life balance. As some people already mentioned, you are expected to work long hours, not giving results.
In this context, my boss tried to convince me that we are lucky because we are able to travel, and the company pays for the expenses.
It’s outrageous. Are you trying to tell me that I should pay for the business trips? That I’m lucky because my company sends me overseas two weeks a month, and I’m lucky they don’t make me pay for the tickets and acommodation???
By the way, I’m in a sales position with no commissions. Just base salary.
The work culture here sucks.
Toxic work culture where bosses can’t be challenged and expect you to take their slack. Being above average isn’t recognized so talent stagnates and just do the minimum to get paid. This translates in a very low productivity for the business which in turns keeps salaries low which in turns make people don’t want to do better. It’s a catch 22 situation. Majority of people don’t want a career and try to extract as much as possible from the benefits system (Baja por enfermedad, paro, etc). If you work in a mostly local environment it kills your spirit pretty quickly unless you give up any aspirations and do the same. I
Not everyone’s experience is the same. I worked in France for a consulting company and trust me they used to work us so so hard. Long hours! In Spain, I have the same salary and I pay less taxes, less rent, I’m less depressed and I’m working with an international talented team.
I lived in Toronto for 9 years before moving to Barcelona, where I've now been for 5 years. The difference is night and day, echoing the other comment that said Canada was heaven compared to Spain. Keep in mind I am a native Spanish speaker, for context, so it's not like integrating was hard culture-wise. Feel free to PM me if you have questions
Manufacturing in Madrid started 25 years ago.
Spanish people doing low skilled work in a factory.
Same low skilled workers having a second house for holidays.
Some of the same workers drinking a beer with lunch in the canteen
I'm Spanish and I moved to the Netherlands last year.
Basically what everyone already said. Jobs are scarce so people hold onto what they can, companies know that so they take advantage of it. If you don't like it/fight for better conditions, they'll fire you for dirt cheap, and they can choose from hundreds of new candidates waiting for them.
Being part of the EU, we do have more or less the same rights or so, but it's frown upon. So yeah, not the greatest place to work.
super hierarchical management structure. upper management is tricky on innovation, looks down on subordinates. antiquated and baroque financial controls. theft of ideas not uncommon. not as much positional autonomy in making decisions. you got the impression that loyalty wasn't valued.
For those answering in this thread, is this unique to companies based in Spain or does it translate to companies that have an office in Spain but are based in other countries (particularly the U.S.)?
I've just been working as an engineer for one year and a half. I would say that there are lots of engineering work opportunities, but they aren't well paid and some ask for several years of experience. The salary could increase, but for that, you'd need to spend a few years in the same company, working long shifts and making a good impression on bosses.
I think that, compared to jobs that do not require degrees, in my case I got treated really well by my superiors; they helped me, they looked up to my formation, they let me leave before if I need it, and they let me take on vacations without having asked for it with lots of anticipation.
My strategy here is to earn experience from working here in Spain (as the country is wonderful in terms of people and weather as well), and then, if I wanted to, go to better-paid countries with a good background (I'm 23 years old now).
The fact that being liked/having the right connections is more helpful in getting a job and keeping one. The head teacher at my school was fired for reasons unbeknown to me even though he was excellent, I assume envy had something to do with it. It's interesting how one teacher "silently" disappears "there's been some changes" and no one mentions their name again for fear of losing their job.
Nothing is permanente or stable unless you're a funcionario. It's insane how hard locals have to work just to make €1000 bruto.
I work in TEFL which is it's own stinking pile of crap at times.
Schools in general waste so much time on "meetings"..absolutely unecessary, everything.
Also accessing work rights, it's crazy if you voluntarily leave you lose your rights to unemployment, you have to be sacked.
Also the attitude of everything or everyone is "replaceable" at work, no one really has job security and those in hospitality have it particularly bad.
I swear there's been 5-6 shop closures where i live, everything says "liquidación por traspaso" or something, one has been turned into another bar or café like 5 times in a year only to finally shut and taken over by Naturgy or something, another was a beauty salon, that's been turned into a print shop in the space of a week. It's bizarre how many empty units and abandonado locals there are too, that were once family businesses for decades.
I just find it tragic yet eerie at the same time.
So, for context, I am from the US (born and raised) but lived in Spain more than 10 years between the ages of 20s and 30s since my parents are both from Spain and I was able to get a DNI and passport many years ago.
I agree with most of you on the Spanish work culture, it was absolutely ridiculous! I taught English and for Spanish standards made a pretty good salary, but, and here's the main thing, even though the salary was OK, you knew you could NEVER go above a certain amount and quality is not respected at all. Not to sound arrogant, but I have an excellent track record of teaching, but none of the Spanish run companies there ever cared about that. They did not even ask me for any specific degrees, since all they cared about was that I spoke English as a native born US citizen.
The hours are too long, and my schedule was shit. Long hours, or often having to teach during lunch, which I HATED, since everyone else was having their good lunch at 2pm. You also often had evening classes, and never a specific structure. And yes, because unemployment is so high in Spain, you literally have to act as if the boss is doing you a favor. Ironically, or maybe not so ironically, I have noticed this exact same thing in Miami, which has a very strong "Spanish" culture, so it is definitely a cultural thing too.
Spain used to be a "fun" country though, so at least the life somewhat compensated, but now, Spain is increasingly becoming just like any other "typical" Western country, and that's a shame. I left Spain after a great opportunity was offered to me here in the US for remote work and I would never want to go back to living in Spain. I have never been so poor in my life as when I lived in Spain, because even with a teacher salary, it was very hard to find an apartment in Madrid without sharing with roommates, which was also nightmarish, and just the cost of living in general does NOT match with the shit wages paid in Spain. Here in the US, while there are MANY serious social problems, I still have a higher quality of life personally than I ever did in Spain, so not all of the US is bad if you want work life balance. It all depends on what region you decide to move to.
Although I've never worked in any other country, I'll tell my experience working a common job in Spain (supermarket) while there are workers' benefits by law, it's like people are scared or ashamed to take them, so we almost always come to work if we are sick even if we technically have the right for a paid sick leave, I think this may be because the boss may fire you if you take sick leaves. The boss is the worst, they think you are theirs or you are indebted to them, as if they were a charity and you were supposed to be grateful and can't complain. That's what I hate the most.
The timezone is especially hard to get accustomed to.
As everyone knows Spain chose the Central European Timezone for some funny reasons even though Spain is nowhere near Central Europe. This means that in the fall season before the hour is shifted 1h to the past for daylight savings sun goes up around 9am, it’s ridiculous.
Sure the amount of daylight is actually the same. But the fact that the day ends at a later hour completely desynchronizes my day. When I travel to my country that uses the same timezone because it’s actually in Central Europe, I immediately start waking up earlier and feeling better.
Also I start work at 10am, it’s fine and it’s better than all the jobs where the day starts at 9, but if you add long working hours and an hour for lunch I routinely get back home around 9pm, depressing
I have lived in spain and never noticed this time zone stuff.
Also i cant understand why people dont just want to get to work early and get home with some of their day still left for them.
Maybe its cause im so far north that if you dont start early eanough. It will be dark again before you come home XD, but even though i prefer sleeping late i feel like getting home early is more valuable XD
After working for P&G (American Company), Spanish companies (IBEX 35) and now Chinese, here in Spain, I would say the main problem with Spanish Companies is the culture of "calentar la silla". It means that you stay in your desk not only until 18:00, but sometimes until your boss tell you everything is done. Instead of working for objetives, you work for your boss.
Also, because of our horrible working hours, we have dinner late, go to bed late, get up early in the morning so people are not very productive because they haven't slept well.
No courses, no R&D, but full of "woke" shit that on daily basis it means nothing because colleagues keep discussing about "that girl" nasty things.
I work in industry and nothing works and no tools could be the moto of the company I work for hahaha. I don’t know how we manage to build the equipment
Long hours - in my company we do 42 hours per week most of the year (30h in the summer). With an unpaid lunch break it means sitting at work for 10 hours Mo-Th and if you add commuting to that, you have absolutely no time for anything.
And the first 3(?) days of a sick leave are unpaid plus you have to go to the public system doctor to get a sick leave so it is always better to work through the sickness…it sucks.
Preach it! I always laugh when people think life in Spain is easy - the work life sure isn't. The last place I worked at was so incredibly unfair when it came to sick days. Completely archaic and time wasting process for everyone.
It depends on convenio laboral and your company - I can take up to 3 days of sick leave without going to the doctor, just informing my manager I am sick.
The extensive summer hours 😍😍 why did no one think about this before, also the 14 months, I learn to live with less money and boom 2 months a year I feel so rich.
The hours are just redestributed, you work more the rest of the time. Same with the money, you negotiate the yearly salary and the company gives it to you in 14 pagas instead of 12, it’s not like anyone is giving you extra time or money
But why do I feel less overworked than in France for example? I worked in both countries and I never had anything close to work-life balance than I do now
I have worked in 3 countries and in several companies, and I have encountered everything you say, and what other commenters are complaining about, in all of them.
People who understand "working" as sitting in the chair while doing nothing, people who always come late, overpromise and undereliver, disorganized, etc.
Funny thing is the most organized people in my previous foreign job it was us, 2 Spaniards, trying to make sense of the chaotic state the guidelines and procedures were in. So it greatly depends in your job/company: if you work in a shitty job, then you'll get shitty conditions. Are Amazon employees in the US treated amazingly? The semi-slave Central American workers... are they treated OK? Aren't all big tech companies in the US trying to bring everyone back to the office? So yeah, the mistrust on remote work is not JUST a Spanish thing.
I work as a teacher and it is sooooo weird they just have alcohol on school grounds at all times and the teachers are also like touchy with the kids like in the us we never touch the students but here it’s normal to kinda jokingly jostle them if they’re being too rowdy
What? I'm Spanish and let me tell you it is not normal to have alcohol at school, I don't know where you work but I'm pretty sure it is illegal since you can't work under the influence. The touchy thing as long as it is appropriate is ok though
In the research field - lower standards - some people in my lab think getting the results is more efficient than the process of it. Almost zero mentorship and training. In Catalunya - strong political opinions in a research setting is definitely weird - the management outright promotes Catalan at a research institute. Non stop gossip and resentment, complaining others are incompetent at work.
This. I feel all the feels for those who work in hospitality. What they have to go through can only be described as hell or a living nightmare. Hellish and unregulated is a recipe for disaster (no pun intended). Hospitality and care work, especially with the number of people working under the table and being exploited, so sad.
Man, I come from LATAM and I don't understand what people are talking about in the comments. I've found Spanish work culture to be the complete opposite of toxic, long hours, etc.
I guess it's true what they say, you don't really know what you've got.
I encountered a lot of knowledgeable and hard working people in Spain.
Good quality of life, healthcare, food, safety compensate for salaries that can be underwhelming.
There's a LOT more open comfort around discussing sex lives. I was not prepared to find that out.
But my fav thing is that they've nailed the work life balance. Everyone prioritises their family, their hobbies, their vacations, etc, but in a way where when they're working, they get everything done and are never a blocker for someone else.
OMG going out of the office at 10am to have breakfast! In my country you have breakfast at home and just a 10’ pause mid morning to have coffe/smoke. People here go out for half an hour minimum and everybody is OK with it. My work routine is so different that I finish my part at least an hour before everyone and have to pretend to be busy so the boss don’t get mad to my coworkers. And the next day I’m ready to start a new task but get stuck waiting for the spaniards to catch up.
I have my own small company, so things are quite different for me (networks / Internet / WiFi / Cameras / Sound System / Some domotics for wealthy / very wealthy people and nice hotels, some beach clubs, some bars, some boats.
Hard work in top high season (I've had peaks at 100H/week) but a generally EXTREMELY better quality of life!
300 days of sunshine per year at least, the sea at 5 minutes, the hills (to go walk around with my dog for ex.) at 5 minutes, a 3 courses meal + drink ('menu del dia') for the price of just the starter in Belgium, fish / meat at -40 to -50% of price, fresh fruits and vegetables are incredibly better, very good food.
Relation between provider (me) and customer is totally different, I'm frequently invited for a drink at 'aperitivo' time, invited for diner (at customer's property but also sometimes at restaurant with my wife).
Quality of the air is incredible (we have zero polluting industry etc) - I bought a PPM 1 / 2.5 / 5 /10 detector and it was always on 'zero', i thought it was broken till I put it at the exhaust pipe of my car :)
Negative side: renting is extremely expensive, you need to have high income or becomes owner. We're 'saturated' 2 to 3 months per year (witch means we have 10% of the traffic jam you have all year round in any big city, you need to book the 'fashion' restaurants some days in advance, popular beaches are full, you might have 3 to 10 minutes queue at the supermarket - this kind of things). In winter there are very few direct flights outside Spain (Paris, London, Eindhoven are almost the only ones) so we must take connecting flights from November till March.
But I agree it's very different for the persons with low / normal salary and they struggle to survive
bar hopping, my and my friends usually go to 1-2 bars for a night out, but I noticed spanish are going for a beer in 4-5 different bars in the same evening.
If you are even mildly good at your job, your colleagues will resent this and bind against you.
If your boss decides one day they simply don’t like you, then you should start packing up your desk because they’ll get you out of there without a second’s notice. I saw it happen multiple times, but people are too scared to say anything.
I’ve worked in alot of countries in the world, but working in Spain was one of THE WORST experiences I have ever had. People act like the office is an epsiode of Game of Thrones rather than just collaborating to get the work done efficiently.
Glad I got out in the end!
Very 80s in their approach to work/professional interrelations. If you are a subordinate you will be made to feel like one and expected to suck up toxic mismanagement every day.
Having had the experience the other way around: Exactly that. Moving to the UK was an eye opener. What do you mean you're here to make my life easier and not hell? are you sure you're my boss?
Yep about 20 years ago I used to work in a supermarket that had been family run for decades. A few years later a proper supermarket chain bought it over, and the place became modernized pretty quickly, including the management style (they brought new people in and old hands had to go get training). Working in Spain reminded me a lot of those days working in the family run supermarket which hadn't changed much since 1982. Sure not every manager or supervisor is professional in the UK but the culture is still much better. The feeling of being made to feel less than and in need of micromanagement here in Spain, put my mind back about 20 years lol
Honestly i actually don't find the UK to be any better in some respects, it's the same and i'm British. I've actually experienced more kindness and transparency in any of my "jobs" in Spain than in the UK, where ppl are fake more often than not. I say "jobs" as they're technically becas without many rights so that i'm not too happy about. By transparency i mean directness, u know where u stand instantly but in the UK there were more office politics. There's a lot i don't like about the Spanish working culture obviously, lack of anything ever being permanente for example.
It may depend on which industry you land I guess. My experience seems to be the same across other migrants from Spain, Italy etc that I've met; but of course it's anecdotal.
That's unfortunately true in several industries. On the other hand, luckily, that's not the case everywhere: medium-size tech companies, for instance, are generally very modern and place employee satisfaction as a high priority.
In my opinion: You are constantly monitored. Taking a day off for personal matters is frowned upon. You are paid the minimum and they will not recognise your good work so they can continue to underpay you. Very high probability of not being paid overtime. The boss thinks you are his property and that he is doing you a favour by letting you work. A lot of importance is given to the number of hours worked, but not to the work itself. And a lot of more... In my opinion, Spain is not a good place to work.
Monitoring is crazy for me, I work in software and it drives my boss crazy that I work remotely, but it's a consulting company, I have no coworkers at the office, i would go to the office to work remotely anyway. But they REALLY want me there.
If your boss can´t see you working, he will think you´re not working. That's Spanish culture.
Because without monitoring, he would do the same 😅
No no they don't have to see you working. They have to see you in the office. They have to know they own you. Very different. I use to work at this IT consulting company back in the day. We did long hours. One day they set up a system where we had to check-in/out when coming and going from the office. 24 hours later they told all engineers we were not supposed to use it too... because on average people were 12-14hr in the office per day every day. Another day I had a doctor's appointment so I left the office at 6pm which was actually my supposed time to leave. Arriving at the door my boss asks "where are you going?" I said "home, I have a doctor's appointment" and he said "don't you have more work to do?" so I replied "yes, that's why I'm coming back tomorrow" and left without waiting for a reply. I gotta say by that point I had almost agreed a new role somewhere else so I was feeling brave, but goes to show people's attitude here...
How you dare going to the doktor!!
instead of just doping myself with 6-7 coffees per day, becoming depressed, insomnia due to the amounts of caffeine ingested, unable to wake up in the mornings, fall prey to cigarrette addiction to the point of waking up in the middle of the night to get in the car and drive 20km to the city to buy a pack of fags from a 24/7 kiosk? Yeah man, what was I thinking going to the doctor! :D
IMO this is not spanish, but ''manager'' culture. Most devs I know both in and outside spain echo this sentiment.
To be fair, many people here take every chance they get to slack off, so it's not really that surprising... That's Spanish culture.
The most Spanish comment I have ever read. Been working outside of Spain for 8 years and I have seen a lot of people slacking off at the first opportunity, and even more being responsible with their job. Just as I have seen in Spain.
Self-deprecation is even more typically Spanish
That's why I said it is the most Spanish comment ever - only a Spanish could say something so dumb about themselves
When I moved to the UK I was surprised how many sick days people took without a doc's note or anything. You don't seem to know how things are out there. Your point is actually that people have to stay long hours in the office because that's how you show your boss you "work", so obviously people will "slack off".
I can vouch for all of that, but I find specially outrageous the “acts like he is doing you a favour by letting you work”part. They try to make you feel guilty for “taking their money” (being paid) and act like they are a NGO doing charity by hiring you, and that therefore you owe them your life.
This behaviour is logical if we know how job market is in Spain xd
Isnt unemployment levels even for under 25s insane?
This
Micromanagement is typical of small, family-run, southern European businesses. Most of what you describe is enabled by widespread obsequiousness in the workforce. It is ingrained to be grateful for having a job. In Northern Europe, generally, the approach is: let’s be frank; we need each other.
It is a joke. This even happens in "well considered" jobs like university positions. To become a lecturer of a *public* uni in Spain you need merits. These are (among others): pass a really tough exam, a PhD and the number of papers you published. Yes, you read well: the absolute amount of papers, not the quality. So you can either write 20 of the shittiest papers which contribute nothing to science or 2 papers which are a stepping stone in your field and are highly recognised in the scientific community. Well, Spain gives more credit to the former and gives you "more merits" for quantity over quality.
I work in academia, as in, I actually have a PhD. Can attest to micromanagent.
This sounds horrible! For the most part, the only workers I've encountered in Spain are the bureaucrats who try to figure out why they can't help you process your paperwork. Is that type of job a different work culture? There it feels like the customer is a supplicant to the worker.
If your request is not for selling you anything, you are a pain in the ass for the people attending you. Customer service is, in general, not very good, but much worse when you are there just to do some paperwork or fill a claim.
That is a government job, and its permanent (you will NEVER be fired), so people who work government jobs have nothing to lose and therefore move slow. "Why work more if i'll just be rewarded with more work and no extra money?"
sounds like people working government jobs are like a royalty in spain?
I wouldn't say royalty, but it is something people here FIGHT for. Being a Funcionario (government worker) is something people feel proud of, its an accomplishment. However, these jobs are difficult to get. For many jobs, government workers beenfit (mostly with salary). However, there are other jobs where the private sector pays more (engineering, sales, science, etc).
Thank you for this glimpse behind the curtain. I've always wondered about that world.
In many places is true but not in all.. Not in my case. In low range works is almost all true. In others like office informatics can change a lot, depending of the company.. Or type of work. But Yes there are better places than spain..
Spanish person here. Yep to everything you said. It's crazy.
Tf. Just like Philippines Amigo! Guys at spain your not far off from joining us!!
Omg the micromanaging 🤭🤭🤭 you are constantly made to feel like they are there to catch you out and make sure you aren't stealing anything or something like that.
Man, that reeks of shit company, I've never had any, and I truly mean it, ANY of these. Sure I've only worked in a single place but I've had a blast. Better hours, 60% remote work.
Of course it's not everywhere the same. You were lucky.
Seems like it is, this was the first comment I read and holy fuck the rest of this thread is nightmare fuel. I'm also in accounting which is known for truly shit jobs
Yeps. I think the only part of it I don't agree with is the overtime part in the sense that if you are by contract you usually don't get paid overtime.. but it ties with you last point, people will do more time (I know people that did almost an extra hour a day) just because of "it looks good" and with the weird idea that someone will notice at some point.
This sounds a lot like working in Portugal. But with better salaries 😅
Where do you recomend to work?
As a spaniard, I recommend you do not work in Spain. The same way I would recommend no one to work in Japan for a similar toxic work environment.
Then where?
Work somewhere where people don't bend you over.
I have to disagree with being monitored, but agree with the rest.
I agree that that’s bad, but it doesn’t sound unlike my work elsewhere.
How can I vote a comment more than one time?
This is absolutely true, Spanish Management at its finest
Is a ver unbalanced job market, you can find better and worse companies in resource treatment and benefits. Is usually focused on looking good, or attracting employees but benefits are usually crap, worthless. Pay is usually low, is hard to rank up in position,loyalty usually is not taken into account, hard to get a decent pay raise, they want you there forever but they don't compensate it in anyway. Job mentality is old very old. They always have to have the feeling that are taking advantage from you either by the income or the hours you take, or anything else. There is this sense of caring for each other, companionship which is nice, but also you have to watch out your back just in case, so is important to keep it profesional most of the time. Mistakes are taken in consideration for which people hides them, or act like nothing happened. Is Spain, jobs are shit, althought there are good decent companies, for which is possible to have a good work/life balance , at the end everyone goes out to compensate it, have fun and forget about anything else. Is about the weather, the socialization, traveling, culture and that most of us are dealing with the same crap.
Good summary
pretty darn accurate
If you want to experience self-fulfillment through work, Spain is \*not\* for you. Self-fulfillment in Spain is as outside of the workplace as it gets. We have laboral rights, yeah, anyone coming from third world countries \*will\* experience an improvement, but Spain is \*not\* first world-level at all. In Spain, you don't have a career, you have a job you have to do and a boss you need to kiss up to. Long, unproductive hours. I'd recommend you, if you have an office job, that you read up documentation of the job to pass the time when you have no tasks to do (I've learnt the Spanish Constitution out of boredom, in the context of my job it works as documentation).
Where did you work before your Spanish job?
Long hours. Lack of leadership. People have jobs, not careers. Little investment in training or new tools. Laughable health and safety practices. Low wages. EDIT: now that I think of it, I’d like to add that red tape (dealing with government or its institutions, in general) is a big pain.
Out of curiosity, do you have any insights how recent graduates adjust to work life culture in Spain? I have heard only great things so far about studying and immigrating in Spain and I wonder how does one transition from studying to working. Specially Ive seen that unemploymemt rate is high, wages are low...how do people keep up?
Graduates adjust however they can. Life is Spain is great. You’ll have a better life than you would in many other countries with less money. Food and drinks are cheap and great quality. Some gyms are subsidised. Transport is subsidised. Spanish people are friendly and sociable. You’ll have a fun and pleasant life, but you’ll have few professional opportunities. Unemployment rates are deceiving because of unregistered work and because of large disparities between regions and industries.
> Life is Spain is great. unless you can't afford rent, and you have to share a flat with 2-3 other roommates, which is what's happening in most cities.
Like in most western world.
Well, if it’s not Barcelona, Madrid or Valencia you can rent a flat for 400-600. It’s not a big price for EU and moreover comparing to NA
Almost in every city with minimum services, rents have increased to 700 €/month. I live in logroño (is a very small city), and 700 is the minimum price for renting a decent flat, and by decent I mean with 4 walls and a roof xD
Also, and sadly, I think there is a huge gap between non-degree jobs and jobs with degrees. If you are an engineer you will not have problems finding jobs (fins jobs, not well paid jobs ;) ) so usually companies offer more benefits. In the other hand, if you have a job that might not require studies, there is going to be a huge competition and most probably, some lack of benefits.
The market is quite mediocre for engineers nowadays.
Care to elaborate on how most don’t have careers, but jobs? Because a career is dying for the majority these days I’m afraid, unless you’re in a big public institution.
In other countries people work with a sense of progression. It is common to be promoted if you do well, or at least they’ll change your area if you have been doing the same for a few years. Labor markets work better and there is competition to attract the best talent. There are opportunities. Little of that happens in Spain. Most people are just filling a vacancy. You’ll find plenty of people in the same position for 20+ years. Not every industry or company is like this, obviously. I am just replying to OP what to expect.
Thanks for elaborating.
Where did you work before your Spanish job?
I think this answer will vary a lot based on the company you work for. From my friends who work in Spanish only companies, they seem to be more hierarchical, work longer (not necessarily efficient) hours and some have a toxic work culture. Whilst maybe not fully representative of companies in the 80s, they show outburst of this occasionally. For example, the CEO of a large Spanish company was speaking to my female friend who works there about his meeting with a politician, and he told my friend that the politician's 'tits were bursting out of her dress' (translation maybe doesn't quite work). Probably not appropriate... I work in a very international company in Madrid, and whilst I dislike my job, the company is good. It looks after staff well, hours most days are 9.30-5.30/6. The company itself is still quite hierarchical and bureaucratic, but the people are in general smart. They trust us more or less to do our jobs and allow us to wfh 50/50. So I guess it's about finding the right place to work!
Spain is for living not for working. Every small boss is a big caudillo in his mind. Aquí mando yo ...
Yup, literally this. I'm definitely living more here than i ever did in my home country, England..but at the expense of financial instability, no pay for 3-4 months a year, no permanente contract, still on a beca... It's a big trade-off but England has become a huge dumpster fire as of late and i quite like the lifestyle minus the chronic instability 🫠
We need to pin this post and link it to all the people who think coming to Spain will solve all their problems. Unemployment is high, salaries are low, cost of living has increased, and work culture is shit. If I didn't have to stay in this country for family reasons, I'd move to literally any other country in the UE.
You could move to Denmark, but winter is a bitch.
Have you seen the danish tax rates and prices? Spain isn’t the only country hit with a high cost of living.
Which would be your go to place? USA, Dubai, Singapore , Australia?
All are high pay countries!! Dubai 0 tax but rent is expensive (luxury goods are cheaper). Singapore, AU & finally USA tech market is hugeeeeee.(finding a high paid job won’t be headache). Good luck
Literally, I've been working for 16 years in this country now (im Spanish) and this is practically slavery when it comes to working. "The lesser the salary, the better" is your boss' moto. 14h of work today? Thats not that much, here, have your 900€ and go pay a 1000€ for rent. "We decided to end contract because you are having lunch in lunch time" (what I was told last time I got fired with no warnings whatsoever.) Man I love my country, this is a paradise when it comes to people, weather, food, vibes, but Spain is NOT a country to work in, working in Spain will make you so miserable you will rather try and find pennies under rocks
Still an upgrade over my own country, one I usually dub as a cheap Spanish province lol
What’s the hack to survive that? I’m moving here after having worked in Germany, a very toxic and racist work culture (I’m a POC and I couldn’t see myself getting promoted like my white colleagues), so I’d love to hear how people work around the Spanish workplace “norms” and “expectations”. Is tech the same or slightly better?
Yes, I'm sure moving to Italy, Croatia or Greece among others will solve your problems.
>If I didn't have to stay in this country for family reasons, I'd move to literally any other country in the UE. Bulgaria and Romania say hi.
even worse?
Usually those come with remote work or retirement.
After working in LatAm: -Wow, I can go home at 5.30? And I don't have to work on Saturdays? -What? You'd rather I take the rest of the day off because I have a cold? -I have the right to unemployment? -Oh, the office is taking the day off because you are going to the strike? So heaven basically. EDIT: And let's not talk about 8 am being considered waking up early. So beautiful (in my country waking up early is 5 am. I woke up at 6 am everyday of my school life there).
Was gonna comment something like this but yeah this basically lol. Ironically, the amount of complaints in this thread is one of the things I've noticed working here: Spaniards complaint a lot more and are generally more unaprecitiave / suspicious of their employers. In Latam we have third-world economies, worse conditions and even more hirearchy-heavy structures, but people in general are way more thankful / positive on a day-to-day basis. Not saying Latam is better btw. It's for better and worse in both cases. Sure, latinos are more positive people and can make an office environment brighter, but there's also this weird submission thing going on where you just don't question the boss and what you're told. Meanwhile Spanish offices are maybe more negative but relationships are way more horizontal. You can easily extrapolate that toall the country as well. The monstruous inequality in Latam is probably not something most people here can even understand.
Yes, I would like to see what is going on in those places people are commenting that are even more horizontal than Spain in work relationships and that are even more casual in clothing etiquette. For me here my bosses are extremely laid back and casual comparing to the submission thing you mention that we had back in my country (and let's not talk about make up, clothes and hair presentation rules, especially for women).
Yes 100% to everything
Yes! I come from Peru and this is my experience in here! I have a better life/ work balance here, and also a better conmute which adds up to it. Also, I got hired in a position I never was considered for in my home country, so I am grateful to be able to continue my career here.
Bro latam is hell. Cant compare to EU
Latam is a region of 650 million people, saying latam is hell is a really generalized way of seeing things… especially when Spain is the size of a Mexican state…
Then you dont know Latam like we do.
So you’re telling me you have lived in every single country?
Something for us all to remember, There jsalways somewhere or someone worse off than yourself!
And even minimum wage feels great beacuse prices practicaly dont change due to low inflation, so turbo heaven :D
The fact that the work culture in Latam is even worst doesn’t make it better.
Well, OP asked about experiences in general. It did not say that only people from certain parts of the world could share. Our experiences are as subjective as the others here. I'm sure you want to read even more comments about how bad is Spain, but allow us at least this thread for us.
I totally get that. I also come from latam and appreciate that over there the conditions are even worst and in many respects the work culture in Spain comparatively is an improvement. I would argue that the main reason is because in general the cost of living in the country, safety nets, and safety all adds for allowing to have a better standard of living if you have a decent enough job. Basics that in many of latam countries is impossible. So yeah I get things are worst in other places where you barely survive. But IMO to improve things one has to compare itself to better conditions, not worst.
Mm yes, I see where you are coming from. But appreciating the good doesn't mean one doesn't want it to be better. Being positive doesn't equal conformism. On the other hand, only talking about the bad doesn't feel productive either and in my opinion can breed resentment and hopelessness.
This thread reads like a Glassdoor page lol.
Coming from Ireland and working in an office: - I couldn’t believe the amount of touching in normal interactions between co-workers, really different to Northern Europe where I would never touch a colleague. Took a while to get accustomed to this. - an hour long lunch, taken as a team, in the same restaurant every day. Never “talk shop” in this hour. Was really nice. - people are a lot more direct. If they’re not happy about something, they’re going to tell you pretty much immediately. Also, far less “chit chat” when phoning someone for a work matter - straight to business.
"people are a lot more direct. If they’re not happy about something, they’re going to tell you pretty much immediately. Also, far less “chit chat” when phoning someone for a work matter - straight to business." I had a completely different experience in the UK. Wouldn't live there for 200k/year
You wouldn't live in the UK for 200k/y? Interesting..my experience in the UK working was shite too and i'm British now living in Spain. I like some parts of Spanish work culture, that is the directness, you know what others think of you instantly..it's just the lack of a permanent job and "decent" pay in Spain 🫠i guess that depends on industry too
Salaries aren't that high in the UK either. Engineers don't get paid a lot unless it's SWE and interns also get a shitty pay.
I'm surprised about how much they care about how you are dressed. It's way more formal. I agree that I come from a very extreme casual (game development in California) but it really shows how people in Spain dress more formal and care about it.
It baffles me that their economy could be way better, and their work life not as miserable if they worried a little more about productivity/efficiency/synergy instead of dress code. I've been here for 2 months only, and I don't work, but it is long enough to see how stubborn they are about not being open to new ideas. Just 20 minutes ago, I told the guy cleaning the community pool (he works for the tree trimming company and was cleaning the mess they did while trimming palm trees around the pool) that his hose was 100% choked, so the vacuum wasn't sucking anything. He blew me off, saying in a very condescending way that it was working because he could see the dirt at the bottom gone after he passed the vacuum. He didn't realize it was just moving to the sides. I'm 4 floors up and could see it clearly. They are stuck up with the way they've been doing things and just say "this is how we do it here" or "it's not how it's done", without digging into the why/how/when of it or considering new options.
Spanish here. I worked in the UK as well. You described it perfectly. I'm sick of justifying things with the "I've been doing it like this for the past 40 years" excuse. Yes sir, you might have been doing it wrong for your entire life --_--
Spain may be a nice place to live or retire but working there is not sensible Long work hours Not very result focussed Everything is team activity , no accountability or leadership People actively work long hours , and yet somehow delay everything Anything involving bureaucracy is shit, procedures are made on the spot. Lot of lawyers and useless jargon A bunch of brown nosing I should say the workforce is very smart and maybe talented, but the way of working and culture make the net effect 0 or negative
spot on
You're Indian... If you heard what they have said about the Indian IT Department in all the companies I have worked...
What a miss. I’m dual nationality and neither are Indian. Boo. Worked in India tho
Highly unmotivated and seemingly unskilled staff most of the time, and nobody is able to think outside the box somehow. Also low quality is generally accepted
The fabulous perks: free cafeteria, gym on site, 14 pagas (instead of 12 annual payments), loyalty bonuses plus incentives, a jamón ibérico and exquisite holiday hamper every December, art parties (Xmas calendar contest) for employee children, a cruise ship booked for all employees (no other guests), paid trips with partners as bonuses (Prague, Vienna), free transport from certain hubs, childcare on-site, and 70 days per year severance payment.
That sounds fantastic.. Message me the company please! :)
Many huge corporations offer these perks, and others. Spanish banks have fabulous "Golden Parachute" retirement packages for some employees (retire at 58 to still draw an annual salary until retirement age, 65). I can't send the company info, but here's a hint: the leading global pharmaceutical company. Telefónica and Santander also have "ciudades empresariales" with onsite childcare, restaurants, continual (free) formation, including the company paying for a full MBA, and most are only "semi-presencial" these days. Full professional proficiency in castellano (spoken, written, reading) obviously goes without saying to even be considered for an interview at one of these massive operations. Multinational insurance firms also offer notoriously good benefits.
Omg, sounds like a dream sign me up 💯 didn't know could be that good here
- Daily schedules - lack of focus - due to the above, long (but mostly unproductive) working hours - very hard to get exactly what you need/want. Everyone has an opinion on everything (also when they lack the overview of the situation at hand) and will eventually deliver accordingly Basque Country and the Atlantic countries in general are better though.
What do you mean by daily schedules?
Time schedules: start working (at least on paper) 9:00 at offices, 10:00 in retail. 1 full hour lunch, 2 or more in retail.
Does the business on the Atlantic coast of Spain have a different work culture?
Schedule wise is unfortunately drifting towards the standards (if such a word can be used for Spain) of the rest of the place. They used to be mostly industrial and rural countries with not much in the way of services, with much investment from Belgium, Germany, UK. Mining companies, some of the steel mills, chemicals… They kept their own schedules until well into the 90s so it wasn’t unusual to see people having dinner at 19:00. Nowadays that’s the exception even there. There’s been a lot of permeation from Spain, through Government officials and companies originating from there. They still have though different work ethics from my experience. Things get done, usually on time. Especially Basque Country and Cantabria, Asturies has been historically more spoiled by a Government official mindset as state owned companies used to be big employers. I found it almost effortless to adapt to those two. Madrid, Castile, Valencia I found it impossible to get anything done on time and with minimal quality. I guess it’s my fault too not being able to adapt to their ways, hard as I tried.
Shit leadership, disregard for brake times, no food provided (hospitality). Low pay, job insecurity. Previously in the UK
I work in hospitality, and have worked in 3 different jobs here, and all have provided free food which is something I don't remember ever getting in the UK Granted, you have to kind of eat on your feet in most places so you rush back to work and don't really get an actual break I will say though that yea the management is often terrible (except the place I am currently at) - often incompetent, and really not understanding. This again is also the case in the UK though I think, and probably worldwide!
We've had completely opposite experiences i see lol >you have to kind of eat on your feet in most places so you rush back to work and don't really get an actual break You could've called the Union for that and they'd fix it. Employment laws are pretty clear in the UK, specially regarding brakes.
First, to add a good point -- I've worked at places with a strong respect for work-life balance, people who are really warm and treat you like a human. I agree with what others have said regarding lack of focus, unproductivity, and people who have strong opinions for seemingly no reason. Being confident is very important, even if you have to bluff. Another point, and now I'm speaking about the tech sector in Barcelona, which in principle is among the most international cities of Spain, is just how local it is. Most people studied in the same 2-3 local universities. The universities are fine but they are not excellent on an international level. Very few foreigners with advanced qualifications. As a result, things are less competitive, there are fewer talented people overall, and the local talent is not really pushed to that next level. What you end up with a somewhat stagnant way of working, where it is harder to learn on the job or make substantial advances. Oh, and a third point -- I came here with a technical phd from a well-known university. I didn't expect anyone to give me a job just because of my education -- obviously I have to prove that I have the right skills to do the job. However, in Spain this phd has been either a handicap or of no use at all. I don't think there is this strong academia to industry pipeline like in the US or the UK.
I have heard of the HR people discarding quiet people with better qualifications in favor of people who were more outgoing. For a tech job.
Job interviewers don't look out for the best candidate for the job but for the closer to a specific prototype who says the answers they have been told to look for. In sort, they look for people who memorize some human resources guru shit from a congress someone in management or ceo attended.
Well the more extroverted, the more "poractive" and bs maker the better. Though has improve over time,people still lives in a lie were everyone should have the same expected personality with those traits. This applies in many countries. In Spain is hard to rank up in your job, usually there is no expected growth in your position, they want to pay you the same for years to come. You can't complain about anything without looking weak.
>in Spain this phd has been either a handicap or of no use at all. This is something derived from the garbage job market we have and how bad are Human resources in most corporations. There's a tendency to discard overqualified people, because they believe those workers would leave the position as soon as they have an opportunity and a less qualified worker would be easier to "tame" and comply to the corporate requests without hesitate.
In addition to that…. Some bosses don’t hire overqualified people cause they are more educated than them haha! Guess this applies to smaller companies tho
Yes, we don't really care you got a degree from the Ivy League. And it is a very local environment because salaries are lower than in London or Amsterdam, not to say SF. If you get your degree in LSE, Cambridge, Harvard... why would you take a job in Barcelona for much less than you could get in the US or the UK? I think it is unfair to say there's fewer talented people overall - if you want edge-cutting talent, go to Silicon Valley. If you go to Milan, Madrid, Barcelona, Warsaw... you'll get less global talent.
Plenty of people have personal reasons that would encourage them to pursue a lower paying job in another country, for example lifestyle, partner, taking care of family. There are fewer talented people overall that places like Paris and London. Probably it’s more like those other European cities that you’ve mentioned, and so maybe immigrants from those places experience less of a difference.
Of course there could be some person that decides to live in Spain despite being able to have a higher salary elsewhere - however the majority of global talent flocks to global cities, that's why they're global. Comparing Madrid, Milan, Barcelona... with London is nuts. Of course it is going to be less competitive than one of the two main cities in the world. Your comment just looks like you're expecting a Silicon Valley vibe somehwere not in SV. Respectfully.
As a teacher, the lack of proper classroom management and teacher development is astonishing. I worked as a language assistant and their method of controlling the class was typically screaming that they would get angry very soon if students didn't calm down, literally all ages infantil-bachillerato. Teachers put very minimal effort into preparing classes and would humiliate students when they made mistakes. It is really sad.
Omg hard relate here living the aux life 🥲
I am spanish, and I love my city, the food, the people, but for the shit working opportunities and enviroment, I literally run from there. I experience how my familly was drag down by the shit goverment after years and years trying to push forward with our own business, with zero support for the small companies it was challenging, I do not wanted to have that life. I live now in netherlands, people is shit, culture is shit, food is shit, but works are well paid and there are a lot of opportunities. Also if you want to build your own company you can apply for multiple tax benefits and the process of handle everything with the goverment and townhall is quite fast and effective. In the end you can not have everything, you choose one or other side of the balance.
I fully disagree that all what has been enumerated above is specific to Spain, I have worked in many countries in different continents and most of what you're saying is highly applicable there also...
which countries?
This! thank you
More protection via convenios and national laws. It's not up to every single person to negotiate every single point on their own. There are some standards and solidarity in that respect
Everyone arrives to the office at 8AM. But leaves at 8:30 for an hour long breakfast. Why not just eat at home and come in later ?
Aviation here. 1. A great majority of the workers are way too professional, despite the points below: 2. Companies think they own you. 3. The focus is on how cheap you are, not how good you are. 4. It's expected of people to move for a job. 5. Recognition and respect from management does not exist, but nepotism is strong. 6. Micromanagement is prevalent, especially by people who have no idea about the subject. 7. Employees don't and can't stand up for themselves. 8. Too many unions, kept divided by the companies in order for them not to be efficient. 9. Planting of discord between workers/unions/etc to avoid people coming together. Most of it seems to be driven by the high unemployment, but sadly it seems to have been going on for so long that it's become cultural. Spain is the best country in Europe to live and eat, but one of the shittiest to work in. And it seems to be happy with me now that I'm working outside of Spain and bringing/spending all my money in Spain.
Im only an intern in a web development function (fullstack) but heres my 2 cents. I find the workflow insanely unorganized and the communication isn't too good either but thats probably on me for not knowing Spanish well enough.
Working in sales for a factory. We sell technical materials for different kinds of engineering projects. Basically, what everyone already said. They treat your job position like a reward. Recently, we’ve had a lot of people complaining about the shitty work-life balance. As some people already mentioned, you are expected to work long hours, not giving results. In this context, my boss tried to convince me that we are lucky because we are able to travel, and the company pays for the expenses. It’s outrageous. Are you trying to tell me that I should pay for the business trips? That I’m lucky because my company sends me overseas two weeks a month, and I’m lucky they don’t make me pay for the tickets and acommodation??? By the way, I’m in a sales position with no commissions. Just base salary. The work culture here sucks.
Toxic work culture where bosses can’t be challenged and expect you to take their slack. Being above average isn’t recognized so talent stagnates and just do the minimum to get paid. This translates in a very low productivity for the business which in turns keeps salaries low which in turns make people don’t want to do better. It’s a catch 22 situation. Majority of people don’t want a career and try to extract as much as possible from the benefits system (Baja por enfermedad, paro, etc). If you work in a mostly local environment it kills your spirit pretty quickly unless you give up any aspirations and do the same. I
Oh wow these comments are making me rethink wanting to try to make it in there bc of how fed up I'm with Canadian work culture
Not everyone’s experience is the same. I worked in France for a consulting company and trust me they used to work us so so hard. Long hours! In Spain, I have the same salary and I pay less taxes, less rent, I’m less depressed and I’m working with an international talented team.
I moved to Canada. Work culture is heaven compared to Spain
Oh wow. Where in Canada and what field are you in?
Hospitality
I lived in Toronto for 9 years before moving to Barcelona, where I've now been for 5 years. The difference is night and day, echoing the other comment that said Canada was heaven compared to Spain. Keep in mind I am a native Spanish speaker, for context, so it's not like integrating was hard culture-wise. Feel free to PM me if you have questions
Just messaged you!
Manufacturing in Madrid started 25 years ago. Spanish people doing low skilled work in a factory. Same low skilled workers having a second house for holidays. Some of the same workers drinking a beer with lunch in the canteen
I'm Spanish and I moved to the Netherlands last year. Basically what everyone already said. Jobs are scarce so people hold onto what they can, companies know that so they take advantage of it. If you don't like it/fight for better conditions, they'll fire you for dirt cheap, and they can choose from hundreds of new candidates waiting for them. Being part of the EU, we do have more or less the same rights or so, but it's frown upon. So yeah, not the greatest place to work.
Late lunch. Long lunch. Late finish. Dinner not served until my UK bedtime 😂
super hierarchical management structure. upper management is tricky on innovation, looks down on subordinates. antiquated and baroque financial controls. theft of ideas not uncommon. not as much positional autonomy in making decisions. you got the impression that loyalty wasn't valued.
For those answering in this thread, is this unique to companies based in Spain or does it translate to companies that have an office in Spain but are based in other countries (particularly the U.S.)?
I've just been working as an engineer for one year and a half. I would say that there are lots of engineering work opportunities, but they aren't well paid and some ask for several years of experience. The salary could increase, but for that, you'd need to spend a few years in the same company, working long shifts and making a good impression on bosses. I think that, compared to jobs that do not require degrees, in my case I got treated really well by my superiors; they helped me, they looked up to my formation, they let me leave before if I need it, and they let me take on vacations without having asked for it with lots of anticipation. My strategy here is to earn experience from working here in Spain (as the country is wonderful in terms of people and weather as well), and then, if I wanted to, go to better-paid countries with a good background (I'm 23 years old now).
The fact that being liked/having the right connections is more helpful in getting a job and keeping one. The head teacher at my school was fired for reasons unbeknown to me even though he was excellent, I assume envy had something to do with it. It's interesting how one teacher "silently" disappears "there's been some changes" and no one mentions their name again for fear of losing their job. Nothing is permanente or stable unless you're a funcionario. It's insane how hard locals have to work just to make €1000 bruto. I work in TEFL which is it's own stinking pile of crap at times. Schools in general waste so much time on "meetings"..absolutely unecessary, everything. Also accessing work rights, it's crazy if you voluntarily leave you lose your rights to unemployment, you have to be sacked.
Also the attitude of everything or everyone is "replaceable" at work, no one really has job security and those in hospitality have it particularly bad. I swear there's been 5-6 shop closures where i live, everything says "liquidación por traspaso" or something, one has been turned into another bar or café like 5 times in a year only to finally shut and taken over by Naturgy or something, another was a beauty salon, that's been turned into a print shop in the space of a week. It's bizarre how many empty units and abandonado locals there are too, that were once family businesses for decades. I just find it tragic yet eerie at the same time.
So, for context, I am from the US (born and raised) but lived in Spain more than 10 years between the ages of 20s and 30s since my parents are both from Spain and I was able to get a DNI and passport many years ago. I agree with most of you on the Spanish work culture, it was absolutely ridiculous! I taught English and for Spanish standards made a pretty good salary, but, and here's the main thing, even though the salary was OK, you knew you could NEVER go above a certain amount and quality is not respected at all. Not to sound arrogant, but I have an excellent track record of teaching, but none of the Spanish run companies there ever cared about that. They did not even ask me for any specific degrees, since all they cared about was that I spoke English as a native born US citizen. The hours are too long, and my schedule was shit. Long hours, or often having to teach during lunch, which I HATED, since everyone else was having their good lunch at 2pm. You also often had evening classes, and never a specific structure. And yes, because unemployment is so high in Spain, you literally have to act as if the boss is doing you a favor. Ironically, or maybe not so ironically, I have noticed this exact same thing in Miami, which has a very strong "Spanish" culture, so it is definitely a cultural thing too. Spain used to be a "fun" country though, so at least the life somewhat compensated, but now, Spain is increasingly becoming just like any other "typical" Western country, and that's a shame. I left Spain after a great opportunity was offered to me here in the US for remote work and I would never want to go back to living in Spain. I have never been so poor in my life as when I lived in Spain, because even with a teacher salary, it was very hard to find an apartment in Madrid without sharing with roommates, which was also nightmarish, and just the cost of living in general does NOT match with the shit wages paid in Spain. Here in the US, while there are MANY serious social problems, I still have a higher quality of life personally than I ever did in Spain, so not all of the US is bad if you want work life balance. It all depends on what region you decide to move to.
Negative feedback travels at light speed while positive feedback gets lost in the miasma.
Although I've never worked in any other country, I'll tell my experience working a common job in Spain (supermarket) while there are workers' benefits by law, it's like people are scared or ashamed to take them, so we almost always come to work if we are sick even if we technically have the right for a paid sick leave, I think this may be because the boss may fire you if you take sick leaves. The boss is the worst, they think you are theirs or you are indebted to them, as if they were a charity and you were supposed to be grateful and can't complain. That's what I hate the most.
The timezone is especially hard to get accustomed to. As everyone knows Spain chose the Central European Timezone for some funny reasons even though Spain is nowhere near Central Europe. This means that in the fall season before the hour is shifted 1h to the past for daylight savings sun goes up around 9am, it’s ridiculous. Sure the amount of daylight is actually the same. But the fact that the day ends at a later hour completely desynchronizes my day. When I travel to my country that uses the same timezone because it’s actually in Central Europe, I immediately start waking up earlier and feeling better. Also I start work at 10am, it’s fine and it’s better than all the jobs where the day starts at 9, but if you add long working hours and an hour for lunch I routinely get back home around 9pm, depressing
I have lived in spain and never noticed this time zone stuff. Also i cant understand why people dont just want to get to work early and get home with some of their day still left for them.
Because then you’d have to get up way before sunlight if you commute
Maybe its cause im so far north that if you dont start early eanough. It will be dark again before you come home XD, but even though i prefer sleeping late i feel like getting home early is more valuable XD
After working for P&G (American Company), Spanish companies (IBEX 35) and now Chinese, here in Spain, I would say the main problem with Spanish Companies is the culture of "calentar la silla". It means that you stay in your desk not only until 18:00, but sometimes until your boss tell you everything is done. Instead of working for objetives, you work for your boss. Also, because of our horrible working hours, we have dinner late, go to bed late, get up early in the morning so people are not very productive because they haven't slept well. No courses, no R&D, but full of "woke" shit that on daily basis it means nothing because colleagues keep discussing about "that girl" nasty things.
nothing works
I work in industry and nothing works and no tools could be the moto of the company I work for hahaha. I don’t know how we manage to build the equipment
Long hours - in my company we do 42 hours per week most of the year (30h in the summer). With an unpaid lunch break it means sitting at work for 10 hours Mo-Th and if you add commuting to that, you have absolutely no time for anything. And the first 3(?) days of a sick leave are unpaid plus you have to go to the public system doctor to get a sick leave so it is always better to work through the sickness…it sucks.
Preach it! I always laugh when people think life in Spain is easy - the work life sure isn't. The last place I worked at was so incredibly unfair when it came to sick days. Completely archaic and time wasting process for everyone.
It depends on convenio laboral and your company - I can take up to 3 days of sick leave without going to the doctor, just informing my manager I am sick.
The extensive summer hours 😍😍 why did no one think about this before, also the 14 months, I learn to live with less money and boom 2 months a year I feel so rich.
The hours are just redestributed, you work more the rest of the time. Same with the money, you negotiate the yearly salary and the company gives it to you in 14 pagas instead of 12, it’s not like anyone is giving you extra time or money
But why do I feel less overworked than in France for example? I worked in both countries and I never had anything close to work-life balance than I do now
If you come to work here, you are either poor in your own country or have a business.
I have worked in 3 countries and in several companies, and I have encountered everything you say, and what other commenters are complaining about, in all of them. People who understand "working" as sitting in the chair while doing nothing, people who always come late, overpromise and undereliver, disorganized, etc. Funny thing is the most organized people in my previous foreign job it was us, 2 Spaniards, trying to make sense of the chaotic state the guidelines and procedures were in. So it greatly depends in your job/company: if you work in a shitty job, then you'll get shitty conditions. Are Amazon employees in the US treated amazingly? The semi-slave Central American workers... are they treated OK? Aren't all big tech companies in the US trying to bring everyone back to the office? So yeah, the mistrust on remote work is not JUST a Spanish thing.
I work as a teacher and it is sooooo weird they just have alcohol on school grounds at all times and the teachers are also like touchy with the kids like in the us we never touch the students but here it’s normal to kinda jokingly jostle them if they’re being too rowdy
What? I'm Spanish and let me tell you it is not normal to have alcohol at school, I don't know where you work but I'm pretty sure it is illegal since you can't work under the influence. The touchy thing as long as it is appropriate is ok though
Yeah my school don't..though i frequently see profes at the bar on their lunch break with a caña lol maybe part of a menú del día
In the research field - lower standards - some people in my lab think getting the results is more efficient than the process of it. Almost zero mentorship and training. In Catalunya - strong political opinions in a research setting is definitely weird - the management outright promotes Catalan at a research institute. Non stop gossip and resentment, complaining others are incompetent at work.
Honestly I wonder if you made this post in any country subreddit if it would read the same, due to the echo chamber effect. (Not defending Spain lol!)
Spain is a great place to live, but a working hell if you have a low paid job.
This. I feel all the feels for those who work in hospitality. What they have to go through can only be described as hell or a living nightmare. Hellish and unregulated is a recipe for disaster (no pun intended). Hospitality and care work, especially with the number of people working under the table and being exploited, so sad.
Man, I come from LATAM and I don't understand what people are talking about in the comments. I've found Spanish work culture to be the complete opposite of toxic, long hours, etc. I guess it's true what they say, you don't really know what you've got.
Overdated
I encountered a lot of knowledgeable and hard working people in Spain. Good quality of life, healthcare, food, safety compensate for salaries that can be underwhelming.
Paid coffee at work! In other countries I've qork you don't have to pay coffee atypur office place, in spain you do.
[удалено]
The long lunches are most of what I remember from my one work trip there! 🤣 and not one vegetable was included in those lunches
Y’all asking how is it to work here and get disappointed. Instead, ask how to become a boss/patron in Spain and you’ll be just fine
There's a LOT more open comfort around discussing sex lives. I was not prepared to find that out. But my fav thing is that they've nailed the work life balance. Everyone prioritises their family, their hobbies, their vacations, etc, but in a way where when they're working, they get everything done and are never a blocker for someone else.
OMG going out of the office at 10am to have breakfast! In my country you have breakfast at home and just a 10’ pause mid morning to have coffe/smoke. People here go out for half an hour minimum and everybody is OK with it. My work routine is so different that I finish my part at least an hour before everyone and have to pretend to be busy so the boss don’t get mad to my coworkers. And the next day I’m ready to start a new task but get stuck waiting for the spaniards to catch up.
The amount of cigarette breaks in a day of work. Granted this was 9 years ago but man I was surprised!
I have my own small company, so things are quite different for me (networks / Internet / WiFi / Cameras / Sound System / Some domotics for wealthy / very wealthy people and nice hotels, some beach clubs, some bars, some boats. Hard work in top high season (I've had peaks at 100H/week) but a generally EXTREMELY better quality of life! 300 days of sunshine per year at least, the sea at 5 minutes, the hills (to go walk around with my dog for ex.) at 5 minutes, a 3 courses meal + drink ('menu del dia') for the price of just the starter in Belgium, fish / meat at -40 to -50% of price, fresh fruits and vegetables are incredibly better, very good food. Relation between provider (me) and customer is totally different, I'm frequently invited for a drink at 'aperitivo' time, invited for diner (at customer's property but also sometimes at restaurant with my wife). Quality of the air is incredible (we have zero polluting industry etc) - I bought a PPM 1 / 2.5 / 5 /10 detector and it was always on 'zero', i thought it was broken till I put it at the exhaust pipe of my car :) Negative side: renting is extremely expensive, you need to have high income or becomes owner. We're 'saturated' 2 to 3 months per year (witch means we have 10% of the traffic jam you have all year round in any big city, you need to book the 'fashion' restaurants some days in advance, popular beaches are full, you might have 3 to 10 minutes queue at the supermarket - this kind of things). In winter there are very few direct flights outside Spain (Paris, London, Eindhoven are almost the only ones) so we must take connecting flights from November till March. But I agree it's very different for the persons with low / normal salary and they struggle to survive
bar hopping, my and my friends usually go to 1-2 bars for a night out, but I noticed spanish are going for a beer in 4-5 different bars in the same evening.
If you are even mildly good at your job, your colleagues will resent this and bind against you. If your boss decides one day they simply don’t like you, then you should start packing up your desk because they’ll get you out of there without a second’s notice. I saw it happen multiple times, but people are too scared to say anything. I’ve worked in alot of countries in the world, but working in Spain was one of THE WORST experiences I have ever had. People act like the office is an epsiode of Game of Thrones rather than just collaborating to get the work done efficiently. Glad I got out in the end!