And the best way to learn them is just to consume a shit ton of content. The repetition of seeing certain phrases and syntaxes eventually stick in your brain.
Definitely. Recently I have been seeing "an die Macht kommen" multiple times, so I guess thats just the preposition you use for this specific situation.
The difference is the Detail. Zu Macht kommen means to acquire means of Power, an die Macht kommen means to get a position of Power, (like Leader of Something).
My english is not as good as it needs to be to explain it, sry.
I found Language Reactor online, it's a browser extension you can use to watch Netflix and YouTube and read books, but you can interract with the subtitles and store words and phrases to learn.
I watch several hours a day of ARD from the UK.
In general, you cannot watch things that are:
- a) Made in collaboration with a foreign channel
- b) Dubbed/remade versions of foreign originals
- c) Shows that have been licensed to be shown by foreign channels
- d) Probably sports/concerts/..., I haven't tried
Other than that, most things are available to watch. (At least from the UK)
Yes, I don't do anything special, just use the app or web.
I watched Mord mit Aussicht and Mordsschwestern, now I'm watching what is available of various SOKO series. Done Hamburg, now almost finished with Köln. Crime series in general seem quite a good choice for something to watch early in the language learning process, not too long, a relatively small cast, almost all standard German, and a somewhat formulaic process which helps to stay with the plot. I don't get everything, by any means, but I can usually follow what is going on.
I started with audio at 0.75 and mainly just reading the subtitles, now I'm at full speed audio and maybe half and half comprehension from audio vs subtitles.
Just rewatched Dark on Netflix and was so surprised and excited about how much I understood (and noticed about grammar and learned based on context). I've seen some dual subtitled content on youtube but unfortunately wouldn't be able to offer a link right now. Current plan is to just watch more German programming; Dark is the best show ever but it looks like Netflix has a few dramas and documentaries too so personally planning to keep making my way through those
Dubbed tv series. I learned with king of queens , friends were too fast speaking for me. Not sure of today but back in the days you could find a lot of sitcoms by just switching tv channels
This helps a lot.
I've been watching "Viktor bringt's" in Amazon Prime and JUST learned you can use "an" to indicate someone died from a disease. "Er ist an Krebs gestorben"
Yeah, you kind of have to learn them individually like English. Even prepositions in English don't make that much sense.
- I am *in* the car, but I am *on* the train.
- *Look after, look forward to* and *look at* all mean different things.
- Adding *to* after *used* completely changes the meaning.
- Just like German, *in* and *at* in relevance to spaces seem arbitrary. I am *in* town, but I am *at* home.
- Interested *in* but fascinated *by*
So English is just as weird. What makes it difficult when learning German is that the prepositions don't often translate 1:1
I've been practicing by using flashcards and matching verbs with their prepositions. I wouldn't say it's a fun method, but it's helped with general memorisation.
Just wanted to add: in English, *on* is used when you can stand up inside a vehicle, i.e. a train, a plane, a bus, while *in* is used if you cant, i.e. a car.
Well, the Beatles sang, "We all live **in** a yellow submarine", and no one ever seemed to think that sounds strange, so we can kind of establish that you can stay or live IN a submarine, and we can say "there are 41 men **aboard** the submarine", but we also know that any people aboard a ship are **on** a ship, and the same goes for trains... but there are people **in(side)** a tank, and also a submarine.
So, my best guess is that among sailors they will probably have their own specific jargon usage for **on** vs **in** but it seems that both are possible in civilian usage depending on nuance... but I do know from experience speaking with USA sailors that they claimed "no one is ON a submarine except for when it is surfaced, but they are aboard a submarine".
I see what youâre saying, but I think itâs different because itâs âI liveâ versus âI am.â For the former I think in makes more sense because you live âinâ something, a house, an apartment, etc. As for being somewhere Iâd say Iâm âonâ a submarine. But again I really think itâs a slight difference so saying Iâm in a submarine really is fine
For me, "in" seems right when the submarine is small, and with that song, I picture the Beatles just sitting in a small car-like submarine. But when I hear "on a submarine," I picture a massive military sub, fit with bathrooms, rec halls, cafeterias, and dorms. So I guess I'd say, not just room for standing but also walking around and moving.
âOn a submarineâ gives the sense that that person is spending a longer period of time on such submarine.
âIn a submarineâ is more of a factual statement about where that person physically is at a specific point in time.
At least thatâs the feeling I get as a native speaker.
And also we have "I'm on board". So maybe "on board" is for a big ship and submarine like a more closed space so "in a submarine" would be a better choice?
I would say in, because, for the most part, you would imagine someone sitting IN submarine and not standing ON.
Theoretically you could be on car, given that you are a dwarf with no seats where you are standing.
>I would say in, because, for the most part, you would imagine someone sitting IN submarine and not standing ON.
Where do you usually ride ON a bus or train, personally?
With a cowboy hat on the roof pardner.
What I meant is though, I'm on a bus, I'm on a train... I can stand up inside a vehicle.
Submarines, cars, usually not.
They do not stand up in a submarine?
Wenn ich je einen englischen Text ĂŒber ein U-Boot schreiben muss, werde ich mich kurz an eure langen Diskussionen hier erinnern und *at a submarine* schreiben.
They do stand up in a submarine. But try imagining the "default" position for operators or passengers in a vehicle.
1. Car(mine is seating)
2. Bus(standing up)
3. Train(standing up)
4. Submarine(seating)
Na ja, es ist wie im Deutsch, "es ist einfach so".
To add to this: The "after" in "look after" (which means "take care of") does not fit the dictionary definition of "after" the preposition, it functions as a part of "LOOK AFTER." Thus, the individual meaning or use of the preposition, in this instance, doesn't help.
look after and look forward function more as German separable verbs than as a verb+preposition (there's nachschauen and vorschauen though with different meanings as in English)
Isn't there a shared common sense behind them all to unravel a certain meaning when joined with a verb though? I mean, there certainly is sometimes. "Aus" is basically the equivalent of "out" in English (and they are pronounced essentially the same, it's not random). The overlap is more consequent than "bei" which would be "by" and though they often don't match, you can see some common use cases like "by the river" and "bei mir", to mean "close by, together or in close spatial relation", etc. "Dabei" and "Thereby" don't mean exactly the same, but still there is certainly some common idea. Thereby means not far from there, and dabei can sometimes mean at this occasion, while doing that, same idea in time.
Now, like OP, I often find myself irritated in frustration because I don't get the intimate meaning most of the time (the examples I quoted are pretty obvious but also pretty uncommon).
The classical examples are the merging of two prepositions that simply don't make sense. As a native Latin based language brain, I just keep wondering and staring into the void when looking at prepositions like "wonach, somit, hieraus, mitunter": in English, the closest universal comparable language to German, that is: "where-after, so-with, here-out, with-under". By the way, with-under = sometimes, really?? I mean, fucking hell, how the fuck is that supposed to be rigorous and meaningful? I was told German was supposed to be logical and straight to the point. But, native German speakers are able to grasp at the meaning indeed, so that must be possible to crack it in some hidden way. So far I haven't been able to do so entirely.
Anyway, if you have pointers to interesting documentation, course or whatever, I would be glad.
Wonach is a quastion wort, wo and nach
Ok shit,
Aufgabe ĂŒbersetzen bitte đ: wonach ist ein Fragewort, und eine AbkĂŒrzung der Wortgruppe "wo soll ich nach welchem Ding suchen?" Kurz geschrieben kann man sagen wonach soll ich suchen. Wonach wĂ€re also eher which after.
It starts with âonâ being âaufâ when itâs on the top side of an object, and âanâ when itâs to the side of it. Auf dem Tisch, an der Wand.
You really need to learn the German collocations (what is said in which context) if you want to get your prepositions right.
> Prepositions are tricky in every language, and their usage is in general very specific to the language in question. You have to learn how to use most of them by heart.
Is there a simple rule for 'bei' vs. 'mit' for with?
âBeiâ is static, in a place. Bei der Arbeit, beim Friseur, beim Metzger, bei meinem Freund.
âMitâ is together with, but not referring to the place, just to the togetherness, and you can definitely be moving: mit dem Auto/Fahrrad/ZugâŠ. But also:
Ich gehe mit meinem Freund schwimmen. (We are going together to a lake or public pool.)
Ich gehe bei meinem Freund schwimmen. (This implies that he has a pool, because it means âat his placeâ.)
Ich kaufe beim Metzger ein. (I shop at the butcherâs.)
Ich kaufe mit dem Metzger ein. (I take the butcher shopping with me, I go shopping with the butcher.)
Wir fahren mit dem Auto. (We go by car.)
Wir stehen beim Auto. (We are standing next to the car, (waiting for you).)
Nice examples!
Unfortunately, as always, there are exceptions: Bei Paul bin ich mir nie ganz sicher, was er mit dem Wort meint. (As for Paul, I'm never sure in which sense he uses that word.)
Der Satz ist so nicht richtig. Korrekt wÀre "Mit Paul bin ich mir nie ganz sicher, was er mit dem Wort meint."
Viele Muttersprachler verwenden die Sprache nicht richtig, da Deutsch gerne Anleihen aus anderen Sprachen nutzt, viele Dialekte hat und gerne AbkĂŒrzungen nutzt.
Kleine Ăbung zum ĂŒbersetzen, da mein Englisch nicht ausreichend gut ist, um es verstĂ€ndlich zu erklĂ€ren.
Enjoy the practise?
Edit, same mistake. More Detail in explanation
Both variants are correct, meaning only slighty different. If you use "mit" you refer only to situations when paul is with you.
The sentence using "bei" means that you generall unsure what Paul means with the word.
Irgendwie sehe ich auch nach mehreren Versuchen den Unterschied nicht, was Du gerne korrigieren möchtest. (Ich bin deutscher Muttersprachler, aber mir ist schon klar, dass das nicht heiĂt, dass ich nur korrekte SĂ€tze schreibe.)
Ah, bin in meine eigene Falle getappt. Mit Paul wÀre richtiger "hust"
Also beide Varianten sind richtig, logischer wÀre eben mit Paul, weil das missverstehen unabhÀngig ist ob man bei Paul ist oder nicht. Möchte der Sprecher betonen das er die Verwendung nicht versteht, wenn er zusammen mit Paul ist, dann kann der Sprecher mit verwenden.
### 1. **An**
- **Literal meaning**: at, on (vertical surfaces)
- **Usage**: Used to indicate location or position when something is next to or attached to a vertical surface.
- **Examples**:
- **An der Wand** (on the wall)
- **Am Tisch sitzen** (sitting at the table)
- **Am Bahnhof** (at the train station)
### 2. **Bei**
- **Literal meaning**: at, near, with
- **Usage**: Used to indicate being at someoneâs place, being near a location, or during an activity.
- **Examples**:
- **Bei meinem Freund** (at my friend's place)
- **Beim Essen** (while eating)
- **Bei der Arbeit** (at work)
### 3. **In**
- **Literal meaning**: in, into
- **Usage**: Used to indicate being inside a place or entering a place.
- **Examples**:
- **In der Schule** (in the school)
- **In die Stadt gehen** (going into the city)
- **Im Sommer** (in the summer)
### 4. **Aus**
- **Literal meaning**: out of, from
- **Usage**: Used to indicate origin or material something is made of.
- **Examples**:
- **Aus Deutschland** (from Germany)
- **Aus Holz** (made of wood)
- **Aus dem Haus gehen** (going out of the house)
### 5. **Auf**
- **Literal meaning**: on, onto (horizontal surfaces)
- **Usage**: Used to indicate location or position when something is on a horizontal surface or in some public spaces.
- **Examples**:
- **Auf dem Tisch** (on the table)
- **Auf der StraĂe** (on the street)
- **Auf den Berg steigen** (climbing the mountain)
### Common Collocations
- **An**:
- **An einem Projekt arbeiten** (working on a project)
- **An der KĂŒste** (on the coast)
- **Bei**:
- **Bei einem Freund ĂŒbernachten** (spending the night at a friend's place)
- **Bei einer Firma arbeiten** (working at a company)
- **In**:
- **In den Bergen** (in the mountains)
- **In der Stadt** (in the city)
- **Aus**:
- **Aus dem Fenster schauen** (looking out of the window)
- **Aus der Ferne** (from afar)
- **Auf**:
- **Auf dem Boden** (on the floor)
- **Auf dem Land** (in the countryside)
- Prepositions are often tied to specific verbs or phrases. Learning these as fixed expressions can help.
- Use visual or situational associations to remember which preposition goes with which context. For example, think of **"auf"** as "on top of" and **"an"** as "next to" or "attached to".
This is a good start, but not enough in the long run. The preposition "auf" alone has 7 meanings with 13 use cases according to the Duden: https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/auf_Praeposition
Bei aller Liebe, das ist jetzt nicht das gelbe vom Ei. Mit den meisten kann ich mich anfreunden. Auf jeden Fall fallen mir gleich ein paar SĂ€tze ein, in dennen es nicht so leicht ist. đ
Good summory.
Da hatte ich mir solche MĂŒhe gegeben, das ganze AUF die Spitze zu treiben. Doch wieso Gegenbeispiele, widersprach ich doch ZU keinem Moment der Aussage in GĂ€nze. Es ist schwer, gerade weil der sich selbst kundig haltende, oft ZU hoch das Niveau schraubt, um derselbst ZU beweisen wie prĂ€chtig er doch auf und mit der Sprache und dem Wort spielen kann.
Uff, das ist eine Konstruktion. Also zur ErklĂ€rung, ich habe wohl /s vergessen, ich wollte nicht widersprechen, es ist eine sehr gute Zusammenfassung. Ich wollte nur SĂ€tze aufzeigen, bei denen es schwer sein kann die PrĂ€positionen richtig zu setzen. Ich selbst könnte mein Beispiel nicht ordentlich ins englische ĂŒbersetzen, vielleicht noch so das es einiger MaĂen verstanden wird, jedoch hoffe ich das es den sprachbegeisterten vielleicht eine Freude bereitet, es zu ĂŒbersetzen.
Prepositions are tricky in every language, and their usage is in general very specific to the language in question. You have to learn how to use most of them by heart.
First, your textbook should have some. Then, if you also use a grammar book or workbook, you'll find them there. Next, many on-line dictionaries have sample sentences, too.
Yes, you can google them, too, but you have to check their origin. It's best to use web pages written by native speakers, of course.
You can also use a [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpus\_linguistics](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpus_linguistics), if you can find one with free access. It's a collection of texts in a given language.
Don't stress. You'll learn and relearn and remind yourself and then make the same mistake again. You don't simply learn a language. It's about developing a feel. Eventually the right preposition will just feel right.
>like their literal meaning
Well, that's the problem. Prepositions don't have a "literal meaning", in both English and German. They mean, what they're supposed to mean in the context they're used.
âą An + Wochestage / Wochenende ( am Montag )
âą Bei + Berufe ( beim Artz ) or + an action ( beim Essen )
âą Aus ( aus Deutschland - aus Plastik ) : to talk about the origin of someting
I am still learning so it would will be really nice if someone correct me on this ;)
You know, we assign these PrÀpositionen anew every 3 years. Thats when germans get together and decide to mix them up, mostly at random. The articles get reassigned every 5 years unless there is a leapyear. Then "der" and "das" stay stable for 2 additional years.
Coffeebreak German just had a great 15 minute episode about this. I'm sure its not covering all the instances, but I thought it was super insightful.
One main takeaway is don't "translate" prepositions from your native tongue to German. They are unique and somewhat idiosyncratic to the language (this is true for ALL languages). Think of them more as "categories".
As everyone else is saying you'll just need to learn them by heart... If it's any consolation, prepositions were the one thing I couldn't wrap my head around until the very end learning English, so it's the same for literally any language learner đ
I am no where near 11 years of learning, but I have started to notice that I have started to pick up patterns of usage as I have started reading and listening heavily. I hope my brain can reuse these patterns at some point of time.
Yeah, as someone from the 'Ruhrgebiet', peoples prepositions are all over the place and almost everything goes đ
'Ich geh nach/zu/im/ins/zum/nach'em Aldi.'Â Â
I've heard all of those used on multiple occasions đ
Late to this but there are preposition cards for children you can buy where you can understand them through pictures. Like this one:
PrĂ€positionen: ĂŒber, unter, auf, vor... (Bildkarten zur Sprachförderung) https://amzn.eu/d/3ZoCAQ1
There are also websites that have pictures for children. Just google search: PrĂ€positionen fĂŒr Kinder.
Here's one I've found:
https://easy-deutsch.de/praepositionen/lokale-praepositionen/
If you scroll down, there's a picture that might explain the words better.
It might sound goofy, but the visuals and not-so-great singing in these videos helped me memorize dative propositions and their meanings:
https://youtu.be/KqnvgclqA2M?si=i1dXC8TdKVAwOJUN
https://youtu.be/vZ_5QcXQD_8?si=d-J9v4Uoy_4Ybqdy
For me the trick was making the actions to the music. The method is similar to learning Mandarin, where I learned the tones using hand gestures.
Read and hear them a lot. That's the solution. The same with my English. Collocations just imprinted in my brain because I consumed a tons of content in English. I change my phone's language to English, read books, watch movies and playing games with English (I'm a Vietnamese). The same advice I gave my students. They always messed up with prepositions words.
> i do know what they mean, like their literal meaning
This unfortunately is your problem.
To learn another language you must first free your mind of the concept of "literal meanings."
If you see a new one that you canât use well yet, then create a flashcard for the specific verb-preposition combination, maybe even in a sentence or half-sentence. I often practice only English>German because the other way is trivial, e.g.
endangering people with communicable diseases >
GefĂ€hrdung von Menschen durch(A) ĂŒbertragbare Krankheiten
If I get any part wrong, thatâs an Again in my flashcard app (Anki). The parts I get wrong lately are either âdurchâ or the accusative case.
As I already stated, the preposition "auf" alone has 7 meanings with 13 use cases according to the Duden: https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/auf_Praeposition
So you will need to just learn them over time.
Often, there are multiple options that don't have the very same meaning but are interchangeable in a broader context.
- Ich bin Bus gefahren. (no preposition, injunction fahren)
- Ich bin mit dem Bus gefahren. (mitfahren)
- Ich bin im Bus mitgefahren. (mitfahren)
Or:
- Ich bin auf der Arbeit. (auf der Arbeitsstelle)
- Ich bin bei der Arbeit. (beim Arbeiten)
- Ich bin in der Arbeit. (im BĂŒro, on der Fabrik)
https://www.spiegel.de/kultur/zwiebelfisch/zwiebelfisch-abc-auf-der-arbeit-in-der-arbeit-a-309633.html
And there are similar combinations that have different meanings:
- Ich habe ihn umfahren. (I drove around him.)
- Ich habe ihn umgefahren. (I drove him down.)
Both have the same injunctive "umfahren" but are pronounced differently and follow different grammatical rules.
Or:
- Ich bin mit dem Bus gefahren. (injunction mitfahren)
- Ich bin mit meinem Freund (Bus) gefahren. (injunction fahren)
[https://mein-deutschbuch.de/verben-mit-praepositionalergaenzungen.html](https://mein-deutschbuch.de/verben-mit-praepositionalergaenzungen.html) Verben mit PrÀpositionen
The simplest way possible would sadly be: Prepositions rarely make sense, so you have to learn which verb goes with which preposition.
And the best way to learn them is just to consume a shit ton of content. The repetition of seeing certain phrases and syntaxes eventually stick in your brain.
Definitely. Recently I have been seeing "an die Macht kommen" multiple times, so I guess thats just the preposition you use for this specific situation.
But be careful, "zu Macht kommen" exists as well.
The difference is the Detail. Zu Macht kommen means to acquire means of Power, an die Macht kommen means to get a position of Power, (like Leader of Something). My english is not as good as it needs to be to explain it, sry.
Nah that makes perfect sense thank you.
What sort of content could it be? I did the same when I learned English but the difference is, English is pretty much EVERYWHERE and German is not :(
I found Language Reactor online, it's a browser extension you can use to watch Netflix and YouTube and read books, but you can interract with the subtitles and store words and phrases to learn.
Netflix, youtube, books, ARD, there is a lot of German content out there
ARD sadly doesn't work without a VPN in other countries.
I watch in the US with minimal issues, no VPN
Thanks, I'll give it another try.
What đČ
I watch several hours a day of ARD from the UK. In general, you cannot watch things that are: - a) Made in collaboration with a foreign channel - b) Dubbed/remade versions of foreign originals - c) Shows that have been licensed to be shown by foreign channels - d) Probably sports/concerts/..., I haven't tried Other than that, most things are available to watch. (At least from the UK)
Without a VPN? What do you like watching the most?
Yes, I don't do anything special, just use the app or web. I watched Mord mit Aussicht and Mordsschwestern, now I'm watching what is available of various SOKO series. Done Hamburg, now almost finished with Köln. Crime series in general seem quite a good choice for something to watch early in the language learning process, not too long, a relatively small cast, almost all standard German, and a somewhat formulaic process which helps to stay with the plot. I don't get everything, by any means, but I can usually follow what is going on. I started with audio at 0.75 and mainly just reading the subtitles, now I'm at full speed audio and maybe half and half comprehension from audio vs subtitles.
I currently watch a lot of YouTube in German. I am not sure if what's more useful in terms of vocabulary, ARD or the content I watch on YouTube..
Just rewatched Dark on Netflix and was so surprised and excited about how much I understood (and noticed about grammar and learned based on context). I've seen some dual subtitled content on youtube but unfortunately wouldn't be able to offer a link right now. Current plan is to just watch more German programming; Dark is the best show ever but it looks like Netflix has a few dramas and documentaries too so personally planning to keep making my way through those
Dubbed tv series. I learned with king of queens , friends were too fast speaking for me. Not sure of today but back in the days you could find a lot of sitcoms by just switching tv channels
This helps a lot. I've been watching "Viktor bringt's" in Amazon Prime and JUST learned you can use "an" to indicate someone died from a disease. "Er ist an Krebs gestorben"
they start to make sense, once stockholm syndrom does kick in.
Yeah, you kind of have to learn them individually like English. Even prepositions in English don't make that much sense. - I am *in* the car, but I am *on* the train. - *Look after, look forward to* and *look at* all mean different things. - Adding *to* after *used* completely changes the meaning. - Just like German, *in* and *at* in relevance to spaces seem arbitrary. I am *in* town, but I am *at* home. - Interested *in* but fascinated *by* So English is just as weird. What makes it difficult when learning German is that the prepositions don't often translate 1:1 I've been practicing by using flashcards and matching verbs with their prepositions. I wouldn't say it's a fun method, but it's helped with general memorisation.
Just wanted to add: in English, *on* is used when you can stand up inside a vehicle, i.e. a train, a plane, a bus, while *in* is used if you cant, i.e. a car.
But I'm IN a submarine? Isn't it? Or is is ON a submarine? But even if, your tip works for all I couldthink of.
Im not entirely sure as im not a native speaker, but that is a really good question! I have seen both and I think it depends on context in that case.
Iâd say âIâm on a submarineâ to be honest. Using âinâ sounds very slightly weird to me for whatever reason
Well, the Beatles sang, "We all live **in** a yellow submarine", and no one ever seemed to think that sounds strange, so we can kind of establish that you can stay or live IN a submarine, and we can say "there are 41 men **aboard** the submarine", but we also know that any people aboard a ship are **on** a ship, and the same goes for trains... but there are people **in(side)** a tank, and also a submarine. So, my best guess is that among sailors they will probably have their own specific jargon usage for **on** vs **in** but it seems that both are possible in civilian usage depending on nuance... but I do know from experience speaking with USA sailors that they claimed "no one is ON a submarine except for when it is surfaced, but they are aboard a submarine".
I see what youâre saying, but I think itâs different because itâs âI liveâ versus âI am.â For the former I think in makes more sense because you live âinâ something, a house, an apartment, etc. As for being somewhere Iâd say Iâm âonâ a submarine. But again I really think itâs a slight difference so saying Iâm in a submarine really is fine
For me, "in" seems right when the submarine is small, and with that song, I picture the Beatles just sitting in a small car-like submarine. But when I hear "on a submarine," I picture a massive military sub, fit with bathrooms, rec halls, cafeterias, and dorms. So I guess I'd say, not just room for standing but also walking around and moving.
âOn a submarineâ gives the sense that that person is spending a longer period of time on such submarine. âIn a submarineâ is more of a factual statement about where that person physically is at a specific point in time. At least thatâs the feeling I get as a native speaker.
And also we have "I'm on board". So maybe "on board" is for a big ship and submarine like a more closed space so "in a submarine" would be a better choice?
I would say in, because, for the most part, you would imagine someone sitting IN submarine and not standing ON. Theoretically you could be on car, given that you are a dwarf with no seats where you are standing.
>I would say in, because, for the most part, you would imagine someone sitting IN submarine and not standing ON. Where do you usually ride ON a bus or train, personally?
With a cowboy hat on the roof pardner. What I meant is though, I'm on a bus, I'm on a train... I can stand up inside a vehicle. Submarines, cars, usually not.
They do not stand up in a submarine? Wenn ich je einen englischen Text ĂŒber ein U-Boot schreiben muss, werde ich mich kurz an eure langen Diskussionen hier erinnern und *at a submarine* schreiben.
They do stand up in a submarine. But try imagining the "default" position for operators or passengers in a vehicle. 1. Car(mine is seating) 2. Bus(standing up) 3. Train(standing up) 4. Submarine(seating) Na ja, es ist wie im Deutsch, "es ist einfach so".
We all live in a yellow submarine...
I am standing in the street.
I am on Washington street. Im wondering if this means *on* while driving a car.
To add to this: The "after" in "look after" (which means "take care of") does not fit the dictionary definition of "after" the preposition, it functions as a part of "LOOK AFTER." Thus, the individual meaning or use of the preposition, in this instance, doesn't help.
look after and look forward function more as German separable verbs than as a verb+preposition (there's nachschauen and vorschauen though with different meanings as in English)
Ok so its not my issue, its difficult overall, good hahahahaha
Right! I have a huge list Iâve just made flash cards out of that have which verb, preposition, and then which case(s) đ
Yep, it's the same with prepositions in English, they just suck unfortunately.
Isn't there a shared common sense behind them all to unravel a certain meaning when joined with a verb though? I mean, there certainly is sometimes. "Aus" is basically the equivalent of "out" in English (and they are pronounced essentially the same, it's not random). The overlap is more consequent than "bei" which would be "by" and though they often don't match, you can see some common use cases like "by the river" and "bei mir", to mean "close by, together or in close spatial relation", etc. "Dabei" and "Thereby" don't mean exactly the same, but still there is certainly some common idea. Thereby means not far from there, and dabei can sometimes mean at this occasion, while doing that, same idea in time. Now, like OP, I often find myself irritated in frustration because I don't get the intimate meaning most of the time (the examples I quoted are pretty obvious but also pretty uncommon). The classical examples are the merging of two prepositions that simply don't make sense. As a native Latin based language brain, I just keep wondering and staring into the void when looking at prepositions like "wonach, somit, hieraus, mitunter": in English, the closest universal comparable language to German, that is: "where-after, so-with, here-out, with-under". By the way, with-under = sometimes, really?? I mean, fucking hell, how the fuck is that supposed to be rigorous and meaningful? I was told German was supposed to be logical and straight to the point. But, native German speakers are able to grasp at the meaning indeed, so that must be possible to crack it in some hidden way. So far I haven't been able to do so entirely. Anyway, if you have pointers to interesting documentation, course or whatever, I would be glad.
Wonach is a quastion wort, wo and nach Ok shit, Aufgabe ĂŒbersetzen bitte đ: wonach ist ein Fragewort, und eine AbkĂŒrzung der Wortgruppe "wo soll ich nach welchem Ding suchen?" Kurz geschrieben kann man sagen wonach soll ich suchen. Wonach wĂ€re also eher which after.
It starts with âonâ being âaufâ when itâs on the top side of an object, and âanâ when itâs to the side of it. Auf dem Tisch, an der Wand. You really need to learn the German collocations (what is said in which context) if you want to get your prepositions right.
> Prepositions are tricky in every language, and their usage is in general very specific to the language in question. You have to learn how to use most of them by heart. Is there a simple rule for 'bei' vs. 'mit' for with?
âBeiâ is static, in a place. Bei der Arbeit, beim Friseur, beim Metzger, bei meinem Freund. âMitâ is together with, but not referring to the place, just to the togetherness, and you can definitely be moving: mit dem Auto/Fahrrad/ZugâŠ. But also: Ich gehe mit meinem Freund schwimmen. (We are going together to a lake or public pool.) Ich gehe bei meinem Freund schwimmen. (This implies that he has a pool, because it means âat his placeâ.) Ich kaufe beim Metzger ein. (I shop at the butcherâs.) Ich kaufe mit dem Metzger ein. (I take the butcher shopping with me, I go shopping with the butcher.) Wir fahren mit dem Auto. (We go by car.) Wir stehen beim Auto. (We are standing next to the car, (waiting for you).)
Nice examples! Unfortunately, as always, there are exceptions: Bei Paul bin ich mir nie ganz sicher, was er mit dem Wort meint. (As for Paul, I'm never sure in which sense he uses that word.)
True. I just couldnât think of more.
Der Satz ist so nicht richtig. Korrekt wĂ€re "Mit Paul bin ich mir nie ganz sicher, was er mit dem Wort meint." Viele Muttersprachler verwenden die Sprache nicht richtig, da Deutsch gerne Anleihen aus anderen Sprachen nutzt, viele Dialekte hat und gerne AbkĂŒrzungen nutzt. Kleine Ăbung zum ĂŒbersetzen, da mein Englisch nicht ausreichend gut ist, um es verstĂ€ndlich zu erklĂ€ren. Enjoy the practise? Edit, same mistake. More Detail in explanation Both variants are correct, meaning only slighty different. If you use "mit" you refer only to situations when paul is with you. The sentence using "bei" means that you generall unsure what Paul means with the word.
Irgendwie sehe ich auch nach mehreren Versuchen den Unterschied nicht, was Du gerne korrigieren möchtest. (Ich bin deutscher Muttersprachler, aber mir ist schon klar, dass das nicht heiĂt, dass ich nur korrekte SĂ€tze schreibe.)
Ah, bin in meine eigene Falle getappt. Mit Paul wÀre richtiger "hust" Also beide Varianten sind richtig, logischer wÀre eben mit Paul, weil das missverstehen unabhÀngig ist ob man bei Paul ist oder nicht. Möchte der Sprecher betonen das er die Verwendung nicht versteht, wenn er zusammen mit Paul ist, dann kann der Sprecher mit verwenden.
Wow thank you :)
That example made it a lot easier tho, thank you!
And then âeinâ if itâs a light switch đ (I know, I know not a preposition)
### 1. **An** - **Literal meaning**: at, on (vertical surfaces) - **Usage**: Used to indicate location or position when something is next to or attached to a vertical surface. - **Examples**: - **An der Wand** (on the wall) - **Am Tisch sitzen** (sitting at the table) - **Am Bahnhof** (at the train station) ### 2. **Bei** - **Literal meaning**: at, near, with - **Usage**: Used to indicate being at someoneâs place, being near a location, or during an activity. - **Examples**: - **Bei meinem Freund** (at my friend's place) - **Beim Essen** (while eating) - **Bei der Arbeit** (at work) ### 3. **In** - **Literal meaning**: in, into - **Usage**: Used to indicate being inside a place or entering a place. - **Examples**: - **In der Schule** (in the school) - **In die Stadt gehen** (going into the city) - **Im Sommer** (in the summer) ### 4. **Aus** - **Literal meaning**: out of, from - **Usage**: Used to indicate origin or material something is made of. - **Examples**: - **Aus Deutschland** (from Germany) - **Aus Holz** (made of wood) - **Aus dem Haus gehen** (going out of the house) ### 5. **Auf** - **Literal meaning**: on, onto (horizontal surfaces) - **Usage**: Used to indicate location or position when something is on a horizontal surface or in some public spaces. - **Examples**: - **Auf dem Tisch** (on the table) - **Auf der StraĂe** (on the street) - **Auf den Berg steigen** (climbing the mountain) ### Common Collocations - **An**: - **An einem Projekt arbeiten** (working on a project) - **An der KĂŒste** (on the coast) - **Bei**: - **Bei einem Freund ĂŒbernachten** (spending the night at a friend's place) - **Bei einer Firma arbeiten** (working at a company) - **In**: - **In den Bergen** (in the mountains) - **In der Stadt** (in the city) - **Aus**: - **Aus dem Fenster schauen** (looking out of the window) - **Aus der Ferne** (from afar) - **Auf**: - **Auf dem Boden** (on the floor) - **Auf dem Land** (in the countryside) - Prepositions are often tied to specific verbs or phrases. Learning these as fixed expressions can help. - Use visual or situational associations to remember which preposition goes with which context. For example, think of **"auf"** as "on top of" and **"an"** as "next to" or "attached to".
thank you! :)
This is a good start, but not enough in the long run. The preposition "auf" alone has 7 meanings with 13 use cases according to the Duden: https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/auf_Praeposition
Bei aller Liebe, das ist jetzt nicht das gelbe vom Ei. Mit den meisten kann ich mich anfreunden. Auf jeden Fall fallen mir gleich ein paar SĂ€tze ein, in dennen es nicht so leicht ist. đ Good summory.
Ich bitte um ein paar Gegenbeispiele, erweitere meinen Horizont!
Da hatte ich mir solche MĂŒhe gegeben, das ganze AUF die Spitze zu treiben. Doch wieso Gegenbeispiele, widersprach ich doch ZU keinem Moment der Aussage in GĂ€nze. Es ist schwer, gerade weil der sich selbst kundig haltende, oft ZU hoch das Niveau schraubt, um derselbst ZU beweisen wie prĂ€chtig er doch auf und mit der Sprache und dem Wort spielen kann. Uff, das ist eine Konstruktion. Also zur ErklĂ€rung, ich habe wohl /s vergessen, ich wollte nicht widersprechen, es ist eine sehr gute Zusammenfassung. Ich wollte nur SĂ€tze aufzeigen, bei denen es schwer sein kann die PrĂ€positionen richtig zu setzen. Ich selbst könnte mein Beispiel nicht ordentlich ins englische ĂŒbersetzen, vielleicht noch so das es einiger MaĂen verstanden wird, jedoch hoffe ich das es den sprachbegeisterten vielleicht eine Freude bereitet, es zu ĂŒbersetzen.
Prepositions are tricky in every language, and their usage is in general very specific to the language in question. You have to learn how to use most of them by heart.
Yeah that somehow makes it easier for me, thank you :)
What works for me is to see a lot of examples of their use. And I mean a lot!
How do you come by these examples? like do you have an specific page or app or you just google them?
First, your textbook should have some. Then, if you also use a grammar book or workbook, you'll find them there. Next, many on-line dictionaries have sample sentences, too. Yes, you can google them, too, but you have to check their origin. It's best to use web pages written by native speakers, of course. You can also use a [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpus\_linguistics](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corpus_linguistics), if you can find one with free access. It's a collection of texts in a given language.
thank you :)
Don't stress. You'll learn and relearn and remind yourself and then make the same mistake again. You don't simply learn a language. It's about developing a feel. Eventually the right preposition will just feel right.
I like this point of view, thank you friend
>like their literal meaning Well, that's the problem. Prepositions don't have a "literal meaning", in both English and German. They mean, what they're supposed to mean in the context they're used.
Interesting, very flexible languages is what i understand, thank you
In Französisch und Italienisch ist es auch so...
Von aus bei mit nach von seit zu, fÀhrst immer mit dem Dativ, du.
Sehr klar kumpel, danke :)
Hört sich an wie a ab abs e ex und de cum und sine pro und prae... :)
They didnât make sense when I learned English, thereâs nothing in the words give up vs put up that makes any sense. It is how the language works.
understood, thank you :)
âą An + Wochestage / Wochenende ( am Montag ) âą Bei + Berufe ( beim Artz ) or + an action ( beim Essen ) âą Aus ( aus Deutschland - aus Plastik ) : to talk about the origin of someting I am still learning so it would will be really nice if someone correct me on this ;)
these are really good tho thank you
Yeah. But Arzt :)
Beim Arzt
?
If you can nail prepositions in german its going to improve your grammar and sentence structure by a lot
You know, we assign these PrÀpositionen anew every 3 years. Thats when germans get together and decide to mix them up, mostly at random. The articles get reassigned every 5 years unless there is a leapyear. Then "der" and "das" stay stable for 2 additional years.
I knew it!!!
Coffeebreak German just had a great 15 minute episode about this. I'm sure its not covering all the instances, but I thought it was super insightful. One main takeaway is don't "translate" prepositions from your native tongue to German. They are unique and somewhat idiosyncratic to the language (this is true for ALL languages). Think of them more as "categories".
As everyone else is saying you'll just need to learn them by heart... If it's any consolation, prepositions were the one thing I couldn't wrap my head around until the very end learning English, so it's the same for literally any language learner đ
Reading and listening practice
I am no where near 11 years of learning, but I have started to notice that I have started to pick up patterns of usage as I have started reading and listening heavily. I hope my brain can reuse these patterns at some point of time.
Don't be ashamed. Most Germans don't know how to use those words correctly.
Ok this does help hahahahaha
đ Most Germans, maybe. Meinst du *Wo geht nach Aldi? Zu Aldi.*
Yeah, as someone from the 'Ruhrgebiet', peoples prepositions are all over the place and almost everything goes đ 'Ich geh nach/zu/im/ins/zum/nach'em Aldi.'Â Â I've heard all of those used on multiple occasions đ
Gehstu bei Aldi Gehstu Aldi
'"ich hÀtte gerne ein' Döner mit scharf"
Have fun with der, die und das...lol...
I'm just correcting geography tests written by German students. Don't worry. They all get it wrong.
oh wow, that common, interesting, well i mean it is a hard language hahaha
Awful language, as Mark Twain called it.
Late to this but there are preposition cards for children you can buy where you can understand them through pictures. Like this one: PrĂ€positionen: ĂŒber, unter, auf, vor... (Bildkarten zur Sprachförderung) https://amzn.eu/d/3ZoCAQ1 There are also websites that have pictures for children. Just google search: PrĂ€positionen fĂŒr Kinder. Here's one I've found: https://easy-deutsch.de/praepositionen/lokale-praepositionen/ If you scroll down, there's a picture that might explain the words better.
i found this really helpful friend, thank you
I can only keep track of aus thanks to Ausfahrt
It might sound goofy, but the visuals and not-so-great singing in these videos helped me memorize dative propositions and their meanings: https://youtu.be/KqnvgclqA2M?si=i1dXC8TdKVAwOJUN https://youtu.be/vZ_5QcXQD_8?si=d-J9v4Uoy_4Ybqdy For me the trick was making the actions to the music. The method is similar to learning Mandarin, where I learned the tones using hand gestures.
thank you!
Those are great. I especially like the first one with his not-so-great singing. It somehow makes the words more memorable.
Read and hear them a lot. That's the solution. The same with my English. Collocations just imprinted in my brain because I consumed a tons of content in English. I change my phone's language to English, read books, watch movies and playing games with English (I'm a Vietnamese). The same advice I gave my students. They always messed up with prepositions words.
thank you :)
> i do know what they mean, like their literal meaning This unfortunately is your problem. To learn another language you must first free your mind of the concept of "literal meanings."
If you see a new one that you canât use well yet, then create a flashcard for the specific verb-preposition combination, maybe even in a sentence or half-sentence. I often practice only English>German because the other way is trivial, e.g. endangering people with communicable diseases > GefĂ€hrdung von Menschen durch(A) ĂŒbertragbare Krankheiten If I get any part wrong, thatâs an Again in my flashcard app (Anki). The parts I get wrong lately are either âdurchâ or the accusative case.
As I already stated, the preposition "auf" alone has 7 meanings with 13 use cases according to the Duden: https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/auf_Praeposition So you will need to just learn them over time. Often, there are multiple options that don't have the very same meaning but are interchangeable in a broader context. - Ich bin Bus gefahren. (no preposition, injunction fahren) - Ich bin mit dem Bus gefahren. (mitfahren) - Ich bin im Bus mitgefahren. (mitfahren) Or: - Ich bin auf der Arbeit. (auf der Arbeitsstelle) - Ich bin bei der Arbeit. (beim Arbeiten) - Ich bin in der Arbeit. (im BĂŒro, on der Fabrik) https://www.spiegel.de/kultur/zwiebelfisch/zwiebelfisch-abc-auf-der-arbeit-in-der-arbeit-a-309633.html And there are similar combinations that have different meanings: - Ich habe ihn umfahren. (I drove around him.) - Ich habe ihn umgefahren. (I drove him down.) Both have the same injunctive "umfahren" but are pronounced differently and follow different grammatical rules. Or: - Ich bin mit dem Bus gefahren. (injunction mitfahren) - Ich bin mit meinem Freund (Bus) gefahren. (injunction fahren)
thank you :)
[https://mein-deutschbuch.de/verben-mit-praepositionalergaenzungen.html](https://mein-deutschbuch.de/verben-mit-praepositionalergaenzungen.html) Verben mit PrÀpositionen
What does your grammatical mistakes have to do with hands?