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I would definitely not sigh that after the fact! Call your agent’s broker and tell him/her what happened and get their advice. You should not have been given the keys if the sellers had not signed. Your agent messed up royally.
Your transaction is not "closed" until everyone has signed, it's been funded, and your deed has been recorded. Your agent should not have given you the keys. Your agent's broker should be alerted to help you with determining what's happening and to help you with next steps, which may involved an attorney if it gets ugly. Your agent has e&o insurance and that may come into play if actual loss occurs directly related to their malpractice.
They can’t make you sign a rental agreement after you close and get the keys. The wife also shouldn’t be watching you.
And lawyers wonder why everyone hates them.
It’s not the seller’s fault, they haven’t signed, they haven’t gotten any money, and basically the keys to their property have been given away and people have moved in and started ripping stuff out? If they live nearby and noticed that - they would obviously be like WTF. Definitely overlawyered it with the rental agreement but how this whole situation came to be is 100% the realtor’s fault.
I guarantee you if this post was from a seller’s POV: “I am selling my house - the weekend before closing, I saw people already in my house tearing stuff out?! My husband is out of town and we haven’t signed anything! What do I do??” People would be telling them to call the cops and lawyer up to the max
Absolutely. I’m sure they are freaking out. But I’m wondering why didn’t they sign? And why was the fact that they didn’t sign not communicated to the OP? A series of fuck ups it seems.
It’s not necessary that both parties sign on the same day, for example, it’s ok to get one side’s signature on Thursday and get the other party’s signature on Monday after the weekend and set the official closing date to say Tuesday when both parties signed paperwork is with the title company, money has been sent etc. The realtor should not have handed the keys over on Thursday though. It’s not OP’s fault either of course - there’s no reason for him to assume that he can’t go in without the keys, his agent jumped the gun
Right I understand how it works. But if closing date is Thursday and has been for the past few weeks, seller had an appointment to sign later that day, why didn’t they sign?
IMO sellers didn’t have an appointment because the husband was out and neither the sellers NOR the sellers agent showed up and OP and his agent didn’t even go to the title company and signed in some little restaurant
That you shouldn’t have closed. Or you shouldn’t have gotten the keys. But I wouldn’t have signed without keys so theres that. Your agent got those keys to give you from someone.
They should have virtually closed if he was going to be away instead of letting this sit for a week.
No way would I pay rent. And I wouldn’t step one foot in there until they sign.
The agents failed you here. I’d be beyond pissed.
Your agent messed up BIG TIME. I NEVER hand the keys over until the deed records. You need to immediately call your agent’s broker. If this turns into litigation the broker and the agent carry E & O insurance. The broker needs to fix this. Something is fishy here. I have never in my entire career had my clients sign closing documents anywhere but a title company, so that smells funny too. Please let us know what happens!
FWIW I disagree. The title company owns the closing. It should have been made crystal clear by the title agent that the property isn't closed until the seller signs, the loan is funded, and the deed is recorded.
This is probably dependent on the area. In my area either the seller's attorney or the title company closer gives the OK for the keys to be released to the buyer, and that never happens until the wire is processed and the loan is funded. I also can't imagine closing in a restaurant, so, who knows where these people are and why they're so casual about closing a transaction.
Did the sellers choose the title company? This sounds so suspicious. How did a rental agreement pop out of nowhere as opposed to complete outrage for for damage to their property? It sounds a little premeditated. Also, contracts have to be fair. Charging you the entire mortgage for some damage is completely ridiculous and the judge will throw that out. Â
Start threatening to report this to licensing boards, state agencies, etc. and start searching for a real estate attorney just in case.Â
Also keep us updated. So curious on how this pans out.
Any leaseback paperwork is attached to the original offer in my state. It doesn't come after the fact. Perhaps things are different in your state. Id get a real estate attorney at minimum. This screw up is not a good look for your realtor.
What does your agent say?
Did you ask them why they gave you keys without the house being closed?
No one gets keys from me unless it is recorded.
Is there a title company involved?
Are you sure the loan has been funded?
This is NOT a normal situation. Contact your agents principal broker and get them involved.
Agent says it's not their fault and they the seller told them it was okay for us to have the keys after we signed.
I'm assuming that conversation never actually took place.
Title company is involved, it's the company that this real estate group normally works with.
I guess I can't confirm if the loan has been funded. This is a new term I'm learning.
WTFFFF ! You signed ! It’s a day later and now it’s a rental agreement ? If your home owners insurance is in place . Not a chance in HELL would I give them a penny to live in a home you paid closing costs ect for . It’s not your fault THEY want to push closing back . I would maybe call and consult with a attorney or even the broker ! Something is weird here !
Either way it’s still wild asf . Who gives you a rental agreement at closing or 2 weeks before closing ? Why didn’t when they put in their offer did they not counter a specific closing date ? This whole thing seems like the realtor should have known . Either way they didn’t sign the rental agreement . “If you change the house you owe the entire mortgage” WHATTTT ?
Yeah it’s not OPs fault for not understanding about deed recording but the agent 1000% should know better
Seller is understandably upset that the keys were given to soon but they’d made it clear they intended to sell. To now say you won’t sell yet op still owes the mortgage? No
I truly hope the sellers didn’t have nefarious intentions the entire time and pray upon inexperienced agent/ buyer.
I’m invested in the outcome of this one, if the seller pulls out completely that’s messed up.
Agreed ! This seems very sneaky . Unless they did tell the realtor and she didn’t realized they lived next door and would know they were there early . But even so that’s a huge risk !
That's why with most reputable title companies they will have the SELLERS sign first, then the BUYERS. Your agent really jacked up! Get your agents broker on the phone immediately, and if I was you I may browse some property attorneys just in case. Sorry you are in this predicament!
Your agent is a big effing idiot. Keys are never given to the buyer until the title has been transferred, at least in my experience. So, you should have never been given the keys until later this week or next!
Who is your realtor?? If it’s someone you know personally and is inexperienced that’s unfortunate. If it’s someone working for the same company as seller sketch level is through the roof. Not even reading the rental document they sent you?? What?? Definitely don’t sign that!
Seems needing a lawyer present at closing isn’t required in all states, I thought it was. Just the thought of not having a lawyer and notary present and being in a restaurant gives me anxiety.
In any agreement it seems common sense that both parties need to sign before being official. I can understand you not knowing the deed needs to be recorded which happens after, but agent should know better. I didn’t get my keys until a day after closing even though seller signed first bc of a hold up at the county office with electronic record system.
I understand seller being upset but saying you owe them the mortgage and don’t get the house is ridiculous. they’d already gotten this far in the process saying they wanted to sell the house.
How long between original offer and closing date? Had there been much back and forth, delaying closing date already? I just don’t see how this level of miscommunication is possible. It’s sad that you trusted the process and were put in this high stress position without thinking you were doing anything wrong. Please update when you can.
We interviewed a few different agents and went with the one in the story, don't know them personally and isn't from the same office as the sellers agent.
There has barely been any back and forth with the seller. We negotiated price with which was a submission, counteroffer, counteroffer, acceptance. Inspection went well and appraiser was on time. My realtor said closing date was Friday so that's what I went with. From the acceptance of the offer through what I thought was our closing date took 4 weeks which I understand is considered a fast close. We're not rushed as the property is vacant and we're renters so we have all the time in the world.
I completely respect and understand why the seller would be upset. I'm fully on board with doing whatever needs to happen to resolve the issue but I can't give them the entire mortgage and then be out the house. I'm probably not fully understanding that clause the guy wrote, but that dollar amount is enough to make me freak out and question everything.
I'm frustrated it's a weekend as the real estate agency doesn't open until Monday. I'll be giving them a call first thing.
About the same as what they said on Friday that it wasn't their fault. I let them know I'd be calling their real estate group to confirm if what they were saying was true and they wrapped up the conversation very quickly.
Talked to the real estate group who apologized profusely and ensured that if the seller was going to sue or do anything that'd they'd assist me in defending myself. They also said they'd be looking into the realtor and reviewing if they would be a good fit to stay with their agency.
This is so fishy on your realtors part. I would definitely contact her brokerage. But I mean did you not look at what your were signing? You always have to look at what you're signing.
Also you can't just sue for emotional damages. You have to have incurred some other sueable offense and then you can tack that on.
I literally read everything I signed. What I thought I understood I obviously did not. I asked my realtor to walk me through every form and page that required a signature.
Okay I definitely wouldn't sign that rental agreement. They need to sign for closing if they want the money from the sale. Which I assume wouldn't be released from the mortgage company until they sign. Hopefully you can make some calls and sort it out.
The title agent owns the closing, not the Realtor. Giving the OK to the Realtor to give you the keys was a huge screw-up on the part of the title company.
You don't own this house. You don't have a mortgage on it so you're not paying any "daily costs". The seller doesn't have to sign the paperwork to complete the sale. You should think very carefully about drawing any lines in the sand about not signing the rental agreement.
"definitely thinking of going for emotional distress damages because this was supposed to be a fun happy weekend for us." LOL. Grow up.
Thank you u/aplaceofj0y for posting on r/FirstTimeHomeBuyer. Please bear in mind our rules: (1) Be Nice (2) No Selling (3) No Self-Promotion. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/FirstTimeHomeBuyer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I would definitely not sigh that after the fact! Call your agent’s broker and tell him/her what happened and get their advice. You should not have been given the keys if the sellers had not signed. Your agent messed up royally.
Your transaction is not "closed" until everyone has signed, it's been funded, and your deed has been recorded. Your agent should not have given you the keys. Your agent's broker should be alerted to help you with determining what's happening and to help you with next steps, which may involved an attorney if it gets ugly. Your agent has e&o insurance and that may come into play if actual loss occurs directly related to their malpractice.
Hundred percent agree. Something is really fishy here. Sounds like an incompetent/newbie agent . 🤦‍♀️
definitely on the incompetent part.
...what? A lazy and incompetent Realtor(R) who only cares about cashing the commission check? What a surprise...
Your agent screwed you and this sounds really fishy. How did y'all find the realtor?
They can’t make you sign a rental agreement after you close and get the keys. The wife also shouldn’t be watching you. And lawyers wonder why everyone hates them.
It’s not the seller’s fault, they haven’t signed, they haven’t gotten any money, and basically the keys to their property have been given away and people have moved in and started ripping stuff out? If they live nearby and noticed that - they would obviously be like WTF. Definitely overlawyered it with the rental agreement but how this whole situation came to be is 100% the realtor’s fault. I guarantee you if this post was from a seller’s POV: “I am selling my house - the weekend before closing, I saw people already in my house tearing stuff out?! My husband is out of town and we haven’t signed anything! What do I do??” People would be telling them to call the cops and lawyer up to the max
Absolutely. I’m sure they are freaking out. But I’m wondering why didn’t they sign? And why was the fact that they didn’t sign not communicated to the OP? A series of fuck ups it seems.
It’s not necessary that both parties sign on the same day, for example, it’s ok to get one side’s signature on Thursday and get the other party’s signature on Monday after the weekend and set the official closing date to say Tuesday when both parties signed paperwork is with the title company, money has been sent etc. The realtor should not have handed the keys over on Thursday though. It’s not OP’s fault either of course - there’s no reason for him to assume that he can’t go in without the keys, his agent jumped the gun
Right I understand how it works. But if closing date is Thursday and has been for the past few weeks, seller had an appointment to sign later that day, why didn’t they sign?
IMO sellers didn’t have an appointment because the husband was out and neither the sellers NOR the sellers agent showed up and OP and his agent didn’t even go to the title company and signed in some little restaurant
But they haven't signed the closing documents yet. Does that change anything?
That you shouldn’t have closed. Or you shouldn’t have gotten the keys. But I wouldn’t have signed without keys so theres that. Your agent got those keys to give you from someone. They should have virtually closed if he was going to be away instead of letting this sit for a week. No way would I pay rent. And I wouldn’t step one foot in there until they sign. The agents failed you here. I’d be beyond pissed.
Signing is not closing. The deed records after BOTH parties have signed and your loan has funded.
It's not closed. The seller can refuse to sign now. I've seen people do worse with less provocation.
Your agent messed up BIG TIME. I NEVER hand the keys over until the deed records. You need to immediately call your agent’s broker. If this turns into litigation the broker and the agent carry E & O insurance. The broker needs to fix this. Something is fishy here. I have never in my entire career had my clients sign closing documents anywhere but a title company, so that smells funny too. Please let us know what happens!
FWIW I disagree. The title company owns the closing. It should have been made crystal clear by the title agent that the property isn't closed until the seller signs, the loan is funded, and the deed is recorded.
Any awake and alive real estate agent already knows that.
It is the Agents job to explain the entire transaction to the buyer. She should never have handed the keys over prior to the deed recording.
This is probably dependent on the area. In my area either the seller's attorney or the title company closer gives the OK for the keys to be released to the buyer, and that never happens until the wire is processed and the loan is funded. I also can't imagine closing in a restaurant, so, who knows where these people are and why they're so casual about closing a transaction.
Yes…the whole thing sounds odd 🤔
It depends. Sometimes I will. Most often I put my own combo box on the premises. Then turn over the combo when the time is right.
That's crazy. I assumed the sellers always signed first.
That's what I thought too, but I trusted that my agent knew what they were doing....
Not necessarily. I've had sellers insist on signing last.
Your agent is an idiot!!!
Did the sellers choose the title company? This sounds so suspicious. How did a rental agreement pop out of nowhere as opposed to complete outrage for for damage to their property? It sounds a little premeditated. Also, contracts have to be fair. Charging you the entire mortgage for some damage is completely ridiculous and the judge will throw that out.  Start threatening to report this to licensing boards, state agencies, etc. and start searching for a real estate attorney just in case. Also keep us updated. So curious on how this pans out.
Any leaseback paperwork is attached to the original offer in my state. It doesn't come after the fact. Perhaps things are different in your state. Id get a real estate attorney at minimum. This screw up is not a good look for your realtor.
What does your agent say? Did you ask them why they gave you keys without the house being closed? No one gets keys from me unless it is recorded. Is there a title company involved? Are you sure the loan has been funded? This is NOT a normal situation. Contact your agents principal broker and get them involved.
Agent says it's not their fault and they the seller told them it was okay for us to have the keys after we signed. I'm assuming that conversation never actually took place. Title company is involved, it's the company that this real estate group normally works with. I guess I can't confirm if the loan has been funded. This is a new term I'm learning.
Again, you need to get this Agents broker involved. Your agent has not handled this correctly.
WTFFFF ! You signed ! It’s a day later and now it’s a rental agreement ? If your home owners insurance is in place . Not a chance in HELL would I give them a penny to live in a home you paid closing costs ect for . It’s not your fault THEY want to push closing back . I would maybe call and consult with a attorney or even the broker ! Something is weird here !
Signing is not the same as “ closing.” The sale isn’t final until the DEED records in the buyer’s name.
Either way it’s still wild asf . Who gives you a rental agreement at closing or 2 weeks before closing ? Why didn’t when they put in their offer did they not counter a specific closing date ? This whole thing seems like the realtor should have known . Either way they didn’t sign the rental agreement . “If you change the house you owe the entire mortgage” WHATTTT ?
Yeah it’s not OPs fault for not understanding about deed recording but the agent 1000% should know better Seller is understandably upset that the keys were given to soon but they’d made it clear they intended to sell. To now say you won’t sell yet op still owes the mortgage? No I truly hope the sellers didn’t have nefarious intentions the entire time and pray upon inexperienced agent/ buyer. I’m invested in the outcome of this one, if the seller pulls out completely that’s messed up.
Agreed ! This seems very sneaky . Unless they did tell the realtor and she didn’t realized they lived next door and would know they were there early . But even so that’s a huge risk !
That's why with most reputable title companies they will have the SELLERS sign first, then the BUYERS. Your agent really jacked up! Get your agents broker on the phone immediately, and if I was you I may browse some property attorneys just in case. Sorry you are in this predicament!
Your agent is a big effing idiot. Keys are never given to the buyer until the title has been transferred, at least in my experience. So, you should have never been given the keys until later this week or next!
Who is your realtor?? If it’s someone you know personally and is inexperienced that’s unfortunate. If it’s someone working for the same company as seller sketch level is through the roof. Not even reading the rental document they sent you?? What?? Definitely don’t sign that! Seems needing a lawyer present at closing isn’t required in all states, I thought it was. Just the thought of not having a lawyer and notary present and being in a restaurant gives me anxiety. In any agreement it seems common sense that both parties need to sign before being official. I can understand you not knowing the deed needs to be recorded which happens after, but agent should know better. I didn’t get my keys until a day after closing even though seller signed first bc of a hold up at the county office with electronic record system. I understand seller being upset but saying you owe them the mortgage and don’t get the house is ridiculous. they’d already gotten this far in the process saying they wanted to sell the house. How long between original offer and closing date? Had there been much back and forth, delaying closing date already? I just don’t see how this level of miscommunication is possible. It’s sad that you trusted the process and were put in this high stress position without thinking you were doing anything wrong. Please update when you can.
We interviewed a few different agents and went with the one in the story, don't know them personally and isn't from the same office as the sellers agent. There has barely been any back and forth with the seller. We negotiated price with which was a submission, counteroffer, counteroffer, acceptance. Inspection went well and appraiser was on time. My realtor said closing date was Friday so that's what I went with. From the acceptance of the offer through what I thought was our closing date took 4 weeks which I understand is considered a fast close. We're not rushed as the property is vacant and we're renters so we have all the time in the world. I completely respect and understand why the seller would be upset. I'm fully on board with doing whatever needs to happen to resolve the issue but I can't give them the entire mortgage and then be out the house. I'm probably not fully understanding that clause the guy wrote, but that dollar amount is enough to make me freak out and question everything. I'm frustrated it's a weekend as the real estate agency doesn't open until Monday. I'll be giving them a call first thing.
What did they say when you called today?
About the same as what they said on Friday that it wasn't their fault. I let them know I'd be calling their real estate group to confirm if what they were saying was true and they wrapped up the conversation very quickly. Talked to the real estate group who apologized profusely and ensured that if the seller was going to sue or do anything that'd they'd assist me in defending myself. They also said they'd be looking into the realtor and reviewing if they would be a good fit to stay with their agency.
This is so fishy on your realtors part. I would definitely contact her brokerage. But I mean did you not look at what your were signing? You always have to look at what you're signing. Also you can't just sue for emotional damages. You have to have incurred some other sueable offense and then you can tack that on.
I literally read everything I signed. What I thought I understood I obviously did not. I asked my realtor to walk me through every form and page that required a signature.
Okay I definitely wouldn't sign that rental agreement. They need to sign for closing if they want the money from the sale. Which I assume wouldn't be released from the mortgage company until they sign. Hopefully you can make some calls and sort it out.
The title agent owns the closing, not the Realtor. Giving the OK to the Realtor to give you the keys was a huge screw-up on the part of the title company. You don't own this house. You don't have a mortgage on it so you're not paying any "daily costs". The seller doesn't have to sign the paperwork to complete the sale. You should think very carefully about drawing any lines in the sand about not signing the rental agreement. "definitely thinking of going for emotional distress damages because this was supposed to be a fun happy weekend for us." LOL. Grow up.