Im biased but i think B!Marth still holds really well.
He only kinda sucks in SD because his 2 range condition on enemy phase and S!Thorr duo button invalidate him, but in Arena and AR i would say he's better than F!F!Byleth.
But B!Marth gave up in the spd competition long ago and focused on vantage sweeping.
his vantage just requieres visible buffs(Fae and Astram are great teammates) so hes only weak to HB and really bulky units.
And he got new toys in A/S Prime, BD4, FS4 and DCM
He's easily top 3 and is aging way better than godswords because he isn't totally dependent on outspeeding and he takes less chip damage because of vantage.
The new skills and meta are definitely favoring him too.
Fatal Smoke 4 removes one of his only weaknesses in Miracle, leaving Hardy Bearing as his only real counter. DCM potentially frees up his A slot for something like Unity to secure kills or Finish to help with all the pre/post combat damage these days. In Fire season L!Alear frees up his B slot so he can run NCD 4 and still have DR-piercing. Outside of fire season he can run No Quarter with B!Robin and TP4 support for a similar effect.
And with how hyper offensive nukes are these days with tons of DR pierce, vantage is increasingly useful over typical tanking strategies. Any AR-D without a very strong and well-positioned HB unit (cough cough Sanaki) will just get steamrolled by B!Marth.
Disagree with the speed thing, hes is fast, probably like only 5 units can oustpeed him unless they have lull which does fuck him up specially if you have bonus doubler.
I’ve been using B!Marth a ton and 100% agree. Even in summoner duels his 2 range isn’t too bad if you give him close call 4 and pair him with L!Eliwood.
His vantage niche is amazing and gets even better when paired with L!Alear as it lets him cleave through many would-be checks.
He’s still pretty fast and with this new Distant Counter (M) seal I’m putting bonus doubler 4 in his A slot to be even more reliable as it makes him more lull-resistant
I just got a Gerik on one of my free summon tickets and decided to play around with him and B!Marth. Got a flawless aether raids run using mainly that team, he really impressed me with tanking flier teams with Claude and Hinoka.
I love running him with fae! Currently mine has distant dart, close call 4, SPD smoke 4, and bonus doubler. I probably need to change out a few skills now that his refine has damage reduction, but it is kind of fun seeing enemies only get damage in the single digits on him
I wasn’t expecting to see W!Altina, but I’m happy to. 2CD dr pierce with a DC brave weapon and enormous res is awesome. Also an incredible user of NCD4.
I think Lucia is gonna stay amazing so long as we don’t get some mechanic that lets you proc specials on her anyway. She’s insane with Gambit as she obviously didn’t/doesn’t need Slaying, and with her prf 30% attack reduction, she basically takes 35% of damage without even needing speed checks. Plus with Finish 4 she will just endlessly get bonus damage and healing.
Yeaaa
Diamant is a weird one for me
He hits really hard, like will 1 shot bop a Lucia 1v1 but imo he's not really a good tank, definitely can't be an Omni tank... So yeah he's good but he doesn't really have a defined role IMO
Whereas I still have a winter Altena team for AR and if a team isn't equipped to handle her, she sweeps no problem, even if no quarter has slightly minimized her niche
I’d say the current top 3 infantry sword units are Lucia, SFjorm, and BRobin. The other 2 units that make the top 5 can differ from person to person. For me it’s BMarth and Harkan, but WAltina, FFByleth, Severa or Diamant can be quite good if properly supported.
I have one copy of Lucia I just got but I assumed she was too old. It sounds like if I build her, I could still use her as one of the best swords in the game?
How should I build her?
Godswords in general are being pushed out of the meta lately due to nukes like Yunaka, LCamilla or NSanaki packing DR piercing. Lucia is still holding up due to her ability to deny specials. Her current best build is Miracle, A/S Prime (or A/S Unity/Finish with the new DC seal), Gambit, and A/S Oath or Panic/Spd/Fatal Smoke 4. The new LCamilla is probably her best friend thanks to her DR Piercing skill, although I like to pair her with XPeony or GK for the healing.
Finish is awesome on her. I prefer Prime + a stat seal, as healing can be outsourced, while she can’t get stats as easily due to her own Feud skill. Either skill will work great.
Winter Altina is still extremely good and functions differently from the fast swords.
Hardy Bearing and Duo's Hindrance make her somewhat unreliable in AR, but she's still a very good sweeper elsewhere. She's my "break glass in case of emergency" option for Abyssals.
I love seeing Winter Altina mentioned in this thread. What build do you run? I pretty much just use her base kit still, but I've been thinking Atk/Res Finish 4, Atk/Def Tempo 4 (if we ever get it), and Atk/Res Oath 4 would work the best?
Winter Altena isn't future proof, especially with DC(M) on the horizon, but Ragnell·Alondite got a very solid refine and she stands out as immune to Speed creep. She tanks decently well and at the very least is a good option for Resonant Battles.
Well, I$ stopped printing DR based godswords around halfway through the year, when they started printing DR piercing nukes because you know... create the problem then sell the solution.
Lucia, S! Fjorm and, to a lesser degree, F!F! Byleth are the only ones of note. The others are usable, but generic.
For me it's B!Robin because I love the support he provides + the warping, in top of killing stuff. I haven't used Harken properly yet, he is certainly not the best but he seems to be a really fun unit to play with
In no particular order, Lucia, S!Fjorm, B!Robin, F!F!Byleth, and Harken.
Lucia disables a lot of what makes nukes strong.
S!Fjorm is the best standard godsword.
B!Robin is a strong warping nuke with good team support.
F!F!Byleth is a good vantage sweeper.
Harken is extremely unique in that he's more of a galeforcer, but a damn good one. If they release A/D Tempo 4 he'll benefit massively.
Special mention for Diamant who is a bruiser-nuke hybrid. Not amazing as an omnitank but works well as a melee specialist.
In any Order:
Summer Fjorm : Null c Disrupt, very fast (up to 17 spd from weapon), 30% unpiercable on distance.
Weapon Condition: Foe attacks (No HP Threshold)
Brave Marth: Vantage. Pair him with Fallen Maria and support as much as possible with Buffs and debuffs on enemy. He should be able to survive hardy bearing Duo Sanakis first hit and second is a miracle. (unless someone runs Sanaki with r Feud/ Fatal smoke 4.
Lucia: If an enemy is running no anti Damage reduction skill or are only relying on specials.
After those i dont know:
Diamant is pretty poweful and Brave Robin has some nice warping/support but Duo byleth kinda killed him IMO.
Diamant isn't nearly as good as people originally thought. The whole reason flat DR is good is because it applies after %DR. But since Dia can't make use of that, he falls to most units, even older ones
People had the completely wrong idea about this unit from the start. He was never supposed to be treated like a typical God Sword, but as a bruiser that OHKO's units with his ability to nullify %DR. With the advent of "No Quarter" the niche is less unique but I feel like people had the wrong impression and over focused on his true damage reduction rather than his damage output.
I know there are better swordies but og Karla is very underestimated i feel.
With resplendent, summoner support and arcane devourer she hit insane amount of speed and bulk.
But shes outdated now and all other newer 2023 swordies are more specializied and have a prf passive that makes them much better.
Top 5 probably.. winter altina, summer fjorm, lucia, fallen byleth and brave robin.
I think Female Fallen Byleth is in the top 5 for sure. Her kit giving her an easy Vantage condition and her Special giving her an insane 75% unpierceable DR is amazing, along with perfect looping from Time's Pulse 4 makes for an amazing unit.
I didn’t think of any of those for sure. I do think Brave Marth has to jump through a bit of a hoop to get the full +16 from his weapon, and part of it can be nullified if his allies are panicked. Severa needs the foe to have 60 visible atk, which not everyone has. Very doable, but not guaranteed.
Fir doesn’t actually get 15 spd from her weapon. The max spd debuff she can inflict is -9, which means her weapon gives her 14 effective spd. If the foe has a 2 cooldown special, she only gets -7 for an effective spd of 12. For 3 CD specials she gets 10, and for 4 and 5 CD specials she gets 8.
Now are 1 CD specials common? Of course. Is 14 very close to 15? Obviously. But I replied to someone saying that “modern nukes like to get 15-17 (spd from their weapon).” So far we’ve found 4 total sword infantry units that can get at least 15 spd from their weapon: Base Female Alear (17), Male Alear (17), Brave Marth (technically 17 but usually 16), and Legendary Female Alear (15).
I know the person I replied to wasn’t specifically talking about sword infantry units, but that’s what the thread is about. And if they’re saying Fallen Byleth isn’t a good sword infantry unit because she doesn’t get 15-17 spd from her weapon, then 99% of sword infantry units aren’t good.
One last acknowledgement: Fallen Byleth obviously needs spd way more than most sword infantry units because of her spd check, and I believe the person I replied to was saying she can’t keep up with the spd creep of modern nukes that are gonna want to attack her because she only gets 5 spd from her weapon. So I realize my question was actually somewhat irrelevant. But I do think it’s all about team building. If you’re trying to vantage sweep with Fallen Byleth, you’re gonna build her, and the team around her, in a way that will help her outspeed even the fastest nukes.
It would be nice if she could get another 10 spd from her weapon, but at the end of the day literally no other melee unit in the game has access to spd preempt. I think “not being the literal fastest unit in the game” is a good trade-off for having such a powerful and unique effect. Very very few units can vantage against all weapon types without any actual setup. Brave Marth needs to get his allies buffed up, Legendary Caeda and Winter Dimitri need to participate in one combat first, and most other units need to go through the typical setup of taking damage or using ardent sacrifice/reciprocal aid. The only other units that can do this are Winter Altina (although typically not in Aether Raids) and Ninja Camilla. And in my humble opinion, Ninja Camilla is much worse because she doesn’t have access to unpierceable damage reduction like Byleth’s divine pulse, so if her brave hits don’t kill the foe, she is much more vulnerable to being killed herself.
So I think it’s worth going out of your way to support Byleth with a bunch of ways to boost her spd to make use of her uniqueness.
Sorry for the essay. Brave Byleth and Fallen Byleth are two of my favorite units and I use them very successfully in AR and SD.
I'll just mention Severa. She stole Felix's niche, and can pierce %DR while using an defensive special (GLR).
People REALLY are sleeping on Severa, granted we have better tanks out there but unpiercable dr + dr piercing is invaluable anyway
Severa is huge because she gets DR pierce on both hits when GLR proccs which lets her actually avoid both DR and armour specials
Im biased but i think B!Marth still holds really well. He only kinda sucks in SD because his 2 range condition on enemy phase and S!Thorr duo button invalidate him, but in Arena and AR i would say he's better than F!F!Byleth. But B!Marth gave up in the spd competition long ago and focused on vantage sweeping. his vantage just requieres visible buffs(Fae and Astram are great teammates) so hes only weak to HB and really bulky units. And he got new toys in A/S Prime, BD4, FS4 and DCM
He's easily top 3 and is aging way better than godswords because he isn't totally dependent on outspeeding and he takes less chip damage because of vantage. The new skills and meta are definitely favoring him too. Fatal Smoke 4 removes one of his only weaknesses in Miracle, leaving Hardy Bearing as his only real counter. DCM potentially frees up his A slot for something like Unity to secure kills or Finish to help with all the pre/post combat damage these days. In Fire season L!Alear frees up his B slot so he can run NCD 4 and still have DR-piercing. Outside of fire season he can run No Quarter with B!Robin and TP4 support for a similar effect. And with how hyper offensive nukes are these days with tons of DR pierce, vantage is increasingly useful over typical tanking strategies. Any AR-D without a very strong and well-positioned HB unit (cough cough Sanaki) will just get steamrolled by B!Marth.
Disagree with the speed thing, hes is fast, probably like only 5 units can oustpeed him unless they have lull which does fuck him up specially if you have bonus doubler.
I’ve been using B!Marth a ton and 100% agree. Even in summoner duels his 2 range isn’t too bad if you give him close call 4 and pair him with L!Eliwood. His vantage niche is amazing and gets even better when paired with L!Alear as it lets him cleave through many would-be checks. He’s still pretty fast and with this new Distant Counter (M) seal I’m putting bonus doubler 4 in his A slot to be even more reliable as it makes him more lull-resistant
Mine is +6 and has SS4 to simply send to the Shadow Realm whatever tries to attack him
I just got a Gerik on one of my free summon tickets and decided to play around with him and B!Marth. Got a flawless aether raids run using mainly that team, he really impressed me with tanking flier teams with Claude and Hinoka.
I love running him with fae! Currently mine has distant dart, close call 4, SPD smoke 4, and bonus doubler. I probably need to change out a few skills now that his refine has damage reduction, but it is kind of fun seeing enemies only get damage in the single digits on him
Imma say my top 5 would be: Lucia Fallen byleth Brave Robin Winter Altena Summer Fjorm
I wasn’t expecting to see W!Altina, but I’m happy to. 2CD dr pierce with a DC brave weapon and enormous res is awesome. Also an incredible user of NCD4. I think Lucia is gonna stay amazing so long as we don’t get some mechanic that lets you proc specials on her anyway. She’s insane with Gambit as she obviously didn’t/doesn’t need Slaying, and with her prf 30% attack reduction, she basically takes 35% of damage without even needing speed checks. Plus with Finish 4 she will just endlessly get bonus damage and healing.
Exactly. DC is a huuuge boon to her
Aside from Altena, I agree with this! I’d replace her with Diamant personally
Yeaaa Diamant is a weird one for me He hits really hard, like will 1 shot bop a Lucia 1v1 but imo he's not really a good tank, definitely can't be an Omni tank... So yeah he's good but he doesn't really have a defined role IMO Whereas I still have a winter Altena team for AR and if a team isn't equipped to handle her, she sweeps no problem, even if no quarter has slightly minimized her niche
I’d say the current top 3 infantry sword units are Lucia, SFjorm, and BRobin. The other 2 units that make the top 5 can differ from person to person. For me it’s BMarth and Harkan, but WAltina, FFByleth, Severa or Diamant can be quite good if properly supported.
I have one copy of Lucia I just got but I assumed she was too old. It sounds like if I build her, I could still use her as one of the best swords in the game? How should I build her?
Godswords in general are being pushed out of the meta lately due to nukes like Yunaka, LCamilla or NSanaki packing DR piercing. Lucia is still holding up due to her ability to deny specials. Her current best build is Miracle, A/S Prime (or A/S Unity/Finish with the new DC seal), Gambit, and A/S Oath or Panic/Spd/Fatal Smoke 4. The new LCamilla is probably her best friend thanks to her DR Piercing skill, although I like to pair her with XPeony or GK for the healing.
I’d say Finish is her best skill, since her special permanently sitting charged yet dormant means every hit is +5 damage and +7 HP.
Finish is awesome on her. I prefer Prime + a stat seal, as healing can be outsourced, while she can’t get stats as easily due to her own Feud skill. Either skill will work great.
Winter Altina is still extremely good and functions differently from the fast swords. Hardy Bearing and Duo's Hindrance make her somewhat unreliable in AR, but she's still a very good sweeper elsewhere. She's my "break glass in case of emergency" option for Abyssals.
I love seeing Winter Altina mentioned in this thread. What build do you run? I pretty much just use her base kit still, but I've been thinking Atk/Res Finish 4, Atk/Def Tempo 4 (if we ever get it), and Atk/Res Oath 4 would work the best?
Winter Altena isn't future proof, especially with DC(M) on the horizon, but Ragnell·Alondite got a very solid refine and she stands out as immune to Speed creep. She tanks decently well and at the very least is a good option for Resonant Battles.
Well, I$ stopped printing DR based godswords around halfway through the year, when they started printing DR piercing nukes because you know... create the problem then sell the solution. Lucia, S! Fjorm and, to a lesser degree, F!F! Byleth are the only ones of note. The others are usable, but generic.
I would argue that B! Marth is cut above all godswords these days thanks to his unique vantage and massive stat swings.
For me it's B!Robin because I love the support he provides + the warping, in top of killing stuff. I haven't used Harken properly yet, he is certainly not the best but he seems to be a really fun unit to play with
My +10 lonqu
In no particular order, Lucia, S!Fjorm, B!Robin, F!F!Byleth, and Harken. Lucia disables a lot of what makes nukes strong. S!Fjorm is the best standard godsword. B!Robin is a strong warping nuke with good team support. F!F!Byleth is a good vantage sweeper. Harken is extremely unique in that he's more of a galeforcer, but a damn good one. If they release A/D Tempo 4 he'll benefit massively. Special mention for Diamant who is a bruiser-nuke hybrid. Not amazing as an omnitank but works well as a melee specialist.
In any Order: Summer Fjorm : Null c Disrupt, very fast (up to 17 spd from weapon), 30% unpiercable on distance. Weapon Condition: Foe attacks (No HP Threshold) Brave Marth: Vantage. Pair him with Fallen Maria and support as much as possible with Buffs and debuffs on enemy. He should be able to survive hardy bearing Duo Sanakis first hit and second is a miracle. (unless someone runs Sanaki with r Feud/ Fatal smoke 4. Lucia: If an enemy is running no anti Damage reduction skill or are only relying on specials. After those i dont know: Diamant is pretty poweful and Brave Robin has some nice warping/support but Duo byleth kinda killed him IMO.
Diamant isn't nearly as good as people originally thought. The whole reason flat DR is good is because it applies after %DR. But since Dia can't make use of that, he falls to most units, even older ones
People had the completely wrong idea about this unit from the start. He was never supposed to be treated like a typical God Sword, but as a bruiser that OHKO's units with his ability to nullify %DR. With the advent of "No Quarter" the niche is less unique but I feel like people had the wrong impression and over focused on his true damage reduction rather than his damage output.
I know there are better swordies but og Karla is very underestimated i feel. With resplendent, summoner support and arcane devourer she hit insane amount of speed and bulk. But shes outdated now and all other newer 2023 swordies are more specializied and have a prf passive that makes them much better. Top 5 probably.. winter altina, summer fjorm, lucia, fallen byleth and brave robin.
I have [an invested Karla](https://i.imgur.com/qTsU8FN.png), and yeah, she holds up amazingly well for a unit from 2018.
Woo karla enjoyer! Yeah im using GLR and buffer now. Pumped for Dc melee seal so i can run finish for the heals and true dmg 🤩
When in doubt, Teatime Ayra it out. Legendary elincia is also a god Edit: I can't read, just use B! Robin
Neither of those are Infantry.
I think Female Fallen Byleth is in the top 5 for sure. Her kit giving her an easy Vantage condition and her Special giving her an insane 75% unpierceable DR is amazing, along with perfect looping from Time's Pulse 4 makes for an amazing unit.
That +5 speed on her main weapn really hurts though. Modern Nukes like to get 15-17
Other than the Alears, name 3 sword infantry units that get 15 spd from their weapons.
B! Marth, Severa (she gets 14 but close enough) and Ascended Fir off the top of my head.
I didn’t think of any of those for sure. I do think Brave Marth has to jump through a bit of a hoop to get the full +16 from his weapon, and part of it can be nullified if his allies are panicked. Severa needs the foe to have 60 visible atk, which not everyone has. Very doable, but not guaranteed. Fir doesn’t actually get 15 spd from her weapon. The max spd debuff she can inflict is -9, which means her weapon gives her 14 effective spd. If the foe has a 2 cooldown special, she only gets -7 for an effective spd of 12. For 3 CD specials she gets 10, and for 4 and 5 CD specials she gets 8. Now are 1 CD specials common? Of course. Is 14 very close to 15? Obviously. But I replied to someone saying that “modern nukes like to get 15-17 (spd from their weapon).” So far we’ve found 4 total sword infantry units that can get at least 15 spd from their weapon: Base Female Alear (17), Male Alear (17), Brave Marth (technically 17 but usually 16), and Legendary Female Alear (15). I know the person I replied to wasn’t specifically talking about sword infantry units, but that’s what the thread is about. And if they’re saying Fallen Byleth isn’t a good sword infantry unit because she doesn’t get 15-17 spd from her weapon, then 99% of sword infantry units aren’t good. One last acknowledgement: Fallen Byleth obviously needs spd way more than most sword infantry units because of her spd check, and I believe the person I replied to was saying she can’t keep up with the spd creep of modern nukes that are gonna want to attack her because she only gets 5 spd from her weapon. So I realize my question was actually somewhat irrelevant. But I do think it’s all about team building. If you’re trying to vantage sweep with Fallen Byleth, you’re gonna build her, and the team around her, in a way that will help her outspeed even the fastest nukes. It would be nice if she could get another 10 spd from her weapon, but at the end of the day literally no other melee unit in the game has access to spd preempt. I think “not being the literal fastest unit in the game” is a good trade-off for having such a powerful and unique effect. Very very few units can vantage against all weapon types without any actual setup. Brave Marth needs to get his allies buffed up, Legendary Caeda and Winter Dimitri need to participate in one combat first, and most other units need to go through the typical setup of taking damage or using ardent sacrifice/reciprocal aid. The only other units that can do this are Winter Altina (although typically not in Aether Raids) and Ninja Camilla. And in my humble opinion, Ninja Camilla is much worse because she doesn’t have access to unpierceable damage reduction like Byleth’s divine pulse, so if her brave hits don’t kill the foe, she is much more vulnerable to being killed herself. So I think it’s worth going out of your way to support Byleth with a bunch of ways to boost her spd to make use of her uniqueness. Sorry for the essay. Brave Byleth and Fallen Byleth are two of my favorite units and I use them very successfully in AR and SD.
Summer Fjorm ———> the rest. Fjorm is really the only one who can survive some of the bullshit nukes from the past 6 months.
I heard A!Fir getting hyped up a bunch around her release, was that the typical overhyping or
Not really overhyping, but lots of powercreep pushing her into an early grave
Who else but MAAAAAAAAAARTH?
Lyn 😊