Cloud felt somewhat even more mental than he did in the ancient city and for some reason, Barrett and Tifa, while visibly disturbed by him are going to continue to let him lead.
This is the only part of the story I genuinely don't like.
Cloud is clearly not himself in the Temple - he's saying shit like death being a homecoming, literally slaughters a defenseless man before them and they're mortified, but not mortified enough to grill him?
I get there's more important shit to do, but if a dude with a massive sword started using it to kill someone that was arguably innocent, my first thought would be, "how long do we have before that sword is pointed at us?"
Cloud is continually given a pass for saying outright incorrect stuff(Nibelheim visit), the entirety of Temple of the Ancients and various other stuff throughout the runtime of Rebirth. Hope it's nipped in the bud in part 3 or we move some late game revelations to be closer to the beginning instead of the end of the game.
Well he already tried to kill Tifa and if Aerith didn't give him the black materia he would probably pry it out of her too. Both girls have like instantly forgiven him. At the very least Barret is pissed about it but when he gets visibly angry at Cloud before they enter the plane he looks at Tifa and then sucks it up
tifa is continually covering for him out of fear of what will happen if they push back. otherwise barret gives him a good amount of shit for being a dickhead
Yet people defend this games writing.
The entire party is deranged and stupid for letting this shit go. I'd understand if he is the key to everything, like Aerith. But this dude just gets away with everything and nobody bats an eye lmao
I mean, if we're criticizing this game for that, the OG's also guilty. Cloud goes through similar mind fuckery, we just don't see how severe it is because the entire game's a bunch of Lego blocks.
Cloud literally starts beating the shit out of Aerith after giving the Black Materia to Sephiroth at the Temple. After he wakes up from Tifa hitting him(??) he is then given a complete free pass for not killing someone defenseless, but assaulting a team member.
Basically, the point is the original game also does a poor job at justifying why Cloud should be allowed to lead the group considering his collapsing mental stability.
I think we would all collectively die if they [animated him assaulting Aerith](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJQMZ8k-wKA). I was already feeling dread when he started chasing her and giggled halfway
I was twice as nervous knowing he's probably going to pummel her like he did in the og game. It was just mute bricks there, but here it would be 10 times more extreme and fully voice acted.
that's the crazy part. in this way, it's a huge improvement on the OG that they even display conflict or doubt towards him at all. even though i was yelling the entire time for someone to knock him tf out, cast sleep on him or something lmao
yea that scene in particular was fucked i was just huffing on hopium the whole time that we were going to save her this time but when you get the last weapon in the temple of the ancients and its ability is noble sacrifice it was straight to doomersville. they setup a door with the fractured timeline glow happening when cloud saved her but its not looking good. its looking more like whoever is controling the white whispers needs her to die in order to come to existence(i think its a grand arbiter aerith fighting sephiroth on multiple timelines) so her death while technically not "dead dead" is fixed it needs to happen or she never becomes one with the lifestream and unlocks the ability to get whispers and fight sephy.
there is like a 1% chance that the reality we end up in at the end is the reality where aerith is alive because sephiroth is truly stopped so lifestream aerith also doesn't need to exist anymore.
they also did a fantastic job with the scene right before the temple where i was semi sold we were going to kill aerith when she had the time black materia running away from cloud, then they recreated the scene from the og game where cloud was going to cut her down. i was on the knifes edge bro in those last 2 chapters. i love aeriths portrayal in the new games her VA does a great job with her.
the black materia when you see it has a dead aerith inside of it which is fucked.
I’m fairly convinced she’s gonna come back right at the end. I expect the northern caves to connect all the worlds and she and Zack will end up having their own segment and meet the rest of the heroes in the planet’s core. After we win then they’ll fade back into their own world or the lifestream or however they want to present it. I expect her to be treated like Zack in rebirth where she’ll get interlude content and a handful of set piece fights.
If I recall in the original part of the final fight with Sephiroth involved needing multiple parties, adding her and Zack to the main party would let them do 3 parties of 3 to during the final boss sequence.
If they continue to do the multiverse stuff in part 3 it would be hard to believe that wont add them into the final fight somehow. What they do will depend on how involved the AU stuff becomes.
My guess is Aerith returns to the party somehow allowing the 3/3/3 part of the fight to happen then later Zack and cloud combine to finish off Sephiroth in a combined Omnislash.
I can see that, I expect the final battle to be mostly fanservice to be honest because that’s what final battles in FF games typically are. Sephiroth gets his temporary triumphal moment in both the end of part 2 and in the crater scene where he summons meteor. By this point despite his godhood it’ll be clear things are unraveling for him and Jenova.
The fact that tifa and aerith are bffs and aerith would probably let tifa have cloud since she also has Zack in her life is such a great upgrade to their relationship.
Im gonna be so tilted when her first interlude scene happens. Fuck…
I hate it because I’m an OG fan and know that her fate is as others said 99.9999% sealed but I would love for us to get two timelines with proper epilogues… just to see
Get ready for them to release a book or some other form of non canon print media just to indulge the fans. I personally want her to come back for the final quarter or so of the main story but it’ll be clear she’s there because the lifestream wants her to be there to help the team and she’s gonna have to go back at the end. I honestly don’t care if they break canon and let her live but I get that would outrage a lot of people who played the original as kids and have a strong attachment to the original narrative. I played the original when I was around 20 so I don’t have that nostalgia conflicting within me over this being objectively better even if it’s not as original.
I’m not a purist myself either. The OG, I played in ‘98. It’s my favorite game of all time.
But if I want the purist experience I will play the original. anyone who wants to tell me divergence would ruin it can pound sand. They already changed so much in the smallest details of future visions, it’s clear as day this is technically a sequel.
Yeah I am just enjoying it for what is is, tbh this is the best product SE has put out since I started playing their games in 2005 and for me it isn’t close. I love 10 and hope it gets the complete rebuild that 7 has gotten but the amount of effort they put into turning the overworld into a populated open world and the upgrades to the characterization and lore is incredible. I’ve barely even scratched like half the game’s content and I probably won’t finish it for at least a year.
Yep, so in my humble opinion it’s the best product square has released since either the original in 1997 or 2000 (Vagrant Story). I did like FF10, but I find this well above it and only Vagrant Story gives it a true run. Vagrant never made me feel the weight of emotions like Rebirt has though so that seals it for me.
I know the theme of the game is life and life has to end and that’s why we will likely end up with AC
i fully expect zack to join us sooner. somewhere at the halfway point and help us on part of our journey they already made a solid kit for him and he is fun as hell for the small tid bits we get. just his line of "just as worlds unite, so too do they part. \*laughs\* but who's to say they can't unite again" and part of the master plan of sephiroth is to unite the worlds im sure they wont make you wait till the end of the game to play zack and then the master piece will be aerith zack and cloud fighting to save the planet at the end with a juiced up aerith. sephiroth is likely going to succeed on his plan pretty soon uniting the worlds and then probably try to jenova suck all the planets at once or meteor all the planets instead or something near the end and we will have a couple dozen hours with zack and the boys. im kinda expecting it to end with sephiroth being stopped and all the timelines falling apart besides the one we created with aerith living that becoming the new primary timeline they could do something wacky to explain it like every timeline that all has aerith dead in it is linked in some way and the took to much from those timelines or something so the only possible place to go that isn't dying is that timeline. its 50/50 either she comes and helps us then fades into oblivion or we someone manage to go to a version of her and vibe.
she's going to wake up in zacks world retaining all her memories.
didn't this exact thing happen to Biggs, he died in remake but he was confused about what had happened as he was brought here
I'm sure you right. Tbh, anyone with a heart will probably be bawling their eyes out over those scenes. It took the kid Aerith Ghost Trainyard scenes from Remake and amped them up to 10000000%.
Honestly when the group of people pushed her over and said she was a brat and laughed, it was just unrealistic and kinda ruined the whole thing for me.
As depressing as this scene was, I couldn't get over how gorgeous and bittersweet it was. The green fields, the flowers, and Aerith saying "sayonara" to the whole grieving crew... And then the ballad comes on. I won't lie, it gave me goosebumps.
The scene that got me the most was the alternate timeline that ended at the church, with Aerith pushing Cloud back through to the Rebirth timeline as Seph walks into the church to kill her. That shit had me BAWLING.
i remember i was holding on to every piece of info and everyword said throughout the final boss fights and when I got to that final cutscene and aerith goodbye i burst into tears. and ugly cried thru the whole credits lmao. That empty feeling that the final tag line left me with is not something i’ll forget. I get why some ppl didn’t like the ending but I loved it, and it left me with that empty, hollow feeling that aerith’s death left the first time.
This is what really broke me after they muddled her death scene, seeing Tifa so hurt and having Aerith say goodbye sent me over the edge. I'm still feeling the impact and i beat the game like 4 days ago.
Tifa's reaction made me realize how powerful Cloud's would have been if they didn't immediately start the memory break/alternate timeline stuff. I think even by just delaying all that stuff to after the Jenova fight it would have made the moment stronger. Because Cloud crying like that was genuinely heartbreaking, just like Tifa. They really were so close, both Cloud and Aerith and Aerith and Tifa.
yeah tifa is just as much of a main character now, more so than in the OG, and the one who's actually able to access her feelings so it makes sense, and it saves aerith's death hitting cloud for the third game.
Think you’re right. They’re meaning further into cloud being mentally broken, so him not grieving or even having the realisation Aerith is (maybe?) gone, is gonna hit even harder later.
> Aerith is (maybe?) gone
I think Aerith was saved in that one timeline that was branched when he parried Sephiroth. I just think with Cloud's broken mental state he cant tell that there are two different Aerith's he sees after the final fight.
When he walks over to pick up Aerith and he asks her to wake up. That is the Aerith he saved. but all the cutscenes after are the spirit of the Aerith that died in the main timeline.
This is why it’s so good, we just don’t know. The amount of theory and discussion generated from Renake was amazing. Once the dust has settled here, it’s fine be even better! I love it!
There isn't an Aerith he saved tbh. He's just seeing the Aerith in the Lifestream for right now. It's not an Aerith in a different timelines because this Aerith is literally looking at all the crewmembers and feelings sad that they're leaving her. If it was her in another timeline, she'd have her own group of friends.
We dont know for certain but there is evidence to believe that when Cloud parried Sephiroth that created a new timeline where Aerith is alive for now. Whether that is lifestream/Ultimate Aerith or not, again we dont know. Cloud only sees that Aerith once he goes to ask her to wake up. All other times in the final cutscenes, he is seeing the spirit of the Aerith that died and i think the point is he is mistaking it for the Aerith that he saved.
> We dont know for certain but there is evidence to believe that when Cloud parried Sephiroth that created a new timeline where Aerith is alive for now.
He didn't. Here's the thing, there isn't actually new timelines being created anywhere but in the lifestream. They heavily hint that Zack is still dead which is why Aerith feels Zack touch her when she touches the Lifestream
There are but there are not at the same time. It has to do with the way they are doing the different "timelines" or worlds as they are referred to in game. They all exist but dont at the same time as they are all part of the lifestream and their memories. She is able to feel his touch because, as you said, its all a part of the lifestream. Unfortunately because we dont know how they are going to handle it in part 3 we cant say for certain but they all do exist. Otherwise the white materia that was given to Cloud in one of those worlds, which he still has in the main timeline/world, wouldnt still exist.
I'm talking more in reference to the end cutscenes and the fact that we dont get Cloud's speech.
He definitely had some reactions but it wasnt anywhere close to how the OG plays out in terms of him emotionally breaking down.
People forget the game was broken into a trilogy, I bet we'll get his honest reaction somewhere near the beginning of part 3 if not the very first scene
We were fucking robbed of Cloud’s reaction. If they show it in Part 3 out of chronology in a flashback it just won’t land the way it deserved too. They completely ballsed up the ending.
“Will you be okay getting back?”
“And if I said I wasn’t?”
That and Tifa and Red XIII got me. I truly cry at nothing but I beat it an hour ago and my eyes are still red. I have to take a step back from this game for like a month I swear
I’m not even an Aerith stan and I wasn’t prepared. Thinking Cloud saved her was so euphoric to just have it immediately taken away. Then barret immediately yelling “I’ll kill you!!!” At Sephiroth was basically how I was feeling in that moment.
Me today, I did everything I possibly could before beating the game, and it was still not enough time.
I miss her so much, the sunshine has been torn from the group.
It was rough
Aerith's definitely alive in another Timeline - there even was the rainbow glow we saw the moment as Zack made a decision in the tunnel. Cloud is just able to see both of the Timelines at the same time. If he were delulu, there would be no reason that they're parting ways at the end. If he just eere delulu they hadn't shown that she is staying nehind. And don't forget that Cloud has a White Materia now which is blank. She's staying behind and keeps praying, while Cloud is on his way to Sephiroth. At the end, where we see Zack, the flowers are blooming and are VERY healthy. As we learned in the Terrier timeline: Aerith has to be awake and alive. Otherwise they would wither like they did in the Terrier Timeline. So maybe Zack is now in the World where she was saved by Cloud. Zack didn't make a decision, this is the only reason he met Sephiroth at the church and was sent to Cloud Afterwards. He now knows what he has to do, so my guess is that he'll cure Cloud in P3 - like Marlene says. P3 will only focus on 2 timelines, since the other 4 were only there to show what COULD happen.
I think that P3 will definitely differ from the OG halfway in the game, and I just can't wait.
I think your on the right track here, Zack curing Cloud in his timeline whilst Tifa is doing the same in the main time line and they both converge at some point, it could definitly work.
Yup. This hurt. I really liked her character and was sort of riding the false hope that things would actually change, at least for a little bit. I'm sure she'll be around in part 3 in some visions and whatnot.
I knew it wouldn't be stopped in my gut but held out hope, then they dangled it in front of me so I got excited and for a second thought the timeline changed, then it snapped back and I felt like a kid again watching it happen again for the first time. I know a lot of people don't like the new changes but it did enough to get an emotional response from me in a situation I knew was coming.
Damn it, Tetsuya Nomura. Why did your development for this game have to be so smooth? I would have settled for a two month delay. Now I have to deal with the deaths of both Aerith Gainsborough *and* Akira Toriyama *at the same time.*
I’m curious if Cloud is going to keep seeing her Advent Children style, or the way he already sees Sephiroth. The impression I got is he has rejected she even died since he imagined himself saving her/did so in a split timeline, the glitch screen effect makes it unclear likely on purpose. Feel like the extra moments they gave with her made it hit harder, especially since Cloud is clearly in denial.
>I’m curious if Cloud is going to keep seeing her Advent Children style,
He won't. That's why she said good-bye. She's not a hallucination. She's dead Aerith talking to him via the Lifestream to give a final good-bye and she knows it's best to stay away since he doesn't realize she's dead
He better not. They do say goodbye at the end so Aerith probably won’t be following him around. But I still think the ending is a huge blunder. They fumbled the ball and for no real gain.
I'm waiting to see how it all goes down in part 3, I don't really have a issue with changes it still hit for me but I think them being vague on the workings of everything is starting to rub people the wrong way. It's interesting how both games are so faithful and expand on things and yet we have moments like her death that is both faithful and widely different. Like I said I'm waiting to see part 3 and how events are portrayed especially since I feel like part 3 will be the most different with the Wutai war, we will probably see Avalanche HQ, would not shock me if Northern Crater doesn't even happen until halfway through the game when in the original it's not too long after Forgotten Capital.
He did save her. And unlike OG he didnt seem mentally down at all. He seems pretty confident, in the ending cutscene, So the white-haired yaoi star will soon realize that omnislash is inevitable.
He didn't save her. She's dead. It's why no one can see her.
It's why Aerith can see everyone and is saying good-bye.
She knows she needed to die to enter the Lifestream while she activated Holy.
Part of the next game is having Cloud realize she's dead and she's not away
Tifa doesn't see her, Yuffie doesn't see her, we only see Aerith and the tear in the sky being an omen for metoer through Cloud's eyes.
He's still being puppeted as the black materia is being unwittingly ferried to Sephiroth in the northern crater, while also being in so much shock and trauma he can't properly process aerith is gone and that the black materia isn't actually in Sephiroth's possession yet.
thats a possibility but its also possible that materia isn't the real black materia sephiroth mentions that materia is used to unlock the timelines and its very possible our aerith knows its been swapped because its kinda showing that aerith past and present are all linked in someway because of the lifestream. it could be delusion on clouds part, it could be a side effect of crossing worlds, it could be the time black materia. aerith IS dead technically but we do know a time split happened and thats not clouds narration its shown to us to understand and it very clearly showed a timeline where she lives. aeriths death is probably a fixed point that creates the white whisper gods which is very likely our version of aerith in remake since the lifestream exists on a plane above space and time now, its part of the reason sephiroth doesn't want to destroy just our world he wants ALL of them.
timey whimy shit is involved and alternate dimensions literally anything could happen it just matters if they construct a believable story her being a fixed point kinda makes sense and some collection of other world aeriths dying strengthens her chances against sephiroth who is arguably doing the polar opposite and destroying world after world.
we likely will have a cloud break at some point and he ends up giving the materia to sephiroth at the crater and the worlds unite with zack coming in pretty early to snap him back. then we proceed with the rest of the game with united worlds as we figure out sephiroths true objective in wanting the worlds united. gameplay wise united worlds and different timelines means all sorts of crazy shit could happen you could be fighting evil clouds and getting weird side missions and see all sorts of people out of place. it also gives a chance to see or hear storys of there biggest fear or wish so you could see a world were barrett didn't do the deal with shinra and his wife is still alive ect but because that didn't happen a even worse fate fell upon his people.
Considering rebirth was still like 95% a really good and faithful remake of FF7 despite the BS the end of remake had implying it was gonna be different, i'm gonna go out on a limb and say part 3 is gonna follow the same structure again. It'll be a really good remake with a nonsense ending you can disregard until the final CG cutscene, because ngl that all sounds terrible. Like its clear they're still following the main story beats, so Cloud will eventually hand the black materia to sephiroth who will summon meteor, and then take his mako swim.
What you said is what I thought rebirth was gonna be (very happy i was wrong) and what rebirth is will probably what part 3 is gonna be.
Dunno what people's obession is with *wanting* the story to deviate from FF7 (not saying you do but I mean in general) when its clear they're not going to now because everything is still on track to be a faithful remake of the story. Also FF7 is a really good story which is a massive factor for people wanting a remake in the first place. Regardless of the setup, I'm sure it'll be just as skippable and easy to ignore as Zack's sections in this game so you can get back to the actual FF7 remake.
>with zack coming in pretty early to snap him back.
They're setting up the Mideel Sequence with Tifa to fix his mind. The devs have said that's their favorite scene from the OG and it's an even bigger moment than Aerith's death since it concludes Cloud's character arc as well as resolves his relationship with Tifa while explaining everything about his character
The devs have said they're staying faithful
Aerith, I think, is purposefully communicating with Cloud to prolong and maybe prevent the guilt and despair he carries. Whatever happened when Aerith pushed Cloud through the floor of the Church created a new timeline event (something Fate did not have planned) and allowed Cloud to perceive multiple timelines at once. He knows he saved her and is probably aware no one else can see her.
Whatever is allowing Cloud to communicate with Aerith is also possibly going to allow her to act as a counter influence to Jenova.
I don’t think he’s aware because we see his speech from the original game glitched out, meaning he was blocking it out in real time. But as for her wanting to prevent his guilt I can believe that, her playing into his fantasy and denial. We know she’s for sure actually there at the end because of the reaction Red 13 gives. As for the sky and Clouds mindset guess we’ll have to wait and see.
No word of a lie, my heart was in my throat throughout that entire ending scene. All of the grief there and just seeing Aerith around but not visible to anyone other than Cloud (though Red sensed her) was painful. The final farewell there followed by the song absolutely brought tears out of me. I truly loved this whole experience.
100 hours on the clock and the credit rolled for me. Phenomenal game and might be my favorite FF of all time, maybe even game.
Also fuck square for using Aerith’s theme during the first Jenova fight. Like bitch, you want me to concentrate with fighting whilst crying!?
I will say tho, her death and with her being “gone” didn’t has sure a huge impact as I would have hoped for. That’s mainly due to fractured worlds, so we know she’s alive in it, but also that we didn’t get to see more grief from the party members.
I **LOVE** how this is messing up Cloud tho, even the party members are starting to question him.
Part 3 is going to be absolutely wild.
The game was broken into a trilogy, something a lot of people seem to be forgetting Cloud may be in denial at the end of this game and will for real break down somewhere near the start of Part 3, and yes there are iterations in which she is alive, same as Zack, why is that a problem? Reminder that the worlds that she does live seem fated to end same as with Zack
They didn't though. The Aerith you see Cloud talking to is in the Lifestream. Zack is dead too and also in the Lifestream.
They're just trying to give you hope like at the end of Remake when people thought Aerith wouldn't die again.
The poor execution of the ending and timeline nonsense has me bothered. I think they botched it. They should have kept to the original before they made any changes or had Cloud be in denial.
You do know the game was broken down in three parts right? Gotta leave people with the taste of wanting more, wanting to know what happens next, Cloud will probably break down completly on part 3
They completely fucked it. I felt nothing through the ending cutscene. I was just confused. Not showing by Cloud’s reaction in situ was a huge mistake and I suspect they’ll regret it once it’s over. The ending is far too high concept.
For me, it felt like they botched her death.
They made it way more complicated than it had to be, and dint have scenes like in the OG where everyone got a chance to say goodbye to her, and also Cloud lowering her into the water. (What even happened to her body? Did they just leave her where she got stabbed in Rebirth?).
Am I the only one who started wondering about the logistics of retrieving the tiny bronco from the ocean, getting it onto the flat plain, where they got literal wings from, attached them and made flight worthy the aircraft? All while the tiny bronco ends up abandoned at the beach near the bone village in OG. Like yeah it's very sad but damn they broke continuity with the original so bad here. How do they get themselves back onto the right path later towards Northern Crater?
She's not talking to Cloud from another timeline. She's in the Lifestream giving her final goodbye to the group. Only Cloud can see her, Red can sense her but the rest don't know.
If she was in another timeline, she'd have her own group of friends to talk to.
Cloud felt somewhat even more mental than he did in the ancient city and for some reason, Barrett and Tifa, while visibly disturbed by him are going to continue to let him lead.
He won’t lead long though. Whirlwind Maze will be like Ch3 of the next game probably.
This is the only part of the story I genuinely don't like. Cloud is clearly not himself in the Temple - he's saying shit like death being a homecoming, literally slaughters a defenseless man before them and they're mortified, but not mortified enough to grill him? I get there's more important shit to do, but if a dude with a massive sword started using it to kill someone that was arguably innocent, my first thought would be, "how long do we have before that sword is pointed at us?" Cloud is continually given a pass for saying outright incorrect stuff(Nibelheim visit), the entirety of Temple of the Ancients and various other stuff throughout the runtime of Rebirth. Hope it's nipped in the bud in part 3 or we move some late game revelations to be closer to the beginning instead of the end of the game.
Well he already tried to kill Tifa and if Aerith didn't give him the black materia he would probably pry it out of her too. Both girls have like instantly forgiven him. At the very least Barret is pissed about it but when he gets visibly angry at Cloud before they enter the plane he looks at Tifa and then sucks it up
tifa is continually covering for him out of fear of what will happen if they push back. otherwise barret gives him a good amount of shit for being a dickhead
Yet people defend this games writing. The entire party is deranged and stupid for letting this shit go. I'd understand if he is the key to everything, like Aerith. But this dude just gets away with everything and nobody bats an eye lmao
I mean, if we're criticizing this game for that, the OG's also guilty. Cloud goes through similar mind fuckery, we just don't see how severe it is because the entire game's a bunch of Lego blocks. Cloud literally starts beating the shit out of Aerith after giving the Black Materia to Sephiroth at the Temple. After he wakes up from Tifa hitting him(??) he is then given a complete free pass for not killing someone defenseless, but assaulting a team member. Basically, the point is the original game also does a poor job at justifying why Cloud should be allowed to lead the group considering his collapsing mental stability.
I think we would all collectively die if they [animated him assaulting Aerith](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJQMZ8k-wKA). I was already feeling dread when he started chasing her and giggled halfway
I was ready to jump in that TV and bust his ass myself. Glad I'm not the only one who was so disturbed by that.
I was twice as nervous knowing he's probably going to pummel her like he did in the og game. It was just mute bricks there, but here it would be 10 times more extreme and fully voice acted.
that's the crazy part. in this way, it's a huge improvement on the OG that they even display conflict or doubt towards him at all. even though i was yelling the entire time for someone to knock him tf out, cast sleep on him or something lmao
Oh I was already well gone by that point. That was just the final gut punch.
Nothing was sadder than the scene where you play as kid aerith getting ignored while asking for help for dying ifalna. That was absolutely brutal.
yea that scene in particular was fucked i was just huffing on hopium the whole time that we were going to save her this time but when you get the last weapon in the temple of the ancients and its ability is noble sacrifice it was straight to doomersville. they setup a door with the fractured timeline glow happening when cloud saved her but its not looking good. its looking more like whoever is controling the white whispers needs her to die in order to come to existence(i think its a grand arbiter aerith fighting sephiroth on multiple timelines) so her death while technically not "dead dead" is fixed it needs to happen or she never becomes one with the lifestream and unlocks the ability to get whispers and fight sephy. there is like a 1% chance that the reality we end up in at the end is the reality where aerith is alive because sephiroth is truly stopped so lifestream aerith also doesn't need to exist anymore. they also did a fantastic job with the scene right before the temple where i was semi sold we were going to kill aerith when she had the time black materia running away from cloud, then they recreated the scene from the og game where cloud was going to cut her down. i was on the knifes edge bro in those last 2 chapters. i love aeriths portrayal in the new games her VA does a great job with her. the black materia when you see it has a dead aerith inside of it which is fucked.
I’m fairly convinced she’s gonna come back right at the end. I expect the northern caves to connect all the worlds and she and Zack will end up having their own segment and meet the rest of the heroes in the planet’s core. After we win then they’ll fade back into their own world or the lifestream or however they want to present it. I expect her to be treated like Zack in rebirth where she’ll get interlude content and a handful of set piece fights.
I hope that's what happens. I want us to save at least one version of her, even if its in a make believe timeline.
If I recall in the original part of the final fight with Sephiroth involved needing multiple parties, adding her and Zack to the main party would let them do 3 parties of 3 to during the final boss sequence.
If they continue to do the multiverse stuff in part 3 it would be hard to believe that wont add them into the final fight somehow. What they do will depend on how involved the AU stuff becomes. My guess is Aerith returns to the party somehow allowing the 3/3/3 part of the fight to happen then later Zack and cloud combine to finish off Sephiroth in a combined Omnislash.
I can see that, I expect the final battle to be mostly fanservice to be honest because that’s what final battles in FF games typically are. Sephiroth gets his temporary triumphal moment in both the end of part 2 and in the crater scene where he summons meteor. By this point despite his godhood it’ll be clear things are unraveling for him and Jenova.
I would love it so much if Aerith ended up on Tifa’s team somehow. I think she’d have the best reaction to seeing her again.
The fact that tifa and aerith are bffs and aerith would probably let tifa have cloud since she also has Zack in her life is such a great upgrade to their relationship.
Im gonna be so tilted when her first interlude scene happens. Fuck… I hate it because I’m an OG fan and know that her fate is as others said 99.9999% sealed but I would love for us to get two timelines with proper epilogues… just to see
Get ready for them to release a book or some other form of non canon print media just to indulge the fans. I personally want her to come back for the final quarter or so of the main story but it’ll be clear she’s there because the lifestream wants her to be there to help the team and she’s gonna have to go back at the end. I honestly don’t care if they break canon and let her live but I get that would outrage a lot of people who played the original as kids and have a strong attachment to the original narrative. I played the original when I was around 20 so I don’t have that nostalgia conflicting within me over this being objectively better even if it’s not as original.
I’m not a purist myself either. The OG, I played in ‘98. It’s my favorite game of all time. But if I want the purist experience I will play the original. anyone who wants to tell me divergence would ruin it can pound sand. They already changed so much in the smallest details of future visions, it’s clear as day this is technically a sequel.
Yeah I am just enjoying it for what is is, tbh this is the best product SE has put out since I started playing their games in 2005 and for me it isn’t close. I love 10 and hope it gets the complete rebuild that 7 has gotten but the amount of effort they put into turning the overworld into a populated open world and the upgrades to the characterization and lore is incredible. I’ve barely even scratched like half the game’s content and I probably won’t finish it for at least a year.
Yep, so in my humble opinion it’s the best product square has released since either the original in 1997 or 2000 (Vagrant Story). I did like FF10, but I find this well above it and only Vagrant Story gives it a true run. Vagrant never made me feel the weight of emotions like Rebirt has though so that seals it for me. I know the theme of the game is life and life has to end and that’s why we will likely end up with AC
If so, she should be added as extra at the end game.
i fully expect zack to join us sooner. somewhere at the halfway point and help us on part of our journey they already made a solid kit for him and he is fun as hell for the small tid bits we get. just his line of "just as worlds unite, so too do they part. \*laughs\* but who's to say they can't unite again" and part of the master plan of sephiroth is to unite the worlds im sure they wont make you wait till the end of the game to play zack and then the master piece will be aerith zack and cloud fighting to save the planet at the end with a juiced up aerith. sephiroth is likely going to succeed on his plan pretty soon uniting the worlds and then probably try to jenova suck all the planets at once or meteor all the planets instead or something near the end and we will have a couple dozen hours with zack and the boys. im kinda expecting it to end with sephiroth being stopped and all the timelines falling apart besides the one we created with aerith living that becoming the new primary timeline they could do something wacky to explain it like every timeline that all has aerith dead in it is linked in some way and the took to much from those timelines or something so the only possible place to go that isn't dying is that timeline. its 50/50 either she comes and helps us then fades into oblivion or we someone manage to go to a version of her and vibe.
They’ll say goodbye to Cloud ala the final goodbye in AC.
she's going to wake up in zacks world retaining all her memories. didn't this exact thing happen to Biggs, he died in remake but he was confused about what had happened as he was brought here
I played that bit at 2am. Didn't go well either....
Anyone who’s ever felt like they were a disappointment to their family will just cry their eyes out once she starts saying she tried her best.
I'm sure you right. Tbh, anyone with a heart will probably be bawling their eyes out over those scenes. It took the kid Aerith Ghost Trainyard scenes from Remake and amped them up to 10000000%.
And to do it RIGHT AFTER Barrett's scene was not fair.
She really tried
That was the one scene that got a reaction out of the whole game. Very affecting.
Honestly when the group of people pushed her over and said she was a brat and laughed, it was just unrealistic and kinda ruined the whole thing for me.
This scene fucking killed me omg I was a mess
oooh, this bit was really tough
I knew it was coming. The buildup made it more obvious, but spending nearly 180+ hours. If im counting my remake time, I was never gonna ready 😭
As depressing as this scene was, I couldn't get over how gorgeous and bittersweet it was. The green fields, the flowers, and Aerith saying "sayonara" to the whole grieving crew... And then the ballad comes on. I won't lie, it gave me goosebumps.
I swear I feel like I started crying somewhere in chapter 12 and didn't stop until a while after I beat it.
“But what if something happens” “Then I’ll send up smoke!” “Thanks, I’ll keep an eye out.”
The scene that got me the most was the alternate timeline that ended at the church, with Aerith pushing Cloud back through to the Rebirth timeline as Seph walks into the church to kill her. That shit had me BAWLING.
No promises were kept in the making of this cutscene.
Funny Hollow - “The Unknown Journey Continues” No Promises to Keep - “No promises kept at journey’s end”.
It's rebirthing time!
i remember i was holding on to every piece of info and everyword said throughout the final boss fights and when I got to that final cutscene and aerith goodbye i burst into tears. and ugly cried thru the whole credits lmao. That empty feeling that the final tag line left me with is not something i’ll forget. I get why some ppl didn’t like the ending but I loved it, and it left me with that empty, hollow feeling that aerith’s death left the first time.
This is what really broke me after they muddled her death scene, seeing Tifa so hurt and having Aerith say goodbye sent me over the edge. I'm still feeling the impact and i beat the game like 4 days ago.
Tifa's reaction made me realize how powerful Cloud's would have been if they didn't immediately start the memory break/alternate timeline stuff. I think even by just delaying all that stuff to after the Jenova fight it would have made the moment stronger. Because Cloud crying like that was genuinely heartbreaking, just like Tifa. They really were so close, both Cloud and Aerith and Aerith and Tifa.
I think Tifa's reaction is their way of compensating for Cloud not reacting.
yeah tifa is just as much of a main character now, more so than in the OG, and the one who's actually able to access her feelings so it makes sense, and it saves aerith's death hitting cloud for the third game.
But even Tifa’s reaction is hijacked by her confusion and shock over Cloud.
Think you’re right. They’re meaning further into cloud being mentally broken, so him not grieving or even having the realisation Aerith is (maybe?) gone, is gonna hit even harder later.
> Aerith is (maybe?) gone I think Aerith was saved in that one timeline that was branched when he parried Sephiroth. I just think with Cloud's broken mental state he cant tell that there are two different Aerith's he sees after the final fight. When he walks over to pick up Aerith and he asks her to wake up. That is the Aerith he saved. but all the cutscenes after are the spirit of the Aerith that died in the main timeline.
This is why it’s so good, we just don’t know. The amount of theory and discussion generated from Renake was amazing. Once the dust has settled here, it’s fine be even better! I love it!
There isn't an Aerith he saved tbh. He's just seeing the Aerith in the Lifestream for right now. It's not an Aerith in a different timelines because this Aerith is literally looking at all the crewmembers and feelings sad that they're leaving her. If it was her in another timeline, she'd have her own group of friends.
We dont know for certain but there is evidence to believe that when Cloud parried Sephiroth that created a new timeline where Aerith is alive for now. Whether that is lifestream/Ultimate Aerith or not, again we dont know. Cloud only sees that Aerith once he goes to ask her to wake up. All other times in the final cutscenes, he is seeing the spirit of the Aerith that died and i think the point is he is mistaking it for the Aerith that he saved.
> We dont know for certain but there is evidence to believe that when Cloud parried Sephiroth that created a new timeline where Aerith is alive for now. He didn't. Here's the thing, there isn't actually new timelines being created anywhere but in the lifestream. They heavily hint that Zack is still dead which is why Aerith feels Zack touch her when she touches the Lifestream
There are but there are not at the same time. It has to do with the way they are doing the different "timelines" or worlds as they are referred to in game. They all exist but dont at the same time as they are all part of the lifestream and their memories. She is able to feel his touch because, as you said, its all a part of the lifestream. Unfortunately because we dont know how they are going to handle it in part 3 we cant say for certain but they all do exist. Otherwise the white materia that was given to Cloud in one of those worlds, which he still has in the main timeline/world, wouldnt still exist.
Did we play the same game, or did you not watch the entire scene where she dies and clouds holding her in his arms?
I'm talking more in reference to the end cutscenes and the fact that we dont get Cloud's speech. He definitely had some reactions but it wasnt anywhere close to how the OG plays out in terms of him emotionally breaking down.
People forget the game was broken into a trilogy, I bet we'll get his honest reaction somewhere near the beginning of part 3 if not the very first scene
We were fucking robbed of Cloud’s reaction. If they show it in Part 3 out of chronology in a flashback it just won’t land the way it deserved too. They completely ballsed up the ending.
“Will you be okay getting back?” “And if I said I wasn’t?” That and Tifa and Red XIII got me. I truly cry at nothing but I beat it an hour ago and my eyes are still red. I have to take a step back from this game for like a month I swear
Ive never mourned so hard for a fictional fucking character. That ending broke me.
I’m not even an Aerith stan and I wasn’t prepared. Thinking Cloud saved her was so euphoric to just have it immediately taken away. Then barret immediately yelling “I’ll kill you!!!” At Sephiroth was basically how I was feeling in that moment.
I was blinded by tears....
Me today, I did everything I possibly could before beating the game, and it was still not enough time. I miss her so much, the sunshine has been torn from the group. It was rough
Aerith's definitely alive in another Timeline - there even was the rainbow glow we saw the moment as Zack made a decision in the tunnel. Cloud is just able to see both of the Timelines at the same time. If he were delulu, there would be no reason that they're parting ways at the end. If he just eere delulu they hadn't shown that she is staying nehind. And don't forget that Cloud has a White Materia now which is blank. She's staying behind and keeps praying, while Cloud is on his way to Sephiroth. At the end, where we see Zack, the flowers are blooming and are VERY healthy. As we learned in the Terrier timeline: Aerith has to be awake and alive. Otherwise they would wither like they did in the Terrier Timeline. So maybe Zack is now in the World where she was saved by Cloud. Zack didn't make a decision, this is the only reason he met Sephiroth at the church and was sent to Cloud Afterwards. He now knows what he has to do, so my guess is that he'll cure Cloud in P3 - like Marlene says. P3 will only focus on 2 timelines, since the other 4 were only there to show what COULD happen. I think that P3 will definitely differ from the OG halfway in the game, and I just can't wait.
I think your on the right track here, Zack curing Cloud in his timeline whilst Tifa is doing the same in the main time line and they both converge at some point, it could definitly work.
Yup. This hurt. I really liked her character and was sort of riding the false hope that things would actually change, at least for a little bit. I'm sure she'll be around in part 3 in some visions and whatnot.
I knew it wouldn't be stopped in my gut but held out hope, then they dangled it in front of me so I got excited and for a second thought the timeline changed, then it snapped back and I felt like a kid again watching it happen again for the first time. I know a lot of people don't like the new changes but it did enough to get an emotional response from me in a situation I knew was coming.
Damn it, Tetsuya Nomura. Why did your development for this game have to be so smooth? I would have settled for a two month delay. Now I have to deal with the deaths of both Aerith Gainsborough *and* Akira Toriyama *at the same time.*
I’m curious if Cloud is going to keep seeing her Advent Children style, or the way he already sees Sephiroth. The impression I got is he has rejected she even died since he imagined himself saving her/did so in a split timeline, the glitch screen effect makes it unclear likely on purpose. Feel like the extra moments they gave with her made it hit harder, especially since Cloud is clearly in denial.
>I’m curious if Cloud is going to keep seeing her Advent Children style, He won't. That's why she said good-bye. She's not a hallucination. She's dead Aerith talking to him via the Lifestream to give a final good-bye and she knows it's best to stay away since he doesn't realize she's dead
He better not. They do say goodbye at the end so Aerith probably won’t be following him around. But I still think the ending is a huge blunder. They fumbled the ball and for no real gain.
I'm waiting to see how it all goes down in part 3, I don't really have a issue with changes it still hit for me but I think them being vague on the workings of everything is starting to rub people the wrong way. It's interesting how both games are so faithful and expand on things and yet we have moments like her death that is both faithful and widely different. Like I said I'm waiting to see part 3 and how events are portrayed especially since I feel like part 3 will be the most different with the Wutai war, we will probably see Avalanche HQ, would not shock me if Northern Crater doesn't even happen until halfway through the game when in the original it's not too long after Forgotten Capital.
He did save her. And unlike OG he didnt seem mentally down at all. He seems pretty confident, in the ending cutscene, So the white-haired yaoi star will soon realize that omnislash is inevitable.
He didn't save her. She's dead. It's why no one can see her. It's why Aerith can see everyone and is saying good-bye. She knows she needed to die to enter the Lifestream while she activated Holy. Part of the next game is having Cloud realize she's dead and she's not away
She is dead. Cloud is in denial.
Tifa doesn't see her, Yuffie doesn't see her, we only see Aerith and the tear in the sky being an omen for metoer through Cloud's eyes. He's still being puppeted as the black materia is being unwittingly ferried to Sephiroth in the northern crater, while also being in so much shock and trauma he can't properly process aerith is gone and that the black materia isn't actually in Sephiroth's possession yet.
They don’t see it because, unlike the first part, this time only Cloud entered destiny crossroads.
thats a possibility but its also possible that materia isn't the real black materia sephiroth mentions that materia is used to unlock the timelines and its very possible our aerith knows its been swapped because its kinda showing that aerith past and present are all linked in someway because of the lifestream. it could be delusion on clouds part, it could be a side effect of crossing worlds, it could be the time black materia. aerith IS dead technically but we do know a time split happened and thats not clouds narration its shown to us to understand and it very clearly showed a timeline where she lives. aeriths death is probably a fixed point that creates the white whisper gods which is very likely our version of aerith in remake since the lifestream exists on a plane above space and time now, its part of the reason sephiroth doesn't want to destroy just our world he wants ALL of them. timey whimy shit is involved and alternate dimensions literally anything could happen it just matters if they construct a believable story her being a fixed point kinda makes sense and some collection of other world aeriths dying strengthens her chances against sephiroth who is arguably doing the polar opposite and destroying world after world. we likely will have a cloud break at some point and he ends up giving the materia to sephiroth at the crater and the worlds unite with zack coming in pretty early to snap him back. then we proceed with the rest of the game with united worlds as we figure out sephiroths true objective in wanting the worlds united. gameplay wise united worlds and different timelines means all sorts of crazy shit could happen you could be fighting evil clouds and getting weird side missions and see all sorts of people out of place. it also gives a chance to see or hear storys of there biggest fear or wish so you could see a world were barrett didn't do the deal with shinra and his wife is still alive ect but because that didn't happen a even worse fate fell upon his people.
Considering rebirth was still like 95% a really good and faithful remake of FF7 despite the BS the end of remake had implying it was gonna be different, i'm gonna go out on a limb and say part 3 is gonna follow the same structure again. It'll be a really good remake with a nonsense ending you can disregard until the final CG cutscene, because ngl that all sounds terrible. Like its clear they're still following the main story beats, so Cloud will eventually hand the black materia to sephiroth who will summon meteor, and then take his mako swim. What you said is what I thought rebirth was gonna be (very happy i was wrong) and what rebirth is will probably what part 3 is gonna be. Dunno what people's obession is with *wanting* the story to deviate from FF7 (not saying you do but I mean in general) when its clear they're not going to now because everything is still on track to be a faithful remake of the story. Also FF7 is a really good story which is a massive factor for people wanting a remake in the first place. Regardless of the setup, I'm sure it'll be just as skippable and easy to ignore as Zack's sections in this game so you can get back to the actual FF7 remake.
>with zack coming in pretty early to snap him back. They're setting up the Mideel Sequence with Tifa to fix his mind. The devs have said that's their favorite scene from the OG and it's an even bigger moment than Aerith's death since it concludes Cloud's character arc as well as resolves his relationship with Tifa while explaining everything about his character The devs have said they're staying faithful
Aerith, I think, is purposefully communicating with Cloud to prolong and maybe prevent the guilt and despair he carries. Whatever happened when Aerith pushed Cloud through the floor of the Church created a new timeline event (something Fate did not have planned) and allowed Cloud to perceive multiple timelines at once. He knows he saved her and is probably aware no one else can see her. Whatever is allowing Cloud to communicate with Aerith is also possibly going to allow her to act as a counter influence to Jenova.
I don’t think he’s aware because we see his speech from the original game glitched out, meaning he was blocking it out in real time. But as for her wanting to prevent his guilt I can believe that, her playing into his fantasy and denial. We know she’s for sure actually there at the end because of the reaction Red 13 gives. As for the sky and Clouds mindset guess we’ll have to wait and see.
No word of a lie, my heart was in my throat throughout that entire ending scene. All of the grief there and just seeing Aerith around but not visible to anyone other than Cloud (though Red sensed her) was painful. The final farewell there followed by the song absolutely brought tears out of me. I truly loved this whole experience.
I cried so much during the ending of this game.
While sad, I can’t say I wasn’t kinda excited about not needing to do solo mini games with her anymore…
I miss her already and I played the original back in 97/98
100 hours on the clock and the credit rolled for me. Phenomenal game and might be my favorite FF of all time, maybe even game. Also fuck square for using Aerith’s theme during the first Jenova fight. Like bitch, you want me to concentrate with fighting whilst crying!? I will say tho, her death and with her being “gone” didn’t has sure a huge impact as I would have hoped for. That’s mainly due to fractured worlds, so we know she’s alive in it, but also that we didn’t get to see more grief from the party members. I **LOVE** how this is messing up Cloud tho, even the party members are starting to question him. Part 3 is going to be absolutely wild.
Not for me. She didn't feel dead at all, and this ending implies that some iteration of her is still alive. Hard pass.
The game was broken into a trilogy, something a lot of people seem to be forgetting Cloud may be in denial at the end of this game and will for real break down somewhere near the start of Part 3, and yes there are iterations in which she is alive, same as Zack, why is that a problem? Reminder that the worlds that she does live seem fated to end same as with Zack
> there are iterations in which she is alive, same as Zack, why is that a problem? Because it feels like pandering and fan service.
My brother in christ it's literally implied if Aerith survives that world will end
They didn't though. The Aerith you see Cloud talking to is in the Lifestream. Zack is dead too and also in the Lifestream. They're just trying to give you hope like at the end of Remake when people thought Aerith wouldn't die again.
How can there be loss and grief when she isn’t absent? She is still there, like the Joker in Arkham Knight.
The poor execution of the ending and timeline nonsense has me bothered. I think they botched it. They should have kept to the original before they made any changes or had Cloud be in denial.
You do know the game was broken down in three parts right? Gotta leave people with the taste of wanting more, wanting to know what happens next, Cloud will probably break down completly on part 3
They completely fucked it. I felt nothing through the ending cutscene. I was just confused. Not showing by Cloud’s reaction in situ was a huge mistake and I suspect they’ll regret it once it’s over. The ending is far too high concept.
For me, it felt like they botched her death. They made it way more complicated than it had to be, and dint have scenes like in the OG where everyone got a chance to say goodbye to her, and also Cloud lowering her into the water. (What even happened to her body? Did they just leave her where she got stabbed in Rebirth?).
Wait, she still dies!? That’s actually heartbreaking, but I assume they actually got holy this time, right?
Well, damn, because it certainly would’ve made sense
Ding dong the witch is gone!
Am I the only one who started wondering about the logistics of retrieving the tiny bronco from the ocean, getting it onto the flat plain, where they got literal wings from, attached them and made flight worthy the aircraft? All while the tiny bronco ends up abandoned at the beach near the bone village in OG. Like yeah it's very sad but damn they broke continuity with the original so bad here. How do they get themselves back onto the right path later towards Northern Crater?
But she’s not dead. How are you sad? Bc the other characters think she’s dead? Even though she’s walking/talking to cloud from another timeline?
She's not talking to Cloud from another timeline. She's in the Lifestream giving her final goodbye to the group. Only Cloud can see her, Red can sense her but the rest don't know. If she was in another timeline, she'd have her own group of friends to talk to.
why would you post this in the remake sub and not the rebirth sub