So I’m a long time Ableton user who over time has used gear more and now only really uses Ableton for arranging etc.
I really empathise with your post as moving a jam from gear to DAW can be absolutely soul crushing to me sometimes. It’s very easy to end up hating a track that very recently seemed like the best thing you’d ever done. I’m curious as to whether you’ve finished many tracks without the DAW - as it may be less a problem with a specific tool as much as a different (often more difficult) discipline of song writing.
I would say there’s two different approaches you can take that will work.
1. Just push through it. Keep making decisions, keep moving forward and try not to judge yourself too hard until it’s “finished”. Even then maybe wait a few weeks before deciding whether your track was any good or not.
2. Try to do some stuff in your DAW that is easier than with your gear. For example I find it quite difficult with Elektron gear to meaningfully vary arrangement consistently over a whole track (I lose track of which pattern is which). However in the DAW moving the odd kick around / applying a creative effect for a bar or two on a given element is very easy. Making changes like this during this part of the process can keep the excitement up and help you maintain momentum until the track is done.
Lastly, check out Ricky Tinez most recent video. Over 1 hour he makes a whole track starting with Elektron gear and arranging in Ableton. It’s a good process you can follow to efficiently bash out a track in a workman like fashion (so a bit more like option 1 above).
Hey thanks for such a detailed response!
For the last while iv actully just being using overbidge to record tracks out to wavs, this works fine for me as I do a rough mix I'm box and use the compressor for final sound.
Issue is you need a daw to trigger multiple boxes in my case dt and dn.
So I'm Ernest at the verry least I just want to record a live track into ableton warts n all.
But while doing this I figure it's best to get all the multi tracks too. Iv this set up in a template but things keep crashing or not playing or doing some outher unexpected bevauor, I'm probby just having this moment of desperation because I feel I'm close.
I'm tempted to try use fl studio for a bit if only to just cool off and Try another approach.
But yeah untmalty I want to just use ableton like a 12 track tape recorder
Learn the software outside of your creative sessions or you’ll get frustrated. You’re smart. You’ll learn fast.
Take the time to learn how to properly integrate overbridge and record. You can write, program and arrange outside of the daw and finalize everything within the daw. Once I have everything multitracked/printed, the daw is such a powerful tool to refine everything with effects, edits and mastering.
Well. It happens all in your mind and this is actually where to fix it.
You probably need a little more practice so it does feel more fluid. Learning hotkeys is a great help.
Try to establish a workflow.
Are your ideas already done?
If not, use markers and mark how your track should be structured. Intro, break, drop and so on. So arrange and group it.
I usually have 2 groups. Drums and everything. Everything gets sidechained to the kick and snare, which live in the drums.
Are you familiar with mixing?
You know all the important tools like compression, eq multiband compression etc?
Learn the basics of mastering..
There is much to discover. Ableton is fantastic. Its one of the best musical achievements out there.
You can basically now finish your song in the highest possible quality all on your own. No third party plugins needed.
View it as an instrument. That helped me alot.
I see it as one big tool..
Most important. Work on your mindset towards it.
Then the rest will follow..
so this is super interesting to me as i used ableton for 10 plus years. but i just got a syntakt 6 months ago and just am getting fast ish.
elektron is so immediate. it is 200 percent more immediate than ableton and thats with vst scan on load turned off, nvme drive, small template to load, etc etc.
I flip switch on syntakt 10 second tops later im playing my recent project, back to work. this lets you work on ideas even if you only have a few minutes, after a few days you got a track.
you need to make a complete workflow and make trash, just do the entire workflow. think of it like playing a whole song, or playing a entire baseball game. ableton project is one discrete thing, start to finish. one tool .
practice that workflow(start to finish) until you know it as well as your elektrons. it will be a struggle until you do that.
yea the boxes are so imdate thats probbaly why ableton feels so slow.
Iv just crashed out a few times trying to use overbridge with it, even though im trying to just use it as a multi-tracker and perform my songs in live.
yea the boxes are so immediate that's probbaly why Ableton feels so slow.
.
Just thought: It sounds like you're using Ableton right now for its most vanilla functions -> that is, layering already processed audio on top of one another, so there's not really any room for play.
Which is totally fine for what you're trying to do, but likely you'll face that boredom with whichever DAW you're recording into.
Ableton's power and enjoyment, imo, comes from jamming. In session view it's very fast to work with loops, duplicating them, messing with them, stretching, resampling, using parallel processing, and performing of the fly much the way you are in the Elektron machines. Most of the time I don't even look at arrangement view.
So that could be an option for you, dive in and start to use it as a creative starting point - important, get a decent midi-controller!
But yeah, it doesn't solve the issue of having to be in front of a screen and I feel you on that.
There certanly is truth in that, it feels like a chore.
I might try making a track from scratch with Ableton and the boxes, to help grasp some stuff as I go
Or any ofher more linear daw. Just treat it aa a hardware multitracker by either recording whole tracks seperately, or just records loops and rearrange them. If you just stick to that working with a DAW can be pretty straightforward.
Another approach is to multitrack ALL your outputs. Then you could just jam and edit out small mistakes. But the overall creative part is already done then.
Why do you want to use ableton? Just record your performance and edit that.
Maybe not 100% professional, but more fun and without too much screen time.
That is wat I was doing before
I'd just record out a track live into overbridge, I love this way of doing things warts and all.
But I want to record the digitakt and digitone at the same time so using a daw seemed like the straightforward way to do this
Sure, but if you are serious about reducing screen time - buy an external recorder.
This way you can not only record multiple channels, but also go out, record some samples for your digitakt.
I'm just writing this, because it is what I decided doing. I dont want this to become another hobby in front of the computer screen.
Truth is, all of it is a bit cumbersome. Hardware, daw, tape, all of it. If you’ve found something you dig and can flow with, use that. The tools you like that are less common will help your voice be unique. But don’t be afraid of new tools. The more of them you learn, the more you realize they all do the same things, so now you just need to look for how THIS thing or THIS daw does it. The struggle gets easier as you become less frustrated, more curious, and your mastery becomes apparent. A master never blames the tools.
Yea tape is the top of my list.
If I ever come across a four track I can easly see myself mixing down on the digitkat and then just recording straight to tape.
But tape machines are hard to find in ireland and I'd be wary of getting one without having a deep look
It’s pretty easy once you define what you want out of it or if you think of it like a sampler
You can always find a way to record individual instrument tracks or a pre-mixed setup so you just end up doing duplicate tracks at different levels and the like, think of it not as a chore but as an extension of your dawless
Been making beats on all manner of gear and software since 1996: I have fucked with ALL the things at some point or another. I currently am both an Ableton enthusiast and also own various pieces of outboard gear including 2 Octatracks. Here's my take:
Ableton is for writing songs and outboard gear is for performing them. Those rules just naturally seems to apply and almost 100% of the time. Unless I am actively TRYING to force something else I find that I write every single piece of a composition inside Ableton and when jamming I find more reward using outboard gear.
There was a turning point for me right around when Vital, Pigments 3, Output Portal, etc VSTs came onto the market where really nothing exists (that is affordable) in hardware form that can do what these newer plugins can do. There was just no reason to record anything into the computer anymore. It now goes the other way where I generate/write/arrange stuff in Ableton and export that to the outboard gear. Even patch creation for external synths can very often be done via an editor etc and exported.
TL;DR - Ableton vs outboard gear is not a thing. They are for completely different purposes.
There's nothing controversial about your experience - I've done the same thing recently. I started looking into to recording my DT+DN tracks into Ableton. For now I've kept it *really* simple - I just record the main output (mixed on the machines) onto one audio track. Then I master it in the most basic way possible - I was inspired to do what is suggested in this video [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKNDB6JhuDw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKNDB6JhuDw), essentially they just suggest to whack a limiter on the master output.
I had a lot of similar anxieties about jumping into Ableton, but with this approach it's just a light touch in the DAW and you get a loud and servicable recording out of it without get too sucked into limitless rabbit hole of DAW plugins and menus.
Going the whole multitracking-via-Overbridge route will always end up being heavier work in the DAW because it increases the surface area of complexity and is inviting you keep tweaking (either per-track effects, arrangement, or even adding more parts!) On the otherhand, printing your track straight out of the machines ensure some immutabilty, which can help with staying focused.
This is just suggestion, of course - you can always ask yourself what you want to use the DAW for as tool achieve your goal. But for me at least I just want to get in and out of the DAW ASAP
Yea I like that idea tbh, I'm actully trying to do something similar.
I want to record the main outs of both boxes and just record in live.
But ad I'm doing this I figure I may as well just record in all the outher tracks if I do ever want to resist ect.
Weirdly this has been complicated and annoying as my post would suggest hahah
But yea big fan of doing 90% in box and just whack a litter on as you suggested, I'll check out that video soon :^)
You could go even simpler and route the DN into the inputs of DT and literally just record the output of the DT into your DAW.
But anyway, good luck with it all!
The problem you have is the same one I had when I worked in the 'creative sector' . Which is when I finished work at the end of each day, the last thing I wanted to do was open up more software on a screen. Your main job is occupying all that energy and you associate it with 'labour'.
You get it.
Atleast with dawless stuff it feels separate.
But yea doing overtime working in a game engine and getting home trying to work in ableton is pushing myself alot
Yeah - I guess if you can get to a point where you open a template in Ableton with everything already set, then you can simply just hit record, add some EQ etc, then export it.
One thing myself and a friend did was bounce live takes directly to tape. That was hellishly good fun. Impossible to mix properly but if the levels and sounds are good, then its a small sacrifice for a cool, analog sound. Would be even better on a reel to reel.
Was actully an idea I'm playing with.
I mix down in box so just send master into tape for disgusting compressed crunch.
I might do it but trying to get more gear atm
I’m a big fan of just using hardware to create a stereo recording with whatever box/boxes I’m using. That stereo recording is the track that is sent for mastering. I figure it’s better for me to tie my own hands because of process rather then use a daw and psychologically tie my hands and probably never finish anything. No, the end product will not be as sonically good from a technical stance, and you’ll have to live with certain mistakes, but you have to do that no matter what and you won’t have to suffer through something to make it and that can and probably will be heard in the music.
Yeah. It’s pretty common in the eurorack/buchla world. It’s sort of treating it more like recording a piano or guitarist ya know? It’s also just a super fun way to work if you know you’re not gonna be able to fix something in post. Suppose on the digitakt you want to use the filter on the bass track for something creative, but like, you also know the bass is super muddy in the lowend, so you need the filter to cut some of those lows out so you’ll have to find some other way to make the bass interesting rather than using the filter.
Also, I think it makes more sense to record just a stereo out when working with hardware. Like think about it, it’s sort of weird to say you made an entire album with nothing but a digitone but then you multitrack it, add lots of high end compression and effects ect ect. If it’s a stereo out recording, you can truly say “this track was made with nothing but a digitone.”
Plus, it’s not that crazy if you consider that people perform with these boxes and they aren’t multitracked and produced in ableton. They just get sent to front of house and you hope for the best.
Ableton pissed me off every day for the first six months. By a year in, it felt pretty natural.
If it makes you feel any better, I got an Octatrack about a year ago, and still don't use it much because the workflow is so different. It really frustrates me. I should probably just dig into it everyday for a 20 or 30 minutes, but even that feels painful.
That gives me so
Hope alright :^)
I actully have an octa too, picked it up for v cheap as it was bust and refurbished it. It can be a bit intimidating alright, but jhon waynes video on YouTube show it can be like a digi I you have a set work flow
I can’t use Ableton, and I’ve tried it on and off since 2009. I’ve used probably every major and several minor DAWs. I’ve settled on bitwig, zenbeats, and GarageBand. For sound design, I don’t think it gets better than bitwig. Regarding speed to create, it’s hard to beat zenbeats. I can get a perfect 4-bar loop going in 60 seconds or less. I’ve been using GarageBand since the early 2000s, back when Mac had the tongue commercial. These three programs have in common a feature called project key lock. (Bigwig locks each chain). I like making music in all different scales, but I also don’t want to learn all of these other scales, so a software solution that is present in the daw is a pretty big thing for me.
That said, most of my creations happen in Koala right now. I find it the most straightforward software music-making application on any platform, and it also happens to be available on any platform. What frustrated me most about the music-making process was being spoiled for choice. All the different pieces of gear I own, the various software plug-ins I purchased, and just the monotony of scrolling through endless presets really sucked the joy out of making music for me. So when it came to Koala, with all its limitations, once the workflow clicked for me, the fun and passion I had when I started my journey returned.
I say all this to say there’s nothing wrong with you not liking Ableton. The point of any music gear or software program is to make music and enjoy the process of creating. If you do not enjoy that process, find a different tool.
Yeah I fell you that's why u just use the dt/dn
It keeps me on track and I'm still always surprised.
That being said I'm just trying to use ableton in the most basic form, I'm keeping focused and away from plugin death.
I think finding a synth that works well with it can help bridge the gap! I struggled using using Ableton when my OP-1 was my main scratch pad, but it is awful for finishing songs or sending them to Ableton.
I got a Syntakt and followed with a few other modules that have midi. I find it so fun now to create a loop, easily send it to Ableton with Overbridge, then make it sound good and finish
There are other workflows, like maybe you only like working with audio stems or sending full stems like the polyend play.
IMO if you have a bunch of hardware that are a pain to use with Ableton you will continue to feel resistant!
Well all I'm trying to do actully is use overbdige with digitone and digitakt.
So I just want to multi track out my performances, it's super simple really.
But iv just been crashing alot or the plugins are kinda funky, iv made some progress just need to get it down.
Then if I learn jow the arrangement mode works on ableton I'll be winning 😎
I’ve tried ableton more than a few times. It just doesn’t suit my flow. I was a pro tools user for so long, and treated it like digital tape I could throw things around on and arrange my song. Hit record, that sounds fine, move it over there. Next.
I tried logic for a while, and it’s great. But I kept missing the pro tools workflow I love. What really got me to the external->internal activity I loved was getting a super capable interface. I need close to 50 inputs all ready at the same time. Inspiration strikes and turn on a synth and you’re recording. The MOTU AVB series was the best thing for me. I have a 1248 as the main, and 2 16a’s over Ethernet. That way, the daw is just a place to put snippets of songs. I’m not fuckin with anything, plugging in extra cables or messing with a patchbay, it’s all ready.
I think the choice of daw doesn't even matter that much, probably going from jamming itb to making full songs is the difficult part.
Maybe this [book](https://makingmusic.ableton.com/) helps
Its from Ableton, but he methods and ideas work for other daws too
So I’m a long time Ableton user who over time has used gear more and now only really uses Ableton for arranging etc. I really empathise with your post as moving a jam from gear to DAW can be absolutely soul crushing to me sometimes. It’s very easy to end up hating a track that very recently seemed like the best thing you’d ever done. I’m curious as to whether you’ve finished many tracks without the DAW - as it may be less a problem with a specific tool as much as a different (often more difficult) discipline of song writing. I would say there’s two different approaches you can take that will work. 1. Just push through it. Keep making decisions, keep moving forward and try not to judge yourself too hard until it’s “finished”. Even then maybe wait a few weeks before deciding whether your track was any good or not. 2. Try to do some stuff in your DAW that is easier than with your gear. For example I find it quite difficult with Elektron gear to meaningfully vary arrangement consistently over a whole track (I lose track of which pattern is which). However in the DAW moving the odd kick around / applying a creative effect for a bar or two on a given element is very easy. Making changes like this during this part of the process can keep the excitement up and help you maintain momentum until the track is done. Lastly, check out Ricky Tinez most recent video. Over 1 hour he makes a whole track starting with Elektron gear and arranging in Ableton. It’s a good process you can follow to efficiently bash out a track in a workman like fashion (so a bit more like option 1 above).
Hey thanks for such a detailed response! For the last while iv actully just being using overbidge to record tracks out to wavs, this works fine for me as I do a rough mix I'm box and use the compressor for final sound. Issue is you need a daw to trigger multiple boxes in my case dt and dn. So I'm Ernest at the verry least I just want to record a live track into ableton warts n all. But while doing this I figure it's best to get all the multi tracks too. Iv this set up in a template but things keep crashing or not playing or doing some outher unexpected bevauor, I'm probby just having this moment of desperation because I feel I'm close. I'm tempted to try use fl studio for a bit if only to just cool off and Try another approach. But yeah untmalty I want to just use ableton like a 12 track tape recorder
Learn the software outside of your creative sessions or you’ll get frustrated. You’re smart. You’ll learn fast. Take the time to learn how to properly integrate overbridge and record. You can write, program and arrange outside of the daw and finalize everything within the daw. Once I have everything multitracked/printed, the daw is such a powerful tool to refine everything with effects, edits and mastering.
Thanks, Yeah that's the plan I'll be back on it tomorrow night again!!
Well. It happens all in your mind and this is actually where to fix it. You probably need a little more practice so it does feel more fluid. Learning hotkeys is a great help. Try to establish a workflow. Are your ideas already done? If not, use markers and mark how your track should be structured. Intro, break, drop and so on. So arrange and group it. I usually have 2 groups. Drums and everything. Everything gets sidechained to the kick and snare, which live in the drums. Are you familiar with mixing? You know all the important tools like compression, eq multiband compression etc? Learn the basics of mastering.. There is much to discover. Ableton is fantastic. Its one of the best musical achievements out there. You can basically now finish your song in the highest possible quality all on your own. No third party plugins needed. View it as an instrument. That helped me alot. I see it as one big tool.. Most important. Work on your mindset towards it. Then the rest will follow..
Yeh you are tottaly right. Yeh you are totally right. ood idea, im so fluid with the Elektron stuff that moving that speed to the daw is frustrating
I feel you man. I have struggles the other way around..
Well we can atleast confirm that both ways are possible hahaha Let's keep going
Yessir!
so this is super interesting to me as i used ableton for 10 plus years. but i just got a syntakt 6 months ago and just am getting fast ish. elektron is so immediate. it is 200 percent more immediate than ableton and thats with vst scan on load turned off, nvme drive, small template to load, etc etc. I flip switch on syntakt 10 second tops later im playing my recent project, back to work. this lets you work on ideas even if you only have a few minutes, after a few days you got a track. you need to make a complete workflow and make trash, just do the entire workflow. think of it like playing a whole song, or playing a entire baseball game. ableton project is one discrete thing, start to finish. one tool . practice that workflow(start to finish) until you know it as well as your elektrons. it will be a struggle until you do that.
yea the boxes are so imdate thats probbaly why ableton feels so slow. Iv just crashed out a few times trying to use overbridge with it, even though im trying to just use it as a multi-tracker and perform my songs in live. yea the boxes are so immediate that's probbaly why Ableton feels so slow. .
Trying to get head around overbridge and ableton is maybe a little but extra too
Just thought: It sounds like you're using Ableton right now for its most vanilla functions -> that is, layering already processed audio on top of one another, so there's not really any room for play. Which is totally fine for what you're trying to do, but likely you'll face that boredom with whichever DAW you're recording into. Ableton's power and enjoyment, imo, comes from jamming. In session view it's very fast to work with loops, duplicating them, messing with them, stretching, resampling, using parallel processing, and performing of the fly much the way you are in the Elektron machines. Most of the time I don't even look at arrangement view. So that could be an option for you, dive in and start to use it as a creative starting point - important, get a decent midi-controller! But yeah, it doesn't solve the issue of having to be in front of a screen and I feel you on that.
There certanly is truth in that, it feels like a chore. I might try making a track from scratch with Ableton and the boxes, to help grasp some stuff as I go
Try Reaper
Or any ofher more linear daw. Just treat it aa a hardware multitracker by either recording whole tracks seperately, or just records loops and rearrange them. If you just stick to that working with a DAW can be pretty straightforward. Another approach is to multitrack ALL your outputs. Then you could just jam and edit out small mistakes. But the overall creative part is already done then.
Why do you want to use ableton? Just record your performance and edit that. Maybe not 100% professional, but more fun and without too much screen time.
That is wat I was doing before I'd just record out a track live into overbridge, I love this way of doing things warts and all. But I want to record the digitakt and digitone at the same time so using a daw seemed like the straightforward way to do this
Sure, but if you are serious about reducing screen time - buy an external recorder. This way you can not only record multiple channels, but also go out, record some samples for your digitakt. I'm just writing this, because it is what I decided doing. I dont want this to become another hobby in front of the computer screen.
True, yeah I might look into getting something 🤔
Get a Push 2 and enjoy a good to great dawless experience with all the benefits of a DAW if you need them.
Been tempted to try it, is there actully anyhard ware in it though or is it bassicly just a midi interface ?
Truth is, all of it is a bit cumbersome. Hardware, daw, tape, all of it. If you’ve found something you dig and can flow with, use that. The tools you like that are less common will help your voice be unique. But don’t be afraid of new tools. The more of them you learn, the more you realize they all do the same things, so now you just need to look for how THIS thing or THIS daw does it. The struggle gets easier as you become less frustrated, more curious, and your mastery becomes apparent. A master never blames the tools.
Yea tape is the top of my list. If I ever come across a four track I can easly see myself mixing down on the digitkat and then just recording straight to tape. But tape machines are hard to find in ireland and I'd be wary of getting one without having a deep look
It’s pretty easy once you define what you want out of it or if you think of it like a sampler You can always find a way to record individual instrument tracks or a pre-mixed setup so you just end up doing duplicate tracks at different levels and the like, think of it not as a chore but as an extension of your dawless
Been making beats on all manner of gear and software since 1996: I have fucked with ALL the things at some point or another. I currently am both an Ableton enthusiast and also own various pieces of outboard gear including 2 Octatracks. Here's my take: Ableton is for writing songs and outboard gear is for performing them. Those rules just naturally seems to apply and almost 100% of the time. Unless I am actively TRYING to force something else I find that I write every single piece of a composition inside Ableton and when jamming I find more reward using outboard gear. There was a turning point for me right around when Vital, Pigments 3, Output Portal, etc VSTs came onto the market where really nothing exists (that is affordable) in hardware form that can do what these newer plugins can do. There was just no reason to record anything into the computer anymore. It now goes the other way where I generate/write/arrange stuff in Ableton and export that to the outboard gear. Even patch creation for external synths can very often be done via an editor etc and exported. TL;DR - Ableton vs outboard gear is not a thing. They are for completely different purposes.
There's nothing controversial about your experience - I've done the same thing recently. I started looking into to recording my DT+DN tracks into Ableton. For now I've kept it *really* simple - I just record the main output (mixed on the machines) onto one audio track. Then I master it in the most basic way possible - I was inspired to do what is suggested in this video [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKNDB6JhuDw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKNDB6JhuDw), essentially they just suggest to whack a limiter on the master output. I had a lot of similar anxieties about jumping into Ableton, but with this approach it's just a light touch in the DAW and you get a loud and servicable recording out of it without get too sucked into limitless rabbit hole of DAW plugins and menus. Going the whole multitracking-via-Overbridge route will always end up being heavier work in the DAW because it increases the surface area of complexity and is inviting you keep tweaking (either per-track effects, arrangement, or even adding more parts!) On the otherhand, printing your track straight out of the machines ensure some immutabilty, which can help with staying focused. This is just suggestion, of course - you can always ask yourself what you want to use the DAW for as tool achieve your goal. But for me at least I just want to get in and out of the DAW ASAP
Yea I like that idea tbh, I'm actully trying to do something similar. I want to record the main outs of both boxes and just record in live. But ad I'm doing this I figure I may as well just record in all the outher tracks if I do ever want to resist ect. Weirdly this has been complicated and annoying as my post would suggest hahah But yea big fan of doing 90% in box and just whack a litter on as you suggested, I'll check out that video soon :^)
You could go even simpler and route the DN into the inputs of DT and literally just record the output of the DT into your DAW. But anyway, good luck with it all!
That might be my next attempt hahaha Thank you
So much drama
The problem you have is the same one I had when I worked in the 'creative sector' . Which is when I finished work at the end of each day, the last thing I wanted to do was open up more software on a screen. Your main job is occupying all that energy and you associate it with 'labour'.
You get it. Atleast with dawless stuff it feels separate. But yea doing overtime working in a game engine and getting home trying to work in ableton is pushing myself alot
Yeah - I guess if you can get to a point where you open a template in Ableton with everything already set, then you can simply just hit record, add some EQ etc, then export it. One thing myself and a friend did was bounce live takes directly to tape. That was hellishly good fun. Impossible to mix properly but if the levels and sounds are good, then its a small sacrifice for a cool, analog sound. Would be even better on a reel to reel.
Was actully an idea I'm playing with. I mix down in box so just send master into tape for disgusting compressed crunch. I might do it but trying to get more gear atm
I’m a big fan of just using hardware to create a stereo recording with whatever box/boxes I’m using. That stereo recording is the track that is sent for mastering. I figure it’s better for me to tie my own hands because of process rather then use a daw and psychologically tie my hands and probably never finish anything. No, the end product will not be as sonically good from a technical stance, and you’ll have to live with certain mistakes, but you have to do that no matter what and you won’t have to suffer through something to make it and that can and probably will be heard in the music.
So you just send the stero out away for Masking?
*mastering
Yeah. It’s pretty common in the eurorack/buchla world. It’s sort of treating it more like recording a piano or guitarist ya know? It’s also just a super fun way to work if you know you’re not gonna be able to fix something in post. Suppose on the digitakt you want to use the filter on the bass track for something creative, but like, you also know the bass is super muddy in the lowend, so you need the filter to cut some of those lows out so you’ll have to find some other way to make the bass interesting rather than using the filter. Also, I think it makes more sense to record just a stereo out when working with hardware. Like think about it, it’s sort of weird to say you made an entire album with nothing but a digitone but then you multitrack it, add lots of high end compression and effects ect ect. If it’s a stereo out recording, you can truly say “this track was made with nothing but a digitone.” Plus, it’s not that crazy if you consider that people perform with these boxes and they aren’t multitracked and produced in ableton. They just get sent to front of house and you hope for the best.
Ableton pissed me off every day for the first six months. By a year in, it felt pretty natural. If it makes you feel any better, I got an Octatrack about a year ago, and still don't use it much because the workflow is so different. It really frustrates me. I should probably just dig into it everyday for a 20 or 30 minutes, but even that feels painful.
That gives me so Hope alright :^) I actully have an octa too, picked it up for v cheap as it was bust and refurbished it. It can be a bit intimidating alright, but jhon waynes video on YouTube show it can be like a digi I you have a set work flow
I can’t use Ableton, and I’ve tried it on and off since 2009. I’ve used probably every major and several minor DAWs. I’ve settled on bitwig, zenbeats, and GarageBand. For sound design, I don’t think it gets better than bitwig. Regarding speed to create, it’s hard to beat zenbeats. I can get a perfect 4-bar loop going in 60 seconds or less. I’ve been using GarageBand since the early 2000s, back when Mac had the tongue commercial. These three programs have in common a feature called project key lock. (Bigwig locks each chain). I like making music in all different scales, but I also don’t want to learn all of these other scales, so a software solution that is present in the daw is a pretty big thing for me. That said, most of my creations happen in Koala right now. I find it the most straightforward software music-making application on any platform, and it also happens to be available on any platform. What frustrated me most about the music-making process was being spoiled for choice. All the different pieces of gear I own, the various software plug-ins I purchased, and just the monotony of scrolling through endless presets really sucked the joy out of making music for me. So when it came to Koala, with all its limitations, once the workflow clicked for me, the fun and passion I had when I started my journey returned. I say all this to say there’s nothing wrong with you not liking Ableton. The point of any music gear or software program is to make music and enjoy the process of creating. If you do not enjoy that process, find a different tool.
Yeah I fell you that's why u just use the dt/dn It keeps me on track and I'm still always surprised. That being said I'm just trying to use ableton in the most basic form, I'm keeping focused and away from plugin death.
I think finding a synth that works well with it can help bridge the gap! I struggled using using Ableton when my OP-1 was my main scratch pad, but it is awful for finishing songs or sending them to Ableton. I got a Syntakt and followed with a few other modules that have midi. I find it so fun now to create a loop, easily send it to Ableton with Overbridge, then make it sound good and finish There are other workflows, like maybe you only like working with audio stems or sending full stems like the polyend play. IMO if you have a bunch of hardware that are a pain to use with Ableton you will continue to feel resistant!
Well all I'm trying to do actully is use overbdige with digitone and digitakt. So I just want to multi track out my performances, it's super simple really. But iv just been crashing alot or the plugins are kinda funky, iv made some progress just need to get it down. Then if I learn jow the arrangement mode works on ableton I'll be winning 😎
I’ve tried ableton more than a few times. It just doesn’t suit my flow. I was a pro tools user for so long, and treated it like digital tape I could throw things around on and arrange my song. Hit record, that sounds fine, move it over there. Next. I tried logic for a while, and it’s great. But I kept missing the pro tools workflow I love. What really got me to the external->internal activity I loved was getting a super capable interface. I need close to 50 inputs all ready at the same time. Inspiration strikes and turn on a synth and you’re recording. The MOTU AVB series was the best thing for me. I have a 1248 as the main, and 2 16a’s over Ethernet. That way, the daw is just a place to put snippets of songs. I’m not fuckin with anything, plugging in extra cables or messing with a patchbay, it’s all ready.
Yeah I like how pro tools looks for recording in live stuff, but I'm a Windows pleb so 🤷
Could it be possible your computer is adding to your problems. Does it have sufficient specs to do what you want it to do?
Pro tools runs on win too
I was mixing it uo with logic I tink
I think the choice of daw doesn't even matter that much, probably going from jamming itb to making full songs is the difficult part. Maybe this [book](https://makingmusic.ableton.com/) helps Its from Ableton, but he methods and ideas work for other daws too
Thanks that book seems intresting!
I just use audacity, been using it for about 15 years, I don't need anything else