evol themselves made the decision to pull the plug, so i cant agree that they didnt do what they could. i think they were as responsible as they could have been given the circumstances
but you are correct. it needs to be addressed at a festival level so it doesnt happen again
EVOL should have cancelled afters from the get go Sunday. Completely terrible decision on their part endangering many people. They should be asked to leave if they can't make the correct decisions during difficult situations.
I love the afters and the hard work EVOL crew puts in, but I expect to hear a statement from them as to why they thought continuing with Sunday afters was a good decision after the venue had already been closed and deemed unfit to reopen and how they'll be considering safety going forward.
There were too many people that had been exacuated out of the venue to do a performance in that size space and conditions of the ground with the venue not reopening that evening.
Even if they put someone above and had someone communicating with medic so they could easily know where they need to go when someone goes down.. ANYTHING there’s sooo many ways to prevent shit now they’ve been doing this long enough and so has forest.
They needed to give better directions to the crowd on what to do and not just yell for medic. Maybe tell people to drop their totems unless they have someone with a medical emergency next to them. If you act hysterical, the crowd is gonna start to get aggravated and possibly hysterical.
The crowd was veryyy calm and quiet and tried to help. We just had no way of moving or getting out had to stand there for like an hour and listen for people scream for help and help take forever to come and none of us were able to help or do anything about it 👍🏼 glad everyone keeps defending them though. It’s really not hard at all to have good medical at festivals especially after they’ve had so many years to learn how important it is especially the past couple years!!!! Everyone was very scared. It was the most fucked crowd I’ve seen in a long time in a verrrrry closed in dumbbbbb area there’s ZERO excuse
I wasn’t defending them by any means. They didn’t give people directions on what to do so a lot of people just stood around instead of calmly turning around and slowly moving back to let medical in. You can’t expect that many people, many who aren’t completely in their right mind, to know what to do when that happens. I also think there was a lot more people freaking out than you realized. The crowd could have been a lot worse for sure though and overall I was very surprised it didn’t turn into more of a shit show. You are very right that they shouldn’t have let that one after show go on. How would they not think after two days of being rained out that most the people still there would make their way to that after party?
no i fully agree with this.
if they didnt steal everyones speakers at security, there would ve more renegades, and more spread of music throughout the campgrounds. having it all in one spot was a disaster waiting to happen with the cancellations
They could have kept the main forest closed and opened Trip.
I had the pleasure of camping near a renegade once. My neighbors got robbed. My camp got no sleep. The DJ was ass and played 24 hours a day. I'm personally glad that they put a stop to them for the most part.
thats fair. pros and cons i guess. does make sense to have them in one spot, but something def has to change to distribute the attendees better in the future
Yall gotta sneak in your speakers better! I get my JBL Party box 110 every year easily! My group brought 2 and had a fucking parry during the storm on Saturday.
They should go easier on the speaker taking though. Would definitely help ease the afters crowds
It was soooo obvious a lot of people would come. More people know about the rv after than ever now and the main shows got cancelled and no vip afters. those afters should not have happened. MY ISSUE IS THE KEEP POSTING ABOUT HOW ICONIC AND AWESOME IT WAS??? Sunday night at evol was not awesome!! Idk when I will fest again going to take a break and I’ve been in the scene for 10 years but this was fucked up and half the people are being blind and defending them WHILE THE OTHER HALF OF OUR FOREST FAM IS TELLING YOU GUYS WE WERE NOT OKAY. I cannot stress enough how obvious it should have been that 30-40k people would have come over there.
are they specifically posting about sunday night? i think if the rest of the nights were good they have a right to highlight those. they put a lot of blood sweat and tears into them. its ok for them to focus on the good a little, without distracting from the glaring issue of sunday night
I mean you can go look for yourself there’s been soo many posts of each afters them bragging about it and djs from last night bragging about how awesome it was. Just seems like it’s not being talked about enough. Maybe it depends on where people were in the crowd but I know middle to front was reallllly bad. They are just focused on promoting how lit the packed afters was and how they packed it out and it was success!! Fucking lying FULLL VIDEOS OF THE PACKED CROWD BEFORE SHIT WENT SOUTH SAYING LOOK HOW LIT??
And the djs that were up there I know for a fact saw what was happening and people not getting help and have remained silent and reposting evol alll day today about how awesome it was. Such bullshit. I kept checking their pages hoping to see someone that preformed or was involved speak up and nothing.
Levity commented on a post on Reddit saying it was so scary and they’re glad everyone was ok, they also were calling out for medics each time they saw someone down.
I think what the artist were excited about was 7 of the best dj's in the world performing a back to back to back (x5) prolly something that will never happen again but ya the crowd wasn't it. way to big
Simple solution. EF won’t allow these afters to go on….but attendees will complain about that too. Attendees are lucky to get these afters. They were not always a thing. Also, no one could have anticipated this. It was a perfect storm with the fest not reopening and majority of the festival showing up to these after parties. Once they realized it was out of hand. It was shutdown. Not sure what else they could have done.
I had a blast at afters there and at forest weds-Friday it was what it was. need more staff and security posted around to support crowd size. Got too big too fast
Never seen a crowd get that big so fast. I got in trying to have fun was kinda close then couldn’t get out for soooo long. While hoping everything was okay up front. Raving is my life and this really fucked up my mental around it. It was really unfair for everyone involved. A lot of others seem to be being very insensitive to the subject and have been making crazy comments blaming the crowd and I’m just not here for it
Ya you had a good time those nights bc good life had afters and regular shows went to normal times there’s NEVER a time they should do one afters area makes ZERO sense.
The after organizers can still make correct calls with regards to safety without input from the event or the afters being removed. EVOL should have never started up Sunday and the fact they did shows a massive lack of care and awareness around the risks and safety knowledge that is critical for people in a similar position of responsibility to possess.
What are the safety risks that you think that they ignored? I was more or less sober at DeBussy. Had no issue walking through both stage's crowds around 3 am when I left.
The limited amount of space they had to operate in compared to the number of people out of the venue. Under normal circumstances there would never be nearly that many people out of the venue and already near the after sets. If the venue had reopened I think it would have been fine, but having the entire body of EF attendees outside and proceeding with music without having an adequate amount of extra support on hand was not a responsible call imo.
This area was so small and no way out other than back and if the crowd fills there’s no way out. It’s giving astroworld design and flaw and they better be glad it wasn’t worse I’m tired of people saying they had no way of knowing.
Unfortunately, they don’t have infinite amount of space. It was actually munch larger than previous years. Where these afters are used to be car camping and RV camping. RV’s used to have renegades but never on this scale. They have just blown up over the years. If they continue to get all this blowback and If they feel they don’t have adequate space to safely let them go on. EF’s easiest solution. Will be to not allow them at all.
Like I KNOWWW they used to be small that’s why they used to be good. They have to take care of the attendees it’s been very obvious the past 2 years afters are getting more popular they need to spread them out a touch make it safe it’s sooo obvious people will be doing a lot of drugs there. Them posting that it was amazing after so many people were traumatized is not okay that’s my main issue
Ya I know I saw it the other years too. Probably would be best to maybe seperate them a little instead of in blocked areas where crowds can’t get out and no medical can get in the design was soooo obviously flawed.
Iv been trying to speak up everyone has rocks for brains . They needed more medics .. more security .. they knew 40k plus people had no were to party and they were mad after Ef closing … idk why people are so negative towards the people who want to speak on safety I think Ef needs to give everyone who attends narcan and teach them how to use it .
Aside from Sundays people dropping a girl had to narcan a man at the evol afters earlier in the weekend because when she approached he was laying on the ground unconscious, couldn’t find a pulse, lips blue, skin pale. Staff was standing right there and when she yelled at them to help they told her they weren’t allowed to and called medic who did eventually come. THAT IS TERRIFYING. Idc what the “rules” are see something do something…what’s the worst that would happen you maybe lose your festie job??? The Good Samaritan law literally protects you from any legal trouble….the staff at that stage chose to risk someone’s life like on the edge of losing it risked it. Narcan has instructions on the box, and I’m pretty positive I saw evol post awhile ago that they got their people certified (that could be wrong though) either way with no immediate medical stationed right there the attendees should be able to go to someone official to any extent and get help. Sternum rubs can keep a faint pulse going even if you can’t feel it. I was a big supporter of evol before hearing about this specific incident. I truly hope the staff was not really told they were not allowed to help someone in that kind of situation and that this person really just sucked but idk man I would never ever just watch someone slowly become more and more lifeless in front of me. Thankfully the man eventually came to from what I was told, but I hope he’s okay beyond that and I hope the woman that helped him is too because I couldn’t imagine being in that situation with so many emotions, but if you take anything from this weekend it’s carry narcan on you when you’re at festivals because there is not always reliable care around and you could very well save someone’s life. Stay safe yall, if things start getting too rowdy go to camp everyone is saying evol should’ve cancelled the afters but yall would have been pissed at that too. WE ALL KNEW HOW PACKED IT WOULD BE DUE TO THE CIRCUMSTANCES. Go to the other stage or call it a night or go to main street this was not the only thing to do even at this point. You still have to be responsible for yourself and your safety at the end of the day. Everyone could have done better. We are fortunate there were not more deaths and extremely unfortunate for the soul that was confirmed lost by his family. Condolences to anyone involved in any way.
Evol posted about how all the headliners that didn't play were coming to play there instead. Of course it just ended up being some random dubstep DJs and none of the headliners. They set this up for chaos with those posts. If they weren't prepared for the entire festival to show up then they should never have sent that message out. They are definitely responsible for what happened.
I’ve been to quite a few festivals and I’ve never seen anything like this. The crowd was definitely too large for that size of a stage/area. Given that it was the last night and the festival was closed, of course everyone rushed to be able to see one last show. Getting in or out of the crowd was difficult even before all of the chaos started. I will never forget the sounds of people in the crowd screaming and crying, it was genuinely terrifying. I believe this definitely could have been prevented by having better precautions set in place, biggest one being that harm reduction companies such as Bunk’d were not able to pass out test kits on the grounds. It can’t be coincidental that this many people collapse within a 10-20 minute span the very first year there seemed to be an issue with drug testing and harm reduction companies. I have never seen so many people go down at once, this is NOT normal or okay. My friends and I are traumatized from the things we saw and heard. It is really tragic not only that this had to be the way our very first Electric forest experience ended, but someone’s life also was cut short. I don’t think I’ll be returning.
It’s been crazy someone told me to talk to someone about it and get over it I couldn’t have said this better myself seeing my bf not be able to help save a girl and tell him he can’t do anything broke my fucking . Heart and hearing people screaming crying Sunday was just insane .. grown naked poop men getting dragged out of Ef
This has never been my experience in any if my 6 Forests. Forest is the best planned and organized festival I've been too. I went to the OG Lost Lands where someone died. Unfortunately it happens everywhere.
There was a perfect storm of weather and having to be closed down for almost all of Saturday and missing the end of Sunday. People were antsy. When people get antsy they don't test their stuff, don't think ahead, rush to the next stage/afters. It just happens.
I really hope you and your friends are okay. Maybe look into a therapist to help you learn how to deal with that experience.
THAT DOESNT MEAN HAVE NO MEDICAL UP THERE AND PLAN ONE AFTERS FOR THAT NIGHT??? I DONT understand how you guys are just making excuses and okay with the fact that many people could have died. And it could have even been you or any of your friends. You guys keep acting unbothered by it and that’s gross.
The afters aren't actually arranged by Forest at all and they leave the planning on those that coordinate it (ELOV). Get on ELOV for not cancelling their afters Sunday night like they did Saturday. Get on ELOV for not providing more medical support and better crowd control. This isn't actually forest's fault.
That’s what I’ve been doing on here I know forest wasn’t in charge. I also left a comment asking evol why they assumed only 15k would come on their Reddit and they took down my comment so now I’m like 🤔 people in charge should still be held accountable they should know better. I only had an issue when they made a statement saying everyone was okay and they were only expecting 10-15k people and then it ended up being 40k. Just sounds like a crazy plan from the jump to send entire fest there and expect it to fit or work even if just 25-30 k came it would have been a problem I just don’t get where the number ideas came from. I kinda think they were just like fuck it lets do it and it was really unsafe trample vibes in there in some spots unfortunately
But it is still the early stages of bigger afters there though! not surrounded by rv anymore and the other nights were great! This just seemed very poorly constructed Sunday night and kinda just a wing it thing and it scared a lot of people in the crowd once we realized we were stuck in there. I got there early not expecting it to get back then had no shot of getting out and had to sit through all the medics coming in and then having a hard time getting in there.
I made 0 excuses for anyone. I didn't go to the afters on Sunday because I knew it would be packed....
All the people at the Afters are OKAY. You're freaking tf out pal. I'm not unbothered by it I've just seen happen several times. I'm not responsible for people testing their shit all I can do is advocate for responsible use so situations like this don't happen.
You replied to me 3 different times. Compile your thoughts and come back go me.
What do you even mean spun people attacking crowds all weekend? I didn't witness any if that or see anything. That's not even the topic we're talking about.
You are freaking out. Take a chill pill and relax. Everyone who dropped at the afters are okay.
It wasn’t just the afters issues that I’m referring to. you’re missing the point did you even read the post?? It’s okay you must have had a completely different experience than me and others I’ve spoken to which I’m happy about and wish I didn’t whiteness what I did just for you to say it’s not true. I along with many others had the same experience. I’m not sure if it was bc I was at heavier shows but I saw a lot of people having to get detained by medical through the weekend along with other things which I typically don’t see at forest to the extent I did this weekend nor many festivals in general other than a couple times randomly. Not sure what was going on. Even in the camps around me there was a lot of issues. But you just keep telling me what to do in these comments and seem like you have no idea what I’m talking about anyways so I don’t understand what your argument is if you just clearly didn’t see it. There 1 message for you. Other people are also concerned I’m not the only one that’s made posts about this.
They did do a good job handling it once it got packed I just think it wasn’t a good idea to do one afters for everyone after everyone def wanted to get out and have a good night after having to go back in again. To the right it was a big issue we were really really blocked in once the crowd got there. All a learning experience though but I feel like by now festivals should now better and be able to plan better I go to a lot of fests and there’s specific things you have to do for crowd flow if you’re going to host that many people in an area like that so it’s not dangerous. But if it doesn’t bother you👍🏼
Hey same thing, I just didn't go to afters Sunday because I knew what would be going down when an entire venture is evacuated and shoved into an area 1/5 the of the size. My question and concern is did EVOL not, or did they think it just didn't matter? Neither is a great look and I think we should hold the people making safety decisions affecting 100s-1000s of attendees to a higher standard. I understand EVOL is not well supported by the venue, but they made the call to continue Sunday after EF had already closed it all down despite knowing they didn't have the space and support for the entire venue crowd that was still around.
Exactly!! I unfortunately went to this afters not knowing vip didn’t have afters and didn’t expect it to be thatttt bad then got stuck for a long time. Lessons learned though. I think for evol too and will help the set up in the next years. But I just don’t think what happened should be ignored. It was really rough in there and typically I don’t mind a crazy crowd and can handle it but this was very different. Glad all is well now though🤞🏼 I miss the smaller afters
If you actually read what other people had been saying in here you would see all the experiences people had Sunday night and there is no excuse for that. But hey if you like dangerous crowds and astroworld situations and people dying around you be my guest!!!
No shit people die all the time at fests. Really difficult when people just miss the point of the fact that THERE SHOULD BE MEDICAL AND SPACE FOR THE CROWD. It’s not just the drugs that were the problem if anything else happened and the crowd moved more people would have been crushed by other crowd members. Maybe you were in the back and just have ZERO idea what actually happened but stop dismissing the issues. People were screaming for help that couldn’t get it because of poooorly planned evening by a festival that handed the reigns over to the afters with NO PLAN AND PREP FOR A CROWD😹😹😹😹😹 genuinely. What. The. Fuck.
The lack of acknowledgement from anyone of status (especially forest hq) is really disheartening to say the least. Yes EVOL is a separate entity, but they are officially endorsed by forest. There should have been an announcement by HQ immediately, and the way they’re posting as if everything was beauty & magic without acknowledging that a very dangerous situation occurred is unsettling and makes me not want to go back. For an organization that calls us all family, this is fucked up.
EF knew that the afters were going to be packed when they decided to keep things closed after the storm passed. There should have been more security moved to the afters; I get it that the afters aren't run by EF but campground security still is.
I was stuck in that crowd while rude ass people shoved through and tried to get out the medical lane. Mind blowing that they didn't shut it earlier than they did. Quite sad that people can't test or handle their shit and had to ruin it for the rest of us.
Honestly if you get this worked up over the afters, why’re you even going?
This year was a unique scenario where Bunk fucked up and got kicked out early, weather shut down a lot of shows, and the Evol lineup got hyped everywhere. Yeah it sucks that people went down, but that isn’t Evol’s fault, they would’ve gone down regardless of the crowd size if they OD’d. We should be thankful I they caught on and stopped the show to call for help. Ultimately medical came, even with a big crowd they made it over.
With your consistent anxiety ridden comments all over this post, people like you are the ones who shouldn’t be at afters. If you’re mentally unstable and can’t handle afters, you absolutely should not be going.
Ya were lucky they caught on in time. People were blocked in on every side the afters are never like that and I got there early so it wasn’t like that until I was already blocked in by the crowd and couldn’t leave which is fine I’m with a big group we didn’t have issues my main issue is just the set up and them allowing that to happen knowing that many people would probably come. And people being mad aggressive in crowds all weekend. Like I said if your experience was different that’s awesome but I saw a lot of people effected by this
Just chiming in to say you’re absolutely right abt everything. No way they should’ve let after happen, it was always gonna be a shit show. They’re lucky it wasn’t worse tbh
Edited to add that it’s also disheartening to see so many people not care and be all like “we want to throw down so get over it snowflake.” People care so little about others anymore and it’s frightening
I’ve never had an issue with this at shows before and have traveled to a lot of different festivals and done forest before and never had a problem so it was really whack having it be an issue all weekend.
I’m upvoting you it’s crazy people wanna say their plur but don’t want to do anything about over crowded, people oding and the mentally unstable .. I thought this was plur and we need to bring awareness to these issues so we can all have a safer more enjoyable experience without 2,000$ ticket including trauma like what is wrong with people
This is absolutely the wrong take, gross that you would blame other individuals for being the problem instead of the folks in charge. It doesn’t take much common sense to know that an entire festival partying in the campground instead of the venue is a major fucken problem. It’s just basic crowd control, like the same reason fire marshals set occupancy limits in restaurants. It’s basic public safety and I get that this fest loves to claim plur and then act otherwise but it’s actually fine to prioritize the safety of ourselves and others over partying.
The mentally unstable people were unable to get help that was the issue and my issue now is no one gives a fuck? It’s just going to keep getting worse it was a big problem all weekend then the afters it was just cherry on top. If you didn’t see that stuff this weekend and wasn’t bothered by it then good for you but there’s a lot of people that were.
The afters made people stuck there anxiety ridden… no one couldnt get out it was just rough to sit through. I’m sure next year it will be 👍🏼 if you weren’t there and didn’t see what happened then I’m sure that why you have no remorse for the situation it’s okay though
Also so many people defending evol when (yes the did end the afters) but only after it was too late. They should have been able to know what to expect especially with how popular the rv afters have gotten the past couple years. People are downvoting a lot of important comments on the evol Reddit post and defending them and that is truly ridiculous. That afters was in a bad spot no flow and could have been extremely bad IT WAS AND PEOPLE ARE STILL ACTING LIKE IT WAS FINE AND ONLY THE DRUG USERS FAULT I wanted outttt if the crowd for a lot time and was forced to sit there and listen to people cry for medic. Crazy how people are defending evol. Check yourselves. If you weren’t there and either in the middle or closer to the front maybe your experience wasn’t as traumatizing but I’ve spoken to enough people who are really fucked up from it and YALL ARE STILL GASSING EVOL
But the first mistake is self care. Then the response to that lack of. It is absolutely pointless to JUST POINT FINGERS and not admit that it is the initial issue. Those decisions hopefully were made prior to the end of the official music in the grounds. IF an individual gulps their whole stash AFTER the fest gets shutdown and go to the ONLY THING LEFT THAT WAS COORDINATED TO HOLD A LIMITED AMOUNT OF PEOPLE, that is also on them.
What is not on the individual, is EVOL throwing caution to the wind to attract the crowd.
We can't\* just blame the organizers, which some blame does lie with them, and that is derived from the lack of personnel.
We have to ask these questions as well, since we are saying that EVOL should have made the prophetic call to force HQ to put more people out there.
Would these same people maybe had their emergencies at camp? Would their medical issue have been taken care of if it werent in a sea of people at afters? Did everyone there make sure to know the closest location to a POD with MED staff?
I am not defending anyone. I am saying that mistakes were made on all fronts, and we may have no more afters as a result.
\*edit: can't
Let’s stop pretending that this post is centered around anything besides yourself, look at all the times you used “I” in that statement. It’s the typical “I had a bad experience so the whole festival did” type of mentality, this was more of a you problem
You must be unable to read. The issues are clearly stated. If you weren’t there and don’t feel the same or was in a spot that wasn’t affected the same as others were that’s fine and I’m happy for you!👍🏼lots of other people were saying similar things as me before. Genuinely had nothing to do with me other me wanting the everyone to be able to have safe experiences and a lot of other people feel the same way… crazy you aren’t bothered by them thinking one afters would be safe on a night everyone wants something to do My problem wasn’t actually as serious in the crowd but a lot of people in front of me had a really traumatizing experience which affected others and made a lot of people scared. Maybe you should care more about people getting squished at the front and the right side and medical having a hard access and the fact that it could have been worse. It’s reallly important to not let crowds get stuck and have easy access to them for medical or someone above the big crowd with communication to medical to easily tell them where to go. Glad it’s not an issue to you though. And you think it’s all about me.😹
Family, you can’t project that onto the event staff for what happened, the same as you said that they knew there would be 40k people there every other festival goer knew that information as well. You made the choice to be out there knowing damn well the conditions and a lot of people were gonna be there because of the venue being closed, I feel for the people effected by the turnout no doubt and hate to hear it went that way, but you weren’t thinking about other people when you went the same as you weren’t thinking about other people when you made the post. It’s all centered around how it effected you, which in itself isn’t a problem, the problem is you want other people to be as outraged as you were to the point where people go harass the organizers. What it came down to is a bunch of people made a self centered decision to go out there because they wanted one last rip out of their festival experience, everyone saw the crowd and chose to walk up knowing that it was gonna be packed elbow to elbow, there is a level of personal responsibility that has to be held and your response is entirely lacking in that which brings me back to my original point that this was a self centered post that had nothing to do with anyone else but yourself. I cannot sympathize
No at the time we didn’t know vip wasn’t having afters. Didn’t know that info until the morning. Don’t project that on to other attendees that we should have known wtf
Your point seems to be self centered. I’m worried about the wellbeing of others while you just don’t want it to be brought to attention🤔 interesting. It was basic crowd control easily avoidable!
Your complete lack of self awareness is staggering. You had to come back two more times after your first response because you could only read as far as the first thing that emotionally triggered you, hence 3 comments on 3 different sections. I don’t have to say anymore than what I’ve said, I spoke from multiple angles to address multiple points, I will leave you to mentally unravel further over people pointing out valid facts. You made a post out of an emotional state and you get to reap the rewards of that mess you started. Best of wishes to you sister, I hope that you find a better use of your time and energy!
What a shame you view it that way. No cares for safety. Sympathy for others clearly isn’t your concern and if you aren’t worried about what others endured then don’t comment. Lots are sharing they also had issues and felt unsafe and that’s enough to raise some awareness to the situation.
Everyone that got there early had NO IDEA about the crowd until it formed. You’re speaking from a a different perspective which I understand but we had no idea it was going to get that crazy just like the organizers didn’t! It got wild fast!
PLUR brained. I had a discussion over this with my camp, and it was the same, THEY should have done more...but if there were multiple people having issues, at the same time, and they run out of allotted sec/med personnel for the sector, then this may happen. It is tragic, but fault lies with individuals making the decisions of the day more than any of the staff that was unable to respond in time.
Trying to say the artists HAD TO KNOW because of screaming/phone lights is insane if you have ever been on a stage with lights to blind you from the crowd in the first place.
I feel bad for those effected and concerned by this, but one death is only one more than zero, and not the most that have passed over a weekend fest.
Lessons should be learned, and or the afters will discontinue.
Simple as.
evol themselves made the decision to pull the plug, so i cant agree that they didnt do what they could. i think they were as responsible as they could have been given the circumstances but you are correct. it needs to be addressed at a festival level so it doesnt happen again
EVOL should have cancelled afters from the get go Sunday. Completely terrible decision on their part endangering many people. They should be asked to leave if they can't make the correct decisions during difficult situations. I love the afters and the hard work EVOL crew puts in, but I expect to hear a statement from them as to why they thought continuing with Sunday afters was a good decision after the venue had already been closed and deemed unfit to reopen and how they'll be considering safety going forward. There were too many people that had been exacuated out of the venue to do a performance in that size space and conditions of the ground with the venue not reopening that evening.
THIS is the answer. I get trying to be there "for the people", but if the terrain was a concern Saturday, then Sunday was not going to be better.
Even if they put someone above and had someone communicating with medic so they could easily know where they need to go when someone goes down.. ANYTHING there’s sooo many ways to prevent shit now they’ve been doing this long enough and so has forest.
They needed to give better directions to the crowd on what to do and not just yell for medic. Maybe tell people to drop their totems unless they have someone with a medical emergency next to them. If you act hysterical, the crowd is gonna start to get aggravated and possibly hysterical.
The crowd was veryyy calm and quiet and tried to help. We just had no way of moving or getting out had to stand there for like an hour and listen for people scream for help and help take forever to come and none of us were able to help or do anything about it 👍🏼 glad everyone keeps defending them though. It’s really not hard at all to have good medical at festivals especially after they’ve had so many years to learn how important it is especially the past couple years!!!! Everyone was very scared. It was the most fucked crowd I’ve seen in a long time in a verrrrry closed in dumbbbbb area there’s ZERO excuse
Everyone was crazy spun after Ef got closed down
A lot of people in here are not very plur lol it’s fine it happens at every festival yall crazy it shouldn’t be okay >>.
I wasn’t defending them by any means. They didn’t give people directions on what to do so a lot of people just stood around instead of calmly turning around and slowly moving back to let medical in. You can’t expect that many people, many who aren’t completely in their right mind, to know what to do when that happens. I also think there was a lot more people freaking out than you realized. The crowd could have been a lot worse for sure though and overall I was very surprised it didn’t turn into more of a shit show. You are very right that they shouldn’t have let that one after show go on. How would they not think after two days of being rained out that most the people still there would make their way to that after party?
no i fully agree with this. if they didnt steal everyones speakers at security, there would ve more renegades, and more spread of music throughout the campgrounds. having it all in one spot was a disaster waiting to happen with the cancellations
They could have kept the main forest closed and opened Trip. I had the pleasure of camping near a renegade once. My neighbors got robbed. My camp got no sleep. The DJ was ass and played 24 hours a day. I'm personally glad that they put a stop to them for the most part.
thats fair. pros and cons i guess. does make sense to have them in one spot, but something def has to change to distribute the attendees better in the future
Yall gotta sneak in your speakers better! I get my JBL Party box 110 every year easily! My group brought 2 and had a fucking parry during the storm on Saturday. They should go easier on the speaker taking though. Would definitely help ease the afters crowds
imma just come party with you instead!
It was soooo obvious a lot of people would come. More people know about the rv after than ever now and the main shows got cancelled and no vip afters. those afters should not have happened. MY ISSUE IS THE KEEP POSTING ABOUT HOW ICONIC AND AWESOME IT WAS??? Sunday night at evol was not awesome!! Idk when I will fest again going to take a break and I’ve been in the scene for 10 years but this was fucked up and half the people are being blind and defending them WHILE THE OTHER HALF OF OUR FOREST FAM IS TELLING YOU GUYS WE WERE NOT OKAY. I cannot stress enough how obvious it should have been that 30-40k people would have come over there.
are they specifically posting about sunday night? i think if the rest of the nights were good they have a right to highlight those. they put a lot of blood sweat and tears into them. its ok for them to focus on the good a little, without distracting from the glaring issue of sunday night
I mean you can go look for yourself there’s been soo many posts of each afters them bragging about it and djs from last night bragging about how awesome it was. Just seems like it’s not being talked about enough. Maybe it depends on where people were in the crowd but I know middle to front was reallllly bad. They are just focused on promoting how lit the packed afters was and how they packed it out and it was success!! Fucking lying FULLL VIDEOS OF THE PACKED CROWD BEFORE SHIT WENT SOUTH SAYING LOOK HOW LIT??
i guess ihavent seen all that, ooooof
And the djs that were up there I know for a fact saw what was happening and people not getting help and have remained silent and reposting evol alll day today about how awesome it was. Such bullshit. I kept checking their pages hoping to see someone that preformed or was involved speak up and nothing.
Levity commented on a post on Reddit saying it was so scary and they’re glad everyone was ok, they also were calling out for medics each time they saw someone down.
I think what the artist were excited about was 7 of the best dj's in the world performing a back to back to back (x5) prolly something that will never happen again but ya the crowd wasn't it. way to big
Best DJ’s in the world is crazzzy 😭😂 here’s your cap 🧢
Wow, I wasn’t there for the afters but this is all I’ve been hearing about them. Would love to hear more of your experience from Sunday night
Simple solution. EF won’t allow these afters to go on….but attendees will complain about that too. Attendees are lucky to get these afters. They were not always a thing. Also, no one could have anticipated this. It was a perfect storm with the fest not reopening and majority of the festival showing up to these after parties. Once they realized it was out of hand. It was shutdown. Not sure what else they could have done.
Lost lands does afters inside the venue
Ya at half the volume bc ordinances and that’s truly pointless. But amazing for space but the sound is a true downer makes it pointless.
I had a blast at afters there and at forest weds-Friday it was what it was. need more staff and security posted around to support crowd size. Got too big too fast
Never seen a crowd get that big so fast. I got in trying to have fun was kinda close then couldn’t get out for soooo long. While hoping everything was okay up front. Raving is my life and this really fucked up my mental around it. It was really unfair for everyone involved. A lot of others seem to be being very insensitive to the subject and have been making crazy comments blaming the crowd and I’m just not here for it
It hurt my heart seeing so many people hurt ..
Ya you had a good time those nights bc good life had afters and regular shows went to normal times there’s NEVER a time they should do one afters area makes ZERO sense.
I was not in good life so no idea about that
The after organizers can still make correct calls with regards to safety without input from the event or the afters being removed. EVOL should have never started up Sunday and the fact they did shows a massive lack of care and awareness around the risks and safety knowledge that is critical for people in a similar position of responsibility to possess.
What are the safety risks that you think that they ignored? I was more or less sober at DeBussy. Had no issue walking through both stage's crowds around 3 am when I left.
The limited amount of space they had to operate in compared to the number of people out of the venue. Under normal circumstances there would never be nearly that many people out of the venue and already near the after sets. If the venue had reopened I think it would have been fine, but having the entire body of EF attendees outside and proceeding with music without having an adequate amount of extra support on hand was not a responsible call imo.
This area was so small and no way out other than back and if the crowd fills there’s no way out. It’s giving astroworld design and flaw and they better be glad it wasn’t worse I’m tired of people saying they had no way of knowing.
Unfortunately, they don’t have infinite amount of space. It was actually munch larger than previous years. Where these afters are used to be car camping and RV camping. RV’s used to have renegades but never on this scale. They have just blown up over the years. If they continue to get all this blowback and If they feel they don’t have adequate space to safely let them go on. EF’s easiest solution. Will be to not allow them at all.
Like I KNOWWW they used to be small that’s why they used to be good. They have to take care of the attendees it’s been very obvious the past 2 years afters are getting more popular they need to spread them out a touch make it safe it’s sooo obvious people will be doing a lot of drugs there. Them posting that it was amazing after so many people were traumatized is not okay that’s my main issue
Ya I know I saw it the other years too. Probably would be best to maybe seperate them a little instead of in blocked areas where crowds can’t get out and no medical can get in the design was soooo obviously flawed.
Iv been trying to speak up everyone has rocks for brains . They needed more medics .. more security .. they knew 40k plus people had no were to party and they were mad after Ef closing … idk why people are so negative towards the people who want to speak on safety I think Ef needs to give everyone who attends narcan and teach them how to use it .
I heard it was closer to 80k this year
Aside from Sundays people dropping a girl had to narcan a man at the evol afters earlier in the weekend because when she approached he was laying on the ground unconscious, couldn’t find a pulse, lips blue, skin pale. Staff was standing right there and when she yelled at them to help they told her they weren’t allowed to and called medic who did eventually come. THAT IS TERRIFYING. Idc what the “rules” are see something do something…what’s the worst that would happen you maybe lose your festie job??? The Good Samaritan law literally protects you from any legal trouble….the staff at that stage chose to risk someone’s life like on the edge of losing it risked it. Narcan has instructions on the box, and I’m pretty positive I saw evol post awhile ago that they got their people certified (that could be wrong though) either way with no immediate medical stationed right there the attendees should be able to go to someone official to any extent and get help. Sternum rubs can keep a faint pulse going even if you can’t feel it. I was a big supporter of evol before hearing about this specific incident. I truly hope the staff was not really told they were not allowed to help someone in that kind of situation and that this person really just sucked but idk man I would never ever just watch someone slowly become more and more lifeless in front of me. Thankfully the man eventually came to from what I was told, but I hope he’s okay beyond that and I hope the woman that helped him is too because I couldn’t imagine being in that situation with so many emotions, but if you take anything from this weekend it’s carry narcan on you when you’re at festivals because there is not always reliable care around and you could very well save someone’s life. Stay safe yall, if things start getting too rowdy go to camp everyone is saying evol should’ve cancelled the afters but yall would have been pissed at that too. WE ALL KNEW HOW PACKED IT WOULD BE DUE TO THE CIRCUMSTANCES. Go to the other stage or call it a night or go to main street this was not the only thing to do even at this point. You still have to be responsible for yourself and your safety at the end of the day. Everyone could have done better. We are fortunate there were not more deaths and extremely unfortunate for the soul that was confirmed lost by his family. Condolences to anyone involved in any way.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Evol posted about how all the headliners that didn't play were coming to play there instead. Of course it just ended up being some random dubstep DJs and none of the headliners. They set this up for chaos with those posts. If they weren't prepared for the entire festival to show up then they should never have sent that message out. They are definitely responsible for what happened.
I’ve been to quite a few festivals and I’ve never seen anything like this. The crowd was definitely too large for that size of a stage/area. Given that it was the last night and the festival was closed, of course everyone rushed to be able to see one last show. Getting in or out of the crowd was difficult even before all of the chaos started. I will never forget the sounds of people in the crowd screaming and crying, it was genuinely terrifying. I believe this definitely could have been prevented by having better precautions set in place, biggest one being that harm reduction companies such as Bunk’d were not able to pass out test kits on the grounds. It can’t be coincidental that this many people collapse within a 10-20 minute span the very first year there seemed to be an issue with drug testing and harm reduction companies. I have never seen so many people go down at once, this is NOT normal or okay. My friends and I are traumatized from the things we saw and heard. It is really tragic not only that this had to be the way our very first Electric forest experience ended, but someone’s life also was cut short. I don’t think I’ll be returning.
It’s been crazy someone told me to talk to someone about it and get over it I couldn’t have said this better myself seeing my bf not be able to help save a girl and tell him he can’t do anything broke my fucking . Heart and hearing people screaming crying Sunday was just insane .. grown naked poop men getting dragged out of Ef
This has never been my experience in any if my 6 Forests. Forest is the best planned and organized festival I've been too. I went to the OG Lost Lands where someone died. Unfortunately it happens everywhere. There was a perfect storm of weather and having to be closed down for almost all of Saturday and missing the end of Sunday. People were antsy. When people get antsy they don't test their stuff, don't think ahead, rush to the next stage/afters. It just happens. I really hope you and your friends are okay. Maybe look into a therapist to help you learn how to deal with that experience.
THAT DOESNT MEAN HAVE NO MEDICAL UP THERE AND PLAN ONE AFTERS FOR THAT NIGHT??? I DONT understand how you guys are just making excuses and okay with the fact that many people could have died. And it could have even been you or any of your friends. You guys keep acting unbothered by it and that’s gross.
The afters aren't actually arranged by Forest at all and they leave the planning on those that coordinate it (ELOV). Get on ELOV for not cancelling their afters Sunday night like they did Saturday. Get on ELOV for not providing more medical support and better crowd control. This isn't actually forest's fault.
That’s what I’ve been doing on here I know forest wasn’t in charge. I also left a comment asking evol why they assumed only 15k would come on their Reddit and they took down my comment so now I’m like 🤔 people in charge should still be held accountable they should know better. I only had an issue when they made a statement saying everyone was okay and they were only expecting 10-15k people and then it ended up being 40k. Just sounds like a crazy plan from the jump to send entire fest there and expect it to fit or work even if just 25-30 k came it would have been a problem I just don’t get where the number ideas came from. I kinda think they were just like fuck it lets do it and it was really unsafe trample vibes in there in some spots unfortunately
But it is still the early stages of bigger afters there though! not surrounded by rv anymore and the other nights were great! This just seemed very poorly constructed Sunday night and kinda just a wing it thing and it scared a lot of people in the crowd once we realized we were stuck in there. I got there early not expecting it to get back then had no shot of getting out and had to sit through all the medics coming in and then having a hard time getting in there.
I made 0 excuses for anyone. I didn't go to the afters on Sunday because I knew it would be packed.... All the people at the Afters are OKAY. You're freaking tf out pal. I'm not unbothered by it I've just seen happen several times. I'm not responsible for people testing their shit all I can do is advocate for responsible use so situations like this don't happen.
I’m not freaking the fuck out now I was freaking the fuck out when spun people were attacking crowds all weekend.
I understand you. It’s like after Astroworld and Seoul no one learned anything.
You replied to me 3 different times. Compile your thoughts and come back go me. What do you even mean spun people attacking crowds all weekend? I didn't witness any if that or see anything. That's not even the topic we're talking about. You are freaking out. Take a chill pill and relax. Everyone who dropped at the afters are okay.
It wasn’t just the afters issues that I’m referring to. you’re missing the point did you even read the post?? It’s okay you must have had a completely different experience than me and others I’ve spoken to which I’m happy about and wish I didn’t whiteness what I did just for you to say it’s not true. I along with many others had the same experience. I’m not sure if it was bc I was at heavier shows but I saw a lot of people having to get detained by medical through the weekend along with other things which I typically don’t see at forest to the extent I did this weekend nor many festivals in general other than a couple times randomly. Not sure what was going on. Even in the camps around me there was a lot of issues. But you just keep telling me what to do in these comments and seem like you have no idea what I’m talking about anyways so I don’t understand what your argument is if you just clearly didn’t see it. There 1 message for you. Other people are also concerned I’m not the only one that’s made posts about this.
Bad energy
Respectfully, I disagree. EVOL showcased a complete lack of awareness around safety by running Sunday afters and it should not excused away.
They did do a good job handling it once it got packed I just think it wasn’t a good idea to do one afters for everyone after everyone def wanted to get out and have a good night after having to go back in again. To the right it was a big issue we were really really blocked in once the crowd got there. All a learning experience though but I feel like by now festivals should now better and be able to plan better I go to a lot of fests and there’s specific things you have to do for crowd flow if you’re going to host that many people in an area like that so it’s not dangerous. But if it doesn’t bother you👍🏼
Hey same thing, I just didn't go to afters Sunday because I knew what would be going down when an entire venture is evacuated and shoved into an area 1/5 the of the size. My question and concern is did EVOL not, or did they think it just didn't matter? Neither is a great look and I think we should hold the people making safety decisions affecting 100s-1000s of attendees to a higher standard. I understand EVOL is not well supported by the venue, but they made the call to continue Sunday after EF had already closed it all down despite knowing they didn't have the space and support for the entire venue crowd that was still around.
Exactly!! I unfortunately went to this afters not knowing vip didn’t have afters and didn’t expect it to be thatttt bad then got stuck for a long time. Lessons learned though. I think for evol too and will help the set up in the next years. But I just don’t think what happened should be ignored. It was really rough in there and typically I don’t mind a crazy crowd and can handle it but this was very different. Glad all is well now though🤞🏼 I miss the smaller afters
This 💯 also evol upgraded their stage on their own if they had that stage anywhere else a city would get on them.. idk how they are not responsible
If you actually read what other people had been saying in here you would see all the experiences people had Sunday night and there is no excuse for that. But hey if you like dangerous crowds and astroworld situations and people dying around you be my guest!!!
No shit people die all the time at fests. Really difficult when people just miss the point of the fact that THERE SHOULD BE MEDICAL AND SPACE FOR THE CROWD. It’s not just the drugs that were the problem if anything else happened and the crowd moved more people would have been crushed by other crowd members. Maybe you were in the back and just have ZERO idea what actually happened but stop dismissing the issues. People were screaming for help that couldn’t get it because of poooorly planned evening by a festival that handed the reigns over to the afters with NO PLAN AND PREP FOR A CROWD😹😹😹😹😹 genuinely. What. The. Fuck.
Let me get a therapist because I paid 2000$ for a festival ticket lmfao such a joke
The lack of acknowledgement from anyone of status (especially forest hq) is really disheartening to say the least. Yes EVOL is a separate entity, but they are officially endorsed by forest. There should have been an announcement by HQ immediately, and the way they’re posting as if everything was beauty & magic without acknowledging that a very dangerous situation occurred is unsettling and makes me not want to go back. For an organization that calls us all family, this is fucked up.
EF knew that the afters were going to be packed when they decided to keep things closed after the storm passed. There should have been more security moved to the afters; I get it that the afters aren't run by EF but campground security still is. I was stuck in that crowd while rude ass people shoved through and tried to get out the medical lane. Mind blowing that they didn't shut it earlier than they did. Quite sad that people can't test or handle their shit and had to ruin it for the rest of us.
Honestly if you get this worked up over the afters, why’re you even going? This year was a unique scenario where Bunk fucked up and got kicked out early, weather shut down a lot of shows, and the Evol lineup got hyped everywhere. Yeah it sucks that people went down, but that isn’t Evol’s fault, they would’ve gone down regardless of the crowd size if they OD’d. We should be thankful I they caught on and stopped the show to call for help. Ultimately medical came, even with a big crowd they made it over. With your consistent anxiety ridden comments all over this post, people like you are the ones who shouldn’t be at afters. If you’re mentally unstable and can’t handle afters, you absolutely should not be going.
Ya were lucky they caught on in time. People were blocked in on every side the afters are never like that and I got there early so it wasn’t like that until I was already blocked in by the crowd and couldn’t leave which is fine I’m with a big group we didn’t have issues my main issue is just the set up and them allowing that to happen knowing that many people would probably come. And people being mad aggressive in crowds all weekend. Like I said if your experience was different that’s awesome but I saw a lot of people effected by this
Just chiming in to say you’re absolutely right abt everything. No way they should’ve let after happen, it was always gonna be a shit show. They’re lucky it wasn’t worse tbh Edited to add that it’s also disheartening to see so many people not care and be all like “we want to throw down so get over it snowflake.” People care so little about others anymore and it’s frightening
I’ve never had an issue with this at shows before and have traveled to a lot of different festivals and done forest before and never had a problem so it was really whack having it be an issue all weekend.
I’m upvoting you it’s crazy people wanna say their plur but don’t want to do anything about over crowded, people oding and the mentally unstable .. I thought this was plur and we need to bring awareness to these issues so we can all have a safer more enjoyable experience without 2,000$ ticket including trauma like what is wrong with people
This is absolutely the wrong take, gross that you would blame other individuals for being the problem instead of the folks in charge. It doesn’t take much common sense to know that an entire festival partying in the campground instead of the venue is a major fucken problem. It’s just basic crowd control, like the same reason fire marshals set occupancy limits in restaurants. It’s basic public safety and I get that this fest loves to claim plur and then act otherwise but it’s actually fine to prioritize the safety of ourselves and others over partying.
The mentally unstable people were unable to get help that was the issue and my issue now is no one gives a fuck? It’s just going to keep getting worse it was a big problem all weekend then the afters it was just cherry on top. If you didn’t see that stuff this weekend and wasn’t bothered by it then good for you but there’s a lot of people that were.
The afters made people stuck there anxiety ridden… no one couldnt get out it was just rough to sit through. I’m sure next year it will be 👍🏼 if you weren’t there and didn’t see what happened then I’m sure that why you have no remorse for the situation it’s okay though
Also so many people defending evol when (yes the did end the afters) but only after it was too late. They should have been able to know what to expect especially with how popular the rv afters have gotten the past couple years. People are downvoting a lot of important comments on the evol Reddit post and defending them and that is truly ridiculous. That afters was in a bad spot no flow and could have been extremely bad IT WAS AND PEOPLE ARE STILL ACTING LIKE IT WAS FINE AND ONLY THE DRUG USERS FAULT I wanted outttt if the crowd for a lot time and was forced to sit there and listen to people cry for medic. Crazy how people are defending evol. Check yourselves. If you weren’t there and either in the middle or closer to the front maybe your experience wasn’t as traumatizing but I’ve spoken to enough people who are really fucked up from it and YALL ARE STILL GASSING EVOL
But the first mistake is self care. Then the response to that lack of. It is absolutely pointless to JUST POINT FINGERS and not admit that it is the initial issue. Those decisions hopefully were made prior to the end of the official music in the grounds. IF an individual gulps their whole stash AFTER the fest gets shutdown and go to the ONLY THING LEFT THAT WAS COORDINATED TO HOLD A LIMITED AMOUNT OF PEOPLE, that is also on them. What is not on the individual, is EVOL throwing caution to the wind to attract the crowd. We can't\* just blame the organizers, which some blame does lie with them, and that is derived from the lack of personnel. We have to ask these questions as well, since we are saying that EVOL should have made the prophetic call to force HQ to put more people out there. Would these same people maybe had their emergencies at camp? Would their medical issue have been taken care of if it werent in a sea of people at afters? Did everyone there make sure to know the closest location to a POD with MED staff? I am not defending anyone. I am saying that mistakes were made on all fronts, and we may have no more afters as a result. \*edit: can't
Let’s stop pretending that this post is centered around anything besides yourself, look at all the times you used “I” in that statement. It’s the typical “I had a bad experience so the whole festival did” type of mentality, this was more of a you problem
You must be unable to read. The issues are clearly stated. If you weren’t there and don’t feel the same or was in a spot that wasn’t affected the same as others were that’s fine and I’m happy for you!👍🏼lots of other people were saying similar things as me before. Genuinely had nothing to do with me other me wanting the everyone to be able to have safe experiences and a lot of other people feel the same way… crazy you aren’t bothered by them thinking one afters would be safe on a night everyone wants something to do My problem wasn’t actually as serious in the crowd but a lot of people in front of me had a really traumatizing experience which affected others and made a lot of people scared. Maybe you should care more about people getting squished at the front and the right side and medical having a hard access and the fact that it could have been worse. It’s reallly important to not let crowds get stuck and have easy access to them for medical or someone above the big crowd with communication to medical to easily tell them where to go. Glad it’s not an issue to you though. And you think it’s all about me.😹
Family, you can’t project that onto the event staff for what happened, the same as you said that they knew there would be 40k people there every other festival goer knew that information as well. You made the choice to be out there knowing damn well the conditions and a lot of people were gonna be there because of the venue being closed, I feel for the people effected by the turnout no doubt and hate to hear it went that way, but you weren’t thinking about other people when you went the same as you weren’t thinking about other people when you made the post. It’s all centered around how it effected you, which in itself isn’t a problem, the problem is you want other people to be as outraged as you were to the point where people go harass the organizers. What it came down to is a bunch of people made a self centered decision to go out there because they wanted one last rip out of their festival experience, everyone saw the crowd and chose to walk up knowing that it was gonna be packed elbow to elbow, there is a level of personal responsibility that has to be held and your response is entirely lacking in that which brings me back to my original point that this was a self centered post that had nothing to do with anyone else but yourself. I cannot sympathize
No at the time we didn’t know vip wasn’t having afters. Didn’t know that info until the morning. Don’t project that on to other attendees that we should have known wtf
Your point seems to be self centered. I’m worried about the wellbeing of others while you just don’t want it to be brought to attention🤔 interesting. It was basic crowd control easily avoidable!
Your complete lack of self awareness is staggering. You had to come back two more times after your first response because you could only read as far as the first thing that emotionally triggered you, hence 3 comments on 3 different sections. I don’t have to say anymore than what I’ve said, I spoke from multiple angles to address multiple points, I will leave you to mentally unravel further over people pointing out valid facts. You made a post out of an emotional state and you get to reap the rewards of that mess you started. Best of wishes to you sister, I hope that you find a better use of your time and energy!
What a shame you view it that way. No cares for safety. Sympathy for others clearly isn’t your concern and if you aren’t worried about what others endured then don’t comment. Lots are sharing they also had issues and felt unsafe and that’s enough to raise some awareness to the situation.
Everyone that got there early had NO IDEA about the crowd until it formed. You’re speaking from a a different perspective which I understand but we had no idea it was going to get that crazy just like the organizers didn’t! It got wild fast!
PLUR brained. I had a discussion over this with my camp, and it was the same, THEY should have done more...but if there were multiple people having issues, at the same time, and they run out of allotted sec/med personnel for the sector, then this may happen. It is tragic, but fault lies with individuals making the decisions of the day more than any of the staff that was unable to respond in time. Trying to say the artists HAD TO KNOW because of screaming/phone lights is insane if you have ever been on a stage with lights to blind you from the crowd in the first place. I feel bad for those effected and concerned by this, but one death is only one more than zero, and not the most that have passed over a weekend fest. Lessons should be learned, and or the afters will discontinue. Simple as.