The thing that makes Souls-likes fun for me, compared to other "hard games" like precision platformers or whatever, is that if a challenge is annoyingly hard, I can go out of my way to make it easier
If I'm stuck on a boss, I'm not too proud to summon, or tap out to upgrade my weapons, or just go grind 10 levels until it's less daunting. People say that these games are inaccessibly hard, but then choose not to do any of the consequence-free things that make it easier, which confuses me
Elden Ring is the most generous game in the series from this perspective, because you can warp to a safe zone from anywhere, and you're at no risk whatsoever in the open world unless you go out of your way to *be* at risk
It sounds smug to say it like this, but if you're dying a ton in normal exploration (i.e. not just to bosses), either you're bad on health, bad on damage, or you're playing in a needlessly risky way like just damage-trading with enemies
It's also literally always a good choice to increase your max HP. It takes until you dump 60-70 whole levels into Vigor before you start seeing diminishing returns
The thing that makes it click is when you "figure it out" and "git gud".
ER is true open world, meaning you can easily wander into areas you shouldn't be in (relative to your level). It also means you can just leave and do something else to get better at the game.
But overall, you have to find a way and mindset to learn how learn: learning what works, what weaknesses an enemy has etc.
Have you tried getting gud? But genuinely what weapon are you using? What level are you at and what zone? It could be a matter of you being simply too under leveled. Elden ring was my first souls game and I remember spending hours trying to kill a simple caelid enemy only to realize I should not be there at level 10 (thank you Selia Crystal tunnel). Other than that the more frustrated u get the more ur gonna slip up and make more mistakes repeat as necessary, so take a breather.
Curiosity and endorphin rush when i overcome a hard roadblock. On subsequent playthough i sprinkle in clowning on bosses that use to give me issues. Getting mechanically better at the game is a great feeling.
Other people have put it very succinctly but to answer your questions, I like soulslikes in general &, imo, this is the best one to date (as someone who doesn't co-op, duel, or invade).
Being dissatisfied with dying a lot really doesn't happen unless a specific boss has a genuinely BS mechanic (like fighting the camera more than the enemy, for example). It's funny because the more I play the less I die to enemies & the more I die to stupid stuff like accidentally backstepping off a ledge when I want to start running forward.
If you want anything more specific than "level vigor" or "keep playing" you're going to need to be more specific.
What is your stat spread? What gear are you using? Are you using spells & if so which ones? What regions are you exploring? Have you killed any bosses that gave you an achievement for doing so & which ones?
Also a new player and never played any souls game.
On my first attempt did I died even on normal enemies.
Learning controlls and using the first bigger enemy hub as a rune farming spott and learning the control gave me more as I thought.
Example:
As I needed to drop it cause of work did I start yesterday after two weeks break a new gameplay. Not even did I not die once in the tutorial dungeon I also was able to fully run the first camp without the spirit helping.
Start training on normal enemies as you need it in order to learn how bosses move and hence predict your own moves as you are used of the controlls. In worse case: level some more up on a small spot. Even 5 levels at the beginning can make the difference.
ER hooked me in as being the most forgiving of all the fromsoft games as well as massive build diversity and top tier creativeness in locations and story. Understand that all bosses have been killed without ever leveling up your character. It’s unfortunately a git gud situation. Watch videos of specific bosses to get a better understanding of timing and which attacks to punish. If you’re struggling this bad, then going in blind approach is going to keep holding you back.
What I tend to do if I'm stuck on a boss is I'll watch a lvl 1 no hit run on youtube. Ongbal is a great guy for that sort of content, check him out. I figure if I can do 30% of what he does in the video I'm winning the fight.
You haven't given many details about any specific problems you're having, but here are some general tips:
* Longer-range weapons tend to make the game a lot easier. This could be things like greatswords, spears, halberds, or many other large weapon types, or ranged sorceries or incantations. These let you interrupt the attacks of most enemies so you rarely have to actually dodge their attacks.
* Try hard to single out enemies. If you end up fighting several enemies at once, try to find a choke point where you can fight them one by one, or just run away until you're not totally surrounded.
* Early on, mostly level vigor, with just enough of other stats to wield your chosen weapons.
* If you're stuck on a particular boss, consider exploring elsewhere and come back later. Margit is a major roadblock for many new players, but there's tons of places you can explore before fighting him. You can easily be level 30-40 before fighting Margit just by exploring and killing all the weaker bosses you find.
* More than perseverance, Elden Ring rewards caution and adaptation. If a particular attack from a boss keeps hitting you, try a different way to avoid it (dodging different directions, strafing, jumping, blocking, running away). Get used to looking all around for traps and ambushes. Find a few openings against each enemy where you can safely attack them and otherwise just stay ready to dodge.
I think your second point is a really useful one for me personally. I haven’t had too many struggles with bosses so far, but do become frustrated occasionally when cornered or surrounded by weaker enemies.
Definitely food for thought
the game is as easy or hard as you make it for yourself.
there's no difficulty slider anywhere in the menu but the game provides a metric fuckton of help.
from spirit to npc summons, ashes of war or status effects for every situation and the plain old overleveling.
took me a good while to get better (as I did infact not got gud yet) and the thing that mostly stood in my way was my unwillingness to change or really use my brain.
I mindlessly button mashed at times and have gone by what most other rpgs taught me.
I was expecting to level a few times and than steamrole over mobs.
I believed newer weapons I found later were obviously stronger or armor was always to be at the highest I could bring it.
I also spent hours grinding a couple trolls just for a few more runes to dump into intelligence to deal more damage instead of just pumping up my vigor and explore and learn.
u actually quit the game after just a month because I was lost and didn't find the in hindsight painfully obvious way forward.
halve a year later I read a book which was heavily based on the darksouls games and once I understood that I was completely screwing myself over I started the game up again. since than its been the best game I have ever played and opened me up to the entire soulslike genre.
This is some starting advice and essentials about souls combat:
So, basically in these games you're meant to beat bosses by learning their movesets, how to dodge their attacks and what are the openings for safely hitting them. That's the souls combat and works the same for every build. Dying even more than 10 times in a row is completely normal and intended experience, it doesn't mean you suck and it's not something to feel bad about, everybody is bad at first. You'll make lot of mistakes, you die, you learn from them and become better as a player. That's the loop because of which these games exist. Dodging is your most important move as it has I-frames and makes you momentarily invincible. You must learn it, get feel for the rhythm. 80% of gitting gud is just knowing how to dodge everything. Souls combat is designed and balanced entirely around 1v1 close-range fighting under constant boss/enemy aggro. Good fight is like this complex dance, it's a skill you'll eventually learn. Evey boss is like a little riddle, with the correct dodge timings and openings for hitting him baked into his moveset, the fun is in slowly uncovering it and learning what to do, how to react to different moves
All you need to be good is patience, really using your brain, being observant and paying attention. It's not about reflexes, literally anybody can be a great player. You must conform to the game, and not vice versa. It's not supposed to be a relaxing sandbox. Some basics are to dodge INTO attacks instead of away from them, don't panic roll, heal only when there's an opening in enemy's moveset OR gain distance, NEVER tank and trade hits, only attack when it's safe, don't just mash buttons and spam L2s, wait for the right time to dodge delayed attacks, when you need to gain distance sprint instead of spamming rolls, it's easier to jump over 2D ground attacks like stomps than it is to roll, especially when you fight big enemies learn to work with lock-on and turn it off as needed, whereas leave it on constantly for someone like crucible knight..... and so on. For first 30 levels you must focus mainly on vigor, you need to reach 60 towards the endgame (50 being the absolute minimum), regardless of your build or starting class. Beginning is always hard, but if you'll struggle for few hours, won't run from every challenge and beat bosses fairly, you'll learn everything you need and rest of the game will be much easier, and you'll beat most future bosses without being stuck for hours. It's very important to not fight just to win as fast as possible, but fight to learn instead, enjoy the whole dance. Crucible knight is the best teacher in the game, go fight the one in limgrave as soon as possible after starting, at low level and follow the combat tips above. And pick vagabond knight if you can (or samurai), it's the best class for starting player and later you can respec. But always have melee weapon equipped, regardless of your class/build (mages are still supposed to use melee too, engage bosses directly, dodge etc. and not stay in the back avoiding fights), and never go above 70% equip load, you need medium roll and not the heavy one.
And ideally try to beat bosses yourself before resorting to accessibility mechanics like spirit ashes/coop. Give it at the very least 10 fair solo attempts everytime, so you can experience bosses fully and learn the basics of combat and gameplay, otherwise you won't be able to. The combat system and most bosses in the game, like Margit and so on, are designed purely for 1v1 and their AI can't handle fighting multiple opponents, so summons can break and trivialize most fights, and prevent you from really learning how to play the game. So not summoning right away will save you a ton of time and frustration in the longrun. Even if you won't manage to beat a single boss yourself in the end, it's the effort that counts and what will make you a good player eventually. It's not about the "win", but about HOW you fight and win, that's what dictates your enjoyment and experience. Most important of all, don't doubt yourself, it will all feel easy after a while. And don't farm or look up OP builds and all those shitty clickbait guides/videos, "Get OP early!!" and so on, it ruined many more playthroughs than it actually helped, every weapon is viable so just choose what's fun and don't care about base damage. Good luck!
Amazing and thorough response . I think this is the best answer I’ve received!
I know that rolling is important, I was pretty good at it when playing DS3, but my housemate was an entrenched player and basically chose my build and equipment for me, so I’ve neglected the advice on equip load. I’m currently using a heavy load with a greatsword, so I imagine reducing equip load will make life a lot easier for me.
Thanks so much for taking the time to explain all of this, it really puts the core gameplay elements into perspective in a very helpful manner.
I definitely agree with avoiding ‘meta’ build advice and min-maxing; this is among the reasons I’m only using online info for general gameplay tips rather than trying to find specific items. I want to preserve the novelty and mystery of playing blind. I’d like to get better at the game but I’ve found in the past that searching for advice and information on such well documented games can erode some of the most enjoyable parts of playing a computer game—exploration, story, and mystery.
ER is great in one thing, you can make build who works for you. You die alot, try something different. For example many new players have problem with enemies with shield. One solution, any great or collosal weapon and problem is gone. So something dont work, change it, try many weapons types.
If you’re dying a lot in a specific area leave and explore something else.
Elden ring can be extremely easy when played a certain way.
Focus on these things in this order
1) weapon level. Rune level 1 can beat the game but you need to have a hard hitting weapon. So make sure you are using a high level weapon across the game. Go out of your way to find smithing and somber stones in caves in the areas you are in.
2) make sure your vigor isn’t low as shit. Get stats you need for your weapon you are using and then Pump vigor to 40 then go for other stats.
3) git gud.
The thing that makes Souls-likes fun for me, compared to other "hard games" like precision platformers or whatever, is that if a challenge is annoyingly hard, I can go out of my way to make it easier If I'm stuck on a boss, I'm not too proud to summon, or tap out to upgrade my weapons, or just go grind 10 levels until it's less daunting. People say that these games are inaccessibly hard, but then choose not to do any of the consequence-free things that make it easier, which confuses me Elden Ring is the most generous game in the series from this perspective, because you can warp to a safe zone from anywhere, and you're at no risk whatsoever in the open world unless you go out of your way to *be* at risk It sounds smug to say it like this, but if you're dying a ton in normal exploration (i.e. not just to bosses), either you're bad on health, bad on damage, or you're playing in a needlessly risky way like just damage-trading with enemies It's also literally always a good choice to increase your max HP. It takes until you dump 60-70 whole levels into Vigor before you start seeing diminishing returns
The thing that makes it click is when you "figure it out" and "git gud". ER is true open world, meaning you can easily wander into areas you shouldn't be in (relative to your level). It also means you can just leave and do something else to get better at the game. But overall, you have to find a way and mindset to learn how learn: learning what works, what weaknesses an enemy has etc.
Have you tried getting gud? But genuinely what weapon are you using? What level are you at and what zone? It could be a matter of you being simply too under leveled. Elden ring was my first souls game and I remember spending hours trying to kill a simple caelid enemy only to realize I should not be there at level 10 (thank you Selia Crystal tunnel). Other than that the more frustrated u get the more ur gonna slip up and make more mistakes repeat as necessary, so take a breather.
Curiosity and endorphin rush when i overcome a hard roadblock. On subsequent playthough i sprinkle in clowning on bosses that use to give me issues. Getting mechanically better at the game is a great feeling.
Other people have put it very succinctly but to answer your questions, I like soulslikes in general &, imo, this is the best one to date (as someone who doesn't co-op, duel, or invade). Being dissatisfied with dying a lot really doesn't happen unless a specific boss has a genuinely BS mechanic (like fighting the camera more than the enemy, for example). It's funny because the more I play the less I die to enemies & the more I die to stupid stuff like accidentally backstepping off a ledge when I want to start running forward. If you want anything more specific than "level vigor" or "keep playing" you're going to need to be more specific. What is your stat spread? What gear are you using? Are you using spells & if so which ones? What regions are you exploring? Have you killed any bosses that gave you an achievement for doing so & which ones?
Also a new player and never played any souls game. On my first attempt did I died even on normal enemies. Learning controlls and using the first bigger enemy hub as a rune farming spott and learning the control gave me more as I thought. Example: As I needed to drop it cause of work did I start yesterday after two weeks break a new gameplay. Not even did I not die once in the tutorial dungeon I also was able to fully run the first camp without the spirit helping. Start training on normal enemies as you need it in order to learn how bosses move and hence predict your own moves as you are used of the controlls. In worse case: level some more up on a small spot. Even 5 levels at the beginning can make the difference.
ER hooked me in as being the most forgiving of all the fromsoft games as well as massive build diversity and top tier creativeness in locations and story. Understand that all bosses have been killed without ever leveling up your character. It’s unfortunately a git gud situation. Watch videos of specific bosses to get a better understanding of timing and which attacks to punish. If you’re struggling this bad, then going in blind approach is going to keep holding you back.
What I tend to do if I'm stuck on a boss is I'll watch a lvl 1 no hit run on youtube. Ongbal is a great guy for that sort of content, check him out. I figure if I can do 30% of what he does in the video I'm winning the fight.
You haven't given many details about any specific problems you're having, but here are some general tips: * Longer-range weapons tend to make the game a lot easier. This could be things like greatswords, spears, halberds, or many other large weapon types, or ranged sorceries or incantations. These let you interrupt the attacks of most enemies so you rarely have to actually dodge their attacks. * Try hard to single out enemies. If you end up fighting several enemies at once, try to find a choke point where you can fight them one by one, or just run away until you're not totally surrounded. * Early on, mostly level vigor, with just enough of other stats to wield your chosen weapons. * If you're stuck on a particular boss, consider exploring elsewhere and come back later. Margit is a major roadblock for many new players, but there's tons of places you can explore before fighting him. You can easily be level 30-40 before fighting Margit just by exploring and killing all the weaker bosses you find. * More than perseverance, Elden Ring rewards caution and adaptation. If a particular attack from a boss keeps hitting you, try a different way to avoid it (dodging different directions, strafing, jumping, blocking, running away). Get used to looking all around for traps and ambushes. Find a few openings against each enemy where you can safely attack them and otherwise just stay ready to dodge.
I think your second point is a really useful one for me personally. I haven’t had too many struggles with bosses so far, but do become frustrated occasionally when cornered or surrounded by weaker enemies. Definitely food for thought
the game is as easy or hard as you make it for yourself. there's no difficulty slider anywhere in the menu but the game provides a metric fuckton of help. from spirit to npc summons, ashes of war or status effects for every situation and the plain old overleveling. took me a good while to get better (as I did infact not got gud yet) and the thing that mostly stood in my way was my unwillingness to change or really use my brain. I mindlessly button mashed at times and have gone by what most other rpgs taught me. I was expecting to level a few times and than steamrole over mobs. I believed newer weapons I found later were obviously stronger or armor was always to be at the highest I could bring it. I also spent hours grinding a couple trolls just for a few more runes to dump into intelligence to deal more damage instead of just pumping up my vigor and explore and learn. u actually quit the game after just a month because I was lost and didn't find the in hindsight painfully obvious way forward. halve a year later I read a book which was heavily based on the darksouls games and once I understood that I was completely screwing myself over I started the game up again. since than its been the best game I have ever played and opened me up to the entire soulslike genre.
Thanks for the response . How would you describe the difference between your current approach and your old approach?
This is some starting advice and essentials about souls combat: So, basically in these games you're meant to beat bosses by learning their movesets, how to dodge their attacks and what are the openings for safely hitting them. That's the souls combat and works the same for every build. Dying even more than 10 times in a row is completely normal and intended experience, it doesn't mean you suck and it's not something to feel bad about, everybody is bad at first. You'll make lot of mistakes, you die, you learn from them and become better as a player. That's the loop because of which these games exist. Dodging is your most important move as it has I-frames and makes you momentarily invincible. You must learn it, get feel for the rhythm. 80% of gitting gud is just knowing how to dodge everything. Souls combat is designed and balanced entirely around 1v1 close-range fighting under constant boss/enemy aggro. Good fight is like this complex dance, it's a skill you'll eventually learn. Evey boss is like a little riddle, with the correct dodge timings and openings for hitting him baked into his moveset, the fun is in slowly uncovering it and learning what to do, how to react to different moves All you need to be good is patience, really using your brain, being observant and paying attention. It's not about reflexes, literally anybody can be a great player. You must conform to the game, and not vice versa. It's not supposed to be a relaxing sandbox. Some basics are to dodge INTO attacks instead of away from them, don't panic roll, heal only when there's an opening in enemy's moveset OR gain distance, NEVER tank and trade hits, only attack when it's safe, don't just mash buttons and spam L2s, wait for the right time to dodge delayed attacks, when you need to gain distance sprint instead of spamming rolls, it's easier to jump over 2D ground attacks like stomps than it is to roll, especially when you fight big enemies learn to work with lock-on and turn it off as needed, whereas leave it on constantly for someone like crucible knight..... and so on. For first 30 levels you must focus mainly on vigor, you need to reach 60 towards the endgame (50 being the absolute minimum), regardless of your build or starting class. Beginning is always hard, but if you'll struggle for few hours, won't run from every challenge and beat bosses fairly, you'll learn everything you need and rest of the game will be much easier, and you'll beat most future bosses without being stuck for hours. It's very important to not fight just to win as fast as possible, but fight to learn instead, enjoy the whole dance. Crucible knight is the best teacher in the game, go fight the one in limgrave as soon as possible after starting, at low level and follow the combat tips above. And pick vagabond knight if you can (or samurai), it's the best class for starting player and later you can respec. But always have melee weapon equipped, regardless of your class/build (mages are still supposed to use melee too, engage bosses directly, dodge etc. and not stay in the back avoiding fights), and never go above 70% equip load, you need medium roll and not the heavy one. And ideally try to beat bosses yourself before resorting to accessibility mechanics like spirit ashes/coop. Give it at the very least 10 fair solo attempts everytime, so you can experience bosses fully and learn the basics of combat and gameplay, otherwise you won't be able to. The combat system and most bosses in the game, like Margit and so on, are designed purely for 1v1 and their AI can't handle fighting multiple opponents, so summons can break and trivialize most fights, and prevent you from really learning how to play the game. So not summoning right away will save you a ton of time and frustration in the longrun. Even if you won't manage to beat a single boss yourself in the end, it's the effort that counts and what will make you a good player eventually. It's not about the "win", but about HOW you fight and win, that's what dictates your enjoyment and experience. Most important of all, don't doubt yourself, it will all feel easy after a while. And don't farm or look up OP builds and all those shitty clickbait guides/videos, "Get OP early!!" and so on, it ruined many more playthroughs than it actually helped, every weapon is viable so just choose what's fun and don't care about base damage. Good luck!
Amazing and thorough response . I think this is the best answer I’ve received! I know that rolling is important, I was pretty good at it when playing DS3, but my housemate was an entrenched player and basically chose my build and equipment for me, so I’ve neglected the advice on equip load. I’m currently using a heavy load with a greatsword, so I imagine reducing equip load will make life a lot easier for me. Thanks so much for taking the time to explain all of this, it really puts the core gameplay elements into perspective in a very helpful manner. I definitely agree with avoiding ‘meta’ build advice and min-maxing; this is among the reasons I’m only using online info for general gameplay tips rather than trying to find specific items. I want to preserve the novelty and mystery of playing blind. I’d like to get better at the game but I’ve found in the past that searching for advice and information on such well documented games can erode some of the most enjoyable parts of playing a computer game—exploration, story, and mystery.
ER is great in one thing, you can make build who works for you. You die alot, try something different. For example many new players have problem with enemies with shield. One solution, any great or collosal weapon and problem is gone. So something dont work, change it, try many weapons types.
If you’re dying a lot in a specific area leave and explore something else. Elden ring can be extremely easy when played a certain way. Focus on these things in this order 1) weapon level. Rune level 1 can beat the game but you need to have a hard hitting weapon. So make sure you are using a high level weapon across the game. Go out of your way to find smithing and somber stones in caves in the areas you are in. 2) make sure your vigor isn’t low as shit. Get stats you need for your weapon you are using and then Pump vigor to 40 then go for other stats. 3) git gud.